Welcome, Guest: Register On Nairaland / LOGIN! / Trending / Recent / New
Stats: 3,154,698 members, 7,823,965 topics. Date: Friday, 10 May 2024 at 07:20 PM

Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? - Politics - Nairaland

Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Politics / Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? (5496 Views)

Pic : Gowon And Trudeau In 1973, Is Africa Moving Forward Or Backward??? / Conservative (PDP ) Vs Progressive (APC) Where Do You Stand / What Is Africa's Biggest Problem? (2) (3) (4)

(1) (2) (Reply) (Go Down)

Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by omonozozo(m): 5:01pm On Aug 07, 2006
I find it interesting that in this day and age, most African nations actually choose to preserve their outdated practices (e.g. witchcraft, female circumcision, etc.). It seems there is a reluctance to move with the times and to progress.
I wonder whether it has something to do with the fear of losing one's identity. However, progress does not mean losing your identity. Even the forefathers created this identity through a gradual process (i.e. progress). So why become stagnant now?
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by mamaput(f): 8:11pm On Aug 07, 2006
Wait till OBJ sees this topic.
I do not think they are Primitive Or Just Conservative?.
I think they are just big pretenders
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by superman(m): 10:22pm On Aug 07, 2006
na wahoo
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by Eurphoria(f): 11:54am On Aug 08, 2006
omonozozoz

pls you may have to clear this one up for me, first is witchcraft exclusive to Africa? it is a popular practice in the most modern countries in the world, there are many traditional practices european countries hold on to from way back, does this make them primitive? Like you said progress does not mean losing identity. I think there is more to what you want to put across, am i right? if so then please put me in the picture cos from what i read the only thing i take issue with is the circumcison thing, otherwise what else is the reason you call african nations primitive?

1 Like

Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by omonozozo(m): 2:27pm On Aug 08, 2006
please you may have to clear this one up for me, first is witchcraft exclusive to Africa? it is a popular practice in the most modern countries in the world, there are many traditional practices european countries hold on to from way back, does this make them primitive? Like you said progress does not mean losing identity. I think there is more to what you want to put across, am i right? if so then please put me in the picture because from what i read the only thing i take issue with is the circumcison thing, otherwise what else is the reason you call african nations primitive?

Eurphoria:

First of all, thanks for your reply.

I need to clarify this: I am not saying that African people are primitive. I want to start a discussion on whether the reluctance to move with the times is due to a so-called "primitiveness", or if it is because a lot of Africans are conservative and therefore unwilling to move with the times.
My view is that many Africans are conservative, but their conservatism is outdated, and not in the best interests of African society and development.

Take the Masai, for example. Why won't they change from being nomadic cattle-rearers to being modern farmers, which would be sustainable and thus make more sense? This is a case of counterproductive conservatism.

A lot of customs practiced in Africa today go as far back as the stoneage. Examples of this include tribal marks, wearing animal skins like in parts of South Africa.

Let's get this clear: I am not saying that Africans should abandon their traditions and completely succumb to Western customs and practices. But I do believe that Africans need to contemporarise their traditions and customs so that they will better fit in todays's modern world and not hinder Africa's progress.
Fashion, again, is a good example. The Ashanti traditional garment, which has been worn for hundreds of years, is still worn today by many Ashanti at important international televised events. It just looks totally inappropriate! An even better example are the Zulu, who insist on wearing animal skins at important events because they believe it makes them look more distinguished, when in fact it just looks extremely outdated. WTF?? angry It's not just a question of taste; it also results in the Western world viewing Africans as "primitive".
Some Nigerian ethnic groups (e.g. Yoruba), on the other hand, have done a brilliant job of putting a modern spin on their traditional garments. That way, they preserve their culture without looking outdated - in fact, traditional dress looks very distinguished and far superior to the standard suit and tie.

This mindset of holding on to outdated customs, come what may, hinders Africa's progress because it stops Africans from aspiring to become better and compete with the rest of the world economically. The revolution needs to begin in the mind. Africa should endeavour to constantly improve and update, in order to keep up with today's modern and competitive world.

I hope I haven't offended anyone with my views; this isn't my intention. It's just a thought. I'm interested in what other people have to say about this.

Those who don't evolve will soon become extinct - it's a law of nature.

I'll get off my soapbox now. grin

1 Like

Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by Eurphoria(f): 3:09pm On Aug 08, 2006
Thanks for clearing it up, i see where you coming from now, just wanted a clearer pic before i lunge into a big discuss about your thread. wink , i'l come back later after some food in my belly .
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by omonozozo(m): 1:01am On Aug 09, 2006
Just imagine, in this day and age when man has gone to the moon and to outer space searching for E.T., there are still places where one village will fight the neighbouring village over a cow or a goat tongue

It's a consolation for me that at least Nigeria have launched a satellite and are planning to launch another one next year.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by iice(f): 6:40pm On Aug 09, 2006
Hmmmmm i guess they are conservative but like you said, their conservatism is outdated. Truly i cant really figure out why we are so afraid to move on. Please someone enlighten me on that. Is it fear? Fear of losing identity as omonozoz said? But isnt it evident enuff that most 'advanced' nations still have their identities? What exactly are we afraid of?
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by nilla(f): 6:47pm On Aug 09, 2006
this is a tough question to answer. But i think i will say we are conservative. But a number of people still might be primitive.

@ iice,
i dont think our fear to move forward has to do with our loosing our identity. I think we can still move forward and still have our identity (like you stated advanced nations still have their identity and they are moving forward by the day).
An important factor that is causing us to be stagnant or evolve slower is the lack of resources (such as money and even human resources).

We are competing with people that are much advanced and whether we like it or not it will take a long while for us to get to where they are.
we are taking baby steps while they are taking gigantic steps.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by iice(f): 7:06pm On Aug 09, 2006
Ok so we are lacking in some resources and althou we have such resources (There's money in Naija, We get enuff people also) why is it we are slow to actually improve for example human resource? But i think i know what you mean. It's basically the system, like in the Naija, state of the country makes it difficult to improve on what we know we have. Going back to 'african conservatism' how will you educate/inform the conservative nations on moving forward?
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by nilla(f): 7:14pm On Aug 09, 2006
we have people, but they are not being utilized. How will they be utilized when there is so much corruption. so its who knows who.

I think the first thing for them to know is that we cant overnight become advanced (it took those advanced countries a long time to get to where they are).
All they need to know is that we have to strive hard to make ourselves comfortable (money is not always it, e.g in nigeria if you have lots of money you will still end up in hold ups on the road the same way others do).
I think we just have to try and change our mentality. Not going in search of money alone, but also seeking to develop ourselves and our environment.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by iice(f): 7:19pm On Aug 09, 2006
nilla:

All they need to know is that we have to strive hard to make ourselves comfortable (money is not always it, e.g in nigeria if you have lots of money you will still end up in hold ups on the road the same way others do).
I think we just have to try and change our mentality. Not going in search of money alone, but also seeking to develop ourselves and our environment.
Yes i agree with you.
Now the trying to change the mentality is the difficult part cheesy
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by nilla(f): 7:21pm On Aug 09, 2006
I know,

we will brainstorm again next time. I have to sign out now
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by otokx(m): 10:23pm On Aug 09, 2006
wonders will never cease, in nigeria even the priests are preaching "God will bless you"; money answereth all things. That is a bush mentality, primitive thats it.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by omonozozo(m): 10:50pm On Aug 09, 2006
I believe the women are our future
Teach them well and let them lead the way
Show them all the beauty they possess inside. 
  wink

I just felt like singing for a minute.

Thanks for your input, nilla and iice.

I can see that you seem to be the only bold people on this forum willing to discuss this topic,
This is what I personally believe to be responsible for Africa's stagnant cultural development:

-Fear
-Inferiority complex
-Selfishness
-Oppression, misuse of power

These are the factors I would like to go into right now, although there are more.

-Fear of the unknown, of the future, of new things. Also, fear of their ancestors punishing them for changing their customs. This is like a bondage.

-Inferiority complex towards the Western world. Africans don't want to be seen as giving up their traditions/customs in favour of the supposedly 'better' customs of the Western world. Because of this, they are reluctant to contemporarise, or just leave it altogether. Thus the tendency of some people to laugh at others and criticise them: "Look at this one, wanting to be like an oyinbo!"

-Selfishness in the sense that certain customs are upheld because they benefit certain people. Example: child abuse continues because many people are profiting from the exploitation of children through child labour. The same thing goes for people having many children in order to exploit them, or families giving their daughter's hand in marriage to a rich man who already has several wives, simply because their family can gain from this. The list goes on and on.

Oppression: people in power have access to knowledge and technology, but they don't want their subjects to have the same access so that they can continue oppressing them. This can be found in the history of the great African kingdoms such as the Benin or the Mali Empire. This is one of the reasons that such great kingdoms crumbled: their rulers had access to knowledge, but chose to keep it to themselves or just share it with a few members of their elite. Additionally, secret courts were created to further subdue the subjects. Nowadays, this practice is still rife in Sharia: although it is outdated, the elite (who will never be tried) wants to continue to use Sharia as a tool of oppression.

These are the main reasons, in my opinion, for Africa's stagnant cultural development and the reluctance to change.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by nilla(f): 5:36pm On Aug 10, 2006
nice points there omonozozo,
i dont think that many people have that fear of the unknown. I agree with you a lot with selfishness and oppresion and a little with inferiority complex.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by N101: 9:41pm On Nov 29, 2009
Very interesting topic. I am of the mind that mamaput said it best:
mamaput:

I do not think they are Primitive Or Just Conservative?.
I think they are just big pretenders

Now being honest omonozozo, there are things you mentioned which I totally understand where you're coming from, but there are others which can be seen as "primitive" that I don't have a problem with.  I don't have a problem with someone dressing up in animal skins.  Neither do I have a problem with the Ashanti outfits.  I do have a problem with the fact that some people see witchcraft in any and every thing and can't be bothered to discern the truth.  I do have a problem with the idea of a bride price.  But that's just me, it is different for everyone.

Let me use a couple of examples of the oppression/suppression of women in African societies, where I've heard people (trying to) justify these practices.  On the one hand men will say women have the power, but in practice they don't.  When a woman's husband dies his family can remove her from the house or accuse her of killing their son.  Or her husband is a serial cheater and can infect her with HIV or any other disease, she's expected to accept this behaviour.  That doesn't speak of "power", it is simply a lack of respect and appreciation for women in Africa.

I laughed the other day when I read about a South African man who married four wives and some guest at the wedding said it means he won't do like men in the West and cheat on them.  I read years ago of a policeman who had two wives but raped the daughter of a colleague.  When has polygamy stopped a man from "cheating", whatever that means in polygamous circles?  These kind of ideas don't speak to me of Conservative, they are double standards; women are expected to be the holders of society's values, however men can do what they like but they want the title "head of the family" as well as social and political power.

So nilla is very right, it's selfishness and oppression and not having the greater good at heart which is the real problem in Africa.  But then I wonder if it breaks itself down even smaller - is ethnic group values more important than the collective values of the wider society?  Is it possible to forge a national identity without losing the ethnic and cultural values that make us unique?
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by AjanleKoko: 9:49pm On Nov 29, 2009
It's a mix of the two, and a bit more.
Some (very few) Africans are progressive, a surprisingly sizeable number are primitive, but most are conservative.

Primitive, because you still have barbaric customs like Oro sanctioned by the government, even though some parts may involve human sacrifice. Some prominent Africans also do human sacrifice for money and power rituals. You even see highly educated individuals still heavily reliant on marabouts, and deep into local cultist activities.

Very few Africans are progressive, which is why you still see a few world-class institutions emerge from the heart of Africa, like GT Bank. The protagonists of that bank have always gone against the grain and brought ideas to the table, despite operating in a sharply conservative industry and environment.
In fact I can think of no nation or people in Africa that are progressive, just individuals.

Africans are mostly conservative. They like progress, but still seek validation using age-old belief systems and tradition. This even supercedes the largely rampant practice of imported religion. I was just reading a rejoinder to Tunde Fagbenle's article in the punch today, by one of General Adeyinka Adebayo's children (the article was a critique of the general's recent visit to Aso Rock). The first point Fagbenle was taken up on was his irreverent and disrespectful remarks about a 'Yoruba elder' like General Adebayo. A clear example of using traditional beliefs as a weapon, rather than staying on cold hard facts.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by ochiaha1(m): 3:35pm On Jul 27, 2011
Africans are primitive and very superstitious in their reasoning. In an age of reason where everything can be logically explained, Africans still hold on unquestioning to age old beliefs and practices which has held the continent backward economically and technologically.

The mind-set of Africans have to be re-oriented through education, teaching of civics in schools, exposure to technological products and designs at very early ages ( Japanese children aged between 8-10 years have a national Robotics production competition where they design Toy Robots, Cars etc and this competition is taken very seriously in that country), exposure to IT savvy products and appliances also from a very early age.

If the above steps can be taken then, we shall move from a backward third world country to one that is truly on its way to industrialisation and technological achievement.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by Hertsnite: 10:37pm On Aug 14, 2011
primitive
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by AjanleKoko: 11:35pm On Aug 14, 2011
ochi-aha:


Africans are primitive and very superstitious in their reasoning. In an age of reason where everything can be logically explained, Africans still hold on unquestioning to age old beliefs and practices which has held the continent backward economically and technologically.

The mind-set of Africans have to be re-oriented through education, teaching of civics in schools, exposure to technological products and designs at very early ages ( Japanese children aged between 8-10 years have a national Robotics production competition where they design Toy Robots, Cars etc and this competition is taken very seriously in that country), exposure to IT savvy products and appliances also from a very early age.

If the above steps can be taken then, we shall move from a backward third world country to one that is truly on its way to industrialisation and technological achievement.

Can you design a robot yourself? undecided
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by okadaman2: 12:09am On Aug 15, 2011
Technically, Japanese pikin are behind our pikin.

I see many small small Nigerian pikin making recycled toys from refuse materials before the age on 3.

When oyinbo children are still doing ewwww eww all over the place, our Naija street pikin don recycle toy from discarded tire, rewire copper and broken bottle. Saving their parents money and the environment all at once.

Japanese and oyinbo pikin nor fit.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by AjanleKoko: 10:59am On Aug 15, 2011
okada_man:

Technically, Japanese pikin are behind our pikin.

I see many small small Nigerian pikin making recycled toys from refuse materials before the age on 3.

When oyinbo children are still doing ewwww eww all over the place, our Naija street pikin don recycle toy from discarded tire, rewire copper and broken bottle. Saving their parents money and the environment all at once.

Japanese and oyinbo pikin nor fit.

In an ironic way, you do have a point.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by pleep(m): 1:22am On Aug 16, 2011
Hertsnite:

primitive
dude. . . just go away, what do you want here?
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by ziga: 2:15am On Aug 16, 2011
First of all, some of the practices that you used as examples to regarding Africa being primitive vs conservative anre outdated and generally discouraged. e.g. female circumcision, tribal marks

People are people regardless. And if you expose the western/civilized man to our environment, he will very likely start to act the same way.

So, my point is we adapt to the resources and environment that we have around us. If you are truly objective and seek to understand why people do what they do, you will understand. But people prefer to look from outside without understanding and make judgement.

Like some other poster said, witchcraft is practiced in different ways all over the world and its not exclusive to Africa.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by Jakumo(m): 7:00am On Aug 16, 2011
Comical levels of superstition and blind religious devotion are, in general,  indexes of abject, primitive backwardness, but in some countries, of which Nigeria, India and Pakistan are fine examples, those obsessive and multi-layered beliefs in imaginary supreme beings do NOT in any way assure respect for legality and basic human rights, or even any predisposition to civilized conduct.

It is thus no surprise to hear accounts of Nigerian lynch mobs, made up of shrieking, bug-eyed muslims or christians, beating to death and setting afire mob victims in response to unsubstantiated accusations of witchcraft or petty larceny, before dispersing to later attend churches or mosques where the killers ostentatiously display their closeness to the God of their choosing.

Similarly, Indian and Pakistani men commit murders of the most horrendous nature against their own female blood relatives, to "punish" any such women who decide, for whatever valid reasons, to back out of "arranged" marriages often imposed with total strangers as husbands.   Those savage homicides are referred to in those cultures as "honor killings", yet the perpetrators of that bloodlust loudly proclaim their religious piety at every opportunity.

To answer the question posed here, Africa, and indeed many parts of Asia, remain home to vast numbers of murderous savages who give the word "primitive" a bad name.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by Krucifax(m): 11:36pm On Aug 16, 2011
omonozozo:

Eurphoria:

First of all, thanks for your reply.

I need to clarify this: I am not saying that African people are primitive. I want to start a discussion on whether the reluctance to move with the times is due to a so-called "primitiveness", or if it is because a lot of Africans are conservative and therefore unwilling to move with the times.
My view is that many Africans are conservative, but their conservatism is outdated, and not in the best interests of African society and development.

Take the Masai, for example. Why won't they change from being nomadic cattle-rearers to being modern farmers, which would be sustainable and thus make more sense? This is a case of counterproductive conservatism.

A lot of customs practiced in Africa today go as far back as the stoneage. Examples of this include tribal marks, wearing animal skins like in parts of South Africa.

Let's get this clear: I am not saying that Africans should abandon their traditions and completely succumb to Western customs and practices. But I do believe that Africans need to contemporarise their traditions and customs so that they will better fit in todays's modern world and not hinder Africa's progress.
Fashion, again, is a good example. The Ashanti traditional garment, which has been worn for hundreds of years, is still worn today by many Ashanti at important international televised events. It just looks totally inappropriate! An even better example are the Zulu, who insist on wearing animal skins at important events because they believe it makes them look more distinguished, when in fact it just looks extremely outdated. WTF?? angry It's not just a question of taste; it also results in the Western world viewing Africans as "primitive".
Some Nigerian ethnic groups (e.g. Yoruba), on the other hand, have done a brilliant job of putting a modern spin on their traditional garments. That way, they preserve their culture without looking outdated - in fact, traditional dress looks very distinguished and far superior to the standard suit and tie.

This mindset of holding on to outdated customs, come what may, hinders Africa's progress because it stops Africans from aspiring to become better and compete with the rest of the world economically. The revolution needs to begin in the mind. Africa should endeavour to constantly improve and update, in order to keep up with today's modern and competitive world.

I hope I haven't offended anyone with my views; this isn't my intention. It's just a thought. I'm interested in what other people have to say about this.

Those who don't evolve will soon become extinct - it's a law of nature.

I'll get off my soapbox now. grin


Whilst every continent has a mixture of both Primitivity and Conservatism, it's not stretch to say Africa has an unhealthy abundance of the former. Even this assertion is a generalisation that I'm particularly loath to indulge.

There are some things to consider and whilst i agree customs and practises should be in tune with the times,i think the Ashanti and Zulu inferences are abit off the mark. The garments is question are normally adorned in observance of customs(during traditional events) and should be viewed in that light alone. This practise is not unique to Africans. Take for instance the Japanese (a highly advanced society) the "Kimono" is still being worn at traditional events by their doctors,lawyers etc. The Kimono goes back hundreds of years.

The flip side to this that i would agree with would be the practises of some African tribes like the Kalahari bush tribes and the Kenyan Masai i think it borders on Primitive but some would rather use the term "different".
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by Hertsnite: 1:32pm On Aug 17, 2011
With out colonialism Sub Saharan Africa would still be in the Stone Age.

Africa is not conservative, conservative is a WI meeting in a nice little village in Wiltshire with old ladies knitting eating cup cakes. Africa is what I would term in an Un PC way, Primitive.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by Kobojunkie: 1:36pm On Aug 17, 2011
I think the last word that should be associated with  the general African Mindset, is the word "CONSERVATIVE".

Majority of the views and values we adhere to, on the most part, are not traditional. We are not known to be a moderate/"CAUTIOUS" people, and we on the most part, opposition to change is done more out of SELFISHNESS than any attempts to preserve old/traditional values.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by Kobojunkie: 7:31pm On Aug 17, 2011
ziga:

First of all, some of the practices that you used as examples to regarding Africa being primitive vs conservative anre outdated and generally discouraged. e.g. female circumcision, tribal marks

Outdated and generally discouraged sure, but they are still practised to this day. The media may have generally moved on, on reporting most of these but it is still practised in many parts of Africa. Even Slavery still flourishes in Africa, even though we rarely talk about it, in the african context.

ziga:

People are people regardless. And if you expose the western/civilized man to our environment, he will very likely start to act the same way.
There are those who have been exposed but still resist . . . so I do not see the relevance of the line above to the argument.

ziga:

So, my point is we adapt to the resources and environment that we have around us. If you are truly objective and seek to understand why people do what they do, you will understand. But people prefer to look from outside without understanding and make judgement.

I disagree with that. What we have has little to do with ADAPTATION. Female Circumcision, Slavery, Bigotry etc. Has little to do with adaptation, or conservatism.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by Roland17(m): 7:52pm On Aug 17, 2011
For any Development and Economic advancement to be sustainable they must be culturally alligned, African nations have become conformists amongst league of nations, with no true identity to alter any change or development, we swallow hook, line and sinker the development strategies of western nations, forgetting that development is in born and can only start to breed from the inside.
Re: Is Africa Primitive Or Just Conservative? by Kobojunkie: 7:57pm On Aug 17, 2011
Roland17:

For any Development and Economic advancement to be sustainable they must be culturally alligned, African nations have become conformists amongst league of nations, with no true identity to alter any change or development, we swallow hook, line and sinker the development strategies of western nations, forgetting that development is in born and can only start to breed from the inside.

How much of what we have today, is in fact of our culture? undecided undecided undecided undecided Forget western influences, and focus on that which many like to claim has to do with culture, how much of it is authentic and how much do we really practice in all veracity?

(1) (2) (Reply)

Italian Engineer Kidnapped In Kwara / A Denied And Delayed Justice For Apo-6 And Ezu River-50. / Happening Now: Igbos In Usa Are On Ground For Show Down Against Buhari

(Go Up)

Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health
religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket

Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10)

Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 86
Disclaimer: Every Nairaland member is solely responsible for anything that he/she posts or uploads on Nairaland.