u do realize that i am critical of both western and anti-western philosophies?? or are we going to just spew lies here??

I think I missed your criticism of "western philosophies".

richyblack already fooled u.

richyblack already schooled u,

bawomolo:

the khmer rouge and communist paramillitary operated in laos and cambodia respectively. the khmer rougue basically had control of cambodia. do u realize that the prince of cambodia was removed from power. both countries were bombed since the vietcong used them as a safehaven. a truly neutral nation like switzerland wouldn't have been bombed.

u do realize that i am critical of both western and anti-western philosophies?? or are we going to just spew lies here??

richyblack already fooled u.

All you're trying to convey is that the US bombed neutral countries. Are you surprised? I've used your own source to show you that those countries were neutral and you're still arguing. Mind you, that they are neutral means that they couldn't even prevent the Khmer Rouge from operating in their territory - I'm really hoping you understand the consequences of neutrality. America only bombed those neutral countries to disrupt rebel supplies that went through the Ho Chi Minh Trail. The key question is who produced the bulk of the supplies that went through the HCM Trail? We all know the answer.

Back to topic.

This is the man of the moment!

The Great Hugo "Boss" himself.

Richy I have a couple of questions for you, hope you dont mind? are you Nigerian? are you a socialist?

JayFK:

Richy I have a couple of questions for you, hope you don't mind? are you Nigerian? are you a socialist?

You can be both. The great Awolowo was a socialist and a Nigerian. Where are you going with this anyway? What has this to do with the topic?

JayFK:

Richy I have a couple of questions for you, hope you don't mind? are you Nigerian? are you a socialist?

Good questions.
1. I'm a Nigerian.
2. I hold many socialist views but do not support every single view that has ever been attributed to Socialism.

Now that I've been gentlmanly enough to answer your questions, can you answer mine?

Why do you ask?

Thanks.

Mind you, that they are neutral means that they couldn't even prevent the Khmer Rouge from operating in their territory

this is false, the cambodian prince was actively fighting against the khmer rouge in the country.

The region Pol Pot and the others moved to was inhabited by tribal minorities, the Khmer Loeu, whose rough treatment (including resettlement and forced assimilation) at the hands of the central government made them willing recruits for a guerrilla struggle. In 1965, Pol Pot made a visit of several months to North Vietnam and China. He probably received some training in China, which must have enhanced his prestige when he returned to the WPK's liberated areas. Despite friendly relations between Norodom Sihanouk and the Chinese, the latter kept Pol Pot's visit a secret from Sihanouk. In September 1966, the party changed its name to the Communist Party of Kampuchea (CPK). The change in the name of the party was a closely guarded secret. Lower ranking members of the party and even the Vietnamese were not told of it and neither was the membership until many years later. The party leadership endorsed armed struggle against the government, then led by Sihanouk. In 1967, several small-scale attempts at insurgency were made by the CPK but they had little success.

In 1968, the Khmer Rouge forces launched a national insurgency across Cambodia (see also Cambodian Civil War). Though North Vietnam had not been informed of the decision, its forces provided shelter and weapons to the Khmer Rouge after the insurgency started. Vietnamese support for the insurgency made it impossible for the Cambodian military to effectively counter it. For the next two years the insurgency grew as Sihanouk did very little to stop it. As the insurgency grew stronger, the party finally openly declared itself to be the Communist Party of Kampuchea (CPK).

America only bombed those neutral countries to disrupt rebel supplies that went through the Ho Chi Minh Trail.

both countries were neutral only in words, evidence have shown the trail was sign of communist activity. again it's funny how u diverted the thread from it's original purpose.

You can be both. The great Awolowo was a socialist and a Nigerian. Where are you going with this anyway? What has this to do with the topic?

awolowo had liberal progressive views. pls stop with the lies again.

[size=16pt]US intelligence helped us strike rebel leader: Colombia[/size]
The Times of India
4 Mar 2008, 0459 hrs IST,AFP

BOGOTA: US intelligence helped Colombia carry out a weekend strike against a FARC rebel camp inside Ecuador that has triggered a regional crisis and military standoff, Colombian officials said Monday.

Colombian police chief General Oscar Naranjo told reporters "it's no secret" that his country's agencies have "a very strong alliance with federal agencies of the United States," though he did not specify which ones.

The raid early Sunday that killed Raul Reyes, reputed to be the number two leader of the insurgent Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC), was an "autonomous operation" that relied on information from several sources, he said.

A high-placed official in the Colombian defense ministry said on condition of anonymity that it was a US intelligence agency that first told Bogota several weeks ago that Reyes was sporadically using a satellite telephone, whose signal could be pinpointed.

"The United States handed over the identification of the satellite telephone to (Colombian) police intelligence units, which in turn processed the information and was tasked with finding the location of the telephone," the official said.

"There were also informants," the source said. "Once the police located the satellite phone, General Naranjo informed the defense minister, Juan Manuel Santos, so that he could coordinate the operation," he explained.

"The United States did not participate directly in this information, but its help was vital in leading us to the site where Reyes was," the official said.

Reyes, real name Luis Edgar Devia, 59, was killed along with 16 other rebels and one Colombian soldier. He was considered the right-hand man to 77-year-old FARC leader Manuel "Tirofijo" ("Sureshot" Marulanda and his likely successor.

The raid took place 1.8 kilometers (one mile) inside Ecuador, sparking a regional crisis and the rupture of diplomatic relations between Quito and Bogota.

Ecuador and its ally Venezuela have ordered troops to mass on their borders with Colombia, raising the specter of armed conflict between the two OPEC members and Washington's main South American ally.

The United States, which considers the FARC a "terrorist" group, has said it supported Colombia's cross-border strike but denied providing any material aid.

State Department deputy spokesman Tom Casey, asked whether Washington provided any intelligence or logistical support for the operation, replied: "Look, I'm not aware of any US government role in this particular military event."

He said Bogota was an important ally, and he urged Colombia and Ecuador to work out their differences diplomatically.

"Certainly, we expect that that's how this is going to be resolved. And I don't think anybody, at this point, ought to be talking about military action," Casey said.

Asked whether Bogota had given Washington advance notice of the strike, Casey replied: "No, I'm not aware that we found out about this other than after the fact."

bawomolo:

this is false, the cambodian prince was actively fighting against the khmer rouge in the country.

@bawomolo,

How far with you? Seems you're shooting yourself in the foot. If the Cambodian Prince was fighting against the Khmer Rouge (an anti-US group), doesn't that support the point I made earlier that Cambodia was neutral but at times was pro-Western?

Nna dis man don taya me o!

awolowo had liberal progressive views. please stop with the lies again.

Awolowo refered to himself as a socialist many times. Where are the lies?

RichyBlacK:

Good questions.
1. I'm a Nigerian.
2. I hold many socialist views but do not support every single view that has ever been attributed to Socialism.

Now that I've been gentlmanly enough to answer your questions, can you answer mine?

Why do you ask?

Thanks.

1. I ask because not a lot of Nigerians hold socialist views.
2. Curiosity, I hold some socialist views myself so,

Tornadoz:

You can be both. The great Awolowo was a socialist and a Nigerian. Where are you going with this anyway? What has this to do with the topic?

no harm done

How far with you? Seems you're shooting yourself in the foot. If the Cambodian Prince was fighting against the Khmer Rouge (an anti-US group), doesn't that support the point I made earlier that Cambodia was neutral but at times was pro-Western?

u do realize his govenrment was overran in 3years with the support of the north vietnamese army.  North vietnamese controlled laos and cambodia de factor. the US bombed those countries for a reason. again why are we diverting the main topic??

bawomolo:

u do realize his govenrment was overran in 3years with the support of the north vietnamese army. North vietnamese controlled laos and cambodia de factor. the US bombed those countries for a reason. again why are we diverting the main topic??

Then get back to topic.

You now see that the Americans were part of the planners of this gross violation of international law.

Where is that 4Him guy who was screaming "conspiracy theorist" when I pointed out that Uribe no get the liver to just enter another country like that without telling oga for White House. The truth is being revealed!

@JayFK
I thought you were one of these neo-cons that go out of their way to distort history. Welcome aboard buddy.

JayFK:

1. I ask because not a lot of Nigerians hold socialist views.
2. Curiosity, I hold some socialist views myself so,

You're right about Nigerians and their socialist views. Many Nigerians tend to be capitalists, especially the young upwardly mobile crop. As immigrants in North America, especially the US, they are usually torn apart politically - they like the conservative message and pro-business clime of the Republican party, but also like the socially liberal and pro-people policies of the democrats. They mostly gravitate to the left, ultimately becoming Democrats.

I support all socialist views except any view that encourages abortion, or any view that involves the killing innocent people, no matter how lofty the goals may be. Any other socialist view is fine with me.

Tornadoz:

@JayFK
I thought you were one of these neo-cons that go out of their way to distort history. Welcome aboard buddy.

@Tornadoz,

It seems JayFK is one of the good souls out there.


@JayFK,

1. What are some of your socialist views?
2. Do you disagree with any of mine?

Thanks.

1. Non Intervention
2. Anti Imperialism/Puppet states
3. I'm all for communal ownership and a classless society however it should not be a one party system like the Soviets.
4. I'm against racism, tribalism, homophobia and I'm all for gender equality
5. Promotions and salaries should be awarded based on merit and education

although It should be kind of a Socialist/capitalist society much like modern China and Sweden

I used to view Venezuela and Cuba as the more advanced countries in South America I mean compare them to the rest of South America. But it seems like Chavez has decided to devote his energies to aggravating the United States

I disagree with your view on abortion though. I feel women should have the right to decide what is best for them, if she's married then it should be the couple's choice.

JayFK:

1. Non Intervention
2. Anti Imperialism/Puppet states
3. I'm all for communal ownership and a classless society however it should not be a one party system like the Soviets.
4. I'm against racism, tribalism, homophobia and I'm all for gender equality
5. Promotions and salaries should be awarded based on merit and education

although It should be kind of a Socialist/capitalist society much like modern China and Sweden

I used to view Venezuela and Cuba as the more advanced countries in South America I mean compare them to the rest of South America. But it seems like Chavez has decided to devote his energies to aggravating the United States

I disagree with your view on abortion though. I feel women should have the right to decide what is best for them, if she's married then it should be the couple's choice.

I agree with your views except for the Chavez issue. I believe the US is the one trying to aggravate the situation. Current US foreign policy scores an F grade on any scale.

On abortion, I agree that a woman has the right to choose but disagree that minors (under 18) should be provided abortion services without BOTH parental notification and consent. Only if there is cause to believe that the minor is in some form of imminent danger which either led to the abortion or that manifests as a result of the abortion, that the authorities can defer to the choice of the minor on whether to go ahead with the abortion or not.

If my daughter is provided abortion in her school clinic without the school notifying me and without my explicit consent, and I later find out while she's still under my care, I'll either disown that daughter and/or do things to the responsible personnel that will guarantee my going to jail.

@JayFK,

Just have some questions or observations regarding your input. I'll try and relate them to the topic at hand.

1. Non Intervention

While every one knows the US is guilty of this, would you say the same regarding Hugo Chavez? Isn't his escalation of this crisis intervention? I still have a hard time figuring out why he is so involved with this to the extent that he sent out troops to his borders ahead of the country whose territorial integrity is in question

2. Anti Imperialism/Puppet states

US and others lead the pack here. But tell me, isn't Chavez guilty of the same?

3. I'm all for communal ownership and a classless society however it should not be a one party system like the Soviets.

Communal ownership of what?

4. I'm against racism, tribalism, homophobia and I'm all for gender equality

The US is arguably the most tolerant country in this regard.

5. Promotions and salaries should be awarded based on merit and education

Is this possible if communal ownership is encouraged? Communal ownership requires all to receive same salary irrespective of individual output. Communal ownership is diametrically opposed to capitalism. While capitalism encourages individual compensation based on efforts, communal ownership doesn't.

although It should be kind of a Socialist/capitalist society much like modern China and Sweden

You want the best of both worlds ehn? If a society is prosperous through capitalism, why the need to make the State a welfare clearing house? If everyone has the opportunity to pursuit of wealth and happiness, why should others live on the sweat of others when they could also be contributing to nation building?

I used to view Venezuela and Cuba as the more advanced countries in South America I mean compare them to the rest of South America. But it seems like Chavez has decided to devote his energies to aggravating the United States

It is not only the US that he is aggravating. The guy just seems to like attention, good or bad. I do not see any wisdom in his actions. His main problem with Colombia is because it isn't run by a leftist like him.

I disagree with your view on abortion though. I feel women should have the right to decide what is best for them, if she's married then it should be the couple's choice.

Tell me, what rights does the baby have if any?

RichyBlacK:

[size=16pt]US intelligence helped us strike rebel leader: Colombia[/size]
The Times of India
4 Mar 2008, 0459 hrs IST,AFP

BOGOTA: US intelligence helped Colombia carry out a weekend strike against a FARC rebel camp inside Ecuador that has triggered a regional crisis and military standoff, Colombian officials said Monday.

Colombian police chief General Oscar Naranjo told reporters "it's no secret" that his country's agencies have "a very strong alliance with federal agencies of the United States," though he did not specify which ones.

The raid early Sunday that killed Raul Reyes, reputed to be the number two leader of the insurgent Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC), was an "autonomous operation" that relied on information from several sources, he said.

A high-placed official in the Colombian defense ministry said on condition of anonymity that it was a US intelligence agency that first told Bogota several weeks ago that Reyes was sporadically using a satellite telephone, whose signal could be pinpointed.

"The United States handed over the identification of the satellite telephone to (Colombian) police intelligence units, which in turn processed the information and was tasked with finding the location of the telephone," the official said.
"There were also informants," the source said. "Once the police located the satellite phone, General Naranjo informed the defense minister, Juan Manuel Santos, so that he could coordinate the operation," he explained.

"The United States did not participate directly in this information, but its help was vital in leading us to the site where Reyes was," the official said.

Reyes, real name Luis Edgar Devia, 59, was killed along with 16 other rebels and one Colombian soldier. He was considered the right-hand man to 77-year-old FARC leader Manuel "Tirofijo" ("Sureshot" Marulanda and his likely successor.

The raid took place 1.8 kilometers (one mile) inside Ecuador, sparking a regional crisis and the rupture of diplomatic relations between Quito and Bogota.

Ecuador and its ally Venezuela have ordered troops to mass on their borders with Colombia, raising the specter of armed conflict between the two OPEC members and Washington's main South American ally.

The United States, which considers the FARC a[b] "terrorist"[/b] group,

has said it supported Colombia's cross-border strike but denied providing any material aid.

State Department deputy spokesman Tom Casey, asked whether Washington provided any intelligence or logistical support for the operation, replied: "Look, I'm not aware of any US government role in this particular military event."

He said Bogota was an important ally, and he urged Colombia and Ecuador to work out their differences diplomatically.

"Certainly, we expect that that's how this is going to be resolved. And I don't think anybody, at this point, ought to be talking about military action," Casey said.

Asked whether Bogota had given Washington advance notice of the strike, Casey replied: "No, I'm not aware that we found out about this other than after the fact."

This is the reason I dislike the US's foreign policies as regards the different countries in the world it deals with.  They pretend to be friends but you do not need to look far to realize they are the worst enemies you can ever ask for.  Two faced, malicious, rumor-mongering, paranoid faulty intellientia!!!!!  Anywhere there is a problem, the US has its nose in there.  I said it!  Like it takes a genius to figure out that our one and only US is a spiritual busy body tormenting other nations to cause problems with its neighbours all for selfish interests? US, the experts in sponsoring coups around the world just for their own selfish interests.

I SAID IT!!!!

No they are feigning ignorance in the true "Reganian alzheimer's" fashion.  I don't need to provide any links for the "evidence crazed group of bed-wetting Nairalanders. But just this one to see how the relationship between Iran and the US have got to this point as a result of their meddlesome, two-faced approach by the US.

http://www.parstimes.com/history/us_iran.html

The US-Iranian hostage crises come to mind! Famous words, "I am not aware"!!!  Bloody Liars!!!! See as they have denied the "COLUMBIANS abi na COLOMBIANS"?  All these countries that keep allying with the US for fist full of dollars should take note.  They will be used and dumped when the selfish goals of the US have been realized. When they have been exposed, the only thing the top spokes man will come out and say "we are not aware"! 

BTW, why is the deputy, Tom Casey coming out to take the fall for his boss? Why does the spokesman not come out and tell the world what he knows?   Useless liars! Always using fall guys to cover up their stinkin' mess.

WHERE IS CONDELEEZA RICE? Too busy cooking up some more terrorist shit of lies like her predecessor Collin "Uncle Tom" Powell!!   Useless people!!!

People never learn from history and as a result, history keeps repeating itself. Now the US has told Columbia abi na Colombia to go and sort out its difference with it's neighbours after causing them to strike first.  They are now left to hang out and dry.  Is this the way to win the 2008 elections?   What exactly are they thinking? The Colombians are now liars I see.


WONDERS!!!!

RichyBlacK:

I agree with your views except for the Chavez issue. I believe the US is the one trying to aggravate the situation. Current US foreign policy scores an F grade on any scale.


On abortion, I agree that a woman has the right to choose but disagree that minors (under 18) should be provided abortion services without BOTH parental notification and consent. Only if there is cause to believe that the minor is in some form of imminent danger which either led to the abortion or that manifests as a result of the abortion, that the authorities can defer to the choice of the minor on whether to go ahead with the abortion or not.

If my daughter is provided abortion in her school clinic without the school notifying me and without my explicit consent, and I later find out while she's still under my care, I'll either disown that daughter and/or do things to the responsible personnel that will guarantee my going to jail.

Obama/McCain, please move over. Here comes a better person than both of you combined fit to rule the world.

I say na you be the man RichyBlack. Common sense is not common. See as you deey grant interviews like no man's business. Nairaland deey trip for you I swear!

Good job!!!!!!

_{SAVE THE CHEERLEADER, SAVE THE WORLD!!!!!}

RichyBlacK:

The definition of terrorist is vague - one man terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. Also, there is no internationally agreed definition of the term "terrorist".

There is my friend:

According to the well known British 'rebel' MP - Tony Benn :

WAR is the TERRORISM of the rich on the poor, while TERRORISM is the WAR of the poor on the rich

My 7 point observations so far.

1. Its obvious we have a lot of really smart opionated people on N'land.

2. The political 'right' is represented largely by 4Him,4Play prob debosky.

3. The liberal left(Chavez & co) largely supported by almondjoy, RickBlack^{(has a Somali babe? where dem dey see such pple sef}

4. The right & the left may never agree.

5. Latest info indicates the FARC rebels supported Chavez while he was in prison on coup charges in'92 as well as his presidential campaign with money from drug trade,kidnappings etc.

5. 4Him & 4Play for all intents & puposes make the most sense

6. We may be really hypocritical at times,we enjoy the freedom and financial stability the US system guarantees but yet criticize its policies at the slightest opportunity, I say shame on you ,this is not to say Bush has all the right answers ,but i think we need to appraise things more realistically.

7. Like someone rightly noted Brazil's Lula has similar ideologies to Chavez but behaves himself like an adult,imagine threatening war because a drug peddling ,kidnapping gangstar got killed? ^{wetin we no go see for this world}


Just my 2 cents

@Debosky

This has absolutely no parallels to Israel and Gaza - Colombia went in and killed a Colombian national on foreign soil, not an Ecuadorean or any foreign national. It is simply a case of pursuing your enemies wherever they may hide. The only 'mistake' by Colombia was not informing Ecuador prior to the attack, which may have allowed the rebel to escape. It is nothing more than a storm in a teacup. This same FARC rebels killed the president's father, they deserve to be killed on the moon if they are found there.

This is the most dumb post i have seen in this our land. In Turkeys case everybody was aware that Turkey is going to strike even the iraqi government so the two incidence have no comparism of any sort. Many Gorgian terrorists are leaving in UK today, do Russia has the right to strike them anywhere in Uk territory with the say so of British Govt? Nah.

presido1:

@Debosky This is the most dumb post i have seen in this our land. In Turkeys case everybody was aware that Turkey is going to strike even the iraqi government so the two incidence have no comparism of any sort.

What does awareness have to do with anything? Does the legality of the US's invasion of Iraq hinge on people's awareness beforehand?

Many Gorgian terrorists are leaving in UK today, do Russia has the right to strike them anywhere in Uk territory with the say so of British Govt? Nah.

Georgian terrorists?Like who? Make no mistake though,if the UK was a small nation within Russia's military reach,Russia will strike if it harbored terrorists who use the UK as a military base to attack Russia.History tells us that Russia does not shy away from breaching such niceties as "territorial integrity" in pursuit of its interests.

You don wake? I see you survived last night! ^^^^^^^^

4 Play:

What does awareness have to do with anything? Does the legality of the US's invasion of Iraq hinge on people's awareness beforehand?

Georgian terrorists?Like who? Make no mistake though,if the UK was a small nation within Russia's military reach,[b]Russia will strike if it harbored terrorists who use the UK as a military base to attack Russia.[/b]History tells us that Russia does not shy away from breaching such niceties as "territorial integrity" in pursuit of its interests.

Then why are we having problems with Chavez? What is the difference? Not credible enough by any G8 standards I presume?

almondjoy:

You don wake? I see you survived last night! ^^^^^^^^

I tell you say I dey kampe,not like OBJ sha. Na today you join NL? I go still dey here when im go reach your turn

almondjoy:

Then why are we having problems with Chavez? What is the difference? Not credible enough by any G8 standards I presume?

Wetin concern the Chav with the killing of a Colombian in Ecuador?

Jairzinho:

My 7 point observations so far.

1. Its obvious we have a lot of really smart opionated people on N'land.

2. The political 'right' is represented largely by 4Him,4Play prob debosky.

3. The liberal left(Chavez & co) largely supported by almondjoy, RickBlack^{(has a Somali babe? where them dey see such people sef}

4. The right & the left may never agree.

5. Latest info indicates the FARC rebels supported Chavez while he was in prison on coup charges in'92 as well as his presidential campaign with money from drug trade,kidnappings etc.

5. 4Him & 4Play for all intents & puposes make the most sense

6. We may be really hypocritical at times,we enjoy the freedom and financial stability the US system guarantees but yet criticize its policies at the slightest opportunity, I say shame on you ,this is not to say Bush has all the right answers ,but i think we need to appraise things more realistically.

7. Like someone rightly noted Brazil's Lula has similar ideologies to Chavez but behaves himself like an adult,imagine threatening war because a drug peddling ,kidnapping gangstar got killed? ^{wetin we no go see for this world}

Just my 2 cents

You see it as a common gangster pow-wow.  When you consider the fact that the almighty US has a hand in it, you may be forced to think otherwise.  Saddam met his end like this. Catro lasted almost 100years. . . . much to the chargrin of the almighty west. All started with a little "pussy footing" under the table, excuse ma french,  . . . . . then what happened?  I am glad most countries are not going to just play sitting ducks and watch other nosey western countries butt into their affairs.  Call Chavez what you want want. He has more gumption than any of the "Forest Gumps" you have in Africa combined!

4 Play:

I tell you say I dey kampe,not like OBJ sha. Na today you join Nairaland? I[b] go still dey here when im go reach your turn [/b]

Wetin concern the Chav with the killing of a Colombian in Ecuador?

The same thing that concerns Iraq with US!   If you are suspicious looking, take 'em out!  Why are the rules different now?

Reach ma turn ke?  I am too smart for that!  You hear say I be YIM commander?  I can never try such a thing.  Even if I do, I know where to go abeg!   No ge that kind agbero romance! Gossips!!!!

Chai!!!! Nairalandyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!