i have to recline to checking up from time to time having read drumb's unintelligible last post to me. It seems the sanest decision to make at the moment.

Image123: i have to recline to checking up from time to time having read drumb's unintelligible last post to me. It seems the sanest decision to make at the moment.

You are becoming more and more difficult to understanding.

I wish you had counted the cost before coming to engage yourself here. Apparently what's being done here is no child's play.

Adios.

[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F7: HOLY GHOST LAUGHTER along with slain in the spirit (Continued)[/size]

It would appear that today’s Christian’s assessment of God’s involvement in any ministry is when so called ‘raw power’ is displayed. It is also interesting that whatever manifestations takes place in services and meetings are accepted as been from God without any reference to the Bible. No one bothers to see how much such occurrences align with the Bible. None does what the Scripture instructed – “Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God” (1 John 4:1). This command is given because it is possible that, even in the Church, signs, wonders, and experiences DO NOT necessarily come from God.


The next experience which WoF folks seeking spiritual high go for, claiming it is outpouring of the Holy Spirit, is ‘holy laughter’.

[size=14pt]What Is Holy Laughter? [/size]

This refers to spontaneous, uncontrollable laughter erupting within congregations, even during times of solemn ceremony or messages from the pulpit. Also reported are uncontrollable weeping, falling to the floor in ecstatic trances, and animal noises such as barking like dogs, roaring like lions, staggering and gyration like drunken people and unable to walk a straight line. But laughter is the paramount phenomenon exhibited.

Again, is laughter a gift or fruit of the Spirit? Galatians 5: 22, 23 says:
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.
Nowhere here do we see laughter listed. So where do these folks get their ‘experiences’ from? Many in WoF circles will prefer a more exotic expression by the Holy Spirit and where He doesn’t give such they create the ‘experiences’ themselves however.


Proponents of these phenomena say they are evidence of a fresh outpouring of the Holy Spirit in response to the people's desire to see a new manifestation from God and a prelude to a possible out breaking of a revival.


[size=14pt]Pertinent Questions[/size]
Is there any account in the Bible that persons were uncontrollably laughing, laughing in a crowd of worshippers, or falling down unable to stop laughing?

Since self-control is a fruit of the Spirit, can that same Spirit lead the believer into an uncontrollable state? Will God ask the Christian to behave orderly, be self-controlled and decent then make him act as if drunk, laugh uncontrollably, or engage in some other eccentric way?
Jesus was given the Holy Spirit without measure yet not once did we find him engaging in these kinds of acts. Did Peter, Paul and the rest of the Apostles and the church with them indulge in any such acts?
1 Corinthians 14: 23, 24 clearly tell us how the church in worship should act even with consideration for how the unbeliever perceives her. Are we to be still governed by that today or has the mandate changed?



[size=14pt]Closing Words[/size]
One of the distinguishing thing between Christianity and eastern religions is that while those religions advocate for the giving up of one’s will or even consciousness to either ‘connect’ with the ‘force’ or god, in Christianity it is the opposite: the Christian is called to use his mind, to renew his mind and not be drunk but rather be filled with the Spirit.

As mystical beliefs, pagan practices, and eastern religion techniques continue to infiltrate the church, one thing is clear: a growing number of well-intentioned (but naïve) believers will continue to misplace their faith and money—deceived anew by the lure of the Serpent's "new anointing"

Worship is a very important thing to God and so how His people come before Him is not taken lightly by God. That is why the scripture has clear directives on how to come before the Lord. The Christian must therefore be careful that he does not mix the holy with the profane when he comes before God.

I REST MY CASE ON F7, FOR NOW.

[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F7: HOLY GHOST LAUGHTER along with slain in the spirit[/size]



This is a refreshed disclaimer that this thread was and/or is not set out to malign persons (e.g. Hagin et al)
but that the truth is the thread is about " Word Of Faith - The Movement's Doctrine And Proponents"
if it happens that Hagin et al had featured in the past, now or later again subsequent posts on this thread,
then it only is and/or was just a matter of citizen journalism and circumstances beyond the thread's control.

Contributor such as DrummaBoy have given low level insights on "What is holy laughter?"
whilst Trustman too provided an impressive low level list of the different types of behavioral "manifestations"
which are displayed, singly (i.e. one at a time) or combined (i.e. more than one at a time) in "holy ghost laughter along with slain in the spirit" sessions

Please note that of course, there are loads of others, that had equally
taught, received, allowed or taken part in this activity known as the "HOLY GHOST LAUGHTER along with slain in the spirit" doctrine
(e.g. Oral Roberts, Paul Crouch of TBN, Kenneth Copeland etc just to name a few)
the thread at this juncture is singling Hagin out with this doctrine because of the following:
1) First as a result of his prominent Father of WoF position.
2) Second, from the word go, this doctrine like every other doctrine in WoF, had started with Hagin
(i.e. he had been in the forefront of the "HOLY GHOST LAUGHTER along with slain in the spirit" doctrine)
along with new-WoF-kid-on-block Howard Rodney-Brown who earlier had got into the action
(i.e. as like they mostly do with every other WoF doctrine)
brought the doctrine up another notch or level up to the point of ludicrous
(e.g. as like was done with name-it... claim it, financial posterity etc doctrines)
3) Lastly, he had prophesied that there will be waves of God's glory never witnessed before sweeping across the country and world at large

As regards #3, simple research on Hagin or if one had been following Hagin,
one would have noticed that he had previously "prophesied" (i.e. this prophecy he made, is captured on video) about a new wave of anointing
that will sweep and move across the country and the world at large.

This "Holy Ghost laughter and slain in the spirit" thing is what Hagin declared to be the first filling demonstration of the new spiritual anointing he said God had promised him.

Hagin usually starts with quoting scriptures
also along the line, in other incidents, he usually gets his music director to sing the "laughing song" repeatedly over and over,
to get attendees worked up for the frenzy (i.e. this can be seen done in other videos)
The lyrics in the songs are for example: "Laughing, laughing, laughing is so much fun..." etc
He also says, when the spirit moves, just jump in, as in, laugh along (i.e. fake the laugh, until to make or start to laugh)

You see, Hagin, been an Apostle that he claims he was, had prophesied (i.e. this is captured on video) that God promised Him that a new wave of special anointing will sweep across the country and beyond.

Since then, Hagin had been trying to validate this prophecy, with the occasional attempts of laughing in Pastors meetings at his Tulsa base,
this is all long before Rodney Howard Brown came on the scene with the "Holy Ghost laughter" when Oral Roberts endorsed it after a Brown performance of it.

Though when initially approached to comment on Rodney Howard Brown and this his prevailing "Holy Ghost laughter" anointing
(i.e. as Brown was a Rhema graduate & ex Rhema tutor),
Hagin's camp then, at first disavowed and distanced themselves from Rodney Howard Brown
but then later on, Hagin's validation quest in an ironic manner was inadvertently given a life line
(i.e. a means of escape from a difficult situation) by Rodney Howard Brown, after an Oral Roberts' Rodney Howard Brown endorsement
(i.e. when Oral Roberts' son invited Rodney Howard Brown to Oral Roberts university campus to preach etc, he came down laughing and endorsed the laughing and Brown in the meeting)

The rest is history, and Hagin forged ahead to exploit Rodney Howard Brown's "Holy Ghost laughter",
packaged it as doctrine in WoF to be milked, made full use of it and derived benefit from it.

Charisma magazine and TBN (i.e. silent WoF shareholders) also helped popularise the "Holy Ghost laughter along with slain in the spirit" doctrine and activity in churches or revivals.

Apart from USA, North America (e.g. Toronto blessing), UK (e.g. Steven Hill)
and some parts in Australia that got intoxicated with the "Holy Ghost laughter" doctrine, the activity though it got imported to Naija
it didn't get a footing in mainstream churches
(i.e. the likes of Oyedepo, Kumuyi, Oyakhilome, Adeboye etc churches didn't get influenced by it at all)

Like how most things become, the "Holy Ghost laughter along with slain in the spirit" doctrine is more or less a fad now,
which is why some might be oblivious of the doctrine,
and even some might be unaware that it did touch base in Naija.
It might not have touch based in mainstream churches,
but it is a fact that attempts were made to introduce it via the youth (i.e. on/through campus fellowships)

Interestingly TB Joshua practices "Holy Ghost laughter and slain in the spirit" too albeit in a subtle manner
(i.e. it is not a mass hysteria or congregational type)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2V7KbbfRHA
For an eye-opening look, watch what seemingly might be a video of the devil behind the scenes laughing self silly,
along with Kenneth Hagin (i.e. the father of WoF/"Word of Faith" family),
Kenneth Copeland (i.e. the heir to Hagin’s WoF/"Word of Faith" empire)
Gloria Copeland (i.e. Kenneth Copeland's wife)
Billye Brim (i.e. Co-host with Gloria Copeland on Kenneth Copeland's BVOV TV program, also editor of publications editing Hagin’s teachings into books & the "The Word of Faith" monthly magazine)
Rev Keith Moore (i.e. former classroom instructor at Hagin's founded Rhema Bible Training Center & closely affiliated with Kenneth Copeland)
Leroy Thompson and wife Carolyn (i.e. of the "Money Cometh To Me, Now" fame, seen in the video, leaning towards Hagin,
tapping him for "anointing" though 2 years later, he declined the Hagin's 1999 Tulsa meeting invite and so refused to show up)
Ed Dufresne and wife Nancy (i.e. another of Hagin’s copy cats, WoF heavily entrenched and Rhema Bible Training Center stalwart)
Mac Hammond and wife Lynne

Watch them and others with dead fish like eyes, laugh themselves silly
It could be possibly a laugh over people not knowing the difference between the franchised "Word of Faith" and the biblical "word of faith"

Watch Hagin flick and waggle tongue, stick tongue out and in, hissing, puffing, spitting like a snake
and then do his best impersonation of Michael Jackson "Thriller" laugh

Watch them bare teeth, hiss and puff too,
and then, like snakes, they slither down seats before laughing themselves silly

Notice Kenneth Copeland. He wouldn't be outdone with the laughing (i.e. he just has to, OTT as usual, go overboard with it)
but then, watch later on his face, from 4.54 onwards... it gives a lot away,
he definitely, is thinking to himself:
"What got into me making a fool of myself just then... this is nonsense, Right?"

Suspicion: Wonder why the cameramen weren't falling down in stitches with laughter too.

This is nothing near the pentecostal experience of Acts 2:1-15, as this definitely looks unforgivably cringe worthy to watch.

This family of the "Word of Faith" movement video makes them out as snakes, serpent hybrids writhing on the floor, like brood of vipers!

For this reason I will mourn and wail;
I will walk around barefoot and without my outer garments.
I will howl like a wild dog, and screech like an owl.
- Micah 1:8 Net Bible

Mourning is the closest anything in the bible that looks or resembles hooting like owls etc like done in "Holy Ghost laughter"
and it is only one reference of a likely similar setting, this is found in Micah 1:8

So it is safe to say, it is not biblical, as their isn't anything remotely like or close to a "Holy Ghost laughter" in the bible

This laughter thing has been around in the East (e.g. Asia, India etc with Buddhists and Hindus) long before WoF latched on to it

"Holy Ghost laughter" is nothing more than just glorified "Laughter yoga"
otherwise, it then is something else worse, sinister and darkening, maybe has to do with Kundalini.

What? Kundalini? Why Kundalini?
Well, because the "Holy Ghost laughter" activities in WoF churches or other revivals have similar peculiarities and/or all the hallmarks of a Kundalini session.
- these strange or unusual features do not look anything like coming from the Holy Spirit but does look more like coming from a Kundalini spirit.
- a spirit the Buddhists and Hindus earlier mentioned above, will have no problem easily confirming or recognising.

Kundalini, (i.e. or Tummo as it is called in Tibet) by the way, means coil and is derived from the Sanskrit word "Kundal".
The Bhuddists and Hindus teach that Kundalini, nourishes the tree of life
and is coiled up within like a serpent, at the base of the etheric human spine with latent power, ready to spring
hence the reason it has also been referred to as "The Serpent Power"



Serpent power is imparted by the guru, done by laying on of the guru's hands or a single touch to the recipients' head (i.e. Shakti-pat),
"Holy Ghost laughter and slain in the spirit" too, is imparted a similar manner: by laying on of hands on people and saying "Be blessed!"
it can be imparted also by just walking by a row, and affect the whole people in the row by merely touching the first person in the row,
or it can be imparted by handing over microphone to recipients.

Both (i.e. "Serpent power" and "Holy Ghost laughter and slain in the spirit'') upon impartation
make people either collapse or fall, seemingly under the "spirit's" power
some people break out into ecstatic laughter, roaring, twisting about, barking, gyrating, hissing, crying or shaking
some could be struck dumb, rendered speechless and unable to talk when asked to

Our mouths were full of laughter and our tongues sang aloud for joy.
- Psalms 126:2

Spiritual "wine" is what Hagin calls the impartation, backing it up with scripture quoting Psalms 126:2 above.
On the stage/pulpit and later on when moving round the auditorium, Hagin will say:
"...come and drink, don't wait, just jump in..." this to encourage present attendees to receive the new wave of glory

Not much will be further said, at this point about the similarities between Kundalini - "Serpent power" and "Holy Ghost laughter and slain in the spirit" except that, readers do their own research on these two phenomena,
to find out whether or not, some form of occult Eastern teachings and techniques were assimilated as church doctrine or activity by WoF.

Laughter is strong medicine for the mind and body, as there are mental health, physical health and social benefits of laughter
and the following URL: http://www.helpguide.org/life/humor_laughter_health.htm attests to the benefits

Laughter even can be a beneficial by-product of a cheerful heart, as can be seen in Proverbs 17:22:
A cheerful heart is good medicine, but a broken spirit saps a person's strength.
- Proverbs 17:22 NLT

So in light of this, laughter is not getting knocked, ridiculed and/or dismissed,
but what is worrisome, is the sheer dishonesty, deceit, falsehood and energy put behind
portraying the "Holy Ghost and slain in the spirit" doctrine or activities for what it is not
It beggars belief, why masquerade a phenomenon provided by the kingdom of darkness,
as a new wave of special anointing sweeping across the country and beyond.
Was it done out of desperation, egocentric or what?

On closing, the bible clearly in Galatians 5:22-23 states what the fruits of the spirit are,
(i.e. they are: love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control)
holy ghost laughter or uncontrollable laughter unsurprisingly is no where on the list.

If not Kundalini, then call it what it is: call it glorified laughter yoga,
- an exercise done in groups, involving prolonged voluntary laughter, and where feigned/forced laughter soon turns into real and contagious laughter.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPMOjI_KVmk
Rodney Howard-Browne with Benny Hinn teaching how to Holy Laughter

Make sure that the light you think you have is not actually darkness.
- Luke 11:35 NLT

[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F7: HOLY GHOST LAUGHTER along with slain in the spirit[/size]
I REST MY CASE ON F7, FOR NOW.

[size=16pt]STILL ON F7: HOLY GHOST LAUGHTER along with slain in the spirit[/size]

Below is an article from the WEB on this issue that might interest some people.
If nothing else i think the article should make every Christian 'test' every experience
witnessed in order to be sure its source is GOD.
Here it is:

[size=16pt]The truth about “holy laughter” is not the SET-APART [HOLY] SPIRIT but a kundalini deceiving demon[/size]

Posted on October 4, 2012

There is much going on in Churches that many believe is the SET-APART [HOLY] SPIRIT but it is not. What people are doing is allowing demons to use their bodies. What is shown in the video [link at bottom of page] about the holy laughter/kundalini spirit is some of what I experienced in workshops that taught new age mysticism but used the words “God/Jesus/angels” so people felt safe. However, the people who taught these workshops did not believe in the Bible as the Word of ELOHIM [Hebrew word for GOD and who I believe is FATHER/SON/SPIRIT] so their “God/Jesus/angels” were different. Christians/Believers in the MESSIAH [CHRIST] were participating in these workshops and being deceived along with everyone else. I even saw a tamer version of “slaying in the spirit” being done by hands being laid on people in a Catholic Church and it was attributed to Mary [Miryam is her true name in Hebrew]. While some of the people in the Catholic Church and most of the people in the new age workshops collapsed on the floor when hands were put on them, the experiences of the people in the new age workshops looked to be more intense: they had visions/heard voices, some could not stop laughing, some talked in tongues [and understood each other], healing occurred, and bodies moved around but not by the people themselves. We all had sinned and opened the door for demons to use us and our bodies. We all were deceived.
Hand drawn pictures of Mary being sold at the Catholic Church during the “slaying of the spirit”, reminded me of pictures people in the new age workshops had of “avatars” – spirit guides that were helping them. I had my own that I painted when I was 21 and really into science fiction/fantasy. I eventually started meditating and praying/invoking in front of it. I was told in the workshops that she was my higher self, and that I was originally a Pleiadian from that star system before I came to Earth, and that I was in Atlantis and was an “old soul” with many reincarnated lives. Google “images of Pleiadians” and you will see many tall, slender, pale complected beings either male/female/or androgynous with long or short white hair. Mine was a female fitting that description and I did not see any of these images when I painted her, I just drew and painted what came to me. I know now that the painting was really the harlot who is called wickedness, who the Bible talks about frequently and is called the “queen of heaven” in Yirmeyahu [Jeremiah] 44:17-25 and 7:18. Mary is not the “queen of heaven”. This is the title of a pagan goddess not a Hebrew handmaid/lady servant. I also about fell over when reading Yesha’yahu [Isaiah] 47:2 in the Lamsa translation of the Bible which is from the Aramaic Peshitta [Aramaic is a sister language to Hebrew and it is the language the MESSIAH spoke]. It is the only translation of Scripture I have found so far, where in regards to the daughter of Babylon [which is another of the harlot's names] when she is being chastised, she is told to “cut your white hair”! Do you remember me mentioning white hair on the new age avatars? All of these beings are actually a representation of the harlot, whether male or female or genderless, the harlot is behind them all. When ELOHIM woke me up from what I was involved in and I accepted HIS SON as my Saviour again [this time understanding much more of what it meant], I “repented/confessed” of what I did while worshiping ELOHIM’S enemy and asked to be washed clean in the MESSIAH’S blood. I cut up the painting and had it burned and had everything else associated with the worship I had done destroyed as well.
ELOHIM is very clear that we are to discern by HIS word. There is nothing in HIS word about HIM doing any of the above actions to HIS people through HIS SPIRIT. While speaking in tongues is Biblical, it was preceded by people hearing a rushing wind and seeing tongues of flame around them [Acts 2:2-3]. Has this happened to anyone you know who says that they speak in tongues? Have they asked in prayer if it is HIS Spirit or a deceiving demon? After what happened to me, I try to remember to go to HIM about everything. I ask HIM if it was HIM or if it was HIS enemy trying to deceive me, to make it very clear to me, to protect me, and in YHWH’S NAME [YAH's NAME - many Bibles use the word "Lord"] which HE gave to HIS SON, may the MESSIAH rebuke the enemy from me [Y'hudah - Jude 9 and Z'kharyah - Zechariah 3:2]. See this for more information http://glclifestyling.com/2012/01/17/hello-world/
The deception in the world is incredible. I try not to go by my own understanding but to go to ELOHIM instead. A good book to get is by Ray Yungen called “Many Will Come in My Name” which goes into deceptions of the enemy in society and another called “A Time of Departing” which goes into what deceptions are infiltrating churches. Ray even told me he met a Baptist woman who had clucked like a chicken in church and believed the SPIRIT did it to her! The links for both books are below. When I was in Israel I met a man from Germany who watched the video [link below] and told me afterwards that it confirmed for him that what he saw in his Church in Germany was not the SPIRIT. He sent family and friends the link to look at for themselves. I saw in a Church in Israel women who experienced kriyas and saw visions of the lion of Y’hudah roaring. Both types of experiences are talked about in the video [link posted below].
Ask Our ABBA [FATHER] in Heaven for the truth of what is going on if any of this is happening in your church, and for HIM to bring down anything that is of the enemy, and heal what has been done. Anyone who has experienced this should confess and repent of being used by demons and inviting them in, ask for forgiveness and to be washed clean by the MESSIAH’S blood, ask for protection, and if there is anything else they need to do to be healed in body/mind/spirit. The enemy is making a mockery of us to our ELOHIM who looks down on all and must be experiencing all kinds of emotions over HIS people being used in these ways. The SPIRIT is probably livid and would like to turn some people into real chickens would be my guess. I also do not believe there is anything mentioned in Scripture about our MESSIAH as our SHEPHERD leading laughing sheep or clucking sheep beside still water!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wr8jAJ90t4c [short version]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et-ELjdBS_k [long version]
http://www.lighthousetrails.com/formanyshallcome.htm
http://www.lighthousetrails.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=LTP&Product_Code=ATOD&Category_Code=RY
[This was posted on an internet site about kundalini - it happened to someone else, not me, and contains important information about what happens] “…Kundalini was awesome at first until I started seeing huge snakes, aliens, reptilians & horrible looking creatures. Please google where a Pleiadian channel-er channels Lucifer & he promotes Kundalini. Kundalini is a snake demon & Kundalini attracts snakes and demons. Leviathan IS ALSO coiled Leviathan a serpent found in churches and Kundalini & Hinduism. I got rid of Kundalini by casting out Leviathan & Kundalini. Please google Leviathan & Kundalini, they are the false Holy Spirits, so you PEOPLE CAN REMOVE KUNDALINI…”

The site is: http://glclifestyling.com/2012/10/04/the-truth-about-holy-laughter-is-not-the-holy-spirit-but-a-kundulini-deceiving-demon/#more-512

^^^

Nobi for today, yansh don tey for back

Revelation 2:24 But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden.

The obsession with F7, a thing very rarely seen shows again that nothing much is to be gained from here. Next.

Image123: Revelation 2:24 But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden.

The obsession with F7, a thing very rarely seen shows again that nothing much is to be gained from here. Next.

Again like I said before- If you have not heard about the 'Holy laughter' then remember the saying "to be forewarned, is to be forearmed".
It's good to have advance knowledge to warn you when you do meet with the 'occurrences '.
Do you wait until you're tempted before you learn about temptation?

[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F8:TITHING [/size]

Bring ye all the money into the church offering plates
that there may be cash enough for ‘God’s anointed’!


We hear or read it all the time: ‘Bring in all your tithe into the God’s storehouse!’, ‘God gave HIS best for YOU, so you should give your best to Him!’, ‘Give so that the windows of heaven will open with BREAKTHROUGH MIRACLES for you!’ etc The coining of such propaganda statements is never-ending.

Tithing was instituted under the Mosaic Law. At the first Council in Jerusalem, which dealt with whether the Gentiles were required to OBEY the Mosaic Law, the divine position was this: “For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay on you NO GREATER BURDEN THAN THESE requirements: that you abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols, and from blood, and from what has been strangled, and from sexual immorality. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.” (Acts 15: 28-29).

How come then that many leading preachers particularly in the WoF movement aggressively push the issue of tithing with the carrot approach and where that does not seem to work for them go for the STICK? Is that position given by the Holy Spirit at the Jerusalem Council still relevant for today or has it been set aside? The issue for the Christian therefore is this: “Whose report will you believe?” Is it the position of the infallible word of God or the teaching of men? If the word of God says ‘no burden’, whether of tithes or firstfruits, etc and man says ‘You must pay tithes, firstfruits, etc’ which one do you want to choose no matter the eloquence in presentation or glowing testimonies of results of following man’s methods? The issue is that of either freedom in Christ or a yoke of slavery by men.

One of the most tragic aspects of this Word of Faith movement is that most of the people involved have never taken time to really study to see if the doctrines of the movement have Biblical support: they have simply brainwashed themselves into accepting the propaganda spewed out to them. This in my opinion is truly unfortunate.


Why did God institute the tithe?
The tithe was used basically to feed the Levite priests (and their families) who were required to work in the temple day and night ministering to God on behalf of God’s people.
Numbers 18: “21 “I give to the Levites all the tithes in Israel as their inheritance in return for the work they do while serving at the tent of meeting. 22 From now on the Israelites must not go near the tent of meeting, or they will bear the consequences of their sin and will die. 23 It is the Levites who are to do the work at the tent of meeting and bear the responsibility for any offenses they commit against it. This is a lasting ordinance for the generations to come. They will receive no inheritance among the Israelites. 24 Instead, I give to the Levites as their inheritance the tithes that the Israelites present as an offering to the Lord. That is why I said concerning them: ‘They will have no inheritance among the Israelites.’”

1 Chronicles 9:33: “33 Those who were musicians, heads of Levite families, stayed in the rooms of the temple and were exempt from other duties because they were responsible for the work day and night”.

In contrast to the other tribes of Israel who were given land as their inheritance, the Levites were not given any land. God was their inheritance – Numbers 18:20: “The LORD said to Aaron, “You will have no inheritance in their land, nor will you have any share among them; I am your share and your inheritance among the Israelites”.. As a result, the other tribes were required to provide the Levites with food since they had no land of their own to farm on. This provision of food for the Levites became the tithe.

Now, when it comes to the church, has God specifically given this same kind of instructions? The answer is NO! Is there anyone in the church that God has commanded today not to do any other work but work in the ‘temple’? The answer again is NO! In fact, there is no physical temple for the church today. Rather the individual believer is now the temple of God – “Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God?” (1 Corinthians 6:19). The much application we can make is that, if tithe were still obtainable today (and it is not so), the place to bring it is to the individual believers. Again, which of the tithe proponents preach this today? None!

It must be noted that there were later on other types of tithes which others ate from and the fact that NOT ALL IN THE LAND of Israel paid tithes.

We shall examine below some of the arguments advanced by tithers and see how far they conform to the Word of God.

The “Abraham paid tithe to Melchizedek” Argument (Genesis 14:18-20) – Tithing by ‘faith’?
Abraham’s tithe to Melchizedek is used as a justification by pro-tithers for the Christian to tithe. The mention and link between Melchizedek and Jesus in Hebrews 5 – 7 is also used by them to rationalize its import into the New Covenant. However, a close look at Hebrews shows that the author is NOT writing in support “tithe” though it is talked about a number of times. Instead, by comparing Jesus to Melchizedek the writer is EMPHASIZING Jesus as our eternal high priest/king. Nothing in that portion suggests the need for or a continuation of tithing. In fact, the writer of the book of Hebrews actually talked about the end of the Levitical priesthood under which the issue of tithing obtained. Another thing to note from Genesis 14:18-20 is plainly that Melchizedek did not ask Abraham for a tenth of the plunder. How is it then that today’s ministers can read Genesis 14:18-20 and use it to ask for tithe, when Melchizedek did not ask for a tithe? In addition nothing in the Genesis passage suggests that God gave it as a command to Abraham to tithe as He did with circumcision.

The “God Does Not Change” Line of reasoning
Some others say that since God does not change the tithing He instituted still stands for today. But is this really so? While it is true God does not change, it is a poor argument to use on behalf of continuing the tithe. It is true that God does not change but first, what does that mean? Does it mean once he institutes a system he is not at liberty to change it or that his NATURE is unchanging? Secondly, if the reasoning that “God Does Not Change” is a valid basis to keep one part of the Law – the tithe – then it is a valid reason to keep ALL of the law ( see Galatians 5:3 ). Then we should have Burnt offerings and sacrifices on the altar of every church! Even tithing of money is totally alien to Scripture so then we should not tithe money. Why should anyone use that argument to justify keeping only ONE aspect of the Law.
When God set up the LEVITICAL PRIESTHOOD He set aside the previously existing system of family priesthood: So God can change a system. When the Levitical Priesthood was instituted EVEN A KING could not take up the priestly function as we find in Uzziah’s case in 2 Chronicles 26: 16 – 23. It was that serious to God.
Believers are now under the New Covenant of Grace, and are subject neither to pre-law customs, such as in Abraham’s day, nor the ordinances of Mosaic Law. Those dispensations are past. Only deceitful preachers still claim we’re under at least ONE of the 613 laws of Moses! Why the focus on ONE of the laws without clear explanation as to how that one law still stands and the rest have become obsolete (since none of the rest is pushed by them as they do tithing)?


Rebuke of the Scribes and Pharisees case
Jesus reprimanded the Scribes and Pharisees for painstakingly giving a “tithe/tenth” of their “mint, dill and cumin”, while disregarding the more important matters of the law: “justice, mercy, faithfulness (Matthew 23:23).

Once again, there are several problems with using this scripture to support the tithe as applicable to Christians today.
• Giving a different interpretation of “mint, dill, and cumin” (food items) to mean “money”. Why convert food items as tithe to money as tithe?
• Jesus was speaking directly to the Scribes and Pharisees – who are Jews – under the Mosaic Law – and obligated by the Law to tithe. Jesus was NOT talking to Gentiles (non-Jews).
• Jesus makes it clear that the "tithe" is a "matter of the law". Since Christians who are “In Christ” have fulfilled the law in Him (Colossians 2:8-23) the Law is NO LONGER applicable to Christians.


On the issue of the threat of death and hell
Many of the WoF preachers in Nigeria have used this threat approach to coerce their hearers or readers to pay tithe. Name ANY of the famous names in the Word of faith movement worldwide or here in Nigerian and you see those who use this ‘guerrilla’ tactic to pressure Christians to pay tithe. They put believers on guilt-trip even where the Scripture says they have been called into freedom.
If the Christian were still required to obey any portion of the law for him to avoid death or hell, then the death of Jesus on the cross did not pay the full price for sin. In that case we cannot say ‘Jesus paid it ALL!’ But it should be clear to any Christian that our salvation depends on faith alone in Christ alone and not upon the observance of any law. Why therefore any minister will teach anything in the law as the spiritual life for the church makes one wonder whether these are ministers of the New Covenant or of something else. Yet Paul clearly stated in Galatians 3: 10 – “For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse …” (SO WHO IS REALLY UNDER A CURSE ACCORDING TO THE NEW COVENANT?) Galatians 3:11 – “Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for “The righteous shall live by faith” So again the question is: ‘If refusal to do tithing will take one to hell what does that say of Jesus’ death on the cross?’

How come no tithe preacher does Acts 2:44, 45 and Acts 4:35?
Here the Bible says “And all who believe were together and had all things in common. And they were selling their possessions and belongings and DISTRIBUTING THE PROCEEDS TO ALL, AS ANY HAD NEED”(Acts 2:44,45); “And laid it at the apostles’ feet, AND IT WAS DISTRIBUTED TO EACH AS ANY HAD NEED” (Acts 4:35”
We see that whatever was received by the church was shared with all, at least those who clearly had needs. But no tithe preacher today does this; rather he would be the one to determine how to use it for ‘ministry work’ which almost always excludes the believers who are right there with him in the local church.
Many prosperity preachers present the idea that ministry requires physical structures - vehicles, buildings, equipments, etc. Maybe, but those items and ministry are not the same. Those items do not accomplish ministry - people accomplish ministry. In fact, the church did not have physical structures until hundreds of years after it began. The reality is that if each believer in any congregation is equipped to do ‘ministry’ work through the taking in of sound doctrine more results will come to such a local assembly than ‘organized’ programmes.
How come no preacher of tithing emphasizes the fact that church age believers are all ROYAL PRIESTS and so are equally qualified to share in or receive of the tithes that come into the church? After all, is we are to apply the OLD TESTAMENT setting it was ONLY the priests and Levites that received tithe, therefore Christians as God’s royal priests today should ALL share in the tithes.

What the Law demands
For those who choose the route of keeping the law, of which tithing is a part, God’s requirement for getting a pass mark is 100% adherence to ALL the requirements of the law. This was the point James 2: 10 makes clear – “For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become accountable for all of it”. The Law required strict adherence to ALL its tenets. Whoever keeps most of the law but fails in one point has become accountable for all of it. So, failing in one point, as far as the law was concerned, means breaking ALL of it! Therefore any Christian today who keeps one or two aspects of the law such as tithing and thinks he is accepted by God on that basis is making a big mistake. So if you tithe, you are obligated to keep the whole law. That is what the Bible says. Maybe you can now begin to see the seriousness of this matter!

No Apostle wrote the church to tithe
Apostle Paul, the writer of the book of Hebrews, Apostles Peter, James and John all wrote to church age believers, yet not one of them wrote on this issue of tithing that many today claim will be of great “blessings” to the Christian who practices it or some others say can be a “curse” that could take the Christian to hell when not done. How did they ever come to miss out on this so “important” matter?

The plain truth is that all that is truly critical or important for the Christian way of life has been given to us in the writings of these apostles. On the other hand anything not given to us by these men but propagated today as critical to the Christian’s spiritual life is man-made and will be wood, hay and stubble at the evaluation throne of Christ.

The Christian stands on a better footing today
The giving of money by the Christian is part of his worship of God. In giving then, the Christian is expected to stand upon the grace relationship he has with God (2 Cor. 8:1, 7) not on any forced system.

The guideline for Christian giving to God today is found in 2 Corinthians 9:6-7: "Now this I say, he who sows sparingly shall also reap sparingly; and he who sows bountifully shall also reap bountifully. Let each one do just as he has purposed in his heart; not grudgingly or under compulsion; for God loves a cheerful giver."

Those principles in the law still required for today are certainly found in the New Testament epistles. And in the epistles we find that tithing, like Sabbath observance and animal sacrifices, is never imposed on the believer. To the extent that tithing IS NOT PRESCRIBED ANYWHERE IN THE NEW TESTAMENT EPISTLES we can safely say that it is no longer compulsory for the Christian today.

To insist that the Christian (not the Jew or Israel) is required to pay tithe today when no portion of the Bible states so is a great perversion of scripture. To seek through all kinds of gimmicks to force the believer to do that which God himself has not stated is nothing but downright EVIL.

I REST MY CASE ON F8, FOR NOW.

[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F8:TITHING [/size]


^{When an old Covenant command,
lines our pockets, it's hard to let it go}

INTRODUCTION

Tithing and it's biblical background:
- Abram is the first, recorded to have tithed in the bible.
- Abram tithed on spoils of war (i.e. Genesis 14:18-20)
- Jacob was second, he promised a one-off tithe if he returns to his father's house in peace (i.e. Genesis 28:20-22)
- Both Abram and Jacob did not tithe any more or after these first and second tithe incidents in the bible.
- God instituted tithing for the Israelites (i.e. God commanded it and for the Israelites it became a law or ordinance)
- Abram and Jacob's tithes were both not commanded by God and also were done before the law or ordinance.
- Abram and Jacob's tithes were both voluntary tithes unlike the Israelites' tithe commanded by God which was obligatory
- God did not demand tithes from Abram and Jacob, He however did demand tithes from the Israelites

Does God change?
- No, God does not change but He does change things from time to time.
- God, for example, changed who were originally going to be the priests in Israel
- God's original plan was that the firstborn son of each household of the Israelites will inherit the priest's office
(Refer to Exodus 13:2, Exodus 19:5-6 for details)
- That original plan changed and got switched to a hereditary priesthood via Aaron with his offspring (Refer to Exodus 28:1 for details)
and further replaced the original plan with the Levites (Refer to Numbers 3:12, 45 for details)
(note all priests were Levites but not all Levites were priests)
- The Levites got the replacement honour based on not partaking in the incident
where the Israelites had that crazy wild night partying and committed idolatry with the Golden Calf
and also for how they ruthlessly dealt with the partied Israelites at Moses' command (i.e. Exodus 32:25-29)
- The Levites apart from been on the Lord's side, probably sided with Moses' because Moses himself too, was a Levi just like they were
(refer to Exodus 2:1-2,10 for details).

"Today you have ordained yourselves for the service of The Lord,
each one at the cost of his son and of his brother,
that he may bestow a blessing upon you this day."
- Exodus 32:29

- That Exodus 32:29 verse above is where Moses was commissioning the Levites into the service of the Lord.

What is tithing (i.e. or a tithe)
- Fundamentally, tithing is 1/10th or a tenth of anything or something
- It could be monetary, it is a tenth of anything.
- Tithing and biblical tithing are not synonymous (i.e. they are not necessarily the same)
- Biblical tithing is specific about and/or over what the 1/10th should on or a tenth should be over.

It is hoped that after all the submissions on F8: TITHING, we all (i.e. posters and readers) would have learned a thing or two, would have become wiser and after:

- able to ask: What of tithing in the bible, what is it? What according to scripture, is biblical tithing?
- able to see: Who tithed
- able to ask: Is tithed given or paid?
- able to ask: What is law?
- able to ask: Does Malachi 3 apply to believers?
- able to ask: Whom was tithed to?
- able to ask: Who was tithe for?
- able to ask: Who were the Priests and Levites?
- able to ask: Why was tithe given?
- able to ask: When was tithe given?
- able to ask: Where was tithe given and where was it stored?
- able to ask: What is "storehouse tithing" and Malachi 3:10 about?
- able to ask: How was tithe given?
- able to ask: Where tithe went, What tithe was for or How tithe was used?
- able to ask: Where tithe was given?
- able to ask: What was tithe given on?
- able to ask: Why was tithing based on agricultural produce and not monetary income?
- able to ask: Who was Malachi 3:8-10 referring to and/or talking about?
- able to ask: What are the types of tithes?
- able to ask: What was tithing given on in Matthew 23:23?
- able to ask: Why did Jesus have to mention food seasonings in the latter part of this Matthew 23:23 then?
- able to ask: Was Jesus condoning and congratulating the Pharisees in Matthew 23:23?

- able to ask: Why does WoF ask for tithe?
- able to ask: Why do WoF receive tithes of money?
- able to ask: How does WoF teach tithing?
- able to ask: Does WoF teach the biblical tithing? (e.g. the aspects of eating tithe or giving it to anybody)
- able to ask: What about Matthew 5:17, WoF uses this verse to claim that tithing was not abrogated?
- able to ask: Should one follow tithing according to WoF's teaching?

- able to ask: What happened to the Temple, the storehouse(s), the Levites?
- able to ask: What happened to the Temple priests?
- able to ask: What happens now, that tithing is no more?
- and finally able to ask: Can tithing be used as a benchmark for training for how to start giving freely?

Continued at:
https://www.nairaland.com/1790500/word-faith-movements-doctrine-proponents/7#25062857

BabaGnoni: ACCIDENTAL POSTING | EDITING IN PROGRESS | ACCIDENTAL POSTING

[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F8:TITHING [/size]



INTRODUCTION

Tithing and it's biblical background:
- Abram is the first recorded to have tithed in the bible.
- Abram tithed on spoils of war (i.e. Genesis 14:18-20)
- Jacob was second, he promised a one-off tithe if he returns to his father's house in peace (i.e. Genesis 28:20-22)
- Both Abram and Jacob did not tithe any more or after those
- God instituted tithing for the Israelites (i.e. God commanded it and for the Israelites it became a law or ordinance)
- Abram and Jacob's tithes were both not commanded by God and also were done before the law or ordinance.
- Abram and Jacob's tithes were both voluntary tithes unlike the Israelites' tithe commanded by God which was obligatory
- God did not demand tithes from Abram and Jacob, He however did demand tithes from the Israelites

Does God change?
- No, God does not change but He does change things from time to time.
- God changed who were originally going to be the priests
- God's original plan was that the firstborn son of each household will inherit the priest's office (Refer to Exodus 13:2 for details)
That got changed and switched to a hereditary priesthood via Aaron with his offspring (Refer to Exodus 28:1 for details)
and further replaced with the Levites (Refer to Numbers 3:12, 45 for details)
(note all priests were Levites but not all Levites were priests)
- The Levites got the replacement honour based on not partaking in the incident
where the Israelites had that crazy wild night partying and committed idolatry with the Golden Calf
and also for how they ruthlessly dealt with the partied Israelites at Moses' command (i.e. Exodus 32:25-29)
- The Levites apart from been on the Lord's side, probably sided Moses' because Moses himself too was a Levi just like they were (i.e. Exodus 2:1-2,10).

"Today you have ordained yourselves for the service of The Lord,
each one at the cost of his son and of his brother,
that he may bestow a blessing upon you this day."
- Exodus 32:29


What is tithing (i.e. or a tithe)
- Fundamentally, tithing is 1/10th or a tenth of anything or something
- It could be monetary, it is a tenth of anything.
- Tithing and biblical tithing are not synonymous (i.e. they are not necessarily the same)

ACCIDENTAL POSTING | EDITING IN PROGRESS | ACCIDENTAL POSTING

i'm loving this, though it'saccidental sha, whatever that means.

Image123:

i'm loving this, though it's accidental sha, whatever that means.

"accidental" as in unintentionally publishing the post.
The unfinished post got published after a fat finger hit the submit key at the wrong time
- similar to a mopol accidentally discharging a weapon

BabaGnoni:
"accidental" as in unintentionally publishing the post.
The unfinished post got published after a fat finger hit the submit key at the wrong time
- similar to a mopol accidentally discharging a weapon

^

BabaGnoni:
"accidental" as in unintentionally publishing the post.
The unfinished post got published after a fat finger hit the submit key at the wrong time
- similar to a mopol accidentally discharging a weapon

lol.

It happens when you have children in the house, who must show that they can out do Daddy on the internet.

BabaGnoni:
"accidental" as in unintentionally publishing the post.
The unfinished post got published after a fat finger hit the submit key at the wrong time
- similar to a mopol accidentally discharging a weapon

Hahahaha, one would need a PhD to defend the antitithe arguments sanely. Those ya questions na law.

By the time BabaGnoni finishes all those outline, ground so shake o. Ol boy, you go fear step-by-step teaching naw.

Goshen360: By the time BabaGnoni finishes all those outline, ground so shake o. Ol boy, you go fear step-by-step teaching naw.

Yes oh! I for see all the tithe merchants scampering out of this thread when the fire works starts

Image123:

Hahahaha, one would need a PhD to defend the antitithe arguments sanely. Those ya questions na law.

On the contrary it is you people that need more than a PhD to defend your daft, fraudulent, manipulative, shallow, twisted and baseless tithe doctrines that has know basis in scripture.

Started from: https://www.nairaland.com/1790500/word-faith-movements-doctrine-proponents/7#25034517

[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F8:TITHING PART I[/size]

What of tithing in the bible, what is it? What according to scripture, is biblical tithing?
- Biblical tithing, as commanded to the Israelites by God and how specified in the bible is this:
• one tenth of the annual produce from the land
• It is of the one tenth of the annual produce of seed of the land or the fruit of the tree and the herd and the flock.

³⁰“One tenth of the produce of the land,
whether grain from the fields or fruit from the trees,
belongs to the Lord and must be set apart to him as holy.….
³²Count off every tenth animal from your herds and flocks and set them apart for the Lord as holy
- Leviticus 27:30, 32 NLT

• Biblical tithing is never a tenth part of one's annual financial/monetary income
- Biblical tithing commanded by God, only involves money when the tither is far from the storehouses in the Levitical cities

Who tithed?
- All the Israelites tithed, priests however are exemptions (Note all priests are Levites, but not all Levites are priests)
- If one did not have these one did not tithe of them.
- Did Israelites carpenters tithe? No, carpenters would not tithe
- What of a fisherman, would he tithe? No, fishermen don't herd nor have flock, so wouldn't tithe
- Did all the Israelites tithe? No, not every or all Israelites tithed
(e.g. the priests by exemptions and Jesus did not tithe; Jesus because of the nature of His occupation as a carpenter)
- Abram or Jacob (i.e. Israel) too did not perform a biblical tithe,
as the tithing they carried out, was not the biblical tithe commanded by God nor given to a Levi.

Is tithed given or paid?
- There is a difference between given and paid
(i.e. given as with transferring the possession of something and paid as with paid in money)
- One is the biblical way of tithing, the other is the WoF way of tithing.
- Tithe is given and not paid (i.e. biblical tithing is given and not paid with or paid in money)
- Tithe was not about money, so the issue of paying does not come into the picture
(i.e. paying in or with money goes against the law/ordinance/specification given by God)
- *** Remember to provide more examples on this (e.g. when far away from the Levitical cities etc etc)
- God's commanded biblical tithing instructs to give tithing to the Levites
(i.e. only members of the tribe of Levi are to receive the biblical tithes)

What is law?
- Law is an ordinance
- Ordinance is an authoritative order, a command, a directive etc.
- Law and ordinance means the same thing. They are interchangeable
- Examples are ordinances are:
Where God commanded Abram or the Israelites to circumcise (i.e. Genesis 17:12, Leviticus 12:3)
or where God commanded the Israelites to tithe (i.e. Leviticus 27:30)
*** Mention scriptures commanding this

Does Malachi 3 apply to believers?
- No, Malachi 3 doesn't apply to believers.
- Malachi 3 has to do with the Israelites, particularly the Levites
- Also whatever is in Malachi 3 is now irrelevant,
as the tithing thereof is an ordinance rendered null and void by what Jesus did at the Cross on Calvary
- Tithing along with circumcision, are stale and past their sell-by and use-by dates
- Tithing along with circumcision, no more have any spiritual potencies or connotations attached to them.
- Tithing along with circumcision, are now just a carnal and self-benefiting exercise lacking any sort of spiritual pay off whatsoever.
- Why? OK, let's start with reading self-explanatory Malachi 3:7 and then compare with self-explanatory Colossians 2:14, to know why

“Even from the days of your fathers
ye are gone away from mine ORDINANCES,
and have not kept them.
Return unto me, and I will return unto you, saith the LORD of hosts.
But ye said, Wherein shall we return?”
- Malachi 3:7 KJV

“Blotting out the handwriting of ORDINANCES
that was against us, which was contrary to us,
and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;”
- Colossians 2:14 KJV

Whom was tithed to?
- The Levites and priests (i.e. tithe was primarily given to the Levites and the priests)
- Note verse 28 below:

²⁵The Lord said to Moses,
²⁶“Speak to the Levites and say to them:
‘When you receive from the Israelites the tithe I give you as your inheritance,
you must present a tenth of that tithe as the Lord’s offering.
²⁷Your offering will be reckoned to you as grain from the threshing floor or juice from the winepress.
²⁸In this way you also will present an offering to the Lord from all the tithes you receive from the Israelites.
From these tithes you must give the Lord’s portion to Aaron the priest.
²⁹You must present as the Lord’s portion the best and holiest part of everything given to you.’
³⁰“Say to the Levites:
‘When you present the best part, it will be reckoned to you as the product of the threshing floor or the winepress.
³¹You and your households may eat the rest of it anywhere, for it is your wages for your work at the tent of meeting.
³²By presenting the best part of it you will not be guilty in this matter;
then you will not defile the holy offerings of the Israelites, and you will not die.’?”
- Numbers 18:25-32 NIV

Who was tithe for?
- The tithes were for God, Who however gave the tithes up or passed them on to the Levites and the priests
- This to support the Levitical priesthood, as the Levites had no inheritance in the land like the rest of the Israelites had

Who were the Priests and Levites?
- All priests were Levites but not all Levites were priests
- The priests originally were Aaron, Nadab and Abihu, Eleazar and Ithamar (Refer to Exodus 28:1 and Numbers 3:2-4 for details)
- The Levites are the descendants of Levi, who had 3 sons, namely Gershon, Kohath and Merari

- For the service and work of God, the Levites were organized into 3 levels of service based on the Levi family tree (Refer to Numbers 3:6-10)
- The first level of service formed the priesthood, was composed of Aaron and his offspring (Refer to Numbers 3:10 for details)
- Aaron and his sons were descendants of Levi's son, Kohath
(i.e. Aaron's his first sons, Nadab and Abihu were consumed by fire, the other two were Eleazar and Ithamar)
- The second level is formed for those to be in charge of the most sacred parts of the Tabernacle
They are the remaining descendants of Kohath who were not descendants of Aaron (Refer to: Numbers 3:27-32, 4:4-15, 7:9 for details)
- The third level is formed for the lesser duties of service
it comprised of all of the descendants of Gershon and Merari (Refer to: Numbers 3:18,20-26,33-37 for details)

Why was tithe given?
- It was given because God laid claim to all firstborns after the Passover that killed the firstborns in Egypt but spared the Israelites
- God declared that the Levites should have all the tenth of the land as an inheritance
the priests however had nothing (i.e. no inheritance or property ownership like the rest of the Israelites had)

²⁰ And the LORD spake unto Aaron,
Thou shalt have no inheritance in their land, neither shalt thou have any part among them:
I am thy part and thine inheritance among the children of Israel
²¹ And, behold, I have given the children of Levi all the tenth in Israel for an inheritance,
for their service which they serve, even the service of the tabernacle of the congregation.
²² From now on the Israelites must not go near the tent of meeting, or they will bear the consequences of their sin and will die.
²³ It is the Levites who are to do the work at the tent of meeting and bear the responsibility for any offenses they commit against it.
This is a lasting ordinance for the generations to come. They will receive no inheritance among the Israelites.
²⁴ Instead, I give to the Levites as their inheritance the tithes that the Israelites present as an offering to the Lord.
That is why I said concerning them: ‘They will have no inheritance among the Israelites.”
- Numbers 18:20-24 KJV
- As seen above, Aaron was categorically informed he would have no inheritance among the Israelites, as God was his share and inheritance

When was tithe given?
- The Levitical tithe, the Festival tithe and the Priest's tithes were all given at the end of the year (i.e. Deu 14:22)
(i.e. it is an annual exercise on agricultural produce)
- The Poor tithe was given every third and sixth year of a 7-year tithing cycle
You shall truly tithe all the increase of your seed, that the field brings forth year by year.
- Deuteronomy 14:22

Where was tithe given and where was it stored?
- Since it is an annual exercise, it was given at the temple at Jerusalem but mostly at storehouses in designated Levitical cities
- the Levites and priests kept or stored some tithes in the Temple
however tithes mostly are stored in Levitical cities' storehouses for use as needed or for future use
- Storehouses in the Temple are rare,
the exception is in 2 Chronicles 31:11 when King Hezekiah gave orders to prepare storerooms in the temple to hold the tithe
- Storerooms are meant to keep tithes for the priests, whilst storehouses is for the Levites.

Also, we have drawn lots to decide who should bring the best of our coarse flour,
contributions, fruit from every tree, new wine, and olive oil to the priests, to the storerooms.
We will bring for the Levites one-tenth of the produce from our fields,
because the Levites are the ones who collect one-tenth of the produce from all our farm communities.
- Nehemiah 10:37 GOD'S WORD® Translation

¹¹ Hezekiah gave orders to prepare storerooms in the temple of the Lord, and this was done.
¹² Then they faithfully brought in the contributions, tithes and dedicated gifts.
Konaniah, a Levite, was the overseer in charge of these things,
and his brother Shimei was next in rank.
- 2 Chronicles 31:11-12 NIV

What is "storehouse tithing" and Malachi 3:10 about?
- "Storehouse tithing" is a 18th century to the present teaching invention to fleece believers
- "Storehouse tithing" is a tradition of man concocted in 1895, to revive the done away with abrogated age-long biblical tithing
- It is based on errors and lies for obtaining money by deception (i.e. obtaining pecuniary advantage by deception)
- The next three Mark 7:9 translations articulates very well the whole essence of "storehouse tithing"

And he continued,
"You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe your own traditions!
- Mark 7:9 NIV

Then he said,
"You skillfully sidestep God's law in order to hold on to your own tradition.
- Mark 7:9 NLT

And he said to them,
“You have a fine way of rejecting the commandment of God in order to establish your tradition!
Mark 7:9 English Standard Version

- Deuteronomy 14:28 and Malachi 3:10 are about warehouses, it is similar to what Joseph built in Egypt & used for storing the tithes received
- There is no way, the Temple in Jerusalem could house all the tithes received by the Levites
so the tithes were usually received by them and kept in storehouses at dotted or designated cities (i.e. Levitical cities) in Israel

Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse,
that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts,
if I will not open you the windows of heaven,
and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.
- Malachi 3:10 KJ Bible

At the end of every three years, bring all the tithes of that year’s produce and store it in your towns,
- Deuteronomy 14:28 NIV
*** Now explain here what Malachi 3:10 is about (i.e. that it is about the Levites, over what is due the Priests)

How was tithe given?
- The tithes were primarily given to the Levites (i.e. it is the Levites who received the tithes from the Israelites)

Where tithe went, What tithe was for or How tithe was used?
- Tithes went to the storehouses dotted all over Israel's Levitical cities
- The tithes for the priests went to Temple's storeroom
- On one occasion the tithes went directly to the Temple
- Tithes were given to the Levites to be used for their feeding.
- Tithes was for eating by the tither
and also for the tither every 3rd year, to eat and share with the Levites, the stranger(s), and the fatherless, and the widow(s)

"Every third year you must offer a special tithe of your crops.
In this year of the special tithe you must give your tithes
to the Levites, foreigners, orphans, and widows,
so that they will have enough to eat in your towns".
- Deuteronomy 26:12 NLT

[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F8:TITHING Contd PART II[/size]

Where tithe was given?
- The tithe were given at storehouses at dotted or designated cities (i.e. Levitical cities) in Israel
- Occasionally, it was given at the Temple (i.e. this was the period when the records on tithing procedure went missing)

What was tithe given on?
- It was given solely and strictly on agro-based or agricultural produce, nothing else, as earlier mentioned

Why was tithing based on agricultural produce and not monetary income?
- God had a reason for specifying that tithing be done in this form or manner
*** Remember to mention the 3 major reasons with their verses
(e.g. guard against self made thinking fear of God, for the temple sacrifices, Levites and priests have no inheritances)

Who was Malachi 3:8-10 referring to and/or talking about?

⁸“Should people cheat God? Yet you have cheated me!
“But you ask, ‘What do you mean? When did we ever cheat you?’
“You have cheated me of the tithes and offerings due to me.
⁹You are under a curse, for your whole nation has been cheating me.
¹⁰Bring all the tithes into the storehouse so there will be enough food in my Temple.
If you do,” says the Lord of Heaven’s Armies, “I will open the windows of heaven for you.
I will pour out a blessing so great you won’t have enough room to take it in!
Try it! Put me to the test!
- Malachi 3:8-10 NLT

- Malachi 3:8-10 is one of those bogeyman verses, WoF uses to scare the living daylights out of anyone not tithing
and also to make such quake in the boots with fear feeling that something bad will happen for not tithing
- Malachi 3:8-10 was addressed to and talking about the Levites
- the "people" in the verse, was referring to the Levites,
- The verse has God complaining of being cheated or robbed by the Levites, (i.e. Malachi 3:9) even the whole lot of them.
- Mind you Malachi 3:10, in it wasn't even about money, like WoF would lead most to believe
- The Israelites gave their agro-based tithes to the Levites
- The Levites, as ordained by God, in turn, were expected to give a tithe of the tithe received to the priests.
- The priests were to receive the best tenth of the Levites tithe
- Unfortunately this was not the case, the Levites greedily were not doing this,
hence God voiced out and complained about the Levites in Malachi 3:8-10
(Note: all priests were Levites, but not all Levites were priests)

"He will sit as a smelter and purifier of silver,
and He will purify the sons of Levi and refine them like gold and silver,
so that they may present to the LORD offerings in righteousness"
- Malachi 3:3

- Notice "...sons of Levi..." particularly in Malachi 3:3 above, to see that it was the Levites the whole of Malachi Chapter 3 was talking about
- So Malachi 3:8-10 is about the Levites, rebuking the Levites for withholding their tithes so thereby not providing for the priests who had no inheritance in the land
- WoF have twisted Malachi 3:8-10, changed the addressee in the verse, turned the verse around, diverting and pointing it at unsuspecting & uninformed individuals
- WoF conveniently refuse to properly and correctly teach the church the biblical truth of Malachi 3:10
and whom exactly Malachi 3:9 was addressing or talking about (i.e. it was the Levites and not the Israelites)
- WoF teaches a twisted Malachi 3:8-10 by changing the addressees in verse(s) to suit dark and greedy ulterior motives

What are the types of tithes?
- There are 5 types of tithes instituted by God for the Israelites.
- The five instituted types of tithes are:
• Levitical tithe

And, behold, I have given the children of Levi all the tenth in Israel for an inheritance,
for their service which they serve, even the service of the tabernacle of the congregation
- Numbers 18:21 NIV

• Festival tithe (i.e. Deuteronomy 14:22-27)
• Poor tithe (i.e. Deuteronomy 14:28-29)
• Priest's tithe (i.e. Numbers 18: 25-32)
• Redeem or Late tithe (i.e. Leviticus 27:19, 31)

Whoever would redeem any of their tithe must add a fifth of the value to it
- Leviticus 27:19 NIV

What was tithing given on in Matthew 23:23?
- Tithe was given on common household seasonings/spices for food
- They given on mint, anise and cummins, which are secondary/minor produce of the land

Why did Jesus have to mention food seasonings in the latter part of this Matthew 23:23 then?

"Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!
for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin,
and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith:
these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone."
- Matthew 23:23

- Jesus was hinting on the display and show of legalism (i.e. the ludicrous of tithing even on seasonings at the expense of noble gestures)
- The Pharisees were trying to follow the Biblical principle of tithing and tithing to the letter,
to tithe of all their increase, (i.e. note it is nothing about money)
- So the Pharisees made people tithe to the letter on crops grown for food including even the likes of cumin etc
(i.e. tithing of herbs too, probably looking after their bellies)
- Jesus' view on the legalism on display here and his response to it, is in the latter part of the verse
- In the passage, Jesus was comparing the Pharisees' tithing to the letter of the Law
with their lack of ability to make considered decisions or come to sensible conclusions,
with their lack of human compassion
and lastly with their lack of belief, as in their faith does not need to depend on logical proof, physical or material evidence)

Was Jesus condoning and congratulating the Pharisees in Matthew 23:23?
- No Jesus was not condoning or congratulating them, He actually was condemning them
and expressing a very strong disapproval of the tithing set up
- Woe implies wishing someone a stroke of bad luck, affliction, setbacks, failure, misadventure, disaster etc.
- Woe means wishing someone problems, difficulties, trouble etc
- Hypocrites implies deceivers, imposters, pretenders etc
- Hypocrite means a person who pretends to have principles, virtues etc (e.g. moral or religious beliefs) that such person does not actually possess

Why does WoF ask for tithe?
- WoF asks for tithes because it ignores the power of the Cross,
WoF does not believe in the power of the Cross
- WoF believes that "the cross has no salvation in it. It is a place of failure and defeat"
and so still living in the past, living before the Cross.
- The true tithing (i.e. biblical tithing) was part of the ordinances Jesus did away with for us on the Cross.
- The tithing WoF asks for or demands is un-biblical, a sham and a fraud

Why do WoF receive tithes of money?
- WoF receives tithes of money because WoF ignores and/or rejects the definition of the "biblical tithe"
- What WoF receives is un-biblical, a sham, and a fraud because the biblical tithe was always agro-based
and not is income or money based as WoF suggests it to be.
- Money only comes into the picture when one is far from the Temple or the Levitical cities for receiving the tithes
In the OT, it was always food and came from farmers and herders.
If they could not carry the food, they were told to sell it travel to the temple,
and then use the money to buy a food tithe. As for spices, I think that was a comment on legalism.
Spice is not really food per se, but the Pharisees were so legalistic they even tithed 10% of their spices too
- but still had other spiritual problems apart from the law.

How does WoF teach tithing?:
- WoF teaches that one pays tithe to the WoF preacher or WoF movement
- WoF categorically teaches that one does not give tithe
(Note, WoF means, one PAYS as in only with money and DOES NOT GIVES as with does not offer anything else apart from money)

Does WoF teach the biblical tithing? (e.g. in areas or the aspects of eating tithe or giving it to anybody)
- WoF does not teach the biblical tithing, and especially not the Deuteronomy 14:23 aspect or the possibilities of eating tithe
(i.e. eat tithe with one's household)
- WoF does not teach the aspect of giving/sharing the tithe with someone else
(i.e. every 3rd year with the Levites, the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow)
- Mind you tithing is abrogated, however WoF though, still practices and teaches tithing,
- WoF is silent on Deuteronomy 12:6-7 & 14:22-29's guidelines for tithe etiquette and rules of conduct,

⁶And thither ye shall bring your burnt offerings, and your sacrifices, and your tithes,
and heave offerings of your hand, and your vows, and your freewill offerings,
and the firstlings of your herds and of your flocks:
⁷And there ye shall eat before the LORD your God,
and ye shall rejoice in all that ye put your hand unto,
ye and your households, wherein the LORD thy God hath blessed thee
- Deuteronomy 12:6-7 KJ Bible

²²“You must set aside a tithe of your crops—one-tenth of all the crops you harvest each year.
²³Bring this tithe to the designated place of worship
—the place the Lord your God chooses for his name to be honored
—and eat it there in his presence.
This applies to your tithes of grain, new wine, olive oil, and the firstborn males of your flocks and herds.
Doing this will teach you always to fear the Lord your God.
²⁴“Now when the Lord your God blesses you with a good harvest,
the place of worship he chooses for his name to be honored might be too far for you to bring the tithe.
²⁵If so, you may sell the tithe portion of your crops and herds,
put the money in a pouch, and go to the place the Lord your God has chosen.
²⁶When you arrive, you may use the money to buy any kind of food you want
—cattle, sheep, goats, wine, or other alcoholic drink.
Then feast there in the presence of the Lord your God and celebrate with your household.
²⁷And do not neglect the Levites in your town, for they will receive no allotment of land among you.
²⁸“At the end of every third year, bring the entire tithe of that year’s harvest and store it in the nearest town.
²⁹Give it to the Levites, who will receive no allotment of land among you,
as well as to the foreigners living among you, the orphans, and the widows in your towns, so they can eat and be satisfied.
Then the Lord your God will bless you in all your work.
- Deuteronomy 14:22-29 NLT

What about Matthew 5:17?, WoF uses this verse to claim that tithing was not abrogated

"Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets:
I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill."
- Matthew 5:17 KJV

"Do not for a moment suppose that I have come to abrogate the Law or the Prophets:
I have not come to abrogate them but to give them their completion.
- Matthew 5:17 Weymouth New Testament

- In Matthew 5:17, Jesus was not talking about the tithing law or referring to the tithing law/ordinance
- If He were, He will be contradicting Himself, because He never tithed and so unable to fulfil that law, even if He tried.
- Also if Jesus was talking of laws (i.e. tithing included) then that implies that all the 613 laws in the OT, are still in force & must be today, all followed too.
- Matthew 5:17 is irrelevant to tithing. Refer to Galatians 3:10 to see the absurdity of this stance
- WoF and anyone that quotes that Matthew 5:17, to justify tithing, is misrepresenting the truth, is ill-informed, ignorant or doing so to pull a scam.
- Focus has shifted from laws and/or the tablets of stone to the Cross and Christ
- We are liberated from the bondage of tithing to the freedom of freewill giving
- We are moved on from coerced stipulated and demanded giving to the ability to act and give at one's own discretion (i.e. John 1:17)

²³Yet a time is coming and has now comet when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth,
for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.
²⁴ God is spirit,v and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”
- John 4:23–24 NIV

- Matthew 5:17 is actually saying, He is not come to stop the Law and prophecies pointing at Him
and maintaining that none of the old ways of doing things will not pass from the Law before everything said about Him has come to pass or true
- Finally on Matthew 5:17, watch 5:18 closely and note the following words "...not ...disappear ... until everything is accomplished" in it

For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear,
not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen,
will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.
- Matthew 5:18

- Tithing disappeared that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom,
when Jesus accomplished everything on the Cross at Calvary (i.e. Matthew 27:51, Mark 15:38, Luke 23:45)
- All the prophecies about Jesus came true at the Cross, and thereby struck tithing off the Law.
- WoF do not believe in the power of the Cross anyway, so no surprises there, that WoF holds on to tithing and teaches it.

Should one follow tithing according to WoF teaching?
- One in order to discover the suppressed truth about this, will need to study the word and seek God's counsel so that there are no more hidden lies.
- The biblical tithing set-up was instituted to provide for the support and nourishment of the Levites;
support & nourishment in the sense of food, drink, warmth etc for the body
- The biblical tithing was not introduced for the Levites to have personal/material/financial gain
- If the above, is how and why the biblical tithing was set up and introduced, then imagine what tithing according to WoF is

What happened to the Temple, the storehouse(s), the Levites?
- The Temple was destroyed
- Obviously if the Temple's gone, there wont be any storehouse(s)
- The Levites became redundant, same fate as the storehouse because the Temple was no more
- More importantly to note is that what Jesus and His blood did on the Cross
replaced what the Levites where doing yearly at the Temple.

What happened to the Temple priests?
- Same that happened to the Temple, the storehouse(s), the Levites.
- There are no more priests for a no more physical temple
- More importantly to note, is that we are the priests now,
all believers are back as priests and just as how God originally intended
- Recall God changed from making the Israelite a kingdom of priests (i.e. Exodus 19:5-6) to making only the Levites as workers and priests instead,
this was after the incident where the Israelites had that crazy wild night partying and committed idolatry with the Golden Calf.
- Note that priests in the biblical tithing God introduced were exempted from tithing
- Believers are the building, not WoF nor physical building)(s) that has come to be known as church(es)
(i.e. for more detail refer to: Revelation 3:12, Ephesians 2:20-22; Ephesians 4:12-16)

⁵ you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood,
offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
⁹ But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood,
a holy nation, God’s special possession,
that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light.
- 1 Peter 2:5,9 NIV

[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F8:TITHING Contd PART III[/size]

What happens now, that tithing is no more?
It is true that tithing is no more
as, tithing and it's law were nailed, dead on the Cross at Calvary by Jesus Christ (refer to Malachi 3:7 & Colossians 2:14 for details on this)
but lack of faith, revived it and the desperate love of money since then has kept it alive and going
Tithing is no more, means, one is free from obligatory or instituted giving
God unlike how He commanded tithing or circumcision for the Israelites, God has given same command to believers
As believers, one is somehow commanded differently though, commanded to give.
Having said commanded to give, not forced to give though but rather to give freely
To give freely as one purposes or thinks in one's own heart
and that's without any external or internal forcing, guidance, on how much to give or not to give

Each of you should give what you have decided in your heart to give,
not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver
- 2 Corinthians 9:7 NIV

- It is hard to cheerfully give, if forced to do the giving.
- Cheerfulness when giving will only be displayed, if one is free from a tithing law, stick and carrot forcing one to give.
- Reading that, there is no need to tithe might sound strange,
and it also might taste like too tough a meat for the teeth to bite on, talkless chewing.
- an awkward situation like this is easily understood, which is why verses like Isaiah 28:10 to learn from, comes in handy.
- One can start with giving nothing, then progress to a little freewill giving here and a little freewill giving there
- Over a period of short time of, a bit here and a bit there,
freewill giving, like a muscle exercised in workouts, becomes natural, spontaneous and easy
- This ultimately leads to performing or doing more freewill giving progressing to 100% or more.
(i.e. freewill giving, changes from Incapable, becoming Ability, and Ability turns into "Abinibi")

Can tithing be used as a benchmark for training for how to start giving freely?
- No it cannot be used because we are now operating in a new order of doing things
and so tithing or 1/10th should never be in the frame any more
- This is because there is no room for tithing or an ideal giving such as a tenth, in this revised way of giving.
- One just starts giving as much as one can, as much as one can afford, or as much as one can do without.
- The giving doesn't not have to be consistent
- It doesn't have to be the same amount, it doesn't have to be at regular intervals
- We are not told least amounts or how much to be giving or start giving with
- We are told SIMPLY to give, and to give as one determines in one's heart
and if it so happens, one determines nothing, then fair enough, no qualms.
- It would not be held against one.
- All God wants is a cheerful giver and this is what WoF ought to be teaching
- We are in a time that tithing does not apply any more, no more, especially in this new order, way of doing things (i.e. Hebrews 9:10)

⁹This is an illustration for the present time,
indicating that the gifts and sacrifices being offered were not able to clear the conscience of the worshiper.
¹⁰They are only a matter of food and drink and various ceremonial washings
—external regulations applying until the time of the new order.
- Hebrews 9:9-10 NIV

So one does not need to tithe then?
Well spotted. Of course, yes, one does not need to tithe.
In fact, one is not even allowed to tithe, not any more, period.
Just like the priests do not and did not tithe
so, one is exempted from tithing.
We are back to how it originally was planned, to all be priests.
We have cycled back to how it originally was meant to be
One is not like before any more.
One is called out of the bondage & darkness into God's freedom & wonderful light
One, now, is royal, chosen to serve as Priests for The Kingdom
And this is closing with 1 Peter 2:9
and the icing on the cake, which is: PRIESTS DON'T TITHE

But you are not like that, for you are a chosen people.
You are royal priests, a holy nation, God's very own possession.
As a result, you can show others the goodness of God,
for he called you out of the darkness into his wonderful light.
- 1 Peter 2:9 NLT

ADDENDUM:
¹⁰Samuel told all the words of the Lord to the people who were asking him for a king.
¹¹He said, “This is what the king who will reign over you will claim as his rights:
He will take your sons and make them serve with his chariots and horses, and they will run in front of his chariots.
¹²Some he will assign to be commanders of thousands and commanders of fifties,
and others to plow his ground and reap his harvest, and still others to make weapons of war and equipment for his chariots.
¹³He will take your daughters to be perfumers and cooks and bakers.
¹⁴He will take the best of your fields and vineyards and olive groves and give them to his attendants.
¹⁵He will take a tenth of your grain and of your vintage and give it to his officials and attendants.
¹⁶Your male and female servants and the best of your cattle and donkeys he will take for his own use.
¹⁷He will take a tenth of your flocks, and you yourselves will become his slaves.
¹⁸When that day comes, you will cry out for relief from the king you have chosen,
but the Lord will not answer you in that day.”
¹⁹But the people refused to listen to Samuel. “No!” they said. “We want a king over us"
- 1 Samuel 8:10-19

Comparing with the above 1 Samuel 8:10-19 passage, 13 things, worth noting concerning WoF's tithing doctrine:
1) It is very obvious to spot similarities with a Ponzi scheme, where fraudulent investing scam promising high rates of return with little risk to investor is taught and promised
- WoF have devised their own form of tithing which is completely at variance to the biblical tithing commanded by God the Bible.
2) The tithing doctrine taught by WoF is not the same as the now defunct and obsolete Israelites tithing practice earlier commanded by God
3) WoF tithing is mimicking a tithing practice which is no longer functional or which as far as God is concerned, is no longer existing or operating.
4) WoF is teaching tithing which God no longer commands.
5) The truth is that, the king in 1 Samuel 8:10-11, is the head of whichever WoF movement teaching a defunct, obsolete and fake tithe doctrine
6) As a matter of fact, 1 Samuel 8:12-14 are the die-hard fans of the "king" and others in the higher echelons of the WoF movement.
The WoF disciples for their submissiveness are compensated with titles, positions, zonal posts etc
or enjoy perks and favours for their blindfolded admiration and loyalty to the "king and his cohort" or WoF cause
7) If truth really be told, 1 Samuel 8:15 & 17, is the ruse WoF is practising and what is used for extorting from unsuspecting and ill-informed investors believers
- It is not a God commanded or directed tithe in the real sense
but rather it is a one tenth tax just like demanded by the Israelite king in 1 Samuel 8:15
8.) Unfortunately, 1 Samuel 8:16-19, is a reality, where believers are abused, used or misused by the WoF tithing doctrine
but when warned, they refuse to listen. “No!” they say. “ Do not touch our sacred cow. We want the "tithing" over us"
9) WoF's tithing doctrine is a meal ticket and a faux-tithing set in place to fund the lavish lifestyle
10) WoF's tithing doctrine is nothing more than a 10 percent taxation masqueraded as tithing
11) Bonus here for those (e.g. hardcore tithers, die-hard tithers or pro-tithers) who think tithing is a do or die resolve:
Forget Matthew 23:23, and check out Luke 18:9-14 to see who was justified between a tithe-giving Pharisee and despised tax collector
12) ANYONE HOLDING on TO the VIEW of that there is a PRINCIPLE BEHIND TITHING,
CAN CLEARLY SEE IN Luke 18:14, that one is justified even without tithing,
and also evident in the verse, the other is not justified despite tithing.
- although tithing is now gone, there apparently, were things according to Luke 18:14, back then, more important than tithing.
13) Lastly, today, no Jew or any member of any synagogue in present day Israel or synagogues in the rest of the world
pays tithe in the biblical commanded manner or with money (i.e. tenth of income)
- they don't tithe, as they know it would be disobeying the law of God and a sin against God.
- There is no more Levitical order of Priests ministering at a Temple in Jerusalem today,
and so this makes it illegal to pay any form of biblical tithe to anyone else than the Levites.
- It was ONLY the Levites who were ordained by God to receive or accept tithe
- So today, any giver of tithe & any receiver of tithe (i.e. receiver, not of the commanded Levitical order) are both committing a grave offense to God
- WoF should not be teaching tithe, besides the fact of not even being qualified, in the first place, according to God's command, to receive biblical tithe.
- Peter, the Apostles, Paul and Jesus knew that to be eligible to receive tithe, one needs to be of the tribe of Levi
this is why none of them taught tithing after the Cross and since the Temple veil was torn
and besides, since Paul was of the tribe of Benjamin, Peter and Jesus of the tribe of Judah, the rest of the Apostles were not Levites
neither of them sought tithing nor encouraged or taught any to give tithe to them or anyone else for that matter.
- Peter and Paul, knew it is biblically improper to give and receive tithes
so they did not depend on it, rely on it or plan to use biblical tithe for the development and spread of the Gospel

On close, freewill giving done out of a willingness coming from the heart will ONLY be practiced by believers,
if good and unadulterated teachings, devoid of tithing, are given, in faith to them.
(i.e. faith as in the 3rd and last one, in Matt 23:23's more important aspects of the law--justice, mercy, and faith)

By informing the readers of the truth behind WoF tithing and uncovering how WoF teaches tithing,
the humble message of this post is two-fold:
Firstly, when an old covenant command, lines in the pocket of such like WoF, it is hard to let go
Secondly, the readership is hereby reassured, tithing has no place in believers' life after what happened on the Cross at Calvary

[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F8:TITHING [/size]
I REST MY CASE ON F8, FOR NOW
Started from:
https://www.nairaland.com/1790500/word-faith-movements-doctrine-proponents/7#25034517

Absolutely brilliant desertation from babagnoni on the tithing subject. I would be bookmarking this and using it for future teachings on the tithe subject matter.

MY SUBMISSION ON F8: TITHING

I have thought very deeply as to what exactly could be said about tithing that has not been said on this forum. At the risk of repetition I venture into making this contribution that will glean a bit from my experiences.

Having attended Roman Catholicism as a child, I knew next to nothing about tithing. Though RCC introduced tithing into Christendom, the last three popes have not emphasized it. RCC gets its funding mostly from its many business concerns that vary from schools to hospitals (Many of which are laudable ventures that provide for the poor in communities and that provide employment for citizens of those communities). They also have a means of levying wealthy members. And the fact that Rome remains the richest Christian organization in the world makes RCC never in short supply of funds. This might be one reason they do not emphasize tithing. I however learnt that it is very compulsory to pay your tithe as a faithful member of other orthodox churches. A friend told me that though his late father was faithful in tithing, to bury him the church screened all the financial books on him and the children balanced every kobo owed before he was committed to mother earth. This, unfortunately, is were WoF finds its inspiration on tithing and not the bible.

The difference between tithing in churches influenced by WoF and orthodox churches is that in the former the system of one man leadership is practiced; in the latter, however, a plurality of eldership is allowed. Where one man leads, the likelihood that financial decisions are made by him alone is high. This is made worse by the ostentatious lifestyles displayed by the "owners" of these churches. The stories of financial scandals that that trail these churches are simply to numerous to recount here. All of these happening while the faithfuls in these assemblies give their tithes, offerings and other financial commitments for the "work of ministry". While the orthodox churches do not have a sound biblical base for collecting tithes, the plurality of eldership allowed in their leadership and the strong commitment to accountability discourages financial abuse.

The sole aim of tithe collection in a church is simply for financial gain. History has shown that when the clergy refuse to work and a church begins to build up a bloated system that includes the employment of church staffs, erecting building, organizing of programs, owning of lands and property, that church will begin to place itself in a position of financial need that can only be met by calling members to tithing. This is how tithing started in the 8th century and that is how it was restored in modern times. However, when the Spirit returns with power, these ecclesiastic burden is usually by passed. Rather, God's people give themselves to prayer, the church building is no longer needed, the people give without inhibition, coercion or law, their is trust and what is given is used to support the poor, the weak and society's downtrodden. There is usually no need to support a clergy because everyone operates as a priest, the leaders themselves work and so the hegemony of the clergy is removed. This is what happened with the first gathering called the church in Acts 4 and it is what happens every time God moves with power among his people.

We are told by tithers that there is not one verse in the New Testament that taught that Christians are not obligated to tithe. We remind them that there is equally no verse that commands Christians to tithe. We are then left to soundly deduce Christian doctrines and practice from the overwhelming scriptural evidence staring us in the face:

1. Jesus Christ commended tithing under the law in Mathew 23:23, but clearly showed that Christian ministers should be supported by free will offerings in Luke 10:7-8.

2. Neither Jesus nor his apostles were recorded to have either received or given tithes.

3. The New Testament records many passages that encourages Christian giving (Luke 6; 1 Corinthians 9; 2 Corinthians 8-9; Phillipians 4, etc) not one of them mentioned tithing as a Christian obligation.

4. The New Testament showed us clearly that Christians were no longer under the Mosaic laws which would include tithing.

5. That if we must tithe we must then keep every other injunction of the law.

6. The Christian is called to imitate Abraham's faith and not Abraham one time act of tithing.

7. The act of free will giving was more in keeping with the spirit of the New Testament that was characterized by the spontaneous influence of the Holy Ghost in the believers mind than a religious adherence to tithing.

8. Colossians 2:16 lists religious feasts, New Moon and Sabbaths as obligations Christians are not to keep. Tithing will surely come under this since tithing is listed along with First fruits, New Moon and Sabbaths in Nehemiah 10:33-38.

9. Hebrew 7 mention tithes in the context of describing the greatness of the priesthood of Christ over that of Aaron.


The New Testament warns the Christian against covetousness and to watch out for false prophets that would make merchandize of the gospel (2 Corinthians 2:17; Philippians 3:19). We are told these false prophets will come in their numbers in the last days to defraud people of money (2 Peter 2:1-3). We are told that their trade mark will be to take advantage of God's people, while exercising autocratic control on them (2 Corinthians 11:20). Jesus warned us that we would have not a few of them in our time but MANY (Matthew 24:5). If in the light of all these scriptural admonitions, we have a cable TV station like Trinity Broadcasting Network (TBN) that has gained the notoriety as a platform where preachers come to beg for money while preaching compulsory tithing; and we discover that the underlying gospel that is taught on that station is wholesale Word of Faith, while their reach and influence has pervaded the majority of Christendom; shall we not conclude that we are in the days that Jesus and his apostles warned about? Shall we not conclude that Word of Faith is a doctrine of hell? Shall we not conclude that tithing is the means earmarked to merchandise this gospel around the world?

I leave my readers to make the obvious conclusions themselves.


[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F8: TITHING [/size]
I REST MY CASE ON F8

With all the stories and concocted lies on display, i just laugh knowing that the Word of God abides forever. Carefully crafted words have no say.

So then we will not be children any more. Clever people may try to make us believe things that are not true. They may teach different kinds of ideas, to confuse us. But we will not be like children, who are easy to confuse. We will not let those different ideas change what we believe.(the definition of APT).


Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

PastorKun: Absolutely brilliant desertation from babagnoni on the tithing subject.
... ...

I cannot agree any less with you PastorKun.

trustman:

I cannot agree any less with you PastorKun.

In fact... master presentation.

BabaGnoni:

Why does WoF ask for tithe?
- WoF asks for tithes because it ignores the power of the Cross,
WoF does not believe in the power of the Cross
- WoF believes that "the cross has no salvation in it. It is a place of failure and defeat"
and so still living in the past, living before the Cross.
- The true tithing (i.e. biblical tithing) was part of the ordinances Jesus did away with for us on the Cross.
- The tithing WoF asks for or demands is un-biblical, a sham and a fraud

[l

This is the core truth about WOF romance with tithes. They do not understand the cross. They misinterpret the cross. In the process they despise the cross and thus live as if there was no cross. Confusing grace with law. Living the Christian life as if there was no cross.

Very very good writing.

I am from Austria and 100 years ago Austria was a big empire the austrian hungary empire and I make a research about tithing in my country and we didnot have it since 1790 because the Austrian emperior closed all the monastery where the nuns and the monks didnot work and the money goes to a special account and from this account and with goverment money the priest where paid.
Since 1938 when Adolf Hitler come to Austria he start with the churchtax and we still have this tax until today and it is between 1,1% and 1,5% of the salary from a year when the salary is over 12 000 euro per year the same is in germany and in many other europa countries.

So it was the first time I hear from a student from Nigeria about the tithing, because this was at that time new for me.

Catholic Priest have to work as teacher for religion in the schools, they have also to work in prisions in my country! Monks and nuns also work as teachers, in hospitals........

nora544: Very very good writing.

I am from Austria and 100 years ago Austria was a big empire the austrian hungary empire and I make a research about tithing in my country and we didnot have it since 1790 because the Austrian emperior closed all the monastery where the nuns and the monks didnot work and the money goes to a special account and from this account and with goverment money the priest where paid.
Since 1938 when Adolf Hitler come to Austria he start with the churchtax and we still have this tax until today and it is between 1,1% and 1,5% of the salary from a year when the salary is over 12 000 euro per year the same is in germany and in many other europa countries.

So it was the first time I hear from a student from Nigeria about the tithing, because this was at that time new for me.

Catholic Priest have to work as teacher for religion in the schools, they have also to work in prisions in my country! Monks and nuns also work as teachers, in hospitals........

If government controls church finances, are they not likely to control the church also?

I know a bit about Hitler's influence on the church. In Germany there was the state church and the underground church. The likes of the theologians Karl Barths and Dietrich Bonhoeffer were leaders of the underground church. Bonhoeffer will later be implicated in a plot to kill Hitler, arrested and executed a few days to the end of the war.

My point is: if you are saying you still run a state church after the style of Hitler, are you sure ministers can speak truth to power as it should be?

I commend the idea of Christians ministers working. I am not sure it's something that can happen in Nigeria.

DrummaBoy:

If government controls church finances, are they not likely to control the church also?

I know a bit about Hitler's influence on the church. In Germany there was the state church and the underground church. The likes of the theologians Karl Barths and Dietrich Bonhoeffer were leaders of the underground church. Bonhoeffer will later be implicated in a plot to kill Hitler, arrested and executed a few days to the end of the war.

My point is: if you are saying you still run a state church after the style of Hitler, are you sure ministers can speak truth to power as it should be?

I commend the idea of Christians ministers working. I am not sure it's something that can happen in Nigeria.

That is tru but also some catholic priest lose their life during Hitler and I know from my grandmother and my father that the life was not easy for catholics.

The goverment give the catholic church the information about the salary you had last year and from this salary of last year you have to pay the churchtax, when you pay churchtax that will reduce the tax you have to pay to the goverment so normal working people get back what they pay for churchtax. The churchtax I have to pay to the churchaccount in my district. So the Goverment give only the information and the church has to look that their members pay the churchtax.

The church is free and can speak against the goverment, and they church is the speaker of the poor.

The priest have the right of free speach!!!!!

It is the same with the pastors from the lutheran church and the priest from the old catholics and the other christian churches we have in Austria.

Image123:

With all the stories and concocted lies on display,
i just laugh knowing that the Word of God abides forever.
Carefully crafted words have no say.

Image123:

So then we will not be children any more. Clever people may try to make us believe things that are not true.
They may teach different kinds of ideas, to confuse us.
But we will not be like children, who are easy to confuse.
We will not let those different ideas change what we believe.(the definition of APT).

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

The Old "British Bulldog Spirit" in the genes seems to be in action there
It may also have had some help from the DNA.

Whoever is wise, let him understand these things;
whoever is discerning, let him know them;
for the ways of the LORD are right, and the upright walk in them,
but transgressors stumble in them
- Hosea 14:9 ESV

But if you have bitter zeal, and there be contentions in your hearts;
glory not, and be not liars against the truth.
- James 3:14 Douay-Rheims Bible

anger and fury on those who, in selfish pride, refuse to believe the truth and who follow what is wrong.
- Romans 2:8 GOD'S WORD® Translation

Why the British bulldog spirit in Image123's genes?
Scientists believe they have discovered the gene which explains stubborn and bullheaded behaviour.
An estimated one-third of us has the gene mutation
which researchers say is nature's way of ensuring there are always some who "shall never surrender".
The team at the Max Planck Institute for Human Cognitive and Brain Sciences in Germany say such historical greats
as Image123 Lord Nelson, Sir Winston and suffragette leader Emily Pankhurst probably have had it.

^{Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-505786/Why-British-bulldog-spirit-genes.html#ixzz38u7q1efA}