I know this might be the most controversial thing I've ever spewed on this forum, but, fact is, there is only one reason why lyrical content is important to the critical reception of hiphop.
It's because half the artists and listeners are uneducated anyways. Kinda like the proverbial city of blind men.
This is the reason why people are praised for spewing what another person already learnt from reading books and watching CNN.
Why do y'all think Common's called Black Man's CNN?? Because the black man will refuse to go to school in order to understand CNN, but then he'll come back and listen to KRS-One and claim he's deep.

Nas comes out to scream Hiphop Is Dead and errone goes, 'damn, this is soo deep' . . . fcukin hell, in the educated circles, it's called the incorporation of subcultures by the ruling class and they've sure predicted it since God knows when.

For you lot, when you're inclined towards intellect, you listen to rap, for other people, they read wide, watch educative stuff, and sumtimes GO TO SCHOOL and then listen to hiphop as a form of entertainment.

Yeah, Obama's best musician is Jay-Z, but nope, he didn't get his silky communication abilities and encyclopedic brains from Hov, he got it from freaking Havard Law School.
So when next you think you're on sum 'high intellectual level' cus you're listening to Thugz Mansion, ask yourself if you've gotten any smarter than all those CEOs of multimillion dollar companies that will rather listen to Jazz.

eldee:

Yeah, Obama's best musician is Jay-Z, but nope, he didn't get his silky communication abilities and encyclopedic brains from Hov, he got it from freaking Havard Law School.
So when next you think you're on sum 'high intellectual level' cus you're listening to Thugz Mansion, ask yourself if you've gotten any smarter than all those CEOs of multimillion dollar companies that will rather listen to Jazz.

This is where Canibus is different from your average rapper like Jigga, Nas, DMX or Fiddy.

He was spitting on Moore's law, Levinson's time equations, LeMarketson's theory, Philosophies of Ilk n David Hume, Orwellian nature of the USA govt.
Go and listen to "Cemantics" and understand why intellectuals will rather listen to a rapper spitting on magnetohydrodynamic mechanics,
Polymers, L and D sudunits of polymers, etc.
If u listen to any CD of Bis'. . . . .U would be opening ur dictionary or googling every verse to understand the concept of his music.
I learnt more from Bis than the boring lectures in ma Uni

This is Canibus version of what Nas pronounced as "Hip Hop Is Dead" in 2006!!!

"Ever since RAP became a lucrative profession/there's a misconception/that a movement in any direction is progression/"
                                                                                                                        -Poet Laureate II(2003).

eldee:

I know this might be the most controversial thing I've ever spewed on this forum, but, fact is, there is only one reason why lyrical content is important to the critical reception of hiphop.
It's because half the artists and listeners are uneducated anyways. Kinda like the proverbial city of blind men.
This is the reason why people are praised for spewing what another person already learnt from reading books and watching CNN.
Why do y'all think Common's called Black Man's CNN?? Because the black man will refuse to go to school in order to understand CNN, but then he'll come back and listen to KRS-One and claim he's deep.

Nas comes out to scream Hiphop Is Dead and errone goes, 'damn, this is soo deep' . . . fcukin hell, in the educated circles, it's called the incorporation of subcultures by the ruling class and they've sure predicted it since God knows when.

For you lot, when you're inclined towards intellect, you listen to rap, for other people, they read wide, watch educative stuff, and sumtimes GO TO SCHOOL and then listen to hiphop as a form of entertainment.

Yeah, Obama's best musician is Jay-Z, but nope, he didn't get his silky communication abilities and encyclopedic brains from Hov, he got it from freaking Havard Law School.
So when next you think you're on sum 'high intellectual level' cus you're listening to Thugz Mansion, ask yourself if you've gotten any smarter than all those CEOs of multimillion dollar companies that will rather listen to Jazz.

No disrespect bro but while this is the most controversial thing you ever said, it also happens to be the dumbest thing I've ever read. I've never heard anyone call Common black man's CNN and the last time I checked, a lot of hip-hop heads still regarded KRS-One as a crazy conspiracy theorist. I listen to music for entertainment but I also want to get the feeling that the musician is creative with his lyrics. The extra points come if the musician is socially conscious, not because I'm not educated but because I love some substance.

To disprove your point completely, I'll point out that the uneducated people who listen to hiphop don't listen to KRS-one or Common, they listen to Soulja Boy.

~Sauron~:

This is where Canibus is different from your average rapper like Jigga, DMX or Fiddy.

He was spitting on Moore's law, Levinson's time equations, LeMarketson's theory, Astronomy!!!
Go and listen to "Cemantics" and understand why intellectuals will rather listen to a rapper spitting on magnetohydrodynamic mechanics.
Polymers, L and D sudunits of polymers.
If u listen to any CD of Bis'. . . . .U would be opening ur dictionary or googling every verse to understand the concept of his music.
I learnt more from Bis than the boring lectures in ma Uni

Exactly my sentiments!!!
In the city of blind men, the one-eyed man is the KING.

Please, try to interpret the following passage
Magenetohydrodynamic mechanics

There's more to the human race than
polymers proteins and protocells
Chemical evolution, L- and D-form sudunits
That come from the love of Hip Hop and Rap music
                                                                              -Canibus

This is exactly what I was saying, Canibus prolly opened a book and draws ot all the words he can't explain
Then people go . . . 'Awww . . . deep shit'
But nah, sumone else will go to school and study that and much more

Oi, gimme smooth flow wth on-point delivery bruv, that's what you're bleeping paid for!!!
I already learnt about Chemical Evolution at school.

Ras Pwn:

No disrespect bro but while this is the most controversial thing you ever said, it also happens to be the dumbest thing I've ever read. I've never heard anyone call Common black man's CNN and the last time I checked, a lot of hip-hop heads still regarded KRS-One as a crazy conspiracy theorist.

You never heard anyone call Common the Black Man's CNN so that means it's never been said??
Aight then, at least you must have heard Chuck D say hiphop is Black America's link to information??
But wait a minute, are you just interested in talking bout who said what??

Ras Pwn:

I listen to music for entertainment but I also want to get the feeling that the musician is creative with his lyrics. The extra points come if the musician is socially conscious, not because I'm not educated but because I love some substance.

If you were as literate as you claim to be, you'll have been able to discern the obvious fact that my post was directed at people that claim to be 'inclined to music on the intellectual level'.
Did you see Sauron's post claiming that he learnt more from Canibus than he did from Uni??
Since you, like myself, place social consciousness as an extra, I see no point in arguing with you.

Ras Pwn:

To disprove your point completely, I'll point out that the uneducated people who listen to hiphop don't listen to KRS-one or Common, they listen to Soulja Boy.

Are you having a laugh?? Erm, what's Street Cred??
What do rappers mean when they use phrases like 'realest nigga' and 'take it back to the street'??
Ohh . . . you think they mean y'all middle-class uni graduates listening to hiphop on your blackberry??

Once again you missed my point, I clearly stated that I was talking about the uneducated ones that want to sound intelligent
And yeah, I'm talking about 'em ones that know they don't need to go to school when they can easily blame 'the system'
I'm talking about the KRS-One fanbase that wanted to boycott Nelly's album for sum reason I'll never understand

^^^
People who say things like "take it back to the streets" or "street cred" actually don't care about lyrics, they care about the beat. Using that logic, those who care about the beat are the illiterate ones and those who care about the lyrics are the smart ones. Case Closed.

Ras Pwn:

^^^
People who say things like "take it back to the streets" or "street cred" actually don't care about lyrics, they care about the beat. Using that logic, those who care about the beat are the illiterate ones and those who care about the lyrics are the smart ones. Case Closed.

Now, this is where you selective cognition comes to the forefront
Do you want me to quote Nas here??
Oh, now Nas does not care about lyrics??

eldee:

Exactly my sentiments!!!
In the city of blind men, the one-eyed man is the KING.

City of the blind?? I am having a laugh. . . . .
Why not google Canibus' biography and see he is more educated than ur Nas, 2Pac, 50 cent or fuckever.


Please, try to interpret the following passage
Magenetohydrodynamic mechanics

There's more to the human race than
polymers proteins and protocells
Chemical evolution, L- and D-form sudunits
That come from the love of Hip Hop and Rap music
                                                                              -Canibus

This is exactly what I was saying, Canibus prolly opened a book and draws ot all the words he can't explain
Then people go . . . 'Awww . . . deep shit'
But nah, sumone else will go to school and study that and much more

Why can't Nas and Jigga open a book and spit the same knowledge??
They don't have an idea. . . . .They'd rather rap about money, women, the price of ice, pink rose. . . .I am sick of listening to such garbage.
Are we even sure Jigga knows what time equations mean??

Oi, gimme smooth flow wth on-point delivery bruv, that's what you're bleeping paid for!!!
I already learnt about Chemical Evolution at school.

U learnt chemical evolution in school but loads of rap listeners have never heard of em.
Eldee, you are not everybody.
Canibus is not saying these things because it rhymes. His biography will tell you he is probably the most-learned rapper out there.
U just don't rap about subject matter you don't understand. . . . .
If you are used to Canibus, you would know he is conversant with what he talks about. He bagged a degree in computer science.

Personally, I'll go for lyrics any day, anytime. I think a song is meaningless if the lyrics makes no sense. A fine rhythm is somewhat necessary but you don't compromise that for sound lyrics.

I’m not only having a laugh. I’m having a fit . . .

I got my formal education from proper institutions. Not from Rap.

I got, and still get my informal education from colleagues, media, church, music (Rap inclusive).

Formal education taught me about Science/Tech, Computers, Law, etc.

Informal education taught, and still teaches me about Interpersonal Relationship, Business, Trust, Love, etc.

Rap encourages me to do certain things that Education decries. For example, Rap encourages me to use foul language. It encourages me to use words like “Idiot” when arguing with people. But Education says not to. So I struck a balance. I chose not to . . .

@Eldee

I’m not 100% into your “controversial theory”. I do not agree with you saying that the sole reason lyrical content is important to the critical reception of hiphop is because "half the artists and listeners are uneducated anyways”. An educated black man would listen to KRS-One and still get more educated.

Why? One - As a human race, our reading culture is fast declining. Worse still, we do not even know. That’s why a full-fledged graduate can declare that rap music teaches him more than what University taught him. Peops would rather sit down all day - watchin’ TV, listening to the radio, fiddling with computers. As such, a black but educated man might prefer to listen to Rap Music and get educated instead of reading up on issues. He might not read what Voltaire, Hippocrates, Rene Descartes or Montaigne wrote on Philosophy or Political Science but he would listen to what KRS or Nas said on the same subjects . . .

Two, rap fans love wordplay, witty sayings, rhymes, quotable quotes et al (all in one package plus information). CNN’s not into all that. CNN just gives information.

Three, with Rap comes creativity. Rap also atimes can give you very vivid and graphic imageries that even the visual details of CNN cannot give. As such, instead of watching CNN telling us ‘bout Charles Darwin’s theories on DNAs, we might prefer to hear Nas tell us in a more creative way like he hinted in his “New World”.

Four, an educated mind seeks more education. And he would seek such education from any source - books, media, music . . .

^{*on a rebounce . . .*}

El, this is however the part I mostly agree with - "For you lot, when you're inclined towards intellect, you listen to rap, for other people, they read wide, watch educative stuff, and sumtimes GO TO SCHOOL and then listen to hiphop as a form of entertainment"

Much as I listen to Rap, I still take out time to read books. It would be a total disgrace for me to pass through the four walls of a college and come back to say "Rap Music gives me more education than my schools gave me". That's why although the schools never imparted all the knowledge I need to get, I update maself regularly with books

I read to get knowledge. And more knowledge. Canibus cannot give me that. This dude raps about what I already learned in school. Computers, aliens, science/tech. Why would I listen to him when he's not telling me anything different from what I already learned? I'd rather listen to Pac and Nas who tell me about life in da projects, "keep yo' friends close but yo' enemies closer", "believe in yourself" and sturvs school never taught me. I don't know of any course in our schools that teach us sturvs like what Nas preached in "I Can" (though he came from the kiddies angle). I don't know of any course where I'd learn a quote like I heard in 2Pac's "Smile":

"Here's a message to the newborns, waitin' to breathe
If you believe then you can achieve
Just look at me
Against all odds, though life is hard we carry on
Livin' in the projects, broke with no lights on
To all the seeds that follow me
protect your essence
Born with less, but you still precious . . ."

When will an artiste like Canibus learn to drop such useful knowledge Instead he goes on and on about electrons, aliens, computers and such sturvs that can't help the world.

And mind you, Canibus studied Computer Science. But I'm yet to hear of any college or even any group of serious minded peops studying his lyrics. Nas and Pac are drop-outs. But renowned institutions like Harvard have their theories in 'em syllabuses. I do not know of any rapper that constantly drops more knowledge than these 2 cats. Someone even describes Nas' raps as "a political science lecture without snoring". Biggie was another drop-out but whilst in school, he was an excellent student. He won several awards as an English student. BTW, he attended the same school as Busta, Jay-Z and DMX

On the real tip, much as I love lyrics, I also love good rhythm. Why would I listen to a versed teacher or preacher who can't articulate properly

For me, Lyrics and Rhythm are like 2Pac and Biggie. I regard them as equals.

d

Nice and insightful analysis y'all.

While it is pardonable that most poster's here analyzed this issue from the point of Hip-hop as most are rap inclined,i will not want us to forget other genre of music like Rock,R n B,Fuji,Apala,Makoosa et al.

In all there is a need to strike a balance between the two.Whilst the posters on the part of the divide that goes for lyrics will be quick to attest to lyrical wizardry and ingenuity as a catch,i doubt if it is the only catch.OK my drift is,what is a good lyrical outflow without a good rhythm to back it up.What's  a Nas,Canibus,Root,Bob Marley et al without a catchy,complementing and indellible beat to follow suit?

I mean Canibus inability to break into the mainstream is an attestation to the power of a good rhythmical blend and back-up to an inciting,exciting and in-depth lyrics

On the other hand too we should ask ourselves,what's the essence of a good rhythm and beat without indelible lyrics.I make bold to say (but for lovers of Jazz and of course proponents and supporters of D'banj's thesis in Mr Entertainer) it is NOTHING,BALDERDASH.Whilst it may get us shaking our body and jumping on the dance -floor for a while,it ends there.

Suffice to say these 2 elements walk hand in hand and none can be relegated to the back-ground.


@Sauron

I have learnt from NL what i did not learn from the Uni too.It is not because NL is the next best thing since google  ,it is because education is a continuous and unending process and journey.Being open minded and receptive is the KEY brov.

@Bamsyle
It's controversial bruv . . . you're not allowed too agree 100%

Although I see where you're coming from, maybe 'solely' was the wrong word to use, but it's still one of the major reasons
If everyone came out spewing 'New World' like Nas, no one will shift when Canibus talks about Chemical Evolution
Do you get me??

Let's look at punk rock as a case study . . . this genre of music started as a form of resistance to the hegemonic ideology of our consumer culture
So it's easily understandable that they had to study hard, read bout the economy before they spew anything
Their target was the average middle-class youth. Now tell me, will anyone take Coldplay's Viva La Vida as 'deep shit'??
The obvious answer is NO!!! Everyone else does the same thing, and yeah, the audience already read bout that in school and the other five agents of socialization.

Compare that to hiphop. A rapper spews sumn and the wisdom-thirsty part of the audience go 'damn . . . dude's deep'
That's what Jay-Z means when he says 'Cause you don't understand him it don't mean that he nice'

kay_pumpin:

@Sauron
I have learnt from NL what i did not learn from the Uni too.It is not because NL is the next best thing since google  ,it is because education is a continuous and unending process and journey.Being open minded and receptive is the KEY brov.

Exactly ma point. . . . .

Education is a continuous process. . . . .I was still in high school when Canibus was dropping the knowledge i was talking about.
I knew about Moore's law long before ma mates who went to the Uni to study Philosophy ever did. . . .Why is it so?? It's because i heard Canibus talking about it and i was curious to know what he was talking about. . . . .This is why i would rather listen to Canibus than a 2pac/Nas/Jigga/Busta Rhymes.
I am always hungry for knowledge, Canibus provoke ma thunks more than any other rapper can ever do.

It's one thing to listen to rappers(including Jay-Z, Nas, 2pac etc) whose vocab pool are at par with students in the 4th grade. . .
It's another thing to blow your mind and enter the dark mind of the most lyrical human being on the planet, Canibus.
What did 2pac say that NWA(original gangstars before him did not say??) Guns, Projects, Women, Cars, Versace??
I saw all that with Al Capone's "Untouchable" or Don Corleone's "Godfather".
How many of 2pac/Nas' songs would prompt you to google or consult the dictionary?? I can't find one.

eldee:

Compare that to hiphop. A rapper spews sumn and the wisdom-thirsty part of the audience go 'damn . . . dude's deep'
That's what Jay-Z means when he says 'Cause you don't understand him it don't mean that he nice'

That was the main reason Jay-Z lost the battle of the king of NY. . . . .

Jay-Z is not deep. He is simply a commercial rapper. Apart from Jacobs, Dayton Spokes and Bubbly, he has nothing else to offer me.
Nas, to a certain degree and Canibus are deeper. Just a mere mention of a word gets me scrambling to google or dictionary and i am curious to know what they are talking about. Which High School teaches Humes law or Levinson's time equations??
But as a rap listener, u have the opportunity of being exposed to these subjects earlier and that is pristine knowledge.
Unlike some people here, i didn't start listening to Canibus AFTER i got outta school. . . .I knew him as a teenager.

Canibus lyrics are pure based upon the fact that he drops knowledge about things that most hip hop heads can't grasp due to their limited education.
In order to truly obtain the knowledge, study Canibus' lyrics and educate yourself instead of being blinded by the commercial trumpery.
How about this for wordplay. . . .

"a wise man sees failure as progress/
A fool divorces his knowledge, and misses the logic/
and loses his soul in the process/
obsessed with nonsense with a caricature that has no content"

At the end of the day, i may agree it bores down to the individuals. . . .Some heads see Rap music as a form of entertainment(good beats, lemme shake me ass and get down) AND some see it as a source of knowledge first before anything else. I belong to the latter category.
I am more of a vocab fan and i am attracted to artistes who flexes their lyrical untouchability in the hip-hop industry.
Knowledge is power and for that, Canibus reigns supreme.
He is not cut for the fans of Nelly, Ja Rule and Soulja Boy. . . . .How are those different to any R-n-B or Rock fans.
Why are we attracted to rap in the first place?? Is it not because we are bored of artistes singing about "making love" and "breaking up"?
What possible knowledge or moral can Neyo, Rihanna or Beyonce give someone like me with their boring bullshit??

Eldee, don't make me vex o. . . . . .Lyrics 100%

Last time I checked, to "communicate" means:

"to impart, to reveal, to demonstrate, to bestow, to succeed in conveying ones meaning to others".

Also, to "educate" means to bring up and instruct,  to train, to teach

Peops often interprete "Best Lyricist" to mean the dude with those above-ya-head kinda lyrics.

No way.

The only reason I would go to school to listen to ma tutors is cos they've got stuff to impart in me. Connected to that is also the fact that they know how to teach, how to instruct. How to deliver. By the seven great lakes, how could I spend my hard-earned money paying teachers who cannot interprete what's in the books for me to understand? Meanwhile, the books were there all the time for me to read. The only reason I would choose to listen to a tutor teaching what's in 'em books is cos he is supposed to be more knowledgeable than I am. But at the same time, he is supposed to be able to interprete what's in those books. He's supposed to deliver.

Why would I need a thesaurus to understand what a "lyricist" is saying? Even the best and most knowledgeable professors have to convert their lectures, thesis et al into simple menus of bread and butter - so that their listeners can ingest 'em.

Well, while talking, you may not be communicating to me 'neways. You could be communicating to yourself. Sumn like a monologue/soliloquy. But folks who intend talking to others but end up talking to themselves fall into a class of peops that we call . . . erm . . . lunatics . . .

A good lyricist is someone who has the elevated visions of Nostradamus with the simple delivery of Ghandi. If I put up a sentence like "The gargantuan idiosyncracies of the misogynist called Canibus are electroencephalographically magnetohydrodynamic", have I communicated anything? Does that make me a good lyricist? Even well-versed professors would check the dictionary to know what that means

I've listened to loads of joints from Canibus. I'm not mesmerized by the intelligence that went into his songs. His lyrical ability might be 'wow' but that does not make him a genius. Canibus goes into technical, esoteric sturvs just to make a very simple point. When you take the time to decipher what's he's saying, you'll then discover that he was just stating a very simple thing. His high-sounding words don't add anything to his songs. Maybe he wants to sound "cool" or pretentious Go through his entire catalogue, you'll find that his philosophy never goes any further than bars that fit neatly into cool-sounding punchlines.

My point: Canibus just has the ability to put complicated words together. Period. The actual messages and meanings in his songs are no deeper than something you'd get from average rappers. They're never as deep as they sound.

It's funny that as deep as Nas is, more often than not we still get to understand him . . .

@Eldee,

I got'ya bruv. Maybe the words "only one" (also interpreted as "sole" were what caused our "different strokes"

All the fans of Jigga, Nas, Nelly, 2Pac etc should take a hike!!!!

What makes Canibus lyrically superior?? He possesses a lyrical prowess and his ability to sew 21-letter words into simple rhymes surpasses the average listeners' vocab. If u want rap lyrics in it's ultimate form with pristine delivery Canibus is the answer.
50 cent, Jigga, Nas 2pac etc are mere grains in the vast wheat field called Canibus.
As a total artiste(entertainment, showmanship, promotion, production, commercial value, juicy videos), i agree he is not in the league of the aforementioned rappers but he is PEERLESS as far as penmanship/mind stimulating lyrics are concerned.

How does a rapper get criticised for putting out intelligence on vinyl/aluminium layer in CDs??
The worst Canibus album is better than the best albums of overrated cats like Jigga/Nas. . . .Where should i start from?
Is it the bulk amount of lyrics dissipated in a diaphragm-straining delivery or the information-saturated, visionary and ingenious poetry??
He is the pure epitome of what real hip-hop should be. . . . . .
Canibus should not be held responsible because average listeners have sub-normal intelligence. . . . .A lecturer drops knowledge and it is up to his students to seek more knowledge around the subject matter. . . .That is what Canibus does.

I am proud to say i am lucky to have witnessed the BOOM ERA of hip-hop music(1993-2003).
There's no way the rap industry will eclipse this decade with the avalanche of muppets and commercial twats the industry boasts of today.
I am sick n tired of critics saying a rapper picks "big words". . . .Just because some of us don't hear these words in a day to day conversation does not make em big words. I will pay double to listen to Bis' showcase of verbal mastery and immaculate vocabulary than 2Pac's 4th grade metaphors!!

I challenge all y'all 2pac's fans to print his best works on this thread and i will fish out FIVE Canibus' poetries that will eat it ALIVE.
He is a cannibal. He eats average rapper's verbiage with his pristine mastery of English Language and delivering his message at the same time.
His only flaw is the folks behind his production unit.
If he had been handled by Dre/Timbaland from the onset. . . .most rappers woulda retired shamefully.

I need two of you(Bamsyle and Sauron) to trade lyrical words on the battle thread.
Really hitching for it,

kay_pumpin:

I need two of you(Bamsyle and Sauron) to trade lyrical words on the battle thread.
Really hitching for it, 

Lyrical words on the battle thread?? Nah.
Bamsyle does not battle. . . . .He is a rock/R-n-B fan.

I have an 8-year old cousin who loves to pen big words from dictionaries. She'll look 'em up and pen 'em together on the pages of an exercise book - whether they make sense or not. Lookin' back, that cousin reminds me of Canibus

For an artiste born in 1974, who completed high school in 1992, bagged a computer science degree much later, began his rap career in the mid-'90s, released over 8 full-length but woeful albums between 1998 and 2007, opted in and out of different contracts and blamed his monumental failures on his producers et al; I got 2 words: TIME UP.

Hehe, when I read this dude's biography, I changed my perception of what the human representation of recurrent/perpetual failures should be. I used to think of Abraham Lincoln. But then it should be Germaine Williams, a.k.a Canibus. But Abraham Lincoln's story was that of failure-to-success. Well, we don't know how that of Canibus would end. He might be another Fatai Rolling $ Not laughing at his misfortunes 'neways but just hoping he does the right thing ^{*at what age?*} Anyways, as for me I don't associate with failures

Dude should take a cue and borrow from veterans like Pac, Nas, Biggie - all dropouts but not ya average MCs. Dude should know he's doing everything wrong. Crappy delivery. High-sounding but meaningless words which actually have underlying simple deductions . . . and the list goes on . . .

America's got a level playing ground for any entrepreneur. If 'Bis had been doing the right thing, we won't be comparing him with Eminem. Even Canibus' die-hard fans criticized his "C True Hollywood Stories" album as "a failed attempt at becoming a commercial and mainstream artist". Wyclef's attempt at turning his life around was a total failure.

Some Canibus' fans remind me of those folks who go to church on Sunday, sit down and listen with rapt attention all day long to the preacher's sermon, jump up in excitement at every sentence screaming "Word/Preach it!" But when they get back home, ask 'em what the sermon was all about and they'll go "Well . . . all I know is . . . it was a great sermon"!

kay_pumpin:

I need two of you(Bamsyle and Sauron) to trade lyrical words on the battle thread.
Really hitching for it,

Hehe, I replied you on this earlier dawg . . .

In the Rap Battle Thread, some 'netcees' (whatever that is ) like Ibime have managed to convince me of their rap skills.

But Sauron? I see verses that sound more like prose than rap . . .

Pac, 'Hova and Nas are the most overrated twats in the Rap industry. . . .If anything, they destroyed hip-hop.
I am wise enough to discern there are two kinds of rap artistes. . . .the real students of the game(Ras Kass, Canibus, Rakim, Common etc) and the commercial twats(2Pac, Jay-Z, Nas, Biggie, Weezy etc). I don't have to spell it out but this is a battle of penmanship and showmanship!!!!

Anyone saying Canibus is a monumental failure is also saying Rakim, RZA and Ras Kass have failed as rappers.
We are not comparing in terms of album sales here. . . . . .We are digging deep into POETRY and vocab pool!!!!
If Outkast's Speakerboxxx/The Love Below album can outsell any album 2Pac and Biggie have put out in their career then we should all conclude Hip-Hop is indeed DEAD n BURIED.

Putting big words together does not necessarily make sense unless the words are applied in the correct context and put together to smell great.
In ma hood, we call such chain of words a SCENTence!!!! I won't waste me time disputing who has got the better lyrics in the rap game!!!
Even the most die-hard 2Pac fans recognise Canibus' immaculate vocab executed with peerless velocity.
Whether it sells or not is open to another debate but that does not take the hues of shine away from his works.

Bamsyle:

In the Rap Battle Thread, some 'netcees' (whatever that is ) like Ibime have managed to convince me of their rap skills.
But Sauron? I see verses that sound more like prose than rap . . .

Roflmao. . . . .hater!!!

It takes a deep mind to understand those topicals . . . . .
Ma masterpieces are not meant for the frail-hearted.

Veterans like Rakim, RZA and Rass Kass might be commercial failures. But on the real tip, a list of Rap Music's Greats is incomplete without 'em. Especially Rakim. Almost every other rapper names him as their greatest influence . . .

Nobody said "album sales" here. We're talking lyrics. A lot of peops have been beclouded for so long with the theory that the dude with the high-sounding words and vocabs must be the champion of the English Language.

Nah.

In the real world, the dude with the most sensible and meaningful vocabs reigns supreme. Rakim is a genius lyrically. A lot of rap cats would run over themselves to feature him on a track. That's someone I'll refer to as the "yesterday, today and tomorrow of the art called Rap" . . . I was still boppin' ma head to "Classic (Better Than I've Ever Been)" yesterday . . . where's Canibus on the rap scene of today?

A great rapper might not sell records. He might not have remarkable record sales. But he'll be respected by the real gees . . . I'm yet to see a Top 10 Rappers List of any rap head with the name "Canibus" . . . No money. No fame. No name. No street cred. The "Canibus" of the epic movie "Clash of The Titans" is more popular than the rapper of the same name . . .

Canibus' epitaph should read;

"He came. He saw. But he was conquered".

Better still;

"He signed for fame
But he got shame
But all the same
He signed his name!"



In this game, you must have at least one of three things - Money, Power or Respect.

Nas and Pac have the three. Canibus has none . . .

~Sauron~:

Roflmao. . . . .hater!!!

It takes a deep mind to understand those topicals . . . . .
Ma masterpieces are not meant for the frail-hearted.

"Deep mind", "Topicals" and "Masterpieces" are words that are as distant from Sauron as the East is from the West

Bamsyle:

"Deep minds", "Topicals" and "Masterpieces" are words that are as distant from Sauron as the East is from the West

This concept is played and leave ma topicals alone.

Bamsyle:

Veterans like Rakim, RZA and Rass Kass might be commercial failures. But on the real tip, a list of Rap Music's Greats is incomplete without 'em. Especially Rakim. Almost every other rapper names him as their greatest influence . . .

Blah. . . . . .Maybe average rappers like Nas n Jay-Z.
Canibus is of a higher plane. Biggie had no influence. 2Pac?? He was influenced by the poetry he learnt in school.
Jay-Z was influenced by Biggie so who are the disciples of Rakim.

Nobody said "album sales" here. We're talking lyrics. A lot of peops have been beclouded for so long with the theory that the dude with the high-sounding words and vocabs must be the champion of the English Language.
Nah.

In terms of vocabulary,

Canibus = 2Pac + Biggie + Jigga + Nas

In the real world, the dude with the most sensible and meaningful vocabs reigns supreme. Rakim is a genius lyrically. A lot of rap cats would run over themselves to feature him on a track. That's someone I'll refer to as the "yesterday, today and tomorrow of the art called Rap" . . . I was still boppin' ma head to "Classic (Better Than I've Ever Been)" yesterday . . . where's Canibus on the rap scene of today?

Was this the reason Canibus punished the lyrical genius(Rakim) on "I'll Buss Em, U Punish Em"??
That was the track that opened ma eyes in 2000 that Bis' is under-rated. I have never heard Rakim so clueless on a rap song.
He was at his lyrical best but his best punchlines got swallowed when Bis was delivering subliminal lyrics warped through intravenous apocalyptic verses to release relentless eargasms.   Canibus > Rakim(lyrically). . . .Enough said.

A great rapper might not sell records. He might not have remarkable record sales. But he'll be respected by the real gees . . . I'm yet to see a Top 10 Rappers List of any rap head with the name "Canibus" . . . No money. No name. No street cred. The "Canibus" of the epic movie "Clash of The Titans" is more popular than the rapper of the same name . . .

Canibus has a name and has got street credibility. His fan base stretches across USA to Canada to Kingston, Jamaica.
Because of his Jamaican roots, he is well recognised in South London by real rap heads.
U need to see his tour in the UK. . . . . .U would marvel.

In this game, you must have at least one of three things - Money, Power or Respect.
Nas and Pac have the three. Canibus has none . . .

Letz set the record straight. . . . .2Pac had no money until his death(He died a poor man)!!!  Nas is average.
Power?? Poor folks don't have power. The only rapper who qualifies for this category is erm, 50 cent but he has no street credz.
Respect?? Come on. . . . .Go and read reviews of any Canibus album and get lectured.

In all the 3 things u listed. . . . . Canibus has 2(money is not really necessary).

~Sauron~:

This concept is played and leave ma topicals alone.

Yep. I'll leave 'em where they belong - the Imaginary World.

Blah. . . . . .Maybe average rappers like Nas n Jay-Z.
Canibus is of a higher plane. Biggie had no influence. 2Pac?? He was influenced by the poetry he learnt in school.
Jay-Z was influenced by Biggie so who are the disciples of Rakim.

Read up Rakim's biography. He's not only referred to as a rapper, he's also called "a pioneer of Rap Music". His partnership with Eric B is critically acclaimed as one of the most influential of hip-hop supergroups. And he was largely responsible for this phenomenon. He started what we now know as "internal rhyming" in Rap. He brought metaphors to the forefront.

From Raekwon to 50 Cent, to Kurupt, Ghostface Killah, Eminem, Jay-Z, Killah Priest, RZA, The Game, R.A. Tha Rugged Man, Will Smith plus all those rappers you listed up there - they all name him as their influence. When Canibus was still non-existent, Rakim had spat ill lines that moved the world . . .

In terms of vocabulary,

Canibus = 2Pac + Biggie + Jigga + Nas

In terms of sensible lyrics,

Soulja Boy + Lil' Boosie = Canibus

Was this the reason why Canibus punished the lyrical genius(Rakim) on "I'll Buss Em, U Punish Em"??
That was the track that opened ma eyes in 2000 that Bis' is under-rated. I have never heard Rakim so clueless on a rap song.
He was at his lyrical best but his best punchlines got swallowed when Bis was delivering subliminal lyrics warped through intravenous apocalyptic verses to release relentless eargasms. Canibus > Rakim(lyrically). . . .Enough said.

Quit having sex with Canibus and yo' eyes would pop open

Canibus has a name and has got street credibility. His fan base stretches across USA to Canada to Kingston, Jamaica.
Because of his Jamaican roots, he is well recognised in South London by real rap heads.
U need to see his tour in the UK. . . . . .U would marvel.

USA? United States of . . . erm . . . Afghanistan? He was born in Jamaica so he's popular amongst his kinsfolk. "South London" + "Real Rap Heads" - haha, I'm having a feverish bout of laughter . . .

Letz set the record straight. . . . .2Pac had no money until his death. Nas is average.
Power?? Poor folks don't have power. One rapper who qualifies for this category is erm, 50 cent but he has no street credz.
Respect?? Come on. . . . .Go and read reviews of any Canibus album and get lectured.

In all the 3 things u listed. . . . . Canibus has 2(money is not really necessary).

2pac had no money until his death but the crumbs falling off his stack would buy off Canibus' entire past, present, and future. Nas' average wealth would swallow Canibus' like what the Red Sea did to the Egyptians.
50 Cent is one of your fave rappers so I leave him to you - finish him off the way you like
I took yo' advice and read reviews from Amazon.com - An excerpt of such Canibus' reviews is this:

"I bought 2000 B.C with relatively low expectations, after reading many average reviews on it . . . Canibus is one dimensional lyrical on this CD--it's all about showin off his battle skills. This can be very impressive, and it is impressive on here, but it does tend to get a little old after a while. There are no . . . deep, meaningful lyrics . . ."

And that's your best MC. No, not for me.

Bamsyle:

Yep. I'll leave 'em where they belong - the Imaginary World.

Put out ur best keystyles and letz anaylse it bar by bar.

Read up Rakim's biography. He's not only referred to as a rapper, he's also called "a pioneer of Rap Music". His partnership with Eric B is critically acclaimed as one of the most influential of hip-hop supergroups. And he was largely responsible for this phenomenon. He started what we now know as "internal rhyming" in Rap. He brought metaphors to the forefront.

Any Arrow can be a pioneer. He is older than Bis and he came out when Rap was about blowing up like nitro.
I know Rakim and Eric B in the days of "Casualty of War". . . .Those were songs you would see on Yo MTV raps then and u would squeeze your face.
There were better cats out there then: Wu Tang, Diamond & Psycho-neurotics, Scarface, KRS-One etc. Nuff said!!!

From Raekwon to 50 Cent, to Kurupt, Ghostface Killah, Eminem, Jay-Z, Killah Priest, RZA, The Game, R.A. Tha Rugged Man, Will Smith plus all those rappers you listed up there - they all name him as their influence. When Canibus was still non-existent, Rakim had spat ill lines that moved the world . . .

But he still got his ass whupped by Bis on that particular track. . . . .
Apart from Eminem and RZA(which i am not even sure he coulda been influenced by Rakim), the others are average.
Will Smith and The Game on that list just spoils it for you.

In terms of sensible lyrics,
Soulja Boy + Lil' Boosie = Canibus
Quit having sex with Canibus and yo' eyes would pop open

U are a fan of showmanship. . . . .It's easy to recognise that.
When Bis spat on Lost Boyz' "Beasts From The East", cats were scampering for cover. Listen to "How Come", 2nd Round K.O and feel his fury.
Soulja Boy?? Put him in 2Pac's category abeg.

USA? United States of . . . erm . . . Afghanistan? He was born in Jamaica so he's popular amongst his kinsfolk. "South London" + "Real Rap Heads" - haha, I'm having a feverish bout of laughter . . .

Please don't choke. . . . .I don't wanna come to your funeral.

2pac had no money until his death but the crumbs falling off his stack would buy off Canibus' entire past, present, and future. Nas' average wealth would swallow Canibus' like what the Red Sea did to the Egyptians.

2Pac had no money, no mutual funds, IRA and no housing estate. He owned no bonds or stocks.
He also didn't own the house in San Fernando Valley. Matter of fact, Modenine would have more money than 2Pac when he died.
Suge Knight milked him dry.

50 Cent is one of your fave rappers so I leave him to you - finish him off the way you like

I like 50 cent because he had a plan in his 2nd coming.
Get rich and go commercial and if u quantify what he has achieved btw 2003 and 2009. . . . .Nas, Jay-Z and other cats should be ashamed of emselves.

I took yo' advice and read reviews from Amazon.com - An excerpt of such Canibus' reviews is this:

Conveniently copying the comment of a critic like you.

"I bought 2000 B.C with relatively low expectations, after reading many average reviews on it . . . Canibus is one dimensional lyrical on this CD--it's all about showin off his battle skills. This can be very impressive, and it is impressive on here, but it does tend to get a little old after a while. There are no . . . deep, meaningful lyrics . . ."

And that's your best MC. No, not for me.

From a fan on Amazon:

This album is definatly the most creative album i have ever listend to lyrically and production wise EVER!!!, no joke, u have to hear it to beleive it , Canibus outdid him self this time with amazing imagery, knowledge full content , clever rhyme schemes , viscious flow , deep philosophical concepts , the list keeps going on and on , This album prooves that there is no one with the lyrical capacity of Canibus , i mean the songs just amaze the listener , also it is a positive vibe towards a degrading hiphop industry, if u are tired of listening to nelly faboulous and most other artists rapping about girls money jewlery and life in the ghetto parsay, then this album is a refreshing mix of thought provoking lyrics, true to life , and very complex.

Another one:

This is undoubtedly one of the best albums of all time. Canibus' word-play is nothing less than pure insanity. I found it refreshing to find a rapper who doesn't feel the need to simply spit about ice and bitches, but brings on something more, Something POETIC, This CD keeps you locked in from the first word to the last. I can't tell you how many times I listened to Poet Laureate when I first heard it. His metaphorical and sophisticated rhyme-style is unlike any other I've heard. His usage of "Big Words" is not boring, or repetitive, but fits perfectly with every bar, and seems to keep you entranced as to what he will intelligently spit next. All in all, this album is amazing. It should, if most people in the world of Hip-Hop haven't noticed already as such, go down as one of the top 10 of all time. Cop it. You'll like it

Need i say more?? I will eat maself if anyone says this about Nas or Jigga.

This is like asking which is more important to a car! Your brakes or your clutch? Of course they are both important as a matter of fact its a fine mix of both it depends on the mood of the listener trust me there are times when the last thing that would matter is lyrics so i would rather have a mix of both.I don't look all out for big words and the so-called scientific terms i also attach importance to street smart lyrics that actually apply to real world scenarios but good beats are what would probably attract you to the track in the first place

A-40:

I don't look all out for big words and the so-called scientific terms i also attach importance to street smart lyrics that actually apply to real world scenarios . . .

Thanks o, A-40. You're not like some weirdo in here who believes intelligence is synonymous with high-sounding and big words

~Sauron~:

Put out ur best keystyles and letz anaylse it bar by bar.

You've been disillusioned for so long. You think all those crappy lines of yours are what they call rap? Real MCs don't even put their lines on the internet alone, they roll 'em on discs for all to read, feel, and judge. Unlike you, I don't brag. I've penned hundreds of rap verses. You'd be amazed at what I spit. Don't even go there . . .

Any Arrow can be a pioneer. He is older than Bis and he came out when Rap was about blowing up like nitro.
I know Rakim and Eric B in the days of "Casualty of War". . . .Those were songs you would see on Yo MTV raps then and u would squeeze your face.
There were better cats out there then: Wu Tang, Diamond & Psycho-neurotics, Scarface, KRS-One etc. Nuff said!!!

For a lover of lyrics who doesn't know what Rakim is all about, I feel pity for you. Rakim - the astounding lyricist, the raw talent. His methodical, yet effortless delivery makes Canibus sound like a cricket. The duo of Rakim and Eric are critically acclaimed as one of the greatest hip hop groups of all time. Rakim is often considered by many fans and even critics to be the greatest MC of all time.

Their debut album, "Paid in Full" was recorded in a week. Rakim wrote the lyrics in the studio. This and all their other albums made it to the Top 10 on the R&B LP charts. Rolling Stone Magazine listed the album as #227 on its "List of the 500 Greatest Albums of All Time". MTV listed the album as the greatest in hip hop history. Hear what MTV had to say:

"When Paid in Full was released in 1987, Eric B. and Rakim left a mushroom cloud over the hip-hop community. The album was captivating, profound, innovative and instantly influential. We'd been used to MCs like Run and DMC, Chuck D and KRS-One leaping on the mic shouting with energy and irreverence, but Rakim took a methodical approach to his microphone fiending. He had a slow flow, and every line was blunt, mesmeric. And Eric B. had an ear for picking out loops and samples drenched with soul and turned out to be a trailblazer for producers in the coming years."

In his era of the 80s, Rakim's innovative wordplay and excellent delivery made him tower above MCs like Run-D.M.C., LL Cool J, and Chuck D. By the late 80s, he had greatly influenced MCs like Big Daddy Kane, Kool G. Rap, and Ice Cube. Even KRS-One who was already established before him would tell you that Rakim later influenced his themes and lyrics.

Go listen to "Follow The Leader", "Microphone Fiend", and "Lyrics of Fury" and you'll come back to lap up your vomit.

Canibus with his 34+ years of existence has nothing but a string of failures as his track record

BTW, Rakim and Eric did "Casualt[b]ies[/b] of War" - the one you referred to musta been done by Canibus

But he still got his ass whupped by Bis on that particular track. . . . .
Apart from Eminem and RZA(which i am not even sure he coulda been influenced by Rakim), the others are average.
Will Smith and The Game on that list just spoils it for you.

That track produced one of the best punchlines in Hip Hop's history: ". . . stick my d**k in your ear and f**k what you heard". It was done by Rakim. He kept his verses short, simple and stright-to-da-point. Your man Canibus was busy telling long tales of Galaxies and the Stone Age Era No quotable quote from him.

Of course you won't know RZA was influenced by Rakim - do you know anything about Hip Hop? Much as you underrate 'em, Will Smith and The Game still have credentials that would make Canibus go pink with shame The Game who just started his career yesterday is more relevant in the game than Canibus.

U are a fan of showmanship. . . . .It's easy to recognise that.
When Bis spat on Lost Boyz' "Beasts From The East", cats were scampering for cover. Listen to "How Come", 2nd Round K.O and feel his fury.
Soulja Boy?? Put him in 2Pac's category abeg.

I love skills, talent, craft. How does high-sounding vocab with a crappy delivery qualify as those?

Great lyrics he spat in "Beasts From The East". Please advise him to keep smokin' da blunt he smoked before he spat then "How Come" was just his usual ish - stories about Galaxies and aliens. 2nd K.O. was good but I've told you before that Nas' Ether eats that up bar for bar.

Canibus with his big and unnecessary words has the same effect that Soulja Boy has on listeners. Both are crap. 2pac with his signature straight-to-da-point delivery would summarize Canibus' 600-word perambulations with 2 bars

Please don't choke. . . . .I don't wanna come to your funeral.

No you won't. You'd have been cremated by then

2Pac had no money, no mutual funds, IRA and no housing estate. He owned no bonds or stocks.
He also didn't own the house in San Fernando Valley. Matter of fact, Modenine would have more money than 2Pac when he died.
Suge Knight milked him dry.

This sounds like a befitting biography for Canibus not Pac Pac was born as a ghetto kid. He had nothing at birth but made fame, a name and money for himself before he died. Forget about all those stories you read in Vibe Magazine or whatever magz you read. Listen to his songs. 2pac was never one to lie about his life. He was the original dude behind "Mo' Money, Mo' Problems". Ask Biggie when you see him

I like 50 cent because he had a plan in his 2nd coming.
Get rich and go commercial and if u quantify what he has achieved btw 2003 and 2009. . . . .Nas, Jay-Z and other cats should be ashamed of emselves.

Is 50 Cent a rapper? We're not talking 'bout the story of rapper-turned-pure water-seller here. From rapper to body-builder to water-seller, God knows what's next. Maybe comedy. If you're a smart bizman, you'll know he's heading towards bankruptcy . . .

Saying Nas, Jay-Z, and 50 Cent in the same sentence is like mentioning Nostradamus, Socrates and Mr. Bean in one breath. Don't compare wise men with fools.

Conveniently copying the comment of a critic like you.

From a fan on Amazon:

This album is definatly the most creative album i have ever listend to lyrically and production wise EVER!!!, no joke, u have to hear it to beleive it , Canibus outdid him self this time with amazing imagery, knowledge full content , clever rhyme schemes , viscious flow , deep philosophical concepts , the list keeps going on and on , This album prooves that there is no one with the lyrical capacity of Canibus , i mean the songs just amaze the listener , also it is a positive vibe towards a degrading hiphop industry, if u are tired of listening to nelly faboulous and most other artists rapping about girls money jewlery and life in the ghetto parsay, then this album is a refreshing mix of thought provoking lyrics, true to life , and very complex.

Another one:

This is undoubtedly one of the best albums of all time. Canibus' word-play is nothing less than pure insanity. I found it refreshing to find a rapper who doesn't feel the need to simply spit about ice and bitches, but brings on something more, Something POETIC, This CD keeps you locked in from the first word to the last. I can't tell you how many times I listened to Poet Laureate when I first heard it. His metaphorical and sophisticated rhyme-style is unlike any other I've heard. His usage of "Big Words" is not boring, or repetitive, but fits perfectly with every bar, and seems to keep you entranced as to what he will intelligently spit next. All in all, this album is amazing. It should, if most people in the world of Hip-Hop haven't noticed already as such, go down as one of the top 10 of all time. Cop it. You'll like it

Need i say more?? I will eat maself if anyone says this about Nas or Jigga.

The first comment tells you to listen to Canibus instead of Nelly and Faboulous and you're grinning like an elf? Phew, what a review!!!

Apart from Poet Laureate II on that album ("Rip The Jacker", the album was absolute hogwash. Hear what a writer wrote about the album: "Canibus sounds like a kid who spends his free time reading the dictionary" Canibus sampled all sorts of beats from various artistes on all the tracks of the album, including Fela's "Mr. Grammarticalogylisationalism Is the Boss" How I wish Fela could have feartured on that track - Canibus woulda heard the story of his life

Me thinks this is a no brainer really.

The reason why it's called Music is cuz it's a sound that has rythm and melody. Not all sound is music. It has to have melody and some sort of rythm.
What makes anything music is the presence of melody and rythm in a sound.

Going by that assertion, the primary ingredients of music are melody and rythm, the rest are just mere additions. Are we to say Jazz, orchestras or blues without vocals aren't "Good Music" ??

Just ask yourself why the great speeches and sayings of this world are not classified as music.

If you have to make sense in your music, by all means do but make no mistake about it, Music doesn't care one way or the other.

U got sound with Rythm and Melody, U got music. U've got sound with Very good Rythm and Melody, U've got Very Good music. U've got sound with Very good Music and Melody with the addition of very good Vocals/Lyrics, u've got Great Music.

Bamsyle:

You've been disillusioned for so long. You think all those crappy lines of yours are what they call rap? Real MCs don't even put their lines on the internet alone, they roll 'em on discs for all to read, feel, and judge. Unlike you, I don't brag. I've penned hundreds of rap verses. You'd be amazed at what I spit. Don't even go there . . .

U are hidebound by your myopia.
How many times do i have to tell a herb like you that penning rhymes for me was just a leisure thang in ma Uni days.
It ain't ma profession so why bust a gut to put lyrics on vinyl??  Hundreds of rap verses?? Show us one and stop bragging!!!

For a lover of lyrics who doesn't know what Rakim is all about, I feel pity for you. Rakim - the astounding lyricist, the raw talent. His methodical, yet effortless delivery makes Canibus sound like a cricket. The duo of Rakim and Eric are critically acclaimed as one of the greatest hip hop groups of all time. Rakim is often considered by many fans and even critics to be the greatest MC of all time.

Then u must be talking about blinkered fans like yourself.
The fact that Rakim was a rap pioneer doesn't necessarily make him the greatest MC of all time. They all came out when the industry was just starting to grow. What was the level of competition in 1992 compared to now??
Cheese n Rice. . . .some fans also think Public Enemy n NWA were the best since sliced bread but how would they fare if they had joined the rap industry in say, 1996?? Food for thunk, negro!!!

Their debut album, "Paid in Full" was recorded in a week. Rakim wrote the lyrics in the studio. This and all their other albums made it to the Top 10 on the R&B LP charts. Rolling Stone Magazine listed the album as #227 on its "List of the 500 Greatest Albums of All Time". MTV listed the album as the greatest in hip hop history. Hear what MTV had to say:

It was a debut album. . . . .Most of the lyrics were pre-written. All they had to do was take it to the studio and add the beats n mixes.
What is so outta-this-world in that?? 2Pac recorded "7 Day Theory" in about 7 days so whats the dealie??
Are u a hip-hop illiterate??

"When Paid in Full was released in 1987, Eric B. and Rakim left a mushroom cloud over the hip-hop community. The album was captivating, profound, innovative and instantly influential. We'd been used to MCs like Run and DMC, Chuck D and KRS-One leaping on the mic shouting with energy and irreverence, but Rakim took a methodical approach to his microphone fiending. He had a slow flow, and every line was blunt, mesmeric. And Eric B. had an ear for picking out loops and samples drenched with soul and turned out to be a trailblazer for producers in the coming years."

In those days, the competition was weak. Any idiot could grab the mic and spit whatever and still get street credibility.
Rap music was begging for a face then so any piece of music from anyone was great as far as black people were concerned.

In his era of the 80s, Rakim's innovative wordplay and excellent delivery made him tower above MCs like Run-D.M.C., LL Cool J, and Chuck D. By the late 80s, he had greatly influenced MCs like Big Daddy Kane, Kool G. Rap, and Ice Cube. Even KRS-One who was already established before him would tell you that Rakim later influenced his themes and lyrics.

All the cats you have mentioned here are just average rappers. It's like saying Junior-n-Pretty were better lyricists than Mode9 because they influenced Eedris Abdulkareem and Rasquie. It doesn't make any sense to me. What you should ask yourself is how would they have fared in the mid-90s when Rap music blew up like nitro?? How many of these so called rap pioneers can stand toe to toe with Lauryn Hill in a battle??

Go listen to "Follow The Leader", "Microphone Fiend", and "Lyrics of Fury" and you'll come back to lap up your vomit.
Canibus with his 34+ years of existence has nothing but a string of failures as his track record

Those were average works. . . . .They get mentioned because they were the music that gave rap music a FACE!!!

BTW, Rakim and Eric did "Casualt[b]ies[/b] of War" - the one you referred to musta been done by Canibus

Keep clutching at straws. . . . . .Rakim n Eric B were just buncha noisemakers in em days who gave the West Coast a life line because of the political rubbish they keep spewing. While they were clueless with their rap songs, Dr. Dre stole the initiative from them(East Coast) and the West grew rapidly.
Thanx to Biggie for restoring the pride back while the likes of Rakim faded into oblivion.

That track produced one of the best punchlines in Hip Hop's history: ". . . stick my d**k in your ear and f**k what you heard". It was done by Rakim. He kept his verses short, simple and stright-to-da-point. Your man Canibus was busy telling long tales of Galaxies and the Stone Age Era No quotable quote from him.

U are really pushing your ignorance to the hilt. . .

The king of punchline is Canibus. Not even your Pac or Rakim can match Canibus when it comes to retching ill punchlines.
On the same track, Bis' spat. . . . . . .

I hear you talkin' but i ignore it/you garbage and your rhymes borin'/
So keep standin' on the corner/the trash-man will collect you in the mornin/'

The sickest punchline ever recorded was also from Bis'. . . .

One of a kind, I got divine chromosomes in me
My sperm'll scramble the eggs in a woman's ovary

Of course you won't know RZA was influenced by Rakim - do you know anything about Hip Hop? Much as you underrate 'em, Will Smith and The Game still have credentials that would make Canibus go pink with shame The Game who just started his career yesterday is more relevant in the game than Canibus.

Classic prattle. Comparing Canibus to Will Smith & The Game just says it all about you.
You are clueless than i originally gave u credits for. Mind u, i didn't give u much in the first place.

I love skills, talent, craft. How does high-sounding vocab with a crappy delivery qualify as those?
Great lyrics he spat in "Beasts From The East". Please advise him to keep smokin' da blunt he smoked before he spat then "How Come" was just his usual ish - stories about Galaxies and aliens. 2nd K.O. was good but I've told you before that Nas' Ether eats that up bar for bar.

Nas' "whiskers like a rat" and "fat lips"?? Those are personal disses synonymous to 15 year olds on  MTV's "Yo Momma".
You have no idea what a battle track should be?? Go and listen to Bis' "Die Slow", "100 bars" and sniff spicy battle lyrics.
How can Ether eat Canibus' 2nd round K.O.?? Ibime should help you out now. You are deteriorating at a break-neck speed.

Canibus with his big and unnecessary words has the same effect that Soulja Boy has on listeners. Both are crap. 2pac with his signature straight-to-da-point delivery would summarize Canibus' 600-word perambulations with 2 bars

2Pac is a noise-maker. He is not a battle rapper.
Even a kid of 5 knows that and Bamsyle at 40 doesn't know?? Pathetic!!!

No you won't. You'd have been cremated by then

Lame!!!

This sounds like a befitting biography for Canibus not Pac Pac was born as a ghetto kid. He had nothing at birth but made fame, a name and money for himself before he died. Forget about all those stories you read in Vibe Magazine or whatever magz you read. Listen to his songs. 2pac was never one to lie about his life. He was the original dude behind "Mo' Money, Mo' Problems". Ask Biggie when you see him

Another heap of trumpery. . . . .2Pac is your idol and you don't even know a germ of information about him.
2Pac died poor. Go to the net and check what he had when he died. . . . .He had nuthing. The truck was even registered under Death Row.
Talking about 2Pac had nothing at birth. . . . .How many of these rappers were born with a golden spoon in their mouthz??
How does this help build a strong case for Pac or how is this relevant to the debate?? Clueless Bamsyle.

Is 50 Cent a rapper? We're not talking 'bout the story of rapper-turned-pure water-seller here. From rapper to body-builder to water-seller, God knows what's next. Maybe comedy. If you're a smart bizman, you'll know he's heading towards bankruptcy . . .

Bankruptcy?? How low can you sink now??
A man that made $400 million to be paid in instalments of $100 million per year will go bankrupt??
Give up Bamsyle. . . . .You are starting to sound like a scratched Rakim CD.

Saying Nas, Jay-Z, and 50 Cent in the same sentence is like mentioning Nostradamus, Socrates and Mr. Bean in one breath. Don't compare wise men with fools.

Another weak defense. . . . . .Commercial-wise, 50 cent is a global brand.
His wealth would sink Nas(who had to put his tails between his legs and went back to Jigga). He lost his street credz since then.

The first comment tells you to listen to Canibus instead of Nelly and Faboulous and you're grinning like an elf? Phew, what a review!!!

U lack comprehensive skills. . . . .
What the reviewer meant was. . . .If u are the type that listens to lyrics synonymous to a kid in the 4th grade, then look away from Canibus.
He only used Nelly n Faboulous as examples of rappers like Jay-Z, Nas and other grammatically challenged herbs in the industry.

Apart from Poet Laureate II on that album ("Rip The Jacker", the album was absolute hogwash. Hear what a writer wrote about the album: "Canibus sounds like a kid who spends his free time reading the dictionary" Canibus sampled all sorts of beats from various artistes on all the tracks of the album, including Fela's "Mr. Grammarticalogylisationalism Is the Boss" How I wish Fela could have feartured on that track - Canibus woulda heard the story of his life

And Bamsyle completes his show of ignorance. . . . . . .

Obviously, u haven't been paying attention and yet you claim you know everything about Canibus. . . .You are a pseud.
Canibus wrote those lyrics before the beats. He was about joining the Army when he finished penning the lyrics of the album.
He send the lyrics to Stoupe(The Enemy Of Mankind) to complete in what even Bis' die-hard critics claim was an instant classic.
"Rip The Jacker" was widely accepted and many hip hop heads compared it to Illmatic. 11 brilliant tracks with no skits and no guest appearances!!
Pure artistry from the blueprints of Shakespeare and Da Vinci.

Who doesn't sample beats for songs on Hip-Hop albums?? Are you this blinkered??
Bis was in the army when Stoupe was mixing the sound so he couldn't have been responsible for that part of the production.
U have really shown your ignorance in leaps and bounds and this debate has lost it's taste.
Letz go back to lyrics versus rhythm debate before you humiliate yourself more.

Hehehehe. . . . what is going on here?

Lemme just say this: Nas' ether diss to Jay Z is only a classic diss in the eyes of the unseasoned observer. I personally thought Ether was trash. Just a bunch of stupid lines that had no base in reality. Jay Z's diss to Nas on Blueprint 2 was far superior. The perception that Nas won that battle only came about because people WANTED Nas to win. It was like a fight between commercial HipHop and Underground HipHop and at that moment, people were fed-up with Jay Z because he was all over our TV screens. If you compare Ether to Blueprint 2, Blueprint 2 easily bodies Ether.

As for Canibus, lyrically he is up there as the best in the biz, but as an emcee he falls short because sonically, his music is a dissapointment.