JMAN05: Christianity encourages Divine Education. Even if you want to keep studying till you die, thats very fine. If the issue is about secular education that has no bearing on the scriptures, it means little to God. Granted, When secular education is meant to teach you how to read, write and speak. That's fine. But there should be moderation.

In the scriptures only few had to venture into secular education, though they did so cos they had no choice I think. Of course, they never allowed those things to be their preoccupation, rather Divine Education did.

Christians as temporal residents, do not pursue worldly knowledge as if it is what they are here for. As if it is the way to the solution mankind needs.

1ord: And that is a good thing. Western or not .I would rather live in a western styled house than in the forest in a mud hut like my ancestors? This is the way forward. Western styled education or whatever is just education it is global people should get with the script.

JMAN05: Christianity encourages Divine Education. Even if you want to keep studying till you die, thats very fine. If the issue is about secular education that has no bearing on the scriptures, it means little to God. Granted, When secular education is meant to teach you how to read, write and speak. That's fine. But there should be moderation.

In the scriptures only few had to venture into secular education, though they did so cos they had no choice I think. Of course, they never allowed those things to be their preoccupation, rather Divine Education did.

Christians as temporal residents, do not pursue worldly knowledge as if it is what they are here for. As if it is the way to the solution mankind needs.

EnlightenedSoul: @Fulaman198

Look at these pictures of the graduating classes from Cairo University, from 1950's until 2004.

I wonder if you get the same impression?

*You might not see it, but bear with...

EnlightenedSoul: @Fulaman198

Look at these pictures of the graduating classes from Cairo University, from 1950's until 2004.

I wonder if you get the same impression?

*You might not see it, but bear with...

TheBigUrban2:


The hijab/bhurka?

Macelliot:
Delusional.....
Just the bad ones among them and they are all from Europe alone... They were prohibited from getting married nor were they allowed to have sex, so it isn't an easy task to remain single till death.
There are more than 12,000 priests in Nigeria alone with more than 100,000 in Africa and no case of homosexual was recorded among them, but only in Europe...
Get the fact!

Fulaman198:

You know what, that is true I didn't even notice ROFLLL. I'm too used to seeing Hijabs I guess.

italo: Every catholic priest has 1st and 2nd degree.

EnlightenedSoul:

You're both right.
There comes a point where the pervasion of religion in a society impedes it's development. The more strictly religion is adhered to, the less room it leaves for innovation and acceptance of scientific or outside teachings, or even the practice of the local cultural tradition! The so-called 'regression' to religious clothing in the above Cairo University pictures is not outright proof of religion impeding science, but I personally think it somewhat supports that trend.

Throughout the few years I spent there (Egypt), I can honestly say that I noticed a marked difference in atmosphere as my time there progressed. One of things I vividly remember is the distribution of strongly opinionated religious pamphlets on different aspects of the religion, with headlines like: Women stop your sinning, the Niqab(face veil) is ordained by God!, Stay in your homes!, religious education is the pinnacle of success! etc (and this in what is believed to be the most moderate Arab country). Then came the revolution wherein politicized religion played it's obvious role.

See here how the Muslim Brotherhood started out as rather benign group, and how it transformed into an extremist group: https://www.mtholyoke.edu/~orr20l/classweb/worldpolitics116/pages/chronology.html

It's the reason I believe in secularism, and dislike religion mixed in with my politics. Politics is dirty enough, no?

Education aside, 30 years prior, a Somali woman could dress like this with no qualms in our sister country:



Or this:





Now this is the order of the day:


[img]http://4.bp..com/-9nQDUdWmm7w/TqLOa5z8xMI/AAAAAAAABRA/Y_9v8opfCAI/s400/Somali_girl.jpg[/img]

That last gal may be holding a biology textbook, but where is the society in terms of advancement? Sprinting backwards.

It's strange how you can almost measure a society's "religious takeover" by the way it changes it's tone of dress and shifts from its adherence to the natural local culture there. And I don't even mean to say that hijab is bad per se, but when dressing like an Arab Wahhabi starts becoming the only accepted form of dress, you should well know that the more extreme 'religious' elements are up and coming.

My take.

You know what's funny? I have to pay special attention to how I'm dressed around folks from Somalia. It isn't so with people from Djibouti.

Fulaman198:

Those are beautiful women. Yeah, I do understand where you are coming from though

EnlightenedSoul:

I apologize for going on and on.
Fundamentalism is the plague!

EnlightenedSoul:

You're both right.
There comes a point where the pervasion of religion in a society impedes it's development. The more strictly religion is adhered to, the less room it leaves for innovation and acceptance of scientific or outside teachings, or even the practice of the local cultural tradition! The so-called 'regression' to religious clothing in the above Cairo University pictures is not outright proof of religion impeding science, but I personally think it somewhat supports that trend.

Throughout the few years I spent there (Egypt), I can honestly say that I noticed a marked difference in atmosphere as my time there progressed. One of things I vividly remember is the distribution of strongly opinionated religious pamphlets on different aspects of the religion, with headlines like: Women stop your sinning, the Niqab(face veil) is ordained by God!, Stay in your homes!, religious education is the pinnacle of success! etc (and this in what is believed to be the most moderate Arab country). Then came the revolution wherein politicized religion played it's obvious role.

See here how the Muslim Brotherhood started out as rather benign group, and how it transformed into an extremist group: https://www.mtholyoke.edu/~orr20l/classweb/worldpolitics116/pages/chronology.html

It's the reason I believe in secularism, and dislike religion mixed in with my politics. Politics is dirty enough, no?

Education aside, 30 years prior, a Somali woman could dress like this with no qualms in our sister country:



Or this:





Now this is the order of the day:


[img]http://4.bp..com/-9nQDUdWmm7w/TqLOa5z8xMI/AAAAAAAABRA/Y_9v8opfCAI/s400/Somali_girl.jpg[/img]

That last gal may be holding a biology textbook, but where is the society in terms of advancement? Sprinting backwards.

It's strange how you can almost measure a society's "religious takeover" by the way it changes it's tone of dress and shifts from its adherence to the natural local culture there. And I don't even mean to say that hijab is bad per se, but when dressing like an Arab Wahhabi starts becoming the only accepted form of dress, you should well know that the more extreme 'religious' elements are up and coming.

My take.

You know what's funny? I have to pay special attention to how I'm dressed around folks from Somalia. It isn't so with people from Djibouti.

Fulaman198:

Lolll you don't need to apologise, I enjoy reading what you have to write.

nora544: I know from a study in America that most of the people who go to the pentecost churches belong to the group with the lowest income but the pastors belong to the richest in America.

In nigeria all this pastors who belong to this churches from America are rich and some have jets, so please why no catholic or anglican or lutheran pastor or priest has this. What I know is that catholic, aglican and lutheran pastors and priest must have a master degree.

This new churches from america should i say are not better than the muslim terorist, this christian extremist brought more harm to nigeria than good.
I was searching about Universities in Nigeria and what I found out that one University it belong to an old church write on their homepage that student who have not the money that they can study should also apply because the best will get scholarship and it is open to every religion, please will you find this at the homepage of one of this Universities from the new churches no.
All what they can make is doctrins and they bring out the nexxt generation of brainwased nigerians who feel that praying and fasting and God will help them.
When somebody get a good test it is God to be glory but no one will tell I have learned so now I have a good result.
Why people are so bad in the jamb because all hope that good will give them the brain that they can make it but they have forgotten that they have to learn and that is the big problem.

this new churchesw brougt out lazy people and all what they want is praying and seed sowing and night vergil and prayer warrior and seed sowing and asking the pastor if he can eat, for all in their life they ask the pastor,.........

When a so called great man of God tell his pastors all who fast for 100 days will not get ebola and that was a professor at the University that say all to me.

Nigerians lost their brain in the new churches from america, look back Nigeria was much better before this new churches grow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i think it just makes us not to think and be unreasonable

For instance, i remember in undergrad in naija and during exam periods when we had to say prayer petitions in fellowships for exam. We had prayer points like 'praying against the spirit/demons of missing paper', 'praying that NEPA should give us light during the exam....' and bla bla bla... When i reflect i ask myself, 'What the phuckk was/is wrong with me/us. How is there a spirit of missing paper when my name was obviously on the attendance sheets( all 3 of them sometimes) and the lecturer carelessly misplaced my script. If it was a saner clime that shitt wouldnt happen or the lecturer would be fired but instead of challenging the system we term it 'a demon' and pray more so it wont repeat itself'.

On one of my nairaland threads i wrote about getting on a bus from phct to enugu in the night few years ago..The roads were freaking bad and the driver had to usually move from his lane to the other lane with incoming traffic just so he could avoid bad portholes which were more like death traps... THe roads were poorly illuminated..There was a pastor on the bus who stood up to pray and told everyone to pray against the spirit of blood sucking demons/witches/wizards on the road that cause accidents on the road...After a while i couldnt take it any longer and told him to shut the phuckk up and to stop using religion to blackmail people as thatz what we suffer in Nigeria...He reacted along with the passengers and accused me of been possessed. I told him further to shut it.A blind man knows that these roads are bad and are death traps and ur driver has to move from one lane to another to avoid portholes popping up everywhere..Why wouldnt there be accidents?Why wouldnt there be loss of lives?I told the pastor that no one was flying in the air trying to cause accidents...I further asked him 'why the demons and witches in naija seem to be more hyperactive than in more developed countries? Why are they hiding in corners or in the air? I told him that The demons are the contractors who did a bad job alongside the minister who commissioned that road. God has shown them to you in physical form..Lynch them and accidents will reduce by other contractors taking a cue. You hear things like the spirit of 'mber month.Why wouldnt there be accidents in 'mber months when the bad roads have much more traffic than usual as that is the time easterners travel.Why the hell cant we reason some of this things? I tire sometimes.
The first time i got here and i wanted to embark on a journey via bus, i usually say my rosary as per naija levels . After a few months it began to look crazy to me cos 'there wasnt anyone trying to make us have accidents or needing the blood of accident victims'. How many times have i gotten on a road from 1 part of the UK to another and just slept off knowing that there are no spirits here. THis is because the system is working and the roads are safe. THe contractors who do the roads i ply on are most probably unbelievers but the fear of the law and not fear of Jah/Allah make them do very good jobs. If u place ur car and travel on the road and have an accident due to bad portholes, do u know that u have the right to sue the government here? You will see lawyers coming to beg you to take up your case.

I remember stories of people who imported cars from overseas through dealership with motor companies, drive to their village to show off and on their way back have accidents as the 'village people were not happy with them'. I was discussing with a chinese friend studying mechanical designs and he mentioned stuff on recalling of cars due to factory issues and which i tried to look up. I will copy paste links on it here. i tried doing a little research on Car recall and what i read astonished me. Do u know that thousands and millions of cars have been recalled due to power steering failure, faulty brake pads etc.by top car manufacturers. Do u know that this year alone toyota recalled 6.4 million cars? Do u know that Toyoya paid 1billiondollars in compensation in 2012 involving unintended acceleration problems in its vehicles.?

From this site, http://blogs.wsj.com/corporate-intelligence/2012/12/26/toyotas-1-1-billion-payout-what-it-means-for-owners-and-more/

In short, here’s the details of what this means for all involved, based on the details outlined in the draft settlement.
Toyota owners, past and present:
- If you sold your Toyota, or returned a leased one prior to the lease expiry, a $250 million fund will be established to compensate you for the reduction in the value of your car. If the fund doesn’t have enough money to cover the full loss in value for every owner, it will pay out a pro-rated amount.
- If you are still driving one of the vehicles listed in the settlement, Toyota will pay for a brake override system to be installed in your car, or make a cash payment in lieu of the installation. The system, the settlement says, “will automatically reduce engine power when the brake pedal and the accelerator pedal are applied simultaneously under certain driving conditions.” If your vehicle is not elligible to have the system installed, Toyota will make a cash payment of up to $125.

In some cases and if u have had an accident due to car trouble the makers pay a fine to you or settle out of court or pay to the government. Now where the hell do u think some of the recalled cars which cant be repaired are sent to..You are damn right. Africa and in our case naija as we dont have a system in place for checking out these.. And the car manufacturers have to recoup their money. An average nigerian gets on the road with a new ride, has an accident due to the brake not working, escapes unhurt and goes to give thanksgiving. AND THATZ IT.

If u know anyone who has had accident with a potentially new car and u know the make of the car, try typing on google for example, 'BMW recalls steering wheel' and u will be amazed at what u see online. Here are more links below.

http://blogs.wsj.com/corporate-intelligence/2012/12/26/toyotas-1-1-billion-payout-what-it-means-for-owners-and-more/
http://www.ctvnews.ca/autos/toyota-recalls-242-000-prius-lexus-hybrids-over-brake-issues-1.1311669
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-26950970
http://www.theguardian.com/business/2010/oct/21/toyota-recalls-166m-cars-faulty-brakes-engines
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2654899/Toyota-recalls-ANOTHER-650-000-cars-defective-airbag-explode-Honda-Nissan-affected-too.html
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/12/26/toyota-reaches-settlement-in-acceleration-recall-cases/
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/car-manufacturers/toyota/10754102/Toyota-recalls-another-35000-UK-cars.html
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2014/07/08/honda-recall-expanded/12388069/
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-10/honda-recalls-175-000-fit-vezel-hybrids-for-control-flaw.html
http://online.wsj.com/articles/nissan-honda-recall-2-8-million-vehicles-1403521353
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-26991354
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1080942_2012-bmw-x5-diesel-recalled-over-power-steering-failure
http://www.autoblog.com/2012/06/22/bmw-recalls-x5-x6-over-leaking-power-steering-fluid/
http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1088099_handful-of-bmw-models-recalled-due-to-faulty-brake-system

I feel religion has really been used to hoodwink africa and africans.

Fulaman198: I just want to hear people's thoughts on this subject matter. I personally believe that to a certain extent it does.

uzoexcel: i think it just makes us not to think and be unreasonable

For instance, i remember in undergrad in naija and during exam periods when we had to say prayer petitions in fellowships for exam. We had prayer points like 'praying against the spirit/demons of missing paper', 'praying that NEPA should give us light during the exam....' and bla bla bla... When i reflect i ask myself, 'What the phuckk was/is wrong with me/us. How is there a spirit of missing paper when my name was obviously on the attendance sheets( all 3 of them sometimes) and the lecturer carelessly misplaced my script. If it was a saner clime that shitt wouldnt happen or the lecturer would be fired but instead of challenging the system we term it 'a demon' and pray more so it wont repeat itself'.

On one of my nairaland threads i wrote about getting on a bus from phct to enugu in the night few years ago..The roads were freaking bad and the driver had to usually move from his lane to the other lane with incoming traffic just so he could avoid bad portholes which were more like death traps... THe roads were poorly illuminated..There was a pastor on the bus who stood up to pray and told everyone to pray against the spirit of blood sucking demons/witches/wizards on the road that cause accidents on the road...After a while i couldnt take it any longer and told him to shut the phuckk up and to stop using religion to blackmail people as thatz what we suffer in Nigeria...He reacted along with the passengers and accused me of been possessed. I told him further to shut it.A blind man knows that these roads are bad and are death traps and ur driver has to move from one lane to another to avoid portholes popping up everywhere..Why wouldnt there be accidents?Why wouldnt there be loss of lives?I told the pastor that no one was flying in the air trying to cause accidents...I further asked him 'why the demons and witches in naija seem to be more hyperactive than in more developed countries? Why are they hiding in corners or in the air? I told him that The demons are the contractors who did a bad job alongside the minister who commissioned that road. God has shown them to you in physical form..Lynch them and accidents will reduce by other contractors taking a cue. You hear things like the spirit of 'mber month.Why wouldnt there be accidents in 'mber months when the bad roads have much more traffic than usual as that is the time easterners travel.Why the hell cant we reason some of this things? I tire sometimes.
The first time i got here and i wanted to embark on a journey via bus, i usually say my rosary as per naija levels . After a few months it began to look crazy to me cos 'there wasnt anyone trying to make us have accidents or needing the blood of accident victims'. How many times have i gotten on a road from 1 part of the UK to another and just slept off knowing that there are no spirits here. THis is because the system is working and the roads are safe. THe contractors who do the roads i ply on are most probably unbelievers but the fear of the law and not fear of Jah/Allah make them do very good jobs. If u place ur car and travel on the road and have an accident due to bad portholes, do u know that u have the right to sue the government here? You will see lawyers coming to beg you to take up your case.

I remember stories of people who imported cars from overseas through dealership with motor companies, drive to their village to show off and on their way back have accidents as the 'village people were not happy with them'. I was discussing with a chinese friend studying mechanical designs and he mentioned stuff on recalling of cars due to factory issues and which i tried to look up. I will copy paste links on it here. i tried doing a little research on Car recall and what i read astonished me. Do u know that thousands and millions of cars have been recalled due to power steering failure, faulty brake pads etc.by top car manufacturers. Do u know that this year alone toyota recalled 6.4 million cars? Do u know that Toyoya paid 1billiondollars in compensation in 2012 involving unintended acceleration problems in its vehicles.?

From this site, http://blogs.wsj.com/corporate-intelligence/2012/12/26/toyotas-1-1-billion-payout-what-it-means-for-owners-and-more/

In short, here’s the details of what this means for all involved, based on the details outlined in the draft settlement.
Toyota owners, past and present:
- If you sold your Toyota, or returned a leased one prior to the lease expiry, a $250 million fund will be established to compensate you for the reduction in the value of your car. If the fund doesn’t have enough money to cover the full loss in value for every owner, it will pay out a pro-rated amount.
- If you are still driving one of the vehicles listed in the settlement, Toyota will pay for a brake override system to be installed in your car, or make a cash payment in lieu of the installation. The system, the settlement says, “will automatically reduce engine power when the brake pedal and the accelerator pedal are applied simultaneously under certain driving conditions.” If your vehicle is not elligible to have the system installed, Toyota will make a cash payment of up to $125.

In some cases and if u have had an accident due to car trouble the makers pay a fine to you or settle out of court or pay to the government. Now where the hell do u think some of the recalled cars which cant be repaired are sent to..You are damn right. Africa and in our case naija as we dont have a system in place for checking out these.. And the car manufacturers have to recoup their money. An average nigerian gets on the road with a new ride, has an accident due to the brake not working, escapes unhurt and goes to give thanksgiving. AND THATZ IT.

If u know anyone who has had accident with a potentially new car and u know the make of the car, try typing on google for example, 'BMW recalls steering wheel' and u will be amazed at what u see online. Here are more links below.

http://blogs.wsj.com/corporate-intelligence/2012/12/26/toyotas-1-1-billion-payout-what-it-means-for-owners-and-more/
http://www.ctvnews.ca/autos/toyota-recalls-242-000-prius-lexus-hybrids-over-brake-issues-1.1311669
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-26950970
http://www.theguardian.com/business/2010/oct/21/toyota-recalls-166m-cars-faulty-brakes-engines
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2654899/Toyota-recalls-ANOTHER-650-000-cars-defective-airbag-explode-Honda-Nissan-affected-too.html
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/12/26/toyota-reaches-settlement-in-acceleration-recall-cases/
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/car-manufacturers/toyota/10754102/Toyota-recalls-another-35000-UK-cars.html
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2014/07/08/honda-recall-expanded/12388069/
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-10/honda-recalls-175-000-fit-vezel-hybrids-for-control-flaw.html
http://online.wsj.com/articles/nissan-honda-recall-2-8-million-vehicles-1403521353
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-26991354
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1080942_2012-bmw-x5-diesel-recalled-over-power-steering-failure
http://www.autoblog.com/2012/06/22/bmw-recalls-x5-x6-over-leaking-power-steering-fluid/
http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1088099_handful-of-bmw-models-recalled-due-to-faulty-brake-system

I feel religion has really been used to hoodwink africa and africans.

CAMNEWTON4PRES: Interesting
And we know what is next

EnlightenedSoul:

You're both right.
There comes a point where the pervasion of religion in a society impedes it's development. The more strictly religion is adhered to, the less room it leaves for innovation and acceptance of scientific or outside teachings, or even the practice of the local cultural tradition! The so-called 'regression' to religious clothing in the above Cairo University pictures is not outright proof of religion impeding science, but I personally think it somewhat supports that trend.

Throughout the few years I spent there (Egypt), I can honestly say that I noticed a marked difference in atmosphere as my time there progressed. One of things I vividly remember is the distribution of strongly opinionated religious pamphlets on different aspects of the religion, with headlines like: Women stop your sinning, the Niqab(face veil) is ordained by God!, Stay in your homes!, religious education is the pinnacle of success! etc (and this in what is believed to be the most moderate Arab country). Then came the revolution wherein politicized religion played it's obvious role.

See here how the Muslim Brotherhood started out as rather benign group, and how it transformed into an extremist group: https://www.mtholyoke.edu/~orr20l/classweb/worldpolitics116/pages/chronology.html

It's the reason I believe in secularism, and dislike religion mixed in with my politics. Politics is dirty enough, no?

Education aside, 30 years prior, a Somali woman could dress like this with no qualms in our sister country:



Or this:





Now this is the order of the day:


[img]http://4.bp..com/-9nQDUdWmm7w/TqLOa5z8xMI/AAAAAAAABRA/Y_9v8opfCAI/s400/Somali_girl.jpg[/img]

That last gal may be holding a biology textbook, but where is the society in terms of advancement? Sprinting backwards.

It's strange how you can almost measure a society's "religious takeover" by the way it changes it's tone of dress and shifts from its adherence to the natural local culture there. And I don't even mean to say that hijab is bad per se, but when dressing like an Arab Wahhabi starts becoming the only accepted form of dress, you should well know that the more extreme 'religious' elements are up and coming.

My take.

You know what's funny? I have to pay special attention to how I'm dressed around folks from Somalia. It isn't so with people from Djibouti.

macof:

What exactly makes women feel the need to put the hijab?
Upon all the discomfort and health risks
Or it's just about the whole "An Order from Allah" theme??

EnlightenedSoul:

For religious purposes, of course. What, did you think it was for fun?

I've tried hijab. It's not so uncomfortable, but it can be really annoying for someone who isn't used to wearing it. It pretty much becomes like a second skin with continuous wear.

The niqab, however, is unbearable IMO. I tried that too. I wore it in Cairo, and besides it being unbearably uncomfortable, I quickly found out that it's considered a LovePeddler's uniform over there. You can imagine my shock.

macof:

Ok thanks you answered my question.
So it's all About religion, not some "cool dress code"
Even when the woman doesn't like it she just has to because of Religion

Is Niqab different from Hijab

EnlightenedSoul:

Yep, religious people all over the world live their lives as dictated by their particular religion.

Niqab is the face veil.

Hijab/"Headscarf": Scarf wrapped around face.
[img]http://thehijablog.files./2013/04/dsc05278.jpg[/img]

Jilbab: A really longgg hijab.


Niqab: Face veil
[img]http://1.bp..com/-NGK0ST2utYs/UhDqnvhLwcI/AAAAAAAAAgw/60jBxBNhTCM/s320/at+12.JPG[/img]

Most Muslim women wear the hijab.

macof:

In other words Religion is sometimes a tool for putting people in bondage...if you can describe the discomfort of niqab on some women as "bondage"
Bare in mind the Africa climate is not friendly to such dress code
Many of these women develop nasty rashes

EnlightenedSoul:

What is next? O.o

Fulaman198:

I just want to hear people's thoughts on this subject matter. I personally believe that to a certain extent it does.

OLAADEGBU:

A sinner who gets educated then becomes an educated sinner. Have a relationship with Jesus and become truly educated.

Apatheist:

Fulaman is not gay!