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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Politics / The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions (7558 Views)
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Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Igboid: 1:24pm On May 17, 2020 |
The whole secession clause argument is built on the the conjecture that it would have helped Eastern region secede without war in 1966. That's a big assumption that is not taking many variables into consideration. 1. The seccession clause is a civilian law that would have been only enforcable by the civilian government and parliament. 2. Now here is the catch. Nigeria in 1966/67 was a military dictatorship who ruled by decrees and not civilian constitutions. 3. Gowon had no problem altering any part of the constitution that would make Biafra secession impossible. He dissolved the regions, and changed the derivation formula of the new states. Under this circumstances, we can as well assume that he would have quickly have abolished the secession clause and replaced it with a new decree that would make secession impossible. 4. Bottom line is that the secession clause argument is a redundant one by Yorubas meant to justify their desire to keep Ndiigbo in a failed union with themselves in Nigeria. Another argument is that Awolowo involvement in 1967-70 events are justified because Zik opposed secession clause earlier that Awolowo wanted. Now, that's another funny one. This would only make sense if Awolowo declared independence from Nigeria and Zik supported the North to march with army to Yorubaland to enforce Nigeria unity. This never happened, thereby rendering the whole argument a waste of time. 4 Likes 1 Share |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Igboid: 1:26pm On May 17, 2020 |
LukasPodolski: History according to Ibadan-Lagos express way media propaganda machine, okwaya? 3 Likes 1 Share |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Iceberg3: 1:27pm On May 17, 2020 |
[s] LukasPodolski:[/s] 1 Share
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Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by diplomat058(m): 1:29pm On May 17, 2020 |
Igboid:Wow! I thought we were conversing, but I was startled by your emotional outbursts. Yorubas do NOT hate anyone. We only look out for ourselves and when you are in the way, we run you over. At some points, it was the Jihad Alimist Fulanis and their imperialist ambitions defeated, then we had to contend with the British colonialists, pretentious usurpers like Zik, internal saboteurs in the then Western Region, the military incursionists into politics, Biafra at Ore (A Yoruba territory) leading to a decisive defeat, Babangida and June 12 leading him to step aside, Abacha and Abiola, Yoruba Presidency in 1999, GEJ's scheming out of Yorubas despite the 2011 support leading to the endorsement of Buhari's presidency, and now restructuring for some, 2023 or secession for others. It has always been a strategy and it will always be. And the western crises started when the NPC/NCNC Federal Coalition jailed Awolowo, and Zik, Balewa and Ahmadu Bello tried to turn the West to their vassal region in 1962, using Akintola. Well, I don't want to take sides, to avoid being deemed partisan. They disorganized the region and made way for the Midwest to leave in 1963. 5 Likes |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by LukasPodolski: 1:33pm On May 17, 2020 |
Igboid:We can't disregard history and embrace narrative from IPOB bureau of statistics. Sunnewspaper,vanguard.. this two has been barred from their own backyard. I'm sorry. |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by LukasPodolski: 1:39pm On May 17, 2020 |
Mr igboid do you have anything to say?
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Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Igboid: 1:43pm On May 17, 2020 |
diplomat058: Lol! You have to rope Zik into your internal crisis in the Western region? Zik is the one who made greed not to allow Awolowo and Akintola unite their ranks? You find a way to bring your hate to the Igbo man and then turn around and accuse us of hate. Zik had no hand in the western region crisis. It was Akintola who went and renacted Afonja part 2 in desperate need to seize power from Awolowo, who went for an Alliance with NPC. But you have to bring Zik into it, and not hold your sophisticated politicians accountable. Zik was the one who pleaded for Awolowo not to be jailed in Northern prison where they would have killed him. Despite Awolowo bad deeds against Zik in the west, Zik intervened and pleaded on Saraduna and co to have Awo transfered to East (Calabar) for his safety. But to the Yoruba man, Zik was the cause of his woes. Again you blame GEJ for Yoruba not having any post in 2011, when again it was your son Tinubu playing your sophisticated politics, who schemed out Mulikat from the house of representatives speaker position GEJ and PDP endorsed her for, when Tinubu and SW ACN all backed break away from PDP Tambuwal for the post, just to mock GEJ and sell the agenda of GEJ marginalizing SW in 2015 in preparation for Buhari becoming a saint and his coronation that following suit? You deceive no one with your veneer of "detribalized" as we all know no such thing exists. We all look out for the interest of our own groups. 2 Likes |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by diplomat058(m): 1:47pm On May 17, 2020 |
Igboid:You are being evasive. What gave you the impression that it would be removed? was the skeletal federalism that we now practiced removed from the 1979 constitution? Ironsi abolished resource control and centralized command structure, was that not the greatest disservice to our federalism? The subsequent military dictatorships only followed his footsteps, and when Ojukwu failed to remit the federal revenues in the Eastern region, that was one of the causes of the war. Awo vehemently fought for the inclusion of a secession clause which Zik and Bello rejected. I believe he was not opposed to secession during the civil war, as he even threatened Gowon that Yorubas would leave too. The major position of the Federal council, which Awo was part of, was that the secession was being foisted on the Igbo people and the oil rich Eastern minorities by Ojukwu, for whatever reasons. So, technically, you can not even indict Awo on the suppression of secession during the war. After all, many Eastern Minority Soldiers also fought on the federal side and this gave credence to the federal narrative that the Eastern Consensus was a well packaged hoax 5 Likes |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Igboid: 1:51pm On May 17, 2020 |
LukasPodolski: https://allafrica.com/stories/200504220226.html |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by LukasPodolski: 1:57pm On May 17, 2020 |
These fools will never blame Azikiwe, Ironsi, the famous coward Ojukwu Kaduna Nzeogwu for their current predicament. Rather, they will blame; The greatest Awolowo for not allowing one dull man to take over the Western region. Why would a visionary leader leave his own people? That man sef dull for 500naira note. Our very own Awolowo was featured in 2019 hottest series, money heist. 4 Likes
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Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Igboid: 2:05pm On May 17, 2020 |
diplomat058 You are being evasive. Still beating around the bush. Did Ironsi dissolve the regions? No! Everything else is your subjective interpretations which you are entitled to. But let's not deviate from the meat of the argument, which is that the FG headed by Awolowo and Gowon were the ones who dissolved the regions and not Ironsi. Ironsi watered the ground, Ironsi buttered the bread, Ironsi sugared the tea, all those are conjectures. Truth is that Ironsi left the four regions intact. It wasn't he who dissolved them. Gowon with Awolowo consent did. The regions didn't survive Gowon and Awo touch, secession clause wouldn't have too. The immediate cause of the war was Gowon and Nigeria failure to keep to Aburi agreement. Awo vehemently fought for the inclusion of a secession clause which Zik and Bello rejected. I believe he was not opposed to secession during the civil war, as he even threatened Gowon that Yorubas would leave too. The major position of the Federal council, which Awo was part of, was that the secession was being foisted on the Igbo people and the oil rich Eastern minorities by Ojukwu, for whatever reasons. So, technically, you can not even indict Awo on the suppression of secession during the war. He was promoting starvation policy to help Nigeria win the war and keep Biafra. But somehow, you believe and want us to believe he wasn't against secession of Biafra, he just enjoys starving Biafrans, incredible. Ojukwu and Effiong were open to plebiscite/referendum in Biafra supervised by UN and OAU to squash the Awolowo propaganda of Ojukwu and Ndiigbo forcing minorities into Biafra. There is a British intelligence report to that effect that showed that the minorities on the majority would have supported Biafra. Awolowo and Gowon had access to that intelligence report. So it's a blatant lie that Awolowo was under the impression that Ojukwu was holding Biafrans under hostage. Look for better lie to spread. This one is dead.
It gave no credence. There were Igbos in Nigeria army too, Ike Nwachukwu was one of them. Banjo led Biafra march to Ore, so are Yorubas now Biafrans too? See the report : |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Igboid: 2:06pm On May 17, 2020 |
LukasPodolski: Maybe because Awowolo masterminded the highest money heist in African history |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by diplomat058(m): 2:09pm On May 17, 2020 |
Igboid:Lol. You made Zik into a saint. First, to correct you, Awo never collaborated with NPC which was controlled by Ahmadu Bello. In fact, since the 1959 election, he prominently favoured a southern alliance in conjunction with Northern minorities, then called pagan provinces, to root out the NPC from being dominant in the Parliament. He was the big picture. Sadly, ambitious Zik was not that patient, and when the NPC couldn't get a majority in 1959, Zik opted to form a Coalition Federal government with the Fulanis. If he refused, a second ballot would have been held, and in the absence of an absolute majority the second time, a simple majority would be used. That way, Awo hopes that the NCNC and the AG would combine seats, at the federal house of rep in Lagos, to secure the simple majority. That was the big picture. Also, the NPC was complicit in the western crises. Awo wanted to partner with Zik's NCNC but Zik was still a member of the coalition government. Akintola, on the other hand, played the NPC card. After Awo was jailed and the UPGA (the alliance of NCNC and AG) lost out in the federal elections of 1964, Zik betrayed the resistance that followed by forming a second coalition government with the NNA (the alliance of the NPC and the new Akintola's NNDP). In the federal cabinet that emerged, no single AG member was in there. Talk about betrayal and selfishness once again. And about Jonathan, in fact, ousting him was really a testament of our political sophistication as a people. I was really happy cos the marginalization was deep and suffocating. And you know it. He, himself, admitted it. 5 Likes |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by LukasPodolski: 2:16pm On May 17, 2020 |
Igboid:Boy you see, they used influential cities and Names to Garner viewers. Berlin,Tokyo,Oslo, Denver, Nairobi,Rio, PA Awolowo's note. Were you expecting them to use dullard Azikiwe, coward Ojukwu, murderer Nzeogwu? The greatest Robbery in Africa is collective looting of over $20B by Allison Madueke, Jonathan and Okonjo iweala. Or. Laundering of billions of NDDC funds to start Air peace, them no born Allen Onyema to enter United States.... Nah jail straight. As for that overrated thief Iweala, her days are numbered. 2 Likes
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Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Igboid: 2:25pm On May 17, 2020 |
diplomat058: I never said Awo went into coalition with the NPC. "Who" in my sentence was referring to Akintola. After Awolowo playing the tribal card against Zik in the western region, you can not fault Zik for not being so enamored with Awowolo. Moreover, it's on record that Awo sent double delegation to Zik and Saraduna same time. While Zik was in Onitsha negotiating a possible alliance with Awo and AG, news filtered through That AG had another delegation in North negotiating for alliance with NPC. Zik and Saraduna were pissed off with Awo for such treachery and decided to form alliance with each other. Awo tribalism killed Southern unity in Lagos. His sophisticated politics which Akintola learnt and that Tinubu is currently playing , killed any chance of AG-NCNC coalition. Zik is not a saint. But the buck of blame ends up in Awolowo table. You lots have a penchant for twisting history. The UPGA coalition decided to boycott elections. When election boycott didn't work and Akintola NNDP had cleared the votes, Zik was left with little options than to form a government with them. Let's not forget that the UPGA alliance which was a southern resistance to Fulani dominance failed because of the Yoruba party of NNDP led by FFK father who joined ranks with NPC. Talk about betrayal. Well, your sophisticated politics like it did when NNDP(Yoruba party) make the effort of UPGA coalition useless, have once again betrayed the the South. And like Zik did, Ndiigbo would again be left with no option but to let the North have it all again. This is what Yorubas call sophisticated politics. Retrogression. 1 Like |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by diplomat058(m): 2:27pm On May 17, 2020 |
Igboid:Lol. You accuse of subjective analysis, yet your post reeks of bias. When the causes of an event are to be analysed, you don't just hear about the immediate ones. As a matter of fact, the remote causes are a better eye opener into the eruptions. What were the remote causes? Well, these are established facts, indicting the January coup executors and Ironsi for remotely causing the war. And then later, the Northern pogroms, Gowon-Ojukwu rivalry and other implicit factors played their part. You wanting to absolve Ironsi of his ill-informed wrongdoings keep up stuck in here. And I talk about Eastern minority soldiers in their hundreds and you compare them them to just one Biafran Yoruba who was a victim of circumstances. This is laughable, to say the least. You talk about the Feds intercepting a British military Intel, do you have veritable non nigerian links for this? This was one of Ojukwu propaganda during the war, but you categorized them as your 'facts' and then turn around to accuse me of indicting Ironsi on fallacious grounds. Lol 2 Likes |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Igboid: 2:30pm On May 17, 2020 |
LukasPodolski:https://www.nairaland.com/2516282/before-forget This is the greatest heist in history of Africa. It's the foundation of modern Yoruba wealth. Those who put Awolowo picture in the money heist movie did their homework well. Dude was a lynchpin. I remember his legendary square off with Akintola over sole distributorship rights of Coca Cola in Western region. Many didn't know, but the rivalry between Awo and Akintola had economic greed undertones. Both of them had their wives fighting over Coca Cola money. 2 Likes |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Igboid: 2:36pm On May 17, 2020 |
diplomat058: "The unprecedented mingling of all groups and settling of many minority people in the Ibo heartland during the course of the war was simply taken for granted. Nonetheless, the Biafran regime was unreservedly committed to plebiscites in any disputed areas within Biafra, or on borders, so that people involved could determine their allegiance. It was proposed that these plebiscites be conducted under international( UN or O.A.U)supervision, and with adequate safeguard against punitive retaliation The federal government rejected the plebiscite proposal, obviously because it implied the recognition of Biafra and the substitution of a democratic vote for force of arms. Had the plebiscite been held, a ceasefire would have had to be declared, neutral observers would have been on scene, and the secession would have been revealed as a people's movement". The New York Review of Books, Volume 14, Number 8. April 23,1970. "In an authoritative and detailed memorandum on the background, cause and consequences of the Nigerian civil war issued in November 1968 by more than sixty British subjects, including Sir Robert Stapleton, the last British governor of the Eastern region( 1959-60), it was concluded that of the 37 percent of the population which they estimated that minority group represented in Biafra, only 10% would favour continued association with the federal government". The. New York review of Books, Volume 14,Number 8. April 23, 19701 Ojukwu, Efiong, Gowon and Awolowo all knew what the outcome of a referendum in Eastern region minorities areas would have been, which was why Ojukwu and Effiong was calling for it, while Awolowo and Gowon refused to accept it, but chose to continue with the propaganda of Igbos holding minorities to ransom. Yes! One-third of minorities would have voted against Biafra, but 2/3 would have voted for Biafra which would have disgraced Awolowo and Gowon. Even the minorities who were campaigning for one Nigeria then, knew they were not the majority in their zone. Saro admitted that more Ogoni leaders were for Biafra than were for Nigeria, and that he faced lots of opposition at Ogoni for siding with Nigeria. 1 Like |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by diplomat058(m): 2:48pm On May 17, 2020 |
Igboid:Lol. Manipulating facts is not the way to go by. First of all, your attempt to allege betrayal was already preempted by my earlier post. There was already a division in the West. Jailed Awo and his AG, Akintola and his NNDP. The former allied with NCNC in UPGA and the later allied with NPC in NNA. If there is any betrayal here, its the actions of Zik and NCNC who, after the 1964 election, left the UPGA alliance to form a coalition government with NNA and made sure that no single AG member made it to the Federal cabinet. That time, the AG were on with the resistance only to hear that Zik had capitulated. The AG, however, fought on with the UPGA alliance in the western region election of 1965 against the NNDP which was a microcosm of NNA. Unfortunately, the Federal Coalition, of which Zik was part, ran the whole thing aground, in favour of Akintola and his NNDP. Why didn't Zik stay true to the alliance? Talk about betrayal and selfishness, once again. Hilariously, Many of those who conspired against Awo died before he came back from prison. 6 Likes |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Tochi3(m): 2:50pm On May 17, 2020 |
nijabazaar:Lol. |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by diplomat058(m): 3:02pm On May 17, 2020 |
Igboid:Lol. You said British intelligence, and came up with some American reports. British Media would report the British intelligence, more credibly, I suppose 4 Likes |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by 7lives: 3:28pm On May 17, 2020 |
nijabazaar: But Aguiyi Irosi dismantled regionalism na, abi Ironsi na Jukun?. Though I know that Igbo politicians won't dare, let Igbos at the national assembly sponsor the bill for a return to regionalism, six regions to be precise, and see how many of their brothers will support the move. I can bet my life on it that Igbos at the NA will not support the motion. Yorubas are ok in opposition, we are ok under regional government, we shall even be better at ruling this country. Yorubas will be here till those who sabotage us pre and post independence, learn how not to constitute a spanner in other people's wheel of progress. 4 Likes |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by 7lives: 3:34pm On May 17, 2020 |
Iceberg3: You are really frustrated o, na war. |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Iceberg3: 3:37pm On May 17, 2020 |
7lives: Another one. Anyways,it's good telling us the single word that summerize your entire life
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Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by nobaga: 3:44pm On May 17, 2020 |
Chei see hypocrite. You voted massively for the same man - Buhari/Okadigbo Iceberg3: |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by 7lives: 3:46pm On May 17, 2020 |
diplomat058: Bro stop jor, you owe no one an explanation for your decision. I endured 16 unproductive years of PDP and I survived. I can't remember coming online to cry, insult or laid a curse on anyone for exercising their right to vote who they want. Come to my end, my street is now tarred, there are street lights, and power have also improve. Forget about those who are gnashing their teeth, things are shaping up, I'm happy. 4 Likes |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by Iceberg3: 3:47pm On May 17, 2020 |
nobaga: Thunda do I'm work if I voted for him then or not |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by 7lives: 3:49pm On May 17, 2020 |
Simbrixton: Na Obsession, no today e don tey. 1 Like |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by 7lives: 4:08pm On May 17, 2020 |
WeneWali: Chai, train don leave this one behind. 2 Likes |
Re: The South West And Nigeria: A Call For Opinions by 7lives: 4:16pm On May 17, 2020 |
LukasPodolski: You wan break the table?, anyway na Tinubu hold them. BAT don lock their brains for inside the bullion van. 1 Like |
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