paxonel:
Let's assume that hellfire is a place everybody will go when they do something wrong. Will a Christian who commits suicide go to hellfire?

Why will anyone think that committing suicide will anul all the born again effort he has been living through out his life until the very day he decided to kill himself?
Is it so written in the bible?

But here is what i saw in the bible.

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

That means if you commit sin you will die.

In this context, the person who commit sin is the person who refused to believe in Christ.

But the person who believe in Christ you will never die, because eternal life is a gift.

So, why will anyone think that someone who believes in Christ will die simply because he had sinned by commiting suicide?

The truth to your question lies beyond the bible. If you really want to know the truth, you have to look outside of the bible, if you are willing to. If you are not willing to, you won't know the true answer.

Sisib15:
Good evening great people,

Please I need your kind input in this issue as the matter is more than me.

Someone called me and needed my advise and I do not have an idea on how to start advising the person.

So she said that her school emailed her about a meeting earlier today . I think the email came last week or so.

So when she joined the meeting today, she said they told her that GRE wrote to them(the school) and stated that they are declining the GRE result given to her, reason being that her image Abi her picture is not consistent.

So at this point , I became confused , I asked if she has any issue with GRE prior to now but she opened up and told me that she paid one agent in Nigeria to assist her write the GRE and her score was so high . The GRE result is authentic but was not written by her.

Also this GRE was done to see if she can get scholarship but she didn’t get the scholarship from the school as at the time she enrolled , probably because the fund has finished or something. This GRE was written for her in 2021 and she entered America last year fall. This spring is still her 2nd semester.

While she was still explaining this to me, a mail notification came to her phone and she checked the mail. The mail stated that the school has told her that she is no longer needed in program.

Please any advise for her. She acknowledged that she didn’t do well and has requested I give her my sincere advise . Should she start looking for another school ? Will she affect her record/sevis? Does anyone know anyone that had encountered similar issue in the past ?

She has several options. She can look into transferring into another program in the same school that doesn't require a GRE score or she could look for admission and transfer to another school/program that will accept her without a GRE score. Her low academic performance may have been what prompted the school to double-check her GRE score. I don't think it will affect her SEVIS records if she's able to transfer to another program within the same school or to another school in time. Even if she eventually falls out of status, she has 5 months to reinstate back into status (that is obtain admission and enroll in the new school).

efficiencie:
Please experts in Ika language from Delta state. What is the meaning of "God is my strength" and "God strengthens me" in Ika.

Chi bu ike m = God is my strength (Chibuikem)

or Chukwubuikem.

This is central Igbo. I'm not sure there's an Ika variant for the name.

RedboneSmith:


We need to correct this impression that the SS Igbo-speaking peoples were the only ones who referred to Igbo-speaking outsiders as 'onye Igbo'. Igbo-speaking people were doing that to other Igbo-speaking people inside the SE at the time. There is a town called Igbere in Abia State, and the name of the town is derived from the expression "Igbo erughi", meaning "the town the Igbo could not reach". And the Igbo in this instance were the Aro. The Aro and their Abam warriors had planned to invade Igbere (which was called Ebiri at the time). Igbere people were able to beat off the attack and prevent the Aro and Abam from taking their town. In memory of that triumph, they started calling themselves Igbo erughi (the Igbo couldn't reach us), shortened later to Igbere.

Also I will continue to take Equiano's reference to Benin in his book with a pinch of salt. If Equiano was writing from what he experienced within his homeland, I would expect him to refer to Benin by the name used among his people, which would be Idu or Ado. Benin people themselves did not even use Benin to describe themselves at the time, but used Edo. Nobody who was living in the Igbo-speaking areas in 1745 would have known Benin City by any other name except Idu or Ado. The fact that Equiano recorded "Benin" tells me he had been peeping into European accounts.

Then he went and wrote further that Benin was bordered on one side by the Kingdom of Abyssinia! Not only is that factually wrong, but no one in the rainforests of West Africa at the time knew about the existence of Abyssinia on the northeastern extremity of the African continent, least of all 12-year old Olaudah!

Olaudah presenting his village as belonging to a province of the great Benin Kingdom is a piece of romantic writing designed to capture the interest and imagination of his European audience. It shouldn't be taking seriously by anyone trying to use information presented in the book to pinpoint where in Igboland Olaudah came from.

Nice one.

In addition to this, Nigeria and several African countries did not exist at that time, thus the nearest major landmark to his village to give readers an idea of where his village was located would have been the Bini empire/kingdom.

ChinenyeN:
Mods, bigfrancis21, odumchi, Fulaman198, my previous post has been hidden and my ability to reply was blocked for a few days. Can we please unhide the post, if it is not breaking any rules? Thank you.

Unlocked. The spam bot incorrectly flagged your post due to so many words. Maybe try to break up the posts into shorter posts to avoid future flag downs.

.

EdwardRandy:

Hello, bro. I greet you.

If you can read my comment, did you later try to reach our brothers in Guinea? Did you make any further awareness?

Not yet. Life got me extremely busy in the last few months/years. But I still have it on my mind.

samuk:


Bishop Crowder on the Niger mission, 1875, page 538.

Thanks for sharing the article. I wanted to see the original article to understand your original statement about: ‘Asaba fast loosing their edo language’. Your earlier statement does not appear induced nor insinuated in Ajayi’s writing that you referenced. Understood, a few words and cultural practices may have been borrowed from the Edo, plus maybe some later Edo migrants may have settled in Asaba, however it remains unlikely that the entire Asaba people originated from Edo.

samuk:


It's almost impossible for you to use your present day observations to explain events of 300 years ago let alone 500 years ago. The world was a complete different place then. Your writeup is ridden with you think, you think....you will probably also think that the present king of England is of English ancestry because he speaks English and he is the king of England. The world doesn't or didn't work like that.

You need to read more and do more research if you really want to learn instead of formulating your own theories using limited knowledge from your today's observations.

In 1875 for example, Samuel Ajayi Crowder visited Asaba and documented that there were large Igbo migrating to Asaba and the indigene were fast loosing their Edo language, although few Edo words were still being used. This is 1875 and you are trying to think and formulate theories about what happened during the reign of Oba Ewuare more than 500 years ago. During the reign of Oba Ewuare, that entire area and beyond were mostly populated by Edo people before they were overwhelmed by other migrants.

The above reference is a eye witness historical account of someone that was on ground in Asaba in 1875 and wrote what he saw, not what he thought. Although you will read Igbo writers that wrote in the 1900s claiming Asaba as original Igbo town.

There are people that still claim Benin ancestry all over the South South to the middle belt, in comparison, Delta North was just another Benin empire towns and villages. The king we now know as Obi of Obolukwu was known in Benin as Ogie Oboro, if the title Obi existed then, Benin would have known and call him Obi Oboro. Perhaps you should ask yourself why the current king of Agbor changed his title from Obi of Agbor to Dein of Agbor and what was the title during Oba Ewuare, 500 years ago.

Interesting. Can you share the link to the book or article about Ajayi’s visit to Asaba in 1875 and his comment on their Edo history?

RedboneSmith:


Can you help me with the Igbo names for panda bear and reindeer?

I’m not sure if Igbo names for those animals exist. Ancient Igbos gave names to those things which they encountered/interacted with. Pandas are from Asia I think and did not exist in ancient Igboland. The closest to panda would be chimpanzee which Igbos call Ozodimgba, partly in reference to their tendency to fight/wrestle. Maybe a modification of Ozodimgba could give rise to a name for Panda. For eg Ozodiocha.

clericuzzio:



What is Agu?

I think Odum is Tiger

Agu is Lion

Remember Aka Nchawa’s song from the early 2000s or if you’re familiar with the Igbo Bible, ‘Anyi nwere Odum Ebo Judea’ ie ‘We have the lion of the tribe of Judea’. I remember reading my grandmother’s Igbo Bible many years ago, the Igbo translation for the Lion of the tribe of Judea was and has always been, ‘Odum Ebo Judea’.

This is an argument that has been made on this forum years ago. You might want to look for that thread for more information.

Interesting.

The lack of common sense on this thread is deafening I must say.

anikemoses:
No way except u can get a citizen to co-sign for u which is like finding a needle in a haystack...The other option is to at least have a year’s tuition ,so that once you’re used to the system , u can find a way around it, which is also not easy coz u can’t serve 2 masters at same time..I know some people will start telling y’all tales about people that survived it..oh well, u don’t want to be working under table to $7/hr and at the end, you’re out of status and can’t get reinstated unless u get married or come back to naija and reapply...

Hey guys,

With a sad heart I regret to announce the passing of one of our long-time members and contributors, anikemoses, who passed away last month. He has been laid to rest. He was a graduate of Troy University and was very active on this thread between 2015 and 2018.

My very good friend, paddy, business partner, crypto expert etc. May his gentle soul Rest In Peace.

Raregem9000:
Find his own way? Remember, we rise by lifting others up. I experienced same thing the poster was saying three years ago. I have a cousin who lives abroad. He has been there for a decade now and i only asked him to just help with an invite while i pay for every money that will be spent and i will work things out when i get there. Note: I'm paying for everything. This my cousin kept on giving me stories like it's not easy there that i shouldn't come. He even said i should use the money i had with me to start a business in Nigeria instead of coming there. I was like why are you still there if it's not easy? I just bone him and block him on every social platforms. A year after, i went to an agent to help on a Canadian Visa but i was duped. I'm looking forward to doing all by myself when i'm ready to go on the adventure again without involving any agent and when the soup is done, i would unblock that my cousin, so that he can see that what he failed to help me with has been achieved.

Lol I see pride and entitlement in your post. That invitation thing no longer works. Also if he invites you and you fail to return home as promised, are you aware that he won’t be able to invite others in the future such as his parents?

paxonel:

Yeye man!

Pakistan and Iran dey their, he will not go and preach. Na fellow Christian country like UK he thinks he can afford to win souls?

Hypocrr..!

I can’t seem to understand the hypocrisy of some Nigerians abroad. I know one here in the US that only preaches to Nigerians/Igbos trying to draw them to his church all in the name of preaching. He won’t evangelize to others like Muslims, Jews, Indians, Chinese etc but when he meets a Nigerian he gets busy with his preaching because he knows he won’t get any kickbacks.

Second, we now take Christianity too far even more than the original owners of the religion lol. See the looks the white cops were giving him.

Third, in the western world there’s freedom of religion. Meaning that you can’t force or impose your religion or religious views on others. Preaching in the public like this can be found offensive by folks from other religions. Religion is seen as a personal thing. Possibly someone heard him, got offended and called the cops.

Probz:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Xh-WlC8kv0


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzzRKGs2f24


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7EsV7O-8kaQ

Where have you been, Mr Ukwu-DC ocha, hm?

Wow interesting. Very pleasing to watch.

Means that finding Igbo-speaking actors and actresses who are not Igbos to act a movie won’t be difficult.

Voice22:
Meet the Hausa man who can speak Igbo Fluently.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpGp8XRGRYk

Impressive. We need more content like this.

I think Nollywood should make an Igbo seasonal movie featuring non-Igbos who speak Igbo like this man, to showcase the beauty of the language and to encourage native Igbos to be proud of the language.

sonofElElyon:


His fault now eh?

The way society nowadays has been conditioned to blame men for everything.

musicwriter:
Good day brothers and sisters.

I research anything that irks my interest; especially African history/black history and I am in contact with scholars of black history home and abroad. Of course, I was led to the scholars through my research.

The whole thrust behind all my research is to find out why Africa is the way it is today. I've already concluded on that research, though. These days what interest me is to find out how our problem began as a race, not just that of Africa.

In 2017, I contacted one such black scholar in the USA, professor, brother Kaba Hiawatha Kamene. I ordered his lectures on DVDs, CDs and it was delivered to me by FedEx courier.

While I was watching the lectures, he casually said something like "I've looked for this person called Jesus in history but couldn't find him"

When he said he couldn't find Jesus in history I didn't feel good because I was a Christian. However, remember professor Kaba Hiawatha Kamene is a core historian majority in history of Europe and he went to seminary/catholic school as a youth. So, if there's anybody who should know whether Jesus was a real person or not, it should be him. That's by the way.

Also remember that all the while I was a Christian I never for once doubted the existence of Jesus. Neither did I research history in search of Jesus because I never questioned his existence.

However, right there and then as I sat watching the lectures, I decided I was going to do a comprehensive research on the existence of Jesus and get back to him (the professor) with the facts of Jesus existence. But what happened instead was that I discovered that the professor was right!! And that's how I quit Christianity.

I hope this will help a black man or woman out there to go research Jesus Christ outside of what you've been told in the bible. By so doing you'll discover the truth and the truth shall set you free, indeed.

Below is the message I sent to the professor recently after I concluded my research.

A personality in the name of Jesus Christ did walk this earth, however, the Christian religion of today has a totally different image of the actual personality. I would often say that if Jesus returns like the Christians believe, they would neither recognize nor accept him and they may likely even stone him to death for blasphemy because he would appear different from what they believe he should look like. History, they say, would repeat itself.

palinco:


I need 100 Igbo natives(50 males, 50 females), who can read sentences in the Igbo language to complete a voice recording/reading task on their android or iPhone mobile phones.
*360 short and simple sentences to be read ( in a quiet environment)
Payment is : N4,000.
Steps:
* Download the Ocean speech app from Google Play store.
* Create an account. would send steps to follow
* Would send the project id.
Interested: Whatsapp me : 080 38 30 47 98.

Nice one. I'm interested. You will find a few people on here, but your best bet will be to go to secondary schools in the east to find Igbo students.

Jakes122:
This is a question so many of us have in mind but finding it difficult to get an answer. Finally, here is David Jeremiah’s answer on this.



Responding to the question, Pastor David Jeremiah wrote on instagram :

Today’s prophecy question comes from Phyllis on Instagram. Phyllis was wondering:

Q: When I die, will I go directly to heaven or will I wait until the Rapture?

A: Before the Ascension of Christ, the souls of believers went to an intermediate heaven called “Paradise” when they died. But when Jesus ascended after His death, He went into Paradise and took its inhabitants – all the Old Testament saints – with Him to the third heaven (Ephesians 4:8-10).

In other words, believers no longer pass through the intermediate heaven upon death. The soul and spirit of today’s believers go immediately to the..... Read More Dr. David Jeremiah Prophetic Answers

If you need answers to your questions, do more research into Near Death Experiences (NDE). I'll highly recommend that you keep an open mind while you digest the information. Good luck.

Nice one, the students are on point. Keep it up ma.

Hopefully someday I will start an NGO dedicated to promoting Igbo language and culture, with scholarships and stipends available to students studying Igbo in higher institutions and, as well as, Igbo teachers/lecturers.

charles009:
Hello Folks,

I need una inputs, I tried scanning through nairaland threads and I am getting more of technicalities and rules lol. I need real experiences. As everybody around me dey japa so I decided to give it a thought. I work with a fintech company and net a little over =N=600k monthly. I am considering relocating to either UK,Germany,New Zealand, Australia or Canada. I am married with four kids. They said study route is the best .

A few of my colleagues that travelled just dey dull my ginger. My Oga who nets over 750k, we spoke today and he is considering a security man job, and claims net pay is over 2M monthly. Biko I cannot come and kill myself.

My friend, we spoke this evening and he responded oboy make I no lie you, na shit i dey pack for here, the good news is they say it will always get better with time. What if person no come eventually become citizen, is it a must you go become citizen.

I don talk to over 10 persons today and they all saying everything is though. Me I don't like stress, where me and wify go dey overwork just dey pay bills. Ofcourse I no get strength for menial jobs, make one oyibo use me take dey shine lol....

I no get any exceptional skill, I be sales man ooo.

Would you advise I still gamble and go with family abi make I hold my job oooo.

Please, I would welcome suggestions and advise.


Thanks Guys

I would not recommend this idea, especially not the UK. The monthly salary in pounds when converted to naira might seem to be a lot but the tax rate in Uk is very high, as high as 40%. Let’s use your salary in Nigeria for example, N605,000. I’m sure that after all deductions are made, your take home is at least N550,000. However, in the UK and at 40% tax rate you’ll be left with N363,000. Rent is paid monthly not yearly and the bills are paid monthly not yearly. You have it going well for you already. The grass isn’t always greener on the other side. Finally before you make such a big move, given that you’re a married man with children, try visiting the Uk first to check out things by yourself. If you’re ok with what you see and you decide to move, then you’ve made an informed decision.

VictorUSA:
This was the message I sent to my uncle who lives in America and he sent me just N30,000.

"Good morning uncle...I first of all appreciate your previous assistance.But I want to tell you that it's not enough.I'm 19 and jobless, but I really need money.I would appreciate anything that comes from you."

You are still young and you need to understand certain things about life:

1) Nobody owes you anything in life not even your relatives (uncles/aunts) or siblings. Your parents are directly responsible for you until you are at least 18 years old. After 18 years old, you are largely responsible for your life affairs.

2) You are not entitled to your uncle's money neither should you have any say in how he spends his money, he earned his money by serious handwork. If he decides not to help you even despite making promises, honestly speaking life continues, he won't experience any sort of downfall as we Nigerians like to wish upon people who did not help us. God is not remotely biased as we humans are. If for anything, your life circumstances should spur and motivate you to work thrice as hard to better your economic situation and trust me, where there is a will there must be a way.

3) Certain traits such as appreciation, gratitude, positivity etc. will take you very far in life. Truth be told, your uncle did not have to send you the N30,000 that he sent. But he did, even if it was not the amount you were expecting, you need to be grateful for the amount that he sent. Little shows of appreciation spur even bigger acts of kindness towards you in the future. In Igbo, if you are Igbo, e kene dike na nke o melu, o mekwa ozo. Try this out, if you haven't already: show enormous gratitude for the little help that he rendered to you. Next time, he will be willing to do even more. However, when you don't show gratitude but entitlement, you are blocking any future assistance that may come from him and you burn bridges.

4) Life abroad might seem alluring and fun to Nigerians back home but it is not a bed of roses as Nigerians think. This can be quite hard to understand until you cross over and experience the system. I will not spend much time explaining this part because from experience, no matter how hard I've tried to do so in the past, Nigerians who have never stepped foot out of the country all their life cannot seem to relate until they relocate and live abroad for a while. When you are much older and life has taught you certain things, you will get to appreciate people's help towards you, no matter how little it is.

5) Understand that life is about choices. I come from a family of rich uncles and aunts (I mean direct siblings of my parents) but my mother (and I am very grateful for this) raised us to be very independent and not depend on anybody for financial help in life. We lost our mother as teenagers and without the help of my rich relatives, we forged ahead in life and today all of us are successful. When we lost our mother who was our major financial backbone, we had the choice of either sitting around, entitled to our rich folks' money and complaining or taking advantage of the situation to work even harder and better our situation. We all chose the latter and this mindset has taken us far in life. Now our rich folks all want to identify with us and surprisingly they talk about us as a case study of success to people around them. Do we have ill feelings towards them? Not the least because we never felt entitled to their help to begin with.

My two cents.

IgbuduMonkey:
The separatist group IPOB formed by the radical thinker Nnamdi Kanu has risen to become the most infuential group in the history of what we regard today as South East Nigeria and Nnamdi Kanu, it's founder is second only to the leader of the defunct Biafra Republic, Dim Odumegwu Ojukwu. But Ipob has peaked and is already in decline. The reason for this decline is it's false founding and message which is in variance with the history of the people the people claim to seek to liberate

Most of the defunct Biafra is in the Igbo
language speaking region of Nigeria with other minority tribes in today's South South region. Today, it is the Igbos of the South East that are far more desirous of an independent Biafra state. But the precolonial history of these people make me feel like a Biafra state is not achievable


Now, the one Igbo ethnic identity we have today is not real, it is a pseudo-nation just like Nigeria and indeed most African countries are pseudo-nations. There was nothing like Igbo nation before colonialism as the Igbos were organized into numerous clans that fought, killed and sold themselves. The region was so toxic in those times that the Igbos account for a very high percentage of people sold as slaves during the slave trade era.

Igbos have never been united in their history and it is their greatest undoing. For example, unlike in Yorubaland where Bola Tinubu, an Osun man could become Lagos governor and control the economy of Lagos state for over two decades because to them what matters is that he is Yoruba, a governor of Abia state once sacked Igbos from other states in that state's civil service

When the separatist leader Nnamdi Kanu accuses the white man for creating what he refers to as the contraption called Nigeria, he fails to realize that the Igbo nation in the same vain can be viewed as a western creation. He fails to realize that the same way Nigeria and Africa can hardly progress because of it's faulty foundation is the same way an Igbo nation can hardly thrive because of it's unnatural founding.

IPob for all it's popularity will eventually degenerate to a clannish rivalry in Igboland and it ia already happening.

To be continued.....

Disclaimer: I decided to reply to your post as a free-thinker, looking at the subject matter from two angles and I am not in support of the IPOB movement in any way.

There was no preponderance of in-fighting and killing within ancient Igboland as you claimed. Yes, there was slavery where the Arochukwu folks were heavily involved in capturing and selling slaves and Igbo slaves account for the highest sold from the Bight of Biafra region, however, Yorubaland experienced more pre-independence in-fighting (Ekiti-Parapo war of 1877, Osogbo war of 1840, Oyo vs Dahomey war etc.) and internal resistance compared to Igboland. Igboland, by far, was very peaceful (the lack of a central king as obtained in the Edo region which often came with periodic tyranny causing Edo people to flee Edoland and seek refuge in Igboland as refugee seekers), flourished in agriculture (attracted Igala migrants in droves to settle along the Northern fringes of Igboland and along the riverside - ndi Olu), etc.

I personally don't agree with IPOB especially the way Nnamdi Kanu is going about the movement - he has created enemies for himself, even unnecessary enmity with people he should have allied with. However, is the struggle for independence valid? Yes, absolutely. Any region has a right to clamor for independence. However, is his approach the best? I don't think so. I think that there are 43 or 44 petitions for independence with the UN and that of Biafra was pending acceptance as of a few months ago.

The lack of a common ethnic image was common to most ancient African tribes. It is not Igbo-specific. In the same vein, this should not be used as a predictive yardstick for future co-operative tendencies.

The Biafran region of 1967 excluded Delta Igboland not because they were not considered ethnic Igbo but because Delta Igbo was part of Bendel State, which was under Western Nigeria and not Eastern Nigeria which Ojukwu was the regional governor of. Ojukwu could legally only declare independence over the area which he had powers over - which was Eastern Nigeria. However, many great sons of Delta Igbo were proudly Igbo and sided with the movement as of then. If Biafra had succeeded, here are 4 likely outcomes:

1) it would have been a French speaking country or French/English bilingual country - Ojukwu had made plans with France to introduce French to Biafran schools. He had personal scores to settle with the British and had plans to sever all ties with Britain, including the English language.
2) developmental growth in terms of infrastructure especially could have been phenomenal, given the enterprising nature of the indigenes of the region. It could have been likened to the phenomenal growth of Israel within a few decades of its creation.
3) economic growth could probably have been stalled at some point, given that Anglophone countries in Africa tend to fare better than their francophone counterparts, especially if the cedis had been adopted by the country.
4) Igbo and Ijaw languages would have gained the status of international languages with Igbo being spoken in 3 countries - Nigeria, Biafra and Equatorial Guinea and Ijaw spoken in Nigeria (Delta State) and Biafra.

Nice development. Keep it up.

Ofili/Ohiri?

Jigo?

IgbuduMonkey:
Great points. I like that we seem to be reaching a consensus.
Now, you must understand that the level of migration to the vicinity around the Niger River was massive as a result of the importance of this river to trade. The language spoken around the region would lead me to believe that the aboriginals were most likely Igbo speakers. It also seems very likely that the Igbo speakers around here either did not know how to explore the Niger or were not interested.
There was an obvious change in the sociocultural dynamics in most of these regions along the Niger, enough to markedly differentiate them from the other Igbo speakers as the culture of the people here became an admixture of the culture of multiple people including culture developed naturally to live the new reality. Also, the economic and political events of colonialization differentiated these people even further. The early acceptance of Christianity by the Igbos and the successful commercial understanding between the Igbos and the British in the late 1800s which led to the commerce consciousness of the Igbos left a defining mark on the Igbos too. Hence the average Igbo today is seen as a good trader and a Catholic or an Anglican. The western Igbo speakers were not so influenced.
The Civil war is the last event that fully differentiated the Igbos. This is not as the Igbo claim- that the so called Igbo denial os because the Igbos lost the civil war. It is because the majority of the Western Igbo speakers were not pro-Biafra(maybe mostly neutral) and did not have the war experience like the Igbos. So today, the fallout of that war: loathing/lack of trust for Yorubas, memory of the war passed to generation etc defines the Igbos but are not shared by many western Igbo speaking tribes

In conclusion, many Igboid speakers have evolved into tribes of their own as the independent Igbo clans of precolonial times have emerged as one Igbo people

You've raised good points.

Before the war, there were dissenting voices within some groups in Igboland about being non-Igbo or some groups had issues with being called 'Igbo'. For the Western Igbos, 'Igbo' (with falling tones) meant 'slave', being that Western Igbo did not actively participate in slavery compared to Eastern Igbo, somehow 'Igbo' became synonymous with 'slave'. So when these groups pre-1967 would have issues with being called 'Igbo', it was due to that 'slavery stigma' that the name came with. Any adult Anioma speaker born before 1967 can easily confirm their original understanding of 'Igbo'. The fallout of the civil war only served to magnify/expand that resistance.

I do agree that certain areas of Western Igbo did receive many inhabitants, but these areas are mostly limited to areas around the fringes of Delta Igbo land. Perhaps less than 30% of the entire Anioma Land was settled by foreigners, which is not significant enough to change the overall identity of their host communities. Another mistake I often see some Anioma people make is to recall their past Kings (some of whom were Bini sent by the Oba to rule other them) as evidence of their Bini ancestry while forgetting that the Oba often always sent people, often Bini, to rule over conquered areas, collect tax and remit to the Oba of Bini. In other words, in an Anioma village subject to Bini rule, while the royal house may be of Bini ancestry, the natives proper was of nearly Igbo ancestry instead.

It's true that Western Igboland was not originally part of Biafra, however understand that Western Igbo was under the Western protectorate and Ojukwu was in charge of the Eastern protectorate, thus his legal powers were limited to the Eastern protectorate and therefore he could not have legally declared a portion of Western protectorate as independent from Nigeria (an area he had no legal powers over) alongside the Eastern protectorate where he had legal powers over.

IgbuduMonkey:
you have made a very intelligent analysis of the Igbo question. Most of your submissions cannot be argued against if we look at things as a snapshot of the present times. But I would rather go back in time to before colonialization and move forward to present times

As you would agree with me, in precolonial times, to the people regarded as Igbo today, there was nothing like Igbo identity. As you alluded, they were decentralized, independent clans having no central authority. There is also no record of these people calling themselves any group name. Therefore, there was little binding factor beside the mutually intelligible language they spoke(today known as Igbo) , though of varying dialects
There is also no proof that the people that speak Igbo today are of common ancestry. To the contrary, evidences abound to show that some igbo speaking people migrated from the Benin to their present locations, particularly the Western Igbo speakers and the Onitshas. In Aboh for example, the original dwellers of the land were the Akarais who were displaced by the edo migrants to areas around Aboh, where they live to this day. That this is the oral history of Aboh and the fact that the Akarais are known makes the Aboh migration story irrefutable. There are also some people that migrated form Igala region. Again at Aboh, which is a heterogenous community, there are families that know for a fact that their forefathers came from Igala(again,irrefutable), some Isoko, some Ijaw etc. So the common ancestry claim is false using the Aboh example
Now, i do not believe that a people have to be of common ancestry to form an ethnic group, and I also believe that there is an emerging Igbo identity, Infact, an Igbo identity has emerged already from people, probably of different ancestry, but not all Igbo speaking people belong to this identity and I will explain in subsequent post

Meanwhile, i do not know why it seems like i get temporarily banned from posting on the culture section sometimes?

Cc bigfrancis21

You made good points. Thank you for mentioning me in this quote.

As regard your question on getting banned, when you make extra long posts, the bot seems to flag such down as spam and it triggers the ban. Avoid making very long posts or posts with too many links in them.

On the Igbo identity, you did raise important points.

However, the Igbo story/history has been told mostly from the point of settlers and hardly from the point of view of the host communities. Igboland did experience plenty influx of people from other tribes/other language speakers. Back in the day there was no common ethnic identity. People's identity was tied to their villages and all people knew was the dialect that they spoke and the village that they came from. Onitsha and next-door Obosi did not see themselves as the same. Owerri and Mbaise too. People crossed linguistic boundaries into others, settled, adopted new languages and the identity of the village/clan that they found themselves in.

Speaking about migration, what has been failed to ask is, why did ancient Igboland seem to attract many settlers from Edo, Ijaw, Igala and even Yoruba? Igala people had a strong penchant and love for migrating downwards to Igboland. Texts about ancient Igboland indicated that the land was very rich and fertile for agriculture, perhaps some settlers migrated down to Igboland and settled for agricultural reasons?

Now unlike other major tribes, Igbo land had no central authority or king. Every Igbo village had autonomous authority over themselves. According to Bini history, majority of runaways from Bini land seemed to be fleeing persecution from their harsh Oba towards the East where they settled in Esan (E san fia - they have fled) land, all the way East to Ika land. Perhaps they found the lack of a central authority in Igboland (which would remind them of where they fled from) and the idea of being in control of their own affairs very attractive? The Yorubas who settled in Ugbodu Delta State have a similar history of fleeing persecution and these migrants fled towards the East where they settled. In today's language parlance, these settlers would be considered asylum seekers who sought refuge in Igboland, were granted refugee status and naturalized within their host communities. As it is with all migrations, the migrants all had to adapt into their host environment, linguistically and culturally especially if they had to be recognized as bonafide citizens of the land. In most countries today, USA, Germany etc. as a migrant applying for citizenship (not permanent residency) of these countries, you must demonstrate fluency in their native language to be granted citizenship. Being a citizen implies that you identify fully with the community that you find yourself in, in all ramifications. These migrants met native Igbo speakers when they arrived and they acculturated linguistically and culturally. In history, migrants barely displaced the native language of their host communities - they always had to acculturate into their host communities, however imprints of their original ancestry may remain. The exception to this is if the migrants met bare lands, took ownership and settled within (example Opobo Rivers State). The presence of Igbo language all over Delta Igbo indicates who the original owners were. The characteristic of modern-day Igbos travelling all over Nigeria to do business and spreading their language came after British occupation of Nigeria in the 1900s. Between the 1500s to 1800s when most of the migrations took place in Igboland, Igbos were mostly farmers, hunters etc. living within their villages and barely traveled out of their regions, except for those lost to slavery.

We do recognize that Delta Igbo area received and hosted several migrants from other tribes and the ancestry of these people are valid. The population of these migrants compared to the original owners was minimal, which further ensured that the host community native language prevailed. However, for the sake of simplicity what identifies you today is the culture and language that you currently uphold. If you speak Igbo, practice Igbo customs exactly the same as those across the River Niger, bear Igbo names etc. then you are classified as Igbo. Migrations to/from Igboland isn't unique to Igboland. It occurred worldwide in the past. England, France, Portugal, Spain etc. all have similar migration tales. Imagine the chaos that would be if a native speaker of Spanish from Spain with full Spanish names tells you he's British because his forefathers migrated from England in the 1700s. Or Louise de BeauRegard from France who speaks only French and practices French culture tells you that he isn't French but Spanish because his forefather came from Spain in 1876.

President Zelensky of Ukraine is a Ukrainian and identifies as Ukrainian and speaks the native language, however he is of Jewish ancestry. In other words, Zelensky is a Ukrainian of Jewish ancestry. Therefore, it is totally ok to say, I am an Igbo person of Bini or Igala ancestry. There is nothing wrong with that.

Jameseddi1:


Olaudah Equiano Was one of this Igbo slaves he stated that this Igbo was under Benin kingdom.

Olaudah Equiano Is the only evidence that Igbo was actually sold as slaves in pre colony era.

Read about his book and you will see the authorities Benin have over igbo then. We are not talking about Yoruba here.

Accept you want to bring evidence of Igbos sold as slave before 19th century that not Olaudah Equiano narratives.

That part of Africa, known by the name of Guinea, to which the trade for slaves is carried on, extends along
the coast above 3400 miles, from Senegal to Angola, and includes a variety of kingdoms. Of these the most
considerable is the kingdom of Benin....This kingdom is divided into many provinces or districts: in
one of the most remote and fertile of which,
- 5 -
I was born, in the year 1745, situated in a charming fruitful vale, named Essaka. The distance of this
province from the capital of Benin and the sea coast must be very considerable; for I had never heard
of white men or Europeans, nor of the sea; and our subjection to the king of Benin was little more than
nominal; for every transaction of the government, as far as my slender observation extended, was conducted
by the chiefs or elders of the place.

1) Do you realize here that Olaudah confessed that while in Africa and growing up in his village he had never heard of Benin until he got to the Americas? And even if his village was under Bini, the power of the Oba of Bini was merely nominal [meaning of nominal:
(of a role or status) existing in name only]. Meaning that if his village was under the King of Bini, then it was only by name because his presence was generally unknown in his village (confirming again that the Oba of Bini's influence barely exceeded beyond the River Niger). It is very likely that his village was not under Bini to begin with because the Bini king would have sent someone to rule over his people if they were subjected under him. All the affairs of his people were handled by the elders of the community and not by a King representative from Bini, as the King of Bini did with the areas under him.

2) Do you understand also that as of the 1800s when Olaudah wrote his book, Nigeria as a country did not exist. Most African countries and boundaries did not exist. Olaudah used the nearest landmark to his village, which was the Kingdom of Bini to pinpoint the geographical location of his people. Did you also notice that he mentioned Guinea as another geographical landmark as well?

I see most antagonists reading his first page, stopping there and making unfounded claims about his ethnicity, without bothering to read his book in full.

Ibo/Eboe was always used to refer to Igbo speaking people, way before the people themselves accepted the name. This argument about whether Eboe and Igbo are the same is quite petty.

Jameseddi1:


Slaves that was taken in your region all was classified as bight of Benin. you and your Friend still here contradicting what olaudah equiano documents supported

Bight of Benin and Benin Kingdom are two different things. Do not confuse the two.

A “BIGHT” REFERS TO a bend or curve, most often a crescent shape, that forms an open bay in a coastline. The Bight of Benin is a roughly 500-mi- (800-km-) long bend in the West African coast, stretching from near the mouth of the Volta River (Cape Saint Paul) in GHANA eastward across the coastlines of TOGO and BENIN to the DELTA of the Niger River in NIGERIA.

.

That is, Bight of Benin starts from Ghana to Togo to Benin to SW/Bendel Nigeria. East of the River Niger (from Delta Igbo) down to Cameroon and even Central Africa was known as Bight of Bonny/Biafra.

Benin Kingdom refers to Bini people (less than 250,000 people at its peak) and their territories proper.

Slaves from Igboland were sold under the Bight of Bonny, not Bight of Benin. Igbo slaves were not sent to Lagos for sale. Yoruba slaves were sold at Lagos and Ouidah ports. The 2 most popular ports in the Bight of Bonny were Calabar and Bonny (Rivers state) ports. The major slave ports in the Bight of Benin were Lomé, Togo; Cotonou, Benin; and Lagos, Nigeria.

The major slaves sold from the Bight of Benin were Asante, Twi, Fon, Ga, Yoruba etc. Slaves from Ghana to Benin dominated the Bight of Benin slave trade until the 1800s (the Oyo-Dahomey wars) when Yoruba slaves, who were mostly captives and spoils of war, became majority. However, from the Bight of Bonny, Igbo slaves remained the majority consistently throughout the entire slave period. Slaves sold from the Bight of Bonny were Igbo, Ibibio, and some numbers from Cameroon etc.