tbaba1234:

You are correct that the Ruh can be used in different context but it is clear from the evidences we have stronger evidences to believe, it was Jubril mentioned as the Ruh in the Quran.

tbaba1234:

In the Quran Allah says:

Verily, this [Qur'an] is a revelation of the Lord of the Worlds brought down by the trustworthy ruh." (Surah al-Shu'ara; 26:192-193)

[s]This is an indication that the ruh is Jubril.

It is because of narrations and evidences like the above that the majority of scholars state that the ruh is Jubril.[/s]

tbaba1234:


Commentaries do not follow conjecture, they are usually based on evidences/hints from the sunnah or even the grammar from the text. There are some that make conjecture but most commentaries try to give a reason for their position.

tbaba1234:

In this case, there is evidence.
Hassan ibn Thabit (rd) in his poem says:

"Whether anyone amongst you (the Quraysh) chooses to satirise the Messenger of Allah, or praise him, or help him, it is all the same, And Gabriel who is the Emissary of Allah, is with us, and indeed the Ruh Al-Qudus has no match" (Sahih Muslim, The Book of Companions of the Prophet, 6550,)

tbaba1234:

In Surah Qadr, Allah talks about the Angels and the Ruh coming down.

Anas narrates that the prophet said:

"When the Night of Qadr comes, Jubril descends on the earth with a huge throng of angels and all of them pray for every servant of Allah, man or woman. busy in salah or dhikr to be blessed by Allah. (Mazhari)

tbaba1234:

More proof:

Al-Bukhari recorded `A'ishah saying that the Messenger of Allah erected a Minbar in the Masjid on which Hassan bin Thabit (the renowned poet) used to defend the Messenger of Allah (with his poems). The Messenger of Allah said, "O Allah! Aid Hassan with Ruh Al-Qudus, for he defended Your Prophet."(fn. Fath Al-Bari 10:562).

Abu Dawud recorded this Hadith in his Sunan (fn. Abu Dawud 5:279) as did At-Tirmidhi who graded it Hasan Sahih (fn. Tuhfat Al-Ahwadhi 8:137). Further, Ibn Hibban recorded in his Sahih that Ibn Mas`ud said that the Prophet said, "Ruh Al-Qudus informed me that no soul shall die until it finishes its set provisions and term limit. Therefore, have Taqwa of Allah and seek your sustenance in the most suitable way."(fn. See As-Sunnah 14:304).(Tafsir Ibn Kathir, Abridged, Darussalam Publishers & Distributors, 2000, vol. 1, pp. 288-289)

tbaba1234:

In Maariful Quran, a tafsir by Mufti Muhammad Shafi on Mariam's visit by the ruh:

[i]A majority of scholars hold the view that the Ruh is Jubril but some say it is sayyidna Eesa himself and that Allahh placed before Maryam , the likeness of her son. [s]But the former version (that it is Jubril) is more appropriate and is confirmed by the statement that follows[/s]:

"He took before her the form of a perfect human" (19:17)

Empiree:
Commentaries by early muslims are not absolute and binding. Quran is still here with us. Early muslims did their best. Dont just stick to their understand. Things evolve overtime. Usually muslims read English translation and we always come across Angel Gabriel in place of Ruh used in arabic text. But Albaqir came up with research, suggesting it might not be Angel or Jubril afterall. Thats a good thought. I no longer hold tafsir absolute. There are things they translated that perfectly fit their understanding at that time.

Let me give you example. Go to sura Ambiya 95-96. Read many different commentary as you can compare to modern time, you will find mistakes in their understanding. I notice that 5 yrs ago through Sheik Imran Hussein. But someone like tbaba may say Imran Hussein is conspiracy theorist. Thats irrelevant. My point is Quran is to be understood as things evolve. NOT rigid. This is why till today, Salafis do not understand what the man is saying because they hold on to centuries old tafsir.

Now dont get me wrong. Early interpretation are very much necessary but I am saying they are not absolute. There are verses that need to be reinterpreted/re-translated in our time. And it doesnt change original Arabic text. Since i notice sura 21, 95-96 i know there is possibility of mistakes elsewhere. This doesnt mean early muslims were deficient in their understanding. Rather because of inavailability of the data at that time.

Be truthful to yourself, in the verse pointed out by Albaqir, did Allah use 'Malaika' or 'Jibril'?. Even Quran that I have here printed in the kingdom of Saud argues about "Ruh" in the beginning of the page. My point is dont take every tafsir absolute. Knowledge is broad. We discover things in the Quran we knew not before. Thats is why Sheik Adam Al-ilory probably said

tbaba1234:
^ I repeated the many times that Ruh can be interpreted as human soul or sometimes referred to as Jubril. Yet you keep repeating Jubril breathe into man?? repeating it again.

May Allah grant all of us better understanding.

Like they say, Allah knows best...

AlBaqir:


Haq dear brother. I remembered when tbaba1234 and I dialogue on "Nafs" as used in sura al-Nisa verse 1. He rigidly claimed it means Adam therefore adopted the "Israili" story that Eve was created from the rib of Adam. All this because Ibn kathir interpreted it.

tbaba1234:


I remember this but I would not accuse you of lying, perhaps you misunderstood me. I did not even assert that 'rib' was accurate, just that Eve came Adam. How can I be accused of rigidity to 'ibn kathir'.

Allah knows, I did my research on ruhaniyah and found nothing backing this idea. Hence my appeal for evidence. I know, I was open to any evidence

Let's just drop it. Because going back to throw accusations leads to other arguments.

Salam

tbaba1234:

Allah knows, I did my research on ruhaniyah and found nothing backing this idea. Hence my appeal for evidence. I know, I was open to any evidence

dragnet:
as usual...

tbaba1234:


Salam alaykum, akhi... long time

Empiree:
Good one. Yoruba people say " If Allah knows, let people( also) know. You should have said "I researched about ruhaniya but found no evidence of them". Instead of coming up with you are sure it's Jinn. They are the ones sucking blood, they frequented him etc. All that are guess work.

Four people from different places cant be lying about it. They are also sure it's ruh-aniya. Thanks to Albaqir for digging up "ruh". Qur'an clearly says only few knowledge of it is disclosed. In my opinion, it's only folks who penetrate Qur'an come across them. Please tbaba, don't just say let's forget about it. We all need to do research and come here with what we found. That's called scholarship.

What if only evidence we have is ruhaniyah themselves introduce themselves as such?. That will confirm what me, albaqir, lanrexlan and kazlaw2000 have been saying that everything is not penned. please let's do research. we never know who may be scholar tomorrow among us. This is part of seeking knowledge that Qur'an speaks about.

I don't restrict myself to certain school or sheikh etc. I like studying here and there. I already made up my mind that any development I found from my man. I won't disclose it here anymore bcus of the way you and sissie concluded which I'm quiet sure was wrong. But you changed my mind with above. I'm not going to be talking about we did this or that.

Focus will be on who ruhaniyyas are?. how people close to them really sure they are not jinn?, did they introduce themselves as such or what?. from what they are created? etc. pls this should be our homework.

"Rahana" that appeared to Mariam(as) suggests to me they are different beings not Angels. Walahu ta'ala allam.

Note: I was told that ruhaniyah said prophet Muhammad (saw) was sent to them as well. He said anytime we hear his name mentioned, we send him our salawat. Then the man told me that "nkan nbe labe sanmo" I:e there are lots of things under the sky.

dragnet:

Wa alaykum salaam... Yessir, hustling has reduced my status to 'reading mode'.

tbaba1234:


May Allah bless your hustle.

Jamo90:

You dont have to change what you're doing for anybody. The number of people benefitting from your posts are more than the critics.

dragnet:
prove it.

Sissie:

lanrexlan:

Team Empiree
Empiree-The Jinn guy
1)AlBaqir-Right hand(Otun) of the Jinn guy
2)Lanrexlan -Left hand(Osi) of the Jinn guy
3)Kazlaw2000
4)Ayinba1
5)Jamo90
6)Hkana
7)Silent followers
^^
The above stands on 'Seeing is believing, experiences play important role in lives of men, you can't dismiss Ruhaniyahs because you can't find them in books'.
Tbaba1234 don see yoruba people as the users of Jinn


Team Tbaba1234
1)Sissie
2)Dragnet
3)Maclatunji
4)...........

^^
The above is 'Bring us textual facts for Ruhaniyah'.


Brother Empiree, me don build house for 'Agboju' o.Maybe you should send money from the states, make I help you buy land for 'Agboju'.
I don commot face on top the matter, it won't end.The argument will just be moving forward and backward as sister Ayinba1 rightly said.

Dear brother Empiree, on this matter I dey ya back 'bi Ike maalu'.Trust me, and please don't regret sharing your stories, the man in that second video talked lightly on Ruhaniyahs because people might misunderstood him.Cool videos.

With the list, na play play oo.No take me serious o.


AlBaqir, Nice video.Jazakumullah Khairan.
@Everyone, no hard feelings ooo.

kazlaw2000:
@albaqir, nice video up there. Jazaakallahu for sharing. @empiree, eku ise naa. Welldone for rekindling our yearnings to get closer to Allaah . If not for real life experiences like these we visualise, what would have motivated us to exert ourselves to the maximum in worshipping Allaah? Shukran brother.
That Sheikh Adam al Ilory's quote u are fond of (about his kind of Salafism), is a masterpiece in intelligence. I think i will have as my profile statement now. Its so on point.
To all participants, Shukran. Its just that we cant always agree.

Sissie:
@empiree you are beginning to repeat yourself...

Problem is assuming you are the only one with experience.

I do not doubt stories like that happen, however saying its ruhanniyah (assuming i accept they exist) and not jinn, and proving is the former not the later is the problem and that we have agreed to disagree.
I have heard of Muslim powerful jinns that can do all that was listed above.

All this seeing is believing talks is story to me.

I try to ignore, but mentions keep bringing me back.

lanrexlan:
It won't be bad if you narrate your experiences.

@Underlined, all these I heard stories of powerful muslim Jinns performing such acts without providing evidences from Qu'ran and sunnah that muslim Jinns can do such is 'STORIES FOR US TOO'.Just like the bold is story to you.

lanrexlan:
It won't be bad if you narrate your experiences.

@Underlined, all these I heard stories of powerful muslim Jinns performing such acts without providing evidences from Qu'ran and sunnah that muslim Jinns can do such is 'STORIES FOR US TOO'.Just like the bold is story to you.