₦airaland Forum

Abiodun234:
On redundancy issues, imagine Egbin power station with a capacity of 1320MW failing or going off-line and there is not TCN/grid.

Right, so if you say own Eko or Ikeja disco and you are getting 100% of your power needs from Egbin and it goes down, you are in a lot of trouble. But since likely Lagos would consume 10+ GW of electricity if it were widely available, you'd only depend on Egbin for 13% of your energy. So life isn't so bad.

The key is not to be dependent on one guy for electricity.

Anyway, one can still source electricity from TCN. But I'm starting to think that the less you have to deal with them, the better. Maybe get 50% of your electricity from them, 50% directly from the power plants. . . something like that.

The system can be developed to a stage whereby you can change disco e.g in the UK. This is only possible because they have a central transmission system, but am not sure Nigeria's system would grow towards that direction.

How do I change discos?

Like, the disco owns the wires connected to my property/house, right? They are inherently a monopoly, I think.

Anyway Nigeria problem always require Nigerian solutions, imported solutions don't work most of the time. .

Heh, true.

This sounds really good. Kudos to the Senate.

Err

[quote author=bk.babe97y link=topic=664896.msg8298974#msg8298974 date=1305119912]“Did you have sex with (the woman)?”
“No,” said Moreno, who has been an officer for 17 years.[/quote]Hrm

Kenneth Moreno, 43, was caught on secret audiotape admitting to his alleged victim that he used a condom during their sexual encounter at her apartment a week earlier, and that she had "nothing to worry about."

http://www.dnainfo.com/20110510/lower-east-side-east-village/police-officer-accused-of-rape-admitted-using-condom-because-he-felt-threatened

Lol. He is screwed I guess. . .

Let me put it this way: The distribution network is not designed to carry large power over a large distance hence the need for transmission network. There is a standard for outputted voltage form power generating station just as you can not change the voltage of your small diesel generators from 240V. (I stand to be correct though).

But I don't need to transmit a large distance. The picture looks like this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Electricity_grid_simple-_North_America.svg

Well, if I'm generating my electricity in Lagos State (either me or some power plant), then what is the point of sending it to the grid when I can just connect directly to my distribution network?

I think it is, bypassing is an issue because of the cost associated with it. Substations are capital intensive, also why construct a new one when you can lease.

Alright, I would need a substation of some sort anyway, to step down from the transmission grid voltage to the voltage for customers. So I don't see how this matters. Rather than my substantial stepping down from high-voltage electricity from TCN, instead if steps up (or down) from low-voltage electricity from the power plant.

I don't see why my cost increases.

The law states that once you generate above a particular amount of electric power you have to evacuate to the grid. I think its 1MW (am not sure as i can not access a reference at this time).

Hrm, unfortunate. Seems to me that law should be scrapped if so. . . people should be able to do whatever they want with the electricity they generate.

The generating and distributing company are separate companies but they the quire each other and create a monopoly if TCN is removed from the equation. For example in the UK, Eon generates and distribute but they have to first send what they generate to the national grid and then buy back from national grid for distribution. the TCN is suppose to regulate the whole system and that is why its not privatised (only the management would be privatised).

Distribution company has a monopoly regardless, no? I don't see how anything changes. It isn't as if the customer can buy electricity from someone else.

Several power plants means you generate more than you require or you construct some power plants as standby. This is too expensive an option in my view. In fact, some countries countries in Europe are interconnected i.e. A grid outside their own national grid such that in case of any eventuality they can easily import electricity.

Well, no, I was thinking more if your needs are 1000 MW, then you source from say 5 local 200 MW plants. That way if one goes down for repairs, you aren't completely screwed.

Or you could buy 800MW directly from the power plant, 200 MW from the grid.

This might be good for the bussiness owner but definately bad for the masses. You see my problem with monopoly, You are already envisaging  higher profit.

Nope, it is great for both sides. Transmission losses are like 9%. . . if I can cut that out, then I can increase my profit and/or reduce the cost of the electricity I sell. Cutting out the (unnecessary) middle man doesn't hurt, in places like say Lagos, the SS and SE where you can generate electricity locally.

Aren't there tests they can do to figure out if she was raped? Semen, dna, I dunno.

Too hard to say from only this article.

By Franca Ochigbo 11 hours 19 minutes ago
Font size:
The Minister of Commerce and Industry, Senator Jubril Martins-Kuye, disclosed that Nigeria’s non-oil export has increased 11 fold from USD 0.2 billion in 2000 to USD 2.3 billion in 2010.
He stated this during the presentation of the report of the Inter-Ministerial Committee on the comprehensive review of the Export Expansion Grant (EEG) by the Chairman of the Committee Dr. Abubakar Mohammad in Abuja.
The minister listed the non-oil exports to include cocoa, leather, rubber, cotton, textiles, shrimps, sesame seeds and gum Arabic.
He said: “The EEG is a well- calculated sound and unassailable policy in the area of export-oriented and forex-earning industrialisation. It’s main objective was to compensate export manufacturers for manufacturing cost increases traceable to hash environment thereby enhancing their products’ competitiveness in the export markets.”

http://www.thenationonlineng.net/2011/index.php/business/5794-non-oil-export-hits-2-3b-says-minister.html

[quote author=aloy-emeka link=topic=664388.msg8298056#msg8298056 date=1305110539]What will his local support look like when he is denying workers better pay?. Akala is setting him up big time.[/quote]They will have forgotten by years 3 and 4. Better to reverse it quickly rather than having it drain your budget for 4 years

Ajimobi should reverse this policy and any other last-minute shenanigans by Alao-Akala as soon as he gets into office.

WEDNESDAY, 11 MAY 2011 00:00 ANONYMOUS

Adams Oshiomhole

The astute labour lead er and governor of Edo state, Adams Oshiomhole recently spoke out against the misdirected anger of the organized labour against the planned privatization of the successor companies of the Power Handling Company of Nigeria, PHCN.

The governor said it was trite for labour to argue that in opposing the privatization of PHCN, it was seeking to secure jobs at the organization or elsewhere. According to him, “NLC cannot continue to insist that the incompetent public sector should continue to manage PHCN. If you do, you are destroying jobs in this economy and I argue, even in terms of the policies of job creation that in the long run, if the power sector is to service the 774 local government areas and every hamlet, the sheer increase in power demands will necessarily lead to more jobs being created,” Oshiomhole said.

He noted that even if a privatized PHCN leads to a temporary reduction in the current workforce of around 50,000, a healthy power sector in private hands could spur the creation of millions of jobs around Nigeria in a very short time.

We cannot agree more. Oshiomhole’s position can hardly be faulted. Here is a man who once led the Textiles workers union, a once thriving sector workforce that has been decimated by the unending failure of government and its policies. He also once led the NLC and distinguished himself as a consummate labour leader; building bridges in ways many before and after him have not managed to do. Oshiomhole is today a state governor, able to weigh on a daily basis, the returns for every Naira that his administration spends. So if any one should know, the governor is one such person.

That he chose to make his statement at the Labour Day celebration is perhaps a pointed message to the myopic labour leaders who are unable to break out of the fixation of the past and think beyond the box.  None more guilty of this than the leadership of the National Union of Electricity Employees (NUEE).

It is because of the NUEE’s hardline that the federal government appointed veteran unionist Hassan Sunmonu as chief negotiator and conciliator in the government’s interface with labour. Sunmonu’s first breakthrough came after the 14-day ultimatum issued by the NUEE and its co-travellers, senior staff association of electricity and allied companies (SSAEAC).

His appointment and the work he has done so far, is quite encouraging and gives hope that all issues that have held down the privatization of PHCN will soon be resolved.

Sunmonu has made the right start. His credibility cannot be questioned and his understanding of the issues at stake should also help the veteran. He spent a number of years outside Nigeria and he can bear testimony to the vastly efficient power sectors in most other countries.

We can now hope that the electricity workers unions and their leaders will have a rethink. Nigeria belongs to all Nigerians and not just the 50,000 employees of PHCN. For whether they accept it or not, the privatization of PHCN offers the best possible tool for the preservation and creation of jobs in the sector and the economy at large. The more it is delayed by the antics of misguided labour, the more the decimation of jobs and the assets held by PHCN. We do not need to travel far to locate examples. Where is Nigeria Airways today and the thousands who worked there? Where is NITEL today and the thousands who worked there?

It is pertinent to conclude by repeating the call of Oshiomhole to labour to take an economy-wide view of job creation and not just a sectional view. We agree with the comrade that the best and most effective tonic required by the economy today is a regime of stable power supply driven by the private sector the same way the private sector delivered telephony service to Nigeria. The will and desire of the 50,000, even if they were well meaning, cannot equate to that of 150 million Nigerians who have all become collective victims of the sham that the PHCN is today.

http://www.businessdayonline.com/NG/index.php/editorial/21202-needless-grandstanding-over-phcn-privatization

It seems like a cool idea, but I just wonder whether it'd not be better to just buy the existing distribution companies in that area (the Port Harcourt Electricity Distribution Co).

If they build a new company from scratch, doesn't that mean duplicating the existing distribution network? This seems like it'd be expensive and redundant.

Or maybe I'm missing something.

By Ejiofor Alike
10 May 2011
Font Size: a / A

Akwa Ibom State Governor, Godswill Akpabio

Akwa Ibom, Bayelsa, Cross River and Rivers State governments have incorporated a joint venture company that is seeking licence to distribute electricity in their areas, as part of the measures to guarantee regular supply of power.

Akwa Ibom state government has also received over N100million from the Power Holding Company of Nigeria (PHCN) for electricity supplied to the national grid by the Ibom Power Plant.

Speaking to select journalists in Lagos at the weekend, Akwa Ibom State Commissioner for Information and Social Re-orientation, Hon. Aniekan Umanah said as soon as electricity distribution and transmission were decoupled from the exclusive list of the Federal Government and approval granted to the four states, they would be in a position to distribute electricity.

Umanah, who was assisted by the Commissioner for Environment and Mineral Resources, Hon. John Harry, gave the name of the company floated by the four states as Four-Power.

He noted that with 191 megawatts capacity Ibom Power Plant, Akwa Ibom State was already in a position to be involved the business of power distribution.

“We have so much gas in Akwa Ibom. Right now, the state government, working with Septa Energy is building the first gas processing plant under government and private-sector partnership and is also laying a pipeline of 59 kilometres that will harness gas and pipe it all the way to Ibom Power Plant. You may be aware that we already have a power plant of 191 megawatts of electricity,” he said.

The Commissioner disclosed that the power station was already contributing about 40 megawatts to the national grid and had also started receiving payment from the Power Holding Company of Nigeria (PHCN).

“We received over N100million in December 2010 for power that we gave to Nigeria. We are not able to domicile the power completely yet because of the distribution and transmission issues, which are still within the exclusive list of the Federal Government. But what comes to mind now is that oil and gas, and maritime-related services are very huge areas we must participate. So, the government of Chief Godswill Akpabio intends to position the people of Akwa Ibom State to become active players in this industry. That is why government is making significant investments, working with the private sector towards the development of the maritime enclave – oil and gas enclave called Ibom Industrial City,” he said.

To actualise this vision, the state government in partnership with Oil and Gas Soft Skills Limited, is to organise a two-day stakeholders’ summit, with the theme: “Harnessing the oil and gas potential of Akwa Ibom State –Opportunities and Challenges.”

http://www.thisdaylive.com/articles/electricity-distribution-akwa-ibom-bayelsa-others-float-company/91088/

[quote author=EzeUche_ link=topic=662729.msg8296782#msg8296782 date=1305094925]If they are just there to make money, why don't they go back home instead of generations living there?  [/quote]Presumably because there is more money to be made elsewhere than in the SE?

right, but the point is that moving somewhere to make money doesn't make one a patriot.

If I move to chicago because there is a job there, that doesn't mean I'm extra-patriotic. In fact, it is irrelevant to my patriotism

edit: typos

[quote author=EzeUche_ link=topic=662729.msg8296750#msg8296750 date=1305094325]Wrong analogy. . . Do many of those illegal immigrants in the U.S. try to assimilate in U.S. culture? I haven't seen any that do. They rather speak Spanish.

At least the Ndigbo will embrace the host community's culture, language and even religion. . .[/quote]Are the Igbos in the north hausa-speaking Muslims?

They are just there to make money. Nothing wrong with that, but to spin that as something noble, selfless and patriotic seems silly to me

@playmode: Why would I prefer this to an RPG? RPG seems much cheaper and nearly as effective if you want to take out somebody's armored vehicle, no?

When is this weapon a  better choice?

Are RPGs just inaccurate or something?

That is a pretty nice gun. Damn

Does willingness to go somewhere to make money = patriotism?

If so, we have a lot of patriotic illegal mexicans here in the US

lmao

1200 is a battalion in an army, lol

[quote author=Kilode?! link=topic=664526.msg8296633#msg8296633 date=1305091610]^ I agree. just trying to point out the fact that extremism and inequality are the chief problems not necessarily that political/economic ideology.[/quote]Agreed.

I don't even think any country can be rich enough for this kind of craziness, except they are the sole military super power with total control over world trade, resources and international cash flow

Some of these small, rich European countries with tiny armies have pretty much free everything though. . . not spending lots of money on an army frees up a lot of cash.

Probably Kuwait too, or one of those countries with billions in exports but a tiny population.

US cannot afford socialism, imo.

[quote author=Kilode?! link=topic=664526.msg8296596#msg8296596 date=1305090699]Sweden, Denmark, Norway, Finland with their social democratic system and some of the highest standards of living on earth do not sucx.[/quote]Very easy to have that if you are an already wealthy country. Then you can pretty much do whatever the heck you like and things will turn out well.

But for an up and coming country, we should provide the basics (subsidized or free primary and secondary education, some healthcare, infrastructure) and leave individuals to provide the rest for themselves.

Not rich enough to have massive # of unproductive government jobs, welfare, free college, free this, free that

They aren't morons. They'll oppose bad PDP policies and sign off on good ones.

This is just propoganda and cheap talk.

BTW, socialism sux

Hard not to respect Ngige.

He won't let party affiliation prevent him from fighting for his constituency (SE zone).

I'm glad that he wants to hit the ground running.

Ogun should be one of the richest states in Nigeria. How many other states have Lagos State (5th largest economy in sub-saharan Africa) as their neighbor? That is a tremendous resource that needs to be utilized for Ogun's development and growth.

Will be interesting to see what his committees recommend.

Ogun governor-elect sets up prep team
By Dimeji Kayode-Adedeji
May 10, 2011 01:01PM

The Ogun State governor-elect, Ibikunle Amosun, yesterday inaugurated a policy working group, comprising five committees with a mandate to work out modalities for the efficient performance of his administration when he assumes office May 29.

At the ceremony which took place at the spacious Hubert Ogunde Hall of the June 12 Cultural Centre in Kuto, Abeokuta, Mr Amosun explained that he had developed a five-point agenda derived from the progressive programmes and manifestos of his party, the Action Congress of Nigeria (ACN).

According to him, the group has been divided into six sub-committees, namely: health, education, agriculture, rural development and rural industrialisation, lands, housing and urban renewal committee, budget and economic planning and security.

Mr Amosun added that the main committees would coordinate the various work groups relevant to their respective focal areas, stressing that the terms of reference include: assessment of the current state of affairs, identifying the challenges and opportunities that could be leveraged, identifying the required transitional initiatives and roadmap to attain the goals.

He said the reports are expected in two weeks’ time, adding, “We recognise that this is a rather short duration. Nonetheless, we trust that these eminent personalities are capable of working around every constraint there may be, including time, to deliver the objectives of this assignment.

“The other area I will request committees and the work group to devote attention to is the funding of programmes and projects. The precarious state of the finances of Ogun State is well known to merit any rehash here. It is therefore imperative that some thought be devoted to identifying creative sources of funding for the implementation of the policies and programmes,” Mr Amosun appealed.

“It is my hope and prayer that the policy document and more importantly its implementation will become a reference point in responsive governance in the country. It is indeed one key element of the process designed to meet the yearnings and expectations of the good people of Ogun State,” he said.

http://234next.com/csp/cms/sites/Next/News/5698812-147/story.csp

hrm

lol

where were you folks who were against a one-party system when the elections actually were going on?

I laugh in Korean

kekekeke

[quote author=~Bluetooth link=topic=664326.msg8294267#msg8294267 date=1305052806]Same Ghana where a woman got married to a dog ? [/quote]rofl

Abiodun234:
-The government is suppose to be in charge of the transmission system (TCN), at the moment there are power plants capable of generating power but there is no transmission facility to evacuate the generated power (Am not too certain about this but I think I read it) . If the government is serious, massive expansion of the nation grid should have reached an appreciable stage by now.

I read this as well. The transmission grid will need to be upgraded a lot. It really is the weakest link in this whole system.

However, I'm starting to wonder if the problems might be overstated? Whoever buys the Eko and Ikeja discos probably won't need to use the national grid; they'll just cut out TCN and deal directly with the power plant, perhaps? Same for whoever buys the SE zone disco (Enugu disco is the name, iirc).

If none of those three discos is dependent on the national grid, then that places less burden on TCN. Who knows though, will be interesting to see what the different discos do.

Any thoughts on this:

Akwa Ibom, Bayelsa, Cross River and Rivers State governments have incorporated a joint venture company that is seeking licence to distribute electricity in their areas, as part of the measures to guarantee regular supply of power.

Akwa Ibom state government has also received over N100million from the Power Holding Company of Nigeria (PHCN) for electricity supplied to the national grid by the Ibom Power Plant.

http://www.thisdaylive.com/articles/electricity-distribution-akwa-ibom-bayelsa-others-float-company/91088/

Would it just be cheaper for them to build their own distribution grid than just buying the existing one for their zone (when PHCN is privatized, that is)?

Or is the point that this grid they want to buy and build won't be subject to FG regulation on pricing. . . ?

Trying to understand what the idea behind building a new distribution grid is.

enyojo, when things are privatized, then won't these slowly moving projects most faster?

I guess aside from TCN, which will still be government owned

Reference:
You see, when I was saying it just last month sovereignty fears were expressed. You will never get service from civil servants. The y should face regulation, period.

I'm not sure the civil servants are to blame for the Transmission Company of Nigeria being kept private by the FG. . . ? They are causing problems I guess because they don't want to lose their jobs once the various units are privatized, and they are owed back money by the FG.

But TCN problems aren't their fault.

You cannot have government controlling regulation and operations in the form of transmission just as you cannot have the private sector regulating itself. Government should simply sell all its assets and move to the other side of the table please.

Agreed.

They want to increase tariff for what, power that is still not stable.
. . .
But to set tariffs before privatisation is futile. Potential investors will not accept this neither will the public who will invariably be subjected to another hike down the line.

No, you have to increase tariffs immediately, or no investors will want to buy.

The Eko and Ikeja distribution companies are probably going to be the two most appealing of the 11 discos. Let's take a look at the Eko Disco:

http://www.nigeriaelectricityprivatisation.com/wp-content/uploads/downloads/2011/01/Eko_Disco_2011_01_11.pdf

Notice that unlike some of the other discos who suffer from customers not paying, Eko Disco has 99% payment. However, it is still operating at a huge loss. . . $131 million in costs, only $112 million in revenue

Notice how they spend $87 million to buy electricity, but only make $79 million from selling it to customers? So even if their business expenses were zero (which they are not, appears to be $43 million per year), then why would any investor want to sink money into this business model?

Would you put your money into this business, without any ability to charge more money for the electricity you sell?

The government is simply going to have to increase the tarriff, so the investors can make their money. Nobody wants to operate a business at a loss.

Now, we can do a bit of calculation using the #s in that PDF to see what the bare minimum whoever buys Eko will need to charge. For every GWh of electricity they sold, they only brought in (on average) $55 in revenue (I'm ignoring the government subsidy right now, which I'd assume will one day go away.) However, it costs them roughly $91 to distribute that GWh of electricity.

So looks like prices need to be increase by at least 66%, just for Eko Disco to break even. This doesn't take into account additional infrastructural investments that whoever buys Eko Disco will want to make, their expectations of a reasonable profit, etc.

Whether we like it or not, the tariff will have to increase.