AbdulSleek:


Banned by the Sultan himself...Alhaji Macbantunji. It was an honour


Now, unto the topic, life and energy are different. One can be dead and still have energy in the body.


What do you mean that it is God's nature to live? Scriptural backing please.


Death is natural. To say that it is in God's nature not to die is a contradiction.




Can God kill himself? Yes or NO

An Atheist asking for scriptural backing?

Nature, in the sense of his qualities or inherent features. Not the sense you mean. It is not contradictory.

The question is not valid. Ask a valid question and I will respond to it.

AbdulSleek:


I see, you belong to folykaze's school of crazy philosophy on energy.


Life and energy are two different things.


please, answer the question- can God kill himself?

Ode. . . .

Can you destroy energy?

Kill is only for physical things with body. God is a spirit and God killing himself is totally invalid

alexleo:

when we talk about God we dont talk about his shape or form because none of us has seen him. The bible did not give us his shape. In the scripture he manifested as a pillar of cloud at one time and at another time he manifested as fire burning in the bush etc. We describe God just based on his characteristics/attributes as written in the bible. He can manifest himself through any medium. It is his characteristics that make him God. Those attributes cannot cease to exist and thats what is meant by he cannot change.

Haven't you read the books of Ezekiel, Jeremiah and Revelation? They all described God and his shape, so you are wrong to say the bible did not give his shape.

By the way, even Genesis says man is made in his image. What do you think that means?

As for his characteristics and attributes which you mentioned, that changed drastically from old to new testament. Even a child can observe that in the bible.

sistar007: Kill is only for physical things with body. God is a spirit and God killing himself is totally invalid

Was Jesus God or not? How come the bible records that he was killed since you say God cannot be killed?

Liveair:

Haven't you read the books of Ezekiel, Jeremiah and Revelation? They all described God and his shape, so you are wrong to say the bible did not give his shape.

By the way, even Genesis says man is made in his image. What do you think that means?

As for his characteristics and attributes which you mentioned, that changed drastically from old to new testament. Even a child can observe that in the bible.

I told u that he made manifest himself in various forms at different places. That alone shows you he doesn't have any particular shape or form you can say he is. But if you say the bible described his shape pls quote the exact places and let's take it from there.

alexleo:

I told u that he made manifest himself in various forms at different places. That alone shows you he doesn't have any particular shape or form you can say he is. But if you say the bible described his shape pls quote the exact places and let's take it from there.

Ezekiel 1:4-28, Daniel 7:9-10
Revelation 1:13-18

Liveair:

Was Jesus God or not? How come the bible records that he was killed since you say God cannot be killed?

Jesus did right and Was a GOD and he still a GOD
IF YOUR ACTIONS ARE GODLY THEN U ARE A GOD

sistar007:

Jesus did right and Was a GOD and he still a GOD
IF YOUR ACTIONS ARE GODLY THEN U ARE A GOD

No, there is a difference between "God" and "a God".
I ask again, was Jesus God?

Liveair:

No, there is a difference between "God" and "a God".
I ask again, was Jesus God?

JESUS IS A GOD.
BUT I DONT SEE ANY DIFFERENCE

sistar007:

JESUS IS A GOD.
BUT I DONT SEE ANY DIFFERENCE

Majority of christians disagree with you on that.
I repeat, there is a difference between God and a God.

For clarity, "a God" means one of the several. God means only one individual.
Which one do you affirm Jesus to be?

Liveair:

Majority of christians disagree with you on that.
I repeat, there is a difference between God and a God.

For clarity, "a God" means one of the several. God means only one individual.
Which one do you affirm Jesus to be?

HE WAS SENT AND HE COMPLETED HIS MISSION COMPLETED

SO GRADUATED FROM MESSENGER TO A GOD



BASE ON THAT JEUSU IS A GOD

Liveair:

Ezekiel 1:4-28, Daniel 7:9-10
Revelation 1:13-18

Ezekiel 1:4-28 was talking about some creatures/beings and also described the throne of God. It didn't describe the shape of God.

Daniel 7:9-10

Didn't describe the shape of God and it didn't suggest that God looks like man. In verse 13 he said he saw one who looked like man. If God looked like man he wouldn't have needed to describe the one he saw as "looked like the son of man". He would ve described him as looking like the ancient of days(God).

Revelation 1:13-18

Is talking about Jesus. That's why he said he's the one who was dead and now alive in verse 18. God did not die, it was Jesus that God gave us(John 3:16). Jesus is not God rather the son of God but they are united in purpose and everything. When Jesus was baptized God said this- "This is my beloved son in whom I am well pleased"

alexleo:

Ezekiel 1:4-28 was talking about some creatures/beings and also described the throne of God. It didn't describe the shape of God.

Daniel 7:9-10

Didn't describe the shape of God and it didn't suggest that God looks like man. In verse 13 he said he saw one who looked like man. If God looked like man he wouldn't have needed to describe the one he saw as "looked like the son of man". He would ve described him as looking like the ancient of days(God).

Revelation 1:13-18

Is talking about Jesus. That's why he said he's the one who was dead and now alive in verse 18. God did not die, it was Jesus that God gave us(John 3:16). Jesus is not God rather the son of God but they are united in purpose and everything. When Jesus was baptized God said this- "This is my beloved son in whom I am well pleased"

Maybe your bible isn't clear enough or you don't undeestand it.
Ezekiel 1:1; KJV
"Now it came to pass in the thirtieth year...The heavens were opened, and I saw VISIONS OF GOD".
Notice that it doesn't say visions FROM God.
v26;
"Above the Firmaments that was over their heads was the likeness of a throne,...as the appearance of a man above upon it".
v28;
"And i saw...of his loins even upwards and...loins even downwards...".

Anyone who understands english can see that Ezekiel saw God in a vision and was describing him there.

Daniel 7:9; KJV
"And I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the ANCIENT OF DAYS did sit, whose garment was as white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne like fiery flame and wheel as burning fire".

If its not clear to you that Daniel is describing God on his throne here, it means a course in english comprehension is required.

Revelation 1:13-16; KJV
"And in the mist...like unto the Son of man, clothed...
v14 His hair as white as snow...
v15 His voice as many waters".

Ezekiel and Daniel described what God (even used tge word Ancient of Days) looks like in their own word while John described Jesus.

Next time don't say there was no description of God's Physical appearance in the bible.

sistar007:
HE WAS SENT AND HE COMPLETED HIS MISSION COMPLETED

SO GRADUATED FROM MESSENGER TO A GOD



BASE ON THAT JEUSU IS A GOD

You are re-writing your own bible.

So Jesus was not God till he "graduated from messenger to God"?

Liveair:

Maybe your bible isn't clear enough or you don't undeestand it.
Ezekiel 1:1; KJV
"Now it came to pass in the thirtieth year...The heavens were opened, and I saw VISIONS OF GOD".
Notice that it doesn't say visions FROM God.
v26;
"Above the Firmaments that was over their heads was the likeness of a throne,...as the appearance of a man above upon it".
v28;
"And i saw...of his loins even upwards and...loins even downwards...".

Anyone who understands english can see that Ezekiel saw God in a vision and was describing him there.

Ezekiel and Daniel described what God (even used tge word Ancient of Days) looks like in their own word while John described Jesus.

Next time don't say there was no description of God's Physical appearance in the bible.

26 Above this surface was something that looked like a throne made of blue lapis lazuli. And on this throne high above was a figure whose appearance resembled a man. 27 From what appeared to be his waist up, he looked like gleaming amber, flickering like a fire. And from his waist down, he looked like a burning flame, shining with splendor. 28 All around him was a glowing halo, like a rainbow shining in the clouds on a rainy day. This is what the glory of the Lord looked like to me. When I saw it, I fell face down on the ground, and I heard someone’s voice speaking to me.

Here he said-

1. He saw what looked like a throne.
2. A figure whose appearance RESEMBLE that of man.
3. What appeared to be his waist.
4. From that waste down was like fire of shining splendour.
Finally he said- this is what the glory of God looked like to me. He didn't say that's how God looks. But in his own description.

And I ask, does this description look like a human being like you and I?

Liveair:


Daniel 7:9; KJV
"And I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the ANCIENT OF DAYS did sit, whose garment was as white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne like fiery flame and wheel as burning fire".

.

So how does this describe the shape of God? He talked about his hair only then the throne. .

Liveair:

You are re-writing your own bible.

So Jesus was not God till he "graduated from messenger to God"?

Jesus said God sent him.

alexleo:

26 Above this surface was something that looked like a throne made of blue lapis lazuli. And on this throne high above was a figure whose appearance resembled a man. 27 From what appeared to be his waist up, he looked like gleaming amber, flickering like a fire. And from his waist down, he looked like a burning flame, shining with splendor. 28 All around him was a glowing halo, like a rainbow shining in the clouds on a rainy day. This is what the glory of the Lord looked like to me. When I saw it, I fell face down on the ground, and I heard someone’s voice speaking to me.

Here he said-

1. He saw what looked like a throne.
2. A figure whose appearance RESEMBLE that of man.
3. What appeared to be his waist.
4. From that waste down was like fire of shining splendour.
Finally he said- this is what the glory of God looked like to me. He didn't say that's how God looks. But in his own description.

And I ask, does this description look like a human being like you and I?

If that description doesn't look like that of a human to you, maybe it looks like that of a goat.
Someone is describing feature of man, hair, loin, feet even his clothing and voice yet you claim it isn't.

I suppose you are not saying that the biblical prophets Daniel and Ezekiel were drunk when they described these, otherwise, they wouldn't have used human appearance to describe him if he didn't look human in appearance.

alexleo:

So how does this describe the shape of God? He talked about his hair only then the throne. .

Do goats sit on thrones?
Ezekiel 1:26 says his appearance is like unto a man.

This is clear enough so stop beating about the bush and address the main issue on the thread.

sistar007:

Jesus said God sent him.

Jesus also said he and God are one. He even said that all things were made by him and that there is nothing that exists that isn't made by him.
Then Gen 1 says in the begining GOD MADE the heavens and the earth. This was written far before Jesus came.

Liveair:

Do goats sit on thrones?
Ezekiel 1:26 says his appearance is like unto a man.

This is clear enough so stop beating about the bush and address the main issue on the thread.

Must every being that is not man be an animal?

The same Ezekiel 1:5-8 still said the other four creatures had the appearance of man. Yet it said that each of them had four faces and four wings. Their feet straIght. The sole of their feet like a calf.

Each of the four faces they had were different from the other. One was the face of a man, the right side is the face of a lion, the left side the face of an ox and the fourth face is that of an eagle. All the four in each of those beings that were described as appearing in the likeness of man.

Now is this how you appear? Which human being on earth is like that?

Appearing in the likeness of man doesn't mean they are exactly the way we are. Its just the closest word they can use to describe what they ve seen.

alexleo:

Must every being that is not man be an animal?

The same Ezekiel 1:5-8 still said the other four creatures had the appearance of man. Yet it said that each of them had four faces and four wings. Their feet straIght. The sole of their feet like a calf.

Each of the four faces they had were different from the other. One was the face of a man, the right side is the face of a lion, the left side the face of an ox and the fourth face is that of an eagle. All the four in each of those beings that were described as appearing in the likeness of man.

Now is this how you appear? Which human being on earth is like that?

Appearing in the likeness of man doesn't mean they are exactly the way we are. Its just the closest word they can use to describe what they ve seen.

Young man, this is exactly why I said you need a course in comprehension!
The four creatures are not God! That is why he described them differently as having four faces and hoofs and wings.
Did he describe God that way?
He has told you what God looks like, with hair, loins and sitting on a throne, with a loud voice like many waters and wearing a white robe as white ask snow.

John 14:4
"...he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then show us the Father".
Jesus is explaining here that he is exactly as the father, both in qualities and appearance.

alexleo:
Appearing in the likeness of man doesn't mean they are exactly the way we are. Its just the closest word they can use to describe what they ve seen.

You seem to be agreeing yet refusing to conceed that the description is that of God.
If a friend of yours says that he saw someone that looked like you somewhere, doesn't that tell you what the person looks like?
Of course its the closest words they can use for the description because that is what it looks like.

Why didn't they use goat, sheep, cow, etc? Because he doesn't look that way period!

Liveair:

Young man, this is exactly why I said you need a course in comprehension!
The four creatures are not God! That is why he described them differently as having four faces and hoofs and wings.
Did he describe God that way?
He has told you what God looks like, with hair, loins and sitting on a throne, with a loud voice like many waters and wearing a white robe as white ask snow.

John 14:4
"...he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then show us the Father".
Jesus is explaining here that he is exactly as the father, both in qualities and appearance.

Liveair:
You seem to be agreeing yet refusing to conceed that the description is that of God.
If a friend of yours says that he saw someone that looked like you somewhere, doesn't that tell you what the person looks like?
Of course its the closest words they can use for the description because that is what it looks like.
Why didn't they use goat, sheep, cow, etc? Because he doesn't look that way period!

The description was God, no doubt, but that description was according to how he(Ezekiel) saw it like he said. Yet God appeared in a pillar of cloud in some other places and pillar of fire in some other place in the bible. What i'm saying is that the shape of God is not restricted to one particular shape. He manifests in various ways. Its not like the case of man that you can say this is exactly how man looks (e.g. he has two eyes, two ears, two hands, two legs etc).

Liveair:

Jesus also said he and God are one. He even said that all things were made by him and that there is nothing that exists that isn't made by him.
Then Gen 1 says in the begining GOD MADE the heavens and the earth. This was written far before Jesus came.

Jesus is already God. But I believed this happened after his peaceful and mission of love on Earth

alexleo:




The description was God, no doubt, but that description was according to how he(Ezekiel) saw it like he said. Yet God appeared in a pillar of cloud in some other places and pillar of fire in some other place in the bible. What i'm saying is that the shape of God is not restricted to one particular shape. He manifests in various ways. Its not like the case of man that you can say this is exactly how man looks (e.g. he has two eyes, two ears, two hands, two legs etc).

You are mixing things up.
Daniel and Ezekiel didnt experience a manifested presence as you said, they saw God in Visions.
Now, there is a great difference btw God's Angels appearing in different forms and God Himself.
The pillar of fire (a manifestation) you mentioned was an Angel of God's presence according to the bible. Same Angel described in Rev 10:1.

The various individual accounts in the bible express similar features repeatedly; Snow-white hair, Shining loins, Dazzling white robe, Fiery feet and River-like Voice. Now, this is the biblical God ask He is.

sistar007:


Jesus is already God. But I believed this happened after his peaceful and mission of love on Earth

It would be irreconcilably contradictory to say that it happened after his earthly mission 'cos creation was already done by him, as he claimed.

Liveair:

It would be irreconcilably contradictory to say that it happened after his earthly mission 'cos creation was already done by him, as he claimed.

A God can't stay in a human body. It will limit him down to the law of nature. (Believe it or leave). God is beyond nature. Why would he breath air into his own body so that he would live

Liveair:

You are mixing things up.
Daniel and Ezekiel didnt experience a manifested presence as you said, they saw God in Visions.
Now, there is a great difference btw God's Angels appearing in different forms and God Himself.
The pillar of fire (a manifestation) you mentioned was an Angel of God's presence according to the bible. Same Angel described in Rev 10:1.

The various individual accounts in the bible express similar features repeatedly; Snow-white hair, Shining loins, Dazzling white robe, Fiery feet and River-like Voice. Now, this is the biblical God ask He is.

Numbers 12:5

5 Then the Lord descended in the pillar of cloud and stood at the entrance of the Tabernacle.[b] “Aaron and Miriam!” he called, and they stepped forward

Exodus 19:9

9 Then the Lord said to Moses, “I will come to you in a thick cloud, Moses, so the people themselves can hear me when I speak with you. Then they will always trust you.”

Exodus 24:17

17 To the Israelites at the foot of the mountain, the glory of the Lord appeared at the summit like a consuming fire.

alexleo:

Numbers 12:5

5 Then the Lord descended in the pillar of cloud and stood at the entrance of the Tabernacle.[b] “Aaron and Miriam!” he called, and they stepped forward

Exodus 19:9

9 Then the Lord said to Moses, “I will come to you in a thick cloud, Moses, so the people themselves can hear me when I speak with you. Then they will always trust you.”

Exodus 24:17

17 To the Israelites at the foot of the mountain, the glory of the Lord appeared at the summit like a consuming fire.

Like I said earlier, there is a difference between when the bible says THE LORD and THE PRESENCE OF THE LORD or MANIFESTED PRESENCE. His presence is a manifestation which is seen as Clouds, Fire and Thunder.

Ezekiel and Daniel saw THE LORD on his throne!
His form, his hair, his clothing, his feet were seen. In the cases of the Israelites you mentioned, they saw his MANIFESTED PRESENCE.
Ezekiel and Daniel never said God appeared IN ...

Num 12:5 which you sited states that God descended IN THE PILLAR OF CLOUD...
Why do you think it didn't simply say GOD DESCENDED? The use of the preposition IN should make it clear that its his manifested presence.

Exo 19 & 24 you sited even makes it easier to see. It says THE GLORY of the Lord...fire. That is clear enough.

Now, read Exo 33:14;
"and he said, My PRESENCE shall go with thee..."
You can now see clearly that God told Moses that his presence shall go with them.

sistar007:


A God can't stay in a human body. It will limit him down to the law of nature. (Believe it or leave). God is beyond nature. Why would he breath air into his own body so that he would live

Its not about Believing or Not. You have to prove your point by siting your biblical reference.
Why I said most christians will disagree with you is that Jesus said that he and the Father are one. He also said to his followers that he who has seen him has seen the Father. See John 10:30.