Welcome, Guest: Register On Nairaland / LOGIN! / Trending / Recent / NewStats: 3,195,820 members, 7,959,571 topics. Date: Thursday, 26 September 2024 at 08:57 PM |
Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing (31621 Views)
A Theological Discuss On Tithing By Rhymeyjohn, Image123, Mark Miwerds & Candour / Anti-tithers Are Playing On The Intelligence Of Nigerian Churches / List Of People I Saw Going to Hell: Footballers & Fans, Musicians, Non-Tithers.. (2) (3) (4)
(1) (2) (3) ... (16) (17) (18) (19) (20) (21) (Reply) (Go Down)
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by Nobody: 8:42am On Dec 13, 2013 |
Bidam: Quote the translations that renders it. You don't just throw an open ended questions into the air without giving us the proper context you are coming from. Answer the question Bro. Stop these hide and seek games, the question won't answer itself or magically disappear. The word "PAY" was only used in the New King James Version (NKJV) which was published in 1982 many years after you were born. Why are you religious leaders doing everything to change the text of the bible? 5 Likes |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by DrummaBoy(m): 9:57am On Dec 13, 2013 |
Bidam: Yeah..they were even hiding my comments while allowing antithers to comment freely on their thread. Joagbaje: The Rule for the audience in that thread says: [size=16pt]THE AUDIENCE[/size] There is the rule and the relevant one which you infringed on is in number 1. I, as a regular member of Nairaland, and not Seun's moderator cannot hide comments. I got Ajibam involved in this project to help in that regard. Because he has to attend to many other issues, including his personal life, he visits that thread say once a day, and deletes comments from "viewers" that is not in sic with what is going on in the discuss. He delets both tithers and antitithers comments. I do not have the power to do it; and in my private emails to him I have never asked him to hide anyone's comment. He does it at his own discretion, based on the rules above. This rule, however, does not say that "viewers" cannot comment at all on the thread. Rather the comment must be relevant. For example, it is possible that the moderators missed an issue; like, even, the issue Image raised on Candour post. If an audience draws our attention to it, in a respectful manner, like Image did; we will attend to it; and the participant at fault will be expected to apologize as the case may be. I believe this should settle this matter. As the people involved are human being and we are ensuring that the discuss is as fair as possible. 4 Likes |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by DrummaBoy(m): 10:00pm On Dec 14, 2013 |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by chagga(m): 9:27pm On Dec 15, 2013 |
“I Pay My Tithes After All My Robbery Operations” – Armed Robber Confesses A 24-year old armed robbery suspect, Mr. Tajudeen Onifara has revealed the secret behind his success in the underworld for nine years during which he robbed many people of their money and other possessions. He confessed to the police that he was dutifully paying his tithe to his church, Christ Living Ministry, Lagos Island, as commanded in the Bible after every successful robbery operation in Lagos, western Nigeria. Onifara was arrested in a hotel with his girlfriend by men of the anti-robbery squad of the state police command after nine years of robbing people. The father of two said he paid his tithe regularly because he believed that as a Christian God always bless a faithful tither. He disclosed that after every successful operation, he would remove 10 percent of the money he stole from people and pay as tithe to church. Onifara attributed his success in crime for nine years to the fact that he paid his tithe regularly as commanded by God in Malachi chapter 3 verse 10 and 11. The verses, he said, mandated Christians to give 10 percent of their earnings as tithe to the church. He said he started stealing at the age of 15 and specialised in robbing customers of banks with locally made cut-to-size pistol before he graduated to a big time armed robber. He said his major breakthrough in the underworld occurred when he robbed a woman who withdrew N2m from a bank in Lagos. He said she was about entering her car when he accosted her and pointed a toy gun at her. The woman quickly surrendered the money to him. “I pretended as if I wanted to assist her. She did not know that I was an armed robber and when we got to where she parked her car, I pointed a gun at her and she quietly handed the money to me. After snatching the money I escaped on a bike with my friend,” he stated. He disclosed that he used part of the money to buy a sophisticated weapon after removing his tithe. On what he did with all the money he stole over the years, he explained that he used the money to enrol his children in one of the best schools in Lagos and opened a supermarket at Idumagbo on Lagos Island. He added that he used a substantial part of the money to take care of himself and his girlfriends. On how he was arrested, he said he was having fun with his girlfriend in Ibadan at a popular hotel when SARS men arrested him. When asked how he felt now that he was arrested, he replied: “I know that robbery is a serious and risky ‘business’ that can cut short one’s life. If I am given another chance, I will abandon it and engage in a legitimate business.” Police sources said Onifara who is now in custody at SARS will soon be charged to court naijatunez.com/i-pay-my-tithes-after-all-my-robbery-operations-armed-robber-confesses/?utm_source=naijatunez+&utm_medium=naijatunez.com+ |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by trustman: 10:46pm On Dec 15, 2013 |
Image123 said in Response to Rebuttal R3 : We give tithe of what God increases us with. If God increases us with currency, then we tithe of it. Tithe is a tenth of income. It is not something we do to be justified before God. i've heard of folks that obey a 'do not tithe' law, because they want to be justified. They believe that if they tithe, they stand to be condemned or to lose their salvation. So there is a i MUST not tithe law that they obey, so as to be justified. This is old covenant pattern. The main point about Abraham's tithe and jacob's tithe is that God and Moses recognised that what they gave was a tithe. They did not say that it did not qualify under God's criteria. The Holy Spirit called it tithe, and it is acceptable. Can a legitimate be done in such a way that can be considered wrong? For example, is it right to have a bath? Will it be considered ok to have a bath in broad day light in the market square? A fitting scripture to such a thing would be – Let everything be done decently AND IN ORDER. Giving, Prayer and fasting may be legitimate things but when done wrongly what do we find? Matthew 6:2 [Giving]“So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. Matthew 6:5 [ Prayer ] “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. Matthew 6:16 [ Fasting ] “When you fast, do not look somber as the hypocrites do, for they disfigure their faces to show others they are fasting. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. We are not at liberty to define our terms before God. We need to understand God’s terms and stick to them. We are not at liberty to define or determine what we think TITHE is. We must understand and stick to God’s own definition of it. Period. We cannot arrogate to ourselves a level of spiritual height where we now choose how we relate with God or our terms for it. He is supreme and sovereign. Humility demands that we conform to His revealed will not choose our own systems for dealing with Him. If you must pay tithe then do it in line with God’s revealed will for it. How did God say tithe is to be practiced? But then what do we find in scripture? Ephesians 2:14-15 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; To the tithers who say they do it because the law prescribed it, Christ abolished what? The same God, yes. Certain similar principles, yes. But quite a different system for living and administering the spiritual life. That a practice is in the Bible does not necessarily recommend it to be used or practiced by the Christian. The Christian must rightly divide whether such a practice is for him or not under the new Covenant. For example, the Bible, in the Old Testament has requirements for animal sacrifices and so on. Would anyone therefore justify animal sacrifice today simply on the basis that it is in the Bible? 7 Likes |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by DrummaBoy(m): 10:26am On Dec 16, 2013 |
trustman: So very well said! [size=16pt]Gbam!![/size] |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by trustman: 6:50am On Dec 17, 2013 |
On Image123 Rebutting M3 Image123 said: One main purpose of tithing is as a show of appreciation and acknowledgement to God. It was also multipurposed for the Levites to be taken care of, as they were not working except in the temple(abi na tabernacle). Such a purpose would have being lost in Numbers 31 as nobody was working yet, they were all receiving manna. There was yet to need to give the tenth to the Levites. The tithe was their salary, a compensation for their not being allowed to work full time outside like other tribes. It was given to take care of them and to help them serve without distraction. Some times if the people were not faithful in their giving, the levites became discouraged and withdrew to go do some work. Num 18:21 And, behold, I have given the children of Levi all the tenth in Israel for an inheritance, for their service which they serve, even the service of the tabernacle of the congregation. First, I’m sure it’s clear to tithers that the Levitical priesthood has been done away with. Therefore there is no need today to give to a set of Levites a 10% that constitutes “their salary, a compensation for their not being allowed to work full time outside like other tribes. … … to take care of them and to help them serve without distraction”. Those in certain positions of Christian ministry (every Christian is in full time service today) may be given money for their upkeep, etc but the GIVERS must not be made to give a compulsory 10% of their income or whatever. If the purpose of giving is to show appreciation to God then, like the widow’s mite, ANY AMOUNT coming from a person’s free heartedness will be acceptable to God. He also said: Tithing is a personal decision, and Abraham took that decision. – This is correct. Consequently, in Christ, a Christian can decide ON HIS OWN to give a fixed amount regularly: But it must be a personal decision. “Each man should give what he has decided in his heart to give, NOT RELUCTANTLY or UNDER COMPULSION, for God loves a cheerful giver” 2 Corinthians 9:7. No Christian is to be coerced into giving ANYTHING – whether a fixed percentage regularly or a one-off giving. It must be a personal decision of the individual otherwise it is no longer given by grace and will amount to nothing before God. We are saved by grace and we are to live out our lives by grace. See also Peter’s remark to Ananias in Acts 5:3-4. The Passover was God’s instruction to Israel but when it was clear that the new covenant set it aside was there still any need to insist on it? On the other hand where there is no direct or clear evidence that God made a thing compulsory under the New Covenant there is no reason for any church today to make it mandatory for the Christian no matter how plausible the rationale presented for it is. Is there a direct or clear evidence that God made tithing compulsory under the New Covenant? I would want Image123 & co to show this. 1 Like |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by Zikkyy(m): 9:58am On Dec 17, 2013 |
Image123 actually made some good points in his response to M3. example is the post below.... Image123: This is what we been saying. Tithe was a specific instruction to the Israelites!!!! so why is the pastor teaching tithe as an instruction applicable to Christians Image123: Thank you image123, this what we have been saying. giving 10% should be as the spirit leads; it is not teachable. you can chose to give 10% based on OT examples, no wahala |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by Zikkyy(m): 10:12am On Dec 17, 2013 |
In his response to M3, image123 agreed that the Israelite did not tithe war booty. I will say they did not because God did not command tithe of war booty. Image123 response is actually in support of our position that not all increase are tithe-able (War booty is an increase), Therefore the view that Israelite tithed all increase cannot hold (joagbaje, please note ) God defined his tithe to be a tenth (not 10%) of agric produce, our pastors define tithe as 10% of all increase (also defined as 10% of 'watever') including income from prostitution, robbery, money ritual e.t.c. so you will understand why armed robbers are tithing. |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by EMILO2STAY(m): 2:31pm On Dec 17, 2013 |
they are slowly getting exposed, even to the extent of shotting themselves on the foot. |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by Nobody: 2:43pm On Dec 17, 2013 |
Zikkyy: In his response to M3, image123 agreed that the Israelite did not tithe war booty. I will say they did not because God did not command tithe of war booty. Image123 response is actually in support of our position that not all increase are tithe-able (War booty is an increase), Therefore the view that Israelite tithed all increase cannot hold (joagbaje, please note ) God defined his tithe to be a tenth (not 10%) of agric produce, our pastors define tithe as 10% of all increase (also defined as 10% of 'watever') including income from prostitution, robbery, money ritual e.t.c. so you will understand why armed robbers are tithing. When i argued about this "a tenth" i got many people who failed their maths class on my neck saying a tenth is 10%. Since that day i stopped arguing about it. Number line 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 6 - 7 - 8 - 9 - 10 (Tenth) Now give a (1) tenth of your yields. Is a tenth not 1 of a tenth? Is that not 1%? Did God say give a tenth of a 100? These greedy murderf%$kers. SMH for uneducated people falling prey to this thievery pastors. |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by petres007(m): 2:45pm On Dec 17, 2013 |
trustman: On Image123 Rebutting M3 Zikkyy: Image123 actually made some good points in his response to M3. example is the post below.... Zikkyy: In his response to M3, image123 agreed that the Israelite did not tithe war booty. I will say they did not because God did not command tithe of war booty. Image123 response is actually in support of our position that not all increase are tithe-able (War booty is an increase), Therefore the view that Israelite tithed all increase cannot hold (joagbaje, please note ) God defined his tithe to be a tenth (not 10%) of agric produce, our pastors define tithe as 10% of all increase (also defined as 10% of 'watever') including income from prostitution, robbery, money ritual e.t.c. so you will understand why armed robbers are tithing. Choi! I must've missed a lot. I can't believe its Image123 who said these things in your quotes! Please provide links to posts you're quoting from if its not too much. EMILO2STAY: they are slowly getting exposed, even to the extent of shotting themselves on the foot. @Emilo2stay, For peeps like Image123, I wouldn't term his apparent shift in position an exposure. I'd say he's given the matter a lot of thought and is coming around gradually. Image123: Although quotes like the above to me, indicate a major, MAJOR change in position as it aptly summarises much of what we've been saying for years. |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by DrummaBoy(m): 8:45pm On Dec 17, 2013 |
petres_007: First I must welcome you back from a long sabatical. Next, the said quote is from this thread: https://www.nairaland.com/1548047/theological-discuss-tithing-rhymeyjohn-image123 It is an initiative here on nairaland where we set up a discussion between two tithers and two people who do not tithe. They are to discuss the tithe indepth so that readers could understand what the real biblical tithe is. We agreed on the rules to be followed and we started the discuss a bit over a week ago. You are welcome to view the discussion. On this post I have provided a link to all the discussion so far https://www.nairaland.com/1548047/theological-discuss-tithing-rhymeyjohn-image123#20085393; presently we are on number 7, and we have 13 more points to discuss. Come along and pls let other know about it so they may learn. Cheers. |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by PastorKun(m): 9:10am On Dec 18, 2013 |
Candour: RESPONSE TO R4 The above quote is from the other tithe debate thread that we are not allowed to post on. I feel compelled to comment on this excellent piece by candour as it nails the coffin of the tithe propagators and should effectively end the debate as the tithe merchants have been exposed to be genetic hypocrites. Kudos to you candour, very well said. 3 Likes
|
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by DrummaBoy(m): 8:30pm On Dec 18, 2013 |
^^^ Well before you rejoice any further, Image123 has offered a rebuttal of that post by Candour. In it he mentioned: Image123: If I am not mistaken I believe that Image 123 has put tithing in the same league of "right" Christian practices as bible reading, devotion, prayer, fellowship or going to church, fasting, honoring one's parent, etc. Well I think this is not exactly correct. Tithing is a strict 10%. And as the pro-tithers define it, 10% of your increase, particularly, 10% of your salary (a definition that is alien to the bible); but it 10%. These other laudable Christian practices do not have a strict percentage or amount that must be done or offered before they are acceptable to God. My point from day one on these tithes debates has always been that the tithing follows a principle of giving. It is giving that is supposed to be in the list image made up there and not tithing. For if giving is acceptable as a Christian practice then the Christian can enjoy the freedom of giving whatever he wants, he can afford, he is led to, 10% or otherwise; just as he has the freedom to go to church or not to go; to pray for an hour, pray all night or pray for a minute; he could also fast for a day, two days or a month; the emphasis is a freedom to do as the Spirit of God propels him to do. No one has that freedom as far as tithing is concerned; it is either 10% or you are not tithing, as far as the definition of tithing from pro-tithers is concerned. So what is my point here: Tithing denies the Christian the freedom he is expected to enjoy in Christ. It is this freedom Paul showed us we must contend for in Galatians 5:1 and ensure that no one denies us that freedom. Tithing denies the believer freedom. I am sorry, Image123, tithing cannot be put in the same league of Christian practices as prayer, fellowship, fasting, giving to parents, etc. These other practices enjoy the freedom of the Spirit. Tithing does not! 3 Likes |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by Nobody: 8:52pm On Dec 18, 2013 |
Image123: Prayer is not by compulsion, giving/tithing is not by compulsion, reading the Bible is not by compulsion etc. One cannot exactly argue that a person is condemned because he/she did has not been having regular devotion, or any other christian practice. But we are very clear about what is the right thing to do. And tithing remains one of the right things for a believer to do, like prayer, fasting, fellowship etc. Loving people cannot justify anybody, honouring our parents or elders cannot justify anybody. We are justified by faith. This debate is going back and forth and its becoming boring. If tithing is not by compulsion, then why threaten people with Malachi 3:8 and accuse them of robbing God? 4 Likes |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by GeneralShepherd(m): 10:56pm On Dec 18, 2013 |
rudedough: Hmmm a tenth of 90 should be 1/10 of 90. I don't care about Yahweh nor the bible but a tenth is sadly 10% |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by Nobody: 11:14pm On Dec 18, 2013 |
GeneralShepherd: 1/10 of 90 is 9 but then God said "Give a tenth" which literally mean 1 of a tenth. He didn't say "Give a tenth of a 100". So where the hell did these Pastors get the 100 from? 1 Like |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by Goshen360(m): 11:18pm On Dec 18, 2013 |
^ That one na algebra and calculus them dey take work their own percentage |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by Nobody: 11:51pm On Dec 18, 2013 |
Goshen360: ^ That one na algebra and calculus them dey take work their own percentage Seriously this one baffle me. At that time, there was nothing like algebra, no percentile, no quartile calculation, they use number line calculations. That is, you place a stick across and your goats pass under it, you pick 1 out of the first 10 goats which is "a tenth" of your livestock. How these Pastors changed it to percentage is still a surprise to me. There is nothing good about religion. Just a bunch of thieves stealing from poor people. 1 Like |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by PastorKun(m): 6:51am On Dec 19, 2013 |
rudedough: To answer your question, it is because they are rogues and hypocrites. 3 Likes |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by DrummaBoy(m): 10:17am On Dec 19, 2013 |
Mark Miwerds ended his Response to Response R4 with: As to the “safest thing to do'' idea, what other practice can we approach with this mindset? Sabbath was even observed by God almighty himself so I guess that makes it a practice we should adopt to be on God's safe side. Then we can go on and pick every other good practice in the old testament like feast of weeks, feast of Pentecost etc. My brethren, if we have to approach God with this ''safest thing to do'' idea, we are no better than pagans and we would do well to stop lying to ourselves as being saved by faith in Christ. And I think it deserves a thousand likes! 2 Likes |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by brilapluz(m): 6:21am On Dec 20, 2013 |
The Patriarch had put himself under oath before going to battle that he WILL NOT PROFIT from this battle. If a lawyer wins a libel battle for a client and the client gets paid damages, will the lawyer appropriate the money all to himself? Won’t we call him a thief and backstabber? If the client offers the lawyer part or all of the damages paid, and the lawyer refuses to collect it, how do we say the lawyer owns the money? The example of likening this war to a cup competition is wrong because the cup belonged to none of the teams before they meet and to liken it to a boxing competition is sad because Abram evidently answered a distress call to save a distressed king and help him recover his goods and his subjects that were taken. That is like saying America answering a distress call from Kuwait in 1990 to save it from Iraqi occupation gives America the right to claim the oil wells of Kuwait which is what made Iraq go rogue in the first place. That would be stealing and betrayal. Sure Abram had a better value system and he put it on display. Honest conscience was better than riches to the great man. JUST ONE WORD FOR THE ABOVE:SUPERB!!!!!! 1 BILLION LIKES FOR THE ABOVE! 1 Like |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by trustman: 11:39pm On Dec 20, 2013 |
On Image123’s REBUTTAL OF M4/M5 NOBODY HAS ANY RIGHT to say what God did not say. NOBODY HAS ANY RIGHT to determine his ‘rule of engagement’ with God. God is sovereign, so we either stick to his revealed will or we don’t. But to choose OUR OWN ‘terms’ or ‘rules of the game’ as far as God is concerned is the height of unbridled arrogance. If Image123 and co will be honest with themselves they are using tithing to earn some points with God. They give undue emphasis to it, not because they can show where it is prescribed under the new covenant, but because they have bought a lie that there is some perceived benefit in doing it. If not, why the excessive prominence given to it in the church today? They have not answered the key question – ‘Where is this TITHING prescribed for the new testament believer?’ They may agree that things like animal sacrifices, though in scripture, no longer need to be practiced today. Why then is it difficult for them to accept that tithing is no longer compulsory. Why a constant reference to the past when – Hebrews 8:6 – “But in fact the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, since the new covenant is established on better promises.” 13 By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear. The Law was the greatest thing the Jews could reference in terms of what God had instituted. To them it was greater than anything else; anything before it or any other system that existed in other nations coterminous with it. when we are told that the new has replaced the old it means the new has replaced that which was greater than than anything that was before it. If the law was that superior then when we are told that the new has replaced the old we need to stand at attention and give a salute instead of resorting to rhetoric. 3 Likes |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by trustman: 12:00am On Dec 21, 2013 |
Image123, on your issue - In Matthew 23:23, Jesus said the weightier matters of the law are judgment, mercy, and faith. Now that the law is abolished, are these heavy matters of the law abolished? Any significant thing required of the Christian will be found in the New Testament epistles which constitute the blueprint for living the Christian life. 1 Like |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by DrummaBoy(m): 5:13pm On Dec 21, 2013 |
Image123 said in his response to response M5 on the tithe discussion thread: It is the above scenario and position that amazes us, not your haranguing or disturbing. Christians should not exactly be amazed at being disturbed or troubled. What we advice is that you leave us with God to decide. It is not you that will tell us that what we want to give our Father is unacceptable. Till date, there remains NO SCRIPTURE presented that tells us not to tithe, whether of crop or currency. Don't worry, don't call us out, thank you very much. We are okay with our giving and we also have the Spirit of God. Find another ministry as it were. Considering the bolded, it seem to me that Image123 see pro-tithers are the persecuted ones. They seem to be the maligned ones on this thread. But it is not true in reality. If anyone is being denied the liberty of what they should believe in Christendom today, it is antitithers. I can understand why tithers cannot have much of a say on this forum; the fact remains that this is a discussion forum where people come to discuss issues, anonymously, and which must be based on sound intellectual and biblical positions. Truth is the practise of tithing does not stand on a sound intellectual and biblical base and is bound to fall on its face anywhere it is scrutinized rigorously. So Image and co feel they are the persecuted ones. In reality, anti-tithers are the persecuted ones. I read Mark Miwerds testimony of how he was excommunicated from church because he no longer tithes and teaches this on the internet. I have read of couples calling off wedding bc the wife, who is a tither cannot marry a man who believes he has liberty with what he should do with his money. I myself was recently sacked from being a church worker bc I made my anti-tithe postition clear to church people. I only recently learnt that many more people who do not tithe took the wiser position of not making it known to others. The truth is that in most local churches people who do not tithe are seen as devils. They are seen as people whose heaven will cave in on them. I was taken to the cleaners on this forum bc I testified that I visited Pastor Kun a leading antitither on this forum and I could not believe how blessed he appeared. With a flourishing personal business in Lagos' harsh economy; driving a 2006 benz; etc. Pro-tithers felt I had said the anathema by saying someone who does not tithe appear blessed. They did not remember that it their foremost doctrine that a devourer will devour anyoen who does not tithe. But here is a no tither who is blessed. I stopped tithing since March this year and my finances has only gotten better. Why all this lamentation: I am back to my main grouse here. That the pro-tithers are the ones that are truly guilty of denying God's people the freedom of using their finances as they feel led by God and not anti-tithers. This I hope Image123 and co will understand and not play the persecuted one on this forum. On the other hand, we that do not tithe are the ones that are facing a great deal of persecution. I still think that it is easier to obey a religious injuction that commands you to give a tenth of your salary everytime you receive than to ground yourself in the biblical understanding that you have perfect liberty to use your money for whatever you want to use it for. To give to church or to refrain. On a final note: I think any Pastor who feels threatened by the doctrine that Christians are not obligated to tithe and feels that such teachings will affect his church's finances can leave the pastoral work and go and find a job to do. Earn legitimate money and stop defrauding people of their hard earned finances. 8 Likes |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by Nobody: 6:55pm On Dec 21, 2013 |
They're all lazy criminal minded Pastors. Even Apostle Paul had a job while preaching the gospel, who are these modern day Pastors to live off of other people's hard earned money? Pastoral work is more of a vocational job. If you want to be a billionaire and contest Dangote in wealth acquisition, with all due respect kindly resign. STOP STEALING FROM POOR PEOPLE. 3 Likes |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by DrummaBoy(m): 7:18pm On Dec 21, 2013 |
rudedough: They're all lazy criminal minded Pastors. Even Apostle Paul had a job while preaching the gospel, who are these modern day Pastors to live off of other people's hard earned money? Rudedough, while the pro-tithers have it wrong on their doctrine, I think your being an atheist, a very biblically knowledgable one for that matter, should be attended to. Will you accept a discussion on a new thread inviting you to discuss your atheistic beliefs and scriptures? I will open it if you do not mind. 1 Like |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by Nobody: 7:47pm On Dec 21, 2013 |
DrummaBoy: Sure i'll love to but on what basics are we going to be having this discussion? You don't expect an Atheist to disprove Theism using Bible / Qur'an scriptures do you? I am very conversant in both the Bible and Qur'an but in reality there's not much to discuss on Atheism - Theism, cos all an Atheist is going to be talking about is the lack of realistic proof while the Religionist will refer to his doctrine as proof. It's going to be a back and forth discussion with no logical conclusion. However, i am still open to any discussion on Atheism. |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by seemylife: 11:12am On Dec 22, 2013 |
I tire for all these tither people o. You want to pay tithe but you don't want to go to the synagogue on Saturday. Which one should carry the greater punishment - not honoring the sabbath day or not paying tithe? If your pastors want us to pay tithe. Firstly they should revert to Saturday as a day if worship then we would know that we are still under the law. Before Christ was the Law, it guided and instructed as a task master because people didn't know what to do. After Christ came Love that was shed into our heart by the Holy Spirit because Christ is not a task master. If a Christian loves God, he will give to God's work and his brethren in need. Giving is an attribute of a loving christian. You don't have to manipulate him or force him. My question to Tithers is, "do you really love God?" 1 Like |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by seemylife: 11:16am On Dec 22, 2013 |
rudedough: Dude, I am just curious not that I am bothered though about you being an atheist. Whatever rocks your boat. A question for you, "Is it God you do not believe in or the "Men of God"" or BOTH? |
Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by Nobody: 11:56am On Dec 22, 2013 |
seemylife: An Atheist does not believe in the existence of God, devil, holy spirit, Jesus and any other superstition or religion. We believe your preferred superstition exists only in your head and religionists are prisoners of their own imagination and creation. |
(1) (2) (3) ... (16) (17) (18) (19) (20) (21) (Reply)
What God Did To My Friend When He Was About To Learn Yahoo-yahoo In A Cafe / Why I Refused To Speak Out On Killings In Nigeria — Pastor Adeboye / Why Some Born-again Ladies Are Finding Difficulties To Get Married
(Go Up)
Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 153 |