Mart d dart: Luke 11:27 "As Jesus was saying these things, a woman in the crowd called out, "Blessed is the mother who gave birth and nursed you"
28 He replied, "rather, blessed are those who hear the word of God and obey it"
If this doesn't show you, I wonder what will

How in God's name does this translate to: "praying to Mary to intercede for you is wrong."

You just want to twist the words of scripture and force them to say what you want they to say, but they wont.

Also, Mary says, in the book of Luke, "all generations shall call me BLESSED." So do you think that Jesus was contradicting that statement and also contradicting God's commandment that he should honour his mother?

italo:

So as we KNOW The Catholic Church to be the one true Church, we shouldnt proclaim it so because we want other people will call it "bias?"

I asked and you didnt tell me: You mean there are many Christian Churches worldwide? Which among these was the "CHURCH" (SINGULAR) that Jesus said he would build on "...Peter...this rock..?"

You know the catholic church is the only and true church of God?, you don't say?...So does that mean non-catholics should kneel before statues and soil our faith in God's word, No, thank you...
PS i still stand by my opinion, Peter was the rock on which Christ's church was established, YES...but that church wasn't the catholic church and Peter definitely wasn't a pope.

Enigma:

Some have tried to point out the difference between The Christian Church or catholic Church on the one hand and the Roman Catholic Church on the other.

That difference is reflected in the description of the catholic Church below --- granted its last line or so is inflammatory.

Westminster Confession of Faith

Why should we believe and accept the description of the Catholic Church rendered by "The Westminster Confession of Faith" when the whole world knows that the Anglican Church and its "Westminster Confession of Faith" only came about because King Henry VIII wanted to keep sleeping with Anne Boleyn openly when she wasnt his wife?

italo:

How in God's name does this translate to: "praying to Mary to intercede for you is wrong."

You just want to twist the words of scripture and force them to say what you want they to say, but they wont.

Also, Mary says, in the book of Luke, "all generations shall call me BLESSED." So do you think that Jesus was contradicting that statement and also contradicting God's commandment that he should honour his mother?

your powers of evaluation needs a little more work, don't they...when someone says "rather" it means the introduction of an idea that is different from the stated one....Jesus used rather because he did not agree that the woman should exult his mother, when she should be exulting God and obey his words

Mart d dart: You know the catholic church is the only and true church of God?, you don't say?...So does that mean non-catholics should kneel before statues and soil our faith in God's word, No, thank you...
PS i still stand by my opinion, Peter was the rock on which Christ's church was established, YES...but that church wasn't the catholic church and Peter definitely wasn't a pope.

For the third time I ask:

I asked and you didnt tell me: You mean there are many Christian Churches worldwide? Which among these was the "CHURCH" (SINGULAR) that Jesus said he would build on "...Peter...this rock..?"

Why are you scared to answer this question honestly?

Mart d dart: your powers of evaluation needs a little more work, don't they...when someone says "rather" it means the introduction of an idea that is different from the stated one....Jesus used rather because he did not agree that the woman should exult his mother, when she should be exulting God and obey his words

Then I ask again:

Also, Mary says, in the book of Luke, "all generations shall call me BLESSED." The Angel said to Mary: "Hail, highly favoured! "So do you think that Jesus was contradicting those statements and also contradicting God's commandment that he should honour his mother?

You're blessed/highly favoured, doesn't mean I should worship you...doesn't mean I should make an image of you out of wax and ceramics and direct my prayers to you...it's never done

italo:

For the third time I ask:

I asked and you didnt tell me: You mean there are many Christian Churches worldwide? Which among these was the "CHURCH" (SINGULAR) that Jesus said he would build on "...Peter...this rock..?"

Why are you scared to answer this question honestly?

Scared?...anyway, do you own a dictionary...look up the meaning of the word "Church", then maybe you will answer the question yourself "honestly"
something really funny is, you have been asking but haven't bothered answering of the points(aside skidding around the edges)

If you ave made up your mind to kill your dog, any rope will do. Its quite obvious that minds are made up how to perceive The Church. I fear nothing we say will make them accept that the church is here to stay. Besides today is Divine Mercy Sunday, not that they care. Can we open another thread and gist about how Mary's intercessions has helped them.

Mart d dart: Scared?...anyway, do you own a dictionary...look up the meaning of the word "Church", then maybe you will answer the question yourself "honestly"
something really funny is, you have been asking but haven't bothered answering of the points(aside skidding around the edges)

For the fourth time I ask:

I asked and you didnt tell me: You mean there are many Christian Churches worldwide? Which among these was the "CHURCH" (SINGULAR) that Jesus said he would build on "...Peter...this rock..?"

Why are you scared to answer this question honestly?

And which question did you ask and I didnt answer. Please point it out and I'll gladly address it.

Unlike you, I am not scared of confronting the truth. Truth will always lead to Jesus and his Church.

italo:



For the fourth time I ask:

I asked and you didnt tell me: You mean there are many Christian Churches worldwide? Which among these was the "CHURCH" (SINGULAR) that Jesus said he would build on "...Peter...this rock..?"

Why are you scared to answer this question honestly?

and I ask again "Do you own a dictionary?. if Yes, look up the meaning of the word church and answer your question yourself" Honesty has nothing to do with owning a dictionary, or does it?

Mart d dart: You're blessed/highly favoured, doesn't mean I should worship you...doesn't mean I should make an image of you out of wax and ceramics and direct my prayers to you...it's never done

Stop deviating.

You were say Jesus didnt want anyone giving honour to Mary thats why he said "rather, blessed are those who hear the word of God and obey."

And I ask again for the third time:

Also, Mary says, in the book of Luke, "all generations shall call me BLESSED." The Angel said to Mary: "Hail, highly favoured! "So do you think that Jesus was contradicting those statements and also contradicting God's commandment that he should honour his mother?

math-diva:
If you ave made up your mind to kill your dog, any rope will do. Its quite obvious that minds are made up how to perceive The Church. I fear nothing we say will make them accept that the church is here to stay. Besides today is Divine Mercy Sunday, not that they care. Can we open another thread and gist about how Mary's intercessions has helped them.

I was a catholic previously and I stand firm to say that if anyone is mediating for me it is JESUS CHRIST-God the son not mary or any saint for that matter

italo:

Stop deviating.

You were say Jesus didnt want anyone giving honour to Mary thats why he said "rather, blessed are those who hear the word of God and obey."

And I ask again for the third time:

Also, Mary says, in the book of Luke, "all generations shall call me BLESSED." The Angel said to Mary: "Hail, highly favoured! "So do you think that Jesus was contradicting those statements and also contradicting God's commandment that he should honour his mother?

I'm happy you finally put it this way
Let's personalize this: Mary says a thing and Jesus says another, which would you obey
your worship of mary has so clouded your judgement, you can't even tell aside God's word from the words of a mortal woman chosen to bear God's child
Jesus says not to and you are going to because "Mary said so"...are you a Mary-tian or a Christian
Food for thought: the christians were first called so in antioch, why? Because they were followers of Jesus CHRIST, mary was never mentioned in the mix

Mart d dart: I'm happy you finally put it this way
Let's personalize this: Mary says a thing and Jesus says another, which would you obey
your worship of mary has so clouded your judgement, you can't even tell aside God's word from the words of a mortal woman chosen to bear God's child
Jesus says not to and you are going to because "Mary said so"...are you a Mary-tian or a Christian
Food for thought: the christians were first called so in antioch, why? Because they were followers of Jesus CHRIST, mary was never mentioned in the mix

So Mary was sinning when she said "all generations shall call me blessed?"

What about Angel Gabriel who said "Hail! Highly favoured." He was sinning too abi?

What about the Holy Spirit who inspired Elizabeth to say these:

Luke 1: 41 When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. 42 In a loud voice she exclaimed: “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the child you will bear!

The Holy Spirit made a mistake?

What about God who said "honour your father and mother"?

He was wrong?

italo:

So Mary was sinning when she said "all generations shall call me blessed?"

What about Angel Gabriel who said "Hail! Highly favoured." He was sinning too abi?

What about the Holy Spirit who inspired Elizabeth to say these:

Luke 1: 41 When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. 42 In a loud voice she exclaimed: “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the child you will bear!

The Holy Spirit made a mistake?

What about God who said "honour your father and mother"?

He was wrong?

this points back to what I said before because you're highly favoured doesn't mean I should Make a statue of you, I wonder how you can see the word of God and choose to ignore it...thou shalt not make for thy self a graven statue in the image of what is in heaven or on earth or beneath the earth...it also says - Jesus is the way, truth and the one and only mediator between Us and God, He is the only middle man...did mary ever ask to be exulted?, she said "Generations will call her blessed" indeed she is blessed to have given birth to a son such as Jesus....but ofcourse the all knowing catholic church saw it fit to create idolistic statues and monuments of God-knows-what...
Quick Question: is she your mother?
I also ask again: are you a follower of Jesus or Mary, please answer the question...(how'd you put it) "Honestly", since you obviously think mary's word is superior to that of God's son-Jesus

Again, stop deviating. We are not talking about statues now. That is another matter.

You said Jesus doesnt want us to honour Mary, that why he said "...rather, blessed are those who hear the word of God and obey it" when someone said "blessed is the womb that bore you."

And you insinuate that Mary too was wrong in saying "all generations shall call me blessed."

So I ask you:

italo:

What about Angel Gabriel who said "Hail! Highly favoured." He was sinning too by honouring Mary abi?

What about the Holy Spirit who inspired Elizabeth to say these:

Luke 1: 41 When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. 42 In a loud voice she exclaimed: “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the child you will bear!

The Holy Spirit made a mistake?

What about God who said "honour your father and mother"?

He was wrong?

Were they all wrong or were they correct?

Mart d dart:
I also ask again: are you a follower of Jesus or Mary, please answer the question...(how'd you put it) "Honestly",

I am a follower of Jesus.

Mart d dart: since you obviously think mary's word is superior to that of God's son-Jesus

This is not what I think. It is what the cells in your brain have cooked up to be 'what I think.'

How can you say the statues are not the matter here?...we are talking about the way the catholics perverted the gospel...
I don't know how much more I have to repeat myself since obviously your evaluative skills are so so...I SAID THEY ARE RIGHT, SHE IS BLESSED AND FAVOURED, BUT DOES THAT MEAN WE HAVE TO MAKE STATUES OF HER AND BOW DOWN BEFORE THEM?
You are a christian? You had me fooled, thought you were the pioneer of marytianity, since I have shown you verses in the bible where Jesus stopped a woman form exulting the womb that bore him/mary and you are still using mary's words as fig...Being honoured is a blessing acccorded you that none or very few has-in mary's case it was her birth to Jesus, in Elijah's case it was being taken up into heaven alive...but tell me, was Elijah ever worshipped, why is mary different?
Concerning the statues, did God say we should use them?

I'll love to bring another issue of importance into full view, Please
Did Mary die?

A

Mart d dart: I'll love to bring another issue of importance into full view, Please
Did Mary die?

Heads up bro,you'll argue/teach/lecture/pacify/curse till you are blue in the face and believe me nothing will change.
Theirs is a one track mind so save your breathe.

bongila:

Heads up bro,you'll argue/teach/lecture/pacify/curse till you are blue in the face and believe me nothing will change.
Theirs is a one track mind so save your breathe.

I will keep trying, God did not give up on me..so i will not give up

What are you saying exactly?

Are you saying it is wrong for us to honour Mary and call her "blessed" or are you saying it is okay?

And you are yet to tell me the Church that Christ founded on Peter.

Let me get you right on these matters before we move to statues, worship and Mary's 'death.'

You cannot escape by trying to confuse me.

Mart d dart: How can you say the statues are not the matter here?...we are talking about the way the catholics perverted the gospel...
I don't know how much more I have to repeat myself since obviously your evaluative skills are so so...I SAID THEY ARE RIGHT, SHE IS BLESSED AND FAVOURED, BUT DOES THAT MEAN WE HAVE TO MAKE STATUES OF HER AND BOW DOWN BEFORE THEM?
You are a christian? You had me fooled, thought you were the pioneer of marytianity, since I have shown you verses in the bible where Jesus stopped a woman form exulting the womb that bore him/mary and you are still using mary's words as fig...Being honoured is a blessing acccorded you that none or very few has-in mary's case it was her birth to Jesus, in Elijah's case it was being taken up into heaven alive...but tell me, was Elijah ever worshipped, why is mary different?
Concerning the statues, did God say we should use them?

bongila:

Heads up bro,you'll argue/teach/lecture/pacify/curse till you are blue in the face and believe me nothing will change.
Theirs is a one track mind so save your breathe.

What about your mind? Multi-track?

Mart d dart: I will keep trying, God did not give up on me..so i will not give up

Even the devil doesnt give up on winning souls.

Italo, you are yet to answer my question: is she your mother?
you quoted a verse it is unfortunate you do not study the word, else you would have seen the remaining verses
LUKE 1: 48 For he has been mindful of the humble state of his SERVANT. From now on generations will call me blessed
49. For the Mighty One has done great things FOR me...holy is his name

Basis: why worship the servant and ignore the master?

God did great things FOR her, not TO her...so she was very much the same mortal before and after the conception and birth of Jesus...NOTHING CHANGED

yes, worshipping mary is wrong not because i say it is but because it was never stipulated by the Gospel.
No, i'm not trying to confuse you, you have done a good job of that yourself
and please, answer the question, did God say we should use statues or not?

The Christian Church: A group not a denomination...Peter HELPED establish the church(The group who believe that Jesus is the son of God and he died for the sins of this world and follow him IN HOLINESS and TRUTH)
Further simplified: it is not a sole group(it is the nature of catholics to think it is a sole denomination) that notwithstanding, it is not a particular brand but a cluster of believers(those that follow the word in HOliness and in Truth)all over the world...so there you are

italo:

What about your mind? Multi-track?

You bore me really with your one track mind. Day you speak the truth,believe me heavens won't fall. Open up man and learn nobody knows it all. Learn to think outside the box.

italo:

Even the devil doesnt give up on winning souls.

LOL, not entirely practical, seeing as the devil gave up after tempting Jesus

bongila:

You bore me really with your one track mind. Day you speak the truth,believe me heavens won't fall. Open up man and learn nobody knows it all. Learn to think outside the box.

GBAM!

Mart d dart: Italo, you are yet to answer my question: is she your mother?

Yes.

Look how I answer your question easily but you are scared to answer mine. Why?

Mart d dart: you quoted a verse it is unfortunate you do not study the word, else you would have seen the remaining verses
LUKE 1: 48 For he has been mindful of the humble state of his SERVANT. From now on generations will call me blessed
49. For the Mighty One has done great things FOR me...holy is his name

Basis: why worship the servant and ignore the master?

We worship no one but God.

Mart d dart: God did great things FOR her, not TO her...so she was very much the same mortal before and after the conception and birth of Jesus...NOTHING CHANGED

yes, worshipping mary is wrong not because i say it is but because it was never stipulated by the Gospel.
No, i'm not trying to confuse you, you have done a good job of that yourself
and please, answer the question, did God say we should use statues or not?

I have told you that we will get to the issue of worship, statues and Mary's 'death' right after we thrash what I have been asking you all-thread which for some strange reason, you are scared to answer.

italo: What are you saying exactly?

Are you saying it is wrong for us to honour Mary and call her "blessed" or are you saying it is okay?

And you are yet to tell me the Church that Christ founded on Peter.

Let me get you right on these matters before we move to statues, worship and Mary's 'death.'