davno: Enjoyed reading this! So can d strike be called off now

may be ooo...still awaiting the out come soonest.

While you dey calm with the comment. Check out doctors/nurses jobs opportunity abroad at http://careerpingger.revlisimo.org/jobs-for-nigerian-doctors-and-nurses-in-saudi-and-qatar/ and inform friends......

kalishay: Doctors in this our beloved country are selfish,full of greed, all after what he/she can burst Of @ the end of the year. they never put the poor patient who can't afford they private hospital bill into consideration. Most of the big doctors how many hours to they put into government hospitals Remember the oath u took when attested as dr. You ll answer on that big day!!!!

I hear so much about this oath! What exactly does the oath say, please?

tohpahz:

giving drug is not our primary responsibility. nd let me correct u.. the doctor doesn't prescribe. the pharmacist does. nd den we administer.. but it's not our primary responsibility...

Which planet did you fall from? Are you in anyway confusing "dispensing" with "prescription" cause the last time I checked doctors responsibility is to prescribe while pharmacist are to dispense. Google is your friend dear. You see why I don't trust other health workers? The hardly understand there job description.

oga morotov1....i need an answer to my question:

what is the purpose or aim of medical licensing exams in different countries you can check google if you need help.

phantom: i have shown you the ones google gave me. i cant find the modified one.
but why are nurses able to modify their pledge but expect the doctors to stick to the hippocratic oath. that line in your pledge was modified why? inferiority complex!!

lmaoo.. wtf cares if dey stick to their oath or not.. dude u can't argue abeg... .nd d line was modified cos nursing has changed as d world changes.. nd we no more aid just d doctor.. we aid other workers too.... nd d old line said AID NOT SERVE.. So even if we were to argue on d former line... we still aid d doctors buh we can't agree to them bossing us..

They always remind us of the Hippocratic oath. But nurses have failed to remember the second to the last line of the Florence Nightingale Pledge. I wanted to post that pledge here but someone beat me to it.

The idea that the original article espouses and i subscribe to is to de-clutter the CMD role.

Like he says, call it CEO so no one feels it's a birthright.

I've worked in hospitals run by financial people, nurses, doctors, administrators etc.

Their success was not dependent solely on medical knowledge.

The other argument he makes is that making doctors executives takes them away from their clinical role, a luxury we can ill afford.

We need all the clinicians we can get.

It's easier and cheaper to learn to manage an organization than it is to learn to treat a patient appropriately

Nurses no longer swear by Florence Nightingale. I just glanced at the American nurses association pledge and noticed that the clause the Nightingale proposed for nurses to be loyal to physician has been modified, nurses are to extend the loyalty and cooperation to other professionals and organisations.

tohpahz:

giving drug is not our primary responsibility. nd let me correct u.. the doctor doesn't prescribe. the pharmacist does. nd den we administer.. but it's not our primary responsibility...

...i hope sensible nigerians are seeing the challenges in the health sector??
i hope nigerians can see the reasoning of people who are up in arms against the doctor...
and to think nurses are part of the "bite" in JOHESU.
look at a nurse feeding people misinformation. nurses are so fixated on hating the doctor,they have muddled up the job description of theirs and others....

dexterinc2003:

My friend,keep quiet!!!u think its ASUU strike wer talking about here abi...because ur babalawo managed 2 patch u up temporarily u r now coming here 2 Run ur lips...u need 2 quit ur passive aggression and begin 2 think rationally,b4 u suggest ur babalawo joins JOHESU to replace doctors.

typical superior mentality that has landed you gays where you are. Call him whatever you want but he virtually saved my life. Eventually Nigerians will see doctors for what they are and seek alternatives. My 'babalawo' patched me up permanently after your kind almost ruined my life. If not for surgeons I do not see the need for doctors. Pharmacists should also be able to diagnose and prescribe medication while you all shove your consultancies up your posterior holes.

Doctors are over hyped and they want to make sure it continues like that, maybe other doctors are good though. Nigerian doctors are just good for nothing. Soon the bubble will burst and you will all be retired to holes while other JOHESU members are given sufficient training to do the job and still keep their titles.

I can just imagine what other JOHESU members have been tolerating all these years.

I lost my uncle last week to prostate enlargement after undergoing surgery. He had been a TB sufferer for years and had become very weak from years of struggling with chronic TB. He just developed an enlarged prostate. Instead of doctors advising him to look for alternative treatment to surgery they encouraged him to undergo surgery and he eventually died from complications. All because they through their marketing Web wanted to pocket 400k from the surgery.

I can almost tolerate corruption of any other profession but doctors, doctors! You people are mentally ill to think you can also become corrupt. You want to live lavish not just lavish but ostentatious lavishness. You think you are also politicians.

Well I do not blame you I blame the institutions that produced you. Other lecturers have made blocking compulsory why can't BMS lecturers do the same too. Producing half baked doctors that value money over human life. The underlying essence of becoming a doctor is no longer to save lives but to make quick cash. You will all be the originators of your destruction. Beasts!

Morotov1: Nurses no longer swear by Florence Nightingale. I just glanced at the American nurses association pledge and noticed that the clause the Nightingale proposed for nurses to be loyal to physician has been modified, nurses are to extend the loyalty and cooperation to other professionals and organisations.

oga i am waiting for my answer. i want a cerebral debate from you...
what is the purpose or aim of medical licensing exams in different countries

phantom:

@ the bolded. you see why allowing you guys to head the hospitals is like initiating apoptosis in our healthcare system.
let me ask you.....what is the purpose of medical licensing exams in different countries

please answer me.

Is there any need for that here. The post you quote was self explanatory. You are retrained and reexamined to ensure you can work efficiently and effectively and also in accordance with the laws guiding the country of resident before you can be licenced to practise.
What do you want to know again.

Eldavido1:

Which planet did you fall from? Are you in anyway confusing "dispensing" with "prescription" cause the last time I checked doctors responsibility is to prescribe while pharmacist are to dispense. Google is your friend dear. You see why I don't trust other health workers? The hardly understand there job description.

pharmacists dispense doesn't mean they cant prescribe.. their original job description before Nigerian bullshit altered it, is to prescribe.. please do tell me the difference between dispensing nd prescribing... 2. please tell me?/if a pharmacist normal work is to dispense nd dey studied drugs. y dd dey study drugs? to sit down nd b giving drugs... haba!!!

in an orderly system, the doctor examines with d nurse. draws findings sends patient for lab tests nd xrays.. mks a diagnosis.. sends to d pharmacist nd gets drugs which we administer.

blink182: typical superior mentality that has landed you gays where you are. Call him whatever you want but he virtually saved my life. Eventually Nigerians will see doctors for what they are and seek alternatives. My 'babalawo' patched me up permanently after your kind almost ruined my life. If not for surgeons I do not see the need for doctors. Pharmacists should also be able to diagnose and prescribe medication while you all shove your consultancies up your posterior holes.

Doctors are over hyped and they want to make sure it continues like that, maybe other doctors are good though. Nigerian doctors are just good for nothing. Soon the bubble will burst and you will all be retired to holes while other JOHESU members are given sufficient training to do the job and still keep their titles.

I can just imagine what other JOHESU members have been tolerating all these years.

I lost my uncle last week to prostate enlargement after undergoing surgery. He had been a TB sufferer for years and had become very weak from years of struggling with chronic TB. He just developed an enlarged prostate. Instead of doctors advising him to look for alternative treatment to surgery they encouraged him to undergo surgery and he eventually died from complications. All because they through their marketing Web wanted to pocket 400k from the surgery.

I can almost tolerate corruption of any other profession but doctors, doctors! You people are mentally ill to think you can also become corrupt. You want to live lavish not just lavish but ostentatious lavishness. You think you are also politicians.

Well I do not blame you I blame the institutions that produced you. Other lecturers have made blocking compulsory why can't BMS lecturers do the same too. Producing half baked doctors that value money over human life. The underlying essence of becoming a doctor is no longer to save lives but to make quick cash. You will all be the originators of your destruction. Beasts!

i am sorry you lost an uncle to what you deem an unfair and callous situation but please leave all emotions and sentiments aside and argue logically. pick a point or issue,lets trash it out. you are emotional and cant reason straight in that situation. many nigerians are like you.they have lost a relation to what they deem to be the doctors greed or wickedness BUT we are seeing just your side of the story. we dont have the other side so we cant blame no one. please calm down and be logical...

Morotov1: Is there any need for that here. The post you quote was self explanatory. You are retrained and reexamined to ensure you can work efficiently and effectively and also in accordance with the laws guiding the country of resident before you can be licenced to practise.
What do you want to know again.

so does the retraining apply only to nigerian doctors?

phantom.. .. lol i laf at yu... whenever u come to a hospital nd c how things really go on... u come nd apologize... :*

tohpahz:

pharmacists dispense doesn't mean they cant prescribe.. their original job description before Nigerian bullshit altered it, is to prescribe.. please do tell me the difference between dispensing nd prescribing... 2. please tell me?/if a pharmacist normal work is to dispense nd dey studied drugs. y dd dey study drugs? to sit down nd b giving drugs... haba!!!

in an orderly system, the doctor examines with d nurse. draws findings sends patient for lab tests nd xrays.. sends symptoms nd lab test to d pharmacist who reviews it. nd. mks a prescription. which d nurse administer

tohpahz:

pharmacists dispense doesn't mean they cant prescribe.. their original job description before Nigerian bullshit altered it, is to prescribe.. please do tell me the difference between dispensing nd prescribing... 2. please tell me?/if a pharmacist normal work is to dispense nd dey studied drugs. y dd dey study drugs? to sit down nd b giving drugs... haba!!!

in an orderly system, the doctor examines with d nurse. draws findings sends patient for lab tests nd xrays.. sends symptoms nd lab test to d pharmacist who reviews it. nd. mks a prescription. which d nurse administer

I think I will like to have a source to what you just typed. Cause what I got from Google is a stake contrast.

If the dictionary meaning of the term
consultant, which has been selfishly usurped by
doctors, is ‘a specialist’; then, why should a nurse,
pharmacist or Laboratory Scientist not be called a
consultant in their field if they have gathered enough
knowledge, skill and pompetency to attain such
specialised level. An expert who gives advice on
business even if he has never managed one single
start-up is called a business consultant. This is the
case in many other professions and vocations. Why
will doctors refuse to face their own effectiveness in
their profession? Why are they trying so hard to bar
other professions from progressing? this is way I stand. Is a pity that most people don't know how this health system work. In patient management evry professional contribute to it. Can a doctor cary out liver function test, big No. Then how can he now diagonise the patient without the scientist doing that. So pls pls people should be told the truth on how this health system work.

phantom:
oga i am waiting for my answer. i want a cerebral debate from you...
what is the purpose or aim of medical licensing exams in different countries

You don't want to debate with me, you want a sentimental riddled show of words of why your profession is better than others.
I am not a member of JOHESU or NMA but I stand much to gain if Nigerian health facilities are privatised. With what one is seeing here , I can deduce those that will lose massively if a middle ground is not reached between the government and its health workers.

ignis: Are medical practitioners supposed to even embark on strike?
I thought the major driving force to the profession is passion to save lives.

is this a joke or what ? this ain't funny at all.

tohpahz: phantom.. .. lol i laf at yu... whenever u come to a hospital nd c how things really go on... u come nd apologize... :*

may i or anyone even distantly related to me NEVER be attended to by the likes of you.
God forbid!!!!!!!!!

Morotov1: You don't want to debate with me, you want a sentimental riddled show of words of why your profession is better than others.
I am not a member of JOHESU or NMA but I stand much to gain if Nigerian health facilities are privatised. With what one is seeing here , I can deduce those that will lose massively if a middle ground is not reached between the government and its health workers.

ARE YOU SAYING THAT THE RETRAINING APPLIES ONLY TO NIGERIANS OR DOCTORS FROM 3RD WORLD COUNTRIES??

you are running away not me. i want a debate from you but your post above shows you are trying to dribble me. answer the question please

Morotov1: That shows you that your ability has been limited by law because the " paramedics " are already performing your duties.
No wonder Nigerian doctors are retrained and reexamined when they leave the shores of these countries.
I will find it offensive if I am called what I am not and since you failed to distinguished the different and subsequently take correction on who and who are paramedics, may I use these medium to extend my desire to and not to be quoted by you concerning this discourse. Thanks.

mind you,the bolded is the reason i am tackling you. the bolded implies that we are retrained BECAUSE our training in nigeria is LOW-QUALITY.

waterhouse071: The lasting solution to the incessant tussle between doctors and other health workers will be the privatisation of the health sector in nigeria and financial empowerment of nigerians by NHIS, so that citizens are going to be capable of paying their health bills in the private hospitals. When this happens, the hospital owners( for example Dangote or Wale Adenuga not the government owning the teaching hospitals and tertiary medical centers) will know what to do so as to efficiently run the organisation. Then all hospital activities will be patient oriented. So, consultant cardiothoracic surgeon or endocrinologist will not have to fight the laboratory technichians, nurses or cleaners for anything because all health practitioners will know their respective importance in hospital which will adequately be compensated accordingly. Those that sacrifice their life to spend 6+X year as medical students and several years as resident doctors to become consultants will not have to go on strike because nurses feel doctors' salaries are too much. Then doctors will be happy to render their services and save lives. The hospital owners will also realise that the role of nurses, pharmacists, laboratory technicians who call themselves by various titles such as matrons, CNO are different from doctors, and that various fields have their limitations. GOD bless Nigeria

Thanks again. Some of us have been saying this for more than 2 years now since the health sector crisis took a dangerous dimension. I still can't understand why people are afraid of embracing privatisation. That is all we need. Back it by appropriate legislation and enforcement, we are there. The health systems in the countries people keep citing have enabling laws that won't allow people feed fat on the system and with minimal govt involvement. Each country and even each state should develop health care model that best suits it.

tohpahz:
pharmacists dispense doesn't mean they cant prescribe.. their original job description before Nigerian bullshit altered it, is to prescribe.. please do tell me the difference between dispensing nd prescribing... 2. please tell me?/if a pharmacist normal work is to dispense nd dey studied drugs. y dd dey study drugs? to sit down nd b giving drugs... haba!!!
in an orderly system, the doctor examines with d nurse. draws findings sends patient for lab tests nd xrays.. sends symptoms nd lab test to d pharmacist who reviews it. nd. mks a prescription. which d nurse administer

I have to laugh in Spanish, where did you watch this fantasy movie. Even in the Uk which you are quick to direct us to Pharmacist just got the license to prescribe in 2006 - and that was due to a shortage of primary health care physicians. In the USA they have not yet been granted this license. Nairaland is a great place to come to for comic relief!

phantom:
may i or anyone even distantly related to me NEVER be attended to by the likes of you.
God forbid!!!!!!!!!

lmao.. AMEN!!!! How possible is it not to be attended to by a nurse!! never!!!!! so kip praying dude. nd i hope ur prayers r answered.. bye dear...

echarlz:

Thanks again. Some of us have been saying this for more than 2 years now since the health sector crisis took a dangerous dimension. I still can't understand why people are afraid of embracing privatisation. That is all we need. Back it by appropriate legislation and enforcement, we are there. The health systems in the countries people keep citing have enabling laws that won't allow people feed fat on the system and with minimal govt involvement. Each country and even each state should develop health care model that best suits it.

Doctors have been screaming and begging for privatization BUT the other health workers dont want to hear it. please help me ask them why on this thread.
Privatization is the way to go! water will find its level!!

tohpahz:

lmao.. AMEN!!!! How possible is it not to be attended to by a nurse!! never!!!!! so kip praying dude. nd i hope ur prayers r answered.. bye dear...

of course i will BE attended to by a nurse at some point or the other(infact i love nurses.my mum is one) BUT NOT YOUR TYPE!

phantom:

so does the retraining apply only to nigerian doctors?

No, it doesn't but apparently doctors faces more extensive academic reevaluation including professional evaluations more than others.
Check out the embargo NHS placed on the doctors produced from some Nigerian universities some time ago.
In US, you must pass the Education Commission of US medical licencing examination, enroll into a residency program before you can be licenced. Straight out of medical school without some years as an intern or completing a 3 year residency before licensing is no longer obtainable.
So a supposed doctor that made the comment that prompted these discourse won't find it easy working in such a clime.

hydeka: Awesome! I have said this before and I will say it again. Doctors have made themselves dictators in the healthcare system who think they can hold everybody to ransome because of their selfish demands which they want us to believe is in everyone's best interest. In the hospital they act as the lords even in cases outside their jurisdiction. They want to head every department in the hospital because they claim to know everything about patients, drugs, physiotherapy, nursing care and they go about dictating to everyone. They believe their opinion should be final. And now that the other members of the healthcare team are standing up to put an end to this anomaly, they resort to blackmailing the government and the people. That is professional tyranny at it's peak. All health practitioners are stakeholders in patient care so there is no reason why a particular group should resort to an autocratic approach in the administration of such a team. If they are all needed to ensure proper healthcare delivery, then they all should have equal say in matters affecting the team.

hey yaa, today you are a team, tomorrow doctor is a tyrant, then I ask, when will you attend medical school to become an Abacha if you so please?

You guys want to bamboozle us who are not in the medical field with sentiments and emotions, funny,
take a trip to jamb records, 95% of people who ended up in para medicine at some point put medicine as first choice go figure.

I dont blame you guys, I think doctors have been playing with you people a lot reason you guys have summoned so much temerity to challenge the statusquo.

go to companies and see what expert technicians are doing to Nigerian experienced engineers, imagine an ordinary radiographer wants to rub shoulders with doctors, you want to own a patient, you want to become CMD, that patient is definitely not me.

the people who are supporting JUHEsU or whatever are people who have not realized why the doctors are striking, they are still laced with the emotion that doctors abandoned their patients but i tell you guys, if you have the least idea what these nurses and paramedicals are asking for, you will weep for this country.

If the NMA should return to work, the following situations are likely gonna play out.

1 as a patient under a consultant radiographer whose curriculum is limited to radiography and a few basic medical courses will have the final say on how you will be treated, before now, it used to be a doctor's call.

2, the leadership of the hospital, heitherto have been doctors, now these charlatarns want to head a hospital too, what it simply means is that a phisiotherapist cmd can tell a doctor how to treat you when he knows nothing about surgery that a doctor knows,
or an Aux nurse CMD can ask a surgeon to conduct a surgery with flash light aka torch afterall, it is a minor surgery, what does she know?


there are other demands by NMA but the 2 above are the major ones that directly affect the patient's welfare.
the way I want this to end is this;

The Govt through the NOA should embark on a sensitization campaign, outlining the implications of this transition, after which there will be a referandum where we the patients will vote.

i cant Imagine a registered nurse who have been packing sh:t and p:ss all her life in the ward will one day become a CMD and decide for a doctor how to conduct his surgery.

The patients that will die on this senseless beuraucracy will be far higher than what will die now as a result of this industrial action, as a result, I implore the NLC, the TUC, PENGASSAN, NUPENG to join the NMA in solidarity because the politicians will take their wards abroad while we suffer for this senseless directive.

Morotov1: Educate me more because doctors have led me to believe that they don't need anybody to know what is wrong with a patient and your peers here admits doing other health professionals job.

That is what happen wen people neglect there work
Now doctors have learnt to do round alone without the nurses. We've been forced to do procedures by ourselves without their assistance despise being part of d job description

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_are_the_duties_of_a_nurse