₦airaland Forum

spacetacular:
I am also studying it which was why I made bold to say it was my opinion.

If it's found to really be a hormonal disorder then indeed it's a disorder of sorts and those hormones are found in the brain. So no point being angry if referred to as a mental disorder.

To the best of my Knowledge​, testosterone and oestrogen have no receptors in the brain, except for feedback inhibition on the pituitary gland, so I don't still see why they should be classified as mental disorders.

spacetacular:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3138231/

My opinion is echoed there. Like I always say, it's my opinion.

It's your opinion. I respect that.
In the conclusion of the article, it is written that their findings suggest that hormones play a role.
It's not conclusive.
I've also come across research that negates the position of the article, I can't find it now.
So, even if it's because of hormones, that still doesn't make it wrong, if it's wrong, that means all cases of hermaphroditism both true and pseudo should be classified as a mental disorder.

spacetacular:
Can you be attracted to anyone without these hormones being activated or present?

I'm not talking about presence or absence, I'm talking about misinterpreted/misreading signals.
It has been evaluated, that and difference in hormone levels. Nothing was found.

ilynem:
Just as there is no evidence that anyone is born gay.

Nature vs nuture proves it. I've used Arab countries as an example.
The scientific consensus is that Homosexuality and any other sexual orientation is not a choice backed up by research evidence, so you can make your inferences from this statement.

spacetacular:
Well in both men and women there are hormones that cause attractions called testosterone and oestrogen and by extension, Oxytocin and Vasopressin.

Misinterpreted hormonal signals lead to wrong emotional feelings.

Homosexuality to me is not genetic but a hormonal misinformation or misreading.

This your position has been evaluated and researched, no evidence to back it up.

ilynem:
That is where exposure comes to play. Expose your child to gay movies, chances are he will grow up to get attracted to men because he will see it as normal. Don't you think kids raised by gay parents are more likely to be gay?

There is no evidence that exposure has an influence on sexual orientation.
No evidence whatsoever.

As for research why Homosexuality was declassified as a mental disorder, this link would help.
http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/html/facts_mental_health.html

spacetacular:
No research declassified homosexuality from being a mental illness. A vote did in 1973 under pressure from the gay community.

Can you give me one of such documented researches from APA that supports you?

Do a research into how APA voted to remove homosexuality as a mental illness and it will all make sense to you.

There is no scientific research that prove IT IS NOT A MENTAL ILLNESS and there is NONE that proves it is.

APA never published their so called SCIENTIFIC evidence.

There is ongoing research to determine intrinsic human physiology as causation because modern science is leaning toward prenatal chemistry, genetic and hormonal factors even dominant primitivism as the underlying ‘X” factor for LBG. The old argument of nature vs. nurture is taking a backseat and current thinking is the choice of sexuality is innate to human nature as eye color.

So it's not scientifically proven but they are simply leaning on sexual evolutionary processes ultimately seeing nothing wrong with it if animals such as Lions, Chimpanzee, Bison etc harbour same traits. In a nutshell they are saying "Hey if animals do it and then we find humans doing it then it's alright. Afterall we evolved from same animals so are bound to take along with us some of their sexual behavior".

Most evolutionists see nothing wrong with being LGBT. so those atheists here Who are in support of this are obviously evolutionists.

Since you've admitted it yourself that there's no research to back up claims that it is a mental disorder, why are you towing that path?
In nature vs nuture argument, Arab countries are known to be extremely anti gay, it is punishable by death. But Arab countries consume the most gay pornoooo in the planet, that all but discards the nuture argument.

Like I said, there are some mental disorders found in DSM I or II that are not on IV or V. As new ideas and research are seen, things are reclassified.

Did you read the link I posted to get how APA got to their position?

Behavioural science is not a pseudoscience.
Here is a definition

Behavioral sciences abstract empirical data to investigate the decision processes and communication strategies within and between organisms in a social system. This involves fields like psychology, social neuroscience ethology, and cognitive science.

For people who think that Homosexuality is a mental disorder, I'll just drop this here.
https://www.psychiatry.org/news-room/apa-blogs/apa-blog/2016/03/homosexuality-as-a-mental-disorder-simply-not-backed-up-by-science
There is no research whatsoever to back up claims that growing up around homosexuals, could be a trigger, same way that there's no proof that growing up around serial killers, rapists, or schizophrenics could make them develop those traits.
Homosexuality was classified as a mental disorder in the past doesn't make it one, as newer research came out, it was reclassified. Pre menstrual syndrome and Hysteria were all classified as mental disorders in the past.
I agree 100% with proudafrogal submissions.

ilynem:
Are you going to keep comparing us to animals?

I'm tackling the "natural" argument, that's all.

ilynem:
Animals have sex with their mothers. That's natural too.

I've already explained this and why it shouldn't be.
Killing is also natural, but I've explained why it's wrong.
You still haven't dropped an irrefutable reason why Homosexuality is wrong, everything​ that you've brought has been shut down.

ilynem:
Anything caused by nature and not human made.

So, is homosexual behavior across every class of animals human made?

onyenze123:
Natural means "not made or caused by humankind"

The question is is homosexuality made or caused by human kind?

Probably, Yes

So, homosexual behavior in animals was also caused by humankind?

Akiintom:
Within the domain of scientific determinants of homosexuality, the homosexuals are not different from heterosexuals. Only in their sexual orientation are they different.

It's may also interest you to know, that amongst the heterosexuals, because of hormonal dynamics, some are meagerly attracted to the opposite sex erotically.

I know a man, who is only drawn to his wife, ONLY when they wanted to have baby. After which, he's off.

They also forget that there are people who are asexual.
No sexual​ urge whatsoever and they were born like that.
Is that one also not natural and a sin according to the Bible?

bennyann:
Yes now. Almost every topic on homosexuality carries something like, then why do animals act like that if it isn't natural. Even animals are homosexuals.....

The comparisons are just too much. We're talking about humans for crying out loud. So I drew my conclusion from the comparisons.

The "animals do it" example is to debunk the "It's not natural" opinion. Simple.
If it's not natural, then animals shouldn't be doing it.

All I see here are people arguing against Homosexuality based on their own personal opinion. Not evidence.
All they come up with is "It is not natural"
I've asked this question, Define natural. No answers yet.
I'm asking it again, define natural.

ilynem:
So if the son is above 18? Is it OK to sleep with the mother? And your comparison with principal, student is just weak. Its funny how you will see "abusing if authority" as morally wrong but abusing the normal sexual practise as OK.

If the son is above 18, it's still not okay, the parent is abusing the position of authority. The comparison is not weak, it's another example of someone abusing their position of authority.

What is your definition of normal?
If something isn't well represented in the population in terms of population, does it make the said thing abnormal?

ilynem:
You see Dr Catfish, my problem is you standing for homosexuality as being wrong and then bashing incest and bestiality as being wrong. Incest can happen between two consenting adults. I posted a picture earlier of a mother who got pregnant by her own son. They are two consenting adults. We haven't been able to prove that Animals can give consent to sex but I can stick my head that they can. Trust me, I know what I have seen (in videos). So if we see one as normal, why don't we see the others? After all, consent is all that matters right?

We haven't been able to demonstrate that animals can give consent to sex, it's purely conjecture, so, until we can demonstrate, they can't​ give consent, and assuming consent is wrong, got Kemen kicked out of the house like I said earlier.

Parent having sex with an offspring is wrong because, the child in question hasn't gotten to the age of consent and to properly understand the consequences of the said action, so they can't give informed consent. Assumed age of competence is 18.
If a parent makes sexual advances towards an offspring, the said parent is abusing her position of authority like a Principal sleeping with his student, and empathy in humans doesn't allow for abuse of position of authority, so, it is wrong.
But if they are 2 adult siblings​, consenting and not having children, it's their business.
I have explained my position why bestiality and incest is wrong.

ilynem:
But doesn't make homosexuality wrong? If the first people in this world were homosexuals, will you be existing today?

The mistake you're making is that you're looking at sexual intercourse as purely for procreation, which isn't so. Sex is to be enjoyed and if a human enjoys that sex with someone of the same sex and both are consenting adults and they aren't hurting anyone in the process, then, it's not wrong. Now tell me which part of this write up is negated by empathy.
Humans are hedonists in nature.

ilynem:
Cocks kill their young. I guess we should do the same

Cocks? Humans have empathy and morals, so, that makes killing wrong.

analice107:
Cc: Space.tacular. Is this true?

This would be a great read. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_HIV/AIDS
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_early_HIV/AIDS_cases
But I've noticed a shocking lack of reading culture in these parts, so I won't be surprised if no one reads this.

Amberon:
Wrong! They got their position through behavioral studies and surveys, not through any scientific work.

What is scientific work?
Explain the scientific process.

Homosexuality is a mental disorder just like all other attractions to animals and in an I objects. The fact that it falls doesn't fall under those categories doesn't mean it isn't. I bet in a few years you would be asking why we can't accept people who sleep with animals after it is legalized in the USA.

Men who sleep with men are homosexuals aren't they?

You still haven't told me the psychiatry textbook that says Homosexuality is a mental disorder. I think everyone can agree that psychiatry is the authority in mental disorders, not you.
Men who sleep with men are homosexuals.
Females who sleep with females are homosexuals, what's your point?

ilynem:
If your answer is "yes" then sir we are already in that future. You will also consent to your wife sleeping with son as long as they decide not to have children. Is that right?

Now, your imagination is running wild. We are talking incest, sibling, cousins, not parents.

ilynem:
OK OK. OK . I am not a medical expert. So let me ask you as the medical practitioner that you are. Do homosexuals (gays and lesbians) stand more health risk (not psychological this time) than heterosexuals?

Yes, male homosexuals stand more health risks. Of which I've explained the reason why.
Female homosexuals do not. At least I've not seen any research to support that.

ilynem:
So to you, incest is acceptable?

I've already answered this question.

ilynem:
So if they get themselves sterilized you will give your children thumbs up to go ahead and have an incest relationship? Maybe even marry and adopt kids? You will be a happy father?

Would I be disappointed? Absolutely. Who doesn't want their gene to be passed down from generation to generation?
But it's their choice. Whatever they choose, man. I can't force my choice down their throats.

ilynem:
No evidence to the contrary? So we are going to ignore the fact they face greater health risks than heterosexuals?
https://www.lifesitenews.com/mobile/news/homosexuals-face-greater-health-risks-than-heterosexuals-study

And you obviously missed the part in the link where it is written that discrimination against this group of people is the cause of the greater health risk.

ilynem:
Good. So you can't be sure as well if animals give consent to humans having sex with them.
Plus incest does not always have to lead to children. They can decide not to have kids (since we are all scared the kids might be deformed). After all, homosexuals can't have children directly. So if they decide not to have kids, will you still see it as wrong.

No one can be sure, so, it's best not to assume consent and do whatever. That was what got Kemen kicked out of the Big Brother house

Humans are attracted to each there based on pheromones and the likes and the difference in genetic make up drives that attraction, but if they've found a way to hack that, good for them. I oppose incest based on the health implications on their offsprings.
But if they can both get themselves sterilized (that's the only absolute way to make sure that they don't get pregnant) and are both consenting adults, whatever floats their boat, man. As far as they are not hurting anyone, I'm good.

ilynem:
And why is that work "less popular"?

Because children's sexuality is a taboo subject. No one wants to talk about it.

And sorry, I might be ignorant but if animals (dogs) give consent before they mate with each other ya? Or is it always rape?

I don't know if animals give consent. You'll ask an animal psychologist or veterinarian for that.

Pastafarian:
I agree that incest is worse than homosexuality

According to what scale?

Amberon:
We are talking scientists and you're talking sexual psychologists, seriously? Like I said , the bolded is all speculation

.
They got their position through scientific work, so that makes them scientists.
You still haven't posted any research work or article to negate my submission or strengthen your position

It is obvious that homosexuality is a mental disorder. And men who sleep with men are called? See how you're trying to deny facts. Homosexuals are more predisposed and have a far higher HIV prevalence than heterosexuals. Can't hide facts.

Homosexuality is not a mental disorder, don't let your prejudice get the better of you.
It is not under DSM, it is not under ICD, so it's not a mental disorder.
Homosexual covers both men and women, and the only group that has been shown to have increased susceptibility to HIV is men that sleep with men. Lesbians don't have increased susceptibility, that was why I made that demarcation.