₦airaland Forum

I was asking on behalf of one of our friends here. Na una get files on top these people. Na only Osimhen many of us know.

charlesemeka85:
Terem Moffi

Finally, something you can say something about. . Nobody said it's dead. Dying and dead are not the same. . Do I need to provide any article to support this? Is there even any system that dies? They mostly evolve. Our point is that the tag 'far far above other systems' is no longer the case. There are other systems just as effective if not more.

TheGoodJoe:
And some people think Tiki taka is dying.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ML-Dr3g3Zk

Why do some of us resort to this? Always, na whiteman dey cheat us.

Philosopher1979:
Nwakali will collect the midfield from party. Remember that match against atletico Madrid. The white man is lying to us that nwakali is not good enough it is time we proved them wrong.

Who is Moffi?

charlesemeka85:
But our players are doing well in Europe’s top league this season

Osimhen- excellent
Lookman- excellent
Moffi- excellent
Onuachu- excellent
Iwobi- good
Samu- good
Onyedika- good
Awoniyi- average(though his first season in epl)
Bassey- good
Alhassan- average
Osayi- good
Zaidu- good (prior to his injury)
Bruno- good
Ndidi- average( just returned from injury)
Akpoguma- average
Ebuehi- average
Simon- good


My personal rating so far

Are you alright? Ban me for what exactly? If you no know wetin you dey talk, no mention person name.

codemaniacs:
he abuses in subtle manners and must not be kept free from abuses...

If I was the mod him and benji would have been banned ...

it is an abomination to come to a Nigerian sports forum and denigrate Nigerian players especially the ones born and groomed in Nigeria..

We dey enjoy your olman vibes too. . Thank you for reminding youngees that there are players and there were players.

Kog45:
Ha Oga Komekn quoted me... you,my good man thegoodjoe and benji93 na run I dey run for una here o.. una strength in written no be here o.

The bolded one caught my eye. Is it that I made claims years ago that were unfounded(or you just couldn't understand)? or I have made loads of claims over the years that are unfounded(i.e you did not understand)? Which is which? . You seem to have a penchant for ambiguity.

MainJoe:
He has come with another lie without no shred of evidence. If you can go back this thread to years, you will read him making claims of things he has no idea about.

See talk. Cocktail vitamins. Lol. If that was possible, 40 players out of 16 U17 players will not fail MRI wrist scan. Cameroon just recorded 32 failures. Logic shows your theory is bent beyond reasonable proportion.

The golden eaglets doctor is talking fusion from grade 4 to grade 6 in months and you guys are trying to sell cheap lies of fusion in years.

Men the theory is fake and bogus. Just bin it and think of a new lie.

ONLY LINUS KNOWS MORE THAN WORLD RENOWNED RADIOLOGISTS.

That would be quite petty. Hatred on steroids.

BascoVanVeli:
Algerians are also player haters. They fired a reporter for reporting that Morocco made it to the semifinals of the world cup.

If this is not pure wickedness I don't know what it is. . You collect him girlfriend ni?

Killrhymz01:
Who is the moderator Abeg, almost two years now

Again, how many? That is the one-million-dollar question. It's not a common thing. Did I not admit that even actual 16-year-olds can have complete fusion? The article proper clearly mentions one case. I am not denying that you could have an actual 17-year-old failing the test. That would be quite ignorant.

I am talking about averages here. I can see you now know where my argument is going, the reason why you are now skirting around. You previously mentioned them and I asked you, how many cases in a given sample.? The question is what happens on average? I mean for instance in a sample of 100 16-year-olds, if 5 of them fail the test, it would be fruitless to argue the five. Oh yes I know the five, but you make decisions based on averages first, then you try to see if you can accommodate the others. Very simple. That's the direction statistics take. Otherwise, there would be no need to calculate the mean, standard deviation e.t.c.

I never said the Ghanaian article is not Ok. I actually hail them for highlighting the issues with respect to the data they collected, but yet you cannot ignore those issues, they significantly affect the accuracy of the Protocol.

And I agree it's taken an extended period of time so it's gone stale. I hail you for continuing this conversation, without evading clear arguments(even though you caused some problems ), unlike our mutual friend. . Hopefully, others get something from this. So I will make my final point and you can do with it what you want.

I previously argued from the article proper an average age of 18 for stage V, Which doesn't include Sub-Saharan Africans. If you include the fact that SA is lower than CA for a Sub-Saharan African country, which means the MRI age lags behind the chronological age, the 18 average goes up to about 20+ for Sub-Saharan African countries.

The reasons suggested by the Malawian study, i.e Malaria and Diarrhea are common in Sub-Saharan Africa, malaria especially, so that doesn't pose a serious problem for the argument.

Also, the Malawian study is more useful in this discussion because it didn't center its sampling on Players. They essentially almost eliminated the main problem that would pollute their data. I believe it's the reason they were able to discover the lag.

I support one of the conclusive remarks of the Ghanaian study. A comprehensive study on Black Africans without the incentive to lie needs to be conducted to be able to properly grade their fusions. As it stands the plus or minus of the use of the MRI on Sub-Saharan Africa is certainly uncertain. The study is needed to narrow down the range and properly quantify it, so you can say, for instance, it has an accuracy of 85% +-5%. As it stands all you can say is it screens out the Old papas. .

Anyways thank you. Maybe we can get back to discussing Tikitaka now. That's a more enjoyable conversation.

Odunayaw:
He is a reason why even with the obvious issue of self reportage, the Ghanian research is very acceptable in my estimation.

We've had Nigerian heritage, US born boys fail this test even with verifiable documents

What do you say to that regard?

I think I have lost steam for this discussion because of the length of time it has taken

Did the Ghanaian study mention the factors that may be responsible for the difference in chronological and skeletal age? I may have missed it, pls point it out to me. Meanwhile, it's common knowledge that malaria is widespread in West Africa. A serious public health problem here.

Also, can you see the Ghanaian study admitting the limits of their studies? Very, very important in any study. A useful study admits the errors and discusses the sources. I salute them for this. The chronological ages were self-reported. You cannot trust it because it's coming from players.

Also, can you see what I was talking about earlier in the form of a digression ? Their conclusion was that the prediction of age by measuring the degree of fusion of the wrist, which is essentially what the MRI does may lack the accuracy needed until a comprehensive study is done on Black Africans who have no reason to lie. You should not even conduct it on players. It would be bad. There's an incentive to hide your true age.

Odunayaw:
The bone is younger than the date

Malaria is widespread but one would expect that factor to also affect the Ghanian research too

Now that's a good point. But wait, do we not have those issues in Nigeria? Is malaria not widespread in Nigeria? Or across west Africa for that matter?
But before this can you tell us what "SA is lower than CA" means?

Odunayaw:
But in the Malawian study this was given

I apologize my friend. . No vex. COULD is not bad.

As I previously mentioned it would be insincere to ignore their summaries of other studies.

Now let's visit their reference on SubSaharan African countries.

They referenced a study in Malawi. The attached figure is a summary of the conclusion of that study. Pls check against the article.
There, it's written SA(Skeletal age) is lower than CA(Chronological age) in comparison with G and P standards. Do you understand this conclusion?
Bear in mind, Skeletal age corresponds to the result from MRI, and Chronological is the one penned down when you were born(supposedly).

Odunayaw:
I am straightforward. You are belly dancing.

An 18y/o COULD. That's my stance.

If you were truthful to yourself you already used the word "on average". So how does COULD not fit that?

Go straight to the point

No you did not. At least not cleary. Be clear. Don't turn to our mutual friend. . Yes or No. Oh yes, and blablabla, oh No and blabla bla. Very simple. Can we be straightforward with our answers?

Odunayaw:
I have answered it. Do you have any other thing to add?

Which question did he ask? Are you serious? You did not notice I asked him a question and he hasn't answered? Are you aware I am still building up to my argument? Are you aware I am still discussing the academic paper with him? Are you aware that I originally mentioned that my argument is a deduction from the article and its references? And that you would have to go through the article first to get there? Do you remember you mistook deductions for assumptions? What are you talking about my friend? What are you aware of?

mostob:
That was in response to the question you asked The.goodjoe. Noneof what you said here doesn't even correlate. The way you're twisting everything is becoming irritating. I was here for facts yet till now, you've not brought any academic paper or article to justify your claim.
I don comot hand. O.dunayaw asked you a simple question which you stylishly dodged.
Enough, I no dey do again

Cocky? Why would I? I am enjoying myself. I am asking you a simple question, but you are dodging it. . From the tables, I showed, the average of grade V was 18 years old, so is it fair to conclude that an 18-year-old European player would pass the test on average?

This is not that hard a question now.

Odunayaw:
This is where you begin to irritate me. You don't understand what "could" mean?

Have we not seen by experience that there's still a probability

Don't act cocky

He pain me say when Messi finally win I no come get strength to argue. . Na this time I know say GOAT trolls dey. If person pass you for something you just let them handle business.
When Penduists dey cook, na few people hear am for here. But as our own food come done, Colonel open Baracks. He pain me but I love it. . Just sidon dey enjoy.

Jodera:
Tbh, na Cr7 fans be the cock weh invite cockroaches for birthday party. I no know why you deh call Messi fans.

And so many occasions, I remember Patrick warning you guys that Messi is not a Man u player and that he should be left alone but no, everytime Una go dey table Messi matter for here. You guys troll Messi here almost everyday last season and if Messi fans who also doubles as Man u fans starts to defend him, you guys will want to blackmail them with "you're not supporting your own legend". I even read that it was worse during the first world cup game when Argentina lost to Saudi. Lol, even Madrid thread no even dey troll Messi the way you guys do here courtesy of yourself, Lostm.yzeal, tremble.champ and chief Trev.or

It's hypocritical of you to now spin it around to Messi fans for eating it when you guys brought the table and served the food
Maybe y'all probably thought here is a closed group and that guests and other people aren't reading (without commenting)and just waiting for the right time to strike.

Penduist made the bed, it's time to lie ontop and Una don dey cry say "messianic cults".

Which Pogba are you talking about? 'World Class' Pogba?

Jokerman:
Pogba is actually better than any midfielder we have now bar Casemiro... I don't know why you people keep bringing good players down

. Very interesting fellow.

Mujtahida:
You go hear wien. Continue. Na you go tire

I don't understand you my brother. Could not would? What language is this? Speak a language I understand pls. Does the article suggest that an 18 year old European would pass the test?

Abeg no start to dodge.

Odunayaw:
Since you are so focused on European. They could not would

Go on

Are you serious at all? You are trying to be smart. For your mind you don make sense . A justify would be a comparable example. You get an invitation, you play then they choose to select you. This is not a justify. It's a test to determine if if you are eligible to play under 17 or not. If you refuse to select someone because there's a more talented player you tell everyone that's what you are doing. How long did it take you to come up with this idea?

mostob:
Principal wanted to reward the brilliant students. Every students who passes are eligible but due to the competitiveness and high population, it was decided to select from those who scored 80% and above.
So if Taiwo scored 75%, does that mean he is not eligible

To be sure you are following do you agree from that Data that an 18-year-old European would pass the MRI test on average?

Odunayaw:
I might as well as post the remaining tables since your last two post have been buttressing the last column

Now...what were you saying

Man, you are a very interesting fellow. . Whose eligibility is the first one? You need to settle down and get everything in order man. They are Eligible, but they are not going. Do you understand what you are saying?

TheGoodJoe:
Eligible means they are suitable for it. Not that they are going. They are eligible but did not meet the NFF eligibility. So they are not going and that is why the former team doctor disagrees with it.

This statement was by the news outlet. This is a quotation of what the former medic actually said: "Players now on Grade 5 will definitely be eligible for the upcoming WAFUB tournament". Certainty.

Who should anyone believe more? An unserious news outlet or a medic? You take the rephrase of the outlet over the actual quotation of the medic. You are a very interesting fellow.

TheGoodJoe:
Former doctor of the Golden Eaglets, Ayodeji Olarinoye, has maintained that players who posted Grade 5 results in the recent MRI age test ought to be eligible for next month’s U17 AFCON in Benin Republic going by his experience.

It is written clearly in black and white now.

The players should have been eligible for the U17 WAFU B but are not because of the NFF grade 4 screening.

Finito.

Why should we believe that's the case and not the news outlet SCORENigeria just making a bogus claim? A different article clearly has a CAF medic saying CAF's guideline is that ineligibility is at grade VI.
Now it's that you won't be able to get into the Golden Eaglet but you would be eligible for the competition. Does it even make sense to you?

According to @TheGoodJoe, CAF and NFF get different rules for MRI. Shame no even dey catch you to talk this. No evidence from any NFF official to confirm grade IV is the highest grade for eligibility. At least there's one from a CAF medic.

TheGoodJoe:

Na wa.

The players are screened out and the former doctor kicked against it because those players are supposed to be eligible because of Grade 5 fusion.

With Grade 5 fusion they will be eligible for the competition but they are not eligible to join the Golden Eaglets because the Golden Eaglets pegged their at Grade 4.

What bullshit is this? . If you are screened out you shouldn't be eligible for any under-17 tournament. You keep turning everything upside down.
2. Again, in the other article why would the CAF medic peg ineligibility at VI, not V?

The other article actually quoted him generalizing to all under-17 tournaments. Ineligibility applies to all under-17 tournaments including WAFUB under-17.

TheGoodJoe:

They would definitely be eligible for the WAFU B but, the NFF has already screened them out. That is why he disagrees with the NFF stance on screening out based on Grade 4. He has been in the system and he is kicking against the Grade 4 criteria.

Why are you always turning everything upside down? The bolded clearly says those currently in Grade 5 were eligible for WAFUB tournament the following month. The Afcon under 17 was originally scheduled for March, which is a few months, away from the test in which case a few months is enough to complete the fusion, not to talk of the World cup in December 2021, which was canceled too.



Question 1: If the highest grade was grade IV, why would a grade V be eligible for WAFUB?

Question 2: Can you tell us why a CAF medical officer pegs ineligibility at grade VI? Why are you running away from this question? Provide an answer. .

TheGoodJoe:

I will get to that. You are just jumping.

“Anyone that has been involved with the MRI era Golden Eaglets knows what it takes to discover players that will finally be within the required grades. Players now on Grade 5 will definitely be eligible for the upcoming WAFUB tournament, there’s no guarantee that players on grades 1-4 will remain eligible for subsequent competitions ( AFCON U17 & World Cup) as no one can determine the rate of growth of the radial epiphysis (bone of the wrist),” Olarinoye explained.

---

Anyone involved before with U17 wrist scan will understand the grade of fusion to make it into the FIFA World Cup. The players that were in Grade 5 and screened out by the NFF would have passed the CAF screening to qualify for the WAFUB tournament. Even the players that are grade 1 to 4 now can grow and have their fusion move to a Grade 6 and not be eligible for the U17 Nations Cup and World Cup. This is the rate at which wrist plates fuse differs from individual and could occur fast for some.

I hope I broke his point enough for you.

You are not serious. The figure is an actual quotation from the former medical doctor. He actually used will definitely be eligible. That's some certainty right there. Read and Listen.

Besides, why are you dodging the report on the claim by the CAF official? Abi CAF is different from NFF ni?

TheGoodJoe:
Former doctor of the Golden Eaglets, Ayodeji Olarinoye, has maintained that players who posted Grade 5 results in the recent MRI age test ought to be eligible for next month’s U17 AFCON in Benin Republic going by his experience.

Former doctor of golden Eaglets said that the players screened out should not have been removed. He believes they should have been allowed to play the AFCON in Benin Republic going by the way they used to do things in the past. You understand?

I am actually yet to get to my deduction. You chickened out, I am not sure why you are jumping in through the window. . Provide a source from NFF that supports the IV grade claim.

This is another article from Nov 2020, where a CAF medical doctor is saying that everyone with grade 6 is deemed ineligible. If grade IV was the highest grade for eligibility, it would be anyone with a grade V is deemed ineligible. You can see the title there, CAF regulations on MRI.
This is the reason you cannot trust our sources alone. Find other sources for confirmation. The protocol is not applied only in Nigeria .

https://www.cosafa.com/dr-ngwenya-explains-caf-regulations-on-mri-scans-in-under-17-football/

Besides, i have no idea how you read these articles. This is not even an academic article. . Look at the figure. The news outlet made a claim that the eligibility was pegged at grade IV, but the former medical doctor disagreed, citing a similar scenario in 2012. Nowhere in that article did they say the grade IV claim is from CAF. Very misleading.
The ony other possibility is that this is from NFF. But given the history of NFF i doubt they would even consider it.

Anyway, which CAF/NFF official did SCORENigeria get their information from? And provide evidence for it. Abi na you dey in charge of that outlet ni? .

TheGoodJoe:
Former doctor of the Golden Eaglets, Ayodeji Olarinoye, has maintained that players who posted Grade 5 results in the recent MRI age test ought to be eligible for next month’s U17 AFCON in Benin Republic going by his experience.

SCORENigeria has specially reported that the pass rate has been pegged to Grade 4, but Olarinoye, who was team doctor of the Eaglets when they conquered the world in 2013 and 2015, disagreed based on his own experience.

---

The team Doctor is saying that the Grade 4 fusion is too high and that Grade 5 fusion is okay. The 2020 team was screened using the Grade 4 fusion and he is pointing out that the previous set used grade 5 fusion.

---

“Anyone that has been involved with the MRI era Golden Eaglets knows what it takes to discover players that will finally be within the required grades. Players now on Grade 5 will definitely be eligible for the upcoming WAFUB tournament, there’s no guarantee that players on grades 1-4 will remain eligible for subsequent competitions ( AFCON U17 & World Cup) as no one can determine the rate of growth of the radial epiphysis (bone of the wrist),” Olarinoye explained.

“I can confirm that some of our past U17 players plying their trades in different leagues around the world were on Grade 5 during the qualifiers and up until the World Cup.

“I don’t think it will be fair to the country if we screened out these players ourselves.

“It will always be a tough one for any U17 coach as he can only work with players declared eligible by the MRI machine. For this reason, the U17 team should spend ample time in camp for quality elimination by substitution process.”

---

So, what else do you want me to prove? The former team doctor has told you that it was grade 5 fusion in previous U17 and also the possibility of players having higher fusions during a short period of time.

Really digs a big borehole into your 20/21 years old theory.

Finito.

Do you understand what the column you highlighted means? The average of all those values is 18.261, approximately 18.3, which i quoted earlier. . So I am not sure why you quoted the column.

Odunayaw:
Since you love tables

Unless you provide evidence from CAF/NFF on this or via any other authentic channel, this cannot be considered reliable information. An online sports news outlet made this claim, but the team Doctor for the 2013/2015 batch disagreed. He claims the same thing was said in 2012, but Grade V players were eligible.
https://scorenigeria.com.ng/grade-5-age-result-good-for-u17-afcon-qualifiers-insists-ex-golden-eaglets-doctor/

TheGoodJoe:
cc: Odunayaw and benji93

Previous U17 used Grade 5 fusion as the benchmark for screening but in 2020, the benchmark was raised to Grade 4.

Don't do this to me now. According to the average of 18.3, 18 on average is incomplete fusion. . Confirm this then we continue. I don't want any confusion. So even an 18-year-old European more than half the time would pass the test. So a European player can lie by a year and still have no problem.

Edit: Also from the figure below, 70% of the 19-year-olds were at stage V, which is incomplete fusion. Quite interesting and strange. More 19-year-olds achieved incomplete fusion. I do think this sample is probably too small. But well we can only go with what we have. If we sample some 19 years olds most of them would pass according to that.

Both are different ways of looking at the data.

Are you following?

Odunayaw:
Glad we've moved past guessing why FIFA don't have SSA in it's sample

Yes, fully 18y/o are mostly Stage VI

Go on