₦airaland Forum

toshmann: The child may be given up for adoption.
Listen, rappe is a terrible situation. There's no good news when one is rapped. The best thing to do here is prevention.
But if it happens, first of all catch the criminal if we can, lock him up and throw away the keys.
Take the woman to hospital to get treatment which included STD treatment and contraception.
If that fails then we must plan to take care of the mother and child.
I don't know what else you want me to say. But PREVENTION is the key

you are male. you are not in any position whatsoever to decide or judge what a r.aped woman does to her unwanted pregnancy.
the logical thing being to get rid of it.
when u become a woman, then u can come back and comment. until then, this is not your issue or topic. why do male always feel themselves expert and authority on women issues?

if the males can't be around to even know the child's name. why should a woman suffer throughout her life to be reminded of an horror. rubbish

toshmann: Why is there so much racism in your post. Your posts are just here to bash black men. If you are one of them girls ladies/women/females (I don't know what will offend you there, no vex) that love to bash black men in front of their white boyfriends I wish you luck. But I though we are discussing feminism here.

You've turned the thread into something else. Black males this, whites better, blacks this. Etc

Guess what, you're black. Deal with it. Your children will also be black, deal with it. White people didnt accept Michael Jackson as one of them with all his "white skin" na you dem go accept?

Best you can be is their . . . . .

last time I checked, senator wendy williams was a feminist white. not black.
besides, the discussion on this topic is sort of a carryover from another tread created by a misogynist to bash black women and accuse them of raising children out of wedlock as if it was a criminal act to be a single mother. if u click on the politics forum and scroll down, u will see it.
also, black feminism is interesting in the sense that black males assume that its ok for them to be misogynistic since racism is supposedly "bigger" than sexism. therefore women should be fighting against racism for all rather than looking at the sexism in black community. many women fall for this trap hence the reason why nothing has yet been done to, for example, attack and bring down the misogynist attitudes that define what we know as "black music"
and music is just one example. sexism can be found in every single aspect of the culture.

fellis: In your opinion.

Nothing to proove that your opinion is right, no proof, no evidence etc. You just feel like making feminists look bad so you blame them for carrying out a false research work.

I had a lot of respect for you before today biola.

hahah he's the same guy who got all up in arms over being called a misogynist. yet he sees no problem associating the good name of feminism with stupid research.
irony much?

I'm sure chimamanda is a feminist for a reason. she is a successful, intelligent professional woman. she will not let any man kick her around. yet she's married at 35. which means that there are men out there (however few there are) who support gender equality. the more of those men that exist, the higher marriage rates will go.

toshmann: Now that's some feminist talking.

But even here I disagree with it. Men and women are not supposed to be competing but complementing each other.

Many marriages breakdown bc there seems to be some sort of conflict from competition within.

hahaha @ your first sentence.
all I can picture is a old white male republican looking at herman cain and saying "Now that's my ni*gger talking"

anyway to respond to your post:
marriages break down because some men have not gotten the memo that traditional gender roles are no longer relevant in 2013. women are working just as much as men. yet they are expected to play tradtional roles in the home. this doesn't work. In marriages where men are more supportive and recognize the need of redefined roles, marriages are more successful. of course this is taking place, like I said, among upper middle class whites. marriage rates are going up for them. and as usual, blacks are always the last to catch up. which is ironic because black males have the least ability of any other race to be financially supportive in the family, yet they also choose to be unsupportive domestically. and u wonder why such marriages won't work.

haconni: These are helpful. Very helpful but some situations can be very dire.

I agree.

nice tips.
but,to make women even more secure, government should enforce laws to punish men who sex.ually and violently abuse women. that way, men will think twice before thinking of harming women.
the reason they do it is because they know they can get away with it and the woman will be blamed for not following your so called "tips"
none of these tips are bulletproof and let us put the onus on the men as well to be more responsible and respectful toward women. that is the best tip of all. Too bad it's not mentioned in your post.

I.Joan:
I really wish women would stop doing this!!!

the burden argument is a myth.
infact women carry the most burden in most societies. esp poor ones.


reminds me of whites who were complaining during colonization that they were carrying a burden. they called it "white man's burden" lol as if blacks begged to be colonized.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_White_Man%27s_Burden

toshmann: Now I see a lot of "black male" this "black man" that in your posts. Are we still discussing or trying to discuss feminism?

If you want to discuss black males and incarceration you can start a thread on it. The overwhelming incarceration of black males is no excuse to desire abprtion rights or cry out for feminism. What is the link between black make incarceration and feminism?
And I hope the feminism you talk about is the one I know bc you seem to be talking about race now. Your focused your aim at black men

well. go back to the first post on this thread. u will see that chimamanda is talking about black feminism.
whites have advanced to a large extent and still advancing. besides, I assume that we are all black on this topic so why not focus on the koko of the matter.

what is the link between black incarceration and feminism, you say?
well, u are the one who brought up the idea that black single parent hood is the result of feminism (VERY WRONG assumption by the way) and then I countered the argument by saying that black incarceration affects single parenthood much much much more than feminism can even dream of impacting single parenthood
hope u get it now!

i'm still trying to figure out in my head how a homophobic person can claim to be a supporter of gay rights.
hahaha. this is so funny and ironic at the same time.

just because you are not out there stoning gay people to death so that means gay people should start thanking u as a supporter?
the level of condescension in that post is ridiculous!!

toshmann: I detest homosexuality and lesbianism but I support gay rights.

ehhh. you make absolutely no sense here. you cannot detest homosexuality and lesbianism and support gay rights.
you can say that you are indifferent to gay rights then it would make sense
because no gay person in their right mind will look at you and call you a supporter.


this condescending tone is the same u assume when you are talking about women's rights. You need to look in d mirror and check urself.

^ exactly

i'm sure there is data out there to show that children fare better in single parent household than in abusive two-parent household.
if there isn't then i won't know what to say except to question the motives of the marriage researchers u are citing. many of whom are probably male.

also, a child being raised in a single parent household is no different than a child raised in a two parent household where the father is not involved at all in the child's development. to make thing worse, if such a man is unemployed (as they tend to be in america), then he becomes useless in d family which is why there is high rate of single parent households in d first place. if a "father" can't contribute emotionally and to make things worse, he can't contribute financially, then what purpose does he serve as a "father"? why isn't society pointing to this sperm donor posing as a father?

toshmann: Like I said, responsible single mothers are preferable to abusive fathers.

ok. so shouldn't we spend more time attacking abusive fathers than we spend attacking single mothers?

there is a high number of black males in jail and involved in criminal activity. don't you think this bears a correlation to why many black childen grow up in single parent household? do you think the women just intentionally decided that "oh I want my child to grow up in the worst possible environment possible"?

biolabee: You used one case in a state that adopted sharia - Zamfara by a gov who was playing to the gallery
For your info, nigerians condemned that act and sought int'l opinion to further sway the pendulum
There are more stonings in afghanistan than in northern nigeria

You said stonings is common in northern nigeria - FALLACY!!

right.because afghanistan men stone their women more than nigerian men stone their women.therefore nigeria must be a doing a great thing?
rubbish. since u are here to defend sharia and who knows maybe u want it to extend thougout nigeria (u already mentioned that women should be blamed for unwanted pregnancy and men have no responsibility for it). in the same contradictory breath you also condemned women's right to abortion.

biolabee: Now you have called me a misogynist,... if u cant have a issue-based discussion without resorting to name-calling and insults, i will have to leave this thread

misogynist shouldn't be an insult to you because all the ideas you have laid out here are misogynist. embrace your ideology proudly. you ARE a misogynist.

Black fathers urged to be more involved with children


Prominent black MP David Lammy will tell the Runnymede race think tank that fathers must take more responsibility.

In a speech on Monday, he will say this would address issues such as education underachievement and high crime rates.

The higher education minister will also praise women in families where fathers are either absent or uninvolved.

In the event to link in with Mothering Sunday, he will say: "What many women want for Mothers' Day can't be given by their children - it is more engaged fathers."

Mr Lammy will touch on figures that suggest 59% of black Caribbean and 44% of black African children grow up in single-parent families.

"The mark of a man is not how many children he spawns but how he matches up as a father," he will say.

Mr Lammy will also call for fathers from all backgrounds to remain in touch with their children whatever the relationship with their mothers.

He will say: "Between a quarter and a third of children with separated parents have little or no contact with their fathers.

"It is not just the structure of families that matters. It is whether fathers continue to contribute to their children's lives."

He will argue that "modern fatherhood needs updating from the traditional model", saying that young people need "an emotional bond with their father".

The speech at the House of Commons will be accompanied by recorded video interviews with leading black figures such as broadcaster Sir Trevor McDonald and chart-topping rapper Tinie Tempah.

Sir Trevor said his father had a major influence on his life.

He told Mr Lammy: "My father always said 'Reach for the stars and you may get to the top of the trees, but you have to aim high'."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/8565277.stm

among whites, even children who grow up with divorced parents still have close relationship with their fathers and are more likely to support the child's growth.
but among blacks, the men have no attachment whatsoever to their children. it is very pathologically sickening.

also, in black families with two parents, you still have high rates of abuse so much so that black children are more likely to be forcefully removed from the family (by the government) and put into foster care.

how do you explain this?
@ davidlan, biolabee, toshman, and other misogynists, how do you explain this?

the funniest thing is that blacks are usually the most sexist and homophobic.
partially because whites have power over them, they in turn look for where to gain power and decide to lash out against women, children and gays.

in fact, good thing that many of the women are single because I am 100% sure many of those kids will suffer from the hands of abusive fathers more than they suffer from being raised with single mothers!!

those statistics claim that children fare better under 2 parent household. yet u cannot know how those one-parent children will fare if they had been raised under the same roof with their fathers (i am talking about black ghetto where there is extreme pathology of violence and crime). the women are single for a reason. the men are probably impossible to live with.
even white society puts them in jail because they are dangerous to society. how much more danger they will pose when they are sharing the same room with women and kids!!

biolabee: the question was how many,,,,, only one case so far

yeah. the only case that gained international status.
imagine if the miss world program hadn't happened then, nobody would have even heard about the amina case.

toshmann: D'you realize that all I said is that women should be careful about the kind of man they sleep with. If perhaps they are so much in love with a nuisance, they should at least take preventive measures against unwanted pregnancy. Is that difficult?
Many women do that and they have no problems, no pregnancy and no baggage of bastards to bring up.

of course a single mother has to go through much more than if she were married to a supportive husband. that's her cross to bear OK. we all have our crosses to bear. even many married women are suffering in silence. that's also their cross. the choose to look good in society while they suffer behind close doors for fear of societal persecution.

but when misogynist males come in and start feeling they can persecute a single woman and accuse her of things she is not responsible for, then that's where feminism come in.
these men are not helping to raise her child for her, so why should they be judge over what is right for her child? or what punishment she deserves for being a single mother?
how many men are raising children? extremely few. so then why are there so many men who have deem themselves expert on child rearing/ experts on who to blame for child rearing?

Facing Death for Adultery, Nigerian Woman Is Acquitted
By SOMINI SENGUPTA
Published: September 26, 2003

KATSINA, Nigeria, Sept. 25— Amina Lawal, the Nigerian peasant woman whose case became known worldwide after she was sentenced to death by stoning for adultery, was acquitted today by the highest Islamic court in her state.

A roar of approval swept through the small, sweltering courtroom when a five-member panel of judges ruled 4 to 1 to overturn Ms. Lawal's conviction in a case that had heaped worldwide opprobrium on Nigeria, Africa's most populous country and one in which the split between Muslims and Christians has become increasingly sharp.

Her veiled head bowed, Ms. Lawal sat quietly, holding in her lap what had been cited as the chief evidence of her crime: her daughter, Wasila, now almost 2 years old. Ms. Lawal was to be executed as soon as she had finished weaning the child.

When a judge, Ibrahim Mai-Unguwa, finished his 60-minute recitation of the panel's ruling, Wasila let out an ear-splitting wail, as if to signal her relief.

Later in the day came cries of relief from distant corners of the world. Both Italy and Brazil had offered asylum to Ms. Lawal.

Mother and child were ushered into a side room immediately after the ruling and escorted out of the courtroom under heavy police guard.

Hauwa Ibrahim, one of Ms. Lawal's lawyers, beamed as she stepped out of the courtroom. ''It is a victory for justice, it is a victory for the law, it is a victory for freedom,'' she said. ''Amina is free today.''

Ms. Lawal, who had been living at her father's home pending outcome of the appeal, was sentenced under Shariah, or Islamic law, which has swept across the country's largely Muslim north over the last three years. Human rights groups condemned her sentence as a violation of international treaties against torture, which Nigeria has signed. . The defense argued that death by stoning was not allowed under the Nigerian Constitution.

Today's ruling relieves Nigeria's president, Olusegun Obasanjo, a born-again Christian from the heavily Yoruba region in the south. from having to intervene directly. Mr. Obasanjo had said that the country's Constitution would ultimately spare Ms. Lawal's life, a possibility that carried the potential for antagonizing his country's largely Muslim, ethnic Hausa north.

Ethnic violence is estimated to have killed some 10,000 Nigerians since 1999. Home to 120 million people, Nigeria is one of the world's biggest oil exporters and is a critical economic and political ally of the United States.

Ms. Lawal's March 2002 conviction for adultery was overturned today by the Katsina State Shariah Court of Appeals, largely on the basis of technicalities in the application of Islamic law. It remains unclear what impact, if any, it will have on the dozens of other Shariah sentences now pending before Islamic courts, some of which involve execution by stoning. Just this week, for instance, another Shariah court, also in the north, convicted a man of sodomy and sentenced him to death by stoning, Agence France-Presse reported.

Ms. Lawal, who was divorced, had admitted to having had a relationship with a man she identified as the father of the child. The man denied the charge, swore on the Koran, and was deemed innocent by the trial court. No one suggested DNA tests. The court ordered that Ms. Lawal be executed.

The Shariah Court of Appeals here in the state capital cobbles together the rituals of British and Islamic legal systems. The courtroom is a former state government building, painted sea blue. The judges wear caftans and turbans. Lawyers from both sides maintain the dress code left over from British colonial rule: black gowns and wigs.

Today, in an opinion read aloud in the regional language, Hausa, the appeals panel overturned the original conviction, largely on the basis of irregularities. It found that the lower courts had been wrong not to allow Ms. Lawal to retract her earlier confession. Moreover, the court ruled, the first confession was invalid because it was uttered only once, instead of four times, as required by Islamic law, and only one judge presided over the first trial, instead of the requisite three.

The panel also cited more substantive grounds. The police officers who arrested Ms. Lawal produced no witnesses to fornication, the court said. The court also gave a nod to what defense lawyers had called the ''sleeping embryo'' theory: under some interpretations of Shariah, an embryo can be in gestation for up to five years, meaning that Ms. Lawal's baby could have been fathered by her former husband.

The one dissenting judge on the panel, Sule Sada, argued that there was nothing wrong with the way Ms. Lawal's confession was drawn and that her conviction should stand.

Speaking for the prosecution, the Katsina state counsel, Nurulhuda Mahmud Darma, told reporters today: ''Whatever the court determines is our guidance.''

The appeals court did not accept one of the key substantive arguments offered by the defense. Ms. Ibrahim had argued that to consider pregnancy as evidence of a crime inherently discriminates against women, and therefore violates an important tenet of Islamic thought: that men and women are equal before the law.

Shariah law governs everything from prayers and meals to custody battles and sexual behavior to spelling out the punishment for crimes like robbery and rape. Twelve of the country's 36 states have put Shariah into effect since 1999, though the code does not apply to Christians living in those states. Ms. Lawal is the second Nigerian woman to be condemned to death for having sex outside marriage. The first, Safiya Hussaini, had her sentence overturned on appeal.

Photo: Amina Lawal held her daughter, Wasila, in her lap in the Katsina State Shariah Court of Appeals yesterday. Her defense team stood behind her. (Photo by Jacob Silberberg for The New York Times) Map of Nigeria highlighting Katsina: Islamic law is in effect in Katsina and other north Nigerian states.

biolabee: where do you get this your facts from ?? haba......
how many women have been stoned in northern nigeria....
Now it seems you are grasping for straws

when it gets to such a point where international countries have to come and intervene to save a nigerian woman from nigerian men. you know things are not right.

toshmann: Which is why women should be careful the kind of man they open legs for.

again, why is it ok that the men can do all these horrible things and go scot free while women are persecuted and blamed for ills?
yes they did "wrong" to open their legs or walk alone on the street or wear clothes that make them look hot.
but are you now advocating that women should wear burqa because otherwise, they are at fault if anything bad happens in society?
do you prefer that we turn into a muslim society?
god forbid the day we start stoning women. like they do in northern nigeria and middle east.
is that exactly what u are trying to say?

some women choose to be single mothers. they want a good husband and when they can't find one, they choose to raise a child single handedly. not every woman is lucky enough to find a husband who has a job/ offers to be a househusband if he is jobless. LOL

biolabee: I laff in feminism////

I'm glad you can laugh in feminism.

davidylan: Those loser men need a willing hole to procreate.

well, let's focus some of our energy on those loser men rather than on women all the time.
I know the temptation is great to persecute those we feel are more vulnerable than us, namely women and children, but if u don't like being called a misogynist, then stop talking like one.

davidylan: and these "everybody" get their facts from?

go on the bill gates website and listen to some of his ted talks on population.
better still, try to track the organizations and projects he funds.

why are women and children always targeted?
https://www.nairaland.com/340584/village-witches-beaten-india#16532873

@biolabbe,
you know posting silly gifs make u look foolish and defeated right? u r putting urself on d same level as pleep and cameroon.

women and children are always targeted because they are the most vulnerable and powerless in society. especially third world societies where women and children have less rights

davidylan: you do know the above is false no?

yadi yadi yada. everybody knows that bill gates main mission is population control in third world. he himself doesn't hide it. and promotes sterilization, birth control and other population control methods all over the third world.

blacks can be equally just as racist as whites.
but white racism is the most dangerous because whites have the power to turn their opinion into action and inflict great harm.

this is why feminists (many of whom are middle class and actually not that vulnerable) advocate on behalf of women, many of whom are sometimes powerless to stand up for themselves against misogynists.

gaining power is the most important thing. people can have their opinion if they want. but as long as they do not have the power to persecute or do harm. then that's the goal

toshmann: I wonder what feminists would say if a man suggests women are sterilized

hahah what do you think feminists have been saying for hundreds of years?
bill gates has a mission to sterilize women all over the third world (esp. india) for being "poor"
it's all part of the Malthusian theory
even in israel, black women there were being sterilized.

again, the most vulnerable people in society are always blamed for all problems and target for harsh treatments.
that's why feminists fight to gain power in society.

trust me a single mother who is a CEO of a company cannot be touched. even if society thinks evil of her, they can't do anything to harm her.
where as, if she were vulnerable, she can be harmed and then the harm will be justified based on the opinion that she is the cause of all evils.

wonder why misogynist men like to say children are raised better in two parent households. yet they ever focus on the missing part of the story: the man. where is the man? what is he doing?
as if these misogynist men even care at all about children.
in fact, those single mothers could have chosen to put their kids in garbage and dumpsters. yet they sacrifice to raise these kids singlehandedly while the "father" is out somewhere absolved of all responsibility (if he is not paying child support). duh. it is obvious where majority of the blame should fall. isn't it?

davidylan: Most of them didnt... they are mostly irresponsible girls from broken homes themselves who will spread their legs for any fool all in the name of "swag". They also know that they can use those kids as bargaining chips to obtain government services they dont deserve. Too bad their kids simply perpetuate the unfortunate cycle of irresponsibility.

again, I will rather choose to be single than "marry" any criminal male from the ghetto.