Elliotwiz1: hmmm i never quote verses on my own if you haven't read about it in the ten years of your ministry, just ask "matt16-18 and i tell you, you are peter(cephas,meaning stone), and on this rock i will build my church, and the powers of death shall not prevail against it...yes i do quote bible passages without telling you the chapter, but as a christian i expected you to know them since you studied the bible for ten years

Elliotwiz1: have you heard of the word back-sliding? Go and check those classified as back sliders...rebellion in the house of God is not tolerated....you've been quoting so many verses, but You've never quoted a verse that says "THOU SHALL NOT PAY TITHES" i will continue paying my tithes until i see a verse that tells me not to pay it.

1Jn 2:20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you know all things.

1Jn 2:27 But the anointing which you received from Him abides in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as His anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true and no lie, and as He has taught you, abide in Him.

danot1030: pastorkun, christembasy wit others ar agents of hell on asignment 2 twist d truth n spread falsehood, their aim is to return d church 2 old age poverty. my disapointment is dat dey will come 2 d public 2 anounce it in NL wen their distruction comes.

Candour:

haba!!! because he stopped tithing you're declaring woe? Is that the worst sin in your opinion? If you hear he commited murder, what will you say?

This is serious

Pastor Kun:

Too many brethen are suffering becos of this false doctrine and the gospel of Christ is being polluted in the process. We cannot afford to rest on our oars whilst brethen are perishing due to lack of knowledge.

naijadeyhia: [b]Acts 15:24: “Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment.” Tithing was part of the law to ISRAEL- NOT the Church.

God sought to kill Moses because he had not obeyed (Ex.4:22-23) the command He gave to Abraham (Gen 21:4), to circumcise his son. But not once do we read of Moses obeying the tithing command before the Tabernacle and priesthood laws were given. We see no reaction from the Lord on this. Why? Because they were not given a tithing command--until-- the Tabernacle and priesthood laws were given. Why do some people want to resurrect the laws that were to point to Jesus Christ as the fulfillment of the law and the prophets. Why do some divide the law up into pieces instead of following ALL of the laws given to the Israelites in the Old Testament? You can’t obey only part of the on giving the tithe (again it was 22% not 10%). We can’t obey because we as New Testament believers have no temple or Levitical priesthood, we are under a completely different system. New Covenant Christians do not have to tithe in order to please God. The intention of our heart is what God is looking at more than the amount we give. Ephesians 1: 3 says “Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ.” We have the blessings by GRACE.

Those who hold the position of tithing for the church are confused of its purpose and history. No Christian should be coerced into giving a set amount to receive God’s blessings. The simple reason is that it removes them from walking in grace and puts them under the law. The Pharisees tithed and watched what people gave, and they continued to tithe as the church was birthed. The church did not tithe.

“Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given orders to the churches of Galatia, so you must do also: On the first day of the week let each one of you lay something aside, storing up as he may prosper, that there be no collections when I come.”(1 Cor. 16:1-2). Notice Paul says the collection for the saints. This is not necessarily a weekly tithe but appears to be a collection for others in need. Those saints in other areas that were in need of financial help, from one church to another. “A contribution made by the rich for the relief of the poor (from Adam Clarke's Commentary). “A contribution, or collection of money for a charitable purpose (from Barnes' Notes).

And what of the commands of helping the poor? Instead, we only hear about robbing God if we do not tithe. You are still sinning if you have something to give, and are selfish towards those in need. God would rather see people serve and participate willingly then be under compulsion to give large amounts of money to others to do the work. “Let them do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to give, willing to share, storing up for themselves a good foundation for the time to come, that they may lay hold on eternal life. (1 Tim. 6:18-19; Gal.5:13) Numerous needs go unmet inside our churches. We need to give to brethren who are in need, not just give to big ministries so they can become bigger. They are not the only ones who do God's work.

The principle of tithing in the Old Testament was to benefit those in need as well: Deuteronomy 26:12: “When thou hast made an end of tithing all the tithes of thine increase the third year, which is the year of tithing, and hast given it unto the Levite, the stranger, the fatherless, and the widow, that they may eat within thy gates, and be filled.” Deut. 14:27-28: ”You shall not forsake the Levite who is within your gates, for he has no part nor inheritance with you. ”At the end of every third year you shall bring out the tithe of your produce of that year and store it up within your gates.” Have you seen any ministry that insists on tithing do this? Why not, it is part of the tithing law.

Are you listening to the “TV evangelist” telling you to sow your seed for your need? Promises, promises…

Paul writes, “For there are many unruly, vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision: whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucere's sake” (Titus 1:10-11).

The words of Hosea continue to echo to us today, (4:6) “My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge.” Bible knowledge is what he is referring to.

New Testament believers are never commanded to tithe but to give (the amount is between you and the Lord). Consider the story of Ananias and Sapphira that has been used and abused in so many ways-- Acts 5:1-4: “But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession. And he kept back part of the proceeds, his wife also being aware of it, and brought a certain part and laid it at the apostles' feet. But Peter said, “Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the price of the land for yourself? “While it remained, was it not your own? And after it was sold, was it not in your own control? Why have you conceived this thing in your heart? You have not lied to men but to God.”

This was not about tithes but a freewill promise they made and they did not keep their word. This does not mean as some claim every time you intentionally lie you will be judged so you must keep your vows (though we should have no intention of doing so); not if you were manipulated by lies into keeping the vow.

Consider what Paul wrote to Timothy the young pastor of Ephesus, “But godliness with contentment is great gain. For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. And having food and raiment let us be therewith content. But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition. For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness” (1 Timothy 6:6-11). If someone is always talking about mammon, then they are not serving God. You cannot have two masters.

New Covenant Principles

The guideline for our giving to God and His work is found in 2 Corinthians 9:6-7: “Now this I say, he who sows sparingly shall also reap sparingly; and he who sows bountifully shall also reap bountifully. Let each one do just as he has purposed in his heart; not grudgingly or under compulsion; for God loves a cheerful giver.” Grace means freedom- law means obligation. We should give back to God as he prospered us, as we purpose in our hearts.

The epistles are the teachings for the church. They contain numerous instructions, corrections and rebukes. Not one of these letters have tithing taught or practiced for the Church--The tithe is not mentioned as an obligation. Tithing is mentioned in the book of Hebrews which was written to Jewish believers in the Messiah, not to Gentile churches. The word “tithes” is found four times in Hebrews chapter 7, more than all the epistles combined. (Heb.7:5, 7:16, and 7:18.) The New Testament focuses on our High Priests ministry of Jesus Christ of whom Melchizedek was pre-figured in type (Heb. 7:2, 4, 5-9). Abraham's tithe in Hebrews 7 is mentioned to explain the greater priesthood of Christ, it is not teaching the practice of tithing to the Church.

Hebrews 7:5: “And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham.” (Heb. 7:9-10 Levi was in the loins of his father when Abraham met the priest of Salem.) Only the sons of Levi were to receive tithes. This means if we do not have a Levitical priesthood we have no right to ask for tithes as if they are obligated to the church. In other words, the Levitical priesthood was instituted with the tabernacle, and the Temple-- not the church. God has given a new priesthood to the church-- according to the order of Melchizedek. Again, what was given to this priesthood was a freewill offering of the spoils, not a portion of Abram’s income. For the writer of Hebrews says, 7:11-12: “Therefore, if perfection were through the Levitical priesthood (for under it the people received the law), what further need was there that another priest should rise according to the order of Melchizedek, and not be called according to the order of Aaron? For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law.”

Heb 7:16: speaks of the new priesthood “who has come, not according to the law of a fleshly commandment, but according to the power of an endless life.” It continues V.18 “For on the one hand there is an annulling of the former commandment because of its weakness and unprofitableness.” Now here we find something interesting, the very place many find the origin of tithing actually denies it continual practice because of its association with the law. The Jewish believers were under grace just as the gentiles were and they were told that the law ended! There is a disannulling of the commandment. The Levitical priesthood was not perfect, therefore it was necessary for a change in the priesthood, and a change of the law. Hebrews 7:5 tithing is called a fleshly, (carnal) ordinance, according to the law because of it association with a priesthood that is no longer in effect. Jesus’ priesthood is superior, having the power of an endless life, not in relation to a covenant that was temporary (Heb.8:13).

Verse 18 disannulling (abolishment) of the commandment going before (what commandment is he referring to? The one mentioned in chapter 7, v:19 “for the law made nothing perfect.” (This includes the commandment to take tithes). Tithing is abolished according to the New Testament (discontinued, obsolete). V.19 continues “on the other hand, there is the bringing in of a better hope, through which we draw near to God.” V.22 “by so much more Jesus has become a surety of a better covenant.” The question that needs to be answered by every individual is: which covenant do you want to be under?

Throughout the history of the Church many have attempted to apply portions of the Mosaic Law and incorporate it into the practice for the church. The Judaizers did it with circumcision, and other portions of the law. The Galatians listened to the Judaizers, as many listen to the lawful tithers of our day. The same words apply “O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you” (Gal. 3:1). The law is obsolete (Heb.8:13). We are under the law of the Spirit which speaks of liberty, not the Old Testament law, which obligates tithing as well as many other things.

The same people that impose their false interpretation of “for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life” (2 Cor. 3:6) bring people back under the law to extract money from their pocket for their ministry support. This is confusion, not rightly dividing the word. The Pharisees, who loved money, became blind because they upheld their own laws and interpretations over Moses’ law, and were stricter at enforcing them. We essentially have the same thing going on today with new concepts of how coerce people to give, now it goes far beyond tithing. They call it seed faith, the Bible has nothing to say on this. No Apostle ever instructed the church to sow a seed, (which is actually the word according to Jesus) of money, and wait for a hundredfold harvest to come in. (according to the prosperity teachers- If it isn’t a hundredfold then it is still to be used as seed again.)

They solicit funds by asking the people to open up your heart (which usually means your wallet) and give to the work that God is blessing so mightily. “Give, pressed down and shaken together” as they promise God will give to you abundantly after you give to them; “you can’t out give God,” and they promise a “100 fold blessing,” “Give this amount now because there is an unusual anointing here,” or “whatever God gives to me will give to you if you partner with me.” The Bible says in Proverbs 21:6: “Getting treasures by a lying tongue is the fleeting fantasy of those who seek death.” Your cup runneth over with such lying words and false promises.

You will always find that those who promote the “give to get concept” will use the Old Testament. They will interpret the new in light of the old, not the old in light of the new. God deals with our motives and he sees the people using His word for ill gotten gain. We need to see the manipulation taking place and make people aware that they are giving their money to those who buy new cars, jets, houses and live a luxurious lifestyle. We should support ministries, big or small, but we need to look into how the money is actually being spent. We are supposed to be servants, not live like kings. Pause and think about it; go to the Scripture to see how the apostles lived and what they taught the church.

In Exodus 36 Moses asked the people for offerings to help build the tabernacle, but even then it was not tithes, they gave willfully and cheerfully. The people gave so much that Moses finally asked them to stop giving. Have you ever heard someone into seed faith say stop the giving? The New Testament believers are to operate by grace giving not tithing by law and we are certainly not to be ruled by made up prosperity promises by money hungry men.

A majority of churches practice tithing more as principle. It may be a matter of semantics when they collect tithes and offerings. What is often meant is that they are making a distinction between regular support of the local church and giving more as one has been blessed. But there are some that are very legalistic and make tithing a matter of proving one is saved. They condemn the people for not being obedient and basically spiritually abuse them. The Bible is clear that we should give to God’s work, but not because we are obligated to keep a tithing law that is under the Old covenant.

We are to give freely as we so choose. The New covenant asks that we give our lives as living sacrifice to Him who bought us, not just 10% of our money, according to our reasonable service (Romans 12:1). Under the law if your giving only 10% of your money you would still be robbing God. Actually, they rob themselves, because God's blessings can only come through grace-giving.

The law has passed away (Heb.8:13) we are under grace. If you have to keep the law then you must keep it all. The law and grace are two completely different systems and two completely different covenants. Romans 8:4: “That the righteousness of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.” Tithing was required by the Law; giving is what we do not according to the Law but according to grace. Our answer is not to go back under the Law but to be under grace. Grace is given to us and we choose how much to “give,” this is not to be confused with a command to “tithe.” God will bless if you have your faith in the right thing, not false promises. It is impossible to keep the tithe exactly as Moses' law commanded: since it was largely agricultural and it was specifically for the nation Israel.

If you don't tithe is it a sin? If you barely have enough to live on it is not the same as someone who has all their needs met and can easily give. So do not become overwhelmed with guilt by men who bring fear of judgment to you.

Again, “Let each one do just as he has purposed in his heart; not grudgingly or under compulsion; for God loves a cheerful giver (2 Corinthians 9:7). Everyone should support the work of their local church some way, by their serving, their money, their gifts or talents they have. “Let them do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to give, willing to share, storing up for themselves a good foundation for the time to come, that they may lay hold on eternal life”(1 Timothy 6:18-19). [/b][/b]

christemmbassey: u don't even know y u are in this bondage. Well, continue.

Processor01: I initially got my first revelation to quit tithing sometime last year when the Holy spirit directed me to Hebrews 7 but I was too lazy to study it and ask him for deeper revelation.

After some weeks I gave into fear and revelations from my church(odozi-obodo) but i kept reading and thanks to the likes of Frosbel, Goshen, Pastor Kun. After some time of self study and prayer I took the bold step and some days I feared that I might have an accident or suffer serious losses but I began to feel this peace and boldness in place of fear.

When I finally got a mega promotion I finally concluded that the God these folks preach seems to be different from my father.

buoye1: I can never stop tithing,only people with a minute knowledge of the word of God ll do so!!!!!Malachi 3vs10-12

olivertwist: Praise God. Earned N217,250 for the month of September. Paid N25,000 as tithe and offering. Can't wait to give more back to God who Owns me and everything I've got.

Okeyson4wisdom: the person that wrote this must be from winners chapel may God open ur eyes coz ur blinded

Okeyson4wisdom: all you that want to send people to hell because of ur wickedness and and brainwashing people not to pay tithes u will suffer in hell. To all those that pay their tithes God will rebuke the devourers for ur sake. Pls never think ure paying tithes to ur pastor. Focus on christ and he will bless you

Processor01: I initially got my first revelation to quit tithing sometime last year when the Holy spirit directed me to Hebrews 7 but I was too lazy to study it and ask him for deeper revelation.

After some weeks I gave into fear and revelations from my church(odozi-obodo) but i kept reading and thanks to the likes of Frosbel, Goshen, Pastor Kun. After some time of self study and prayer I took the bold step and some days I feared that I might have an accident or suffer serious losses but I began to feel this peace and boldness in place of fear.

When I finally got a mega promotion I finally concluded that the God these folks preach seems to be different from my father.

ddeola: At times, some people dey behave funny just because dem get different opinion or doctrine for dier church.

It is simple, if you believe in it continue in it and expect the reward as promised by God Himself because God can never change. He is God and will continue to be God whether people believe Him or not.

If you don't believe, no wahala just don't expect a fulfilment of the promises attached to tithing because God is not a respecter of person.

I would rather we spend more time evangelising the world and spreading the gospel than arguing over believes and doctrines. Preach Jesus, the only way to the father and as for other matters, allow the Holyspirit direct you and leave the ideas and principles or teachings of men abi na philosophers make I call am for dem.

Jesus is Lord!

Candour:

This is one of the sweetest testimonies I've heard on this issue.

God's blessings and promotions are free and can't be bought even as salvation can't be bought

God bless and sustain you my brother.

rezzy: Praise the Lord, my testimony goes like this, You anti tithe Christians have not been able to confuse me. I still pay my tithe. Praise Master Jesus. Halleluyah

fr_evangel: @Goshen360,

Hebrew 7 and the annulment is a broad discussion and deserves a separate thread.

However, even when you succeed in explaining that to tithe preachers, they will come back to tell you Abraham Tithed and so Tithing was revealed before the Law.

Pastor Kun:

The idea that you need to pay God[tithe] before he can bless you must be the biggest heresy in modern day christianity, the idea is absolutely ridiculous.

idnoble135:
So bad. We are not going to derail the thread by talking on those two subjects. But..... It is well o.
Tongues does not exist? Same as the "special anointing"?
My good brother, all i'd say is, walk closely with God. It wont take long for him to show you if you are right or wrong(and then prompt you to make corrections).