MetaPhysical:


I bring you authorities on semitic and middle eastern languages who confirm the connection between that region and Yoruba, you dismissed them as unqualified. I bring you authorities on christianity and judaism who all share the view that Yoruba is from AfroAsia, you dismissed them as people influenced by foreign religion and requested for an authority on Ifa. I bring you Araba of Ife, you now dismiss it as works of fiction from John Wydham. You have done a bad job of representing the side you are on.

How would a person that could not answer question on Laba or sigidi begin to question the meaning of Aramfe? Did you not say somewhere that you are getting initiated into Isese? I do not believe you but even if it's true please do not go forward with the initiation. Protect your head and do not proceed with the initiation. I say this with seriousness!

OlaoChi:


This is a long list that will take time going through several dictionaries, and i dont wan to do it but I will if you challenge me by answering my own questions. stop ignoring them and shifting post. You have left them unaddressed for 3 days. Even BabaRamota1980 ran away, but you are still here with your hebrew obsession.

1. Go and Identify the non-Yoruba arts from the pictures i posted, since you claim yoruba art has nothing to do with african art.

2. Find ifa among the Hebrews

3. Evidence that Yoruba brought Afa to Igbos and Ewe, Fa to the Fon, Ifa to the Igala, Epha to the Urhobo and Iha to the Edo

So dont ask me any questions before answering these... I am not a fool you ask questions while ignoring mine

Hati13:

I’ve already contributed to this thread before and after you come here and start quoting me. Told you to not mention me anymore but you are doing it. You are clearly a sick person.

OlaoChi:


What you are saying here about records is what i have said since but you never did comprehend or you just choose to act like I didnt say it. Yoruba has no written history so there is only traditional sources(Language,Art, Music, Festivals, Cult/Family Rituals, Orally passed information within Families etc) and in the world of academics any work must have a source not guess work and assumptions, therefore Traditionalists must be involved and not ignored or spoken for. I have said that twice.
What business have Pastors with Sango ritual? or Ifa divination? or Shigidi? You keep mentioning Pastors and non-initiates who themselves didnt even study the topic they are talking about. Olumide Lucas wrote on Egyptian influence on Yoruba traditional religion when he was not a traditionalist and had no idea of Isese. Where are the sources? Just because i say mention scholars, doesnt mean mention a person who has published a book... Scholars are people who study, research, draw theory, discuss, take a position and open themselves up for scrutiny. Scholars are University trained and know the tenets of their discipline and follow it, Scholars are endorsed by Institutions and often are Lecturers themselves.

Lucas and Oduyoye do not stick to their discipline, in fact what did Olumide Lucas study at the University? His credentials are unknown, because all the poeple who mention him call him an Egyptologist but he had no thorough knowledge of Egyptology

I have never attempted to reduce yoruba to written records and that is very clear. You still have not provided any evidence

If Yoruba art is so different you can take up Olu317's assignment and identify which of those pictures I posted are non-yoruba..if you want I will post them again. You need to provide evidence in form of 1. what oral history records Yoruba being Semitic migrants 2. Enough Linguistic similarity between Yoruba and Semitic languages - at least 20% Lexical similarity, Similarity in Sentence structure, Verb Conjugation, Noun forms etc 3. Similarities between Yoruba and Arabic Art/Music for you , then Olu317 will provide Hebrew Art/Music 4. Similarities between Yoruba traditional religion and that of Arabs and Hebrews


Mr. man let me tell you something frankly, any person who doesnt know his father is a bastard. If you are yoruba as much as you like to claim (you even say i am not yoruba because I dont share your delusions...which piss me off ) you would know the importance of one's ancestors and how much not just about clan/family affiliation but blood descent is important. But its not your fault..you cant possibly feel true yoruba pride...its the effect of foreign religion on you. It is not new for Yoruba identity to be attacked by people of its own.

MetaPhysical:


You are nothing but a punk! First, this is a public forum for open discussion and interchange of ideas. What do you know on Yoruba origin to begin with? Has any Yoruba claimed origin in Ethiopia? What is Ethiopia where Yoruba is concerned? Yoruba as a aborigene is far superior civilization to your Ethiopia, and Yoruba as a migrant is way above you in civilization. Who cares to hear about your warped history?

...what claims do you have anywhere in Africa that supersedes that of Yoruba legends?

Get the fvk out of here abeg! Punk!

OlaoChi:


@Olu317. I am still waiting

Hati13:

Your statements are contradicting each other. You said “this is a public forum for open discussion and interchange of ideas” and say why are you concerned with Yoruba. To tell you the truth I’m not concerned with Yoruba and like you said this is a discussion forum so when I saw this thread, I started to discussion.

And don’t get emotional and say Ethiopian civilization is inferior to Yoruba. You are screaming “stay on topic” but here is you getting out of topic (saying Yoruba is superior to Ethiopia in civilization) and trying to initiate a conversation so you can scream “stay on topic” if I responded. You are a sick man.

Olu317:
When did you become this Hati13? You can do better than this.

Hati13:

[s]Your statements are contradicting each other. You said “this is a public forum for open discussion and interchange of ideas” and say why are you concerned with Yoruba. To tell you the truth I’m not concerned with Yoruba and like you said this is a discussion forum so when I saw this thread, I started to discussion.

And don’t get emotional and say Ethiopian civilization is inferior to Yoruba. You are screaming “stay on topic” but here is you getting out of topic (saying Yoruba is superior to Ethiopia in civilization) and trying to initiate a conversation so you can scream “stay on topic” if I responded. You are a sick man.[/s]

MetaPhysical:


You are nothing but a punk! First, this is a public forum for open discussion and interchange of ideas. What do you know on Yoruba origin to begin with? Has any Yoruba claimed origin in Ethiopia? What is Ethiopia where Yoruba is concerned? Yoruba as a aborigene is far superior civilization to your Ethiopia, and Yoruba as a migrant is way above you in civilization. Who cares to hear about your warped history?

...what claims do you have anywhere in Africa that supersedes that of Yoruba legends?

Get the fvk out of here abeg! Punk!

12salim:


LOL! You jareers never ceases to amaze me! One madder than the other!

Olu317:
As long as you wish, you can wait. It is practically impossible for you to engage without letting emotion control your state of mind, simply because you feel angered over information thrown at you . You agreed with non native and non speaker who were the people/researchers/linguists that grouped Africa into five language family; Hamitic, Semitic, Bantu,Sudanese and Bushman, but you condemn others who have more related words and cultural affinity to Yoruba as not true. Even to the extent of using a very derogatory word on me? Obviously, you are a young man.

This is a food for thought for you from a man who is one of the most respected linguist, Joseph Greenberg. This is what he had so say as regard classification of African language and all the people/ linguists that grouped such languages.

“ Africa, The Semito–Hamitic ( since the ultimate relations of the Semitic group to the Hamitic cannot be doubted ) and the Sudanese whose membership for the moment mist, be restricted to the West Sudanese and Bantu and which may some day be demonstrated to include all the other non Hamitic languages. The great desideratum of African linguistics remains more DESCRIPTIVE DATA. When one considers that of the HUNDREDS of LANGUAGES of Africa, a mere HANDFUL has received anything approaching a DESCRIPTIVE treatment by PRESENT DAY LINGUISTIC STANDARD, that there are still LANGUAGES of which we know hardly more than the NAME, it is evident that the careful reconstruction of the Parent Speech of each restricted group of languages and further comparison carried with rigor demanded in historical linguistic work,must, to a great extent, wait upon the further accumulation of ACCURATE DESCRIPTIVE MATERIAL. The hypothesis of widespread hybridization and morphological borrowing ,so often assumed by the DESPERATE CLASSIFERS ,while it cannot be ruled out
a priori must be subjected to the TEST OF NORMAL METHOD OF historical linguistics based on adequate material. "
His assertion meant most of the classifer's work were based on inconsistency,kangaroo method of gouping . . What a damning effect on Yoruba language and some others!

I wouldnt have posted this because it is not for your eyes only but reference.

An advice : Explore beyond your boundary and learn to be a good Omoluabi.

OlaoChi:


I stopped reading where you wrote "hamitic"
No linguist or anthropologist would use the term "hamitic"

Provide evidence please or shut up and run along like the other two have

Olu317:
Just look at how unlettered you are? So, Hamitic isnt used by linguist? Very disappointed at the poor knowledge you had acquired over 4 years on NL. What a waste! Funny enough, I am not even two years on NL and had knowledge of my history via the right source before being on NL . Just look at you and the choice of words that you use as if you and I are age mate? Anyway, don't ever quote me again. Else, I ask for your ban.Period.
Go edit your unlettered ignorance of ‘hamitic' before I share your knowledge on NL. I just have compassion on you because you claim Yoruba.

Olu317:
BabaRamota1980, come and see a disappointing Yoruba young man that act like them them from other region,who are always filled with hate when facts are glaring before them. In fact, he even said ‘Hamitic' isn't a word that was used by a well known linguist ,which was used to represent the classification of African language.
Below was the exact word of ‘Joseph Greenberg' . I am not the kind that can laugh a lot. So, kindly come and help me inform him , that he has blundered as a bittered Yoruba man,with no knowledge of antiquity and history

MetaPhysical:


Let me start from bottom up for you....

One of the best social attributes of Yoruba is diversity. We must have diversity of thoughts and opinions and worldview, without being labeled ignoble names and identities. If we all agree that Yoruba is aborigene there would have been no stirring of the spirit into inquisition about our past and then we would remain static with no new discoveries and knowledge. Similarly if we all agree that Yoruba is migrant, there would be no drives to find out the alternative. You cannot keep rubbing scholarship in people's face but then talk like an unlettered person in your response to them, it kills your credibility. The first principle of interaction is respect and humility, regardless of what you know or think you know, assume the person you are talking to is a friend and not a foe. To win people over to your side, you must show compassion and understanding, otherwise you loose them. This is basic rule in human interaction. I find it very hard to reconcile people who come out proclaiming intellect but out of their mouth and spirit is spitefulness and arrogance, the two do not harmonize. I can get dirty with the tongue and very caustic but again, i cherish my Omoluabi and my personal ORI more than I value my opponent's. Are you aware that on this internet we cross paths with people with Ase? You dont know who is on other side, prevention is better than cure....always humble yourself and restrain, its the best medicine. In fact, it is what IFA teaches, humility and restraint!


On any language, SOUND is the phenomenal character of tongue and speech. If sound is not present language has no character, even though communication is still possible. The language we call Yoruba has a character that is overwhelmingly superior to the native and aboriginal tongues anywhere in its region. There is no need proving anything as you are quick to call for...but you should investigate it yourself so you can grow and be enlightened. Four or so years ago when I joined here and started talking about this topic of origin my opponents would counter my position that most of Yoruba words were borrowed from Huasa and Islam. I didnt know any better because I neither spoke Hausa or Arabic. So I took upon myself as a challenge to learn Hausa so I can have it as a tool to filter and speak authoritatively on what is borrowed from Hausa and what is not. Today, I can speak Hausa fluently. I can write it and read it. Personal challenge to grow and expand, in just four years I acquired a tool and overcome the barrier presented by my opponents.

I have root words that you have never heard before in Yoruba and I have concrete evidence of aspects of Arabia in connection with Yoruba that is indisputable. It is waste of time and resource bringing those here to discuss. This forum is gutter, I must protect the information from getting soiled. Everyone come out here and say Yoruba is not mentioned by Arab and they did not write about us. They have never denied Yoruba footprints in Arabia either. They don't need to write about us...they have records of our presence in that land. It is in their antiquities and rites of worship as well. If they allow research into their pre-Islamic past those records will speak, but they will not open that gate into the pre-dynastic Arabia.

I respect the beliefs you all hold on your side of the argument and I see it as diversity. I dont have need to abuse your person because you differ or refuse to accept what I present. Mind over emotions!

Olu317:
BabaRamota1980, come and see a disappointing Yoruba young man that act like them them from other region,who are always filled with hate when facts are glaring before them. In fact, he even said ‘Hamitic' isn't a word that was used by a well known linguist ,which was used to represent the classification of African language.
Below was the exact word of ‘Joseph Greenberg' . I am not the kind that can laugh a lot. So, kindly come and help me inform him , that he has blundered as a bittered Yoruba Ibo man,with no knowledge of antiquity and history

BabaRamota1980:


People like him with claimed knowledge should be assisting his kins in Ngwaland to open threads and showcase Ibo history instead of jumping ln Yoruba thread. I saw his many attempts trying to link Yoruba with Ibo. They have no history so they use us to attain significance.

Im glad you and metaphysical refused to address anything Ibo in here. This is Yoruba.

Hey olaochi if you want to highlight what Oduyoye said about Ibo, open a thread biko so Ibo historians can join with you.

MetaPhysical:


Really

Iran di iran, omo ale!
Ogun laa ba ti e je!
Wa rin njo ebi n'pona!
Alafia onije ti e!
Arun a ba e gbe d'ojo ale!
Ile a ba e ja!
Omi a ba e ja!
Afefe a ba e ja!
Ina a gb'ogun ti e!

May these words spread far and wide and be with you in all pace and circumstance, Ase Edumare!

BabaRamota1980:


Ahhhh, alaye, no do that. The guy has yanminri gene in him. This is normal for them to call their own biological father worse. Im telling you, to Yoruba its abomination to address elder this way but in Iboland where his blood come from its part of everyday life. Abeg you o...e yanda e.



Hey olaochi, olaochi, olaochi, how many times i call you? You think say everybody here na mate? As you dey talk to everybody with insult na so some people do take enfer market nak.ed, amd remained there for ever.
Be careful o. This thing na ordinary discussion, why you dey call elders bastard and omo ale and all these foolish names? These are Yoruba they take offense, no be like your elders back for Ngwa. Do you hear me? No more insult o.

OlaoChi:


the Truth is always insult on those who are proponents of lies. If i say those who dont know their fathers are omo-ale..is it not true?
Oya prove to me that you know your ancestors, if a man is so sure about something he should be able to provide a good reason for his assurance

And stop calling me Igbo, i do not identify as Igbo, having an Igbo grandparent(which you people had to go over all my previous posts to find out) is what is making you people have orgasm as if you are more Yoruba than an Oyinbo man who follows Yoruab traditions


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRzkSiU8Ix8

This is Nathan Lugo, a white man(although he has some african ancestry) who is more Yoruba than you. .. so challenging my identity as a Yoruba is foolish...this is what pissed me off before i decided to be very blunt and tell you just what you are being...maybe you do not know you are Sabotaging yoruba identity or that is infact the aim

BabaRamota1980:


Shut up abeg! the guy told you dont use that word or any vulgar when you talk to him. Did he not warn you? Can you discuss without be abrasive, eehn, can you? If you dont like what people say is an insult the corrwct way to address your opposition? Frankly i think you need to stop talking on this thread because from page 1 till you got in everything was ok. After you got in it has been upside down. Who cares about your truth if your teachings also come with abuse and insults, who cares?

Stephen Adebanji Akintoye, also known as S. Banji Akintoye (born 1935), is a Nigerian-born academic, historian and writer. He attended Christ's School Ado Ekiti, Nigeria from 1951–1955,[1] and studied history at the University College (Overseas College of the University of London), Ibadan (1956–1961), and doctoral studies from 1963-1966 at the University of Ibadan, where he was awarded a PhD in History in 1966. He taught at the History Department at Obafemi Awolowo University, Ile-Ife, Nigeria, where he became a professor and Director of the Institute of African Studies from 1974-1977. He has also taught African History in universities in the United States including the University of South Florida, Tampa, Florida; Montgomery County Community College, PA, and Eastern University, St. Davids, Pennsylvania. Akintoye has written four books, chapters in many joint books, and several articles in scholarly journals. He took a leading part for some time in the politics of Nigeria and served on the Nigerian Senate from 1979–1983 during the Second Republic. He currently lives in Pennsylvania in the United States.

Akintoye is one of the current leading scholars on the history of the Yoruba people.[citation needed] His most recent work, A History of the Yoruba People (Amalion, 2010), draws on decades of new findings and thinking on Yoruba studies that challenges some previously dominant notions about the origins of the Yoruba. This work dispels the Middle Eastern and Arabia origins propounded by such scholars as the late Samuel Johnson (1846–1901) and also gave prominence to the works on the Pre-Oduduwa Period by Ulli Beier among others.[2][3] Akintoye also gave prominence to the role of Ilé-Ifè over that of Oyo. A reviewer, Wale Adebanwi, notes: "...this book directly contests and shifts the focus of Yoruba history away from what many have called the Oyo-centric account of Samuel Johnson... Where Johnson avoids the creation myth that positions Ife as the sacred locus of Oduduwa’s original descent and the orirun (creation-source), Akintoye, justifiably, restores Ile-Ife to its proper place as “ibi ojumo ti mon wa’ye” (where the dawn emerges)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Adebanji_Akintoye

BabaRamota1980:
Olu, where u dey, abeg help me beg metaphysical to soften. I see where he warned this guy to stop using vulgar words on him, but he continued, so i cant blame metaphysical....but this is open forum, agbalagba must exercise restraint and forgive even when small pikin offend. Add mouth beg this man. This is heavy stuffs, we dont want this on a discussion like this that can be retrieved by anybody and anywhere. Not good. Abi wetin you think?

MetaPhysical:


I repeat what I told you before...FVCK U!