₦airaland Forum

MuttleyLaff:
I dont know where all these "mumbo jumbo, selective perception, cognitive dissonance and confirmation bias" air is coimng from

You made a confident and forceful statement
but when asked to share it, you suddenly developed cold feet and choose to cow into silence
Just one, one, one

So you are unable to mention anywhere here on this thread, the core tradition teaching of Christianity that is not really good for african society and so needs immediate abrogation?

when i feel the urge to do so. I will gladly mention you. As for now I am interested with the op discussion.

OLAADEGBU:
Could 2 People Populate a Planet to 7 Billion People?

"In a few thousand years, we expect only seven billion humans. But calculating how many humans there should be in tens of thousands of years doesn't add up—or rather adds up quite a bit too much!" Learn more in this feedback article from AiG's Bodie Hodge:

https://answersingenesis.org/bible-characters/adam-and-eve/could-2-people-populate-planet-7-billion-people/

let's do the maths together......let's assume the growth rate and the average number of birth that can make it possible. Suggest one

paxonel:
hmm!
Is that why you think imperialism is a christianity thing?

How about colonial masters, do you realize their agenda in Africa was not to propagate christianity but to explore Africans?

There is no much difference between the colonists and Christian marketer's (missionary) the whole idea of propagating Christianity is to make it universal religion And the most relevant
.
Missionaries (marketer) came with the attitude that all things European were superior to all things African. Most missionaries believed that once Africans were colonized by European countries they would be more likely to seek after Western Education and Christianity which the missionaries controlled. It was their mission to do anything necessary to convert Africans who were viewed as uncivilized and barbaric.

And in doing so, they indirectly help to further the cause of their colonial friend which is explotation. You can only exploit a brainwashed mind. Not by gun but by engaging his mind.

You guys can make it happen. Do public annocement , ensure the location or avenue is secular due to the nature of your idealogy.

You can use use public university auditorium etc....you have never love what you propagate if you are scared of taken it to the open...... I will be glad to see it happen...

There are Muslim who do it . they are called acadip. I even have a friend as one of their member. This people do win a lot of Christian to their side whenever they open a public lecture. They have produce video and lot of books.....yet to see Christian too in this category and likewise traditionalist. I remember my secondary school, I use to debate my Christian and muslim friends after night prep from night till the morning. With our little experience then , we still make a meaningful contribution. What a good old days....

paxonel:
so, where was these ifa and odudu when white people came to Africa to conquer it ??

the same way white paganism was attack.and replaced with Christianity.

MuttleyLaff:
Why dont you go ahead and share the flaws you are aware of then?

Stop shuffling please.
Just present what you considered not good enough and leave out there so others can determine the merit of the opinion(s)

This comment is out of place

This line of thought is unneccesary

Please here is an opportunity to share where the bible is inerrant

I am not ready for mumbo jumbo , selective perception, cognitive dissonance and confirmation bias. If I feel the urge to play the mental game where the obvious truth will be glaring at us and we will still feel the need to debate it . I will create a thread over it and mention you..... You once honour my john 3 vs 16 thread right? So anticipate another one from me soon.

paxonel:
then IFA is your holy book
adherents of other religions do this too. Christians, Muslims, atheists, Buddhists or whatever
yes! It answers my question
in the real sense everyone is a fundamentalist. Atleast you just gave me a few shot of your traditional fundamental beliefs which is very good

The Yoruba spiritual system is not a “revealed” religion made up by a clergy of prophets as seen in Constantine’s Christianity or Muhammad’s Islam less than 1,700 years ago.

The Yoruba spiritual system, like all indigenous African systems, was developed over hundreds of thousands of years from the village culture. This was mastered at a time when no Homosapien lived outside of Africa. When the the Black African was not only the first but only practitioner of civilization. Therefore IFA is not to be found in book but in society.

The nature of ifa system is about how to achieve harmony in the village. As the village developed into a town and then a city and then a kingdom, the system became more complex in order to deal with larger issues.

However, IFA: was never imperialistic like Islam or Christianity which was designed for control over vast territories. This is why the Yoruba system, which is profound in its original form,can be easily adjustedde for it to address the communal needs of its intercontinental community. A great challenge, for we have seen all other religions fail. Expecially those with fundamentist mimd.in IFA, the same principle that was the pillar of the village is also the pillar of the global society. This principle odudu iwa “Balanced Character.” that got modify ,adjusted as the need for the needs for the society development increase.


I am not a fundamentalist , as my faith did not allow that.....

paxonel:
oh!
I will rather have them seperated too in Nigeria.
And do you know why those books are still referred to as holy in France and elsewhere till this moment?
It is simply because seperating the church from the state did not stop people from reading the bible.

Now, let me ask you, what reference book do you fall back to as an atheist?
Whatever it is, that is your holy book

they are labelled holy, since human are anthropocentric in nature. We always want to put reference/relevance on a particular object over another. Just like the way we honour and value gold more than every other stones. Let me enlightened you on how the world holy was inscribed into the bible

In a tradition settings of the bible, it is an expanded form of the name held over from its original Greek title, τὰ βιβλία τὰ ἅγια, which literally means "the holy scrolls." In the original Greek, τό βιβλίον (τὰ βιβλία is the plural form) is a generic, therefore not a proper noun, so the adjective τὰγια was necessary to specify which scrolls were being talked about: the holy scrolls, not just any old scrolls. In Latin, this expression was partially translated and partially borrowed as biblia sacra (Latin at the time did not use definite articles). Greek words were borrowed into Latin all the time, so even in Latin it might have needed clarification.it is about identify which manuscript should be scriptural. Have you ever hear the Muslim referring to Quran as holy Quran or the Hindu referring the Vedas as holy. Or the jews referring tanakh as holy?


To your question, I am not an atheist, and i am surprised you labelled me as one. I am a traditionalist who tolerate every idea that add value to humanity. And it cut across every religion while using IFA teaching as my watchwords. In essence i fall back to myself within. I am the keeper of my own conscience.

My Biggest victory is not to be found outside , it is to win myself.

A self realised person is like bright illuminating light. Hope that answer your question.


So tell me why you are a fundamentalist?

MuttleyLaff:
I agree, non, with paxonel

vaxx, you earlier made the below quoted comment:
"Present to us the negative effect of Christianity teachings in African society.
i agree not all its teaching are bad. so you can compliment it.
With the already said about African tradition. It is not intelligent enough to be bias.
What is it that is not good in biblical teaching. I await your unbiased response."

Please go ahead and share this strong personal opinion(s) you have,
about core tradition teaching of Christianity that is not really good for african society and and so needs immediate abrogation

I am honest to my self . the op had done well by pointing out some flaws with our traditional cuilture which I agree it is not fashionable to our current society if we yarn for development.

But he was primitive enough to called Christianity flawless while you also compliment him. A higher form of biased. You are even requesting i shouild present what i consider not good enough so you can apply some mental gymnastic to solve it while living the truth in limbo. How dishonest can that be bro....


This is a sign of fundamentalist...... We can never be wrong....... My bible is inerent till infinity...

paxonel:
whether they are truly holy or not that's not the issue.
The issue I am saying is that, if any of these books serves as references to moral codes for Nigerians using them, then they should abide by the moral codes and ignore external traditional influences that will make them do otherwise

you earlier labelled them holy not me.and I complement it. Your assumptions had once been practiced and it was not successful. Read how France separate church from state. The reasons behind it.

paxonel:
non!
Except those African beliefs i mentioned. [sub][/sub]

Christianity or Islam if allowed the way their holy books presented their ideas will never constitute any problem to any nation rather they admonish adherenents to obey God's laws which will improve the way they live

You just make a bogus claim ......these book you called holy are written by human and human by nature are bound to err. And if you claim this book are so holy that every principle , moral guide and rituals in them are perfect, therefore no need for further modification or correction. You just become primitive and it will be right for me to call you fundamentalist who refuse to evolved....


This indeed is a very dangerous concept to the development of African society.....

paxonel:
i mentioned superstitious beliefs in churches .
Just because there is existence of the supernatural,it does not imply that witches and wizards are the ones responsible for the predicaments of Nigerian christians.
When you go to churches, the order of the day is always prayer against device of the demons which is not bad anyway.
But by the time the idea presented by the prayer leader or the pastor is that someones misfortune in life comes from one old woman or mother in the village(always woman) or some fellow human who they think is a witch, guess what the effect will be?
The fellow will end up hating the woman or mother or the person.

The fellow will never know exactly where his problem is coming from, in order for him to find a lasting solution himself.

The fellow will become perpetually confused and loose his self esteem and confidence depending on pastors and prayers

The fellow will never grow to become truly intelligent

good , you are still repeating African tradition believe that has been ingrained to main Christianity which should be discarded. I quite agree with you. Since it does not add value to African society.


But my question is What are the core tradition teaching of Christianity that is not really good for african society and needs immediate abrogation? If African want to move forward.

for your article to become a valid conclusion.. Present to us the negative effect of Christianity teachings in African society . i agree not all its teaching are bad . so you can compliment it. With the already said about African tradition. It is not intelligent enough to be bias. What is it that is not good in biblical teaching. I await your unbiased response.

What I see is fela incarnation........ Falz ride on bro, forget this haters do not let them kill the vibes in you...... This is the dude who is advocating on behalf of the youth who want a drastic change Immediately. Enough of reckless spending, enough of demagogue politician, enough of barbaric society......


Why will I be here if my country is good enough.... Falz ride on bro......your voice can make it work... Who want to play with fire.......

You want to know the essence of mosalah prayer? Go and read up on what it is called placebo effect.

MuttleyLaff:
It is primitive because the concept and its development is unsophisticated

Those who dont are original and knowledgeable enough to recognise that the rapture concept is an oddity

you are.wrong..Unsophisticated does not make it primitive.in technicality it is much modern. About 170 years ..

I care less about is originality.., I am only attacking the choice of words used to described those who hold on to the belief.

MuttleyLaff:
It is primitive vaxx
It is unrefined thinking and belief
This is why I asked, out of curiosity, share ALL your understanding of what rapture is
and to give illustrations or examples of how and when rapture occurs

I care less about the biblical theology or thought that was derived to arrived at the concept. My main defence here is challenging the statement that it is primitive belief. Which is not true.

According to an online dictionary, "" adjective"" primitive means 1 relating to, denoting, or preserving the character of an early stage in the evolutionary or historical development of something.

2 very basic or unsophisticated in terms of comfort, convenience, or efficiency.
not developed or derived from anything else.
(of a part or structure) in the first or early stage of formation or growth; rudimentary.

I will like to know how it is correct to qualify any body who hold unto rapture believe with such an adjective. In fact in a logical sense. It is very proper to call the Christian who do not subscribe to this concept primitive.

MuttleyLaff:
Modern belief with a primitive slant

Its primitive because the belief is oblique

It means holding on to the core traditional and original early belief(s)

You challenged a phantom error

I know you not being a christian, yet still, out of curiosity, share ALL your understanding of what rapture is?
Give illustration or examples of how and when rapture occurs

I am not defending rapture here, I am only challenging the claim that it is christain primitive believe.. I care less about rapture......in fact if you do not believed in rapture, you are liking to a primitive Christian.

paxonel:
the same thing applies! Your whatever religion and christianity are not in the same field so i dont need to discuss bible with you because it will never make sense to you.
Even christians are confused when it comes to bible how much morè non christian like you.
if your religion and christianity were of the same profession(meaning, your religion is christianity) then we can talk from there.
good for you.
We make reference to bible to get our doctrines not wikipedia.
Therefore it is a primitive act to indoctrinate a person of another religion different from yours by not using his own holy book but your own(wikipedia) .

By the way, guess how your wikipedia defined rapture?

Google it.

Rapture definition from wikipedia
The rapture is an eschatological term used by certain Christians, particularly within branches of American evangelicalism, referring to PURPORTED end time event...

Mark the word PURPORTED
Purported means it is said to be true or real but definitely not true or real.

what are you saying?. Who is debating biblical theology with you. You do not even understand the premise of your argument. You said "" African that believe in rapture are primitive" in which i correct your assumptions. That you must be joking. That the concept rapture is mordarn and it is primitive Christian that reject it. I care less about rapture....

It seems you stop using using your illogical comparizm and you are now speaking straightforward . you could not even separate profession from doctrine. Christianity' is like every other religions what make it differ is operation ( we call it doctrine in religious terms)and not profession..

Who is indocrinating who. I am only interested in correcting your erreneous claim that beliving in rapture is primitive.... Or do you not understand the vocalb you are using? Do a good google search on it. And futhermore, wikipedia on this topic is an open source of information which is consider less bias and contain lot of refrences which is combination of both biblical verses and all sort of relevant information. Therefore it is not limited in scope unlike the bible. So it make more sense and enlighten to introduce you to a website that is much more open rather than close..


As I said earlier, I am less concern if rapture is true or not according to biblical theology. I only debunk your erroneous claim that it is primitive Christian believe . in fact if you do no believe it . you are a primitive Christian.

paxonel:
it does not follow like that!
You have to be in the same technical department with a colleage who is trying to explain to you some technical faults in machines operated by your company for you as a casheer to understand what he is saying .

Finance department and technical department are not the same.

And a medical student may not understand some technical terms law students are used to, unless he start practicing law himself .

Technically, the word rapture do not appear in the bible, christians are reading somėthing else in the bible and they misunderstood them to be rapture because the developers of the rapture doctrine did the same mistäke teaching people to do the same.

the doctrine was developed some cenuries ago by some primitive christiáns and it is still widely accepted till now does not mean that the doctrine is true.

You are not a christian forget it.
Only christians who read their bible will understand

No, you are wrong. You are just using illogical argument here.


Who told you a first bank staff can not perform adequately well with zenith bank.must he or she work with zenith bank to understand the technical know how of the bank?

The process and procedure to run an effective bank is the same all over or wherever.Banks accept deposits from customers, raise capital from investors or lenders, and then use that money to make loans, buy securities and provide other financial services to customers. Any work apart from this is just an innovation....... Therefore a nigeria banker can adequately work well in Germany. Despite the technology involved. All he or she need is training to understand the operations. He already understand the technicality that goes with the practice.

Secular Banking practice procedure are the same all over the world. what differs is the mode of operating which is not a big deal for external employee.

Medical and law practitioners are not in the same field but footballer of different clubs are in the same profession. As I argue before that you can not sideline Ronaldo of real Madrid from giving a vital information about Liverpool.


Let me enlightened you about rapture. My text is taken from Wikipedia. In case you need further reading.

The theological notion of a "rapture" was invented 170 years ago. In 1830, in Port Glasgow, Scotland, fifteen year old Margaret MacDonald had a vision concerning the return of Christ. Her vision was adopted by John Nelson Darby a British minister and founder of a denomination called the "Plymouth Brethern." In 1909, an American, C. I. Scofield, pubished an annotated version of the "King James" translation of the Bible called the "Scofield Reference Bible." Therefore if you do not believed in rapture you are a primitive Christian because the idea is some centuries years old and not the core traditional Christian believe.

paxonel:
let a christian speak

You that is not a christian what do you know in the bible?

You better face your religion o

that is a big mistake on you. Is like what those ronaldo knows about Liverpool since he is not a liverpoolian. Aren't they the same football club.

paxonel:
there is nothing like rapture mr man.
Real christians dont believe in that ,only primitive african christians do

What do you mean by primitive Africans Christian. Believing in rapture itself is a modern believe. Just some 100 years old... So nothing primitive about it. If you do not believe it , it means you are a primitive Christian who still holds on to the core Christian tradition believe.

Mind you i am not a christain. I just challenge your error

This is. Not a true story.. Op find a better way to attack islam

Am so bored

Abdulgaffar22:
Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all they have, and spare them not: but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camels and donkeys ( 1st Samuel 15:3)
But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be their king- bring them here and kill them in front of me(Luke 19:27)
Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace but a sword. For I have come to turn a man against his father, a daughter against her mother (Matthew 10:34-35) All these are Biblical verses. They are not verses of Quran. Now what do you have to say about them? All the verses of Quran you quoted above will be clear when you read them in their proper context.

Are you not fasting?

Hakeem12, can you direct me to where I can download this series. ""Scorpion""I mean to season 5. And "The perfume" not a series movie.

It depends on where you are coming from, if you are a christain, then Jesus is the one who founded Christianity himself. It.cannot be an apostle.apostle literary means the sent ones. Therefore apostle Paul is just a messenger of Jesus gospel. :

As a lover of history, I will say the Roman Emperor Constantine.is the one who called together the Council of Nicea by which came the Nicene Creed and the concept of the Trinity that unites much of Christianity today..a form of branding.

However, some Muslim says it is Paul.who rebrand Christianity. Joseph smith of later days church says he received direct revelation from Jesus himself.....so much controversy I guess.....


I prefer to go with history.

HardMirror:
continue crying

you have just been exposed and delivered from your utter ignorance. Pls do not made mention of my monicker unless you are not intended to promote the same ignorance. You just did here. Stubborn head

butterflylion:
I am actually doing him and his thread a favour by responding to this idle meaningless banter. But someone has to at least drop some intelligence on this thread

how can he be so stubborn to accept simple correction? He does not even know he just make an error for comparing me with you. Yet he is still stubborn.

butterflylion:
Its a mockery of intelligence to actually equate Gods intelligence to those of men despite having foreknowledge that God does not exist in the realm of men.

You disappoint me when you fail to think.

and he also dissapoint me for comparing me to you. He is even arrogant to apologized. Vaxx and butterflylion are not the same...... Oga op.

HardMirror:
and what makes you say this? i only winked.

are you not the one mistaking me to butterflion?