Alade Tunde:
when did Awujale and Ijebu told you that,when did you visit then and they told you they are not yoruba,pls don't say dis in Ijebuland orelse your eye will pay for it mumu ode oshi,pls say something else ok?follow the topic and answer it not saying what you don't konw

Itsekiris are Ijebu descendants, says Awujale, calls for Ijebu state

By Ernest Nwokolo
Published 2/05/2010
ijebus are not yoruba

The Awujale of Ijebuland, Oba Sikiru Kayode Adetona, has declared that the Itsekiri people currently in Delta State are descendants of the Ijebu stock and not part of the greater Yoruba nation.

The monarch said the Itsekiri people in Delta State are true Ijebu sons and daughters stressing that the Itsekiris in the Niger Delta still retain core Ijebu dialect in their language. He said migration for expansion and survival accounted for why they are currently in the Niger Delta area.

The monarch who spoke to journalists as part of preparation for his 50th year anniversary celebration in June this year, also expressed disgust over the nation’s economy being controlled by the federal government, saying it does not augur well for rapid development of the country adding that it undermines self-actualization.

Awujale noted that the only time monarchs in Yorubaland ever came together to see each other was in 1937 when the colonial masters then worked to forge peaceful relationship ‘among us as a way of reducing the inter-tribal wars and its attendants effects."

" We are never one. We are different people and that is the truth. If I speak my Ijebu language, neither somebody from Ekiti, Ondo nor Ibadan will understand and if any person from any of those places speak his, I won’t understand," Oba Adetona said.

Adetona who is often referred to as Orisa Ijebu by his subjects, said it is the uniqueness of the Ijebu people that is behind the agitation for an Ijebu State to be excised from the present Ogun State. He expressed confidence that the dream would be a reality in his lifetime. However, in a statement by the Egbe Irapada Oodua, EIRO on Saturday, the group said the ancestry of the Yoruba people as descendants of Oduduwa has been settled by "intellectuals of international standing both at home and abroad after intensive research which began around 1050 AD."

The group in a statement by Dr Akinlola Sowumi, leader of the group in Ogun State, noted that the Ijebus deserve to have a state but that the agitation could be waged without resort to the distortion of timeless historical evidence about the history of the Yoruba people.
After this, you will now know that you are a fool and feel sorry for yourself.

Alade Tunde:
shut up,who told u dat rubbish, and wot do you know about we yorubas

Lil boy, no point displaying stupidity here, if you are intelligent, just shut up your smelly mouth and write a rebbuttal to my post.

Chyz*:


Wrong Negro,

Edo is a group of related tribes, not a langauge. Bini do not speak the same language as etsako or urhobo but they are all edo. There are yorubas who are edo, exotik is one of them. Aniomas are considered edo by some but we speak Igbo. Dont come here and start spewing falsity.

urhobos are NOT Edos

Negro_Ntns: Wrong Andre.

Edo do not need to spend time in Yorubaland to speak the language, they already are speaking it as a dialect.

Yoruba - Oba a pe l'aye

Edo - Oba a to k'paye.

Meaning: may the King live long!

Wrong. The Binis say, 'Oba gha tor kpere' meaning 'The Oba will live long'.

stpat1:

urhobos are NOT Edos

Pls could u explain this.

Thanx

macof:

Pls could u explain this.

Thanx

As a people group they are not edos but their language is classified as edoid, urhobo are classified as benue while edo is Guinean.

The name "Yoruba" was/is specifically in reference to Oyo

back in the days, Ile-Oodua as it was called consisted of many independent nations most of whom migrated from.Ile-Ife, others migrated from outside..maybe even beyond Nigerian territories to mix with the people and create new cultural consciousness

Ekiti is only referred to as Yoruba today because most Ekiti Kete speak Oyo language coupled with the fact that most of Ekiti were Oyo colonies before the Kiriji war.

Ekiti language is not Yoruba (but simply Ekiti), neither is Ondo, Owo, Bini, Ijebu, Ife etc.
They all have their languages with heavy similarities that's why when the Europeans came, seeing the same religion, similar culture and tradition made them proclaim this people as "one tribe" but with the exception of Bini and it's closest Towns because, the Bini were very much independent and strong on their own unlike Owo, Ijesha, Ijebu who were holding on each other.

The Oodua people are not "one tribe" we are different tribes and formerly different nations.

The Owo language is very similar to Bini language than even Oyo

Ijebu is most similar to isekiri

Awori is similar to Oyo

Typical Ekiti accent sounds more like Bini accent than Oyo accent.

The word "Yoruba" is just to merge us together and give us one name.
but in the real sense of the word only Oyo is Yoruba.

Edo(bini) is a distant tribe under the umbrella.
Isan and others are to Edo as Ogbomoso/barapa is to Oyo.

Ekiti, Edo, Oyo, Ijesha, Isekiri etc. are all Tribes of the same ethnic group

macof:

The Owo language is very similar to Bini language than any other tribe.

Owo dialect is very different from Bini's.
There is a similarity of tongue among Owo,Ondo,Ilaje,Ikale and Itsekiri dialects.

Banuso99:
Owo dialect is very different from Bini's.
There is a similarity of tongue among Owo,Ondo,Ilaje,Ikale and Itsekiri dialects.

Are u sure?

I have never heard Owo language but when it comes to culture, they have bini all over

macof: The name "Yoruba" was/is specifically in reference to Oyo

back in the days, Ile-Oodua as it was called consisted of many independent nations most of whom migrated from.Ile-Ife, others migrated from outside Nigerian territories to mix with the people and create new habitats.

Ekiti is only referred to as Yoruba today because most Ekiti Kete speak Oyo language coupled with the fact that Ekiti was an Oyo colony before the Kiriji war.

Ekiti language is not Yoruba, neither is Ondo, Owo, Bini, Ijebu, Ife etc.
They all have their languages with heavy similarities that's why when the Europeans came, seeing the same religion, similar culture and tradition made them proclaim this people as "one tribe" but with the exception of Bini and it's closest Towns because, the Bini were very much independent and strong on their own unlike Owo, Ijesha, Ijebu who were holding on each other.

The Oodua people are not "one tribe" we are different tribes and formerly different nations.

The Owo language is very similar to Bini language than any other tribe.

Ijebu is most similar with isekiri

Awori is similar with Oyo

Typical Ekiti accent is even closer to Bini accent than Oyo accent.

The word "Yoruba" is just to merge us together and give us one name.
but in the real sense of the word only Oyo is Yoruba.

Edo is a distant tribe under the umbrella.
Isan and others are to Edo as Ogbomoso is to Oyo.

Ekiti, Edo, Oyo, Ijesha, Isekiri etc. are all Tribes of the same ethnic group

Edo is separate and has never and will never be of the same ethnic group with Ekiti, Oyo, Ijesha etc.

macof:

Edo is a distant tribe under the umbrella.
Isan and others are to Edo as Ogbomoso is to Oyo.

Ekiti, Edo, Oyo, Ijesha, Isekiri etc. are all Tribes of the same ethnic group

Macof, Edo/Bini/Eshan are not part of the Yoruba tribe whatsoever. Edo is a distinct tribe of its own. Under the Edo tribe, you have respective several dialects/groups such as Bini, Ishan, Afemai, Etsako, Urhobo, Isoko etc which are, in actuality, complementary dialects of one another even though these people would rather want to see themselves as distinct and different. In the field of linguistics, all these groups were grouped as one and called Edoid. Just as you have Igbo, Yoruba tribal constructs where Igbo is the name construct for all bia-speaking clans(Onicha, Awka, Nkanu, Owerri, Arochukwu, Ogwashi Ukwu, Etche etc) who all speak dialects of the same 1 language and Yoruba for all wa-speaking clans(Oyo, Ijesha, ekiti, etc) who all basically speak dialects of the same language. In the same vein, Edo/Edoid is the name construct for all Bini-like speaking clans who speak dialects of the same language with some dialects diverging off so much that it almost stands separately as a different language of its own.

Bini language is neither Yoruba nor Igbo. Its a very distinct language. Edoland being juxtaposed between Yoruba land to its west and Igboland to its east, the Bini language shares word similarities between Igbo and Yoruba.

For Bini-Igbo, common words to both languages are Ugegbe(eye glasses, mirror), Osa(God eg Osakwe, Osadebe which are surnames both Binis and Igbos bear), akpati(box), Uku(great/big), etc. For Bini-Yoruba you have omo(child which some binis also call ovie), oba(king) etc.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edo_language

bigfrancis21:

Macof, Edo/Bini/Eshan are not part of the Yoruba tribe whatsoever. Edo is a distinct tribe of its own. Under the Edo tribe, you have respective several dialects/groups such as Bini, Ishan, Afemai, Etsako, Urhobo, Isoko etc which are, in actuality, complementary dialects of one another even though these people would rather want to see themselves as distinct and different. In the field of linguistics, all these groups were grouped as one and called Edoid. Just as you have Igbo, Yoruba tribal constructs where Igbo is the name construct for all bia-speaking clans(Onicha, Awka, Nkanu, Owerri, Arochukwu, Ogwashi Ukwu, Etche etc) who all speak dialects of the same 1 language and Yoruba for all wa-speaking clans(Oyo, Ijesha, ekiti, etc) who all basically speak dialects of the same language. In the same vein, Edo/Edoid is the name construct for all Bini-like speaking clans who speak dialects of the same language with some dialects diverging off so much that it almost stands separately as a different language of its own.

Bini language is neither Yoruba nor Igbo. Its a very distinct language. Edoland being juxtaposed between Yoruba land to its west and Igboland to its east, the Bini language shares word similarities between Igbo and Yoruba.

For Bini-Igbo, common words to both languages are Ugegbe(eye glasses, mirror), Osa(God eg Osakwe, Osadebe which are surnames both Binis and Igbos bear), akpati(box), Uku(great/big), etc. For Bini-Yoruba you have omo(child which some binis also call ovie), oba(king) etc.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edo_language

Wats killing ur argument is ur lack of knowledge in Oodua peoples history.

Oyo are the only Yorubas, Ekiti, Ijebu, Ijesha, Awori, Owo etc. are not part of the Yoruba tribe, they are tribes of their own and were ones Nations of their own

Even within Ekiti, there's some considerable difference in dialect, Of the 16 major Kingdoms, we find 4 varieties owing to their closeness to other tribes like Okun, Igbomina, Ijesa and Owo, also the origins of the people as many Towns in Ekiti have mixed origins mainly of Ife, Bini, Ijesa, Okun and aborigines of old

Wat makes Bini non-Yoruba is same thing that makes Ekiti, Ijesha, Ijebu etc. non-Yoruba

They have "clans"(as u call it) of their own within the tribe.

the name "Yoruba" as it refers to all people of the region is to give a sense of one-ness as we have same traditions and similar culture, and closely related languages.

Isan is to Edo as Ogbomoso is to Oyo.
So by saying bini isn't part of the ethnic group for some language differences is to say Others aren't part of the ethnic group

Why are Austrians called Deutsch like the Germans despite some difference in language? Even the Dutch of Holland accept their linguistic and cultural bond and history with Germans

Andre Uweh:
Edo is saperate and has never and will never be of the same ethnic group with Ekiti, Oyo, Ijesha etc.

Ok I get u all seriously I do.

But here's but here's my point

Wat do u consider to refer different tribes as part of an ethnic group?
This would help u understand better

Btw is Edo an ethnic group or a tribe?

macof:

Ok I get u all seriously I do.

But here's but here's my point

Wat do u consider to refer different tribes as part of an ethnic group?
This would help u understand better

Btw is Edo an ethnic group or a tribe?

In the field of linguistics, dialect/language similarity is the first basis for consideration of similar clans. Bini, Ishan, Afemai, Etsako, Urhobo and Isoko are all classified as Edoid because they share similarity in dialects. And this Edoid group of languages are distinct and different from other languages in Nigeria and hence, stands out alone as a separate ethnic group.

While tribe is used to refer to a uniform set of people, ethnic group is used to refer to a collection of similar tribes who speak variations(dialects) of a common language. For example, bini, Ishan etc can be called tribes and the ethnic group is Edo.

Negro_Ntns: Like the Aniomans who speak Yoruba dialect, like the Ijebus, the Ijeshas, Ilorins, Aworis, Itskeiris, the Edos speak Yoruba dialects.

Unlike Iboland which is knoted in linguistics, Yorubaland and Yoruba race is knoted in hereditary.

So I understand your diifuclty at understanding the union. There are Oyo people that don't speak Ijebu or Ijesha but they are all still in the Yoruba race and speak one or the other of the numerous dialects.

We have rich and diverse tongues tied under one race. European is an European whether English, French or german but the three languages and also Spanish are dialects, one of the other. You understand it now?

The Ibo language on the other hand is comparable to the Americas, where regardless of the cultural nativity, which are diverse, everyone speak one language of the colonial race -Portuguese/Spanish in South America and Mexico and Puerto Rico and English in North America and few islands.

Aniomans speak yorubas kwa?
Are u talking of delta Igbo anioma or Zimbabwe anioma?
Tufiakwa

bigfrancis21:

Macof, Edo/Bini/Eshan are not part of the Yoruba tribe whatsoever. Edo is a distinct tribe of its own. Under the Edo tribe, you have respective several dialects/groups such as Bini, Ishan, Afemai, Etsako, Urhobo, Isoko etc which are, in actuality, complementary dialects of one another even though these people would rather want to see themselves as distinct and different. In the field of linguistics, all these groups were grouped as one and called Edoid. Just as you have Igbo, Yoruba tribal constructs where Igbo is the name construct for all bia-speaking clans(Onicha, Awka, Nkanu, Owerri, Arochukwu, Ogwashi Ukwu, Etche etc) who all speak dialects of the same 1 language and Yoruba for all wa-speaking clans(Oyo, Ijesha, ekiti, etc) who all basically speak dialects of the same language. In the same vein, Edo/Edoid is the name construct for all Bini-like speaking clans who speak dialects of the same language with some dialects diverging off so much that it almost stands separately as a different language of its own.

Bini language is neither Yoruba nor Igbo. Its a very distinct language. Edoland being juxtaposed between Yoruba land to its west and Igboland to its east, the Bini language shares word similarities between Igbo and Yoruba.

For Bini-Igbo, common words to both languages are Ugegbe(eye glasses, mirror), Osa(God eg Osakwe, Osadebe which are surnames both Binis and Igbos bear), akpati(box), Uku(great/big), etc. For Bini-Yoruba you have omo(child which some binis also call ovie), oba(king) etc.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edo_language

Wats killing ur argument is ur lack of knowledge in Oodua peoples history.

Oyo are the only Yorubas, Ekiti, Ijebu, Ijesha, Awori, Owo etc. are not part of the Yoruba tribe, they are tribes of their own and were ones Nations of their own.

For example Ekiti is divided into at least 3 smaller tribes. Here's an history to make u understand

1. The 16 sibling clans.
Ado(formerly Ulesun), aramoko, ijero, ikole, erijiyan, Ikere etc. are Towns of one Tribe in Ekiti- same origin, exact dialect. In fact they all share the same progenitor and ancestor(a very important Ifa priest who lived about 6,000yrs) making them the oldest running tribe in the region.

2. Ido, Osi, Oye, etc. are different from the above and a much newer settlement that came from Ile-Ife independently: Ido was founded by 5Hunters from Ile-Ife about 700years ago
Osi was founded by a prince from Ile-Ife around the same time.
Ido and Osi went ahead to found other Towns eg. Ifaki


3. Other Towns eg. Efon came from Akoko, Ondo and Owo during war against Bini

Now these Ekiti people who are today considered one tribe were initially different people with different origins.
The 3 categories I gave have a distinct dialect among themselves but understand each other well due to frequent trades and the amalgamation of their territories to form one Nation.

Wat makes Bini non-Yoruba is same thing that makes Ekiti, Ijesha, Ijebu etc. non-Yoruba

They have "clans"(as u call it) of their own within the tribe.

the name "Yoruba" as it refers to all people of the region is to give a sense of one-ness as we have same traditions and similar culture, and closely related languages.

Isan is to Edo as Efon is to Ekiti as Ogbomoso is to Oyo.
So by saying bini isn't part of the ethnic group for some language differences is to say Others aren't part of the ethnic group. I tell u an Ijebu man can never understand Ijesha language neither would he understand Ekiti language
Wat brought about the confusion is that.Most of these cities also spoke Oyo language because they were Oyo colonies. It's like saying Celts and Saxons in Britain are Same tribe

Ur logic on referring Edo as an ethnic group can be used to refer Oyo, Ekiti, Ijesha, Ijebu as Ethnic groups of their own.

macof:

Wats killing ur argument is ur lack of knowledge in Oodua peoples history.

Oyo are the only Yorubas, Ekiti, Ijebu, Ijesha, Awori, Owo etc. are not part of the Yoruba tribe, they are tribes of their own and were ones Nations of their own.

For example Ekiti is divided into at least 3 smaller tribes. Here's an history to make u understand

1. The 16 sibling clans.
Ado(formerly Ulesun), aramoko, ijero, ikole, erijiyan, Ikere etc. are Towns of one Tribe in Ekiti- same origin, exact dialect. In fact they all share the same progenitor and ancestor(a very important Ifa priest who lived about 6,000yrs) making them the oldest running tribe in the region.

2. Ido, Osi, Oye, etc. are different from the above and a much newer settlement that came from Ile-Ife independently: Ido was founded by 5Hunters from Ile-Ife about 700years ago
Osi was founded by a prince from Ile-Ife around the same time.
Ido and Osi went ahead to found other Towns eg. Ifaki


3. Other Towns eg. Efon came from Akoko, Ondo and Owo during war against Bini

Now these Ekiti people who are today considered one tribe were initially different people with different origins.
The 3 categories I gave have a distinct dialect among themselves but understand each other well due to frequent trades and the amalgamation of their territories to form one Nation.

Wat makes Bini non-Yoruba is same thing that makes Ekiti, Ijesha, Ijebu etc. non-Yoruba

They have "clans"(as u call it) of their own within the tribe.

the name "Yoruba" as it refers to all people of the region is to give a sense of one-ness as we have same traditions and similar culture, and closely related languages.

Isan is to Edo as Efon is to Ekiti as Ogbomoso is to Oyo.
So by saying bini isn't part of the ethnic group for some language differences is to say Others aren't part of the ethnic group. I tell u an Ijebu man can never understand Ijesha language neither would he understand Ekiti language
Wat brought about the confusion is that.Most of these cities also spoke Oyo language because they were Oyo colonies. It's like saying Celts and Saxons in Britain are Same tribe

Ur logic on referring Edo as an ethnic group can be used to refer Oyo, Ekiti, Ijesha, Ijebu as Ethnic groups of their own.

The problem with you is that you like arguing aimlessly.

The Edos are not Yorubas. Period. They might have shared Kingship similarities in the past, that doesn't make them in any way, Yoruba.

Yoruba, today, is used to refer to all wa-speaking clans of the south west, and not only Oyo. Of course I know full well that the name, 'Yoruba' is of Fulani origin and was used by the Fulanis to refer to the people of Oyo whom they chased away from up north and pushed further south to their current location today. However, the term has expanded in usage to refer to all wa-speaking Yoruba clans.

The Binis/Eshans/Etsakos don't speak Yoruba neither do they speak a Yoruboid dialect. Igala as a language is closer to Yoruba than Edo is and will ever be. The average Yoruba person will decipher about 30% of what an Igala person speaks and vice versa but WILL not understand Bini/Eshan etc when spoken.

That Yoruba was used initially to refer to Oyo doesn't mean the term can't change in usage. After all the meaning you assign to a word is subjective. Meaning that its open to change and dynamic human interpretation. The term, 'American' was initially used to refer to the red/native indians of North America but today now refers to white americans, black americans, etc. The usage and context of words change over the course of time.

Coming to Igbo language, there are over 800 dialects. The first time non-imo-person Igbo visitor to Owerri will never understand the owerri dialect when spoken. A non-nsukka Igbo person will hardly understand Nsukka. Same goes for Ikwo, Izzi dialects in Ebonyi state. Yet they are all dialects of the same Igbo language. That the Onicha man will hardly understand Nsukka or Izzi/Ikwo doesn't mean the dialects are now separate languages on their own and therefore now ethnic groups. Some dialects are very light and easy to understand such as Onicha Igbo, Enugu township Igbo(which is mostly Onicha-like), Aba Igbo, Asaba Igbo(Onicha-like too) etc.

If you think English ends only in American, British and Nigerian English, take a trip to England one day and enter deep into their villages such as Chelsea, Manchester, Birmingham, Woolsworth, Fulham etc and see if you'll understand a word of what they say there. Yet its English but hardly understood by non-English people. This is English spoken in its raw and undiluted form and different from the English spoken in London, a situation which can be likened to what is obtainable in our villages in Nigeria where the village language is more concentrated and thick than the township language.

I wonder where you're getting this your logic from. International journals, researchers, professors and history book writers have never towed the path of error of including Edo as part of Yoruba whatsoever. Not even for one. Commonality in language is the first basis for determining relatedness of sub clans and Edo and Yoruba are entirely two different languages and hence were classified differently just as Igbo and Yoruba were classified differently even though there are similar words common to both languages such as Onu/Enu(mouth), Nti/Eti(ear), Duuru/duro(sit), ogwu/ogun(drug/charm), ozugo/otito(its enough), Egwugwu/egungun(masquerade group) etc.

Don't turn an already known truth and fact upside down.

Edoid languages and Yoruboid languages are different groups.

Reseachers have grouped Southern Nigeria's languages into the YEAI grouping - Yoruba, Edoid, Igbo groups with each group separate from each other.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoruboid_languages
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edoid_languages

This is the same mistake they were making in the delta-igbo thread and i have tried to correct the notion tirelessly but the desire to believe in one indivisible igbo ethnic group is the stumbling block to understanding what macof just explained there. It is totally impossible for a language to have over 800 dialects as this shows lack of development, organization and distinction.

I have always corrected this wrong notion that ijebu, ekiti and all that are not dialect of yoruba language but a different language on their own. They are a different ethnic group on their own but agree to come together under the yoruba nationality as this identity is just used to show oneness as macof have explained. This identity is not so important if there is no fairness or equity inside the group and this will push the group to pursue separate aspirations on their own. Th yorubas might have passed that stage of separateness as a result of the yoruba civil war and the bondness that they have developed inside of one Nigeria so i trust them to sort their issues in a yoruba only nation.

The first research into the igbo identity just hurriedly created a central igbo language and said all the others are a dialect of it but this is very false. There has been a lot of research and this has lead to the better classification into igboid languages and the demarcation is the basis of forming ethnic groups like you have ekiti being an ethnic group on its own but made up of three tribes and associated clans. The igbos east of the Niger are the only ones without clear demarcations in the igboid family but a new research just published last month divided the igboid languages into 15 groups. The nsukka and owerre that they wrongly call a dialect is actually an ethnic group and rightly a language on its own but they will still insist on calling it a dialect.

A dialect of a language is common and unique to the clans that make up that particular tribe, this is what i have been explaining to them and rightly what you have just explained. The ndokwa or ukwuani-aboh is an ethnic group that is made up of two distinct tribe, the first tribe is the ukwuani tribe and the other tribe is the aboh tribe. They all speak ukwuani language but in three different dialects, the ukwuani tribe uses ukwuani dialect, while the aboh tribe uses the aboh and ndoni dialect. There are 37 clans between this two tribes and i don't know why people will now say ukwuani is a dialect of igbo language. Ukwuani people are just part of the igbo nationality to show oneness and this does not mean that they are of the same ethnic group.

http://www.rogerblench.info/Language/Niger-Congo/VN/Igboid/Comparative%20Igboid%20complete.pdf

bini and ishan people are actually not yoruba or edo but far away guinean that stretches across west africa.

Here's some difference in Ekiti and Oyo language....I can't speak Ekiti but I try to understand when spoken to
Oyo - Ekiti
Osi- Usi (left/West)

Iya- Yeye (mother)

Iyawo- Aya (wife)

E Ku'se- Era aba (welldone)
E ku'se - Okun( greetings)

Ogbeni- Awe (reference to ur mate)

Igbo- ugbo (bush, light Forest)

O - I (reference to a third part individual)

Mo ma- Mii ( I will) eg. Mo ma lo- Mii lo (I will go)

Ko si- ke wa (not available)

E[erh] - O[orh] (you) eg. Mo pe e - mi pe o(I called you)

Ibi- Kabi (place)

And many more.... U know these languages are very tonal, one mis-spoken sound in a word distorts it's meaning. An Oyo man would have it easier to push an elephant than Have a nice conversation with an Ekiti man.

I don't base my knowledge on wat some certain people said, when I can prove it myself.

Ekiti is as non-Yoruba as Edo is non-Yoruba

Edo is as Yoruba as Ekiti is as Yoruba

^^
Continue in your desire to claim Edo people. After all, everyone is entitled to their beliefs.

bigfrancis21: ^^
Continue in your desire to claim Edo people. After all, everyone is entitled to their beliefs.

Am nt claiming edo people.

Edo are not Yoruba yes
In the same logic non-Oyo people are not Yoruba

We Ekiti choose to be referred as Yoruba not because we are Yoruba but for the sake of "oneness"

As I have explained before All groups in Oodua territory have Tribes of their own

Pharoh: This is the same mistake they were making in the delta-igbo thread and i have tried to correct the notion tirelessly but the desire to believe in one indivisible igbo ethnic group is the stumbling block to understanding what macof just explained there. It is totally impossible for a language to have over 800 dialects as this shows lack of development, organization and distinction.

I have always corrected this wrong notion that ijebu, ekiti and all that are not dialect of yoruba language but a different language on their own. They are a different ethnic group on their own but agree to come together under the yoruba nationality as this identity is just used to show oneness as macof have explained. This identity is not so important if there is no fairness or equity inside the group and this will push the group to pursue separate aspirations on their own. Th yorubas might have passed that stage of separateness as a result of the yoruba civil war and the bondness that they have developed inside of one Nigeria so i trust them to sort their issues in a yoruba only nation.

The first research into the igbo identity just hurriedly created a central igbo language and said all the others are a dialect of it but this is very false. There has been a lot of research and this has lead to the better classification into igboid languages and the demarcation is the basis of forming ethnic groups like you have ekiti being an ethnic group on its own but made up of three tribes and associated clans. The igbos east of the Niger are the only ones without clear demarcations in the igboid family but a new research just published last month divided the igboid languages into 15 groups. The nsukka and owerre that they wrongly call a dialect is actually an ethnic group and rightly a language on its own but they will still insist on calling it a dialect.

A dialect of a language is common and unique to the clans that make up that particular tribe, this is what i have been explaining to them and rightly what you have just explained. The ndokwa or ukwuani-aboh is an ethnic group that is made up of two distinct tribe, the first tribe is the ukwuani tribe and the other tribe is the aboh tribe. They all speak ukwuani language but in three different dialects, the ukwuani tribe uses ukwuani dialect, while the aboh tribe uses the aboh and ndoni dialect. There are 37 clans between this two tribes and i don't know why people will now say ukwuani is a dialect of igbo language. Ukwuani people are just part of the igbo nationality to show oneness and this does not mean that they are of the same ethnic group.

http://www.rogerblench.info/Language/Niger-Congo/VN/Igboid/Comparative%20Igboid%20complete.pdf

bini and ishan people are actually not yoruba or edo but far away guinean that stretches across west africa.

are you now a yoruba man not an ika man, so you are an authority in this field, Ekit is yoruba and they just have dialect.... why are you cionfused

Benin-Ife-Yoruba Controversy
My understanding of, and position on the Edo/Ife/Yoruba relations is concisely stated at pages 3 and 4 of my publication entitled "Benin In World History" first released in 1997. Copies of the publication were made available to the public through some bookshops, gift shops, and book stands in Lagos Benin and Abuja. Copies may still be available in the bookshops and gift shops at Falomo Shopping Centre, Lagos, at Five Star Hotels' gift shops at Abuja and at the Edo Line in Benin City. My position remains firmly as I stated them in 1997, and I feel particularly happy and vindicated that my views therein are in full accord with Omo N'Oba's declaration of Benin history on the subject, in his recent Autobiography entitled " I Remain Sir, Your Obedient Servant"

Some commentators, including Professors of History in the South-west zone have granted interviews accusing the Benin monarch of looking for and courting cheap popularity and playing politics. Unless they have been wrongly reported or misquoted, their comments smack of intolerance and illibralism, particularly as they emanated from members of the Ivory Tower and their History Departments that are supposed to be centres of excellence in the Liberal Arts and the humane disciplines in the universities.

The Benin monarch was writing his Autobiography and where else should he be telling his readers and the public who his ancestors were and who they were not, I take my stand with His Royal Highness, the Oba of Lagos, who has maintained that Omo N'Oba is in the right. Every person, however highly or lowly placed, has a right to tell the public in his autobiography, who his ancestors were and who they are were not, and he or she is to be believed until the contrary is conclusively established. That is my understanding of the contribution made by the Oba of Lagos, Oba Rilwan Akiolu, during his response to a question put to him on the matter. That response was objective, principled and dignified.

Already made available to the public by the mass media are the statements from his autobiography where the Benin monarch declared his ancestry from Oranmiyan through Ekaladerhan and direct to the Ogiso dynasty. Also made available by the media to the general public is the statement made by the Ooni of Ife debunking Oba of Benin's declaration of the ancestry of Benin Kings, insisting that Benin is one of the kingdoms founded by Oduduwa who descended from heaven to Ile-Ife with four hundred deities. Thus, while the Benin monarch's declaration of his ancestry is earth-and historical, the reaction by the Ooni of Ife has raised the matter to a higher level of the mythical and the celestial. At that level of the mythical and the celestial at which the Ife monarch and the protagonists of his point of view are conducting their response to Omo N'Oba, it seems that no progress can be made on this controversial issue unless and until that celestial father figure is
demystified and humanised and his earthly identity is revealed and established.

In his Lugard lectures on the origin of the Yorubas, 1955, Dr. Saburi Biobaku identified the Oduduwa of History, not as the one who descended from heaven but as a fugitive prince who arrived Ile-Ife by the 11th century from the East, and was made king and called Oduduwa by the people of Ife. But Biobaku did not go further than that and he left undisturbed the prevailing theory that Mecca was the homeland of Oduduwa. Many other scholars and historians have on the other hand, advanced the viewpoint that the homeland of Oduduwa is most likely to be within what is now the Nigerian geographical area, not outside Nigeria, and most certainly not as far away as Mecca.

Studies and research in areas such as these grey areas of our national history are what our professional historians in the universities, the emeritus and the not yet emeritus professors, should be doing for the country, and for the promotion of unity based on authentic facts and credible historiography. Had these been done before now, this long-standing simmering controversy should have been rested and resolved long ago.

The news that the Alafin of Oyo is considering making known his views on the issues raised in the controversy is most welcome. Like the Benin monarch, the Alafin is historically acknowledged to be a direct descendant of the same Prince Oranmiyan. What the Alafin of Oyo has to say about who his ancestors were and who they were not would shed considerable light on this matter, particularly as the name Yoruba was until the last century or two, the clan name of the Oyo people until the missionaries at Abeokuta and the colonial administrators extended that name Yoruba to cover all the clans and people of Southwestern Nigeria, who like the Oyos greeted with Eku, for example Eku abo, Eku aro, Eku joko, Ekuijometa etc. Thus was the designation Yoruba extended to the other clans namely, Egba, Ijebu, Ekiti, Lagosians (eko,) Akure, Ijesha, northern Nigeria peoples who greet with Eku, etc. All these peoples and their Obas are stakeholders in this ongoing
controversy. Their statements on the founding of their kingdom and who their ancestry were, would shed considerable light on the ongoing debate in which it is claimed that their kingdoms were founded by Oduduwa, who descended from heaven to Ile-Ife with four hundred deities.

Apart from the main controversy, there are side issues in the controversy that demand historical attention. Firstly is a lingering impression that because Prince Oranmiyan came from Ife to Benin, he was an Ife prince. That impression is refused and is not borne out by many examples of which we are witnesses even in very recent times. We shall begin with the case of one "Chief Eleyemi" of the Village Headmaster fame in a television play, who was here in Lagos making his round of jokes in his cast. Very few knew he was a prince until suddenly one day we learnt that his people from a town in Ijebu Remo had called on him to return home to become Oba of his town.

Today, "Chief Eleyemi", probably born in Lagos, but who certainly spent a good part of his life in Lagos is Oba in his home town. The questions are does the fact of coming from Lagos to ascend the throne of his ancestors in his homeland make him a Lagos Prince? The answer is an emphatic NO. Also did he have to be sent home by the Oba of Lagos. T he answer too is No. He needed only to have been sent off by his family and town folks resident in Lagos.

The above case study of "Chief Eleyemi's" home coming from Lagos to his hometown in Ijebu Remo, is replicated in many other examples of princes who in recent times returned home from Lagos to their homelands to ascend the thrones of their ancestors. They include "Councillor Balogun" also of the Village Headmaster cast who is now an Oba in his hometown. Others include Oba Adesanoye of Ondo, late AIhaji Umaru Sanda Ndayako, Etsu Nupe, etc. The list is endless. The present Alafin of Oyo too returned home from Lagos to ascend the throne of his ancestors. All these aforementioned royal fathers came from Lagos to their hometowns to ascend the thrones of their ancestors. They are not regarded as Lagos princes. The case of Prince Oranmiyan cannot be an exception, unknown to and strange to the experience of Nigerian peoples and in fact to the history of mankind in general; in which we are being told that a prince with no pre-existing blood relationship was
approached and begged by the Benin kingmakers to come and rule over the Benin Kingdom.

Thus, in the light of all the foregoing, historiography in Nigeria must consider in earnest the Benin antecedents of Oduduwa of history through the Oranmiyan Ekaladerhan Ogiso connection; and that Ekaladerhan and Oduduwa could be names of one and the same person at two different periods of his life history, firstly as Ekaladerhan in Benin and later as Oduduwa in Ife. For example the present Benin monarch, in the years before his father's ascension to the Benin throne in 1933 was known as Prince Solomon Eweka, thereafter he became Prince Solomon Akenzua and after his own coronation in 1979 he is now known as Omo N'Oba Erediauwa, Oba of Benin, three different names at different periods of a life time and he is one and the same person.

Another issue that has been imported into the ongoing controversy is the membership of the Western House of Chiefs by Oba Akenzua II of Benin, father of the present monarch of Benin. On this issue, it is necessary to state clearly, if only for the information of our youths and future generations, that Oba Akenzua II, did not become a member of the Western House of Chiefs because he was a son of Oduduwa but solely because of his exalted position in the Western Region of which his kingdom was a part, at that period in Nigeria's history.

All historical records and evidence on Oba Akenzua's reign, that spanned both the colonial period and the post-Independence era uptill his transition in 1976 severally and collectively establish that throughout his long reign he resisted all overtures and pressures to make him a Yoruba or a member of Egbe Omo Oduduwa; to the extent that he personally founded and led the Benin-Delta Peoples Party to agitate for a separate region for the non-Yoruba speaking peoples of the Western Region, a cause that was achieved by the creation of the Midwest Region by Plebiscite during his life time. The statement by Omo N'Oba Erediauwa in his Autobiography is in order with and in full agreement with the position that his illustrious father had maintained and defended consistently, namely, that the Benin Kingdom is neither Yoruba nor is it a kingdom founded by Oduduwa. It is therefore difficult to see the point being made or scored by bringing Oba Akenzua II of blessed
memory into the ongoing controversy.

In addition, one of the factors militating against objectivity in the ongoing controversy is ethnicism and a feeling among some in the Southwest that as the majority ethnic group west of the River Niger, going by contemporary ethno-geo-politics, they should have been and must be the Alpha and Omega all the time, in the past, in the present and in the future. But history is a matter of facts and not of illusions of present grandeur. Were it not so, how can one explain the historical reality that great and powerful United States of America of today was a colony of Britain, instead of the other way round.

Ugowe writes from Benin-City

http://www.edoworld.net/Benin_Ife_Yoruba_Controversy.html

tonychristopher:


are you now a yoruba man not an ika man, so you are an authority in this field, Ekit is yoruba and they just have dialect.... why are you cionfused

Please listen to the voice of a yoruba man that is telling you that ekiti is not a dialect of the yoruba language.

macof:

Am nt claiming edo people.

Edo are not Yoruba yes
In the same logic non-Oyo people are not Yoruba

We Ekiti choose to be referred as Yoruba not because we are Yoruba but for the sake of "oneness"

As I have explained before All groups in Oodua territory have Tribes of their own

tonychristopher:


are you now a yoruba man not an ika man, so you are an authority in this field, Ekit is yoruba and they just have dialect.... why are you cionfused

Ekiti is not Yoruba

Have u been following them thread at all?

Ekiti and Yoruba have the same origin but speak totally different languages.

The Ekiti settlement is well over 5000yrs according to oral history. The Yagba people of Kogi and Igala seem to have come from Ekiti atleast in little waves of migrations(just my assumption here), that's why the Yagba and Ekiti greet the same way "Okun" or "Era" not "Eku" as The West side uses

Idole(ido, osi, ifaki, oye) is a tribe with it's dialect in Ekiti different from Ado and the rest.

Can u show a list of word similarities between Ekiti and Yoruba?
I would show more word difference and u would see that the languages are structured differently.

1. ekiti accent is fast, very fast like chanting incantations in Yoruba movies, that it's difficult to comprehend

2. A lot of words are different

3. Where a word is written the same, the accent changes the tone of the word that it won't make sense in Yoruba.

Ekiti people speaks Yoruba too very well because Ekiti was once an Oyo colony, but Ekiti has it's own language.

In everytin I believ we can conclude by sayin ethnic identity is what we choose to be. The major issue of ethnic confusion amongst we black africans today owes to what our colonial masters did to many of us. We all know that prior to colonialism there was nothin like a one-yoruba or one-igbo ethnicity. The colonialists saw like ppls and sometimes grouped dem up togeda as one ppl. Today we see that some tribes (especially the larger ones) have to be divided into sub-tribes first before clans while some (especially smaller ones) divide into clans directly. For instance, there are no clans of the yoruba tribe but only sub tribes because it is nothin but a mergin of like ethnicities by colonial masters WHILE there are clans of d Igala tribe because the ppl defined as igala today have always been one united kingdom.

macof:

Ekiti is not Yoruba

Have u been following them thread at all?

Ekiti and Yoruba have the same origin but speak totally different languages.

Ekiti people speaks Yoruba too very well because Ekiti was once an Oyo colony, but Ekiti has it's own language.

Macof, I truly agree with what u hv been saying, the only major reason why ekiti or Ijebu ppl appear yoruba or more yoruba than the Edo or Nupe or Igala ppl is that the Ekiti or Ijebu ppl also speak general yoruba (oyo dialect) as a second language, hence makin it easy 4dem 2b seen as one ppl with yorubas, otherwise they'd have been clearly classified as a distinct group.
I believe if all nupes, Ebiras, igalas were to have been speaking the oyo dialect as a second language, they'd hv been classifed under the larger yoruba body too cos they share similar cultures and close dialects with the yoruba tribes.
This has one way made it the reason why some delta igbos reject the larger igbo identity, because they do not speak the central unifyin igbo dialect well as a second language. If they had, their igboness would neva have been in doubt like it is today. There is just a kind of bond that a common language creates. Many of the northern minorities who are not hausa and have neva considered themselves hausa appear hausa mostly because of the linguistic comand they hv in the hausa language. Some of the have been absorbed by the larger hausa body (especially the muslims).
Without a central unifyin dialect, the deifnition of an ethnic group can hardly b complete.

Nowenuse: In everytin I believ we can conclude by sayin ethnic identity is what we choose to be. The major issue of ethnic confusion amongst we black africans today owes to what our colonial masters did to many of us. We all know that prior to colonialism there was nothin like a one-yoruba or one-igbo ethnicity. The colonialists saw like ppls and sometimes grouped dem up togeda as one ppl. Today we see that some tribes (especially the larger ones) have to be divided into sub-tribes first before clans while some (especially smaller ones) divide into clans directly. For instance, there are no clans of the yoruba tribe but only sub tribes because it is nothin but a mergin of like ethnicities by colonial masters WHILE there are clans of d Igala tribe because the ppl defined as igala today have always been one united kingdom.

Macof, I truly agree with what u hv been saying, the only major reason why ekiti or Ijebu ppl appear yoruba or more yoruba than the Edo or Nupe or Igala ppl is that the Ekiti or Ijebu ppl also speak general yoruba (oyo dialect) as a second language, hence makin it easy 4dem 2b seen as one ppl with yorubas, otherwise they'd have been clearly classified as a distinct group.
I believe if all nupes, Ebiras, igalas were to have been speaking the oyo dialect as a second language, they'd hv been classifed under the larger yoruba body too cos they share similar cultures and close dialects with the yoruba tribes.
This has one way made it the reason why some delta igbos reject the larger igbo identity, because they do not speak the central unifyin igbo dialect well as a second language. If they had, their igboness would neva have been in doubt like it is today. There is just a kind of bond that a common language creates. Many of the northern minorities who are not hausa and have neva considered themselves hausa appear hausa mostly because of the linguistic comand they hv in the hausa language. Some of the have been absorbed by the larger hausa body (especially the muslims).
Without a central unifyin dialect, the deifnition of an ethnic group can hardly b complete.

true, basically ethnic identity is a choice, in as much as the culture and traditions are similar or a common origin exist.

But I was just trying to correct Francis who was acting as if he knows anything about Yoruba language or the people called "Yoruba" today.

Owo people are more Edo than Yoruba(Oyo) but they call themselves Yoruba or Owo

macof:

true, basically ethnic identity is a choice, in as much as the culture and traditions are similar or a common origin exist.

But I was just trying to correct Francis who was acting as if he knows anything about Yoruba language or the people called "Yoruba" today.

Owo people are more Edo than Yoruba(Oyo) but they call themselves Yoruba or Owo

I'm only being realistic here and also going by researched facts and findings, in addition to my own personal relationship with and observation of Edo state people, and not by some hearsay 'my great grand father in the village told me'.

This whole thread is ridiculous. I see people claiming Edo to be a dialect of Yoruba and so on. Edo and Yoruba are two distinct languages, fairly different from each other.

Just because you find similar words here and there does not mean these languages are the same or dialects of each other, tell me: have you ever come by a language that does not borrow words? Core vocabulary is still distinct.

StarFlux: This whole thread is ridiculous. I see people claiming Edo to be a dialect of Yoruba and so on. Edo and Yoruba are two distinct languages, fairly different from each other.

Just because you find similar words here and there does not mean these languages are the same or dialects of each other, tell me: have you ever come by a language that does not borrow words? Core vocabulary is still distinct.

^^^
Thank you.