So now you see how it is.

The first wife is so bitter she takes it out on the second, then gets used to it and eventually it becomes like 'I can handle this!'. When the man now goes for a third wife imagine what the second wife will put *that* one through.

Not to mention the Yoruba culture which will see the iyawo kneeling down to greet the iyale every morning (in front of the iyale's kids) and not being able to give her anything with the left hand, etc etc.

Now imagine an Iyawo from a wealthy family. The Iyale immediately gains status and privilege, plus the dubious pleasure of slapping someone around who, weeks earlier, would have scoffed down her nose at her.

I'm niot saying women should be grateful for polygamy or whatever. No woman would exchange her husband (or ability to have a husband) for a personal lifetime slave/army of slaves. But just as the kingpin of the prison yard gets used to his status as jailhouse don, the iyale eventually lets the power go to her head. And since the husband will probably die before anyone else in the household, eventually she becomes the custodian of his entire empire and shares it amongst her children.

This is not ideal, but all a far cry from 'suffering'. If the Iyale, like Tanna, was already expecting a second wife anyway, she would in fact be overjoyed.

My point is this: the people GUARANTEED to suffer are the children. Even the Iyale's children. Because they will be robbed of a father and given a demigod, and forced to play office politics in their own home. When the man dies, all out war will break out and they will ALL be casualties, even thiose that get the lions share of the spoils. We all take for granted our ability to trust our siblings with our lives. In a polygamous home its an endless game of cat/mouse, with backstabbing and intrigue. That is a terrible fate and one that no right thinking person would want for their kids. But by the time it happens, its too late.

@toh:

Understandable that Tanna makes you depressed. In fact to an extent I wonder if she's real and not some guy masquerading, but she sounds genuine enough. My point is that she has been so tolerant and laid back that it seems a shame not to at least hear her out. Evn if you are sure you will never understand her. I know personally how an illness can change a person's perspective, and I also know I can never fully understand her position, since she's a woman (supposedly) and I am not. So I won't just jump to a conclusion and call her an idiot.

I'd hear her out. And if she still sounds like a raving maniac, I'll conclude that she is an idiot, but keep the view to myself. Courtesy should count for something, ne?

@toh

I know you aren't referring to me when you call others idiots. I'm just highlighting the fact that it makes it sound as though you are responding based on pure emotion, and not thinking through the facts (note: i said *it makes it seem*). There's a time to be forceful and a time to appear reasonable. Since the opposition chooses to act civil, we owe them the courtesy of reciprocating or we sound like a mindless rabble. I'm not attempting to limit your freedom to unleash your vocal missiles on your hated enemies. Afterall its the anonymous net. Check my posting history- you'll see I have unleashed more than my fair share of deadly insults on nairaland! To tell you to stow your sharp tongue for its own sake would be hypocrisy on my part. I merely recommend that you cool it for this particular discussion, since ola, tanna etc have chosen the road of civil discourse. When they start with the insults, I will shut up and let you do your stuff.


@spoilt

I said not *neccesarily* unhappy. Interestingly, the polygamous marriages I actually had the devious privilege of witnesing in my extended family were treated like death sentences by the Iyale and her people- it always felt like divorce, but African style. That goes without saying. However as time goes by, things change and the Iyawo starts to suffer terribly at the hands of practically everyone, her slavemistress most of all. And I hope you are aware of the tendency of polygamous men to choose one wife as the trophy and the other as the manager? guess who usually ends up the manager? guess who's kids end up wielding the most power in the household? It goes without saying also that the two polygamous marriages I witnessed from inception till date took place in wealthy households.

Other polygamous situations in my experience were in existence before I landed on this mortal coil, and the husbands usually not alive. The Iyale rules with an iron fist and is usually anything but unhappy.

I offer no explanations for these beyond the rudimentary, because I can only report on what I observe, and not my theory on how things *should* be. Sure the iyale is supposed to become a destroyed, wrecked, nervous skeleton of a woman. However in my experience she becomes a large domineering primadonna. Sure the husband should become a hypertensive wreck. However he just comes across as an 'untouchable God' held in awe by everyone in the household, including both wives who franticaly tidy the house and admonish their children on their behaviour when they hear that daddy is on his way to 'this' house.

The other thing I have noticed is, that the children are NEVER happy about the situation. I havent seen an exception. I dont know why, and I dont care to know. Its just how it is. And it makes perfect sense.

As a result, choose Monogamy not for the sake of your mental health or wellbeing, or the love of your wife. Choose it for the children. Its that simple. (ps I'm not advocating taking a second wife if the first wife cant/wont have children. The kids of the iyawo will suffer just the same. It becomes worse if the Iyale later gives birth)


Postscript: for non yoruba speakers, iyale = first wife, iyawo = second/subsequent wives. In a monogamous home, the only wife is called iyawo, for whatever reason.

@spoilt:

the 'extended version' of your first response to mine wreaks havok with the continuity of this thread! Please move the admonitions about my generalization to the second response. It appears I was apologizing for my stance on polygamy which isn't the case. I apologized for lumping u with TOH vis a vis calling people idiots.

My stance on polygamy is clear: I am AGAINST it.

I am also against people coming up with weak arguments FOR my anti-polygamy stance that WEAKEN my position. claiming that the man will not know peace is just WRONG. It is NOT TRUE.It is the kind of argument the opponents can shoot to pieces easily.The people that suffer are the wife and children.

Remember, if you tell your son that he will turn to a yam when he steals, the day he steals and doesnt transform, you are in trouble. Let a spade be a spade. A man is NOT suffering when he has multiple women to choose from, LEGALLY. Trying to scare people away by misrepresenting the facts worsens the problem. Let it be clear from the get-go: *IT IS FOR THE SAKE OF THE CHILDREN*

A man who hates his first wife already doesnt care about her happiness, so he wont give a crap if his polygamy is 'unfair' to her.

As for the personal survey: i explained my sources. Primary source is my own extended family, the only family whose dirty secrets I can claim to be privy to. Small it may be, but large enough to provide a substantial number of counterexamples to the 'only a mad woman will accept another woman into her house' theory.  Old-school yoruba values are different from what we learnt while growing up.


PS *once again: kindly fix the continuity of your responses. Thanks!*

Apologies. You were openly aggressive and sharp-tongued but somehow managed *not* to use any foul language! Impressive. So TOH is the sole offender it seems. I'll remove your name from the post.

Nonetheless, consider softening your stance and delivering your posts in a more relaxed, thoughtful manner. Attacks may be fun but hey dont help your cause. I only attack people on NL when I dont give a crap about the topic and just want to get someone wound up for nothing.

@TOH:

Please stop embarassing us anti-polygamists and cool down on the name calling, eh? Or at least be tactful and indirect about it like @babyosisi . the pro-polygamists have been more civilised in putting their points across.

My opinion:

Polygamy is wrong. But it has nothing to do with sex or whether a man or woman should have self control or whatever. It rather has everything to do with the children. Both my parents are from polygamous homes and I know what that entails. My nuclear family is monogamous and the difference is huge.

I have never seen a polygamous family where the kids are happy.

The *older* woman is not neccesarily unhappy (rail all you like spoilt, many 'madams' love the idea of having an 'iyawo' to treat like a housegirl along with her supposedly lower-ranked children). The younger woman went in with eyes open, so if she isnt happy, tough cookies. The man is obviously over the moon, regardless of whatever nonsense he says about 'wahala' (all na grammar. Most polygamous men have their wives in seperate houses and just abandon the one that talks too much.)

At the end of the day, claiming that a man shouldnt be polygamous because he should 'have self control' and 'be fair' is like telling the rich to give their money to the poor. So you got shafted by your genes and ended up female, tough. By nature polygamists don't have sympathy for you, so their answer is just 'suck it down'.

Claiming that the man will die of wahala is just laughter-inspiring. The family will go to hell but the dude will just smile to a happy grave with a satisfied libido and a full stomach

Claiming that one wife will poison the man is blatantly stupid. The fight is *FOR* the man afterall. why admit defeat by breaking the toy thats in contention? she'd rather poison her adversary instead. At which point the man will just drive her out and go marry a tight-a$$ed 20-year old from OSU.

The ONLY WAY you can prove that polygamy is wrong is to mention those who REALLY suffer- the children. The kids are the #1 priority of a marriage, and if you agree with me, you'll never condone polygamy. Of course if you don't care about kids, theres nothing stopping u from going wild and building a harem.

I thot u were in Lagos?!!?!?


abule egba! Thats ogun state already!

Yeah wii rules

but how many wii games do you REALLY want to play?

for now, there are just a handful. Personally I think the wii is excellent but he go drain my pocket no be small for just 2 or 3 games. No way jose

yo linux gurus in the house!

Is there any php app i can install on linux that will act as a web-based media library?

or any thing that can achieve this:

i want an app that will search my system for media files like a media library app eg windows media player, but will then provide a web based frontend so i can access media from multiple computers in 1 place.

cheers!

hey nuttyprof!

ajah may not be a bad idea! got enough space? i think Gbade will be bringing a full PC (not a laptop) so we need to prepare for that

gbade do u drive? got a car? 'round which area do u work/school

For anti-spoiler reasons i dont read the Naruto Manga!

Because spoliers are BLASPHEMY!!!! I was one of the patient guys who waited for the fillers to end. And now that they have, all u useless manga readers don spoil am finish so the thing no sweet at all. shame!

The time to watch all of them? ol boy that mega collection was amassed over a period of six years from 2000-2005. Am still getting new anime even now, but hardly watch anything, my last anime craze was gundam seed destiny! The new animes are gotten by friends and dumped on my head with recommendations to 'watch it! its the bomb!'

But after so long, the thing don stale no be small,

Plus at my current level, its hard to ignore peoples puzzled looks when they see u watching 'cartoons'

Ah the joys of technology. The hours spent downloading over dog slow links from dodgy websites that stayed up for only a few days at a time. The days of endless yarning and gisting with worldwide anime fans on the insidetheweb.com boards and swapping of 1,000 RAR files via yahoo mail with anime freaks in eastern europe! The joy of emule and the ultimte MORPHEUS before it was canned. The exccitement of raiding IRC for FTP sites and the delight of finding rare classics like miyazaki's amazing 'only yesterday and the tear-jerking 'grave of the fireflies'! memories, memories,

old school anime?

Try Neon genesis evangelion and visions of Escaflowne. Pretty good!

blue sub is a 6 episode OVA with excellent graphics mixing 2d and 3d. very very good with excellent sound

Lain is not for the faint of heart or the slow of thought. Its also not for those who lack patience or attention spans. In short, proceed with caution!!!! I recommend reading 'thought experiments lain' on the web (google for it) while watching lain, to understand some of the deeper concepts.

lol.

na true sha. Gamine fine no be small,

wonder why she never entered those braindead nairaland beauty contests,

If Tanna is to be believed, she had 2 years on a sickbed to come up with that point of view.

People have a lot of time to think when lying on a sick bed.

Insulting her isnt the way forward. Find out from her whether, now that she is well, she still feels the same way.

Remember in the past, when polygamy was the norm, wives had a hand in choosing their husbands future wives because such wives would become subservient to them, even to the point of becoming housegirls.

Today of course, the second+ wives become the trophies while the 'old cargo' wives are discarded.

isn't monogamy + divorce just a variant of this theme? except that you not only ignore the older wife, you kick her out of your home.

Ah well. I have never seen a happy polygamous home. But I *have* seen at least one happy monogamous one! In any case I cant imagine marrying more than one wife. But I wont be so quick to condemn those who feel they can.

@sam

dragonball was the inspiration for naruto (kishimoto said so) so dont compare them like they are in competition. DBZ has been over for a while, and naruto is like the sucessor!

Also the saiyans will wipe the floor with even the sannins in naruto, but then superman will probably kill everyone and tell me, what would u rather watch, smallville or naruto

even sef. like i said earlier, LAIN is the ultimate anime character. she will WIPE OUT everyone in dbz and naruto one time. yet you lot will prolly be asleep by episode 2 of lain (for serious computer geeks only! i guarabtee u u will understand matrix revolutions when u finish watching it! )

Hmmm.

I almost didnt reply to this thread

but i thought what the hell

let it be known that i have more than 250gigs of anime- and thats just the ones ikve watched. when i finally lost interest i still had several gigs of unwatched anime, and my friends still dump stuff on my head that i neve rget around to watching

also let it be k nown that much of that 250gig is tiny files from the old days in 1999 and earlier when we painstakingly leeched 25meg realmedia files off dial-up. Yes, we are old skool

so. Here is a SERIOUSLY ABRIDGED list. I cant remember all the anime ive watched. never.

hajime yatate stuff

escaflowne
gundam wing (never finished it)
gwing: endless waltz
gundam seed (not yatate but gundam!)
gseed destiny
gundam 08th MS team (love it but still not finished)
gundam movies 1 & 2 (gundam 77 compilations. excellent but 3 is on the harddrive still unwatched after 3 years)


jc staff and gainax stuff

evangelion
evangelion death /rebirth+end of eva
aim for the top gunbuster
gunbuster 2:diebuster (AWESOME!)
furi kuri (flcl)
melody of oblivion

kawamori stuff

macross zero
macross plus
robotech
macross do you remember love (lovely)
macross 2 lovers again
macross flashback 2012 (searched for this for over a year)
macross dynamite 7 (aquired taste but amazing if u like j-rock!)
macross 7 (absoute rubbish)


kawajiri stuff

noir (beautiful! salva nos forever!)
avenger (rubbish)
madlax (was an experience watching it as it came out in 2004! lovely memories)


production IG stuff

GITS (ghost in d shell)
GITS: SAC (watched as it came out. amazing!)
gits2:innocence
GANTZ (NOW LISTEN YO!!!! )


shonen jump stuff

NARUTOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO (the BEST>ANIME>EVER)
KENSHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIN!
flames of recca (boring shit)
bleach (XCELLENT! but ran out of steam)


random stuff

yukikaze(great graphics)
blue submarine no 6 (Grafikdon, check this one out! great graphics)
appleseed
gundress
gunsmith cats
grenadier
gunslinger girl (very good but ive lost many episodes)
witch hunter robin (good music)
cowboy bebop (never got the hype)
dna2 (nice but the manga is better)
fushigi yuugi ( worst animation ever)
hoshi no koe (DONE BY ONE GUY AND A MAC!!!! YES!!!!!)
metropolis (work of art)
kiddy grade (boring for 100000 episodes then suddenly becomes amazing)



look people. ive watched too many animes.

my anime addiction kinda died sometime in 2005/2006. Ask me about any anime pre-that time and see if i havent watched it.

*yawn* am tired i need to sleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep,

wow.

bigbrovar is a linux maestro now

I knew it! He always sounded like a potential linux guy

@gdon

the incredibles and shrek 2 are far more than just impressive. They are mind blowingly incredible.

Not many 2d features can match up to lionking, so I wouldnt be so quick to say I'd take 2d over 3d any day.

however I disagree with moondust who seems to think 3d is the future and 2d is the past.

there are many techniques in 2d that cant be imitated in 3d YET because 3d is still based on puppeteering and modelling, which is a different style of expression from the frame-by-frame line-drawing/visualization style of 2d.

In the future however tools will emerge which will see the computer interpreting an artists 2d-vision into a 3d world. THEN 2d will be out of date. However that day is still very very far away and until then we will still need 2d for animation where a glorified puppet show does not suffice.

Well, this is what you get when you allow any tom dick and pascal to open his own backyard university with kangaroo regulation.

Simple fact: if the big boy decides tomorrow that all yellow girls must score 0.0 GPA's, you all can't do squat.

Its a priv ate university. The ownership can do whatever the hell he wants. If you want a say in the matter, dont send your kids to such a place. simple.

Yup.

100% correct.

Cov U isnt a public school people. They dont owe you squat until u pay em, and the have the right to refuse ya money

2d has its uses.

The biggest animated movie this year is not the 3d extravaganza ratatouille, but rather the 2d simpsons movie.

2d isnt out by a longshot. And lionking would probably suck in 3d.

Oga admin can move it for you, if you ask nicely.

Thats Seun

?

Its not funny, babyosisi. Its simple. Men benefit from polygamy. So they will tell you it is good. Women do not benefit. So they will tell you it is bad,

, unless they are second wives to rich men. THEN they will tell you it is good.



***


omoge

Oyibo women (and that includes akata/away-an black women) will not stand for it because they can comfortably imagine a life after divorce. African women live with it because divorce = death sentence. Rather live in misery than commit suicide by getting a divorce.

Denying someone NYSC clearance because of his health. What in the world next. As if premarital sex is the only way you can contact AIDS.

If they want to be all religous and holier than thou they should just subject the students to a virginity test. At least then they would be honest to themselves.

All girls hitch up ya skirts and let teh cleric examine the integrity of thy holy hymen,

As for pregnancy, well, one can say since moral instruction is a part of the school's curriculum, contracting a pregnancy would be seen as a failure of said compulsory course.

It is however a double standard because what then do you do to victims of rape or harrassment. And why do the boys go scot free.

Hmmm grafikdon I can relate.

There's a girl I left for apparently no reason. People think I'm wicked for doing so.

What they dont know and i wont tell them is that she wanted me to start beating her up.

using the same language that girl used on you. weak and not man enough and whatnot. Provoking and making fun of you when you dont follow through.

of course that was a long time before we actually broke up. It had begun then, sha. And I never told her why.

Till this day I dont know whether she was joking but I have no intention of finding out. That kind of joke is crossing the line.

Funny thing? Based on how she otherwise acts, if she were on this forum, I'm sure she would be one of those saying she can never be with one who beats her.

Ah well. The things that happen behind closed doors.