You say 27 Quran. Are you mixing Ahroof and Qiraah?


Which of your claimed versions has no established trace back to prophet Muhammad pbuh?

Ohyoudidnt:
Angels are with Allah in what way?

My translator automatically converts the nun to ba however you realize the difference here is the position of the dot.

You however know the evolution of the arabic alphabet or don't you?

Is it a mistake that ibaad was used in place of inda ?

OR


When did ibaad evolved to inda ?

Ohyoudidnt:
You say 27 Quran. Are you mixing Ahroof and Qiraah?


Which of your claimed versions has no established trace back to prophet Muhammad pbuh?

How many Qur'an dialects were given to Mohammed?
Is it 7 or 27?

On whose authority the extra 20 Qur'ans?

Enough for the tribes. 7.

What tribe are Umar bin Al-Khattab and Hisham bin Hakim?

rolams:


I just dey laugh you walahi. I don't just know why? Serious laugh oooo! Your head go push you go challenge scholars who get your time soon.

Aptly predicted!

Ohyoudidnt:
Enough for the tribes. 7.

What tribe are Umar bin Al-Khattab and Hisham bin Hakim?

But we have up to 27 Arabic Qurans: how?

We should only be able to account for 7 and no more!

Are these 27 Qurans?

List them then

Ohyoudidnt:
Are these 27 Qurans?

List them then

Hafs an Aasim
Warsh an Naafi'
Qalun an Naafi'
Al-Duri an Abu Amr
Khalaf an Hamzah
Khallad an Hamzah
Ibn Kathir an Tha'labi
Al-Kisa'i an Abi Amr
Ibn 'Amir an Shaybah
Hisham an Ibn 'Amir
Abu Ja'far an Madinah
Yaqub an Nafi'
Ruways an Rawh
Rooh an Rawh
Ishaq an Ibrahim
Idris an Dawood
Isa an Ubayd

The rest


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7YFb92_Npk

Part 2


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLq3GOwmC8M

You say there are 27 Qurans then list just 17 and 2 Videos?

Is each video equal to 5 Qurans?

Your video title says 32 different Qurans so I don't get concisely what you are saying.

Can you be precise?

Ohyoudidnt:
You say there are 27 Qurans then list just 17 and 2 Videos?

Is each video equal to 5 Qurans?

Your video title says 32 different Qurans so I don't get concisely what you are saying.

Can yoy be precise?

Exactly, still counting.
Before long we shall see 70 Qur'ans.


All we needed to show you was 8 Qur'ans, then you can explain where the 8th Qur'an came from. But we found 3, then 5, the 9, them 13, then 17, then 27 and now 32!?

What a joke!

TenQ:

But we have up to 27 Arabic Qurans: how?

We should only be able to account for 7 and no more!

No, explicitly name the 27 you stated first then we can continue 70.

You are the joke if you don't name the 27

Sheik Ohyoudidnt ,
This is another one for you o!

See the Warsh Qur'an
Warsh Qur'an 2:125
{ وَإِذْ جَعَلْنَا اَ۬لْبَيْتَ مَثَابَةٗ لِّلنَّاسِ وَأَمْناٗ وَاتَّخَذُواْ مِن مَّقَامِ إِبْرَٰهِيمَ مُصَلّيٗۖ وَعَهِدْنَآ إِلَيٰٓ إِبْرَٰهِيمَ وَإِسْمَٰعِيلَ أَن طَهِّرَا بَيْتِيَ لِلطَّآئِفِينَ وَالْعَٰكِفِينَ وَالرُّكَّعِ اِ۬لسُّجُودِۖ }


Did you read in this passage : watakhazu ?


Warsh Qur'an 2:125
"And when We made the House a place of return for the people and security, and they took from the standing place of Abraham a place of prayer. And We made a covenant with Abraham and Ishmael, [saying], 'Purify My House for those who perform Tawaf and those who are staying [there] for worship and those who bow and prostrate [in prayer].'"

Check the Hafs Qur'an!

Hafs Qur'an 2:125
وَإِذْ جَعَلْنَا ٱلْبَيْتَ مَثَابَةً لِّلنَّاسِ وَأَمْنًا وَٱتَّخِذُوا۟ مِن مَّقَامِ إِبْرَٰهِۦمَ مُصَلًّى ۖ وَعَهِدْنَآ إِلَىٰٓ إِبْرَٰهِۦمَ وَإِسْمَٰعِيلَ أَن طَهِّرَا بَيْتِىَ لِلطَّآئِفِينَ وَٱلْعَٰكِفِينَ وَٱلرُّكَّعِ ٱلسُّجُودِ


Did you read in this passage : watakhizu ?



Hafs Qur'an 2:125
"And [mention] when We made the House a place of return for the people and [a place of] security. And take , from the standing place of Abraham a place of prayer. And We charged Abraham and Ishmael, 'Purify My House for those who perform Tawaf and those who are staying [there] for worship and those who bow and prostrate.'"




So, my Sheik Ohyoudidnt,
Is watakhizu the same as watakhazu?

Ohyoudidnt:
No, explicitly name the 27 you stated first then we can continue 70.

You are the joke if you don't name the 27

I agree that I am a Joke.
Allah revealed one Qur'an to you Muslims and it multiplied in your hands.

You can see how perfectly preserved the Qur'an is!?

I agree that I am a joke : I don't dispute that as far as you are concerned. Watch the video I attached, you even have more than 27.

LOL!

You see, didn't I warn you.
I told you to stop, but you didn't.

Writing to agree does not validate or negate your claim of 27.

Do you confirm that you are just being a nuisance and not a clown?

How have you shown imperfections in the preservation have your illustrated clearly different to the point of contradictory messages?

How many recitations exist in Islam and how many styles are there?

What is the difference between the recitations and styles?

Ohyoudidnt:
How many recitations exist in Islam and how many styles are there?

What is the difference between the recitations and styles?

You tell me.?

At least I have shown you that Warsh Qur'an and Hafs Qur'an doesn't agree with earth other.

So, my Sheik Ohyoudidnt, from Qur'an 2:125, is watakhizu still the same as watakhazu ?

Or maybe It's just a style of pronunciation written down so that it changes the word of Allah into something Allah didn't say!

Have a nice day sir.
It's important to know that your Islamic scholars play Taqqiya on you in glorifying the Qur'an.

When you know the Truth , the Truth will set you free.
Jesus said:
I am the Way, the Truth and the Life, no one comes to the Father except by Me.

mhmsadyq:


Aptly predicted!

He don happen?

You have claimed 27, 32 and say we will get to 70 but named only 17. You forgot the names of the 10 to make it to 27?

Nevertheless, were there variations in recitation done by Muhammad pbuh?

Was he aware his companions and other muslims recited differently?

Did he say one recitation was wrong and the other right?

Did the companions continue this trend?

You worry about an act to safeguard the variations from possible corruption which is referred to as the Uthmani codex yet are in awe that ancient arabic writing accomodates the 7 or 10 styles of recitations. Simply
by adding a letter or omitting a letter, or elongating or shortening a vowel or placement of diacritical marks.

We have gone through a few specific examples and there aren't any critical or worrisome differences in the meaning of the verse.

Now; if these variations were not known in the time of the Prophet pbuh there will be issues but they have been known in his presence. He did not condemn or forbid them. An added benefit to grant from Allah ease to his followers. You know the just before dawn meal and end of the fast by sunset is another of these grants.

These variations all fall within set limits such that for any accepted recitation;
* It must have an authentic chain of narration where the chain of narrators was continuous

* The narrators were all known to be righteous
* The narrators were all known to possess
good memories.
* The recitation be conveyed by a large
number of narrators on each level of the
chain of narration below the level of a
companion of the prophet.

Where there were authentic chains but insufficient number of narrators the recitations were accepted as explanations (Tafseer) of the companions but were not considered as methods of reciting the Qur'an.

All others are rejected.

I haven't seen your truth

You stated 27 and listed 17 what happened your truth motor ran out of gas?

TenQ:

You tell me.?

At least I have shown you that Warsh Qur'an and Hafs Qur'an doesn't agree with earth other.

So, my Sheik Ohyoudidnt, from Qur'an 2:125, is watakhizu still the same as watakhazu ?

Or maybe It's just a style of pronunciation written down so that it changes the word of Allah into something Allah didn't say!

Have a nice day sir.
It's important to know that your Islamic scholars play Taqqiya on you in glorifying the Qur'an.

When you know the Truth , the Truth will set you free.
Jesus said:
I am the Way, the Truth and the Life, no one comes to the Father except by Me.

Ohyoudidnt:
You have claimed 27, 32 and say we will get to 70 but named only 17. You forgot the names of the 10 to make it to 27?

Nevertheless, were there variations in recitation done by Muhammad pbuh?

Was he aware his companions and other muslims recited differently?

Did he say one recitation was wrong and the other right?

Did the companions continue this trend?

You worry about an act to safeguard the variations from possible corruption which is referred to as the Uthmani codex yet are in awe that ancient arabic writing accomodates the 7 or 10 styles of recitations. Simply
by adding a letter or omitting a letter, or elongating or shortening a vowel or placement of diacritical marks.

We have gone through a few specific examples and there aren't any critical or worrisome differences in the meaning of the verse.

Now; if these variations were not known in the time of the Prophet pbuh there will be issues but they have been known in his presence. He did not condemn or forbid them. An added benefit to grant from Allah ease to his followers. You know the just before dawn meal and end of the fast by sunset is another of these grants.

These variations all fall within set limits such that for any accepted recitation;
* It must have an authentic chain of narration where the chain of narrators was continuous

* The narrators were all known to be righteous
* The narrators were all known to possess
good memories.
* The recitation be conveyed by a large
number of narrators on each level of the
chain of narration below the level of a
companion of the prophet.

Where there were authentic chains but insufficient number of narrators the recitations were accepted as explanations (Tafseer) of the companions but were not considered as methods of reciting the Qur'an.

All others are rejected.

The narrators have good memories yet Uthman rejected all their Qur'an for his own standardised Qur'an.

At least, I have shown you CHANGES in meanings in black and white as a result of your changes in spellings.

No matter how you repeat falsehoods, it doesn't make it True.


So my friend,
Is the Qur'an still perfectly preserved word for word up to the diacritical marks according to the Islamic preferred Narrative ?

Ohyoudidnt:
I haven't seen your truth

You stated 27 and listed 17 what happened your truth motor ran out of gas?

How could you be this shameless.
If you have the time, transcribe out the list for me from the two attached videos.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7YFb92_Npk


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLq3GOwmC8M


Above is what you claim not to watch and SEE : watch it now and it even has audio for you to simultaneously LISTEN to it for correct pronunciation!

From only 1 Qur'an, you claim 7 dialects: anything after 7 is not defendable sir!

Does your sharing of videos that point at wrong titling justifies your falsehoods?

Don't these Mushafs include the style and transmitters?

Are what you labelled as Ibn 'Amir an Shaybah and Hisham an Ibn 'Amir different from Hafs ibn Asim?

Is this too different from Yaqub an Nafi'?

What is different between Khalaf an Hamzah,
Khallad an Hamzah?

Look picking names of transmitters instead of their reading doesn't amount to different Quran.

Why weren't these different books opened by Jay Smith to show differences in their verses?

Ohyoudidnt:
Does your sharing of videos that point at wrong titling justifies your falsehoods?

Don't these Mushafs include the style and transmitters?

Are what you labelled as Ibn 'Amir an Shaybah and Hisham an Ibn 'Amir different from Hafs ibn Asim?

Is this too different from Yaqub an Nafi'?

What is different between Khalaf an Hamzah,
Khallad an Hamzah?

Look picking names of transmitters instead of their reading doesn't amount to different Quran.

Why weren't these different books opened by Jay Smith to show differences in their verses?

I can't help but laugh at you.

Only one ERROR is enough to burst the comedy of your standard Islamic Narrative.

Which of these Qur'an is the Exact Quraish Arabic Qur'an on the mother tablet in Heaven dictated to Mohammed?

Is it the Hafs or the Warsh or the numerous other Qurans in existence?

May Allah reward you. As I was advised it is often fruitless with a lot of these guys. It really is a period of dajullun.

They think the recitations differ in core message picking single word variations here and there and exclusively reading without going with the entire verse

They don't know or in a bid to deceive think the ummah is unaware of the 10 recitations.

Ohyoudidnt:
Does your sharing of videos that point at wrong titling justifies your falsehoods?

Don't these Mushafs include the style and transmitters?

Are what you labelled as Ibn 'Amir an Shaybah and Hisham an Ibn 'Amir different from Hafs ibn Asim?

Is this too different from Yaqub an Nafi'?

What is different between Khalaf an Hamzah,
Khallad an Hamzah?

Look picking names of transmitters instead of their reading doesn't amount to different Quran.

Why weren't these different books opened by Jay Smith to show differences in their verses?

1.Abu Ruwaym Ibn ʽAbd ar-Rahman Ibn Abi Naʽim al-Laythi better known as Nafiʽ al-Madani and His method of recitation via his two most famous students, Qalun and Warsh, is the most common Quran reading mode in North Africa, West Africa and Qatar.A large number of narrators became famous for his recitation, and among them are four of the narrators in the “Small Ten
2.Abdullah bin Kathir al-Makki, who is the second reciter of the seven. He read to Abdullah bin al-Sa’ib and his students Abdullah bin Abbas as Mujahid bin Jabr and others. He became famous through his narrators Ahmed Al-Bazi and Muhammad Qunbul.
3.Abu Amr bin Al-Alaa Al-Mazni Al-Basri, the imam of the people of Basra in reading and Arabic. Abu Muhammad Al-Yazidi took the reading from him, and narrated it from him. Abu Omar al-Douri and Abu Shuaib Al-Susi are famous for reading from him.
4.Abdullah bin Amer Al-Yahsabi, the imam of the people of the Levant. His narration is famous through the narrators Hisham bin Ammar and Abdullah bin Dhakwan
5. Asim bin Abi Al-Nujud Al-Kufi, the imam of the people of Kufa, read to Abi Abd Al-Rahman Abdullah bin Habib Al-Salami from the Tabi’een ,Shu'bah bin Ayyash and Hafs bin Suleiman relate from him
6.Hamza bin Habib al-Zayyat, the imam of the people of Kufa after Asim. He read to Hamran bin Ain and Suleiman bin Mahran al-Amash. His two famous narrators are Khalaf bin Hisham Al-Baghdadi and Khallad bin Khalid
7.Abu Al-Hassan Ali bin Hamza Al-Kisa’i Al-Asadi, the imam of the people of Kufa after Asim and Hamza Abu Omar al-Douri advanced. Abu al-Harith al-Laith ibn Khalid

Completing the 10 readings collected by some of the imams and are added to the 7 canonical stated above are:
8 The reading of Abi Jaafar Yazid and his two narrators are:
1. Suleiman bin Muslim bin
Jammaz
2. Issa bin Wardan,
9 The reading of Yaqoub bin Ishaq
Al-Hadrami who has two
narrators:
Muhammad ibn al-Mutawakkil, known as Royce and Rawh bin Abd al-Mumin al-Hudhali
10. Khalaf bin Hisham Al-Baghdadi is called Khalaf the Tenth, in order to distinguish his narration from the aforementioned Hamza from his chosen reading, which is the completion of the ten readings. Two narrators of him are Ishaq bin Ibrahim Al-Warraq and Idris Al-Haddad.


The last three primarily used in tafsir.

Imagine picking narrators as separate recitation.

Let them watch their 'discovery' shattered


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bm-mv9SH7sU



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8lRzGHrPC0

TenQ:
Sorry for the late reply, I was placed on Ban by the Nairaland Bots!

My argument is that the verse on Breastfeeding was DELETED from the Quran and not on the meaning of the remaining verses

I showed you several evidences that the verses used to be RECITED up to the time of the death of Mohammed.
Suddenly check throughout the whole Quran, we cannot find it again.

What Happened?
Deleted by people who took offence of it.

All the Hadiths below show that Allah revealed the verse of Breastfeeding Adult men in the Qur'an


Sunan an-Nasa'i 3307: Book 26, Hadith 112
It was narrated that 'Aishah said:
"One of the things that Allah, the Mighty and Sublime, revealed" -(one of the narrators) Al-Harith said (in his narration): "One of the things that were revealed in the Qur'an"- "was that ten known breast-feedings make marriage prohibited, then that was abrogated and changed to five known breast-feedings. Then the Messenger of Allah passed away when this was something that was still being recited in the Qur'an."

Sunan Ibn Majah 1942: Book 9, Hadith 98
It was narrated that 'Aishah said:
“Once of the things that Allah revealed in the the Qur'an and then abrogated was that nothing makes marriage prohibited except ten breastfeedings or five well-known (breastfeedings).”



Sunan Ibn Majah 1944: Book 9, Hadith 100
It was narrated that 'Aishah said:
“The Verse of stoning and of breastfeeding an adult ten times was revealed and the paper was with me under my pillow. When the Messenger of Allah died, we were preoccupied with his death, and a tame sheep came in and ate it.”



Are you now convinced or the hadiths are all FABRICATIONS!?






The Hadiths above showed that
1. The verse of Breastfeeding was Revealed by Allah
2. The verse used to be recited up to the time of the death of Mohammed
3. There was no evidence to show that the verse was completely abrogated: what was abrogated was a reduction from ten times breastfeeding to five time breastfeeding

If you can provide the Quran of Abu Bakr or the Quran of Uthman, we may find it

The hadiths were recorded by Muslims for Muslims. Why would they tell damaging lies about their esteemed prophet.

By the way, all the three hadiths I presented are Sahih

Only Aisha spoke about her own written verse that was eaten by a ame sheep. The verse as you can see were memorised and recited.

Well what I understand from the Quran, is most of narrations in hadith are somewhat at odds with the Quranic teaching. Hadith look like the work of someone who has never seen nor read the Quran. If you are sincere researcher you would have noticed that by now. At best, I can say Hadith is a work of people trying to understand the Quran, in their own way. I have proofs to demonstrate how hadiths had been fabricated and attributed to the belove prophet of God(Muhammad). But that is beyond the scope of our discussion.

Only Aisha spoke about her own written verse that was eaten by lame sheep? Is that all you have to say to wave the irregularities in the story away? A revelation that was said to be revealed in the presence of multitudes of people both from the polytheists and the believer side. You mean to tell me Only Aisha recorded it? Haba oga! If others recorded there own did the goat ate them too? We might want to also know why the goat is so selective.

You see I don't care about what the Hadith said as I don't believe in them. I am just pointing irregularities in the story for you to thinl and reflect, if the hadith has anything to do with the Quran. I am not here to argue with you. In fact I am happy. Perhaps this will make them think and see what this Hadith are truly are.

satmaniac:


Well what I understand from the Quran, is most of narrations in hadith are somewhat at odds with the Quranic teaching. Hadith look like the work of someone who has never seen nor read the Quran. If you are sincere researcher you would have noticed that by now. At best, I can say Hadith is a work of people trying to understand the Quran, in their own way. I have proofs to demonstrate how hadiths had been fabricated and attributed to the belove prophet of God(Muhammad). But that is beyond the scope of our discussion.

Only Aisha spoke about her own written verse that was eaten by lame sheep? Is that all you have to say to wave the irregularities in the story away? A revelation that was said to be revealed in the presence of multitudes of people both from the polytheists and the believer side. You mean to tell me Only Aisha recorded it? Haba oga! If others recorded there own did the goat ate them too? We might want to also know why the goat is so selective.

You see I don't care about what the Hadith said as I don't believe in them. I am just pointing irregularities in the story for you to thinl and reflect, if the hadith has anything to do with the Quran. I am not here to argue with you. In fact I am happy. Perhaps this will make them think and see what this Hadith are truly are.

I appreciate your observation, unfortunately,
1. There is no Islam without the hadiths
2. Muslim scholars have tried to sanitise the hadiths by grading them as Sahih, Hassan, Daif and Fabricated. All the hadiths I've quoted are Sahih except for the one of tame sheep eating the Qur'an which is Hassan.
3. Except Muslims generally by nature are liars, there is no reason for most of the hadiths being untrustworthy
4. Since non of you modern Muslims were around at the writing of the hadiths, how can you prove that the hadiths are untruthful?
5. I am sure you dont practice Mutah, unfortunately, this you got from the hadiths not the Qur'an.


Aisha had a written copy BUT she also has a reason to hide the copy of the verse on stoning (and breastfeeding) so that the case of adultery may not be revisited over her after the death of Mohammed. Of course, there were other hadiths that reported that the RECITATION of the verses used to be done by Muslims .

I agree that a lot of historical truths about Islam is embarrassing to modern Muslims and thus, you want to DELETE it from Islam if possible. It's not only about the hadiths alone but also about the oldest set of historical books about Islam. Unfortunately, the Qur'an cannot stand alone as an Islamic source for Muslims.

Thanks and have a good night rest sir

TenQ:


I appreciate your observation, unfortunately,
1. There is no Islam without the hadiths
2. Muslim scholars have tried to sanitise the hadiths by grading them as Sahih, Hassan, Daif and Fabricated. All the hadiths I've quoted are Sahih except for the one of tame sheep eating the Qur'an which is Hassan.
3. Except Muslims generally by nature are liars, there is no reason for most of the hadiths being untrustworthy
4. Since non of you modern Muslims were around at the writing of the hadiths, how can you prove that the hadiths are untruthful?
5. I am sure you dont practice Mutah, unfortunately, this you got from the hadiths not the Qur'an.


Aisha had a written copy BUT she also has a reason to hide the copy of the verse on stoning (and breastfeeding) so that the case of adultery may not be revisited over her after the death of Mohammed. Of course, there were other hadiths that reported that the RECITATION of the verses used to be done by Muslims .

I agree that a lot of historical truths about Islam is embarrassing to modern Muslims and thus, you want to DELETE it from Islam if possible. It's not only about the hadiths alone but also about the oldest set of historical books about Islam. Unfortunately, the Qur'an cannot stand alone as an Islamic source for Muslims.

Thanks and have a good night rest sir

No islam without Hadith? Did you know the Hadith at most came 200 years letter after the death of prophet Muhammad? Go search when was Muwatta Imam malik(One of the earliest Hadith) was collected. So you mean to tell me people have not been practicing Islam until the Hadiths were collected long after Muhammad was gone?

She has hidden her own copy of the stoning, and yet she said it used to be there. Does this sound like someone trying to hide something? The thing I am trying to tell you is there is no event of Gharaneeq and neither is there law approving stoning of adultery. Guess where we can find that. Yeah, in the bible. I think someone tried smuggling the Jewish law into Islam and sine there is no basis for it from the Quran. He or her manufactured such stories.

A lot of historical truth you say. Yet these embarrassing accounts can't be found in the Quran, unless in invented sources that were fabricated long after the apostle of God was gone?
So,if you want to know what Muhammad had said or done, then pick up a Quran. This is how you know. The coomand of what he should and should not do, were given in there. That is how you know what is truth or not. Unless you and your opponent are trying to say he disoby the commands.
Who grade as Sahih? God or his appostle? You need to dig deeper into the history of Hadith, you will understand that Hadith is an attempt by satan to corrupt the pure teachings contains in the Quran. Oh the all-knowing God, the creator of all has foreseen this and forecast it in the Quran, in the following verses 6:112 "We have permitted the enemies of every prophet-human and jinn devils-to inspire in each other fancy words(like goat eating revelations) in order to deceive. Had your willed they would have not done it. You should disregard them and their fabrications."
Ignoring such fabrications: This what I am doing and Iurge you and your opponent to do the same.

satmaniac:


No islam without Hadith? Did you know the Hadith at most came 200 years letter after the death of prophet Muhammad? Go search when was Muwatta Imam malik(One of the earliest Hadith) was collected. So you mean to tell me people have not been practicing Islam until the Hadiths were collected long after Muhammad was gone?

Of course we know that the hadiths were collected much later and so were most of the historical books of Islam and the Tafsir.
The traditions and the history were what people collected as the hadiths, tafsir and history of Islam.
1. How will you know how to pray from the Qur'an alone
2. How will you know how to slaughter from the Qur'an alone
3. Would you not be practicing Mutah from the Qur'an alone?
4. From the Qur'an alone won't you be practicing marriage of pre-puberscent girls and divorcing them?

The problem is that the Qur'an is in fragments and incomplete without the other books. For instance, from the Qur'an alone can you tell me the meaning of Messiah? From the Qur'an alone can you tell me who Israel is?

This is a big problem sir. The problem was hidden all along simply because only the Rich Scholars could afford the collection of the full library of compilation of the books of hadiths, Tafsir and History of Islam. But now, the internet broke this barrier plus the barrier of the mastery of the Arabic language.

satmaniac:

She has hidden her own copy of the stoning, and yet she said it used to be there. Does this sound like someone trying to hide something? The thing I am trying to tell you is there is no event of Gharaneeq and neither is there law approving stoning of adultery. Guess where we can find that. Yeah, in the bible. I think someone tried smuggling the Jewish law into Islam and sine there is no basis for it from the Quran. He or her manufactured such stories.

But it wasn't Aisha alone who gave narrations of the report of stoning and breastfeeding in the hadiths. They ALL agreed the the verses USED to be RECITED as part of the Qur'an.
Of course, this is not the only verses acclaimed by early Muslims to be absent from the Qur'an of Uthman. Many of these were forgotten and some remembered in fragments.

satmaniac:

A lot of historical truth you say. Yet these embarrassing accounts can't be found in the Quran, unless in invented sources that were fabricated long after the apostle of God was gone?
So,if you want to know what Muhammad had said or done, then pick up a Quran. This is how you know. The coomand of what he should and should not do, were given in there. That is how you know what is truth or not. Unless you and your opponent are trying to say he disoby the commands.
Who grade as Sahih? God or his appostle? You need to dig deeper into the history of Hadith, you will understand that Hadith is an attempt by satan to corrupt the pure teachings contains in the Quran. Oh the all-knowing God, the creator of all has foreseen this and forecast it in the Quran, in the following verses 6:112 "We have permitted the enemies of every prophet-human and jinn devils-to inspire in each other fancy words(like goat eating revelations) in order to deceive. Had your willed they would have not done it. You should disregard them and their fabrications."
Ignoring such fabrications: This what I am doing and Iurge you and your opponent to do the same.

I think the reasons these hadiths and Tafsir especially came in were to explain the Context of the verses of the Qur'an especially as Islam began to spread to areas with knowledgeable Jews and Christians on matters of History in the earlier revealed scriptures disputing with the Islamic claims
It is impossible to explain from the Qur'an alone
1. The denial of the Crucifixion of Jesus
2. The seeming Prophethood of Zhulqanain
3. Mohammed not knowing with certainty if he's going to paradise or hell fire
4. All Muslims entering the fire of Hell (but later removed)
5. Mary mother of Jesus mistaken for Mariam daughter of Amran who was sister of Aaron and Moses

Without the Hadiths and Tafsir and the Historical books, no body would be able to make sense of the Qur'an. It's like a book that dropped right out of the blues that even though is expected to be a follow up of the earlier revealed scriptures contradict it so much that they can't be bound together in a single volume (like the old and new Testament).

Denying the Hadiths, Tafsir and the Islamic Historical books creates other dilemma and unsolvable problems for Islam.

But why would these sincere Muslims of Old write damning things about their beloved Prophet? You will agree with me that Fabrications in religion are usually done by people to embellish the truth to make it more grander, nicer and glorious. Report of events that are seemingly Raw, Unpolished and Derogatory are usually Truths as the events happened.