₦airaland Forum

timonski:
^ you christians are just as confused as the atheists. Science confirms that the biblical god is just an alien, albeit a powerful one

LOL! Aliens? Well as we have learned from the christians if you believe it and have faith it's true so I guess aliens created the universe. But who or what created the universe?

timonski:
Lol. How can *molecules* cause a big bang?

If you missed grade 6 life science class I'm not about to explain it to you. You can google it.

truthman2012:
False!!!

Igbo mythology is demonic deception.
When did Igboland come to existence? How did Amadioha create the Israelites, Egyptians who existed long before the Igbos? No doubt, the first man was not Ibo.

How did the Israelites create the Igbos? (LOL!). What applies to one applies to all.

timonski:
And how do you atheists know that the universe wasn't created by God?

Because God doesn't exist. As you christians keep saying: nothing cannot create something therefore if nothing created God then God cannot be something.

truthman2012:
The big bang theory says the universe started as a small singularity and then expand. What caused the 'the small singularity' as nothing can cause something?

I would not go into other issues you raised as it will derail the thread.

Molecules caused the small singularity.

truthman2012:
What caused the Universe as NOTHING can cause SOMETHING (if not God)?

I will keep repeating this question, which am sure no atheist can answer.

And I told you the big bang theory offers a more sound and valid theory than this God not a single soul in the billions of years the world has been in existence has never seen. This God who only let Himself be known by a select population for thousands or maybe millions of years leaving the rest of the world in the dark. If He is real why did he for centuries allow the rest of the world to be heathen. If he could send the Israelis Jesus, Moses, Isaiah etc. then why couldn't he do the same for the Chinese, Indians, Koreans, Africans etc.

honourhim:
Nneoma do you understand the word feigning?
How does not having time to write means feigning? Did I say it after your reply? No. So why would you now feel I was defeated by your reply and because of that i feigned that I have no time?

Yes you feigned you have something to say but ended up saying nothing.

Ps: thanks for calling me Nneoma *blush*

GeneralShepherd:
But you said something cannot come out of nothing, yet your God came out of nothing. Why is your God violating your own logic? If a God can come out nothing then you just agreed that the universe might have come out nothing.

It simply means that we agree that something can come out of nothing,unless you agree that God is nothing.

Anyway for now nobody knows how the universe started and till there is a proof for a God, I'm happy loving my family and friends. I am actually happier now that I am an atheist. For two years it's been fun.

All religions serve one purpose only: to control and oppress the mind. Christians will claim God is not to be questioned you are only meant to have faith. In the same breath they claim everything has a purpose meaning that I have a mind that can think and rationalize means that is my mind's purpose. If God created my mind for that purpose why then would he stop me from fulfilling the purpose of the mind? Doesn't make sense.

honourhim:
How did you know that God didn't know that lucifer will fall?

if he knew and he still allowed it to happen then he is a sadist not loving. He deliberately created humans to be weak, put us in the lion's den then expects us to be strong and resist the devil whom even the angels (who are supposedly holier and stronger than us) couldn't resist and we humans who were deliberately made weak are meant to be strong enough to resist this "devil"? He clearly doesn't love all his "creations" equally therefore he is not a fair and just God as christianity claims he does or else he would have at least made us strong instead of weak and then brag about weakness of humans. By the way a human and animal parent goes out of the way to protect it's young and would never deliberately put its child in harm's way. If God knew about Lucifer but allowed it to happen that raises some serious eyebrows.

God has hiis reason for allowing things go that way and it must not suit ours. Do you know his purpose for creating the earth and all that are in it?

Clearly to amuse himself if he deliberately created Lucifer and allow him to bring evil into the world. What greater purpose does allowing a 3 month old baby to be raped serve? People to enslaved simply because they have darker pigmentation? Why does he continue to hide Himself when He can see people killing each other over Him? He can end the arguments and senseless
killings simply by revealing Himself. What purpose does allowing religious gangsters to prosper at the expense of the poor who are trying to reach out to Him in the first place?

Did God claim he is only loving and does his love mean poampering evil doers?

First question: YES! Walk into any church first thing they'll tell is "God loves you my child". So this God's love means that I must be neglected by my father before birth, by my mother at child birth, abused by my aunt and uncle who raised me and later by my boyfriends and physically abused by my husband everyday? Because He doesn't want to pamper me? These things must have happened to me because somehow as a foetus inside my mother's tummy I must have sinned and deserved punishment?

Did he say he ll forgive when you ve not asked for it?

does the bible not say: "ask and it shall be given unto you?". Therefore why is it unreasonable for me to expect forgiveness if I ask for it? Humans forgive when they are asked, why can't God who is supposedly greater than us?

Did he say he is punishing because he loves to punish even when he made a way of escape (the redemption plan)? If he loves punishing then he wouldn't have made the way out.

all of that wouldn't have been necessary had He not created evil in the first place. If He is as all knowing as claimed He would have known what will happen and if He really was loving He would have prevented it or at least destroyed Lucifer and evil and He wouldn't be waiting time immemorial to do it. The argument that God hasn't destroyed Lucifer because He is a loving God who does not destroy does not fly. What about the residents of Sodom and Gomora? The first population before the Noah flood or the Philistine soldiers he killed (or allowed to be killed)?

You think you are defending God but all you have done is prove what greater love than God humans have. How more forgiving humans are. Your parent no matter how much wrong you have done will never destroy you instead (even though they might punish you) will love you harder and work harder to protect you because they will interpret it as they haven't done a good job of guiding you.

malvisguy212:
lucifer was created with one of the finest material;

Ezekiel 28:12–15
12 “Son of man, araise a lamentation
over bthe king of Tyre, and say to him,
Thus says the Lord God:
“You were the signet of perfection,1
full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 You were in Eden, the garden of
God;
fevery precious stone was your covering,
sardius, topaz, and diamond,
beryl, onyx, and jasper,
sapphire,2 femerald, and carbuncle;
and crafted in gold were your settings
and your engravings.
On the day that you were created
they were prepared.
14 You were an anointed guardian
cherub.
I placed you; you were on the holy
mountain of God;
in the midst of the stones of fire you
walked.
15 You were blameless in your ways
from the day you were created,
till UNRIGHTEOUSNESS was found in you.

How did unrighteousness found in satan? Notice the word "I WILL"in the verse bellow;

Isaiah 14:12–15
12 “How you are fallen from heaven,
O Day Star, eson of Dawn!
How you are cut down to the ground,
you who laid the nations low!
13 You said in your heart,
I will ascend to heaven;
above the stars of God
I will set my throne on high;
I will sit on the mount of assembly
in the far reaches of the north;
14 I will ascend above the heights of the
clouds;
I will make myself like the Most High.’
15 But you are brought down to Sheol,
to the far reaches of the pit.

Your point is...?

malvisguy212:
when you made this post
"I never said anything caused God"

What are you trying to say here?

#sigh... If you start from the beginning and read carefully you'll notice I keep saying there is no proof of God, God doesn't exist therefore if he doesn't exist nothing can cause Him. Understand now?

malvisguy212:
Another reason for rejecting God
(choosing atheism), is a willing
acceptance of satanic deception.

The angel Lucifer fell and became Satan (“adversary”) due to his desire to supplant God.
This was Lucifer’s single-minded obsession. He not only rejected God by attempting to supplant Him, but he urged humans to do likewise. Satan urged Eve to choose against God for her own self-fulfilment:
He said to the woman, “Did God actually
say, ‘You shall not eat of any tree in the
garden’?” And the woman said to the
serpent, “We may eat of the fruit of the
trees in the garden, but God said, ‘You
shall not eat of the fruit of the tree that is in the midst of the garden, neither shall you touch it, lest you die.’” But the
serpent said to the woman, “You will not
surely die. For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.” (Genesis 3:1-5 ESV).

The tactic is clear: firstly, question God’s
statements, then, contradict God’s
statements and, finally, urge rebellion in seeking equality with God.

This manifests in atheists as
1. Questioning whether there is a God to
make statements in the first place, so
God did not say anything.
2. Contradicting the statements said to
have been spoken by God.
3. Seeking equality with God by replacing God with the self.

This satanic deception appeals strongly
to atheists as it bolsters two of their
desired delusions: 1) absolute autonomy —being free to do as they please, and 2) the lack of ultimate accountability—there are no eternal consequences for doing as they please.

Christianity doesn't need anything or anyone to make it contradict itself it does that perfectly all by itself. Proof: God is supposedly all knowing and knows what you are going to do before you know yourself. If that is true why didn't he know that Lucifer was going to try to overthrow Him and "bring" evil? A rational being with that knowledge would have prevented that from happening by either not creating Lucifer or stopping him somehow before hand. God is claimed to be loving and forgiving yet he loves punishing people and destroying cities in the bible. That's neither loving or forgiving.

malvisguy212:
you can twist your earlier coment you made, no problem bro, the truth is this , there is God.

Christianity is not a blind faith.

Next time start from the top of the conversation not the middle else you'll always catch the wrong end of the stick as you have done now.

honourhim:
And I told you that I don't have time to start writing experiences. If I had time to do that you would ve seen that my points are different from what you wrote.

You are the one that requested that people should share experiences and I know that what I want to write will require some detailed account which I have no time to write. hence I sincerely said no time on my side. I said this from the beginning but now you are making it look as if it was your reply that made me say I don't have time. Na wa for you. Na so you dey twist things?

With your response I can see that you don't even know what the thread you opened entails. That means that contrary to my thought, you opened the usual box-me-i-box-you thread between atheists and christians. You dey try o.

But you didn't make any point You only said you have proof but don't have time to write. Is that not feigning?

malvisguy212:
your earlier coment indicate , nothing caused God, in other word, God is the first caused.

I never said that either. What I said is there is no proof of God's existence and the faith and the bible are not proof

malvisguy212:
ok. Thank you for your time. God is the FIRST CAUSED.

Either you missed the point or you just jumped in without reading the beginning.

malvisguy212:
but you BELIEVE the thing caused God. So He exist.

I never said anything caused God.

honourhim:
Its not me you were addresseng I can see.

My brother you are confused let's drop it.

malvisguy212:
in other word, you see no reason of worshipping the cause that caused god , but he exist because you argued for it. IT MEAN YOU ARE DISOBEYING THE CAUSE THAT CAUSED gOD.

What? How can I disobey something I don't even believe exists?

malvisguy212:
we are not talking about the seen ,we are talking about the supernatural,you and I know that our parents are human, but God is a spirit,the atheists argument is "something made God (spirit)". Will you worship this thing? And the next question is this " what made the thing that made God " this is senseless.

I already said no, I don't see reason to worship anything. For what good reason? If my parents asked me to worship them that would make sense because they do things for me and it would be like payback. But now for me to worship something that only exists in my mind and does nothing for me makes absolutely no sense.

truthman2012:
Put your questions to Him. His actions are unquestionable by ordinary mortals, whose eyes cannot see beyond the physical.

You claim to know him why can't I ask you?

truthman2012:
Little scientists say there is no God. Many if not all have had dreams at one time or the other. Their SPIRIT moves and they find themselves far from where they really are. In dream they don't even know they are dreaming, they think it is their whole life, until they wake up.

If there is SPIRIT, yet they could not see it as they cannot see God the Father of all spirits, which makes them to deny His existence.

They sleep, dream and wake up again when the spirit returns to the body. Man becames dead when the spirit leaves and does not return.

The Devil can make intelligent people do sensless things.

You haven't answered me. If God is part of the universe and the universe has a cause then what caused God?

malvisguy212:
ok bro, I want to ask you a question;

Assuming you are right,something caused god, what next? Will you worship this thing that caused god? Or will you continue to ask the same question, what causes the thing that caused god?

No. Why should I worship anything? Do you worship your parents? They created you. Do you wake up and pray to them, sing praises to them? Do they require that of you or are they just happy to see you healthy and happy and ask for nothing back except for you to do your best and be happy?

Simple question:

If God exists and is everywhere then why did he only "reveal" himself to only a small, select selection of the population. Why did for examples Africans, Chinese, Aboriginals etc not know about him? Why did he not send messengers to them? Why did he wait until the white people went into the world to steal other people's land "to spread the knowledge" about him? If he created all then why did he have special people (the Jews) what of his other "creations"? Don't they matter?

honourhim:
What's the lie there? She just rehashed the usual atheists stuff which has no solid base. At least my comment was made based on the points in the OP which you people have serially failed to nullify.

Simply nulify those points and you ve addressed my comment. For now, una dey dance kwashiokor dance.

Go back and read what you said. Then read my response to you. Did you not say there's no reason to doubt God created the universe? Now which part of my response to you is digressing?

truthman2012:
My point is: what caused the 'singularity'

Same thing that created the singularity talked about in the bible. Remember you said it includes God so you can't use God as a cop out

davien:
This is circular reasoning because you can't use the bible to prove anything about what it already claims.....it's like using a Harry potter novel to prove hogwards is a real place

Lol! D haven't you learned anything? If you believe and have faith it's real. Unicorns exist, Edward Cullan exist, Wolverine and the X-men exist. How do I know? The My Little Pony books say there are unicorns. Twilight tells us about Edward and his family.

honourhim:
Obviously you don't unerstand my point.

Because you made no point only feigned at making one then cowered away with "I don't have time to write"

honourhim:
That doesn't address my comment either.

Then your comprehension skills are seriously lacking...

truthman2012:
Universe is defined as ''the whole creation and the Creator'', meaning it includes the earth.

The Big Bang Theory from the link says the Universe started from 'small singularity' and expanded. Whatever the singularity means, SOMETHING must have CAUSED it. What is the something if not God?

@ bolded: Errr... So does the bible. You do you that a mass is singular don't you? Doesn't the bible say earth was once a mass and God separated day and night, collected the water etc.? So therefore what is your point?

truthman2012:
From your order of creations: Universe first, then bang, galaxy and planet, right? Serious error. Everything created is known as the Universe.

''Earth evolves and fertilized over time''. Did the earth evolve from nothing as nothing produces nothing? It must have evolved from SOMETHING and that something is God. Or tell me what the something was.

You will have a hard time proving something evolved from nothing.

Uhhh... I never said earth was created from nothing. I don't have the patience to explain the whole thing and I remember saying WATER (which something) fertilized earth allowing life to grow. I also remember specifying that I've over simplified the theory and I referred you to the link so that you can get a more thorough explanation

davien:
For a christian to lie through his teeth like this is a great feat....since when is the universe defined as the bolded?
Wow!...just wow!

No hold up! Let us use his argument and his definition. So the universe according to @truthman2012 is ''the whole
creation and the Creator'' and in the same breath he says that according to the law of cause and effect something must have created the universe. Now if by @truthman2012 definition of the universe (I remind all that he said the universe is defined as: ''the whole
creation and the Creator'' - Creator being God I assume because he capitalized the word) then that means GOD MUST HAVE BEEN CAUSED BY SOMETHING because as the christians keep saying nothing can create nothing and @truthman2012 said in his OP the universe was created or caused by something else therefore if christians assert God exist the what or who created God?