davidylan:

I read through your write-up thoroughly Bindex, that was why i came to my own conclusion. I stand by my point - if you thought the heart-felt faith experience was a farce it was simply because you never truly experienced it. You simply played the typical nigerian christian game of make-believe. I see many "christians" today quote the bible endlessly, are pretty quick to come up with "name it and claim it" quotes, pray endlessly (always for material blessings) but deep down they do not have a deep connection with the Father.

the Christian walk is not about you, it is all about Christ. It is not about your feelings, it is about His command and His will. I am not perfect, there have been times i was tempted to take a step back and live like every other normal atheist but having tasted what it truly means to love God selflessly, to be able to talk to Him and listen to Him talk back, to be able to take silly problems to Him to solve and be amazed when He responds . . . i dont need to be told this isnt make-believe.

It may be a farce to you . . . you are surely entitled to your opinion

mazaje:


it is a farce and a delusion that keeps goons like you in check. . . . .

toneyb:

"You can't convince a believer of anything; for their belief is not based on evidence, it's based on a deep-seated need to believe."

--Carl Sagan

mazaje:

how do you know this? the other time you once labelled wirinet's relatives as "not truly saved" without ever knowing any one of them, now you are falsely asserting that my man bindex was never really a christian. What connection do you have with the father that other christians do not? davidylan is the only guy that knows christianity and is connected with the father eh? deluded goon

m_nwankwo:

@Poster

To believe or not believe in God is a decision that only you can make. Advices and opinions of others may be well meant but they will not solve your seeming problem. The search for God is personal and my view is that you should only believe what you have personally experienced. What others tell you may be true but unless you have personally experienced it, it will not help you. Doubt is very essential for both material and spiritual development. Thus you should not dismiss or ignore your doubt but wrestle with them, confront them until you gain clarity and inner peace. To ignore or dismiss ones doubt especially in spiritual matters will only lead to blind faith. You should not believe in God because you want to, rather you should because you have personally experienced God both in what is physically visible and invinsible. No true belief in God can arise without personal experience of God and his will.
Thus if one honestly has not personally experienced the existence of God, then it is correct not to believe until you have the personal evidence. I wish you strenghth in your search. Stay blessed.

duduspace:

Interesting m_nwankwo, would you oblige to tell us in practical terms how your personal experience of God and his will was?

And I do respect your opinion given in the second part.

duduspace:


I was a muslim for the 1st 14 years of my life and later converted to Christianity after my dad died. I was a Christian for over a decade. I lost my faith in the bible and the god it was talking about when reality hit me real hard. It was a TRAGIC experience but I think looking back its kind of good that it happened, I know understand life and people better than before when i was living like a blind man groping in darkness for what is not there. I understand what it means to lose your faith, I was once in the posters shoes, I creid for weeks but as things became clearer to me I was happy that I no longer held those beliefs. I know how Painful it is that is why I encouraged the poster to hold unto his beliefs if it will make him happier.

ifele:

you dont need religion yu neeed god.

bawomolo:

mad_max : are you willing to try other religions?

Davidylan:


Re: I Think I'm Losing My Faith In God
« #5 on: May 20, 2009, 08:20 PM »

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blackspade . . . let me be 100% honest with you. You're in the same boat i was in for a time. There have been times i have wondered if God truly exists or if he cares . . . i have had occasions where i was just too depressed to do anything but lie down and cry silently.

But each time i felt so down, a certain peace i cant understand floods my soul . . . in those moments when i prayed, i felt someone was listening . . that someone cared as long as i was willing to seek for His help.

Your situation is normal, we are still in a flesh that would rather sin than obey the Lord. We live in a society where everyone else who isnt christian seems to be happier and live more fulfilled lives than those of us who carry the bible around. But we also live in a society where God still loves His own no matter how small they may be.

Brother, this is the time to read the bible more . . . this is the time to get involved in bible-believing church, this is a time to surround urself with friends who are interested in the things of God too. We cant go this journey alone . . . that is why Prov 27:17 says - Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend.

God's grace is sufficient for you. Stay firm.

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Mad_Max:

You must have been devastated. "Things became clearer to you"? How? You don't have to answer that, of course. Did you leave Christianity for the same reasons you left Islam? Why did you convert to Christianity in the first place? What did you want,while you practiced it, from that religion? What did you want it to do for you? Obviously, it failed you in this regard.

I know you know religion has two kinds of adherents: those who chose it because it reflected their true spiritual identity, because it spoke deeply to something hidden in them. And those who had religion thrust upon them; it was the family religion and they believed what everyone else believed. Most of us fall into the last category,and many are accepting of this and continue to be blind,indoctrinated mice to the end of their lives. At some point we should question what has been thrust upon us,reject it, and then seek our true spiritual identity and the religious philosophy within which it flourishes. It might turn out to be the religion of our parents after all, but this time we would know what we believe; it would be our choice. It might be another religion entirely. If one religion has failed you,does it mean ALL religion has failed?NO. If a segment of a religion has failed,has that religion failed?NO.

I was born Catholic and practiced that impressively solemn,futile horror of empty religious ritual until I couldn't stand it anymore and hated religion. It was easy to conclude that was the Christian experience, and abandon that religion. I did. But after a while I started searching again. Did Catholism fail me, that beautiful,utterly lifeless,ritualistic,pseudo-religious monster?YES!!! It has failed many and turned them from God,like it did me. It's very good at that.Did that mean Christ, and by extension Christianity has failed? Absolutely not. Religious institutions are human institutions, and sometimes when men fail we think it is God that's failed. Er, NO.

And yet Catholism has many indoctrinated devotees: I can't comment on the genuineness of their religious experience because I don't know it, I only know mine,which was empty,zero,nothingness. I do know that God is merciful and ignores many of the artificial human constructs,like 'denomination'', that separate us. In spite of the fact that I had different experiences with different segments of Christianity, Christianity is one. The divisions of which much is made, are mostly unimportant differences in biblical interpretation. In the essentials,all of Christianity is in agreement: Christ is the way, the truth and the life. All else is plain silliness.

And yet,and yet:dead emptiness while practicing Catholism,which is within Christianity, the emptiness going away when I departed from it. And aliveness and wholeness now, and within the same Christianity I was so eager to give up after being let down by a segment of it.

Perhaps something similar happened when you were a Christian.

ifele:

you dont need religion yu neeed god.

akered:

I have an interesting article I wrote about my journey to being an agnostic. It might help you along your journey. I tell you, it can be quite rough. but once you are rid of all the shackles of religion, life becomes so easy to live. I wish you well. One advice, always be honest with yourself.


MY IMAGINARY CITY
By Akered

Once upon a time, a long time ago, my world view was deeply religious. I was devoted to my religion and holy book. I felt well protected with the armour of God. My world appeared to be a city, meticulously constructed with beautiful engravings and huge halls. The walls were deep and strong, to keep us all safe from the corruption and sin of the outside world, and they were guarded by God to prevent Satan intruding. All in all, a very comfortable and safe place to live.

One day I wanted to just look up close at one of the engravings on a wall. It didn’t quite look right, and I just wanted to check that it wasn’t my eyesight. When I reached out to touch the engraving, to my horror my hand went right through. There was nothing but dust left of that engraving. I went to my preacher, as he would have to know about this. I showed him the hole, guiltily expecting him to berate me for it. Instead he acted as if he couldn’t see it. He commented upon how beautiful the engraving was, how neatly it fit in with the rest of the decorations, and how his father, and his father’s father had also admired this engraving.

As you can imagine this caught me a bit off guard, but I accepted that maybe it was me who was wrong. After all, he was expected to be much more intelligent that I was in matters like this, not to mention wiser. In a spirit of interest however, I went and had a look at some of the other sections of the city.
To my amazement I could knock down whole walls and rooms with hardly any effort. After a while I was pulling down the buildings just for the pleasure of being able to. Whenever I pulled down a structure I could see that people were still walking around in it as if nothing had happened. This confused me and scared me.

After a while I knocked down the outer wall, the one that protected me from all of the evil in the world. What I saw was a collection of similar cities and small towns. I went and had a look at a few of them, but I didn’t seem to be able to inhabit them, because again I could easily knock holes in the buildings, and find myself unwelcome.

Eventually from my standpoint all that I was left with was a huge flat plain. There was nothing left that could stand up to even the most simple investigation. Nothing was certain, everything crumbled. I could still see my family walking in the air as if their city was still there, but I could not talk to them because they were so far away.

The flat plain was definitely the most intimidating time for me. I could not talk to anybody. I had no shelter, no rules, no group. I spent many hours shouting for people to hear me in their imaginary cities, but to no avail. Perhaps this is what hell is like? No certainty, no authority, no faith, no deity. I tried everything.

Eventually I worked out that the only option available to me if I wanted somewhere to live was to build it myself. I started out with some building blocks that I knew couldn’t be knocked down. “Treat people the way you like to be treated”, “Learn before believing”, “Understand before judging”,
”Be honest with yourself”. These are plain and simple bricks, not the fancy marble
sculpturing that my old home had, but at least they are verifiably solid. They withstand the most rigorous scrutiny. The house is simple and I started to enjoy every day I spent in it.

My neighbours now look at me with a mixture of envy, fear and curiosity because I didn’t build my new house with any of the ‘usual materials’ that is commonplace in all the cities I visited. How could this house stand? Hmmm! How could it protect against all the dangers lurking in every corner, the principalities and powers, and rulers of darkness? No engravings or sculptures, just simple solid bricks, but they suffice for my home. I included a garden for contemplation, and I considered myself lucky to have such a large plain to build on. Now my house is how I want it, shape, size and décor. I few neighbours have come over to see how they could build a house like this. Some have started building, others are consumed with fear. I wish them well, in their journey to the real world.

Stogwu123: who is mention islam dat is founded by a sex machine/expert and sex abuser...Bukhari (62:6)
"The prophet used to go round
(have sexual relations with) all
his wives in one night, and he
had nine wives."Bukhari (5:268) "The prophet used to
visit all his wives in a round,
during the day and night and
they were
eleven in number." I asked
Anas, 'had the prophet the strength for it?' Anas replied,
'we used to say that the
prophet was given the
strength of thirty men. Here below ar futher proof dat islam is a false religion.....Differences Between Muhammad and Jesus Muhammad... Jesus... Said Allah hates those who don't accept Islam. (Qur'an 30:4, 3:32, 22:38) Said God loves everyone. (John 3:16) "I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah" (Muslim 1:33) "He who lives by the sword will die by the sword." (Matthew 26:52) Stoned women for adultery. (Muslim 4206) "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." (John 8:7) Permitted stealing from unbelievers. (Bukhari 44:668, Ibn Ishaq 764) "Thou shalt not steal." (Matthew 19:18) Permitted lying. (Sahih Muslim 6303, Bukhari 49:857) "Thou shalt not bear false witness." (Matthew 19:18) Owned and traded slaves. (Sahih Muslim 3901) Neither owned nor traded slaves. Beheaded 800 Jewish men and boys. (Sahih Muslim 4390) Beheaded no one. Murdered those who insulted him. (Bukhari 56:369, 4:241) Preached forgiveness. (Matthew 18:21-22, 5:38) "If then anyone transgresses the prohibition against you, Transgress ye likewise against him" (Qur'an 2:194) "If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also." (Matthew 5:39) Jihad in the way of Allah elevates one's position in Paradise by a hundred fold. (Muslim 4645) "Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called Sons of God" (Matthew 5:9) Married 13 wives and kept sex slaves. (Bukhari 5:268, Qur'an 33:50) Was celibate. Slept with a 9-year-old child. (Sahih Muslim 3309, Bukhari 58:236) Did not have sex with children. Ordered the murder of women. (Ibn Ishaq 819, 995) Never harmed a woman. "O you who believe! Fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness." (Qur'an 9:123) "Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth." (Matthew 5:5) Ordered 65 military campaigns and raids in his last 10 years. (Ibn Ishaq ) Ordered no military campaigns, nor offered any approval of war or violence. Killed captives taken in battle. (Ibn Ishaq 451) Never took captives. Never killed anyone. Encouraged his men to rape enslaved women. (Abu Dawood 2150, Qur'an 4:24) Never encouraged rape. Never enslaved women. Demanded captured slaves and a fifth of all other loot taken in war. (Qur'an 8:41) "The Son of Man came not to be served, but to serve." (Matthew 20:28) Was never tortured, but tortured others. (Muslim 4131, Ibn Ishaq 436, 595, 734, 764) Suffered torture, but never tortured anyone. "And fight them until there is no more persecution and religion is only for Allah" (Qur'an 8:39) "Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you" (Matthew 5:44) Blessed the brutal murder of a half-blind man (al-Tabari 1440) Healed a blind man (Mark 8:28) Ordered a slave to build the very pulpit from which he preached Islam. (Bukhari 47:743) Washed his disciples feet. (John 13:5) What are the Greatest Commandments? "Belief in Allah and Jihad in His cause" (Muslim 1:149) What are the Greatest Commandments? "Love God and love thy neighbor as thyself." (Matthew 22:34-40) Demanded the protection of armed bodyguards, even in a house of worship (Qur'an 4:102) Chastised anyone attempting to defend him with force. (John 18:10-12) Died fat and wealthy from what was taken from others in war or demanded from others in tribute. Demanded nothing for himself. Died without possessions. Advocated crucifying others. (Qur'an 5:33, Muslim 16:4131) Was crucified himself. According to his followers: Had others give their lives for him. (Sahih Muslim 4413) According to his followers: Gave his life for others. (John 18:11 and elsewhere) Differences Between Early Muslims and Early Christians Muhammad's Companions... Jesus' Disciples... Lived as warriors. Lived like harmless hippies. Slew and persecuted religious minorities. Were slain and persecuted as a religious minority. Emphasis on Jihad (the way of Muhammad) "He who fights that Allah's word should be superior fights in Allah's cause" (Bukhari 53:355) Emphasis on Evangelism (the way of Jesus) "Go ye into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature" (Matthew 15:16) Attacked and conquered the populations in parts of 28 modern countries in just the first three decades following Muhammad's death. Did not resort to violence of any sort, despite tremendous persecution. Declared holy war on the people of five major world religions in just the first 100 years following Muhammad's death. Went centuries without declaring 'holy war'. Plundered and lived off the wealth of others. Gave away their possessions to those in need. (Acts 2:44-45) Captured and enslaved non- Muslim people. Considered themselves to be slaves of others. Waged war to keep members from leaving the religion. Put apostates to death. No record of aggression toward apostates. Muhammad's own family members quickly fell into armed warfare against each other. Jesus' disciples never resorted to violence against one another (or anyone else). First 240 Years: 11 of the first 32 caliphs were murdered by fellow Muslims. First 240 Years: 14 of the first 25 popes were martyred by pagans (none by fellow Christians). Caliphs were polygamous and maintained harems of hundreds of captured sex slaves. Popes were expected to be celibate. Islamic mosques sustained by taxes forced from subjugated non-Muslims (the jizya). Christian churches sustained by voluntary tithes from Christians. Differences Between Islamic Teaching and Christianity The Qur'an The Bible External sources (the Hadith and Sira) necessary for translating the Qur'an Historical context contained within the text of the Bible Must know Arabic in order to "fully understand" the Qur'an (according to Muslim apologists) Universal. Can be translated into other languages without excessive commentary. Chronological progression of the Quran is from peace to violence. Chronological progression of the Bible is from violence to peace. The words 'torture' and 'punishment' appear six times more often than in the New Testament. The word 'love' appears five times more often in the New Testament than in the Qur'an, Contains not a single original moral value. The 'Sermon on the Mount' and others. Suffering is an excuse for violent revenge and establishment of Islam by force "And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution [of Muslims] is worse than slaughter [of non- believers]...and fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah." (Qur'an 2:191) Suffering builds character "We also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope" (Romans 5:4) Emphasis on this World "And Allah has made you heirs to their land and their dwellings and their property" (Qur'an 33:27) Emphasis on the Next "Mine is not a kingdom of this world" (John 18:36, see also Luke 14:33) Kill, convert or subjugate Christians and Jews. (Qur'an 9:29) Share one's faith with gentleness and respect. (1 Peter 3:15) Martyrs as Killers "Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain" (Qur'an 9:111) Martyrs as Martyrs "As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are counted as sheep for the slaughter" (Romans 8:36) Killing Apostates "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them" (Qur'an 4:89, also Bukhari 52:260, 83:37...) Letting God Judge Apostates "For we know Him that has said, 'Vengeance belongs unto me, I will recompense,' says the Lord. And again, 'The Lord shall judge his people'" (Hebrews 10:25-30) Punishment "Let not compassion move you from carrying out God's law..." (Qur'an 24:2) Mercy "Love is patient. Love is kind... It keeps no record of wrongs" (1 Corinthians 13:4-5) Charity and Non-Believers Mercy toward fellow Muslims - ruthlessness toward unbelievers. Muslims are warned not to befriend those outside the faith. They must even ensure that their charity tithe (zakat) does not go toward the needy of other religions. (Qur'an 48:29, 3:28, Sharia) Charity and Non-Believers Christians are specifically told that even those who hate them are entitled to kindness and charity. They should be loved and cared for as surely as any fellow believer. (Mark 10:25-37) The Qur'an does not command husbands to love their wives, but it does give men permission to beat disobedient women. (Qur'an 4:34, Sahih Muslim 2127) "Husbands, love your wives and do not be harsh with them." (No permission to beat women) (Colossians 3:19) Explicitly allows Muslim men to rape their female slaves, even those already married. (Qur'an 4:24, 70:29-30, 23:5-6...) Tells masters and slaves to serve each other as if serving God. (Ephesians 6:7-9) Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those who are with him are ruthless to the unbelievers" (Qur'an 48:29) "Do good to them that hate you" (Luke 6:27) Allah wills those that stray and are lost (Qur'an 16:93) God wants all people saved (1 Timothy 2:4) Warns Against Questioning Faith. (Qur'an 5:101-102) Welcomes Intellectual Challenge. (1 Peter 3:15) Violence as Virtue "Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not." (Qur'an 2:216) Violence as Sin "Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: 'It is mine to avenge; I will repay,' says the Lord. On the contrary: 'If your enemy is hungry, feed him... '" (Romans 12:19-20) Hell for unbelief. Good deeds count for naught (Qur'an 18:102-107) Hell for bad deeds and the failure to do what is right (Romans 2:6-8, Matthew 16:27, Matthew 25:41-45) Judging "Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with them..." (Qur'an 9:73) Judge Not "For when you pass judgment on another person, you condemn yourself..." (Romans 2:1) Taking wealth from others "Allah promiseth you much booty that ye will capture..." (Qur'an 48:20) Working for and giving wealth to others "The thief must no longer steal but must work hard and do what is good with his own hands, so that he might have something to give to the needy." (Ephesians 4:28) Calls down Allah's curse on Christians and those of other religions. (Qur'an 9:30) Calls down God's blessing on those who curse Christians. (Matthew 5:44) Arrogance & Privilege "Ye are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind" (Qur'an 3:110) Humility & Servitude "If anyone wants to be first, he must make himself last of all and servant of all." (Mark 9:35) "O you who believe! do not take My enemy and your enemy for friends: Would you offer them love while they deny what has come to you of the truth? (Qur'an 60:1) "Love your enemies..." (Luke 6:27)

blackspade: My whole family believes in god and I do too, but recently (as in the last few months) I've been questioning myself with things such as: does god exist? what if religion is just one of the worlds longest running fairytales? why are there so many contradictions in the bible? am I wasting my time worshipping something I can't see? is christianity just a mechanism used by europeans to spread their idealogy and culture?

I want to believe in god, and recognize some of the things in life that we can't explain, and can only be explained by god, but sometimes I just don't know. I've been feeling a little depressed lately, so maybe that has something to do with it, I don't know. What the hell is wrong with me? Am I just going through a phase?

SeanT21: @black

"Then Jesus said to Thomas, "Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe."

Thomas said to Him, "My Lord and my God!"

Then Jesus told him, "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed." John 20.27-29"

Jesus never rebuked anyone for doubting,only for refusing to consider the evidence" Doubting is not a sin. Deep Down I don't blame U for doubting.After all you did not see God walk on the water and you did not see him raise the dead,etc.

Read and Study THE BIBLE is the only answer to your problem!!

Ask God to sustain your faith

kambo:

dont misinterprete scriptures. Doubting is unbelief and it angers God. Never ever quip this nonsense again.
The children of isreal cudnt enter d promise land because of their "unbelief". The Bible calls unbelief "evil".
Jesus wasnt physically present wen Thomas doubted but on appearg he Rebuked thomas for doubtg the testimony of his resurrection Without any physical evidence. Wats dat drivel about "refusg to doubt the evidence"?