johnw74:

What's with all the double posts?
Are you alright upstairs?

zodiakzax:
their problem is they fail to even understand what God's Nature and Human nature is. Bible says the head of the Wife is the Husband (man), does that mean that the woman is less human than the man? No. But even though having the Same nature the man is greater in position. Simple Logic. Likewise the Father and the Son, Father and Son having the same nature but Father greater in position, that doesn't make the Son less God than the Father, does it?. they are all confused pple,i dont blame them, their father the devil is more confused than them. Keep up the work bro

johnw74:






^^^
There is the very best of false jw gooknews

false jw don't believe the Bible and attempt to mock those who do, and who present their views with scriptures.

Joh_8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

johnw74:






^^^
There is the very best of false jw gooknews

false jw don't believe the Bible and attempt to mock those who do, and who present their views with scriptures.

Joh_8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

solite3:
my belief is the bible. That's why I was able to prove it but you

solite3:
do you even know what trinity mean you think it is referring to three gods but one God in three persons who are co equal and coeternal.
Let mean summerise it for you
The father isGod
The son is God
The Holy Ghost is God
All are one God
But
The Father is not the Son neither the Son same person as the holy ghost
They are not the same person

johnw74:



Of course the Holy Spirit is God - God and the Word, who else could this verse be referring to:

Mat_12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

johnw74:



Of course the Holy Spirit is God - God and the Word, who else could this verse be referring to:

Mat_12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

johnw74:


Of course the Holy Spirit is God

2Co_4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

johnw74:


Of course the Holy Spirit is God

2Co_4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

johnw74:

The truth is stale to false jw, that's why they don't eat of it.

johnw74:

The truth is stale to false jw, that's why they don't eat of it.

johnw74:


false accuser,
like I said, talk about confusion, you are full of it

again:
Jehovah means God, Jehovah doesn't mean Father.

H3068

יְהֹוָה
yehôvâh
yeh-ho-vaw'
From H1961; (the) self Existent or eternal; Jehovah, Jewish national name of God: - Jehovah, the Lord. Compare H3050, H3069.
Total KJV occurrences: 6521


And Jehovah is God and the Word John 1:1, although false jw cannot possibly understand God's truths,
and false jw doesn't believe the Bible.

johnw74:


false accuser,
like I said, talk about confusion, you are full of it

again:
Jehovah means God, Jehovah doesn't mean Father.

H3068

יְהֹוָה
yehôvâh
yeh-ho-vaw'
From H1961; (the) self Existent or eternal; Jehovah, Jewish national name of God: - Jehovah, the Lord. Compare H3050, H3069.
Total KJV occurrences: 6521


And Jehovah is God and the Word John 1:1, although false jw cannot possibly understand God's truths,
and false jw doesn't believe the Bible.

johnw74:








What are you talking about, false jw doesn't believe the Bible.

false jw has a false jesus
false jw has a false bible
false jw doesn't know that "THE" "HOLY" "SPIRIT" is God.
everything about false jw is false

Mat_12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

ummm, better beware of these "it's" and things.

johnw74:


I wrote that: "Christians know that Jehovah is God and the Word John 1:1"
and that: "Father and Son are two persons, one God"

but false jw loves to lie, it comes naturally to you.




Father and Son are two persons, one God.
Jehovah is God
God and the Word is God

talk about your confusion

You disbelieve all the bible verses posted showing that Jesus is Jehovah
if you don't want to go back and look at them, just ask and I will post them again.

and keep wallowing in your unbelief of the Bible.

johnw74:



solite said Jesus is God Jehovah,

solite did not say Jesus is the Father,

but false jw loves to lie and twist things around.

Jehovah is a name for "God" not a name for "Father"

And Christians know that Jehovah is God and the Word John 1:1

Father and Son are two persons, one God.

Go back and look at all the Bible verses posted showing that Jesus is Jehovah, that Jesus is God,
and then disbelieve all those scriptures like false jw do.

solite3:
very good so believing the bible is a false belief. Have I ever said Jesus is the father? Like I said earlier why will you not prefer non Christian belief? Yes the father is greater in position but Jesus is fully God himself.

brocab:
Lies! in what faith do the JW's stand for, a Christ they don't even know-the unknown God.

dayowunmi:
You answered the question yourself already in your conclusion. There wouldn't have even existed the concept of heaven or hell if Adam had not sinned, because it was sin that brought separation (death) to Man. God placed Adam in the garden of Eden(presence) which means presence of God, so he was meant to live in Eden (presence of God) i.e Heaven forever, it was his sin that canceled that divine plan. So to answer your question, he would have made heaven

solite3:
Jesus is God Jehovah who created all things. Deal with it

OLAADEGBU:


Can you do us a favour by quoting where the Bible says that the soul and spirit of a dead man is unconscious?



Before the resurrection of the physical bodies the spirit/soul of man lives on either in heaven or hell.

"All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again" (Ecclesiastes 3:20).

This statement refers to the universal curse God pronounced on man and all his creatures because of disobedience. Both men and animals where made out of the basic elements of the earth and their physical bodies is said to return to the earth at death.

"Who knows the spirit of man that goes upward, and the spirit of the beast that goes downward to the earth?" (Ecclesiastes 3:21).

Spirit is the same word for breath. The human spirit is that aspect where man communicates with God's Spirit and this is what returns to God at death. Animals do not have this aspect.

brocab:
Another JW bites the dust!
The bible never records Jesus saying the precise Words "I Am God" That does not mean however, that He did not proclaim that He is God.
Take for example Jesus's words in {John 10:30} I and the Father are One.
We only need to look at the Jews reaction to His statement to know He was claiming to be God. They tried to stone Him for this very reason; You are a mere man claim to be God {John 10:33}
The Jews understood exactly what Jesus was claiming-deity When Jesus declared, "I and the Father are One" He was saying He and the Father are of One nature and essence. {John 8:58} is another example. JESUS declared I tell you the truth... Before Abraham was born I Am!
The Jews who heard this statement responded by taken up stones to kill Him for blasphemy, as the Mosaic Law commanded {Leviticus 24:16}

brocab:
Stop wasting my time read the scriptures.

brocab:
Another JW bites the dust!
The bible never records Jesus saying the precise Words "I Am God" That does not mean however, that He did not proclaim that He is God.
Take for example Jesus's words in {John 10:30} I and the Father are One.
We only need to look at the Jews reaction to His statement to know He was claiming to be God. They tried to stone Him for this very reason; You are a mere man claim to be God {John 10:33}
The Jews understood exactly what Jesus was claiming-deity When Jesus declared, "I and the Father are One" He was saying He and the Father are of One nature and essence. {John 8:58} is another example. JESUS declared I tell you the truth... Before Abraham was born I Am!
The Jews who heard this statement responded by taken up stones to kill Him for blasphemy, as the Mosaic Law commanded {Leviticus 24:16}

[/quote]

alexis:


Revelation 3:14 declares: "And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: ‘The words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of God’s creation.’" Using these words, Jehovah’s Witnesses claim Jesus to be the first creation of Almighty God and therefore, not God. The only problem here is the actual text. The word translated "beginning" (Gk. arche) here actually means "source." In other words, it means "beginning" as in the first cause, not in the sense of being the "first effect." Arche is used as such elsewhere in the book of Revelation. In chapter 21, verse 6, Almighty God says: "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end . . ."

according to you arche is the right word and it means source and you said it was used in revelation 21:6. How do you explain it?
Don't mix things up, I'll explain those portions but let's take it bit by bit.

---

[quote]

Do we want to say God was created because arche is used to describe him? By no means! Understood properly, Revelation 3:14 reveals Jesus to be the source of God’s creation—God himself. This fits perfectly with John’s christological declaration in John 1:1-3: the Word created "all things . . . and without him was made nothing that was made." If the Word was created, he would have had to create himself, which is absurd.

Me Deny the Bible? The Bible has made it clear who Jesus is. Let us not use doctrine to challenge Doctrine. Let us use scripture that is clear to interpret scripture that is not clear. Revelation is a very deep book and one can't grasp it's meaning easily. So, let's put revelation on hold for the sake of debate. I will like you to explain these to me:

1. John 20:28 = And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. Here you have Thomas who is a jew, who knows that the Lord God is one. Why would Thomas address Jesus as God? Mind you, this is not a sign of respect; this is a sign of worship to the reference to someone mighty.
2. John 5:18 = Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.. Here is another time the jews tried to kill Jesus; why - the reason is stated clearly, Jesus told them that He and God the Father was equal. This is a direct statement coming from Jesus own mouth. How can you explain this?
3. Philippians 2:6-10 = Verse 6 nails it right on the head. It said - Jesus who being in the nature/form of God - the verse claims direct equality of Jesus as God. Paul of course was a jew and knew what that meant. If you read the rest of the verses, it explained when Jesus was a man, he succumbed himself as a man. That is what you heretics JW don't get.

So, do me a favor and explain these clear passages I have mentioned and tell me what Jesus, the jews and Paul was claiming?

Emusan:


Lol...please be surprised about your delusion.

The summary of your confusion is this:

1. You claimed now that the context of NAME in Matt 28:19 means "in the power or authority of" not a personal name."

Now focusing on the 'OF'

2. It means The Father has His own Power or Authority, The Son has His own power or Authority likewise the Holy spirit has His own power or Authority.

3. By inserting it let see the meaning "...in the power or authority of the Father, the Son and the Holy spirit"

4. This negate your believe that Holy spirit is the active force of God because according to you the Holy spirit has His own power or authority.

IN ADDITION, this is how you'll know that you people are great perverter of the word of God, now for you to dismiss the evidence of Matt 28:19 you interpreted the name as POWER OR AUTHORITY but when when Jesus said "He has manifested the NAME of the Father" you people said Jesus meant Jehovah whereas the position of scholars here is that the name in John 17:6 means power or authority.

Holy spirit is called by these names in the scripture:
The Spirit & Spirit of God just as Jesus is called The word & word of God.

brocab:
And according to C. T. Russell's teachings, Jesus is the Almighty God.

zodiakzax:
according to your founder Jesus is Almighty God and that is what we also blv in. Sorry u make no sense. I don't think you have read the finished mystery, so send me your email and I will send a copy to you.

And not only the atheist mock us, the Muslims,hindus, satanic followers, Mormons, Jehovah Witness (WTS)etc you can see the trend right? Same category, same father, same lost pple who shall fight against the Truth bcs it will set them free.

Which truth? Trinity and the rest? They are not only mocking you, they know it doesn't make sense! How many of your doctrines have you ever adjusted? You won't tell us your Church so we won't mock you.
For your mind you know the truth.



e doesn't want that you know; your father, Satan, always moves around like a wild lion seeking whom to devour. Unfortunately u r part but all is not lost, turn to God and Jesus and you shall be saved.

solite3:
See as they are avoiding this thread like disease
May God have mercy on these Jehovah witnesses, help and deliver them.

May Jesus reveal himself to you.
If you encounter Jesus like Saul did.you will realise your foolishness all these while

zodiakzax:
sorry dude, you have no case. Of course watch tower will deny his teaching, do you know why? Bcs the Devil is a confused being himself. Russell was right in somethings and wrong in some, what we are saying is. he at least had the sanity to know that Jesus is God and the Holy Spirit is a person etc. But of course WTS will deny it bcs their father is of the devil. Hmmm my friend, I can only pray for you, don't you see you are being deceived? The JW's on the link we shared were very concerned about the finished mystery and some by the mercies and grace of God have turned to Jesus their God and Saviour. May God open your eyes

alexis:


Very simple: Revelation 3:14 is saying that Jesus was the source of all created things. Jesus Christ was not the beginning of God's creation, but rather He was the One in whom all creation had its beginning

What can you say about:

1. Revelation 1:11 and Isaiah 44:6
2. Revelation 22:13

I am interested in your answers

Emusan:


I can see that you lack scriptural knowledge and simple English. So, go back to your watchtower for more training.

You asked for a NAME which you're even raising muscle that we should support with Scripture. Now that I shown you that the word Holy spirit itself is a name, you decided to attack sstrawman.

Please when Bible says people will be baptised with Holyspirit and fire, did it say in the NAME of Holy spirit and fire?

Do you now know that Holy spirit is a name?

Emusan:


And the same Bible says Jesus is God, the Holy spirit is God and the Father is God yet there is one God. Then how can you reconcile this?

NOTE: Never boycott my question again because I've asked you several questions here which you didn't address, if you know you can't answer my questions never bother to reply.




Please, where in the scripture the Son was rated second in the universe? Besides, is Jehovah dragging position with anybody in the universe?



1. It means the Holy spirit is eternal and not created, since is within God Himself. True or false?

2. What is the spirit of God or is there anything as spirit in God apart from the Holy spirit?

[qaboveIn fact the holy spirit's work is so many that we can't exhaust it here!

Very funny is it Holy spirit that is doing the work or God if we go by your explanation above? That's what you get when you're just following people's idea and not what you understand personally by reading Bible.

Emusan:


Just as you and your organization are promoting falsehood about Christ and the scripture.



But you agree that John 1:1 says the word was God according to those translations, so how many God do you have?



So can show me where I've ever said Trinity is a mystery?
Besides, everything about God is mystery because His ways far beyond humans' way. Bible uses the word MYSTERY more than twenty times, so how dare accusing Trinitarian of saying Trinity about God is a mystery?



Since God wants us to know Him can you say you've FULLY known Him?



Since you've been having this true knowledge of Him, have you FULLY known Him in totality?

Jesus Himself said "...and NO MAN knoweth who the Son IS, BUT THE FATHER; and who the FATHER IS, but the Son..."

Despite the lots of revelations about the Father and His Son in the Bible Jesus could still make that statement. Is that not a mystery in God's being?

Following this Jesus' statement we can then conclude that you and your organization have become God for fully knowing the Father and the Son.



Do you agree that there is a mystery within the being of God Himself? Anyway, Trinity is not a mystery to understand in the knowledge of knowing the unsearchable & unlimited God.

Emusan:


Olodo!

If the word "Holy spirit" isn't a name, why would Jesus said people should be baptised in the NAME of the Father, the Son and the Holy spirit?