JMAN05:

Let me assume that your last words were sincere.

Now answer me:

When did Cyrus make the decree that jews should return?

How was this secular date arrived at? by the time you give it to me, then I will open your eyes cos it is still blocked for now.

truthislight: @arsenalwenger

Now, that you are a liar is very obviouse.

And that you are a deceitful fellow is esterblished from the contradictory lies in your post.

See below:



this is you posting here and saying that "you are not here to proof 607BC to be wrong".

But on an earlier post, you said it is wrong:



so, what are you here for then ?

Your presence here from the above ^ is useless, what christian are you speaking from both side of the mouth!

Since it has been esterblished that you are deceitful, what should i do with you ?

If i call you the sort of person you are, you will feel bad, but it is you allowing yourself to be use by that one for what you dont even the capacity to comprehend.

587 means that the Jews spent 50years in Exile as against Yahweh's word of 70years.

Are you an atheist ?


So now, please, run along! Will you ?
Smh.

truthislight: I never expected any usefull thing to come out from @Hisblud thread, i dont know what i am even doing here sef.

*Anyone that have time to waste can come and dance in circle in the mud with you. Smh.*

Peace though

truthislight: I never expected any usefull thing to come out from @Hisblud thread, i dont know what i am even doing here sef.

*Anyone that have time to waste can come and dance in circle in the mud with you. Smh.*

Peace though

TroGunn:

From this post, the only thing you can accuse JW of is trusting the Bible completely, as opposed to accepting possibly inaccurate secular history.

Let's look at your Britannica link a bit ( http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/47693/Babylonian-Exile ). I find it informative, here's what it says in part:

"Many scholars cite 597 bc as the date of the first deportation, for in that year King Jehoiachin was deposed and apparently sent into exile with his family, his court, and thousands of workers. Others say the first deportation followed the destruction of Jerusalem by Nebuchadrezzar in 586; if so, the Jews were held in Babylonian captivity for 48 years. Among those who accept a tradition (Jeremiah 29:10) that the exile lasted 70 years, some choose the dates 608 to 538, others 586 to about 516 (the year when the rebuilt Temple was dedicated in Jerusalem)" .

Clearly the choice is ours - whether to believe the Bible's 70-year exile or 48/50-year secular history version. As a Christian, what are U saying? That the Bible is wrong?

One fact, the Britannica and pretty much everyone agree on is the 538BC date when Cyrus ordered the Jews to return ( @Hisblud, please take note - this is what I said everyone agrees, not 607BC). Here's what Britannica wrote " The exile formally ended in 538 bc, when the Persian conqueror of Babylonia, Cyrus the Great, gave the Jews permission to return to Palestine. "

Based on this date, and accepting the Bible's 70-year exile will land you in 607BC as the date of Jerusalem desolation.

Note that the Britannica puts it on 608BC, because they started counting back from the time the order was given by Cyrus in 538BC. But Biblically, the exile actually ended when the stated "Sabbath" on Jerusalem ended, when the Jews returned fully 537BC ( in the 7th month according to Ezra 3:1-5).

Because the exile was to start from when "the land hath enjoyed its Sabbath", lasting 70 years as shown in 2 Chronicles 36:20-23 - "And he removeth those left of the sword unto Babylon, and they are to him and to his sons for servants, till the reigning of the kingdom of Persia, to fulfil the word of Jehovah in the mouth of Jeremiah, till the land hath enjoyed its sabbaths; all the days of the desolation it kept sabbath -- to the fulness of seventy years. And in the first year of Cyrus king of Persia, at the completion of the word of Jehovah in the mouth of Jeremiah, hath Jehovah waked up the spirit of Cyrus king of Persia, and he causeth an intimation to pass over into all his kingdom, and also in writing, saying, Thus said Cyrus king of Persia, All kingdoms of the earth hath Jehovah, God of the heavens, given to me, and He hath laid a charge on me to build to Him a house in Jerusalem, that is in Judah; who is among you of all His people? Jehovah his God is with him, and he doth go up.'" (Young's)

Thus, the 70 years were to be a period when the land of Judah and Jerusalem would enjoy “sabbath rests.” This meant that the land would not be cultivated—there would be no sowing of seed or pruning of vineyards. (Leviticus 25:1-5, NIV)

As Britannica shows "Historians agree that several deportations took place (each the result of uprisings in Palestine)" , but the 70-year exile started when "all" the Jews left the land ( with no one to cultivate the land) after a particular uprising involving assassination of Gedaliah:

2 Kings 25:25, 26 - "In the seventh month, however, Ishmael son of Nethaniah, the son of Elishama, who was of royal blood, came with ten men and assassinated Gedaliah and also the men of Judah and the Babylonians who were with him at Mizpah. At this, all the people from the least to the greatest, together with the army officers, fled to Egypt for fear of the Babylonians ".

Only then, in the seventh Jewish month of that year could it be said that the land, now desolate and unworked, began to enjoy its Sabbath rest. To the Jewish refugees in Egypt, God said through Jeremiah: “You have seen all the disaster that I brought upon Jerusalem and upon all the cities of Judah. Behold, this day they are a desolation, and no one dwells in them.” (Jeremiah 44:1, 2, English Standard Version) So this event evidently marked the starting point of the 70 years.

Now, after Cyrus gave the order in 538BC, the Jews had to prepare to travel, a journey of at least 4 months (Ezr 7:9). The Jews returned fully in 537BC (in the 7th month according to Ezra 3:1-5) to be ready to start cultivating their land again, thus ending the Sabbath rest of the land.

Thus, from a Biblical point of view, the 70year exile ended, not when Cyrus made the order in 538BC, but when the Jews actually got back to their land and settled in to cultivate it in the 7th month of 537BC (Ezra 3:1-5) and obviously began 70years earlier in the 7th month of 607BC (when the last group left the land fallow, and fled to Egypt - 2 Kings 25:25, 26).

The question for Christians is, do you believe and trust the Bible completely or you allow "secular history", known to be wrong and sometimes founded on errored sources, shake you trust in the Bible?

JMAN05:

Just see, he is not saving face with pointless sarcasm. When you began you were vibrating, but now your true heart is known. You never wanted the truth at all. You just thought you had enough point to chase this guys away.

TroGunn:



It is generally accepted and known to be factual that the date that Cyrus led the military campaign that sacked Babylon was in 539BC. - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyrus_Cylinder

According to Jewish Encyclopaedia, "On the first day of the year, Nisan 1 (March 20), 538, in conformity with Babylonian custom, he grasped the hands of the golden statue of Bel-Marduk, and thus became consecrated as monarch. From this ceremony dates the first year of his reign as "King of Babylon, King of all the Lands." - http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/4828-cyrus

From this, Cyrus made order for the Jews to return (538BC) and the Jews eventual return in 537BC ( in the 7th month according to Ezra 3:1-5) can be deduced quite accurately. This marks the end of the 70-year exile. Counting back 70years takes us to 607BC as the time when Jerusalem was made desolate.

It's a simple case of whether we accept the Bible's 70-year exile (Jeremiah 25:1, 2, 11; 29:10; Daniel 9:2) or secular sources 50-year exile. The Bible has always been accurate and we'd take that over any secular source.

The secular sources for the 50-year exile are known to have inaccuracies. One of them is the records of Berossus who lived close to Neo-Babylonian period. His record is known to be inaccurate - he was wrong about who Assyrian King Sennacherib succeeded - his Father or brother.

Another secular source is the Canon of Ptolemy - largely accurate but known to contain omissions.

The 3rd source, based on ancient tablets detailing dates in relation to position of moon and planets can support both the 587BC and 607BC dates.

Of course, we'd go with the Bible record of 70-year exile anytime because of it's track record of accurate history. Secular history gets revised now and then to fit current information - the Bible has stayed accurate and gets vindicated, as this fairly recent example shows- http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/135432#.UouXEZt3vX4

JMAN05:

If Hitler say you shouldnt preach and you preach, will you not be going against the authority established by God?

JMAN05:

Please tell me the hebrew word for angel. after then, your eye will clear now, I promise.

TroGunn:

True, Secular history has it that the babylonians destroyed Jerusalem in 587 BC as against 607 BC as taught by JW. Now, secular history is known to be wrong. And when you consider the basis for the 587 BC date, you'll realise that it's almost certainly wrong.

The Bible points to 607BC as the date Babylonians destroyed Jerusalem. Here's how:

Various Bible verse show that Jerusalem was to lay desolate and waste for 70 years.

2 Chronicles 36:20-23 - "And he removeth those left of the sword unto Babylon, and they are to him and to his sons for servants, till the reigning of the kingdom of Persia, to fulfil the word of Jehovah in the mouth of Jeremiah, till the land hath enjoyed its sabbaths; all the days of the desolation it kept sabbath -- to the fulness of seventy years. And in the first year of Cyrus king of Persia, at the completion of the word of Jehovah in the mouth of Jeremiah, hath Jehovah waked up the spirit of Cyrus king of Persia, and he causeth an intimation to pass over into all his kingdom, and also in writing, saying, Thus said Cyrus king of Persia, All kingdoms of the earth hath Jehovah, God of the heavens, given to me, and He hath laid a charge on me to build to Him a house in Jerusalem, that is in Judah; who is among you of all His people? Jehovah his God is with him, and he doth go up.'" ( Young's)

Clearly Babylon fell, generally accepted to be in 539BC. Cyrus in his first year of ruling Babylon decreed the Jews can go back to Jerusalem.

It's also generally accepted that the Jews were back in Jerusalem by 537CE, which is when the 70-year exile ended. Thus, counting back, the start of the 70years would be 607BC - based on the Bible. Secular history arriving 587BC is based on records known to have errors.

Note that it's a calculation of years, so the length of 360- or 365 day-per-year is irrelevant since days are not being used.

We'll look at the dream of Nebuchadnezzar, other related Bible verses and how it all fits together in another post.

Donmams: It beats my imagination why some fools will claim that the North and South West are against mr. President and his ministers whenever they criticize the gov't. Well let them hear that the north and the southwest have over 75% voting strength. It will be the end of the igbo loving president in 2015. The South East will regret their stupidity for siding with jonathan for the next 200 years.

vedaxcool:

You left out Rwanda, 900,000 christians in a killing spree! You guys are doing fine killing each other!




oh child, u simply have been reading with your eyes closed, have a nap and when you wake read the thread op again,here is the link https://www.nairaland.com/1522898/muslim-inventions-shaped-modern-world#19637209 replying you is like explaining quantum physics to a Fly! common sense dictates that your refute a thread that shows major invention in an age the whole world including Christendom was steep in ignorance made by muslim world. if this thread is not an evidence to you then pls just leave and preserve what is left of your intellect!

MacDaddy01:


So you now lie against her husband to defend Muhammad?

IGBO-SON:
I hope memebers have noticed what nairaland is doing!?.......well, the neutral non Hausa/Fulani/Yoruba/Igbo ones at any rate!

A positive thread on Princess Oduas' achievements was created yesterday, and not only is it yet to hit front page, but it's been relegated to the graveyard that is the travel section! Now, how is the thread in question any different from another one also created yesterday about Osun building the longest runway in Nigeria?........a thread which still adorns the politics section as we speak!

This website has now taken a story not based on any concrete evidence, but instead based on heresay, conjecture and hate; a story from the daily-trust.......a known divisive and hateful Hausa/Fulani mouthpiece dedicated to promoting hate, suspicion and paranoia against Ndigbo public officials that are working tirelessly to level the playing field that's been tilted in favour of Hausa/Fulani/Yoruba for close to 40 years! Nairaland has not only allowed such filthy gossip from daily-trust to remain in the politics section, but they've promoted it to the front page faster than you could say 'what-da-hell'!

I know what their game is! They're trying to create an impression with all this gossip, leaked-findings and hearsay that people* (*read: the usual hateful mob suspects) already expect that this hardworking woman would be sacked, and that it's only a question of 'when' not 'if'......thus trying to force the presidents hand on this issue!

I've come to the realisation that for us all to progress individually, the Hausa/Fulani, Yoruba and Igbo need to be seperated from each other.....either in a confederation, or we all go our seperate ways! Let's stop pretending with this fake 'one naijeriah' mantra.......no one is buying that shi/t anymore!

The President should be wise and ignore these scum!


PS- This is the link to the thread i referred to earlier: https://www.nairaland.com/1507627/pictures-stella-oduahs-airport#19357860

Orlando Owoh:
The question is, which Yoruba person came out to support FFK for stealing the said money? If you can't answer then keep shut.

ngozievergreen:

Bicourtney is fraud.
Stella's transformation agenda was going to affect Bicourtney badly but the Yoruba fraudster and owners started sponsoring SR to rub.bish stella.
Now, how many yorubas have spoken against Bicourtney?
.
Nonsense.

the_ripper3: Islamic year
Islamic bank
Islamic school
Islamic dress
Islamic calendar



Muslims and their noise sef. sallam aleikum. We pray for less terror attacks perpetrated by largely Muslims this year.

Truckpusher: Finally and gradually the clueless fisher man is doing what the Northern islamaofascist oligarchy refused to do for their own people for fear of being on equal ground which will give rise to questions and even the very foundation of Islam which has always been a tool of control in the hands of the Fulani invaders against our lost Hausa,Kanuri brothers and the rest of the tribes that has been swallowed up by Islam by force under the power of the sword.

Finally the child that grew up in the banks of the river nun whilst watching the sombrero river banks will unmask the face of our long lost fellow black Africans by directly making it possible for their sons and daughters to attain western education which the Barbarian Fulanis invaded long time ago and dominated for yrs whilst keeping them in slavery,poverty and in ignorance .

The enslavement of our brothers in the North is one of the greatest human tragedy that has ever befallen the black man that no one has ever voiced out because the people themselves are so lost that they themselves doubt their very existence as a people hence they remain captives to their fulani invaders.

Now history is being rewritten ,all we can do is to wait,watch and see how long Nigeria will last and see the lasting effect of this policy on this Fulani Islamaofacist oligarchy.......The Fulani man would be more than ready to go his ways ,than to have a large number of his subject in the North become orientated in the ways of life of the Southern Nigeria..........

EDUCATE THE NORTH AND WATCH THE USMAN DAN FODIO EMPIRE THAT WAS BUILT WITH BLOOD COLLAPSE LIKE THE BERLIN WALL....Allahu Akhbar

ziccoit: Christians and others are better than these chameleons. When you see them wearing big bears, jumpy trousers etc you want to say this one is a Muslim. Alas! they are not.

ngozievergreen: So, some Yoruba journalists had hoped US and UK will join them in their propaganda?
Dem down see their lives nah

FreeGlobe: Blame it on the desperation of punch liepapers and premium times.