Great analysis man. Thumbs up.

t-something:



since you couldn't answer my questions I asked earlier , let me reduce this concession fraud to the level you would understand .

The concession agreement is supposed to run for an agreed period of time during which the concessioniare is supposed to construct and continuously maintain the road infrastructure for the period stated in the agreement . He is to recover his investments by tolls and other services on the road.

Now coming back to Lekki road, the concessioniare isn't recovering any investment from the tolls , rather they are generating funds that would be used in constructing the road. Why am I saying this? You recover your investment if the road had been completely constructed , but in this case the road hasn't been completed yet users are being tolled.

Now the Government wants to do something, wouldn't they have just cancelled the contract due to non performance / breach of contract by the concessioniare , rather they want to buy back the concession agreement with 7 billion .

Ask yourself how much has the concessioniare invested so far on the road? How much have they generated by way of tolls and advert on the uncompleted road? So why are you still paying them 7 billion instead recovering money from them?

My brother wake up and smell the coffee , Lagosians have been scammed by one of the greatest scam artists in Africa.

By the way who tolls a road leading to a predominantly residential area without providing an alternative toll free road?

I cant phantom how people reason, how is this a good sign? The same people signed out the concession now they want to cancel the concession. There is only one truth; calculation were not made appropriately when it was signed off. The money being accrued is not shared into the right coffers properly. The Lekki to Ikoyi toll has made them to realize this thus making amends, they want total control of the concession with the gimmick of listening to the desires of the people. They would reduce the fare, mismanage the road and smile to the bank. The expressway was expanded by just a single lane and it has taken forever to complete and it has gulped how many billions of naira. Now they want to take control and make money to spend for 2015 election, anyway Its not today that Lagos has been funding elections in other states. Eko o ni baje!!!

Billyonaire:

Not really, LCC is actually owned by Tinubu and Fashola via their Surrogates, what happens is that the Eko Atlantic City, which they own majority of, is a better investment for them, so they are looking for a way to get more funding from state funds to push the construction, so it becomes necessary for them to let go the Toll in exchange for the billions and use the billions on the Eko Atlantic Project and Free Trade Zone project, its all thievery.

My Time Shall Come.

You are watching too many movies. With this conspiracy theory mindset, you would do well as a script writer for Nollywood. Make haste while the sun shines

marleymcintosh:

By all atandards, they have performed excellently. The road is built to standard, well lit, maintained and remains the safest in the state.

I beg to differ. Yeah, the roads may be good but this project took WAY to long. Plus it's not even completed yet. Worse, they are relying on money obtained from TOLLS to finish the project. I doubt there was any clause that said they project should be finished using proceeds from the TOLL. It only shows incompetence on the side of LCC.

If they finished the entire stretch and then started collecting tolls, then we'd give them some credit. The fact that we've been used to sub par services does not mean we should reward incompetence. They failed.

Yes oh. same here.
120*2*360*1.5= please help me the figure so we can apply to Fashola to also buy out our forced toll taxation....Thank u!!!

oxford: i demand a refund of all the toll i paid in the last three years

120 x 2 x 360 x 3 = N259, 200.

#refundnow

marleymcintosh:

By all atandards, they have performed excellently. The road is built to standard, well lit, maintained and remains the safest in the state.

[size=14pt]Obviously you've never been to UYO[/size]

infobiz9ja: I woke up in a new Buggati

go back to sleep and complete the dream.

A-town:


Excuse you but in the case of "building a brige" they are providing new/alternative infrastructure.
It is different when you decide to "widen" the road that residents have been plying (also the only available road) and then decide to tax it. They shoud have built an "Alternate road" e.g the coastal road and then TOLL it. No one would have complained. I am not against tolling but everyone knows that the greed and corruption involved with that lekki toll is inhumane

If we subtract LCC coming in to rebuild the road, that means the road could have remained a two lane expressway if the Government is unable to fund such a project either due to priority, lack of finance or whatever reson. I remember vividly the hardship faced on the road back then.
While I can't vouch for the process of awarding the contract to LCC or the intricacies behind toll collection, I live along the corridor and I chose to ply the toll plaza except when i feel like because i have an option of the alternative route: Ligali - sand field - Oniru estate.

publisher:

[size=14pt]Obviously you've never been to UYO[/size]

"safest in the state" I said, not in the nation.

marleymcintosh:

"safest in the state" I said, not in the nation.

[size=14pt]I get you.

My anger is that in UYO,they have toll free new highways that are longer,well lit and well constructed. Most of these roads were constructed in less than 2 years. Lekki/Ajah Express had been on-going for over four years now,if i'm not mistaken.[/size]

publisher:

[size=14pt]I get you.

My anger is that in UYO,they have toll free new highways that are longer,well lit and well constructed. Most of these roads were constructed in less than 2 years. Lekki/Ajah Express had been on-going for over four years now,if i'm not mistaken.[/size]

yeah , very true! its taking like forever to construct

Dis is d scamm of d 21st century.wat will be pple rxn if GEJ pays Bi-Countey 90b 4 lag -Ib after cancelling the project

t-something:



since you couldn't answer my questions I asked earlier , let me reduce this concession fraud to the level you would understand .

The concession agreement is supposed to run for an agreed period of time during which the concessioniare is supposed to construct and continuously maintain the road infrastructure for the period stated in the agreement . He is to recover his investments by tolls and other services on the road.

Now coming back to Lekki road, the concessioniare isn't recovering any investment from the tolls , rather they are generating funds that would be used in constructing the road. Why am I saying this? You recover your investment if the road had been completely constructed , but in this case the road hasn't been completed yet users are being tolled.

Now the Government wants to do something, wouldn't they have just cancelled the contract due to non performance / breach of contract by the concessioniare , rather they want to buy back the concession agreement with 7 billion .

Ask yourself how much has the concessioniare invested so far on the road? How much have they generated by way of tolls and advert on the uncompleted road? So why are you still paying them 7 billion instead recovering money from them?

My brother wake up and smell the coffee , Lagosians have been scammed by one of the greatest scam artists in Africa.

By the way who tolls a road leading to a predominantly residential area without providing an alternative toll free road?

A-town:


I beg to differ. Yeah, the roads may be good but this project took WAY to long. Plus it's not even completed yet. Worse, they are relying on money obtained from TOLLS to finish the project. I doubt there was any clause that said they project should be finished using proceeds from the TOLL. It only shows incompetence on the side of LCC.

If they finished the entire stretch and then started collecting tolls, then we'd give them some credit. The fact that we've been used to sub par services does not mean we should reward incompetence. They failed.

yeah, it has taken forever! It has been a permanent construction yard. They should have not started tolling until after completion. But I learnt interest was accruing on the loans LCC took for the project

marleymcintosh:

If we subtract LCC coming in to rebuild the road, that means the road could have remained a two lane expressway if the Government is unable to fund such a project either due to priority, lack of finance or whatever reson. I remember vividly the hardship faced on the road back then.
While I can't vouch for the process of awarding the contract to LCC or the intricacies behind toll collection, I live along the corridor and I chose to ply the toll plaza except when i feel like because i have an option of the alternative route: Ligali - sand field - Oniru estate.

The greed/illegality of the agreement will always come into play. Any sane human being knows that the only VIABLE option for that road is to create FLYOVERS at phase 1, second roundabout, 3rd etc. That nonsense roundabout expansion is a sorry excuse for a solution. You don't create such at "choke" points. 10yrs ago, you could drive from mobil house to vgc in less than 20minutes because that axis wasn't congested. The problem now is congestion. Increasing the lane from 2 to 3 really doesn't do much because the population has quadrupuled. Ideally, a 5 lane road would have been good but i guess that's not feasible.

Do you know what LASG/LCC's response was when asked why they decided not to build flyovers? They said it would be too expensive. Imagine. All they wanted to do was to make as much profit as quick as possible.
The residents have suffered for the last 5years due to the slow construction and they still are (vgc to ajah is still horrible) and you're making them pay TOLLS. How do you expect people to be happy to keep paying TOLLS when they know you haven't solved their problems?

Even when the project is complete, there will still be massive traffic but at the choke (roundabouts) points and toll gates simply because that axis is getting more crowded everyday. LFTZ will also make matters worse.

A govt that has it's peoples interest at heart will do the right thing and not try to reap people off. FLYOVERS!! That was/is/should have been the solution. The whole project is a fraud. Better yet, LASG should build that coastal road so that there is at least two highways leading into that zone. Imagine if an emergency/tsunami occured on that axis. God forbid. One way in one way out. The fatalities that would result are unthinkable

All I see is a group getting ready for 2015 & trying to raise money for the election no matter what it will cost them.

This is the best time to renovate the Ikoyi or kirirki prison just incase.

Emperor_007: The toll has been a fraud from day one, and it's on record that Fashola is a party to this fraud.


Where on earth does one collect toll, without having an alternative route first?




.

What type of fraud. You mean someone who wants to defraud uses his own money upfront on a project that will take several years to recoup your capital talk less making profit?

there are alternatives routes. check your facts.

marleymcintosh:

yeah, it has taken forever! It has been a permanent construction yard. They should have not started tolling until after completion. But I learnt interest was accruing on the loans LCC took for the project

This does not give them the right to use "citizens" money to fund their "feck up". They expected to recoup money for 30years right? Then get another loan to finish the project. If they need our money to fund the project, is it okay for me to say that the citizens "own" part of the road too and shouldn't have to pay toll when they complete it?

In an ideal society, the concession should have been revocated after LCC didn't finish the first section in 3years. It was obvious they were incompetent from start.

publisher:

[size=14pt]I get you.

My anger is that in UYO,they have toll free new highways that are longer,well lit and well constructed. Most of these roads were constructed in less than 2 years. Lekki/Ajah Express had been on-going for over four years now,if i'm not mistaken.[/size]

If you are angry, go back and live in Uyo then. A level of objectivity is required in constructive arguments. Comparing 2 roads being built takes into consideration Terrain; Population; Usage during construction; Disruptions during construction and importantly Funding (Akwa Ibom collects free 13% derivation, LASG has to grind Tax out of you & I) You might also be shocked to find out that the population of Lekki to Epe is more than the whole of Uyo

software man:

What type of fraud. You mean someone who wants to defraud uses his own money upfront on a project that will take several years to recoup your capital talk less making profit?

there are alternatives routes. check your facts.

It is a fraud juh. They used their money? How come the project is not complete and they need revenue from the TOLLS to complete the project. A project that had a life of 3years, 8years after, still not complete and actually requires revenue from TOLLS to finish it.

software man:
first, you show complete ignorance or deliberate mischief right of the bat by not understanding what budgets are and what a concession arrangement is.
basically, the big idea behind the lekki concession is to transit from infrastructural development to investment. of is the concessiomaire's money that builds the infrastructure and manages it for a given period of time to recover its money and make some profit. there is no govt money involved and therefore no budget..

the second incredibly stupidr part of your post is the implication that the entire budget of Lagos state for the year was meant fto build or buy back the lekki expressway.
The actual figure for the buy back that the govt is seeking a supplementary budget for , even when clearly stated , is invisible to you.

please let us have a proper discussion on polo y matters and stop all this obsession with tinubu. it seems this obsession is beclouding your thinking and making you write meaningless jargon.

God bless you... These ignorant illiterates are getting out of hand...

ba7man: There are free alternate routes.....They kept announcing them on Tv over and over again before they started collecting toll. They granted interviews to inform people.

^^^


Those are not what's termed alternative routes, for a road to be qualified fit for toll. They're roads originally constructed to take care of people living around those areas.


Do you now, understand the difference?

Meaning, the toll is a broad day extortion and fraud. And for the state government to keep mute till now ( Fashola pretending he doesn't know is fraud ), made him a party to this fraud.





.

software man:

i answered your questions but you did not understand. so i will try again.

How many years will it take Lagos to complete a 50Km road that is tolled at every 10km interval ?

The number of years it takes to build any particular lenght of road depends on a good number of factors that i as outsider cannot answer.

The road in question is a concessioned road thereby funding shouldnt be an issue because the consessionaire is expected to sorce funds and complete the road quickly. The has been no force majore or war which has prevented the work from progressing. Even if the contractor is to be constructing 10Km of the road every year they ought to had completed by now. (2006-2013) . This is a failure and as a citizen its your right to demand an explanation

Lagos spends over 500 billion annually for about 14 years, can you sincerely point out to infrastructures worth this amount?

haba. in 1999, the entire lagos budget was 1 billion naira only.Even though this increases every year as a result of superb economic management of the tinubu / fashola administation , it only came to 492 billion this year.
secondly, the budget of a state does not go into building infrastructure alone( workers salaries,recurrent expenditures,education, health, environment etc) are included. so your question makes no sense whatsoever.


Let us ignore the budget up to 2007. let us take 2007 -2013 for purposes of this argument. the budget during this period have ranged from 300 billion to 500 billion, so we can conservatively say 350 billion is the average budget for this six years. let say LASG has a ratio of 50:50 for recurrent expenditure vs capital expenditure even though this is outrageously high because the FG operates 65:35 despite carrying the burden of security, foreign responsibilities and other things which states do not bear.
350 bill X 6 years = 2.1 trillion
50 % for capital projects = 1.05 trillion
Now let us take a budget performance of 65% as you stated below,
65% of 1.05 trillion = 682.5billion
Can you now point out to infrastructure in Lagos worth 682.5 billion that has been constructed in Lagos within the past 6 years? Note i have not included donations/ support from private bodies neither have I included the 610 billion loan.

thirdly,The fact that you budget a particular amount in a year does not mean that you will realise that same amount.(while the budget performance of the tinubu / fashola administration avarages 65% in the past fourteen years, the PDP federal govt has being abysmally less than 30% on the average.)

There are current plans to reduce the burden of Lagos ports (both seaport and airport ), this would result in decreased revenue , except the Govt increases the current tax burden , how do they intend to repay the 610 billion debt if by now that things are good, the govt is still planning to increase its borrowing ?

The statement 'There are current plans to reduce the burden of Lagos ports (both seaport and airport ), this would result in decreased revenue' makes no sense to me. are you saying that the government is planning to reduce economic activities in the lagos and apapa seaport? What percentage of duties from ports and airport which is collected by the the federal government comes to the lagos state government?

Don't look at this statement from a myopic view point.Look at it from the bigger picture. If for example 500 people usually pass through Lagos due to the ports, hence spend $1000 daily , with the opening of several other ports, now that patronage is reduced to 300 people who spend same $1000 daily. Now LASG revenue should be as a result of monies spent within its territory, and now that has reduced , therefore its revenue would reduce.

A government that increases its internally generated IGR by nothing less 200% every year for the past fourteen years and that is projecting 40 billion monthly IGR within the next two years does not have to worry about a debt profile of 610 billion.


How has the government increased its IGR? Has it increased its source of income or it rather increase the burden of taxation? If you are knowledgeable in finance you would know that increase in tax burden generally leads to a reduction in population hence reduction in business activities. If other cities provide the same infrastructures and ports of entry, whilst maintaining a lower tax regime, people will naturally tend to migrate to those cities. Watch out the migration to enugu cos of the Airport and Akwa Ibom cos Ibaka port.

The important thing is to continue to invest in infrastructural development,security etc in order to continue to attract private sector investments(which is the major engine of growing a mega city world wide).
The state of new york and California in the US are richer than most countries and still carries debts totalling billions of dollars.

I hope i have now answered your questions.

i hope I have beeen able to wake u up. I these explanations dont wake you up, my brother nothing else will

From all the big grammars have bin hearing notin concern me! The one wey I want hear na no more paying of toll fee! Datz all!

software man:
iif you check your records LCC owned by the chagouries has been in the Nigerian construction industry
since the early nineties.

A concession arrangement involves a company using its own money to develop infrastru
cture and then recover its money over a given period of time after which the infrastructure reverts back to the govt. Usually with these contracts is what is called a buy back option which apparently Lagos state is now trying to exercise for wider policy option.

Interestingly, the PDP controlled federal govt has failed severally in every since concession projects they ever attempted and I can understand how very ignorant and misguided people who lack the capacity to make meaningful contribution to POLICY discussions end up coming here to expose their crass ignoramce and stupidity.

On point.


I don't know why these illiterates open their mouth

A-town:


This does not give them the right to use "citizens" money to fund their "feck up". They expected to recoup money for 30years right? Then get another loan to finish the project. If they need our money to fund the project, is it okay for me to say that the citizens "own" part of the road too and shouldn't have to pay toll when they complete it?

In an ideal society, the concession should have been revocated after LCC didn't finish the first section in 3years. It was obvious they were incompetent from start.

Its politics as usual. Only God knows the reason behind this cancellation. Maybe LCC is cutting out some powers on collections...lol

marleymcintosh: I wonder what cancelling of concession has to do with stopping tolling on the road. A majority of those who complain about tolling have never passed the corridor since it was built! Tolling the road is for public good as long as the proceeds return to the state government or the company holding the concession.
How do we expect the concessionaire to recoup its investments on the construction and maintenance?
On the question of alternative routes, they have provided. During peak periods, it it faster to go through the alternative routes than the toll gates. So what all the fuss about?
If government decides to build a bridge connecting two communities like Ikoyi and Lekki phase 1 and toll the road, it is your choice to pay up or ply the admiralty - ozumba - falomo bridge - kingsway road route. Your time or cash, you decide which is more valuable to you.

Actually it seems to me some people here do not even understand what is being discussed.

Once they see lagos state, tinubu or fashola's name, they jump on the bandwagon and start spewing senseless garbage.
There is no cancelling of concession here. The right word is acquiring the existing concession rights.

there are several reasons a government might want to do this.

They will probably come up with another concession company now. Eti OSa or Epe concession or some shait and continue the usual feck up. Frying pan to fire!!

marleymcintosh:

Its politics as usual. Only God knows the reason behind this cancellation. Maybe LCC is cutting out some powers on collections...lol

Whose money was used to execute the completed phases of the project?

Govt or LCC's money? How long do you think it will take to recoup all the money invested by LCC?

This discussion exposes the ignorance of many people.

software man:

What type of fraud. You mean someone who wants to defraud uses his own money upfront on a project that will take several years to recoup your capital talk less making profit?

there are alternatives routes. check your facts.

^^^

Fraud in the sense that, it's completely the primary function of the state to construct roads ( either through tax collected or other state revenue ).

Secondly, do you know the minimum criteria that certifies a road fit for toll?


Those are not what's termed alternative routes, for a road to be qualified fit for toll. They're roads originally constructed to take care of people living around those areas.


Do you now, understand the difference?

Meaning, the toll is a broad day extortion and fraud. And for the state government to keep mute till now ( Fashola pretending he doesn't know is fraud ), made him a party to this fraud.


If you want to be honest to yourself, you're aware that, Fashola agreed to such venture because of the signature behind LCC.





.

t-something:



since you couldn't answer my questions I asked earlier , let me reduce this concession fraud to the level you would understand .

The concession agreement is supposed to run for an agreed period of time during which the concessioniare is supposed to construct and continuously maintain the road infrastructure for the period stated in the agreement . He is to recover his investments by tolls and other services on the road.

Now coming back to Lekki road, the concessioniare isn't recovering any investment from the tolls , rather they are generating funds that would be used in constructing the road. Why am I saying this? You recover your investment if the road had been completely constructed , but in this case the road hasn't been completed yet users are being tolled.

Now the Government wants to do something, wouldn't they have just cancelled the contract due to non performance / breach of contract by the concessioniare , rather they want to buy back the concession agreement with 7 billion .

Ask yourself how much has the concessioniare invested so far on the road? How much have they generated by way of tolls and advert on the uncompleted road? So why are you still paying them 7 billion instead recovering money from them?

My brother wake up and smell the coffee , Lagosians have been scammed by one of the greatest scam artists in Africa.

By the way who tolls a road leading to a predominantly residential area without providing an alternative toll free road?

What precisely is the point of your post?
Unless you have access to the details of the concession agreement contract,you are just speculating which is what i do not want to do here. I know that in most concession agreements the smart thing is to define it in phases to enable the concession company to start recouping their investment as the work moves along.

Do not forget that a concession agreement involves a private company investing it's own resources upfront and wait for a period of time to recoup by collecting daily toll. it usually involves the management and maintenance. Unless you have a copy of the contract than like i stated earlier you are just speculating.

believe me, you are the one confused here. Just tell me what the scam is here. it will be easier for any one to award a contract , and inflate it , use government money to execute it and smile to the bank.concession contracts are usually financed by international financial institutions and these people would not jeopardize their money without doing proper due diligence.

Can anyone read meanings into this news? If this news is true, I smell serious fraud!!
I will find it difficult to understand how the LASG will be willing to pay out more than 7 billion Naira for a 30 year concession agreement. If you are willing to pay out such huge sum of money for a 30 year agreement, what stopped you from constructing the road within the last 6 years of this administration. Who then will give account for all the toll money which are already collected . How can you make extra-budgetary allocations of more than 7 billion Naira for LCC when the road is not near completion? O God, intervene and give us God fearing leaders who will show accountability and hate nothing but corruption.

Wow!!! This is not only a great move, it's a very wise and prudent move.


This is another great addition to our fast expanding public infrastructures. Having this wonderful infrastructure now to do what ever we want to do with instaed of decades from now makes a lot of sense.

This is a good buy back and administrative move.


Eko o no baje o