Maynman:


I’ll tell him what causes dream and also tell him dreams are not real, just as day dreaming is not real.

We're talking about someone who never has dreamt. How do you prove to him that dreams exist?

HisSplendor:


We're talking about someone who never has dreamt. How do you prove to him that dreams exist?

I’ll tell him what causes dream, and also that dream doesn’t “exist”.
For an effect to occur there must be a cause!

We have people that “has never” had hiv, but they know what hiv means and how it works, what causes it and effect.

This is basic for a kindergarten.

HisSplendor:


You're not getting it. Everyone can experience it here if they search for it. The experience is personal to those who search. It is a foretaste of what everyone MUST eventually experience after death.

You're the one who's not getting it. What's is it everyone can experience here if they search for it?

You said it can only be experienced after death hence your advice we buy "a red cap" incase.

Why changing the goal post?

I believe you can now see why I said you don't understand your op.

If people can experience it here according to you, then we don't need to buy any "red cap" since we can prove the existence of such a place before we go there.

triplechoice:

You're the one who's not getting it. What's is it everyone can experience here if they search for it?

You said it can only be experienced after death hence your advice we buy "a red cap" incase.

Why changing the goal post?

I believe you can now see why I said you don't understand your op.

If people can experience it here according to you, then we don't need to buy any "red cap" since we can prove the existence of such a place before we go there.

Before I continue with you, first point to me where I said it can only be experienced after death. This shows you don't understand anything we've been discussing.

Maynman:


I’ll tell him what causes dream, and also that dream doesn’t “exist”.
For an effect to occur there must be a cause!

We have people that “has never” had hiv, but they know what hiv means and how it works, what causes it and effect.

This is basic for a kindergarten.

Just listen to yourself man.

HisSplendor:


Just listen to yourself man.

Listen to your advice sir, personal experience is not “proof”, a dictionary will tell you that.

Maynman:


Listen to your advice sir, personal experience is not “proof”, a dictionary will tell you that.

When did I tell you that personal experience is proof?

However, your personal experiences can stand as proof for your own self. Not necessarily for others. Hence, others must find their own proofs.

HisSplendor:


When did I tell you that personal experience is proof?

However, your personal experiences can stand as proof for your own self. Not necessarily for others. Hence, others must find their own proofs.

If personal experience can stand as proof for your own self why were you asking him to show proof of his assertions?

We have hundreds of religion, thousands of gods and each of their followers claim their experience as “proof”.

I don’t think “proof” works like that.

Maynman:


If personal experience can stand as proof for your own self why were you asking him to show proof of his assertions?

We have hundreds of religion, thousands of gods and each of their followers claim their experience as “proof”.

I don’t think “proof” works like that.

He never said his assertions were based on personal experience.

From your second paragraph, I understand that you know or believe that the adherents of these thousands of religions have personal experiences. At least that tells you that there's more to life than what the natural realm or mere human logic can offer.

You're not far from discovering the truth.

HisSplendor:


Before I continue with you, first point to me where I said it can only be experienced after death. This shows you don't understand anything we've been discussing.

You have come again. Must you mention it clearly. People can make correct deductions from what you have written.

Your explanation makes us understand it can only happen after death hence the reason you adviced buying "a red. cap" incase..

If there's certainty due to having experienced it personally yourself, you would not speculate for everyone as to what might happen when they experience later. There's no evidence whatsoever from anything you have been explaining that you have had any such experience before now.

Everything you have explained is from the position of a believer of something that you think is true. You have not had that experience you want your followers to accept.
.

Even if you have had it, explain how you were able to validate the experience to be true.

For the umpteenth time, you don't understand your own op.

HisSplendor:


He never said his assertions were based on personal experience.

From your second paragraph, I understand that you know or believe that the adherents of these thousands of religions have personal experiences. At least that tells you that there's more to life than what the natural realm or mere human logic can offer.

You're not far from discovering the truth.

“I don’t know or believe that the adherents of these thousands of religions have personal experiences.” That’s what they claim, it’s all a CLAIM that they can’t prove to others.

That was also what zeus worshippers thought and they also claimed they had experience, till we found out it was all mythology.

You’re not far from discovering the truth about your religion either.

HisSplendor:


When did I tell you that personal experience is proof?

However, your personal experiences can stand as proof for your own self. Not necessarily for others. Hence, others must find their own proofs.

But at the beginning you used your own personal
experience, which is not objectively proven, to judge others as unwise.


Focus on yourself and let others experience what they may experience or not experience..

You're not even sure of yours to start with.

Maynman:


“I don’t know or believe that the adherents of these thousands of religions have personal experiences.” That’s what they claim, it’s all a CLAIM that they can’t prove to others.

That was also what zeus worshippers thought and they also claimed they had experience, till we found out it was all mythology.

You’re not far from discovering the truth about your religion either.

He's really not far from discovering the truth of his religion.

triplechoice:


But at the beginning you used your own personal
experience, which is not objectively proven, to judge others as unwise.


Focus on yourself and let others experience what they may experience or not experience..

You're not even sure of yours to start with.

I didn't use my personal experience in anyway to judge anyone. Or did the story I shared talk about my personal experience?

I just used the story to illustrate the need for everyone to look before leaping.

Maynman:


“I don’t know or believe that the adherents of these thousands of religions have personal experiences.” That’s what they claim, it’s all a CLAIM that they can’t prove to others.

That was also what zeus worshippers thought and they also claimed they had experience, till we found out it was all mythology.

You’re not far from discovering the truth about your religion either.

We'll, as far as I'm concerned, I'm not someone who deceives himself. I don't have anything to do with religion if it has nothing to offer. The reason why I worship God is that I have vivid experiences. I would be a fool to be deceiving myself.

HisSplendor:


We'll, as far as I'm concerned, I'm not someone who deceives himself. I don't have anything to do with religion if it has nothing to offer. The reason why I worship God is that I have vivid experiences. I would be a fool to be deceiving myself.

But you know “god” through religion. Probably from abrahamaic religion

Odin worshippers also claim they had “vivid experiences”.

triplechoice:


You have come again. Must you mention it clearly. People can make correct deductions from what you have written.

Your explanation makes us understand it can only happen after death hence the reason you adviced buying "a red. cap" incase..

If there's certainty due to having experienced it personally yourself, you would not speculate for everyone as to what might happen when they experience later. There's no evidence whatsoever from anything you have been explaining that you have had any such experience before now.

Everything you have explained is from the position of a believer of something that you think is true. You have not had that experience you want your followers to accept.
.

Even if you have had it, explain how you were able to validate the experience to be true.

For the umpteenth time, you don't understand your own op.

Even if I didn't say it directly, kindly provide evidences of the indirect statement. I personally have a before-death experience. So, how would I now say "it can only be experienced after death.' Again, you don't seem to have a good grasp of this discourse.

Maynman:


But you know “god” through religion. Probably from abrahamaic religion

Odin worshippers also claim they had “vivid experiences”.

Everyone has a claim.

My claims are personal to me. And as I said, I cannot deceive myself.

HisSplendor:


Everyone has a claim.

My claims are personal to me. And as I said, I cannot deceive myself.

Still a claim like odin worshippers claimed.

Maynman:


Still a claim like odin worshippers claimed.

A claim is a claim.

HisSplendor:


A claim is a claim.

Exactly.

Maynman:


Exactly.

If the claimant is now deceiving himself, he's the fool.

HisSplendor:


If the claimant is now deceiving himself, he's the fool.

We’ll never know.

HisSplendor:


Even if I didn't say it directly, kindly provide evidences of the indirect statement. I personally have a before-death experience. So, how would I now say "it can only be experienced after death.' Again, you don't seem to have a good grasp of this discourse.

Are you now running away from the story you shared and what you made of it.

The 100 men where embarking on a journey to a place they have never been to before, and were advised to buy "a red cap" due a rumored king on the way

What does this tell you ?

Do they have any previous experience of the far distant land there were journeying to?

Yes or no

The correct answer to that is going reveal between me and you who has a thorough grasp of the discourse

I wait.

triplechoice:


Are you now running away from the story you shared and what you made of it.

The 100 men where embarking on a journey to a place they have never been to before, and were advised to buy "a red cap" due a rumored king on the way

What does this tell you ?

Do they have any previous experience of the far distant land there were journeying to?

Yes or no

The correct answer to that is going reveal between me and you who has a thorough grasp of the discourse

I wait.

You can't experience a journey before taking the journey.

Death is a journey. We're not talking about death right now. We're talking about spiritual experiences of which death is just a part. You can have spiritual experiences before dieing but you can't die before you die. Hope you understand?

Maynman:


We’ll never know.

At least the claimant knows his own truth.

HisSplendor:


At least the claimant knows his own truth.

Truth is not subjective. And he got are claims that he can’t prove to be TRUE.

HisSplendor:


You can't experience a journey before taking the journey.

Only when you're going there for the first time.

Please answer the question I asked. Don't avoid it with this. The men, have they been there before ? Yes or no

Death is a journey. We're not talking about death right now.

You're really confused. The op discussed what we may expect after death, and since nobody knows, buy " a red cap" . Is that not so? Focus on the op please.

We're talking about spiritual experiences of which death is just a part. You can have spiritual experiences before dieing but you can't die before you die. Hope you understand?

My friend just rest. You don't know what you're talking about.

Everything you replied has nothing to do with the op.

And just look at the confusion you typed.

"You can have spiritual experiences before before dieing" what kind of spiritual experiences? Why can't you specify it and let's see if it relates with the op.

And who has said people can die before they die?

Why did you not make all of these submission after narrating the story to see if it would fit.

You're desperately trying to bring in what is extraneous to the op because you have simply lost it.


Does Christianity teaches that people can experience heaven or see God before they go there?

You're delving into esoterism and no longer discussing Christianity.

HisSplendor:
There was once a thriving great city whose people dwelt in affluence. Those were days in antiquity when men listened only to oracles and worshipped idols.

This thriving great city suddenly became a host to many problems and calamities. The inhabitants died young. War, pestilences and severe hardship almost brought the city to extinction.

At the instruction of the king, the city priests contacted the Oracle and brought instructions from the gods.

The solution to the city's misfortunes require the adventurous journey of 100 men into a far away ancient city. They must cross seven rivers to the east of the city to get to this ancient town. Each of these 100 men must return with a bowl full of the dust of that town. 100 bowls of sand from the ancient town would heal the land.

As a matter of urgency, the king enlisted a group of 100 volunteers. They were mighty warriors from noble families. A day was fixed for the journey. The 100 volunteers prepared for the D day.

Just as the D day began to approach, odd news began to filter into the city. There's a small town en-route this ancient city. The 100 men must pass through that town to get into the city. There's no other route. However, the king of this small town was rumored to be hostile to travellers. He beheads every Traveller who does not wear a red cap. So was the rumor.

There was no way of ascertaining the veracity of this rumour since no one has ever travelled there from the city. So, some believed, while others disagreed.

This rumour divided the 100 travellers into 3 groups.

Group 1 : Those who believed the rumor and therefore bought themselves a red cap.

Group 2: Those who were unsure of the rumor but bought themselves a red cap to avoid distasteful eventualities.

Group 3: Those who disbelieved the rumor and never saw the need to get a red cap.

The D day came and all the 100 men set on their journey after receiving blessings from the king. The company was a mixture of those who wore a red cap, and those who didn't.

There was an old man in this city. The oldest of them all. After the 100 men had departed, he summoned his numerous children and said, 'Do you see this travelling company? Those who have a red cap are wise because, if in case, this rumour turns out to be true, these wise ones would save their heads a million times. And if it's a false rumor, they actually have nothing to lose. But those who journeyed without a red cap are fools, for if this rumour turns out to be true, they'll certainly lose their heads."

Conclusion
The company of those who wore a red cap are the believers. If there's no God out there in death, they have nothing to lose.

But the Atheists who are taking a godless journey into the unknown eternity are simply being reckless. If in case there's a God out there. They're losers.

Can you tell us the group that was eventually beheaded? I guess you can't. That is to say the dilemma continues. The dilemma of who is right between atheist and theist continues

americanigga:


Can you tell us the group that was eventually beheaded? I guess you can't. That is to say the dilemma continues. The dilemma of who is right between atheist and theist continues

Everyone believes his right but there are 'What ifs' that could make a serious human being wiser.

triplechoice:
Only when you're going there for the first time.

Please answer the question I asked. Don't avoid it with this. The men, have they been there before ? Yes or no


You're really confused. The op discussed what we may expect after death, and since nobody knows, buy " a red cap" . Is that not so? Focus on the op please.


My friend just rest. You don't know what you're talking about.

Everything you replied has nothing to do with the op.

And just look at the confusion you typed.

"You can have spiritual experiences before before dieing" what kind of spiritual experiences? Why can't you specify it and let's see if it relates with the op.

And who has said people can die before they die?

Why did you not make all of these submission after narrating the story to see if it would fit.

You're desperately trying to bring in what is extraneous to the op because you have simply lost it.


Does Christianity teaches that people can experience heaven or see God before they go there?

You're delving into esoterism and no longer discussing Christianity.

Man, from what you type up there, i can see that there are many things you don't understand.

While you're talking about the OP, you do not seem to understand that we started from the OP and have progressed. You're trying to draw the discussion back again to where we started from.

Please, read up again before replying.

triplechoice:


Are you now running away from the story you shared and what you made of it.

The 100 men where embarking on a journey to a place they have never been to before, and were advised to buy "a red cap" due a rumored king on the way

What does this tell you ?

Do they have any previous experience of the far distant land there were journeying to?

Yes or no

The correct answer to that is going reveal between me and you who has a thorough grasp of the discourse

I wait.

I think the problem here is that you're unable to draw a parralell between the story and the argument.

As I've said before, the journey they took symbolizes death. That's as far as the story goes. Are we limited to just the story even when reality offers more incidences?