₦airaland Forum

Wilgrea7:
they will be punished according to their crimes.. the wages of sin is death not eternal torment

concerning Jesus teachings on hell I've clarified that somewhere

If the wages of sin is physical death as you are interpreting iti. why would sinners who are dead several years ago still be raised up to be dead again? If the wages of sin is this physical type of death then the righteous shouldnt die at all.

Mark 3;29 talked about eternal damnation.

You are trying so hard to shy away from what Jesus said just to run away from your fears.
Matthew 25;46 talked about everlasting punishment.

Wilgrea7:
you ignore the verses that talk about anhilation but accept the unexplained ones that talk about eternal torment

before u use the book of revelation to say the lake of fire burns forever remember 2 things

1.. the book of revelation is highly symbolic as the beasts and the marks are not literal

2. the word for ever has been used in the bible to mean till the end of life or for a period or till that thing is accomplished

take Jonah for example who said “ the earth held me in her bars for ever and ever ” meanwhile it was just 3 days or the command God gave someone to serve another person for ever which was to mean till the person dies

the people thrown in the lake of fire will be there until their punishment according to their crimes is fulfilled. but the end of the wicked remains destruction

Dont deceive yourself bro. Nobody is forcing you to believe in lake of fire so this idea of trying to make it look temporal against what the bible said is a height of deceit that wont do you any good at all.
Jesus spoke severally about the everlasting torment by fire in the book of Matthew, Mark, Luke. If you want to shy away from the one written in Revelation then you cant run away from the one Jesus said.
Ask yourself this question- Why will God raise sinners up from death if it is only to burn them temporarily? Some of this people died hundreds of years ago and have turned to sand so why wake them up only to burn them off again? Face the truth and stop giving yourself false hope. Lake of fire will burn its occupant eternally.

Wilgrea7:
exactly... the same fire that turned Sodom and Gomorrah to ash.. its the fire from God

It turned them to ashes because this present physical world and the happenings in it are meant to be temporal so there is no way the fire would have burnt them eternally.

Wilgrea7:
that's talking about the lake of fire... not the popular fiery place unrighteous people go after death... also

2 Peter 2:6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;

Jude 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.



eternal/everlasting fire turns to ash... that's the example of what eternal fire does... destroys completely for ever... this destruction occurs in the lake of fire... what other points do u have??

Eternal fire there refers to fire from God. Why do you people like giving yourselves false hope? It is clearly written that the lake of fire will burn forever why do you people like to moderate the message there? Your changing it does not change it. Hope you know?

Etesam:
Now I am confused.

What is your confusion?

akintom:
Am humanist (go check up Humanism first), i can confirm to you that your lies don't apply 0.000%.

It's a sign of irrationality for you to claim without proofs, that a group of people who don't subscribe to spirit and its worship, will now be congregating in similitude of your religious rituals.

I told you earlier, you're the very first victim of what you warned your fellows of. In that you have dabbled into what you have both deficient and confused knowledge about.

Oga you are giving yourself too much heat. I ve told you that the submission i made is true. You can verify it by taking your time to go through some threads in this section biko. I dont have time to waste in raising false statement against anybody or group of people. I dont need your acceptance to make my points true. Its not me alone that is aware of this here pls. Other people who are aware of it knows i am not lying. If you are not aware of it then thats it for you but it does not mean that i am lying. If you dont understand the submission i made in the OP(as it appears you dont) then thats your problem to sort out.

Beelow is a similar observations by someone else

DoctorAlien:
Is it a surprise that religious features like preaching(against the idea of gods), evangelism(to convert to atheism), and pastor-congregation relationships are seen even among atheists?

Man is religious by nature. He must worship. It doesn't matter what he worships. It can be GOD, trees, cows, celestial bodies, stones, gold, his fellow man, himself or even his own sense of judgment.

Nice post, OP. May GOD continue to bless you.

shadeyinka:
Pls check your mail. I have a word for you

Sorry, this very email is having issues so its not accessible for me.

1990news:
Seems you are the OP,.

Seriously It seems This is how your atheism works= pretending not to know the obvious.

hopefulLandlord:
oh! damn!

I wanted to put "Atheism"

hopefulLandlord:
Somebody left theism and said he has seen the light in theism, then after some years he dumped what he called light and came back to the atheism that he called darkness, which one is weightier?

you're violating Number 3 of your OP or bordering on violating it

You ve answered the question. If you had told me that somebody left atheism and said he has seen the light in theism, then after some years he goes back to atheism that he called darkness then that would ve been weightier. The case you presented here is not weigthier when you weigh it with the one i presented in that post.

Again i didnt violate my rule three. I am not making unnecessary argument so far except if you feel the points you were raising are not necessary.

hopefulLandlord:
how about those that are dumping theism for atheism? lmao!

you're already violating your own OP

can't help it, can you?

Somebody left theism(christianity) and said he has seen the light in atheism, then after some years he dumped what he called light and came back to the christianity that he called darkness, which one is weightier?
I didnt violate my OP, I said christians should reply atheists if they have proper answer to give but where they dont have they can leave it or simply say i dont know. No violation.

hopefulLandlord:
atheism had NEVER spread in Nigeria to this level before and that's a fact

Nairaland has helped in a big way for this and your arguments with us are also helping

don't let those churches and mosques fool you, almost all atheists I know in real life attend them; almost all pretend outwardly to be theist since there's no special privilege or advantage that comes with being known as atheist

in fact, its all disadvantage or no difference at best

Social media has been a boost to everything in Nigeria since it came into this country, its not isolated to atheism.

1990news:
Dont mind them, some day, the dirt would fall off their eyes.

Exactly what will happen to you people. It happened to some of you and they dumped atheism and came back to christianity.

hopefulLandlord:
some guy who keeps wishing our atheism away

Just as you are wishing christianity, nay, theism away.

1990news:
who be this

And who are you

hopefulLandlord:
Atheism is spreading

they've lost a lot more from engaging us, now they want to re-strategize

now they're saying we are not atheists


"Christianity is not a religion"

"you guys aren't atheists"

Atheism has been spreading since ages past. Christianity and other religion have also been spreading since ages so theres nothing new about atheism spreading except that you want to give yourself false hope by monopolizing spread to atheism. New churches and prayer houses are springing up almost in every street. Wake up from your atheism-is-spreading dream bro.

akintom:
"These group of individuals have a gathering point just like the religious people, they preach against God just as we preach the goodness of God, they testify against God just as we testify God's goodness"

The above is your exact words unedited.
You're so soon becoming a victim of the panicky counsel you just gave your fellows.

May i help you add this to your list of commandments....

*when you decide to engage atheist, avoid being twisty and dodgy, you get strangled that way.

Again if you claim that statement is wrong then it either means you are being hypocritical about it or you are new in this religion section or you sincerely lack understanding of my submission.

1990news:
Pastor will raise his hand the whole congregation wee fall only the
camera Man...
Ayam not understanding

Yea. There are fake pastors who stage-manage miracle just to get more members which translates to more money. Its not new to us because Jesus told us that such wayo people will come into the ministy. Its not only in christianity, there is fake everywhere. Fake doctors, fake policemen, fake atheists like some of you here etc.

Seun:
The only thing I would add to your list is this: "be willing to change your mind if their arguments make sense to you; don't be dogmatic!".


Atheists appear more intelligent because they are right. Your intelligence is wasted when you use it to defend something that is just not true.

Atheists are not right. They claim to be right.
To the extent a good number of us have gone in christianity we are very sure it is true thats why we have read all the arguments you people presented and still stand firm on God's side. That you didnt get to the extent we have gone is your own cup of tea. Yet some who left christianity to atheism like you are coming back to christianity after several years because they have seen the truth we saw.

akintom:
From this painstakingly written piece of yours, it's obvious that the writings, nature of debate and arguments of atheists/humanists on this platform have been giving you a real and consequential concerns.

That established, i however noted some unfounded suspicions, disregard for your Bible and outright lies.

Your Bible encourages you to investigate matters properly, and uphold that which is true (findings supported by evidence). In disobedience to your Bible, you went on alleging some gathering of atheists in some places and observing methods of worship similar to church rituals.

Can you present a name of one leader?, can you give address of where they gather to do all that you claim?.

Well, am not surprised at your panicky conclusions, it's of the nature, character and traditions of folks that are mentally driven by a badly written and ridiculously fictitious book - Bible.

Going through your response, it appears you lack understanding of my submissions. I advice that you go through it again, calmly this time around, so as to get it clearer. Some other people have gotten the message as you can see. Cheers.

Dear brethren in Christ,

we all know that atheism simply means unbelief in God. Taking a critical look at the activities of certain individuals in this forum who parade themselves as atheists, it is obvious that they actually can be referred to as anti-religion cult. These group of individuals have a gathering point just like the religious people, they preach against God just as we preach the goodness of God, they testify against God just as we testify God's goodness. They have their leaders who they chorus yes to everything they say just as religious people do.
The irony of it is that these same people are the ones that will turn around to condemn the activities of christians when they too are replicating same in their circle. In no distant time we will see these people replicating all the practices of christianity in their own way.
It is obvious that the attitude of these people falls appropriately into that of anti-religion cult than atheism. I therefore urge you my brethren to henceforth see them as anti-religion cult rather than atheists. Referring to them as atheists will be an insult to those of them out there who are actually living the true definition of atheism.

In the light of the above written, I encourage you all

1. To remain steadfast in God, be prayerful, preach the word and as much as possible represent Christ well.
2. Respond to any of their posts or threads which you have answers to. The ones you dont have answers to simply keep out of it or say- "I dont know". No human has answers to every question in this life.
3. Dont go into unnecessary argument where you cant defend your stand well enough. When you dabble into what you cant defend well you end up making a fool of yourself.
4. Dont jump into any thread opened by these cult members. First of all weigh their thread whether its worth giving attention to, if its not pls dump the thread and move ahead. Time is of essence in life, except you are an idle civilian whose time is lying idle.
5.. Where you want to quote bible pls try and quote the one that properly fit into the discussion, dont just throw up anything you like and start panel beating it to fit into your response.
6. When they mention bad practices seen amongst christians pls dont go defending blindly when you know those things are actually happening rather you can cut down their exaggerations where it arises.

7. Dont be fooled that atheists or their anti-religion counterparts here are more intelligent than religious people. Unbelief in God doesnt translate to being more intelligent in life, it doesnt translate to being more wealthy, it doesnt translate to being more excellent in academics, it doesnt translate to having the best marriage, it doesnt translate to employment opportunities, it doesnt translate to success in life. Its just unbelief in God and nothing more. Religious people have been excelling wonderfully in every sphere of life so for someone to parade himself as a higher human simply because he doesnt believe in God is a height of foolishness. Dont fall for it pls.

God's blessings to you all.

Lennycool:
Ahh but Allah still means God, if it offends you, you should just ignore it, wasn't that what the OP advised the atheist in Kenya.

Chineke is God in Igbo. Oluwa is God in Yoruba. They can equally use any of the two let's see how the Northern Muslims will react.

hopefulLandlord:
Exactly!!

That is my point

The word "God" unites all theists and atheists are feeling left out

So they wrote a "petition", they didn't burn cars or raze houses or massacre people

Its just a petition

Christians dont engage in violent protest against their faith either.
Atheists are in the minority so they cant even vote out God from the constitution. If they were in the majority like theists they would ve done it so there is no point pretending as if they would ve been more considerate.

Lennycool:
Very correct, even if it was Allah instead of just God. CAN and co will b|tch till eternity.

You stupidly hate christians. Muslims still use the word "God". Muslim are allowed to use sharia law in Nigeria. You just want to display your hatred which is nonsensical to us.

hopefulLandlord:
I might not fully agree with this petition

however the OP is displaying hypocrisy IMHO

if that name "God" were "Sango" for instance, Christians would fight tooth and nail till its removed, of course, Sango is God too but I'm sure Christians won't take it lying down

you say they should be skipping it, I'm pretty sure they're doing that already but also want that name removed

its a simple petition for Flying Spaghetti Monster's sake

Yes christians will kick against sango because they didnt say Yahweh should be the word there. If they say sango then we will insist on Yahweh.

DeSepiero:
Its actually a 'she' not 'he'.
By the way, you so much believe that the so called mystic's account of hell is credible? Because she has 'mystic' attached to her name?
Maybe you can believe just about anything, provided the speaker seems cool and what the speaker is saying corroborates your previous beliefs.

Her testimony is one out of the many that abound coming from none christians so i dont get your drift.

Wilgrea7:
i never twisted the message of eternal torment... i don't agree with it at all.. i once believed it as i was brought up with the doctrine and the mentality... i decided to do a proper research on it and I found out it was false... i agree with eternal punishment not eternal punishing.. i don't claim i know it all.. if anyone has anything contrary to what i know and believes its the truth, he/she should bring it forth.

If you choose not to believe it that's your choice but that's not what the bible said. God will help us not to go to hell but that doesn't mean we should twist the message to massage our sentiment.

Wilgrea7:
its still dumb... so the majority of people there are there because they don't believe hell exists... seriously... who came up with this stuff??

anyways I'm done with people scaring me about an eternal hell.. my main aim in life is God and not avoiding hell... i guess when we all die we'll find out who was lying and who was saying the truth

Nobody is scaring anybody. All of us are praying to make heaven but we shouldnt twist the message of eternal punishment.

Wilgrea7:
the writeup is so dumb that anyone with sense could see the lie in it.. so now people don't go to the eternal hell (as u think ) for not believing in God... but go there for not believing in the hell.

that's a poor lie

He said most of the people there. He didnt say all. If you are good follower of Christ and you don't believe hell is eternal then you need check your followership because Jesus said it severally that it's eternal.

Wilgrea7:
whoever wrote this must be on some nice weed

so most of the people that will be in hell are those that didn't believe hell exists... that's plain dumb.. wat of Christians who follow Jesus Christ but don't believe in an eternal hell... so they will go there too.. op wake up

He is not forcing you to believe. Keep deceiving yourself that the lake of fire is not eternal. The man here is a mystic man, not a pastor yet is telling you what he saw and you still want to keep consoling yourself that hell is not eternal.

Genesis2000:
I have been imagining this for some times now.

I knows that testimonies are good, and i have also given my testimonies on several occasions.

But what in a situation whereby you re traveling or going else where and you borded a 14 seaters bus and may God forbid the bus have accident and only you survived. Will you go to church and testify and give thanksgiving?

I have raised this question somewhere before...

Do you think it is proper to do so?

Someone is wondering now, what kind of question is this? And why wouldn't i testify of his goodness upon my life? Hmmm

to this person, ok what if your wife or your only son is involved in that accident, would you still go ahead and testify?

Don't you think that some of these testimonies we hear these days are not really necessary?

Don't you think that such testimony are really selfish and selfcenterdness?

Do you think if Jesus is in a boat and and by accident he lost all his disciples, do you think he will testify for his safety?

We were all leaning anyway. And i stand to be corrected.
Do you think these kinds of testimonies really worth it.

Does any body here has any contrary opinion to these?



Pls let here from you. Thank you.

To testify is a different thing but to take it to the level of rice and stew is the one i dont see the need. You are eating rice and stew because people died and you survived? That looks wicked.

EyeHateGod:
This religious folks are just dumb

Dumb man calling others dumb. Atheism is truly a stupid venture.