₦airaland Forum

CAPdan21:
I'm talking about all comps...hw many epl matches has Chamberlain started

If he is so good why is he not a regular?

We judge with EPL

CAPdan21:
oxlade Chamberlain with how many apps has more goals than utd entire midfield...even keita almost equal man utd midfield stats on his own...it's people like u dat were comparing TAA to that relegation slide tackler...which of man utd midfielders could come from the bench and made the same impact wijnaldum made against barca in CL semi last season

Chaberlain has only 1 EPL goal this season.

Only McTominay equaled Liverpool midfield goals this season.

patrickmuf:
You are going in circles, how come Rashford and Martial control and score off passes from Pogba and when he doesn't play, the supply is lacking? Abi you want to feign ignorance of how many times Rashford has scored off a ball over the top from Pogba?

You made a careless assertion that Liverpool's front 3 and to a lesser extent their fullbacks are key to creating chances noting that their midfield is average. I corrected that assertion. Salah, Mane and Firmino will struggle if they played for us.

Pogba played the highest number of minutes for us last season 3012 minutes which is equivalent to 33.5 games. He created only 9 assists

Accept you were wrong about this midfield team. It is our forward who lack the quality to cause harvoc. No one forward player can play with his back to the goal to control long balls. No one gets the ball and the whole opposition defence will immediately be in disarray.

Salah, Mane and Firminho will shine in any team.

CAPdan21:
All these are just circular arguments..the myth that liverpool midfielders are not really good is debunked by the fact that they have dominated almost all teams they have played this season...rewatch mancity vs leceister, wolves and sheffield and compare with their matches against liverpool

And they could not dominate United midfield even though having superior forwards and defnders.

Remember too stats are facts. They give a big clue.

iamoyindamola:
Lie these guys can't pass or score. When you say move ball forward we can all see what happened when they played against United or Chelsea and city they struggled once the midfield get the ball they return it to the defence and from there to the attackers.
Against man utd they couldn't create anything because man utd allowed the midfielders to have the ball blocking the wings and full backs

Sometimes the space a midfielder has depends on how opposition players fear the strikers and they get disorganized.

obainojazz:
Wrong... Liverpool players are able to move the ball to the final third... I'm not sure I've seen Fred run with the ball for two metres sef... No be by Debryune type of passes.. Even man city midfielders move with the ball

All these are part of what the stats measured scientifically. But with naked eyes, I McTominay runs with the ball and Pogba does that too even though lazily.

However, I did not know Xavi, Scholes, Pirlo running with the ball. If na Ramires we fit agree

airmark:
So goals scored by midfielders are what determines creativity in the middle of the pitch.

Creativity

Chances created per minutes played
Pogba 32.6
Keita 49.3
Fred 54.9
Ferbinho 77.4
Henderson 79.6
Milner 83
McTominay 97

However among all of them, McTominay is most likely to score a goal
When it comes to Tackles, 1.Keita, 2.Febinho and 3.Henderson are all slightly ahead of McTominay who is united best in that aspect.
On interception, Keita and Fred are the best. Pogba is desperately poor in interception.

CAPdan21:
Being a big fish in a very small pond does not make McTom better than any of these...abi is it mane or salah that u want them to be comparing rating with

How the players ranked generally in all department. Tell me where you think Liverpool is obviously superior?

Midfield
Keita 7.16.............................................. (started only two games)
McTominay 7.15
Pogba 7.09
Febinho 7.06
Hendenson 7.01
Fred 6.89
Matic 6.76
Chamberlain 6.58
Milner 6.52

Forwards
Mane 7.62
Salah 7.36
Ferminho 7.29
Rashford 7.28
Martial 7.22
James 6.81

Defence
Matip 7.52
Trent 7.42
Dejan 7.22
Robertson 7.21
Bissaka 7.12
Maguire 7.01
Dalot 6.86........................................(one game so far)
Young 6.76
William 6.63
Lindelof 6.60
Shaw 6.63

Goalkeeper
Allison 6.6
DDG 6.4

odizeey:
Because them no dey count leg over and do stylish things na.
Una gats come to the understanding say world-class no be by leg over and flash.

McTominay doesn't do leg over. He is the most business like midfielder out there

patrickmuf:
Has Fred Pogba and McTominay played together since Fred rediscovered himself and McTominay stepped up?

McTominay is our best player this season. He might not have a leg over, but he does the best work in the midfield. Hardly any midfield has dominated him

patrickmuf:
Please stop it already. With Trent Alexander Arnold and Robertson joining the attack, Liverpool have a front 5. What this means is that Firmino can easily drop a little deep whilst Mane and Salah find their way to the box.

The midfielders you think aren't creative are excellent ball carriers, they drive with the ball at top speed into the opposition's half taking out one or two players in the process. Henderson is also there with his excellent long passes (Up through as gamers will say). In our set up, only Pogba is better than Henderson when it comes to those cross field balls and through passes. This season, against Everton, Henderson created at least 3 clear cut chances releasing Mane through on goal vs Pickford with just a ball over the top. What else is creativity? Wijnaldum beating his marker with pace and power whilst driving forward before releasing the ball to the overlapping Robertson is also creativity. You make the mistake of thinking creativity is when someone releases the ball to an attacker through on goal.
I don't even want to talk about Van Dijk and his epic long diagonals from defence, that is a huge weapon there. Wolves also have Coady who is adept at those devastating long passes, which was handy against City.

In all, Liverpool have creative players from Allison whose kicking is 90% of the time pinpoint accurate to Van Dijk to their overlapping fullbacks to Henderson to runners like Wijnaldum/Chamberlain/Keita to their front 3...It's a functional unit and not just their front 3.

First what you have confirmed is that a coach based his team creativity of the creative players in his team. If you have full backs that are creative and your midfielders are less creative, then the full backs can go all out while the less creative players stay to block. That is what Liverpool does. Every teams knows its strength. This is why Bissaka will be less forward going that Willians when they both mature. You guys should understand this.

As for creativity in midfield, those Liverpool midfielders are ordinary or even worse than ours. When you play a long ball to Messi he will control it. Play same long ball to Lingard or James, he will lose it. So foget about Henderson long balls. Salah is there to control them

CAPdan21:
Using a one-off match in which most of liverpool players played badly is a bad argument...that's like using Liverpool vs barca 2nd leg 2 conclude that origi is better than messi

Liverpool midfeilders are ordinary. They are at the bottom of team ranking in whoscored. The five midfielders occupy 9th, 10th, 11th, 12th and 15th position.

McTominay is 3rd on United ranking.

airmark:
I was referring to the match that made you jump into hasty conclusion - Liverpool vs Sheffield. Those two players i mentioned earlier didn't play and obviously, they were missed.

Hendeson, Febinho and Keita have only contributed 3 goals and 4 Assist in the EPL despite having such team mates as Salah and Mane.

Only McTominay has three goals to tally those three Liverpool midfielder of yours.

airmark:
Nabil Keita and Fabinho's injuries took away the spark. Your team have average midfielders, don't force it.

Check your line again.

Fabinho played and Keita came in latet. . You are the one forcing it. Pogba did not play and Fred had not even hit form.

Our midfield has done well againt top teams.

simonjassy:
As good as this liverpool are,they would be easy pickings for barca at 2009-2011.Is it their front three that would press barca?..

Samething if they met United of 2009. But again football is not mathematics because they beat Barca like nonsense the last time. That was the match I knew Hedenson was at his best.

CAPdan21:
I'm not talking about just goals and assists...passes made, completed, dribbles, chance created, accurate through balls are all individual metrics that we can use to judge

The last time United and Liverpool met, McTominay was rated higher than all Liverpool midfeilders by whoscored, Skysports, Dailymail, etc.

Fred still got much praise even though he was not in form.then.

hardeycute:
WTF are you saying? I can't even say it's goalpost shifting

I am.telling you midfield is aa good as what is in front of it

CAPdan21:
I said nothing about them not being creative...read my post again preferably with your blinkers off...if u don't agree being any man utd player stats let's compare

I saw your post. I saw everything. Comparing stats doesnt make sense. Fletcher, Cleverly, Gibson were superstars when Rooney was on top scoring form in 2009-2011.

See Origi making a last man tackle to prevent a goal from open play, 30 seconds later he was about to shoot in the opposition box.

CAPdan21:
That's because liverpool creativity does not come from midfield but from the fullbacks...the midfield is to recycle the ball and cover for the fullbacks..wijnaldum 4 the netherlands scored about 6 or 7 goals in euro qualifiers including a brace against germany...that is to show the different roles he plays not about lacking creativity

So you have agreed that Liverpool's midffield is not as creative?

Even the fullbacks are gifted anomous space due to Mane and Salah dragging almost all defenders away.

obainojazz:
Our midfielders can't win or hold the ball, something Liverpool midfielders can do.

This midfield I see making back and square passes and only play long balls forward to Mane and Salah?

Pogba and Matic holds the ball very well. Fred and MacTominay play fast forward football.

CAPdan21:
Lmao...fred and intelligent play in thesame sentence..chai! wetin moses nor go c 4 mt. sinai...it's this kind of delusion that made man u fans to compare TAA to that Ijebu slide tackler

Fred is very intelligent. May be you dont watch him well. He play between the lines unlike these Liverpool guys.

The fact that Salah and Mane drags the whole of opposition defence to themselves on and off the ball in the final 3rd makes the rest Liverpool players lool creative.

Also anytime Mane and Salah are running towards opposition box, it is almost like somthing would happen or they will win a penalty. Unlike United forwards who are highly predictable. They cannot make a swift 180-360 degree turn with the ball inside and around the opposition box

CAPdan21:
where did I mention pogba in my post..pogba when he puts his mind into it is a very good midfielder but these days it's easier for a camel to pass through a needle..at least with milner you know what u get

Is Pogba not a United midfielder playing behind Rashford, Martial and Lingard? Now is not rated in Europe in the last two years.

From what I see today, Liverpool midfleders dont have the intelligent play of Fred. It is the front three that is the power

I guess Milner got 10 assists playing behind Suarez or Salah who reached the level of Messi and Ronaldo at the time

CAPdan21:
There is no evidence that doing so will suddenly turn them into world beaters...milner played as a creative winger before moving into midfield ditto wignaldum, milner even getting 10 assists in UCL one time, what has McTom and Fred done

So.Milner is more creative than Pogba?

CAPdan21:
This is just wishful thinking...all Liverpool midfielders are clearly better than their united counterparts who find it hard to even pass the ball a few yards...which of united midfielder would you take instead of a midfielder from pool?...even aging milner creates more chances than united entire midfield lineup

Play Fred, Pogba and McTominay behind Mane, Salah and Fermino and see.

LegoxMetahuman:
you know ball

three front men and the creative left and right back of liverpool

Those full backs have the guts to go all out too because one of the midfield players acts as an extra defender. Like I saw Milner did three times already. Even a full back went to attack from open play.

I have not been having time to watch other teams. But today I am watching Liverpool.

The midfieder's creativity is ordinary. Fred would do more.

obainojazz:
Most clubs have good midfielders.. Our midfield is poor and that's just the fact.

Our midfielders poorer than Milner and Henderson in terms of creativity? Liverpool midfield ia helped by Mane's dropping deep and the quality of what is in front of them

Before we had Rooney, Park, Giggs, Tevez, Valencia, and even Ronaldo who felt running with the ball from our half or building from our half was part of their duties. Even when Fletcher was used in the wing in a few games.

Now we have forwards who think that their duty is only in the final third, except when we concede a corner kick. I think it was also a reason Moyes failed when he tried introducing playing in infividual zones.