₦airaland Forum

@Slim

I don go check am, he signed one of those "bond" long term contracts in 2008, I guess a long term contract is anything from 4-6 years so he has anything from 2 to 4 years left which puts us in a relative strong position, but Le Prof had better have a plan in place, I don't like the sounds of discontent though he might have been misquoted. But even I would rate Le Prof barmy if he doesn't find a way to retain this boy.

A bit of a shame Szczesney is starting to moan in the press back in Poland about opportunities at Arsenal, he might be another one we'll lose like Merida, definitely going to be a topclass GK very soon. I trust Arsene can talk him around though, I hope he has one of those long term contracts with us.

slimshay:
Tell twitchy to stop lying. Totoham don't have youth. They don't even feature in the reserve league wtf is he saying.
We will be seeing our young boys as usual against all the wasted money twitchy has. Krancjar, Jenas, dem dem.
Tsall good, the young guns ready to blaze. Tenhutt!!!!

No mind popeye, such a brazen iro, they cancelled their reserve team after they played against our Reserve team of under 18s with a team that cost more in transfer fees than Arsenal's first team and could barely muster a 1-0 victory. We should beat them today. The only 2 young players he can call up are probably Jonathan Obika and Danny Rose the other good ones, Townsend and Bostock are out on loan.
Infact, those 2 are actally out on loan too so I don't think he has any youth available that he would dare put out even against our Academy players except he wants a disgrace at shite hard lane.

Glad to see that there are some people who don't just swallow the English media's garbagge without thinking for themselves. Almunia is a decent keeper, he may not be exceptional like Cech or VDS but he is not responsible for us not winning the PL last season as he is being made out to be.
I used to believe Fabianski was better (I still believe he has better reflexes) but Manny Almunia deserves the number 1 position at Arsenal, to survive such an onslaught and not allow his head drop is very commendable.

slimshay:
Last post I meant fa* cup.
We have 2 good left backs, why do all this shifting around. Clichy might av a few mistakes in him but he's been putiing in a good shift. Folks need to be careful so they dnt turn clichy to the almunia of this season.

I no know why some of our players dey always get comma, Clichy is a committed player who will almost die on the pitch for Arsenal but he is no longer a small boy and should be one of those the others look to for confidence how can an unknown Elmohammadu (abi na wetin be him name) be making him look so poor? 
Compare his performance yesterday with Sagna's assured performance? he no dey look Evra? 
If he continues like this, he will give those hard core briticos like Myles Palmer the ammo to pile pressure on Arsene to put Gibbs in at his expense.

He that hath an ear, let him hear. Austerity measures now in place at Chelsea.

http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/2896/premier-league/2010/09/18/2125389/chelsea-owner-roman-abromovich-set-to-make-financial-club

I can imagine Roman telling those guys something like "Eyin boyz, it aint easy to continue bleedin 250 milla out of your personal fortune every other year, money has wings and it does fly"

Dr Kitaun:
Take 7. . .against W/BROM, ao do we cope without FAB, SONG, CHAMAK? Pls put in consideration d status of dose wit knocks

Chamakh won't be out now, he has a week of rest to recover in time for next week and I don't think he copped any injury now did he? anyway, Bendtner and RVP will soon be back and if push comes to shove we can play JET.  

Dr Kitaun:
take 4 . . .I appreciate that Dudu agrees with me that JET is the future of Arsenal footie, just like we said of SONG.

That one is a sure banker Doki, the boy get the X-Factor, he is next in line to be our Drogba since Ade was found wanting and Madame Kovacevic has worsened Bartender's groin. Ki olorun ki o so omo naa fun wa and keep him far away from the Shawcrosses and Taylors of this wicked world.

Lack lustre game coming off a european high, oh why oh why must all our games after European games be all away this season? I hope I'm spared more games like this. All dem guys chillin with Colin Lewin had better get back in the squad real quick.

I expected Le Prof to rotate a bit particularly in the center, my favourite teenager Wilshere IMO shouldnt have started today and maybe one other player upfront but can't blame His Lordship much, prolly keeping Denilson to provide some experience in the Carling cup team for tuesday. Having said that though, that doesn't explain Clichy's nervy moments or Song's lack of caution, he knew he was on a yellow and that those men in black shorts are out to get us.

Never thought the day would come when I will have to come down hard on my favorite players, but Song, Clichy, Rozza and Jack(in the first half) didn't cover themselves with much glory, to be honest I think we were lucky to escape with a draw though Sunderland can also count themselves lucky. My MOM was Kos without a doubt with Squill coming real close, he was a rock in the 1st half getting all dem headers, Chamakh was a warrior as usual but I think he would welcome this week long rest, all that hard work on opposition backline is sure to take its toll.

Now on to the kids on tuesday, I'll be watching out for my main man JET starting to write himself into Arsenal fan folklore by tearing apart Tottnumb, lest I forget, get well soon mon capitane we need you and Mr. Dowd, pls stop living 15 seconds behind everyone else.

Imagine some haterz are jubilating because Arsenal drew an away match which team was the last to win all its games? at the least it wasn't a collapse like Manure against Everton.
Fair game to Sunderland, they kept at it and got their rewards, the team will take the lessons and move on, this is in no way a calamity.

Well, an unfortunate one but the team still showed a lot of resillience, we've picked up a point where we got none last season and it wasn't in any way a bad performance, first half aside.

Song should have been smarter than that actually, he already had a yellow and the ref had allowed one earlier indiscretion go.

@HNIC

I hope A-40 is looking at Koscielny today, I've lost count of how many headers he's won in the box, even when Sunderland players have got the second ball back into the box.
Sunderland might implode in the 2nd half, there was some space already opening up towards the end of this half, don't think they can sustain that pressing but that doesn't excuse our boys, we were dire.

And why the hell does Clichy look like someone who's never played football atimes? same way he allowed Nani to mess him up against Manure last season.

We are not playing well, lucky to be ahead, Le Prof should have refreshed this team. Too many tired legs out there. Hope we ride out this Sunderland onslaught and things get better in the 2nd half after their gra gra has subsided.

chamotex:
No it was what you said and the assumption you jumped to, not me.
Your argument is pointless.
It would have even been better if you had judged with the youth team and not the reserves.
Any one can play for the reserves, hence, doesn't reflect much. For example, we won the reserves league for our section last season but that doesn't mean anything regarding to what the future holds.

You pointed out the 4-1 defeat and guesstimated that 'not much quality is coming through'.
Majority of this is simply[i] bad mind[/i] and your optimism to see United crumble which is understandable as a GAYnner.

You cant use Reserves result to extrapolate future success . . . that is my point.
For all I care the reserves can finish bottom . . . It doesn't mean a player from that team can't make it into the first team.

The results doesn't matter as much . . . it's used to breed players.

And those 2 lines in bold are the only things I wrote abi? well you are right on one point, a lot of it is bad mind, I don't deny that, it doesn't change the fact that there is not much quality coming through Manure's youth ranks though, particularly when compared with Arsenal and with the HG rule that is bad news for Manure and one that makes me very happy.

With the HG rule, the quality of your young players becomes even more important and with the new financial rules, you just can't go about splashing the cash to overcome the negative impact of not having good young players so whichever way you look at it Manure's future doesn't look very rosy from where I stand whereas Arsenal tick all the sweet spots.

1. We have good young players coming through (Won Academy leagues back to back with different players and a Youth cup in recent times with some of those players already in the first team frame within 2 years).

2. We are now making a success of turning them into first teamers (our squad now is over 70% composed of players who came through our youth system whereas the last youth product to have been fully integrated into the first team picture at Manure is Fletcher).

3. We are still going out there to get talented youth players in their teens (Wellington and Galindo for example who will qualify as HG) while Manure is going for Bebe, Obertan and Hernandez in their 20s who will  never qualify as HG and in some cases don't really look the part.

Now fault my points with data of your own and stop repeating the mantra that because you were good yesterday, you will still be good tomorrow or better still stop the glib remarks about someone being deluded and make some sense of your own.

debosky:
I don retire from this argument, according to Dudu because of black eyes.  

The difference is still clear - while Utd can 'gamble' with £7m, Wenger can only gamble with Amaury Bischoff on a free.  

Sorry Debo, no be black eye, dat one na typo, na green eye wetin oyibo man dey call "oju kokoro" Manure deserve some respect cos they've always had results but every golden era comes to an end and methinks the agogo is sounding for them right about now.

LOL @ Allardyce.

When they gave him Newcastle, what did he do with it?

dayokanu:
^^ You had sevral youth players in 2004 and still went trophyless for half a decade after that.

What happened to the Senderos, OwusuAbeyie, lupoli, Aliadiere, Hoyte, Djourou Flamini etc of then?

Were those players not the ones to guarantee your competitiveness and winning in the 2005-2010 time frame? What happened to them

How much time do the youths of 2003 need to mature? 15yrs?

Did you read this?

duduspace:
You've got to give youth time to mature, in the interim while we were blooding them, our stadium debt prevented us filling the gaps adequately with enough quality in the first team

Therein lies your answer, meditate on it day and night and the answer will come to you. 
The important thing be say make my boys no fail my hand on Saturday or I will go on sabbatical leave from this forum like Sauron.

dayokanu:
@duduspace,

In 2003-2004, You had a lot of youth players like Hoyte, Senderos, Lupoli, Owusu Abeyie, Aliadiere, Djourou, Flamini, Fabregas, Clichy

Yet in 2009/2010, 6-7yrs later, only 2 of them are left and a typical Lineup of Almunia, Sagna, Vermalaen, Gallas, Clichy, Fabregas, Song, Arshavin, Van persie, Nasri, Eduardo would have only 2 of those "Prodiguous" youths

What did that make you win 7yrs later and what became of these prodigous youth wenGAY was brandishing at that time

Stop twisting the truth DK, in 03/04 season you mentioned we went unbeaten, even then 2 out of that lot still remain and another one of them plays for AC Milan. In 09/10 season you've forgotten that Song, Theo and Bendtner have joined the 2 who remain from that season? and this season, Gibbs and Wilshere have also joined them.
Ours is a project in the making, those 2 from 03/04 you mention are still what yu'll term young players in the grand scheme of things, nowhere near their peak yet.

You've got to give youth time to mature, in the interim while we were blooding them, our stadium debt prevented us filling the gaps adequately with enough quality in the first team, now our youth have grown and we've now got them in abundance, for each Ramsey cut down, there is a Wilshere waiting in the wings. Una go hear weeeen

debosky:
While nothing stays the same, hindsight is the best judge of the future - they have weathered virtually every storm in the league and come back stronger - I see NOTHING in your analysis to prove otherwise. Utd have never used domination as youth level to propel them to titles, except for maybe the 'first' team of kids and nothing more since then. Rooney, CR and Tevez that won their last set of CL and EPLs weren't youth players, neither was Rio, VDS or Evra. The fact is, Utd continues to attract top talent and will continue win with the best coach/coaching system in the entire league.

How good was Chelski's youth when they won back to back EPLs?  

And how much debt did Abramovic write off to achieve that? over 500m. If you add that to the 700m manure already owe, what will remain? They might be the first big club to be ejected from European competition under the new rules if they contemplate doing that.
Your not seeing anything does not mean there isn't anything there, the more some people look, the less they see.  

debosky:
The debt has not affected their transfers in any way - it is owed by the OWNERS not by the club - their ability to compete on the market still stands.
In terms of the EPL they have been in decline since the 90's - that statement stands firm. A few triumphs on the way cannot mask the decline. Failure to win your domestic league is the clearest measure of decline out htere.

Look at this man, are you living in the past, even hard core Manure fans are now beginning to get worried with the way things went in this last transfer window, when you cut off the head of an animal you still get the odd quiver, I firmly believe Manure is headed towards serious cost cutting if not outright ruin.

debosky:
This is simple maths - Utd is WORTH more now that when the Glazers bought them. The debt is small compared to the overall value of the club so anyone buying them would be making a great investment. There is no keg of gunpowder to explode - they make more money than any club in England and have done so CONSISTENTLY for years.

The debt is an ownership debt, not one owed to buy players or fund stadiums or the like. Once the owner changes hands, the debt changes hands - simple. All you need is an owner with deep enough pockets (of which there are numerous). The Glazers are simply not willing to sell at the moment.

And which kind of debt exactly do Liverpool have again? Gerrard's debt? or ownership debt like Manure? and you claim the debt is small compared to the value of the club? how much exactly was Manure valued at last? about 1.8b GBP, lets even say 2b GBP and of which they have .7b debt, does that look small to you? How much exactly is this debt that is dragging liverpool under (less than 250m GBP)? go figure.

debosky:
Have you WATCHED the goals or are you just quoting stats?  

It's like saying because Koscielny managed to scramble in a goal that he's an early revelation.  

Ok - you are free to call him what you wish. As far as I'm concerned, it's been a fluke beginning which will peter out soon enough.

It is you who hasn't been watching his games, did you even know he had 2 assists? I just noticed a player who was having significant impact on Fulham's early season and pointed him out wondering if anyone had taken notice, you didn't exactly have to respond did you?  

debosky:
Enough of this - I'm done with analysing other clubs. It is our duty to PROVE on the pitch and with trophies (THIS SEASON) that we are the best. All this talk of other clubs going into demise is very boring.

Why do you like turning the tables? I didn't start an argument, you did by taking exceptions to what I said, if I'm giving you a black eye with the facts, its not my fault is it?  

debosky:
This is why some people call gooners deluded. For all your 'examples' this team has won NOTHING, even with the so called development of youth players into the mainstay of the team.

Without any trophies to show for the 'rosy future' and 'visionary strategy' yet you talk about winning the quarduple? The mind boggles.  

Maybe I need some of the ganja you're smoking bro. . . .it must be very strong stuff.  

Ogbeni, they don't need an excuse to call you deluded, or do you now believe you're deluded? Now your sense of humor seems to be deserting you, I said maybe when we win a quadruple did I give you a time scale as to when we will do that?

debosky:
This is laughable and shallow at best. Just what have you seen 'developing' at Utd? I remember when Arsenal won the title with the invincibles and Wenger talked of an era of dominance for Arsenal, and with Chelski's introduction everyone thought Utd's days at the peak were over. What happened? They've come back stronger, won 3 titles on the trot and a CL trophy to boot.
There is TOO MUCH quality, experience (both playing. coaching and management) and earning potential in that club for it to fall away so drastically.

Fair enough, but the core of your gist is that they've done it before and its certain that they do it again? I don't buy into that logic because it means that things will always be the same and that is the greatest untruth anyone can perpetuate. Nothing stays the same.

debosky:
It is ridiculous to assert a lack of quality in the youth ranks right now means much for the future performances - they can buy in the best young talent if needed. Secondly Arsenal's youth dominated a while back, yet practically none of them from that side have gone on to make it, indicating that youth level performance is a HIGHLY dubious measure of future senior team success.

You don't have your thinking cap on here Debo, can you tell me a more accurate metric you can use? maybe a Galactico policy perhaps but with Manure's indebtedness such an approach looks less likely by the day.

debosky:
Liverpool has been in decline since the early 90's (nearly 2 decades), how can you sanely compare them to the most successful club in the EPL's history? Liverpool's problems are numerous - they don't make enough cash AND are massively in debt with two owners clueless about footie. Utd is in a far better position and their underlying value makes them immune to Liverpool's type of problems.

Now this is utter bull, in the 2000s, Liverpool has won a UEFA cup, Champions league and some FA cups, does that look like a club that has been in decline since the early 90s. don't argue just for argument's sake. Your other points do have some elements of truism in them but yu're stretching them even further than yu claim my optimism stretches manure's imminent demise.

debosky:
This is a ridiculous comparison. If the Glazers TODAY say they want to sell, Utd will get sold for BILLIONS to some rich Arabs and will get even stronger. Liverpool has no such pull beyond HISTORY. Utd has both earning power and probably the largest fanbase in the world - there is no comparsion.

With the debt loaded on the club already, do you think all Arabs are stupid Those chaps at City know what they are doing o, don't think they are stupid for once, their monetary input goes beyond the club and into business opportunities in Manchester as a whole. It is when the keg of gunpowder explodes in Manure that people's eyes will open. City didn't have the debt that manure have now so don't equate the two.

debosky:
na wa oh. How many games has he played for Fulham again?
One sub appearance, one CC game and one league game?
Scoring against Port Vale of all teams when Fulham won 6-0? He's only scored in one EPL game and that was last week. Both goals were lucky/flukes. There is a lot of time before we can say anything about him

He has got 2 goals and 2 assists in 3 PL games for Fulham, and my point is he is an early revelation so I don't understand why you take exception to that? those goals are in no way lucky and besides you do make your luck at least that is what we are told.

slimshay:
Dudu even though I believe you are trying to look at a vary large picture, I have to say your conclusion is overly optimistic.
There are not enough parameters considered before you paint a bleak future for them. Even though it will be such fun to see.

Thanks joo, I'm allowed to be optimistic and to not wish our opponents well aint I?  some people never see the larger picture until they are smack dab in the middle of it. To be honest, I see only doom and gloom in manure's future some of is optimism but most of it is from the facts I see on ground and emerging trends, I'll give you a very good example.

Most people are amazed at what this arsenal team is doing now but 2 performances in the past convinced me Arsenal's future was very rosy as totally different from what the media was painting. Arsenal v Liverpool Carling Cup in 2007 when a team with guys like Song, Cesc, Diaby and Theo (all then comfortably under 20 years old) went to Anfield and beat a Liverfluke team (with Gerrard, Alonso, Bellamy and Fowler) 6-4, another one was two seasons ago when a team with Gibbs, Wilshere, Ramsey, Vela and Bendtner (all mostly under 20 years old at the time rated Arsenal's youngest ever team with an average age of 19) beat a full strength Wigan team 3-0 in the carling cup.

Which players are the bedrock of our squad now? yes you can point at the enhancements like the Arshavins and chamakh's but the strength in depth has come from the opportunities given to youth within the club and not the purchases, just imagine if we had to buy Cesc and Song now? this is what sets us apart from the other Top clubs (apart from possibly Barca and maybe Bayern) and what some of them are now going back to (which has brought about unusual signings like Bebe at Manure) Most people didn't see this coming but those who had their thinking caps on saw Arsene's strategy and the larger picture. It is a pity, some still don't see it. Perhaps they'll see it after we do a quadruple.

chamotex:
Bros Debosky, you get sense wella . . . so because the reserve team lost 4-1 . . . we can then conclude that they are all rubbish and cant make it into the first team.
I bow for some reasoning o . . . .

Is this what I've said or the assumption you've jumped to? for the sake of clarity and making allowance for grammatical misunderstandings, here is what I mean in a nutshell. At present the quality in Manure's youth ranks is quite suspect and it doesn't bode well for their future, Arsenal are better positioned in this regards compared to them and the results in the youth ranks indicate this, if  this position doesn't change then Manure will in the near future slip out of the top 4 particularly with the HG rule coming into play and their increasingly precarious financial situation. Is that clear enough now?

debosky:
Extremely rash propositions by you Dudu - you've somehow managed to link a loss in a (meaningless) reserve game to a lack of talent coming through their academy to implying the club will end up finishing outside the top 4??

When they destroyed Arsenal at the Emirates wasn't it Rooney and Nani that ran the show? Those two (for example) will be around for the next 5-7 years at least so they are ok as far as I'm concerned.

Utd has more than enough talent, heck more than half of their first team will ALWAYS meet the homegrown rule and they are too well managed to ever go the way of Liverpool. There is way too much going on at Utd for them to ever go the way of Liverpool - their revenue geneation alone is more than sufficient to guarantee that.

It's one thing to claim their youth team isn't up to scratch, it's another to use that to define the whole club's future. Giggs and Scholes are important, but there is a heck of a lot of quality aside from them. That aside, Utd ha the greatest drawing power for talent in England, aside from Frenchies who'll always prefer Arsenal. There is absolutely no cause for alarm at Utd, except for maybe a temporary dip, which is in itself unlikely.

I didn't say it would be now, but from what I can see it will happen in the not too distant future, and it did not come from only yesterday's game but from a trend I noticed developing at Manure from last season. It actually maybe quicker than we even think. Will Rooney and Nani be fit all the time? even with Valencia out I believe they already have a major problem but that remains to be seen.

Compare what that reserve team did against a similar reserve team and what an Arsenal team mostly comprising of 17 & 18 year olds did against PL veterans of Blackburn just 2 weeks ago.  When we said this about Liverfluke 2 seasons ago, some people thot we were talking nonsense harping on about how how Liverpool is buying Torres and buying that player while we werent, how quickly did they go from 2nd place and competing for first place to can't even make top 6 and with massive financial woes making recovery even more difficult?

You give Manure too much credit, the same way some people gave Liverfluke too much credit until things fell apart. There is a lot wrong with that club and it will be revealed very soon, all our eyes will see it.

debosky:
He scored two lucky goals last weekend, there's nothing much to speak about as yet.

You obviously haven't been watching him and no way were those goals lucky, he's come up for Fulham when they've needed goals and he has also been assisting even in previous matches. Before anyone starts accusing me I didn't call him the next Messi, just that he is a player who has shown some early season form as Rodallega did last season.

Why did Sauron have to run away now? his boy Morrison, was in the Manure Reserves team beaten by Aston Villa reserves 4-1 yesterday and so was Mr Bebe idi and Silvestre's nephew. I feel for Manure, they will be the next to go the way of Liverfluke, they haven't got much quality coming through the ranks (apart from Cleverley and 1 or 2 more) despite the HG rule, na only long range shots that Gibson guy sabi shoot.
I wonder how they'll excel in the future, expect to see Manure slide down as Messrs Giggs and Scholes wind up their careers, Baba Fergie might just exit with them so so as not to soil his legacy.

Has anyone been watching this Dembele guy at Fulham? so far he has been the early revelation of this season as Rodallega was last season.

Specialist900:
DK loves Arsenal, his problem is that we have not won a trophy in 5yrs not making top 30 in his age group is by your own ratings. I wonder how you came up with it.

You know DK is adept at false propaganda, he is a true Nazi student of Goebbels when it comes to false statistics.

Ibime:
As usual, you attack the messenger and not the message. Why focus on my claims to having an exquisite first touch, a completely unverifiable fact. Let's concentrate on whether Vela has this first touch like myself, Messi and Maradona. At least he has one thing in common with the three of us, namely a wizard of a left foot.

No vex, I was just taking the mick, but yu were elevating yourself to an elite level yu shouldn't even begin to aspire to. Those who say Vela has the potential to be like Messi also didn't intend for their statements to be taken the way yu're taking it now. Vela is a damned good player for his age and really does have Messi's potential or at the least comes close to it, getting to Messi's level however is another thing entirely as there are so many factors involved.

Ibime:
These are not skills you learn such as stepovers etc exhibited by the likes of Ronaldo. If you don't have this quick feet touch by age 16, you will never have it. I can speak with authority on this issue, having mastered this touch myself.

Why are you now suddenly sounding like someone with a messianic complex? Have you been discussing with Apostle King in Jail recently? 
So in the history of man, its only Maradona, Messi and your Humble self who have this touch? What a holy Trinity.

dayokanu:
Carlos vela, Jack Wilshere, Gilles Sunu, Mike Randalls, Nordvelt, Lansbury, Almunia, Fabregas, Henry, WenGAY, SolCampbell, Wankott, Usmanov, Aliko Dangote, Owusu Abeyie, Arturo Lupoli, Diaby, Djourou, Karbasiyoon even Emirate stadium all have the potential to be Messi

Good lord, what such of obsession is this? DK actually knows the names of all the members of our reserves and U18s

We know you love us, so stop the jilted lover's charade.

Ibime:
It is of no consequence to us if Gaynners continue to wallow in collective self delusion and spurn all wise counsel. Adeballz and Duduface will still be here to argue same points after another failed season.
DK, abeg where is Saurons infamous chart of a typical Arsenal season? Abeg post am for dem.

Oh, are you a catholic? it seems your creed is "As it was in the beginning, it is now and ever shall be world without end" but hold on, I remember a time Arsenal won at least 1 major trophy every year. So because we have been arguing this points for the past 5 years, that means we'll still be arguing it next year?  
Go tell that to the lot on the Liverpool thread, it might make them feel better with their situation, it is doing nothing for us, history is rewritten every day, infact every second so we won't let past failures hang on our necks.  

slimshay:
Actually ibime, you are right. Messi had been playing with his father's balls since he was a spermatozoa. He didn't need to learn s#!t.
Seriously I coulda sworn there was a Barcaloanus thread somwhere on nairaland for all you grown men willing for the young man's willy. Yeah that's right, run along now.

I heard he was actually meant to be one of Quintuplets, but he successfully scored goals with the others out of his mum's womb. He was born with an MVP award round his neck.