i read comments from pple justifying trinity by quoting mt 3:16&17. is just heart aching dat u did not also notice dat a voice approved jesus there. whose voice was dat, jesus's? even stephen confirmed in acts 7:55&56 dats he saw jesus standing at d right hand of God and not inside God.
beside i noticed dat d trinitarians are more of insulting pls try and be more of christians(peace)even if u ve d wrong believe.

frosbel:

95% of bibles are in total agreement, no please don't tempt me to talk about the Quran or even ISLAM , trust me I am always ready for this debate as well ,

Let us just say that the Bible , Jesus and PAUL support ONE GOD ONLY , but MEN , especially those wicked evil men in the Vatican have used tradition and paganism to corrupt their Catholicism.

nobody said God isnt 1

You are a Muslim so I expect you to know much about the Catholic crusades and how they massacred tens of thousands of Muslims, Christians and Jews who rejected their Pagan creeds.

frosbel are u kidding me Have u added distortion of historical facts to ur already long list of deeds Go and asked the muslim what caused the crusades, go and asked them, nobody asked muslims to accept any creed, even in the time of muhamed wen he was persecuted d muslim usually run to xtian states like constantinople, ask them if i am lying, yet the same muslims invaded constantinople and israel and imposed their religion, go and check history, they went futher, almost all the historical christain sees were invaded, alexander, constantinople and antioch, did i lie muslim? The crusade really started wen either xtians decide to liberate Jerusalem or wen the muslims decided to invade the west, the wanted to invade spain after they had succeeded in defeating the whole xtian east, wen the war at spain came the pope had to call a crusade and yet d xtians were outnumber but forced the muslims to retreat. Make research and stop making silly claims

Ubenedictus: and all christians must obey christ wu said that he shuld b honor as his fada is. The honor given to d fada is worship, the son asked for d same honor, are u xtian gonna tell christ he doesnt deserve it? Besides my bible tell me that the father confirms that all the angels shuld worship his son. Ijawkid u are on ur own here, both fada and son must be worship and glorified.
Peace

You can't worship 2 persons...that 'll be idolatry.....

Honour and revere Jesus the high priest of God ,but give full worship to Yahweh.......

Yahweh is the only true God....abi u never read that part for bible??

1. A religion with different constitution.
2. A confused religion.
3. A religion without a uniform way of worship.
4. A religion which was rebranded by paul after the death of Jesus.
5. A religion that you can formulate, implement and manipulated to your own taste and comfortability.

Ubenedictus: nobody said God is 3, we said in one God there are 3 person. Learn to differentiate person from being

This is heresy......

There are no 3. Persons in 1 God.....not @ al!!!!!!............l

The bible till today doesn't support this...........

Rather it is ""listen O isreal,Yahweh our GOD is 1 Yahweh""...

Learn to quote clear scriptures to support this catholic doctrine....

matrix789: IF YOU UNDERSTAND GOD then HE IS NOT GOD

trying to understand God with human knowledge.

For the scripture says "His ways are not our ways, neither are his thoughts our thoughts".

TRINITY is not three Gods, but three persons in ONE God.

We walk by faith, not by sight (or proof)

albacete:

trying to understand God with human knowledge.

For the scripture says "His ways are not our ways, neither are his thoughts our thoughts".

TRINITY is not three Gods, but three persons in ONE God.

We walk by faith, not by sight (or proof)

Please u both should put on your thinking caps and read deuteronomy 6:4........and stop living in mysteries........

When you can't prove a pagan doctrine you call it a mystery....

Jesus said to his fellow worshippers ""listen O isreal,Yahweh our God is 1 Yahweh"".....

Recite that same creed and forfeit the trinity...it dulls every adherent .......

LCASHMAN:
COMMON SENSE PEOPLE. THREE THINGS CANT BE ONE. IT IS T H R E E .THREE ORANGES PLUCKED FROM ONE TREE CANNOT BE ONE ORANGE.SIMPLE MATH. 1+1+1=3.
JOHN 17:3

but in marriage, 2 becomes 1, right? Though not in the real sense of the word.

In your analogy above, if an orange will give u vitamins and not protein, taking 3 oranges will still give u vitamins.

TRINITY is three in ONE, not THREE.

frosbel:

95% of bibles are in total agreement, no please don't tempt me to talk about the Quran or even ISLAM , trust me I am always ready for this debate as well ,

Let us just say that the Bible , Jesus and PAUL support ONE GOD ONLY , but MEN , especially those wicked evil men in the Vatican have used tradition and paganism to corrupt their Catholicism.


You are a Muslim so I expect you to know much about the Catholic crusades and how they massacred tens of thousands of Muslims, Christians and Jews who rejected their Pagan creeds.

Dont bring Islam in here: The contradictions in the bible which u admit has nothing to do with Islam or muslims.You said "95% of bibles are in total agreement". Is the 5% not in agreement word of man or word of God? Is God contradicting Himself in the bibles? Of ccourse God is consistent in truth so the contracditions are evidence that a whopping 5% (by your own admission) of the bible is word of man. No wonder they keep revising it , even expunging whole portions: if you remove a portion of "word of God" it means you are saying what you are doing away with is not word of God. Now lets hear how you contradict yourself by trying to explain away this fraud of some people writing something and palming it off as word of God. Your pastime of islam bashing is no answer pls.

ijawkid:

You can't worship 2 persons...that 'll be idolatry.....

Honour and revere Jesus the high priest of God ,but give full worship to Yahweh.......

Yahweh is the only true God....abi u never read that part for bible??

and i also noticed that the name Yahweh doesnt refer to one person. Christ didnt just ask for honor, he ask to be honor even as his father. How do u honor d fada. My bible says "let the angels worship him" even d angel worship christ wow!

ijawkid:

This is heresy......

There are no 3. Persons in 1 God.....not @ al!!!!!!............l

The bible till today doesn't support this...........

Rather it is ""listen O isreal,Yahweh our GOD is 1 Yahweh""...

this simply says Yahweh is one it doesnt even exclude the posible of more than one person in Yahweh. U didnt proof ur position.

ijawkid:

Please u both should put on your thinking caps and read deuteronomy 6:4........and stop living in mysteries........

When you can't prove a pagan doctrine you call it a mystery....

Jesus said to his fellow worshippers ""listen O isreal,Yahweh our God is 1 Yahweh"".....

Recite that same creed and forfeit the trinity...it dulls every adherent .......

believe what u want Sir, i have said it again and again: God is TRINITY.

Nobody said it is 3 Yahwehs, it is 1 Yahweh in 3 persons. Read joe4christ's posts and get a better understanding of the trinity.

ijawkid:

Please u both should put on your thinking caps and read deuteronomy 6:4........and stop living in mysteries........

When you can't prove a pagan doctrine you call it a mystery....

Jesus said to his fellow worshippers ""listen O isreal,Yahweh our God is 1 Yahweh"".....

Recite that same creed and forfeit the trinity...it dulls every adherent .......

i think u have dull ur brain so u cant see what is right in front of u.

Ubenedictus: and i also noticed that the name Yahweh doesnt refer to one person. Christ didnt just ask for honor, he ask to be honor even as his father. How do u honor d fada. My bible says "let the angels worship him" even d angel worship christ wow!

The name Yahweh refers to 1 person...have u been dodging deuterenomy 6:4 and mark 12:29??.....

Show me from the bible where the name Yahweh doesn't belong to the Father alone??

You have come with your heresy once more.......

Jesus is mediating for you ,you can't literally worship him.....rather he (Jesus) channels your worship(that's if you have not murdered Yahweh) to Yahweh.........

......

That is the work of a mediator and a high priest....

Jesus is the channel through which our worship gets to Yahweh.....respect Jesus' office......if u worship Jesus the same u wanna do to Yahweh,then you are an idolater.....

Exclusive worship belongs to Yahweh alone..........

Angels don't offer worship to Jesus,they respect him as Yahwehs king designate and show that by bowing down........

The angels along with Jesus all worship Yahweh......get that into your catholic skull.....lol......

And b4 I forget,I hope mary too has a chair close to the Father,so that she can be called a high priestess......

It is everything and everybody you want to worship.......

Ubenedictus: i think u have dull ur brain so u cant see what is right in front of u.

No!!!!

Trinitarians are the ones who have been dulled overtime so as not to know who they are to worship.......

Jesus came down to the earth to show every1 who rightly deserves exclusive worship,but the trinity has squashed that....

Now people worship 3 peoples........now that my freind is called idoatry.....

Jesus worshipped Yahweh,imitate him.......

Listen O isreal and O nairalanders,Yahweh our God(I don't know if he Is the God of trinitarians) is 1 Yahweh........

Worship Yahweh........

Ubenedictus: u want to show me where d word bible is in d bible abi? U make me laugh

Their most unpopular phrase "show me where it is in the Bible".

Just like Thomas who said to Jesus "unless i see and put my hands on thy side where thou was pierced, i will not believe".

Ubenedictus: this simply says Yahweh is one it doesnt even exclude the posible of more than one person in Yahweh. U didnt proof ur position.

Your thoughts has got heresy written all over it......

Bible says Yahweh is 1,but u mr benidictus wants to turn that around...oya open scriptures show me.....

Soon you'll start going to sodom and gomorrah,cherry picking scriptures that have nothin to do with trinity and forcing trinity into it.......

Open where the bible says that Yahweh is more than 1 person or that many persons bare the name Yahweh....I dey here dey wait for you....

@ OP:

just one question--if Jesus isn't God, who is Jesus?

albacete:

believe what u want Sir, i have said it again and again: God is TRINITY.

Nobody said it is 3 Yahwehs, it is 1 Yahweh in 3 persons. Read joe4christ's posts and get a better understanding of the trinity.

Ur colleague here is saying Yahweh is name that belongs to more than 1 person.....that is heresy @ its peak.....

The trinity has no foundation in the bible...its an old pagan crap.....

God is 1 in 1...not 3 in 1......

God is 1 and not triune.....

Learn from Jesus and leave paganism alone.

passion007: @ OP:

just one question--if Jesus isn't God, who is Jesus?

Jesus himself said he was.

Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, He was asking His disciples, “Who do people say that the Son of Man is?” And they said, “Some say John the Baptist; and others, Elijah; but still others, Jeremiah, or one of the prophets.” He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” And Jesus said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.” (Matthew 16:13-17).

Jesus did not claim to be equal to God, he clearly humbled himslef and remained surbodinate to his Father, Jehovah.

passion007: @ OP:

just one question--if Jesus isn't God, who is Jesus?

Jesus is the son of God,servant of the most high,high priest of the most high,mediator between the 1 true God and man,apostle of Yahweh.....

You guys have become so obsseses with Jesus being God that u have forgotten who Jesus really is and what he is doing in the heavens......

[quote author=mu2sa2]Dont bring Islam in here: The contradictions in the bible which u admit has nothing to do with Islam or muslims.

I think you meant a small number of mistranslations.

You said "95% of bibles are in total agreement". Is the 5% not in agreement word of man or word of God?

Each bible when read in the proper context contains the truth of GOD's word.

The letters themselves are dead which is why you do not see us rioting when a bible is burnt.

What brings these letters to live is the Spirit of GOD. In others words a true believer will experience a rebirth through God's Spirit and the wisdom of GOD provides the resource and logic to correctly decipher the true meanings of God's WORD.

It is also true to say that there are other books that were not included, suffice me to say that the most important books such as the TORAH and Prophets and Psalms and Proverbs are included and these are the main body of Jewish scripture which btw Jesus used and so did all the apostles.

Then we have the 4 gospels which give account of the life , sayings and command of JESUS, the Acts of the Apostles which is an account of the start of the first church , the pioneers, the pattern of worship and living, experiences , miracles and wonders.

Finally we have the book of revelation which contains prophecy of the beginning of the end and the end.

Let me repeat the BIBLE contains the words of GOD but the Spirit of GOD breathes life into those words and this is what makes them divinely inspired.

Is God contradicting Himself in the bibles? Of ccourse God is consistent in truth so the contracditions are evidence that a whopping 5% (by your own admission) of the bible is word of man.

caused my mistranslations but when the bible is read with the inspiration of God's Spirit it all adds up.

No wonder they keep revising it , even expunging whole portions:

They revise it to make it more understandable in TODAY's english, surely you do not expect us to be reciting and chanting our scripture in ancient Hebrew and Greek, right ?

if you remove a portion of "word of God" it means you are saying what you are doing away with is not word of God.

We have the WORD of GOD , this WORD is 1000& Complete and this WORD of GOD is Christ JESUS, the Son of the Living GOD.

God speaks to us in these last days through his SON.

Now lets hear how you contradict yourself by trying to explain away this fraud of some people

mostly a very few verses here and there in the KJV which were mostly additions and not removals.

Your pastime of islam bashing is no answer pls.

I don't need to bash ISLAM , your pals in the North and elsewhere show us that they truly believe in ONE GOD by their acts.

Besides, believing in ONE GOD means nothing if you are living in your SINs and still in bondage to them, even SATAN and demons believe in ONE GOD and they are still heading for the lake of fire.

Belief in ONE GOD must also be accompanied by a belief in the MESSIAH Jesus and repentance from SINS.

Screaming GOD is ONE forever while killing , lying, stealing , lusting etc is a total waste of time, God is not deceived by an outward show of righteousness.

Why the Trinity of God-Head as taught by religion will never be discerned by mediocre men of faith is understandable, because religion is mythical dogma animated by faith. Religion will never understand God until it refuses to be dogma. Knowledge of God lies in understanding of mystery. Only Mysticism goes that far. True answers about God lies with the Mystics. In essence, Trinity is Paganism that found its way into Christianity. Both Paganism and Christianity are different channels of mythical dogma, both lack adept knowledge of what real God is.

stop arguing with devil incarnates!

dont throw your pearls before swine!

he that will perish will perish and that without remedy!

vanminister: stop arguing with devil incarnates!

dont throw your pearls before swine!

he that will perish will perish and that without remedy!

Only in Christianity and Islam are fellow humans with diverse belief system be termed, swines, devil incarnates and infidels. Is that Godly ? Yes, as Godly as the Gods of ChrIslam

if the righteous are scarcely saved where shall the sinner and the ungodly appear?

D truth of d matter is dat ppl dat won't believe in d trinity concept won't as long as their hearts are hardened... But I have just this thot 2 share...Christians fondly say, Jesus is Lord. Christians also fondly say my Lord and my God, maker of the heavens and d earth...d trinity is very simple 2 understand if ure open-minded.

frosbel: Trinitarians insist that you worship a different God if you do not have a three-person-God as they do. Therefore, by their own admission, they have a different God than Jesus did and Jesus' God was a different God than their God. Jesus' God was not a Trinity, a Triune being, a three-person-God. His God was a one-person-being, his Father alone. Will Trinitarians then confess that their God is a different God than Jesus' God?

Oddly enough, they implicitly do confess their God is a different God than Jesus' God. My God, for example, is exactly the same as Jesus' God. His God was the Father alone and my God is the Father alone. But since my God is not their three person God, Trinitarians insist that necessarily means I have a different God than they do.

But if I have a different God than Trinitarians do, then so did/does Jesus my Lord. My God is his Father alone and his God was, and is, his Father alone. They are identical.

What then does this tell you about the men who desire to persecute those who do not serve their God but rather serve the exact same God as Jesus?

Why would you want to have a different God than Jesus?

I ascend to my Father and your Father, and my God and your God.
- Jesus my Lord


Jesus has made us to be kings and priests to His God and Father.
-John


You turned to the God from idols to serve a Living and true God, and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, that is Jesus, who rescues us from the wrath to come.
- Paul

Jesus has made his disciples to be kings and priests to who? To his God and Father. That's the God Jesus' disciples serve, the Lord's God, his Father alone, Jesus' God and Father.

Jesus served his Father alone as his only true God. He instructs his disciples that his God is their God. Yet Trinitarians claim that serving the Father alone is to have a "different God." And indeed, they will even claim that to have a different God than the Trinity means you cannot be a Christian and you will not be saved.

But Jesus had a different God than the Trinity. His God was not the Trinity but was the Father alone. Have Trinitarians then condemned Jesus for having a different God?

[size=20pt]@Frosbel, [/size]my question is "How does belief in the God who manifested as Father, as Son, as the Holy Spirit affect my salvation"! please kindly state scriptural basis of why my belief in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ Jesus, be affected, by my belief in how God manifest Himself as Jesus Christ, who also sealed me with the Holy Spirit! That is all i did like to know from you. thanks

hisblud:

[size=20pt]@Frosbel, [/size]my question is "How does belief in the God manifest as Father, as Son, as the Holy Spirit affect my salvation"! please kindly state scriptural basis of why my belief in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ Jesus be affected by my belief in how God manifest Himself as Jesus Christ, who also sealed me with the Holy Spirit! That is all i did like to know from you. thanks

Good question.

I was saved as a Trinitarian, in my opinion what matters is that we believe in the messiahship of Christ, the washing away of our sins by his blood, the rebirth by the Spirit of of GOD the Father and the Fatherhood of GOD.

Salvation can ONLY be found in JESUS, if you believe in HIM , are baptised and repent from ALL your Sins then You or I or anyone for that matter will be saved.

Quite shockingly , if you believe in ONE GOD like I do and also believe in Jesus Christ , according to those Trinitarians this is not enough , we have to believe JESUS is GOD to be saved. This is a LIE of SATAN and is found nowhere in the bible.

Also , this wicked doctrine prevents others who are confused by it's illogicality from coming into the kingdom.

So your concern should not be about YOU , but Others, and how can you bring them into the KINGDOM with the TRUTH and not the LIE that GOD is 3.

frosbel:

Good question.

I was saved as a Trinitarian, in my opinion what matters is that we believe in the messiahship of Christ, the washing away of our sins by his blood, the rebirth by the Spirit of of GOD the Father and the Fatherhood of GOD.

Salvation can ONLY be found in JESUS, if you believe in HIM , are baptised and repent from ALL your Sins then You or I or anyone for that matter will be saved.

Quite shockingly , if you believe in ONE GOD like I do and also believe in Jesus Christ , according to those Trinitarians this is not enough , we have to believe JESUS is GOD to be saved. This is a LIE of SATAN and is found nowhere in the bible.

Also , this wicked doctrine prevents others who are confused by it's illogicality from coming into the kingdom.

So your concern should not be about YOU , but Others, and how can you bring them into the KINGDOM with the TRUTH and not the LIE that GOD is 3.

Frosbel! Frosbel! Frosbel!

Well, thanks for ur contributions so far.
What matters is our relationship with God, not our beliefs (or non-beliefs)

Do have a lovely day!

frosbel:

Good question.

I was saved as a Trinitarian, in my opinion what matters is that we believe in the messiahship of Christ, the washing away of our sins by his blood, the rebirth by the Spirit of of GOD the Father and the Fatherhood of GOD.

Salvation can ONLY be found in JESUS, if you believe in HIM , are baptised and repent from ALL your Sins then You or I or anyone for that matter will be saved.

Quite shockingly , if you believe in ONE GOD like I do and also believe in Jesus Christ , according to those Trinitarians this is not enough , we have to believe JESUS is GOD to be saved. This is a LIE of SATAN and is found nowhere in the bible.

Also , this wicked doctrine prevents others who are confused by it's illogicality from coming into the kingdom.

So your concern should not be about YOU , but Others, and how can you bring them into the KINGDOM with the TRUTH and not the LIE that GOD is 3.

In essense what you are emphasizing is that some make it mandatory before you are saved which is contrary to the gospel (1 cor 15) and based on that i agree that the belief in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ Jesus is the only Gospel by which am saved. However, since i believe in the Gospel and sealed with the Spirit of God, i will consider what you say and allow Him to convict me for or against the God manifested as Father, Son and the Holy Ghost.

Sleek05: D truth of d matter is dat ppl dat won't believe in d trinity concept won't as long as their hearts are hardened... But I have just this thot 2 share...Christians fondly say, Jesus is Lord. Christians also fondly say my Lord and my God, maker of the heavens and d earth...d trinity is very simple 2 understand if ure open-minded.

Jesus can be called Lord, God can reffered to as Lord if one wishes. It doesn 't make them same person. Abraham was referred to as Lord by Sarah. Today Judges are called Lords. Lord is a title of honour.

But there is only one Most High and Almighty God - Jehovah ( Yahweh), who is the maker of the heaveans and earth. Jesus Christ is his beloved servant, get his authority from God and and is surbodinate to Jehovah.

That they may know that thou alone, whose name is Jehovah, Art the Most High over all the earth. - Psalm 83:18. (Only Jehovah is Most High)

I can do nothing on my own. I judge as God tells me. Therefore, my judgment is just, because I carry out the will of the one who sent me, not my own will - John 5:30. (Jesus humbles himself before God, the Almighty. )

For the Scriptures say, "God has put all things under his authority." (Of course, when it says "all things are under his authority," that does not include God himself, who gave Christ his authority.) - 1 Corinthians 15:27