Sam_Ikenna:

1. If you believe Asaba got the right justice from Nigeria, boldly and loudly state before NLers that such justice is what you hope for your people if found under similar circumstance.

2. If you in all honesty believed that Biafra was wrong and deserved whatever happened to her and her people including, but not limited to, 30000 mutilated bodies in 1966, 3 million killed during the war, Starvation as a weapon, 20 pounds, Abandon property, mass purge from civil service, etc. then boldly state before the world that you would adore and cherish the kind of justice Biafrans got if your group or region were under similar circumstance.

Stopid questions. What did you think war was about? Exchanging kisses?

[size=18pt]When Igbo soldiers were going around killing other peoples leaders maybe they should have thought twice[/size]

Blockade, Starvation abandoned property, mass purge are legitimate war time tactics that has been used before

Blockade was place on Russia during the World war

Soviet soldiers plundered Berlin in 1945

Japan was nuked in 1945

Germans lost a lot of rights after losing the war which included the Allied countries fining them and placing a military base their, they even had limitations on their military strenght.

Many Germans lost their properties after the war

Recently go and read about the Balkan wars in 1993. And see if they were exchanging Bouquet

dayokanu:

Stopid questions. What did you think war was about? Exchanging kisses?

[size=18pt]When Igbo soldiers were going around killing other peoples leaders maybe they should have thought twice[/size]

not only did Igbos kill others' leaders, thay also celebrated and laughed like jackals at Hausas in Hausaland, making the Hausa's blood to boil and pounce on the ibo jackals.

ndu_chucks:

This question is irrational. I can count at least 2 oxymorons in the question. You seem to have forgotten that war is not a dance party and people get killed in wars. It is basically impossible to paint the picture of death in pleasant colours. Death should never be wished on a fellow human being for no just cause, whether he/she is a member or "your people" or not.


I remind you once more that war is not a dance party. The numbers you are throwing around are probably not accurate and the number of dead during the war has been a bone of contention for a long time. Nigerians have never been able to count living people let alone dead people during the war. How did you arrive at those outrageous numbers? Just so you know, blockade is a legitimate tool of warfare.

If the blockade caused the deaths of thousands of rebels, then the blame lies squarely on incompetent leaders and military strategists on the biafra side. As soon as a blockade was implemented, rebel leaders should have known that they could no longer win the war.  The compassionate and smart thing to do thereafter would have been  to surrender.  Instead of surrendering and saving the lives of hundreds of thousands if not millions, as you put it, the rebel leaders kept fighting and causing the deaths of their own people through starvation etc.  In the end these rebel leaders fled. SMH

Nwanne m, It took me a long time to forgive Ojukwu and his military commanders for these unnecessary deaths.

Ndu_chuks Nwanne, let me first say that (1) you are not Igbo and (2) you dont have to forgive Ojukwu for anything.

In my earlier post I asked "Nigerians" in NL to state in unambiguous terms the rightness or wrongness of the justice that Nigeria administered to innocent men in Asaba in 1967, Easterners in the north in 1966, and finally Biafrans during and after the war. I also stated that for those who believe that the justice Asaba and the rest of Biafrans got was a well deserved one to say in clear terms that if their people were under the same circumstance they would, in good faith, accept that same Nigerian justice.

What I have in bold above is as bright as the sun yet people, including you Ndu, chose to avoid it. I dont know why you didnt give a direct response. In life there are many kinds of justice and each one of them has a contour line, sort of an isocline, and your acceptance of any form of justice means you've put your self on that isocline. This isocline may or may not be linear but as long as you're on it there is not getting out. Asaba justice or injustice is an isocline, therefore if you believe what happened there in 1966 was right then you are on that contour line which doesnt have to be straight, and woe betide you if Asaba justice contour line is circular or elliptic then you know its orientation is coming back to pass through your position. So, like I stated in my earlier post - life is Karma with capital K and it is very easy to be caught or trapped in the wish you had for others.

Now we're clear on that lets move on for the business of the day 'cause thats why I'm responding to you.

I have a question for you, Ndu_chuks, and I hope you'll answer that question with yes or no. I'm not going to judge your answer rather I will respect you as a man for at least giving a straight yes or no.

Beneath all your posts is a statement that reads "Keeping Nigeria united is a task that must be done," so it got me thinking that maybe you are the right person to answer this question. Now this is my question to you Ndu, and I want a yes or no.

If keeping Nigeria united requires that 5000 (not 30000) of your people be butchered in 1 year (not 3 months) by another group, and if your people withdraw back to their ancestral land and declare their own independence that FG should launch a humane war (not genocidal) that will kill 500,000 of your people (not one million or 3 million, just mere 500,000) to bring them back, and after the war let FG give your people 500 pounds each (not 20 pounds), would you accept it? Would you still accept that this "task that must be done" must go on?

Mind you, I didnt put Asaba, abandon property, starvation, and shooting at everything that doesnt move because after all its a humane war.

Ndu Nwanne I'm waiting for your answer.

I don't know people will wake up from tribal politic face the fact of the matter that Nigeria is not moving forwad because of mistake of some people, that say they are born to rule, why should you people waste precious time in tribalism and make sure that our future is better than today, I personally feel that should form the basis of any national issue than to fight one another. The insult should not be there at all ,be it as it may killing of any human being is not good at all , except in a situation of war, and for those of us that are not conscious of the current trends of events in Nigeria, it was still under democratic government that a sitting head of state (who was a retired General), odered troops to Odi & Zakibiam, and yet heaven did not fall , yet people are divergent in their views. If Nigeria should move forward then we all have make sure that few that is holding the country ransom are made to face the music, though people like Ibori has started reaping his own fruit, and will go for all his likes , who belives that governance is all about looting, including , the general from Egba land, the General from Mina (Two of them), what amuse me most is that some of these people has not been able to see the reality on the ground, about what is happing to some people in other countries and they deceive themselves that it will not come near Nigeria at all, they should wait a while God will surely rise one of these days , and there will be vengeance for all the blood they'v shed . Think and ponder it is not ethnic or tribal war but, there are few that say Nigeria will enjoy their God given resources.

I am very proud to hear on BBC as Ojukwu is glowingly addressed as "the late Biafran leader". It is instructive that inspite of several years of pretences to the contrary, the world recognises the existence of the Republic of Biafra. Note the language: "late Biafran leader". Not "late leader of defunct Biafra". These are two different phrases with different connotations. The first phrase, which BBC uses implies a Republic still in existence,while the second phrase, which BBC does not use, refers to a Republic that existed and collapsed after a period of time. Indeed, the world knows that Biafra lives!

who ever read that letter ojukwu sent to awo(?) floating all over the internet would have been a fool to allow them biafrans occupy their land without consent. even if they were flushed out of the occupied land and nuked back in where ever was their territory is only fair game.

exotik:

who ever read that letter ojukwu sent to awo(?) floating all over the internet would have been a fool to allow them biafrans occupy their land without consent. even if they were flushed out of the occupied land and nuked back in where ever was their territory is only fair game.

Much to your dismay/wish we still dey here kampe.

Sam_Ikenna:

Much to your dismay/wish we still dey here kampe.

and isnt that what nigeria fought for? make u dey here kamkpe for nigeria and not biafra?

or correct me if im wrong, is there is sovereign nation called biafra wey u dey kamkpe outside what is today known as nigeria?

ndu_chucks:

This question is irrational. I can count at least 2 oxymorons in the question. You seem to have forgotten that war is not a dance party and people get killed in wars. It is basically impossible to paint the picture of death in pleasant colours. Death should never be wished on a fellow human being for no just cause, whether he/she is a member or "your people" or not.


I remind you once more that war is not a dance party. The numbers you are throwing around are probably not accurate and the number of dead during the war has been a bone of contention for a long time. Nigerians have never been able to count living people let alone dead people during the war. How did you arrive at those outrageous numbers? Just so you know, blockade is a legitimate tool of warfare.

If the blockade caused the deaths of thousands of rebels, then the blame lies squarely on incompetent leaders and military strategists on the biafra side. As soon as a blockade was implemented, rebel leaders should have known that they could no longer win the war. The compassionate and smart thing to do thereafter would have been to surrender. Instead of surrendering and saving the lives of hundreds of thousands if not millions, as you put it, the rebel leaders kept fighting and causing the deaths of their own people through starvation etc. In the end these rebel leaders fled. SMH

Nwanne m, It took me a long time to forgive Ojukwu and his military commanders for these unnecessary deaths.

Sometimes your plank of argument is outright ridiculous and has disingenuous written all over it. Starvation in Biafra was instigated by total blockade and reckless Egyptian MIG 21 pilots who tend to fire at anything that moved thereby suffocating subsistent farming system in place. Even feeding centers where the Red Cross and Caritas fed children and the elders, Nigerian government ordered the Egyptian and Australian MIG 21 pilots to fire air-to-surface missiles to the defenseless masses. It is absolute naïveté for any person to insinuate that opposing forces will simply surrender because knuckleheads across the ridge have staged a blanket blockade instead of weapon only.

The argument for Biafran soldiers well fed and citizen gone hungry is lame one at best. Even the citizen contributed to the war effort by donating the little they have to soldiers so that can be able to fight and kill the aggressors who were bent on killing and ra.ping the men and women in Biafra. This is called the support of the war effort. In USA during the WW 2, women had to give up their panty hoses and some other garments used in manufacture of materials needed for war. In Biafra, people gave up the little yam, cocoyam, coconuts, palm kernals, palm oil and women even donated their rapars for amry uniforms.

Of course, blockade is a weapon of war baring humanitarian instances. If you stood up argument against its humanitarian instances, you have no pedigree whatsoever to discuss the massacre in Asaba. I guess the end justifies the means. Personally, I do not have problem with this philosophy.

exotik:

who ever read that letter ojukwu sent to awo(?) floating all over the internet would have been a fool to allow them biafrans occupy their land without consent. even if they were flushed out of the occupied land and nuked back in where ever was their territory is only fair game.

exotik:

and isnt that what nigeria fought for? make u dey here kamkpe for nigeria and not biafra?

or correct me if im wrong, is there is sovereign nation called biafra wey u dey kamkpe outside what is today known as nigeria?

You said you wanted us to be nuked, didnt you? Ok, I'm saying we're still very much alive. It has nothing to do with being in Nigeria or Biafra but all to do with your wish. You sat in your, probably, cozy chamber and found it nice and dandy to tell us how much you wanted us to be nuked. Nuked for what? Nuked for rejecting pogrom and mutilation that took over 30000 precious lives of Easterners b4 the watchful eyes of Gowon led Govt?

Its funny how we make some comments and think they don't matter. Guess what, your comment/wish also implies that if you or your people/family ever stand up against unjust massacre in any shape or form that whoever is doing the massacre should up it with more deadly/precise complete extermination.

Now I ask you, do you still wish other people nuked for their right? Think before you answer because you might be answering for your unborn generation.

Sam,

You are calling for an outright declaration of truth on the Asaba massacre.  I support you on that but are you genuinely calling for a reconciliation truth that supports the entire MidWest on a broad basis or one narrowed to just Asaba and its effect on the Igbo conscience?  

You mentioned the law of Karma, with a capital "K".  Translated into the natural phenomenon of dual and opposite forces, Karma will become "Cause and Effect".  Do you disagree?  

For every "Effect" at the outcome, there was a "Cause" in the beginning.  The event in Asaba was an "Effect" of something, it would not have happened at all unless something prior in timeline and of similar scale had happened to feed it.  Do you not agree with this?   To discuss the outcome in Asaba, we must discuss the beginning of the narrative and explain why in the first place the Nigerian Army was even in Asaba.  What or who were they looking for and why?  

I support your call for truthful revelation, I hope you will support my demand for a broad narrative on the "Cause and Effect" of events in MidWestern State.

You said you wanted us to be nuked, didnt you? Ok, I'm saying we're still very much alive. It has nothing to do with being in Nigeria or Biafra but all to do with your wish. You sat in your, probably, cozy chamber and found it nice and dandy to tell us how much you wanted us to be nuked. Nuked for what? Nuked for rejecting pogrom and mutilation that took over 30000 precious lives of Easterners b4 the watchful eyes of Gowon led Govt?

. . . dont get sensitive over the word "nuke". Do you know how many times this morning alone I have Ibos use the word nuke in calling for a wipeout of Yorubas? It is used loosely on both sides.

Exotic, you looney. . . .stop nuking people on their land.

Sam_Ikenna:



You said you wanted us to be nuked, didnt you? Ok, I'm saying we're still very much alive. It has nothing to do with being in Nigeria or Biafra but all to do with your wish. You sat in your, probably, cozy chamber and found it nice and dandy to tell us how much you wanted us to be nuked. Nuked for what? Nuked for rejecting pogrom and mutilation that took over 30000 precious lives of Easterners b4 the watchful eyes of Gowon led Govt?

Its funny how we make some comments and think they don't matter. Guess what, your comment/wish also implies that if you or your people/family ever stand up against unjust massacre in any shape or form that whoever is doing the massacre should up it with more deadly/precise complete extermination.

Now I ask you, do you still wish other people nuked for their right? Think before you answer because you might be answering for your unborn generation.

so u biafrans felt the best way to reject the so-called progrom from the north was to invade the then midwest and heading to the west? were the midwesterners and westerners the ones commiting the progrom? why didnt u head north? am not against u fighting for ur rights, but dont in the process of fighting for ur rights deprive me of mine when i was not the one who deprived u of urs in the first place. so yeah, of course, if biafrans were nuked after the invasion and forcefully imposing themselves on others, it would have been fair game.

^^^^^ rascal, I didnt know you have this much sense.   

Great point!!  Invade Hausaland, not Midwest.   Plant this flag in Hausaland and call it Republic of Arewa and install Chukwuma in Kaduna as Sardauna.   Very good point exotic.

Dudu_Negro:

Sam,

You are calling for an outright declaration of truth on the Asaba massacre.  I support you on that but are you genuinely calling for a reconciliation truth that supports the entire MidWest on a broad basis or one narrowed to just Asaba and its effect on the Igbo conscience? 

You mentioned the law of Karma, with a capital "K".  Translated into the natural phenomenon of dual and opposite forces, Karma will become "Cause and Effect".  Do you disagree? 

For every "Effect" at the outcome, there was a "Cause" in the beginning.  The event in Asaba was an "Effect" of something, it would not have happened at all unless something prior in timeline and of similar scale had happened to feed it.  Do you not agree with this?   To discuss the outcome in Asaba, we must discuss the beginning of the narrative and explain why in the first place the Nigerian Army was even in Asaba.  What or who were they looking for and why? 

I support your call for truthful revelation, I hope you will support my demand for a broad narrative on the "Cause and Effect" of events in MidWestern State. 

This is one of the reasons that made me adamantly believed in disintegration of the cesspit called Nigeria. There is no future for all of us if we can not shove back the ethnic biased tendencies and be real for once. The last time I check though, Asaba was part and parcel of mid-western region. It is clearly that Asaba was not part of eastern region.

The incursion of Biafra into mid-western region was every bit legitimate as mid-western region was bone fide part of Nigeria that had precipitated a war against eastern region. Anybody who thinks otherwise has issues with recollection and ignorantly oblivious with chronicle order of events as they unfolded in 1967 during the debacle between Nigeria and Biafra.   

A person really wonders why there was no massacre of Edo or Ishan folks when 2nd division of Nigerian army blazed through Benin City. Asaba was part of mid-western region as were Benin City, Warri and Sapele. The only remarkable difference among these cities was Asaba is Igbo.

It is only moronic dunce or irredeemable dimwit will remotely think mid-western region or western region was an entity belonging to Republic of Dahomey and attack on these territories was a breach of any law Biafra when Nigeria had on June 6 through 26, 1967 sustained military attacks including amphibious raids against eastern region or Biafra.

So if Western Region and Midwestern are still part of Nigeria and Biafra has a right to attack them

Then inhabitants of Western region and Midwest too have a right to defend themselves

So where does the story of Yoruba fought them come into play or Some people betrayed them

Wole Soyinka and the late Fela Kuti would weep to see as some of their people are justifying an atrocity.

I hope my Igbo brothers do not allow the actions of a few to paint one group with one stroke.

Either way, I am tired of the Ndigbo playing the victim.

This atrocity was committed against our people, but do not cry, because living well is the greatest revenge.

^^ Simple, Stop whining, bitching and wailing at every opportunity.

I bet in the next 2 days another Igbo would open another Biafra thread whining again

How come other regions dont whine about their leaders that were killed by Igbo soldiers

dk, exactly!

Maybe Yoruba should go to UN and solicit white people to review and bring condemnation on Ibo for killing Akintola, Shodeinde, Ademulegun and his wife, . . . and for Ojukwu putting bullets in Ademoyega and Banjo. Maybe we should open posts and give granular details using exagerration to emphasize what did not happen in order to win sentiments and support. Maybe we should call it ethnic cleansing.

subscribing. . .

EzeUche:

Either way, I am tired of the Ndigbo playing the victim.
This atrocity was committed against our people, but do not cry, because living well is the greatest revenge.

yes, quit whining becos biafra was not an "ndigbo" struggle, and ndigbo is not biafra. and to my knowledge the name biafra was suggested by an ijawman who was part of the struggle. but ndigbo-extract of biafra hijacked the movement, and when the ijaw-extract of biafra asked ndigbo-extract what would be their fate if the biafran dream was to become a reality, ndigbo-extract famously replied, "the status quo remains the same" and that was what alienated the ijaw-extract and they abandoned the movement, but today the ndigbo-extract are the ones crying foul. cry me a river.

breaking news see the kind of people una dey argue with

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-883822.0.html#msg10309042

Dede,

if you want to get a partial truth to soothe and heal Igbo conscience, then fine do that amongst yourselves and do not seek our agreement.  However, you are doing it in our view and we would love to stay out of your discussions. . . but, we will not keep silent and not respond if you write stuffs that are untruthful from our point of view.  What is true to you maynot be true to us. . . . and what is true to us may not be true to you.  

if you want to get a full truth to heal people on both sides, then you must be open to discussions on the total events, not just on Asaba.  

I would like to remind you that before and even after Biafra had declared secession. . . .there were Igbo citizens still coming in from West and crossing into Alaigbo through MidWest.  Their passage was not blocked, they were not persecuted, no one touched them.  The non-igbo midwesterners wanted and desired to remain neutral. . . .     Ojukwu was protecting his people from who?  From non-igbo midwesterners or from Hausas?   When war broke, you should have faced the people that had just spent almost a year since July66 in continous bloodshed of Igbos.  Exotic just told you that.  Instead Ojukwu went after people that had not shed one single igbo blood and planted flag in their territory telling them they better start learning igbo language if they dont yet know how to speak it.   wtf!!  

Personally to me, the event in Asaba was a reprisal.   I dont consoider it a genocide or a crime. . . .it was a reprisal. I will bring another point to your focus.  

The Jan 66 ccoup, everytime we talk about it and charge that it's an igbo planned coup. . .  .what do you east Igbos say?  "oh no, it was not an igbo coup. . .the anioma boys did it".  Well, for slaughtering other people that had not done anything wrong dont you think anioma deserved also to have its people killed for the action of the so called "anioma boys"?    CAUSE and EFFECT. . .or like Sam said. . . KARMA!!!

Dudu_Negro:

dk, exactly!

Maybe Yoruba should go to UN and solicit white people to review and bring condemnation on Ibo for killing Akintola, Shodeinde, Ademulegun and his wife, . . . and for Ojukwu putting bullets in Ademoyega and Banjo. Maybe we should open posts and give granular details using exagerration to emphasize what did not happen in order to win sentiments and support. Maybe we should call it ethnic cleansing.

You can go to hell if you wish. I guess imbecility has no boundaries. You are a dimwitted dirty rat. Members of Nigerian army killed Akintola, Shodeinde, Ademulegun and his wife. Ojukwu might have signed on for the execution of Banjo for treason but Ademoyega was alive till after the war. Ademoyega even wrote a book about the coups and civil war. Marooned maggots will stop at nothing in order to secure a chip lie.

do you want discussions or insult. . . I can do both satisfactorily!

If Nigerian Army killed those people, then the action of Nigerian Army in Asaba should be seen as a domestic problem contained within the sovereignty of Nigeria and you should stop invoking Biafra in it. Also, stop calling UN since this was a domestic and not international issue.

Dudu_Negro:

Dede,

if you want to get a partial truth to soothe and heal Igbo conscience, then fine do that amongst yourselves and do not seek our agreement. However, you are doing it in our view and we would love to stay out of your discussions. . . but, we will not keep silent and not respond if you write stuffs that are untruthful from our point of view. What is true to you maynot be true to us. . . . and what is true to us may not be true to you.

if you want to get a full truth to heal people on both sides, then you must be open to discussions on the total events, not just on Asaba.

[b]I would like to remind you that before and even after Biafra had declared secession. . . .there were Igbo citizens still coming in from West and crossing into Alaigbo through MidWest. Their passage was not blocked, they were not persecuted, no one touched them. The non-igbo midwesterners wanted and desired to remain neutral. . . . Ojukwu was protecting his people from who? From non-igbo midwesterners or from Hausas? When war broke, you should have faced the people that had just spent almost a year since July66 in continous bloodshed of Igbos. Exotic just told you that. Instead Ojukwu went after people that had not shed one single igbo blood and planted flag in their territory telling them they better start learning igbo language if they dont yet know how to speak it. wtf!! [/b]Personally to me, the event in Asaba was a reprisal. I dont consoider it a genocide or a crime. . . .it was a reprisal. I will bring another point to your focus.

The Jan 66 ccoup, everytime we talk about it and charge that it's an igbo planned coup. . . .what do you east Igbos say? "oh no, it was not an igbo coup. . .the anioma boys did it". Well, for slaughtering other people that had not done anything wrong dont you think anioma deserved also to have its people killed for the action of the so called "anioma boys"? CAUSE and EFFECT. . .or like Sam said. . . KARMA!!!

What has free passage or even domicile in the mid-western or western region of Nigeria got to do with Asaba massacre and your skewed plank of argument? If Biafra had stood as a nation, the citizens of Biafra and Nigeria would still enjoy free passage to/fro both countries as the citizens of Nigeria and Cameroon or Republic of Benin or Togo or Ghana have mutual interactions and share of domicile.

Biafra not Ojukwu went after Nigeria as the later had commenced military operations against the former. Sometimes I ask God why you allowed me to share nationality with moronic dimwits who can not make simple and clear deductions.

LORD HAVE MERCY pls which one is domestic problem and none domestic problem can some one pls help me out some people are insane

Members of the Nigerian Army killed Akintola , Sodeinde etc

Members of the Nigerian army also killed those at Asaba


Do me I do you

dayokanu:

Members of the Nigerian Army killed Akintola , Sodeinde etc

Members of the Nigerian army also killed those at Asaba


Do me I do you

whats your occupation in america you sound like a dodgy person

Dudu_Negro:

do you want discussions or insult. . . I can do both satisfactorily!

If Nigerian Army killed those people, then the action of Nigerian Army in Asaba should be seen as a domestic problem contained within the sovereignty of Nigeria and you should stop invoking Biafra in it. Also, stop calling UN since this was a domestic and not international issue.

I had no intention to throw insult into the debate. I wonder why you did not remember this line from your previous post in response to my post. I had posited Asaba was part of mid-western region of Nigeria and the act of massacre in Asaba instead of Benin City or Warri or Sapele was a matter of concern to any reasonable and sensible human being.

Of course, the killing in Kaduna, Lagos and Ibadan were Nigerian issues since there was no Biafra in the equation. But this can not be said about Asaba massacre which has everything to do with dispute between Nigeria and Biafra. If you can not understand the difference and linkage, I can not help you.

Again, I did not mean to insult you but a person of average intellect such as you should not flaunt ignorance in the public. 

Da infamous:

whats your occupation in america you sound like a dodgy person

My occupation is to come online and whine about Biafra, About how everyone hates Igbos, How everyone is jealous of Igbos etc

Isnt that a career on its own?