₦airaland Forum

LOL! Religion and its wahala. Let's look beyond our "holy books", history is a better teacher.

According to history-  Judaism - First

                               Christianity - Second

                               Islam - Third

Now who copied who?

What is God's real name - Hashem? YHWH?

                                      Jehovah?

                                      Allah?

Na wa o! You people keep knocking your heads together for religions that have persecuted, violated, and enslaved your people. Like one racist said "Africans are hybrids, , neither here nor there". And oh by the way, Dear Muslims, your precious Arab brothers kindly took 12 million black slaves through the Trans-Saharan slave trade route, as well as the fair skinned brothers of my dear Christians who kindly relieved Africa of 8 million able bodied young men through the Trans-Atlantic slave route which set the stage for the anarchy, corruption and poverty the continent has witnessed till today.

Oya round 1 - FIGHT!

Yeye people!

Gbawe:
Pragmatists have no choice. Only dreamers , especially given how Nigerians have historically been 419ned mercilessly, will take leadership utterances seriously when nothing is in place to show things will be different. Did you not see all the previous antics of Adoke Bello yet Jonathan , amazingly, still saw it fit to bring him back as AGF ? Let me jog your memory. Halliburton? "we can't prosecute" a paedophile Yerima ? Teslim Folarin in combo with Ringim?  

I ask you again ; Who will Okonjo Iweala prosecute her corruption "war" with? Is she now a do-it-alone supercop as well or will sensible and realistic folks conclude that , to achieve success, Okonjo Iweala actually needs ultra-dedicated and principled men and women of proven integrity , in the right positions (EFCC, ICPC, NPF, AGF), who can turn down $15 million bribe when "corruption fights back"? I am sorry , but I remain highly sceptical while Okonjo Iweala only has Adoke, Waziri , Ringim et al to work with . When even ultra dedicated and upright folks will struggle  how will a bunch of complicit corrupt "voltrons" fight corruption effectively in the most Corrupt Nation on earth?

Apparently some of my sarcasm was lost on you, but still, I understand where you are coming from. I totally do. And who says pragmatists can't get a laugh out of some situations. You need to calm down a bit bro, for all you know we might belong to the same school of thought, only I have stopped pulling my hair over the Nigerian leadership problem. The appointment of Okonjo Iweala into Jonathan's cabinet is a welcome development, even though I think he is not being too realistic about the extent of her powers. The man seems to have a lot to deal with and lacks the guts to stand up to the forces that have pinned down this country for long, so maybe he thinks bringing in a supercop with enough "balls" and clout with the international community will do the trick, I don't know, but then again, would you rather we threw our hands up in despair and sulk in the corner without doing anything about out problems? Yes, Ngozi has a herculean task, but you just might never know. Let's see how this one plays out.

OYINBOGOJU:
Good move by my heroin

Lets hope she get  the best supports from the President himself

Lemme sit and watch

, you have turned this woman to a hard drug. But no problem, I already put an "e" in my mind's eye while your comment.

@topic, a lot of people seem to be leaning towards the negative when it comes to Okonjo Iweala. It is not as if she is not aware of the shenanigans our politicians are fond of, I am sure she is on to something. You just might never know the great transformation that will follow after her "cleansing". Whether it affects Goodluck, his cronies and even dear old "I dey laff o!" remains to be seen. For now, let's just keep our fingers crossed and watch our "Prime minister" do her job.

haka_nai:
The answer ls with your leaders and elders who should have being championing the case and seeking justice not just being nonchalant.You don't expect a northern elder to go and know what is happening in your domain when you have human beings that carry age and brains to know when they should go and say my people are angry and unhappy and it is my duty to say so and seek re-dress.
Its not Ghali but Na'Allah that said so!He speaks for himself and today it is a fact that being in the house does not in all case present what others think period.While Ghali was saying that in the house,Yar'adua was shaking hands with boyloaf and calling them to Aso rock for dialogue.Same northerners with diverse views.
I don't know what you mean by fished out? Do you mean Killing innocent people in there houses ,burning peoples property and burning public markets! You must seriously have lost it.
Even in a house with many people,you have different views and if i remember same house of assembly cautioned him and demand an apology for same.Which means such an action is wrong.Since we've learn from that ,do we then say we repeat it again as fools will. Your excuse hardly holds water and your blaming of the Nigerians/Norths elders for not interfering in your activities is wrong.Especially since you have your own elders. Abi they are on vacation? Our elders have come out to even challenge the government to go and see/ask the victims who survived.Simple English to better your operations and you are busy denying.Typical sign of guilt.
Lastly people like you seek number 1.,2.,3. & 5. based on my earlier post.
Boko haram needs a remedy and i don't care how justice reaches them as they have individually taken part in actions against any innocent person.But i remain against the harm caused to the law abiding and innocent Nigerians.

Bolded - (1) Is Nigeria led by council of elders or do we run a Federal structure? A leader who prefers to plunder the resources of another region for the benefit of his own region simply because he does not know what is happening in the South is a selfish leader with an acute sense of tribal or regional jingoism. How can the president of a country not know what is happening in his own country? Is he just leading the North? BTW, Why should some recycled old men who have never contributed to the development decide how a country should be run? I hate this South/North dichtonomy but the truth is the South tends to sacrifice more for our wobbling Federal Government to continue its useless existence than the North, and you add insult to injury by implying that Northern elders are "sharper" for always crying blue murder at the slightest provocation while Southern elders allow the government do its work. SMH

Thanks for letting me know that it was Na'Allah that said two million Niger Deltans can be wiped out for "Nigeria" to have peace. Even if he spoke for himself, he gave us an insight into the mindset of some Northern leaders. Yes people can have diverse views, but one thing is sure, comments made by most Northern leaders or "elders" imply that they believe that the rest of the country should catch cold every time the region sneezes. Not cool. All Nigerians must be treated equally.

Bolded - (2) - Did you read the part where I said I was against the killing of innocent civilians. I meant "fishing" out the terrorists, not innocent people. But you see dear Haka nai, innocent civilians were violated, battered and killed during the "fishing" out of ND millitants before the amnesty deal (which in my opinion does not answer the question of under development in the region BTW), so the harsh reality is that as militants or terrorists are sons, brothers and husbands to the people of the affected locality, and some protection is always offered to them by these people and that must frustrate the government. Hence, the killing of innocent people in Odi or ND then and Maiduguri presently. This in no way absolves the government of blame, but you see the hypocrisy some of you display is very annoying. If the South can take it in the name of preserving our nationhood, why can't you guys do the same or at least join hands with a Southerner in power to rid a menace that is not serving nations of the M.E well. A menace that uses religion (which of course is a potent force in swaying the poor, deluded drug addict who has no idea that he is being used) in order to fight for a few selfish people who do not have the well being of their people in mind, is something we must never put up with.

Bolded - (3) - Honey, it is not my fault that you can't see beyond your nose, but hey, if calling me names makes you feel good, knock yourself out. 

Bolded - (4) - *Sigh*

Bolded (5) - Best thing you have said so far.

While I don't condone the incessant killings of civilians under the guise of flushing out terrorists, I can't stand the hypocrisy of some Northern politicians about this Boko Haram issue. When Odi in RIvers State was literally razed to the ground by trigger happy men of the armed forces of Nigeria, where was the outcry? When Honourable Ghali Na'abba brazenly called for the extermination of the people of the Niger Delta for the "greater good" of (Northern) Nigeria, where was the indignation? Now, a group of people who are clamouring for the most senseless demands are being fished out, and we hear all manner of speeches from people who couldn't be bothered if the whole of the Niger Delta that sustains the Nigerian economy is wiped out off the face of the earth. Let's face it, Boko Haram is nothing more than a ploy by the North to disrupt Jonathan's administration. The sooner we are objective and fair in our analysis of the issues bedeviling Nigeria, the better for us. Otherwise, our simpering resentment against perceived injustices will lead to the implosion of this great country.

@Andyanders, thanks for your kind words. @Mikeapollo, thanks as well. Hope you will forgive me for not being an enthusiast of e mail et all. My friends are always on edge over my not-so-constant e mails. With all these sharp sharp means of communicating with folks these days, e mail sending feels like I am going back to 1994. Still, I took note of your e mail. Who knows, I might just repent tomorrow.

Hey Fxtopedia, you are the one that is too much o! Walahi, you make me blush with that big advert. Hope you are well!

juman:
@Virgo

It is conspicuous that Asiwaju Tinubu is a leading person in yoruba land.

He leads the group (ACN) that bring changes to yoruba land. Definitely he is the leader.

But you know nah some few people are not comfortable with that.

Well, too bad. If there is no unity in a tribe, then talking about a united Nigeria is mere wishful thinking. I hope the Yorubas get their act together. A house that is divided cannot stand.

Also, a person's birth circumstance should not be a motive for discrediting him from being a leader or helper of his people. I hope TB knows that the same Jesus he claims to follow did not have the kind of father that people claim Tinubu also did not have. So, is TB saying Jesus is not fit to be a leader just because Joseph was not his father? Shame on hypocrites! I have completely lost my respect for Tunde Bakare.

"From any angle you look at it, such a statement is wrong no matter what provoked it.
It is not christianly in any way or at the least not Jesus like. It is also not right for someone seeking a leadership position and should Ideally be looking to build bridges and not create chasms between the disparate entities in Nigeria. Are those born out of wedlock not human beings and Nigerians? Undecided
The same principle on which I supported Bakare is the same for which I condemn him on such a statement. I believe he will look on this statement some day and regret it".


@Dudu, I didn't want to delve into the political issue connected to this story because I  am not Yoruba, and I think the peculiarities of Yoruba politics can be best understood by those who have roots in the Yoruba race. I have followed the whole Omatseye/Nation V. Awolowo/Tribune story and I frankly don't understand what the furore over Yoruba leadership is all about. I mean, if Tinubu or someone else has the political clout to be a voice for the Yoruba nation, why the bickering?

Anyway, that is besides the point. I merely focused on the religious part of this story because I was astounded by the level a "man of God" was willing to sink to score political points. I mean, it is scary and completely shameful. I believe that anything that runs contrary to the teachings of Christ should not be remotely regarded as Christian. I think it doesn't speak well for Christianity as a whole for a "man of God" to resort to name calling and hateful sermons. In fact, I am totally embarrassed for "Pastor" Tunde Bakare. Jesus preached love, equality, magnanimity, and forbearance to  his followers, so what religion is "Pastor" Bakare representing because from what I have seen, he is preaching the exact opposite of what Jesus preached.

efisher:
Now that a bomb has gone off in police headquarters, lets see what the police will do next.

Terrorists - 1   :   Police - 0

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-691744.0.html

Thank you. You just took the words out of my mouth. Personally, I think this is just a repeat of the usual scenarios Nigerians are forced to witness time and time again. It is all hot air! The powers that be know that some political figures are behind Boko Haram. Chances are that they saw it as the North's answer to N/D militants. These guys are funded by some Northern elites. So, if the government likes, they can add militant fighters of OPC to their new task force for all I care. Fact remains that our "leaders" do not have the will to tackle the problems they created themselves.

Seriously, those supporting Bakare's comments need to have a rethink. I am more concerned with the religious angle of this story than the political one. As someone who follows the teachings of Jesus, I cannot for the life of me see any similarity in the lifestyle of Bakare and that of Jesus or even their teachings. Isn't the whole concept of Christianity supposed to support a lifestyle that emulates the teachings of Christ.

How different is this pastor from radical imams using their places of worship to spew hate. How can a man of God condemn another in such harsh terms. There is nothing constructive about Bakare's criticism, the man should just find a place to sit down. Nigerians are gradually seeing the true colours  of all these two faced prophets who use their pulpits to pursue personal ambitions. Nonsense.

Greed, bad leaders, disunity and lack of trust among Africans, complacent masses, shortsightedness, black man's attitude of "me, myself and I", and plain stupidity.

Jenifa_:
so what's up with you? how bodi, my brother

@virgo,
that is the gospel truth right there. that post is definitely right on point
I heard it too that while ethiopia was suffering it's famine in the 90s, the country was a net exporter of food!!  
so instead of "charity" why didn't the west simply stop importing ethiopian crops and let them divert the plantation for sustenance cropping?
the whole idea of charity and developmental aid is just a joke the west play maybe to laugh at us or something. lol

what we need right now is a revamp of our foreign policy. we need especially good and confident leaders to handle our foreign relations

Exactly!!!

@Jenifa, another comment from the same white man while my African brothers claim that there is nothing wrong with the land grab.


[b]The idea that any of this is a "new" controversy is nonsense.   Europeans have been grabbing land in Africa for plantation agriculture and mining for the last few hundred years.   But more recently, at least since 2008 and the global "food insecurity" scam (which is the real controversy), foreigners have been going to Africa and buying up land at record rates.   The Saudis have bought thousands of acres in Ethiopia (with much starvation) for food exports and are in the process of expanding.  Other gulf states have done similar things in other parts of Africa. Asian nations are seeking to do the same and everyone should know about the massive uprisings in Madagascar caused by the Korean company Daewoo trying to snap up large amounts of land.

No this is not new this is simply the same old pattern of foreigners deciding that Africas resources exist primarily for the benefit of NON Africans and that Africans should only be treated as peon workers who get the leftovers after everyone else gets their share.   But if you notice over the last few years while all of this land grabbing has been taking place, you have heard oh so many stories about the "West", ie the World Bank, UNCF, World Food Organization and so forth promoting Green initiatives in Africa and new Agricultural partnerships.  But what have these initiatives produced?  Pretty much nothing.   Those are simply PR ploys to divert attention from the real story, which is the global economic system taking land from Africans so they don't have the means to feed themselves.   Most of these NGOs and Global institutions are financed and backed by the same companies snapping up land in the first place.  They only exist as modern versions of Missionaries designed to con Africans into thinking that these people are there to help them, when they aren't.   They are there to take land from Africa and resources.

The evidence is obvious and everywhere on the ground.  It doesn't get more blatantly obvious than the Ethiopian example.   These people are taking food out of the mouths of Africans but at the same time financing charities to promote "helping" starving Africans, which never happens, but allows them to fool everyone into thinking that they are there to help.[/b]

Jenifa_:
lol. I don't even think we are talking on the same wavelength.

PS: what do you think about the US blaming the middle east for terrorism. why didn't you guys just blame yourselves?


yea I knew he was being sarcastic.
I was just pointing out the irony that most nigerians don't even think that way. it would have been better if we actually thought that way.
imagine even our educated Ngozi Nwela. I was embarrassed hearing her giving a speech where she was using an analogy of western countries as our 'parents' and we as the 'children'. how can you stand up to western exploitation if you consider westerners to be your parents? 
and when the whole paternalistic mentality has been internalized in us.

Walahi, it is a big shame. The funny thing is that the educated blacks who get to international organizations like World bank and IMF become more ignorant of the Western ploy to exploit the continent. Seems to me that the more educated these guys get, the more foolish they become. See Ouattarra in Ivory Coast. A former employee of IMF and a mere puppet for "father France" who will no doubt gladly hand over the country back to be pillaged to help develop France and give the white man his chocolates. Bunch of nitwits!

Jenifa, glad you saw the sarcasm. Well, I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinion on the matter. I decided that there was no need to to go through lengths trying to argue my point till the end. Meanwhile see what a white man posted about the land grab situation on another website.



"The reason that global food insecurity is a scam is because those preaching it imply that by easing food insecurity they are trying to help those who are most food insecure.   But that is not the case in reality.   The actual beneficiaries of projects and plans to address global food insecurity are primarily the large multinational agricultural entities and rich countries, none of which are in any sense close to being food insecure.   So it winds up being another way for them to take even more land and resources from those least able to afford it.

[b]The simplest answer to feeding people most in need of food is to put more land under cultivation and the output into the mouths of the people.  That has been the equation for agriculture since the neolithic.   If you can grow a certain amount of crop on 1 acre of land and it takes x amount of crop to feed Y numbers of people, how many acres do you need to feed a given number of people in a population?   That is simple math and the most logical simple answer to a given problem.   But that is not how the modern economic system works.  The modern equation is convoluted and backwards, especially when it comes to third world countries that are constantly exploited for their resources.   It becomes, if I can make x number of dollars for N amount of crop on the global market and x amount of land produces y amount of crop at z cost per acre, then I can gain greater amount of profit by decreasing the cost of of producing said crop on greater amounts of land for trade on the global market.   Nowhere in that equation does feeding the population ever come into play.  The goal is profit and what you get from the "global market" is all that counts.   But the global market does not equate to "feeding the people", so in reality this only furthers the food instability of those people who are not in control of the land and the resources.   So at the end of the day it is simply another scam to increase the profits of the rich global companies and does nothing to help those who are food insecure like Africans".[/b]

So why should I bother if other Africans are cool with the land grab since we so desperately need to belong to the global community. No wahala. We dey look nau!

Jenifa_:
ironically, the average nigerian does not think this way and that is partially why nigeria is the way it is today.
the average nigeria will lick any white man or woman's butt and not recognize the source of exploitation when it is staring them in the face.
even our leaders are #1 puppet to the west.

imagine western companies finding it so easy to infiltrate government ranks and turning national decisions in their favor. that is mumu to the highest order because I don't know what else it could be.  i'm talking about the wikileaks thing

@Jenifa, violent may have been sarcastic with the last comment you replied to.  .

As for the multinationals infiltrating government, it is quite pathetic. It is for this same reason that Allison Madueke may not return to government for daring to promote the PIB bill. Our leaders are the worst stooges on earth. Now, you see how easy it is for the West to acquire lands in Africa with a bottle of Johnnie Walker and three claps. Lol.

Kobojunkie:
Well . . . you tell me of a better word to qualify your attempts so far to offload the blame on to the FOREIGNERS when most of the decisions to sell when most of thr decisions where made by your local(many of them ELECTED) leaders?

I frankly do not care what word you want to use. I blame the West as much as I blame our leaders. If you didn't see that in all my posts, then that is not my business.

Kobojunkie:
You mean Africans aren't the most cunning of them all? Come on  now . . . 

Whose fault is it that Africans are hoodwinked at every turn? I mean come on, think deeper on these things. They say "once beaten, twice shy". Why are you all too willing to pretend Africa is ok playing the not-so-smart person in it all?
WOW . . .  I marvel at the way you conspiracy theorists pick around like hens when you want to pick examples. So, a few mistakes and a few isolated incidents are evidence enough to bolster your seemingly, for lack of a better term,  xenophobic stance there?? lol 
Anyways, I know a lot of Westerners, and asians who will wonder if you are complete upstairs for making the statement you have their on them.
So, let me get this straight. Africa cannot feed it's own self (financial crisis or none). Now, because the financial crisis, created by the west(according to you), made this reality more obvious, the west, asia and arab nations should not try to purchase land from Africa?OK. . . . so you are saying that even though you continue to elect corrupt leaders to represent you, the west, asia, and arab nations should take the blame when those corrupt leaders shortchange you and your future in these deals?

What exactly are you talking about? What xenophobic stance? Lol, this is funny. You know what, just forget it, I am not even going to allow myself partake in a merry go round with you. It is clear that we are on different sides of the divide on this one. There is no need for name calling as there is no guarantee that we are going to agree with each other at the end of the day.Thank you.

You haven't actually said much in relation to my earlier post, especially considering the fact that they consist of begging questions that needed desperate answers from folks like you who happen to be in the know before the news even got out. . . .and that folks like us who only love to brandish our English could be saved from our ignorance.

One begins to question how liberated and exposed some of you are when issues like this are being discussed.
For some of you, If Dangote had bought the entire Uganda with a single check, he's just being an astute businessman who  recognize value and simply made a gun for it. . .but if some guy in Texas think it will be a nice thing to own a direct exposure to African markets, you come out with your sharp knives asking for his head----nothing but his head is good enough to appease the gods for attempting a 21st century invasion!!!!. . . .but if you receive any less treatment, they are being racist!!!

For some of you, the concept of the world being a global village will never register in your pea sized brain, you wonder why China opens its doors wide enough for investors to conduct transactions, you never quite understand why London is referred to as the world's business capital, the concepts of wall street never sleeping is far too complex for you to grab, and with your mouths left ajar, you simply watched while the rest of the world advance, far ahead of you, when asked, your answer?-----"Let's prevent 21st century invasion, they are coming for our Lands, they are coming for our oil, the white man is planning to steal away our kids!!!-----how lame can you get?"

It's quite relieving that you wouldn't have time to argue with common me, that's like saving me a lot of time trying to explain the concepts of open markets, economics of supply and demand, global trade etc etc to someone who in all probability is least likely to understand even the simplest things.

It's even more amusing that the so called West are doing more than several of you multiply together to eradicate poverty and disease from Africa.  you love it when the make donations in billions of pound sterlings to Haiti, Somalia and Niger, but you can't stand them investing their monies in this economies---- very fair don't you think?

Many of you arguing blindly probably don't even know that Ethopia is the 10th poorest country in the world with only a GDP of 700 million dollars.  Their Agriculture business has suffered serious lowdown because of poor cultivation techniques and frequent drought and  80% of its population live on breadline. Most of you sit back in your comfortable homes and watch this economy plunge into the dark of darkness, but when you hear investors planning to throw in millions of dollars, you take to the internet and start a cyberwar----now, that's what i call PATHETIC!!!!!!


1- Clearly I am not interested in going through long arguments with you because I don't agree with your position. At least you can forgive me that. I agree with the position of the Oakland institute about land grabs in Africa, and being a student of history, don't blame me for being apprehensive.

2- Oh come off your high horse. I am no racist. I believe in equal opportunity for all, regardless of race, but my position is that investors should be fair to the people. Don't come pretending to be their friend or wanting to create jobs for them when all you want is to make huge profits at their expense.
 
3- Right. And your brain is too big to accommodate the fact that people are entitled to their own opinions and can disagree with you.

4- From the look of things, they have already come for our lands and our oil while we are here wasting time disagreeing over their motives.

5- Good luck to you. BTW, I just got here this evening and have been treated to the wealth of your knowledge on world economics and I still disagree with your position. So your subtle barb means nothing to me.

6- They create the chaos, reap from it and send aid to Africa. You can't imagine how grateful I am.

7- Sure, Ethiopia like some other African countries subject to the whims and caprices of the West, are poor. So why not just sell the whole country/countries to the highest bidder.

Violent, please allow me to re-iterate my position that Africans are being sold for the cheap, without getting unnecessarily worked up just because I cannot see the "light" of your arguments. Thank you.