₦airaland Forum

Image123: so, will you tolerate a goat as family?

I think you have some issues. Consider taking a holiday or getting laid (preferably not with this goat you're obsessed with).

shuddyy: Hmmm. so far, I think the moslems here are doing a better job on this debate - better convincing arguments!

You wouldn't happen to be muslim, would you? What exactly is y'alls argument?

musKeeto:

Et tu, muskeeto?

You can slave but don't slave jews? Jews can be salaried workers though, of course recommending the same for people from other tribes would be silly.

There's no strong condemnation here, instead I see laws requesting you to be decent; it approves of slavery so long as you remain humane. It makes some laws which amount to "love thy slave, and slave be good to thy master". Eventually, an ambiguous suggestion to release them, but only if xtian?

It looks like it had political reasons for not condemning slavery. Clinton privately approved of gay marriage but couldn't say so publicly because it would mean political death. Obama was able to publicly declare his support only this year, the first US president to do so. Weed will probably go through the same process. Omnipotent God seems to be doing the same, it seems to be afraid to condemn slavery lest it lose votes. Is it a politician? Well, if it were the product of human minds it would have a gender, probably male, 'he' would also reason like humans (eg, be tribalistic like on the slave issue), have human emotions, require 'votes' and of course, have morality that changes with the population's whims.

You still haven't shown me where this god that gives you a moral code is, it seems to be in your minds. Also where did it get its moral code from?


Edits.

The story long. I hope I can keep it short. I also really shouldn't be spending time here. Anyways

never_say_never: just as we were taught that 2+2=4 in mathematics, if you never believed that, then you probably wouldn't know anything about maths.

First off, you need to differentiate between learning social norms and most education involving topics like mathematics (particularly, arguably the most objective persuit there is), sciences, etc. Even their objectives are different. One is involved with technical knowledge, the other with norms used to deal with society like moral codes.

Religion could try to pass itself off as technical knowledge, which is true in a sense. Problem occurs when religious dogma is taught as fact, it most certainly is not (evidence, where? Not even logical evidence to back it up). Not only that but people being taught these 'facts' are not allowed or encouraged to question, they must agree with its dogma. Other brainwashing techniques also become involved, usually even the brainwasher is unaware of what they are doing, they were programmed earlier to perpetuate said religions doctrines. If you need to clear that up, wiki to start

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialization
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indoctrination

Using the word 'believe', I just don't know what better word to use so I'll stick with it, sort of. But you don't believe 2 + 2 = 4, it is objectively so, with or without the presence of conscience to translate it (thereby adding our subjectivity to it). Philosopher input is welcome (step in quantum lovers, etc).

never_say_never: I must say it's rather harsh that you consider religious people as being coerced into it. I believe there are some things we were taught (not forced) to believe... What you refer to as bigotry/intolerance comes as a result of the fact that it's suprising that in this part of the world (where we were all brought up to believe in a supreme being, be it under christianity, islam or paganism), there are people who believe in nothing supernatural at all.

Like I say, you've been conditioned to not question doctrine, at least I hope so as this is rather bad reasoning. To elaborate, you say the blue then say the red in the same paragraph? You're more or else saying that people just accept the religion they are born into, that does not translate to putting any thought into it. You, as an african with no ties to manchester, have a family and all of them are man u fans? Then pressure from your family was involved. Either some sort of peer pressure or downright manipulation (even if done just to please your kind parents, you probably haven't given it enough thought). Btw, being a bigot just because someone does not share your opinions is not justifiable.

Look at these
http://religions.pewforum.org/reports

What I want you to take from there is number of people who were raised in homes where religion was not an issue, in essence a lot less pressure from the family to follow some religion or the other. From those homes, roughly 50% of them do go on to be affiliated with a religion. That is how it should be without coercion, you make up your mind for yourself as to what stance suits you best then you follow it, no pressure involved. With that note that quite a few still became religious despite less pressure, those one can safely say came to their decisions after having given it a lot more thought than the indoctrinated.

And there are all sorts of atheists, or anti-theists (unaffiliated, humanists, even buddhists, etc, agnostiscs, pantheists etc), just as there are all sorts of theists (xtian, muslim etc). So the 50 - 50 is fairly accurate.

never_say_never: As regards to gay bashing(without religious quotes), apart from the fact Nigeria is very religious, isn't it obvious? 2 men can't reproduce cos it takes a man and woman to do so, or am i wrong?

So you think it's by force for one to have children? You're still forcing your opinions on others.


I've already wasted too much time. Hope you guys question your beliefs. Not asking anyone to throw away god, just don't blindly follow

frosbel: This was supposed to be an atheist bashing thread not a place to perfect your abusing skills

Frosbel...

Again, despite spending days here at times, you learn absolutely nothing. You can't even troll properly. You're not supposed to let us know it was intentional. Amateur

The gift that keeps giving

dhtml: most programmers are not too-religious as far as i know

It might have to do with the training. A fair amount of mathematicians are supposedly like that, though I'll have to verify that. But I think it has more to do with the personalities that are attracted to programming. You look up a list of alpha programmers you're not going to find many religious like you say. Even before they were trained/taught themselves, they were likely atheist or indifferent. Despite the usual acrimony in their dealings with each other you'll find they share a lot of other traits as well.

How does one become a doctor/programmer sef? Isn't that too much?

Is it me, or do people invite 'trouble' then cry foul later on?

truthislight: reasonableness will here be Considered to be the ability to influence/adjust/and act according to the obvious without sentiment coming in between.

But that ^^^ is not the main issue here, but that Jesoul reasonableness is clearly obvious that you had to notice it and made this thread.

Is that trait available in you and the likes?

Is it me, or do you personally seem to have a deep mistrust of atheists?

@moskeeto : well played, good ser. Well played

@logic: is it me, or are your posts getting funnier. The one just now with tpia on the other thread. That was mean..and funny, thank you very much

@topic
They are sort of similar, sometimes just a matter of degree. Sometimes a matter of outlook. As there's no evidence for a god (and no logic to support one), an atheist sees even considering the notion in your worldview as illogical, maybe. Or something similar

There, at least I'm not totally off topic

F00028:
listen you sanctimonious piece of *** if you dont know the meaning of the word, abusive, look it up.
the only reason why i dont get into a pointless name calling match with you is, quite frankly, i dont feel like it. though i usually make an exception in the case of that poster boy for imbecil!ty, sagamouse.

and condescension doesn't really make you superior it just means you're a pretentious blowhard.


how i choose to push that blaady ajegunle motorpark debater's button is not your concern.

You calling an atheist sanctimonious now? Wow, I'm morally superior maybe? I usually just ask hypocrites not to be that, or bigots. Or blindly follow an illeterate from 1400 yrs ago, etc. You do harm real people with your stoopid you know? Ah, its just fun and games maybe? Eediot

Anyways, how do you expect any thinking person to attend to the stoopid in your post? You didn't respond to anything at all there. Can't you just stay out of a discussion if you do not even grasp the basics?

You made me agree with sagaxxx for $deity's sake...

diehard: @wiegraf, 'Your religious morals' as you put it, has never changed. they are not based on my feeling cos that changes a lot, or how i see it cos i get wiser everyday. They are based on ideals higher than me. That is absolutely correct and does not have shades and shadows. And they can only be defined by a higher being. I call HIM THE MOST HIGH, cos you can go any higher. Your statement ' These days though civilized folk respect rights and try to cause as little harm/injury to other life as they can' is not correct. Men are getting more evil as the days goes by, you only need to look at the society around you to confirm it. The purpose of this thread is to educate people on the folly of Atheist and frankly i do not expect everybody to agree with me cos not all men are wise.

This is clearly false. Did xtianity condone slavery? Does it do so now? What about the mess that is the OT, did god change its mind?
And note you have now made a claim that a higher being exists, giving you laws. I hope you have proper evidence to back up your claims, not opinions else you just wasted everyone's time

diehard: @obi1kenobi, Your argument about what is moral has changed into what is acceptable to 'me'. A lot of things are acceptable to people that are not acceptable to others. Since i cannot enter into you book of 'dos' and 'don'ts'. i can submit my argument based on your statement. Since pre-marital sex is moral in your books, but in the books of the fathers whose children you sleep with that is very immoral. Based on these two opposing views. who is right? the fathers whose daughters is being defiled or the guy who enjoys the defilement. Can you see the folly of your argument?

So? That's how its always worked, even if one doesn't want to admit it. These days though civilized folk respect rights and try to cause as little harm/injury to other life as they can. Your religious morals, man made as they are, are constantly changing as well. Or do you think slavery is acceptable?

Sagamite: For your sake, I am taking that as a mis-spoke and you meant to say @frosbel?

You're supposed to be smart, figure it out

@f00028

You're making this very hard for me. You've actually made me agree with His Fucktardness. You say wiegraf is abusive then you quote him? You willing to accept your hypocrisy?

When you're being a moro.n and I point out you're being one, that's not abusive (maybe a little, but you're asking for it). If you don't understand at least the basics of an argument, try to stay away from it. Like just now with 'the smoke without fire' thing.

@sagamite, you're still a person


This is what you get when you open threads particularly to flame

Let me rain on your parade (a bit). The change is fairly undeniable, but she could always claim something else caused it if she feels like dancing around.


I party poop?

musKeeto: I'm not getting married till I find a lady like her.. :/

Great mod. Manmustwac too..

But Maclatunji's the best.. The mod-erer...

Bravo good ser. Please, take a bow

Old picture
Him get phd ne abi na medical doctor?

never_say_never: Everyone is entitled to his beliefs and opinions, so calling atheists fools won't change them, actions & probably miracles will. If christians were coerced into believing, science coerced atheists too. Some christians believe in science too, so how about a benefit of the doubt from atheists too?

You may have problems understanding the meaning of the word coerce. No one's threatening or bribing/manipulating us atheists to do anything. And xtians are given the benefit of the doubt, but have no evidence. If xtianity/whatever was not tagged 'religion' the respect would be a lot lower

If you think actions change people you think intolerance, baseless gay bashing and calling people who don't subscribe to your beliefs fools are the most productive route?

Why the need to change/convert one anyways. I, and most of us atheists it seems, could care less what religion you follow. It's the bigotry, intolerance, etc that shift us into action.

You think gay bashing is right? Give me cogent non-religious reasons why so? Pls, no opinions as well

never_say_never: Eunny, but what if they're same, ever thought of that? Football's all about winning, so if you play either like Chelsea or Barcelona to win the cup...the end justifies the means.

I'm going to tell you how it looks to the average atheist (can't speak for all of us), so nothing personal. Though you shouldn't care much for our opinions as we're 'fools' in xtianspeak anyhow. Pascal's wager is generally considered extremely cowardly and self-serving: you believe in god because you're scared or concerned primarily with your self-preservation, not because you're a good person or god is a good deity. You've been coerced/blackmailed into believing.

The other arguments in this thread, you guys genuinely think the average atheist has not seen them tirelessly before? The ones floating in this thread are of the lowest quality....

And no, most of you haven't heard or given anti-theist arguments any decent thought. Mostly just sheeple in here from what I can tell. There are religious that have given their faith proper consideration though, I doubt most of those would be blindly intolerant.

When a bigot or two pop in just to drop completely inane comments I can pat myself on the back and go "good job wie, good job".
I suppose this will do. For now...

fellis: later then night owl

sleep well

Crap, still haven't started, as you can see...

Paris-Love:

What's this thread about?

Cry for help?

So just because couple of threads were created in a few weeks questioning atheist belief(or non belief) that this guy suddenly turned into an atheist evangelist preaching tolerance.

Never knew the religion of gays is also for the lily-livered

That's some but.t hurt right there. May I ask why?

fellis: ^wiegraf why do you like long posts so much?

I'm terrible at managing my time. Ego trip. Everything is connected, etc. And they are actually rather abbreviated... Usually rather longer in my head sadly. Explains why it takes me forever to do anything.

fellis: anyway, you did the same thing I did in your topic. Why do I say so? Because you said 'religious tolerance' as if it was every single religion you were talking about instead of just the Christian religion. You should have written 'The Christian religion's tolerance *sarcasm*'

No, I use 'religious' tolerance because it applies to not just xtianity (I'm looking at you too, muslims). Quite a few others are as hypocritical or worse than xtianity, even some that don't involve god(s)

fellis: Secondly, you cannot decide to hurt truth's feelings because you suspect that he is lying he might be telling the truth afterall and if so, you end up offending him. What stops you from employing diplomacy and tact instead of writing careless and hurtful words?

Hush with all that mushy hurtful words shenanigans. He's an adult. Not careless anyways, like I told I don't think he deserves much respect. I dish it out according to my opinion of the person. Even while messing with you I use kapish only after you used it no? Subjective but meh...


G'night
Now, to actually do some work...hopefully....

fellis:

But that was how you generalized in your thread topic. Why have you decided to act like it is such a big deal because I did the same thing?

Because atheists don't have a moral code, or make any claims to morality, etc. Humanists etc? yes. atheist? No. It's simply a stand on god(s). So if I'm being a douche, atheism has nothing to do with it. If I were say humanist, you could look up humanist doctrine and search if there were something in there that explicitly encouraged me to be a douche. I make my own code though, so when I'm a douche, it's all me.

Xtianity/islam on the other hand, adherents would claim to subscribe their religion's moral code. When they're bad, depending on context, their behavior may have been engendered by their religion's doctrines. In this case, definitely so. She cut off relations with her sister because of her religious beliefs. Unbelievers are fools, burn in hell, don't influence my kids etc etc.

Btw, considering said religion advertises itself as one of love, that's fairly hypocritical, no?

fellis: As for the Ti Dom; yes, I do cringe but I also consider the fact that other people might not see things the way I do, and so I try to be sensitive with their feelings

*See sexist remarks below.
Again, considering possible slander, 'hurting his feelings' is an acceptable risk. If he's lying he's doing a fairly terrible thing, which could potentially affect a lot people as he's subtly encouraging intolerance. Insidious, really. He should back up his claims or STFU. That's standard operating behavior over here anyways.

fellis:

You've never heard of xtianophobia or atheistphobia**, but you've heard of islamophobia, yes? Do you think maybe that's because fellow (tolerant, like the ones in said country below) muslims have been whinning about persecution little to much.




*you're a woman, you're expected to dish out Fe (or Fi) a lot in this society. Else you'd probably be ostracized one way or the other. Sorry. If I were female I dunno, I'd probably still tell a lot of ppl f.uck you when they cross that invisible line even I sometimes don't notice till after the breach (but my line is fairly relaxed imo). I could sit here and talk of course. Anyways, I obviously care little for social norms I think illogical. So long as they hinder the truth, f.uck em


** which should be popular btw, as we really are well persecuted in many parts of the world, iirc there's even a predominantly muslim country that doesn't allow anti-theists into its borders. Along with maybe jewphobia (different from anti-semitism maybe).

aguiyi: woe unto them who say there is no God

Some loving, charitable xtians in the house today

fellis: Wow!
A fine example of atheists' morals on display here.

Correction, a fine example of an atheists' morals here. Or of wie's morals to be more accurate. There is no such thing as an atheistic moral code, or doctrine etc. Attack humanists, or secularists (though many are religious). Anyways I'm damn proud of it (as you would be too you Ti dom), the truth is more important than emotions. Being Ti dom, look me in the eye and tell me you don't cringe when you see the silly "think of the children" mentality overplayed.

fellis: I don't understand.............

Have you ever heard of xtianophobia, or atheistophobia?

@ihe, but this is a wonderful topic...

@cyrexx, I'd say that's more some sort of humanist, maybe

@op, at least we won't have to listen to gospel music, xtian rock, etc *shivers*

fellis: Whatever.



Firstly, you should be careful what you write. If truthislight is being completely honest then you are hurting his feelings by saying words like,'his story is convenient'. You can't prove it false so stop saying it is.

The truth is that bad atheists exist regardless of whether the story is true or false. Kapish?

You guyz should stop pulling the persecution card every chance you get.

He is very likely lying, which is a particularly nasty thing to do, as it spreads intolerance. Even if he isn't I don't care much about hurting his feelings, it's an acceptable price to pay to verify his story. He can always defend himself, kapish? Perhaps you think truth is deserving of some sort of respect or the other but after yesterday's display elsewhere he's getting absolutely non from me.

And you woreva the first part you're ignoring the fact that her case isn't paper thin unlike mr truth.

As for the persecution charge. Hmm, let's see, a muslim claiming others are using the persecution card? Need I go on?

kayjegs: Okay. Is there any moral duties of a parent to a child? You are not realistic brother. Will you just have a child and say he or she is free to do whatever she likes. Please..lets not deceive ourselves all in the name that you are a liberal man. What you can tell me that I can agree with you is that perhaps if the child is no longer under your roof, of course no one will know whatever he or she does but as long as he/she is under your roof, you wont allow it. Dont just try and flex one muscle as if you are the only liberal person in the world.

It seems to me that apart from being someone who expects others to base decisions on whether they please you or not you're also some sort of mind reader. Or perhaps it's simply that your arrogance extends to thinking you would know exactly what I would do. I have already told you what I'd do, don't put words in my mouth.

fellis: Now that I think of it, maybe OP's story was fabricated.

Hmmmmm......

Liars everywhere.........

Op is a known blogger and columnist. She's made an eulogy available online which she'll present at the funeral (in the spirit of the post, just not as scathing). Considering there are likely to be readers of hers ready to defend her sister's legacy at the funeral if she deviates they are likely to cry foul. Actually if she were pulling a stunt her in-laws etc would have cried foul already

TruthIsLight is just weird, and the story a bit too convenient, yes?


Devil worshiping moral lacking atheists and their world domination plans must be stopped.

kayjegs: This is my question to all those saying, its her or his decision:

If your son at that particular age too says he is feeling somehow and that she wants to change to a girl or vice-versa for your girl, what will you do? Will you allow it in the name of liberalism? These questions goes majorly to the moralists, atheists and free-thinkers here. Be very sincere.

Irrelevant. Completely. That is what I want, not what the op tranny and her parents want. I have absolutely no right to tell her/them what to do when it does not affect me or anyone else in any single way. Simple. How arrogant to even assume my opinion should have any weight on their decision. Are they alive to please me?

Either ways, if I were in the west I would, without a doubt. Over here, I'd have to find a way to get her out first considering the sheer amount of 'love' and 'tolerance' you abrahamics have.