₦airaland Forum

safarigirl:
first off, that interview is dated February, 2017. It has been on this thread earlier this year sef. As at that time, we had only won two games. Hardly a reason to tag him an opportunist

Secondly, the boy is just 15, do you really think he's dreaming of a chance to feature in the 2018 World Cup?

Call him up first, even if it's for the age grade competitions, then we'll see what happens

My suggestion is we form a good relationship with him and his parents. Even invite him for training with our next U17s. But you know the NFF policy of recruiting the U17 only from our grassroots here (I don't completely know how true). Leave him to mature while at his base in Germany while keeping tabs with his development and then re-invite for the 2021 U20.

Goke7:
and folks are making a case for him? I think we have not learnt any lesson from our previous world cup woes with the way discussions have been going on here as regards players selection, am afraid Russisa 2018 may not be different, same sentiments ruined our chances in the past and It's haunting us again

Thank you my brother.

On the reasons for our past failures we have all contributed to, I have Toyin Ibitoye's twitter handle. someone should please help us with that of The NFF.

Please summarize some of the points and merge some. Make them more like bullet points so they would be more appealing to read.

We'll present subtle recommendations so it won't seem as if we are teaching the NFF and Rohr their jobs.After which you post the points for us to go through again before posting to Ibitoye and the NFF.
We can also create a separate thread for it and make the mods take it to front page.

I trust you to do a good job.
Thanks.

Joebie:
Just because somebody call for Martins, no mean say they believe in old legs. enough of the tagging. Forgiveness for example have always clamored for young players.. so just because he call martins that means say he is in #TeamOldLegs. Me i'm in #TeamPerformance oh.

so much talk about building for the future. The inclusion of Martins can never derail that. I'm not clamoring for Martins but why are we crying as if should Martins manage to make it to the mundial the career of the plethora of 21 year olds we have will end. In fact i'm impressed with the pool of players we have in that 18-22 age range oh.. And I must say so much can happen before Qatar 2022. Team building is a continuous process with a mix of young and old (that are relevant). And it should always be so. Show me 3 solid CFs today that are proven in SE shirt, then I will say forget Martins. But let's truth be told, even at his age many of these young kids can't match his recent stats. Well, but I will be fair, let them battle it in camp. Rohr will not accept bribes.

I am not among those that have tagged you or anybody #TeamOldlegs.

But correct me if I am wrong. You also recently clamoured for Osaze, Emenike and Ike Uche right?

Mickael2:
Like I have said many times, the mark of a tactical coach is your ability to use what you have well.


Now you said no national team plays that way. Let's look at Germany, their '10' is Muller, I need not tell you that Muller is probably going to be the highest goalscorer in the history of the world cup before he retires and what does he do? Creative? No. He just picks up the pieces and it is successful. When Muller does not play or when they do not play with a true 9(like when Gotze plays), Muller moves in as the main CF but that's for later. The point here is that Muller is the perfect definition of an Alli-esque playing performing very well for the best national team presently.


Now I am not saying Etebo should be our 10, no. But you made it sound as if Etebo cannot fit into our 10 role, you said he did it well at U23, and he has only been tried once in that position in the senior team, why not give him more time

Firstly, Etebo is not in the class of Muller. In fact no Nigerian player is.

To your last paragraph, check my earlier comment: I said Etebo cannot be playing the number 10 position when we have Mikel and Iwobi in the team. Also that this is the senior level and not the U23.

We are talking about the FIFA world cup here.

And as I said before, the type system you play will go a long way in determining the type of 10 you'll field.

Joebie:
No we don't disband the team, but we work on our lapses. What top European oppositions may bring could expose other areas we did not see during the qualifiers, and it could expose some players as well -- those we became comfortable with.

Questions. For Example, if Ezenwa lets in a number of goals cheaply, will many of us not call for his head? I'm not even settled about Ezenwa. But that was just an example.

Now you are beginning to get my point.

I tell you that if Nigeria should lose to Argentina by as much as 3 -4 goals most fans here would clamor for the disbandment of the team. That's how Nigerian fans have always been.

I am also expecting Nigeria to be on the back foot especially the early part of the game. How we handle the first 20mins would be crucial.
The friendly will really stretch our team and thank God Argentina are coming with a full squad.
No shame if we lose to them but we must not be easily shoved away. I am not tipping Nigeria to win but the boys should play with a winning mentality.

I also agree about Ezenwa. I see him as a goalie that can easily chop up to 4 goals when we face a team like Argentina if the team should have a bad day in office. I said something like about Ezenwa easily conceding 4 goals before that defeat 4-1 to Ghana at the WAFU tournament. But after it happened as usual Ezenwa's faithful came for his defense.

Goalies have their bad days once in a while. But I am not completely sold out on Ezenwa. The only positive I get from him is his level of composer. But some times he over does it. Just look at that penalty we conceded against Cameroon.

Humility017:
seconded....
what's your take on this young lad

Dominic Vinícius Eberechukwu Uzoukwu ?
watched his video...think I liked him..he is like Isaac success kind of player..brings his body to play on the ball...good on the air too and ball control.
should his move to Everton or any of the epl teams comes true come January next year....

Let's see him on that stage first and then assess him. So until then.....

Kog45:
Good pick Ighalo
Iheanacho
Kayode Olarewaju

Same here for now.

safarigirl:
except Martins becomes the top scorer in the Chinese League between now and March, I will not see any need to include him in this team

I don't even know why this argument is coming up in the first place.

The era of Martins and his classmates is gone.
Its like we did not learn from the mistakes of having Rufai and Yekini at the 1998 WC.
Yekini was even in a better position to make the team than Martins is right now.

We have to move forward with the crop of Attackers we have.

Ighalo, Iheanacho, Nwakaeme, Kayode we have now. I have sadly dropped my case on Abraham.

Let's move on with these ones and any other strikers that may sparkle this season. And as usual we'll also depend on the abilities of our AMs and wingers for us to get goals.

safarigirl:
thanks for not being an asss to make your point

Some people here prefer to use the asshole method to make statements...

Like I said, the like for like is a preliminary thing, I thought about replacements based on how the game will be going, but to do the equations would be a long, boring read that nobody would be interested in

That would imply saying if we are leading after so and so minutes, put this person, if not, move this person to this place and sub in this other guy.....

I don't know about you, but it is too early in the morning to do any of that and I no get time. Besides, multiple people have done like for like sub's on this thread recently, only difference between me and them is I didn't do it on a board

Thanks for the complement.

But get something right. Like for like substitutions are not wrong. But they cannot be predetermined.

A coach can make like for changes to maintain the balance or structure of a team if the balance of play are in him team's favour and he has a comfortable lead.

About other peeps also proposing like for like, it is not every time that one has the appetite for arguments. Some times you just smile and maybe shake your head and read the next post.

elyte89:
Martins football age 34-35years....real age. 42-43years old, dis guys u re comparing martins re using real age not a falsified one

I know Obafemi Martins very well.

He was one of my boys back then at the white sand training pitch, in Lagos.

He is not up to 40. Haba.

He graduated from Coker Secondary school, Orile Igamnu in 1997. That was 20 years ago. Add 20 to average secondary school graduating students age . That would give you an estimate of Martins' age.

safarigirl:
okay

Thanks for understanding.

kennysville:
Thats the right way to reason my bro. Not this like for like.

Substitutions are not made for making sakes. They are mostly for tactical reasons.

safarigirl:
I always do a substitution list, how the game is going would require too many equations I prefer to not concern myself with until the match is being played. Rohr also seems to enjoy the like for like sub method.

My subs are just five. Some of those players I put like for like, is to gauge how they would fit in with a different partner

Eg....the Ighalo-Nacho combo should be switched so we see how Kayode and Nacho go

I understand you perfectly.

Testing attacking combo is fine but those defensive changes may not be necessary except if there are injury cases.

If you want to see Ebuehi in action then you should start him cos the dynamics of the game may not allow for like for like defensive changes

Yes Rohr makes like for like but he also makes tactical changes. Making like for like changes is no crime but all your changes cannot be like for like.

Also a coach can make a like for like switch but may assign the newly introduced player another role. That is how dynamic tactics are.

Mickael2:
Since you do not want to answer let me go ahead.

Dele Alli is not a creative player in the sense that he almost never sprays a defence splitting pass. He isn't creative, his strong points are his quick passes, quick movements and ofcourse his eye for goal.


Yes I am placing Etebo and Alli on the same scale, no because they have the same quality but because they have thesame strengths. Etebo just like Dele is the kind of guy who is always the 'late comer to the party in the 18', he arrives late into the box or does his own thing when the other defenders think that there is nobody else to mark. HARDLY do you ever se Dele Alli joining the build-up, he moves in almost a straight line with Kane ready to pounce. I mean this is what Etebo does well, during the qualifiers for the Olympic he did it well, during the matches at the Olympics he did it well and scored. You do not need to be Messi to play like Messi, there is no comparison between Alli and Etebo but Etebo plays just the way Alli does and he can be effective if we play to his strength. This is one of the reasons why I hail Sia1, he realised this during the Olympics and used a target man who Etebo could easily move in line with and it worked did it not? Now when I say Rohr isn't the most tactical mind, you can see he wanted to adopt the same strategy in the match against SA but he used Iheanacho as the point man which failed. You can see the only time Rohr's plan worked, we had a shot which could have been a goal from? You guessed it, Etebo.


The problem is that you played football in the 80's when Maradona was the 10 and everyone wanted to be like him. Now the definition of a '10' has changed. I personally believe that your '10' is the midfield player charged with creativity. Mahrez is a winger but I'd grade him as Leicester's 10 still, Eriksen is who I would grade as Tottenham's 10 but he is not the AMF, the CMF. The definition of a 10 depends on the tactics, I can play Etebo as a '10'(your own style of '10') but he wouldn't be the actual '10'(that is my own definition). Etebo is the kind of guy who just strolls around, forget that he even exists, just let the ball rebound off him back to a player in the green jersey, he is not the kind of AMF that will be the focal point, no he is the kind of AMF that picks up the pieces just like Dele Alli and scores tons of goals, just look out for his late runs and we have goals. I am not generating these style of play from my head, this is what worked for Sia1 and it is what works for Poch at Tottenham too.


Etebo can play the '10' role perfectly, change Iheanacho with Ighalo in that game against SA and Etebo would have scored. Iheanacho was not dragging defenders out, he was dragging defenders in which is contrary to what a CF playing with Etebo should be doing. So can Etebo/Ndidi/Onazi work? Yes with a point man it can work wonders. Well I would suggest you replace Onazi with Ndidi as the DMF and put Mikel as the 'Eriksen' of the team sha

Firstly, yes I played football in the generation when a number 10 meant Central Midfield position but I also know the number 10 position has undergone a transformation to mean playing behind a striker in a 4-5-1, or 4-2-3-1 or any other variant of 4-5-1. Football is dynamic, we recognise that and we have moved with it.

You don't need to be a great dribbler to play a modern number 10. Now, what is very important here is the system the team plays. For a team like Arsenal, Man city or Nigeria that thrive on possession football it is very important for a number 10 to be a very good ball passer and a creative player. His linkup play must be top notch. Dele Alli kind of number 10 fits into the way spurs plays. He will not thrive as a number 10 in a team like Arsenal, Wenger will play him as wings forward instead. Look at Ozil and Iwobi they are great ball passers.

Most national teams play possession football so most number 10 of national teams must be good passers and distributors

Once again you cannot compare the abilities of Dele with those of Etebo.

Etebo has only performed well as an AM at U23 level.
His best performances for the Super Eagles have been in the CM position.

That is why I earlier stated that at this level(I mean senior level) for the Super Eagles and the way Nigeria plays Etebo cannot be our number 10 where great ball passers like Mikel and Iwobi are in the team.

Even look at Etebo's performance against SA. The midfield was cut off completely from the attack due to Etebo's lack of creativity.

safarigirl:
I think Rohr should find a way to play Nacho as a SS against Argentina.

My line-up against Algeria would be


Ezenwa

Shehu(Ebuehi @ 70 mins)....Awaziem...Balogun...Echiejile (Aina @ 80 mins)

Ndidi...Mikel (Iwobi @ 60 mins)....Onazi

S. Moses....Ighalo.... Kayode (if invited)



Against Argentina

Ezenwa (Uzoho @ 70 mins if invited)

Shehu....Ekong...Balogun.... Aina

Ndidi(Agu @ 75 mins)...Mikel(Iwobi @ 65mins)....Onazi (Ogu @ 80 mins)....V. Moses

Ighalo(Kayode @ 60 mins)...Kelechi


Thoughts?

Fact that you want to see like for likes changes in the game and assess them is cool.
But substitutions are done according to balance of play, how the game is progressing and what results you want to achieve.

What if we are chasing the game are we going to be making those defensive, goal keepers and like for like substitutions you have proposed?

The major aim of friendlies is not just to test all like for like players. Testing your tactics is very important, also your players mental strength, how easily you can switch formations to get results, your ability to cope with pressure and ceaseless attacks(which is expected in that Argentina game). We may also test attacking combinations. But all still depends on the balance of play and the mode of progression of the game.
For Eg we may need to pull out a midfielder for an extra attacker if we need to add more bite in attack. Or we pull out an attacker and introduce a midfielder to seal off the game. We may also resort to 3 CBs to seal off the game too. And we may also make like for like changes where and when necessary. All cannot be like for like changes.
And also the game itself will determine what time you may want to make changes, you cannot predetermine time of substitutions.


Best we can propose is starting 11 and substitutes list. Note also that the coach may chose not to make all the 6 substitute changes also depending on the way the game is progressing.

Joebie:
African oppositions offer something different. Else, we can just sit back now and say we are good to go. I don't think Rohr thinks so.

Are you saying after the series of qualifiers thus far you can't tell the strength or weakness of the team?

Now, don't get me wrong I am not saying the Grade A friendlies are not necessary. Yes they are going to test the team in the different departments.

Rohr knows the strengths and weaknesses of the team and has been working on them all through the qualifiers. But saying we should wait to play Argentina before we know the strength and weakness is not the case. What if we lose 4-0 are we going to disband the whole team and begin afresh?

Besides after this window the next one is in March and we have to play AFCON qualifiers against Seychelles and we may just manage to squeeze in another friendly. And then the next window is for WC preparations/camping. So if you bank only on grade A friendlies , there is no much space for those.

Seychelles is not a grade A opposition but it can also be used for build up for the WC. All games are important, not only the grade A friendlies. That is my point.

Joebie:
Grade A friendlies will test how strong we are in each department.

So you could not decipher from the 5 grade A WC qualifiers we have played thus far? you have to wait for 'Grade A' FRIENDLIES which are not as competitive as the WC qualifiers?

Mickael2:
I have a gift for him. A DVD of Busquets+Matic+Casemiro's games so he can understand how to stay in his position as a DMF at all times. If he accepts the gift and uses it well then he can become a better player

We the Nigerian fans will appreciate that.

Mickael2:
Is Dele Alli creative? Answer the question directly because I have a point to pass across afterwards

1. Are you saying Dele is not a creative player?
2. Are you placing Dele and Etebo on the same scale?
3. Why would Etebo be playing 10 when Mikel and Iwobi are in the team. We need the best player for each position. Etebo is limited in ability to shoulder that responsibility in the world cup

Mickael2:
Tell me you can pronounce the name of that team

Christmas is 60days away bro.

Mickael2:
I am curious, according to your definition of a '10', what does Dele Alli play for Tottenham?

Dele plays mostly as a '10'.

Mickael2:
Nice goal against a 3rd division side to make it 4-0

Eh.. 3rd division side. Weh done. A catch you.

Joebie:
Etebo as AM as well. We need to hear from Rohr though. Maybe he thinks about this differently.

It is not compulsory to make changes. If he feels he has not seen any player outside the squad that can better what he has already he can stick to what he has.

That midfield in my opinion is our strongest department.

Where we need to sort out now is our attacking department.

Mujtahida:
That means between Etebo /Ogu /Agu one must drop for a spare AM with skill and flair. Muazzam? Joel Obi? Aluko?

With Mikel and Iwobi already in the team we don't need another spare AM. Etebo remains because he can also play as a CM and winger.

Mujtahida:
Yeah, there's something not quite so energetic or vibrant about Ndidi when he plays for Nigeria. Also Etebo can play as the AM with Mikel and Onazi behind. Wait ooo are only going to be playing 4-3-3? What of other formations? It's like 4-4-2 is slowly fading away.

At the level we are presently, Etebo is not creative enough to function as the AM(number 10).

The role belongs to Mikel and or Iwobi.

forgiveness:
It's Francis Uzoho that plays for Deportivo the while Kayode plays for Girona-fc.

It was an error

TheGoodJoe:
That is my man. Emmanuel Ebiede aka the waistbreaker. Sinclair. He did a good work with that guy. Pure genius. I am a fan of his for life.

Sad he never got the chance to play for the Super Eagles. Does not take away his genius.

'The chance'

He should have displaced Okocha or Oruma in the France 98 squad abi?

TheGoodJoe:
Better.

As I keep saying, coaches have their context of selection and I respect that. I will use Gabriel Jesus and Iheanacho (I beg do not vex for reference points).

I see Gabby miss some goals and I shake my head with a smirk. Jeez, Nacho will not miss that.

However, other attributes of Gabby makes Pep prefer him. As long as Pep is true to himself, I respect that.

In the case of Owubokiri, Siasia and co. might have other qualities that the coaching crew preferred.

Just pointing out you should not write him off as lesser quality.

Besides "Owublow" as popularly called was an out and out striker. The only person he would have displaced was Yekini. And you know that was almost impossible.

And I don't think he could play the roles Siasia and Amokachi played in the team.

He simply was not needed

TheGoodJoe:
Owubokiri was second highest goal scorer in Europe. Give the young man credit. I doubt Amokachi, Siasia and the great Yekini could achieve that.

There was no way Owubokiri would have displaced any of our strikers then.

Even the highly fancied Efan Ekoku could not.


Go and dig up another Monday Sinclair's boys again. I dey wait you.

You have not mentioned Emmanuel Ebiede.

Kog45:
But better than Efan Ekoku

In what context?

Efan Ekoku was even rated by many to be better than Yekini.

The debate then was Yekini/Efan. Owubokiri was making waves but not much highly rated by the coaching crew.

Joebie:
Let's expect a few surprises from Rohr.
Owubokiri was performing at the club level I assume. Comparison with Aluko is unfair.
is Aluko peforming? Also consider that there have been several coaches since then.

When we mention some of these players, we also have to remember the crop of players they had to contend with.

Was Richard Owubokiri better than Yekini, Amokachi and Siasia?

Joebie:
No harm in trying lol

Hahaha, sit watch and see.