₦airaland Forum

[quote author=fergie001 post=134723436][/quote]This is very commendable and should be passed as quickly as possible.
Lagos being the state with the largest population and the largest economy in Nigeria should have the highest local government areas.

I can see the hands of the President on this bill and that shows that it will pass in both houses easily.

delkuf:
Good morning, God will help us. Have a good day

Amen sir.

delkuf:
I didn't say Jesus said we are more blessed than him. What I said trying to say was that muss it when he doubted the Lord Jesus and he became irrelevant afterwards. He wasn't even there when Jesus appeared to the disciples. So I wanted not to focus too much on him. You were bringing him up frequently. So I trying to tell you that the lack of faith of Thomas took him out of the picture. What is faith. Faith is believing without seeing. But Thomas wanted to see before he believed. Thomas messed up.

Great sir. I understand your point.
My view on that is that we all do mess up sometimes. Sometimes we show a lack of faith when we pass through situations that seems overwhelming to us. It is not an excuse for us or for Thomas. My point is that we are just humans and sometimes we have doubts even now. But thank God who is always patient with us and knows that we are just humans and he treats us with so much love that even when we are in that state of doubt and faithlessness, he shows up in his compassion and built our faith up just like he did to Thomas. Praise God.

Thanks.

delkuf:
you are saying what am I am saying. The Lord Jesus went to the Father in heaven after he resurrected from death and he decended from heaven with eternal life. And eternal life comes the Holy Spirit. This is what have been saying.


I can't much about other disciples but Thomas was his own problem because he doubted the Lord Jesus. The fact that he doubted the core foundation of our salvation took him out of the picture. Even if he received the Holy Spirit, he will still not be relevant. You are more important than Thomas. Between you that didn't see the Lord Jesus live and believe him and Thomas that eat with Jesus sleep with him and even hear him teach not reading about him, who do you think God will appreciate more. So don't let focused on Thomas.

If you have more questions to ask about what will are discussing, you can ask.

Since we both agreed that Jesus only ascended once and descended once. There is no longer issues. That was the major discussion and we have both agreed on that.

If you say we are better than Thomas, I do not think that was what Jesus meant. Jesus only said "You saw me and you believe, blessed are those who did not see me but believe". He did not say "more blessed than you (Thomas)".
And whereas Thomas name will be numbered among the foundation of the New Jerusalem not us and also he will sit on one of the twelve thrones with other apostles like Jesus promised, not us.
All the twelve are all fortunate to be pioneers of the gospel of Christ. They were not perfect humans (not even Peter who denied Jesus three times). But they will all be rewarded by Christ at his coming.
Research even shows the Thomas was the first among the Apostles to minister in Africa and the he even died in Africa. (I am not holding it as fact since it is not explicitly in the scriptures about his missionary journey) But I believe none of the apostles were useless even those records may not be kept or seen of them.

Thanks

delkuf:
let look at John 6:51, " I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live forever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which i will give for the life of the world". Jesus said he is the living bread which came down from heaven. You yourself said he ascended to heaven to bring the Holy Spirit. It was part of what you wrote. If he will give the Holy Spirit to the disciples, he must have ascended to heaven and decended back to earth. You said Jesus went to the Father after he resurrected to bring the Holy Spirit, so if he went to the Father in heaven, he will also decend back to earth from heaven.


Thomas not being among the disciples when Jesus gave the Holy Spirit to the disciples, after the Lord Jesus left this world did we really hear of him again. Even the fact that he doubted the Lord Jesus that has render him someone of no importance.

Sir.
1. Same Jesus said if he did not go to the Father, the holy spirit will not come. Doesn't that mean that Jesus ascended to heaven and then the Holy spirit came? John 16:7

2. Are you saying we didn't hear of Thomas again because he didn't receive the holy spirit or because he doubted Jesus? I don't think that is what you meant sir.
Can you tell me out of the eleven why we didn't hear of Matthias, Bathelomew, Thaddeus, Simon the Zealot and even Andrew the brother of Peter and one of the four closest disciples of Jesus when he was with them. Why didn't we hear of these people again throughout scriptures after Jesus ascension. Is it that they did something wrong just like Thomas?

Thanks

delkuf:
between when Mary wanted yo touch Jesus and when he told Thomas to touch his hand anf side something happened. I like the fact that you said, Jesus told Mary not to embrace him because he has not yet ascended to the Father and release the Holy Ghost. So Jesus ascended to the Father in heaven to bring down the Holy Ghost before he appeared to the disciples because the first he did when he appeared to the disciples was that he breathed on them and said receive the Holy Ghost(John 20:20-23). So because the Lord Jesus ascended to the Father in heaven to bring down the Holy Ghost, he also decended and released the Holy Ghost to the disciples and to those that believe. My brother this is a whole new journey. It is the ascension of the Lord Jesus to the Father in heaven after his resurrection and his descending back to this world that give us eternal life. There are lots of things concerning this.

Sir.
That's not how the story went.
Okay, let's look at it like this.
1. When Jesus breathed on his disciples and said "receive the holy spirit". It was a prophetic statement because Thomas was excluded. Can we say Thomas did not receive the Holy spirit?

2. Why did I say Jesus statement was prophetic?
Just like Jesus said to his disciples in Mark 16:14-20 that the disciples should go around the world and preached the gospel and they went. But truly we know that that was not immediate but prophetic because the same Jesus in Acts 1 and 2 that the disciples tarried in Jerusalem until they received the holy spirit and then they went out to preach.

Sir, one thing we must know is that the account of each scripture writers differ and their timing should be considered.

2. Same with Luke's account and Act and Paul's account in Galatians.
According to Luke in Acts 9:18-20, Paul began to preach after he was converted by Ananias. But according to Paul, in Galatians 1: 16-17, :after his conversation, he went to Arabia and then returned back to Damascus and started ministering.
So, we need to understand each writers angle.

Thanks.

delkuf:
don't you think it is contradicting that the Lord Jesus will tell Mary not to touch him but he telling Thomas to put his hand in the print of nail and he should touch his side. Don't you think between when the Lord Jesus told Mary not to touch hima and when he showed himself to Thomas and the other disciples something has happened

I like your view sir.
Let us look at it this way.
1. Mary: Mary was happy to see Jesus after he died. Our of her immense joy, she was about to 'embrace' Jesus. Jesus reply to Mary was that of "Mary, do not be overjoyed to embrace me because all have not been done until I ascend to my Father and release the Holy spirit. But go and share what you have seen which brings you joy to my other brothers (the disciples) and tell them that what you have seen, they will see when I appear to them in Galilee."

2. Thomas: Thomas was in doubt that the person whom the apostles said they saw was really Jesus and he doubted to a level where he said to other disciples (not Jesus) that "have you confirmed it is Jesus by touching him? How do you know when you did not even touch his injured hand and feet? Let him appear again and let me touch him and then I will believe, if not, I won't."
Jesus appeared to Thomas and told him to do that which he wanted to, but fortunately Thomas himself believed at the word of the Lord.

Conclusion, it is clear from the storyline that Both Mary and Thomas (probably even all the apostles) NEVER touched Jesus.


Thank you sir for your wise engagement.

delkuf:
When the Lord Jesus appeared to his disciples, was it after ascended or the Father. Because he told Mary, I have not ascended to my Father and you Father and your God and my God. So after the Lord Jesus told Mary this, did he ascend to the Father in heaven or he went and show himself to the disciples

Thanks sir.
The second part is the correct answer.
After Jesus appeared to Mary, he also appeared to two disciples on their way to Emmaus. After that he appeared to Peter and then James. Then he appeared to the ten (except Thomas) and then to the eleven (including Thomas) and then to them at the river bank where he told Peter to take care of other brethren. Then to the 120 at his ascension.
In all these, Jesus kept appearing to his disciples within those days.
Did he eat and sleep with them during this period or was just appearing? It is not clear. What we know from the scriptures is that, he broke bread with the disciples at Emmaus and also cooked some fish for his disciples at the river bank.
That is the part that the scriptures revealed to us and it is evident that Jesus did not ascend to heaven until after his ascension.

Thanks

delkuf:
I would like to ask to ask, after the death of the Lord Jesus when he resurrected, he told Mary mardalene in John 20:17
"Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to your brethren, snd say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God".
Jesus told Mary that he ascend to his Father and our Father, my God and your God. My question now is, WHEN THE LORD JESUS ASCENDED DID HE DECEND TO EARTH AGAIN. Did he came back to earth

Okay sir.
Your question is straight forward and I will answer it straight.
Did Jesus ascend to heaven and then decend later to earth?
The answer is NO.
Why no?
Jesus was telling Mary. "You can't touch me now because I HAVE NOT ascended into my Father".
So, it is obvious that Jesus did not ascend unto his father before then.
Now, the other part of your question was DID JESUS THEN ASCEND TO HEAVEN AND THEN DECEND TO SEE THE APOSTLES?
The answer is still NO.
Why no?
Jesus appeared to his disciples severally as a proof of his resurrection and then after some days (some say forty days), he ascended into heaven in the presence of all his disciples and will decend again at his second coming.

Thanks.

judewrites:
The solemn words "Rest in peace" which are commonly used in referring to the dead originates from the latin prayer "requiescat in pace" meaning "may he or she begin to rest in peace (Amen)".

Unknowingly to many, each time we say "may his or her soul rest in peace" we are actually offering a prayer for the dead which is not biblical.

The bible never teaches that we should pray for the eternal rest of the dead as some religions do.

Once a person dies, they face judgement from God (Hebrews 9:27) and their fate is sealed eternally in heaven or hell. (Matthew 18:9)

The only prayer we can offer for the dead according to scriptures is the prayer of resurrection. (2 Kings 4:32-35, John 11:43-44, Acts 9: 40-41)

In such cases, divine judgement is suspended and the dead are given another opportunity by God to miraculously live again in fulfillment of their destinies.

We don't pray to God to forgive the sins of the dead or repose/rest their souls.

Offering prayers for the peace of the dead are rooted in heretical beliefs in 'purgatory'_a temporary place of purification until one is fit to enter God's presence.

Personally, I have always doubted the use of "rest in peace", because it's not scriptural to pray for the peace of the dead.

But to we that are alive, what's the meaning of life like Solomon pondered? (Ecclesiastes 1)

The whole essence and meaning of life is to please God; we are purposely created to please Him most especially through faith, praise and worship. (Revelation 4:11)

No matter what you are or have, life is meaningless and miserable outside pleasing God.

To live fulfilling lives on earth and to ultimately make heaven, our lives must be well pleasing to God:

📖 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
— Matthew 3:17

Sir.
Two quick questions.
1. Let me ask you, is it scriptural to call the scriptures "Bible"? Since the word Bible is not found in scriptures. Can we say that calling the word of God Bible is not scriptural because it is not in the scriptures? Answer it sir.

2. The is no place in the scriptures where it says that when someone dies, he will be judged that same day. Is there any? Paul made us know that those who died in Christ are sleeping in their graves until the resurrection.
That is the position of the Scriptures sir.

Let me add this.
That something is not scriptural doesn't mean it is good or bad. So, saying something is not scriptural doesn't mean it is bad.

Thanks

sonmvayina:
Thank you sir.
May the good Lord continue to give us the strength to keep his divine laws.

Amen sir

Janosky:
Do you know that Isaac was begotten at Hebrew 11:17-19?
Is Isaac one of the sons of Abraham?
Yes?
Therefore Jesus is one of the sons of God Jehovah even though Jesus Christ is begotten, which accords him a unique status among the sons of God, likewise Isaac among the sons of Abraham.

Sir
I don't repeat myself. I have made my points, you have made yours.

Thanks.

MaxInDHouse:
No wahala, your point is unscriptural that is what you need to know!

I have heard you sir

Thanks.

MaxInDHouse:
No Muslim can see God's Kingdom unless he or she becomes a Christian!
The only opportunity such a person has is if he conscientiously practice his faith without getting the sense of what Jesus taught he will be resurrected as one of the UNRIGHTEOUS and during Christ's 1,000 year reign he will have the opportunity to learn from Christians when all false religions are no more, by that time only Jehovah's Witnesses will be preaching and teaching throughout the earth so if after his resurrection and seeing with his own eyes that his former religion has been destroyed with all its features yet he maintained that he will not practice true Christianity then he will be judged by what the Christians preach to him {Revelations 20:11-12} in fact he only has just a hundred years to live {Isaiah 65:20} unlike others who are fighting hard to put away their old personality due to what they have learned about Christ. Ephesians 4:22-24

So don't think any religionist apart from Christians can survive the judgement day, no matter what you think you're doing as good if it's not in line with Jesus' teaching they are as useless as filthy rags! Isaiah 64:6

Max
I have heard you. I have made my point.

Thanks.

Ken4Christ:
You just wrote your opinion and not scriptures.

The scripture addresses those who have never heard about Christ. God will judge them according to the natural law placed in their conscience.

But those who hear and do not believe will be dawned. Jesus said so. The Apostles affirmed it.

Those who believe and commit sins without repenting will also be damned.

JW is not a denomination. It's an organisation set up to oppose the truth of God's word.

I accept that I said my opinion.
But what I know from scriptures is that some will be judged by their WORKS. You said it is only those who did not hear about Jesus. And I said it is for all whether they have heard or not.

But like I said, salvation through Christ is not for all. It is only for the elect. It is not by desire to accept or reject but for those whom God has chosen even before the foundation of the world to reign and lead in the kingdom of Christ.
But everyone in the world either elect or not have the choice to either live good or wicked.

But like you say, its my opinion. If you know me, you will know that I never claim right or wrong that is why I always respect people's opinion because it is only god that decides the judgement of a man.
But let me be emphatic. IF A MUSLIM HEARD OF CHRIST BUT DID NOT ACCEPT BUT DECIDED TO LIVE RIGHT WITH HIS NEIGHBORS. HE MAY NO BE IN THE MILLENNIAL REIGN WITH CHRIST WHICH IS MEANT FOR ONLY THOSE WHO ARE ELECTED, BUT HE WILL AT THE WHITE THRONE JUDGEMENT BE JUDGED BY HIS WORKS AND IF HE HAS BEEN FOUND TO LIVE RIGHT WITH HIS NEIGHBORS, HE WILL BE IN THAT KINGDOM TO COME ETERNALLY.

Thanks.

Ken4Christ:
I don't agree with you on who is cast into the Lake of fire or not. The scripture is very clear on the subject of eternal destiny. It's not about how wicked one is. So many good people are in hell and many more will go to hell. And so many so called wicked people made heaven and many more will make heaven if they embrace the grace of our Lord Jesus that brings salvation.

First, I don’t think you know much about the doctrines of JW which Max is heralding. They are anti Christ. They are not Christians. They oppose every truth of God's word and derail people away from the path of salvation. Let me give you a few example:

1. They don't believe Jesus rose from the dead bodily which the scripture clearly teaches. They assert in an earlier publication that God melted his body with chemical that it disappeared. In their recent publication, they said that God took the body.
2. They don't believe that salvation is obtained by grace alone. They emphasise work.
3. They don't believe that Jesus is God. They call Jesus a god and an angel.
4. They don't believe that the Holy Spirit is a person. They call him a force or wind.
7. They don't believe Jesus is coming back to rapture the church. They said he already came back 1914.
8. They don't believe every believer in Christ will go to heaven. They teach that only 144,000 is destined for heaven.

I could go on and on.

Concerning the subject of Lake of fire or hell, I repeat; it's not about how wicked you are. Anyone who rejects Jesus as Lord and Saviour will be cast there.

Our Lord Jesus said that those who don't believe in him are already condemned- John 3:18.

Max is an agent of darkness; teaching doctrines of devils. I have been studying the doctrines of Jehovah Witness for about 40 years now. They are a false religious cult.

Ken
1. I don't have issues with any denomination. If we hold everything against ourselves, we will all be guilty. What matters to me is not what a person professes or confesses but the life the person lives. That's all.
2. I am a strong believer of Jesus and a full fledge Christian, but I do not believe that everyone who do not believe in Jesus will go into the lake of fire.
A. We have people who have never heard about Jesus. How will God judge them.
B. We have people who believe in Jesus but they live a wicked life. How will God judge them.
C. If God judges every man by what they believe and not what they do, how will that be a fair judgement from a just God.
D. When the rich young man asked Jesus what he can do to be saved. Why didn't Jesus say, believe in me? Why did he say, keep the law. But when the rich man justified himself, thought Jesus was happy with him, but the response of Jesus was that if the rich man wants to be PERFECT, then he should follow him.
D. From the conversation of the young rich man and Jesus, I can deduce that living right place a role in eternal life while faith in Christ brings a perfect life that is worthy of being a leader and ruler in the world to come.
E. My submission. In the world to come, every good man from every tribe and religion of good intent will be there, while believers in Christ will reign and rule in leadership over them in a way that everyone will know and accept that God is a just God.

You may disagree, and if you do, you are right. But I do not agree that everyone who is not a Christian will go to the lake of fire.

Thanks.

MaxInDHouse:
Well i strongly believe you have serious issues with biblical understanding.
First of all there was nothing like suffering after death from Genesis to Malachi because God made a clear statement that Adam will cease to exist, if Adam who opened the door to sin and death will cease to exist what is the moral justification for excruciating pains for his descendants who found themselves in compromising situations that's pushing them to commit sin?
The idea of eternal torment is of pagan origin because the demons teaches that God can't make anyone cease to exist {Genesis 3:4} and that's what they have been promoting throughout the world it's only within God's people Israel that it is clearly stated in the scriptures that the dead are unconscious {Ecclesiastes 9:5-10} the idea of having a deal with the dead is prohibited in God's law because there is no living dead it's demons that are pretending to be dead people to further promote their teachings.

Jesus used lots of idioms in his teachings and for anyone to understand what he taught you need to move closer to those who are anointed with holy spirit {Matthew 28:20} or make a thorough research on what you read in the scriptures doing so with two or more individuals who are also sincere. Matthew 18:20

Jesus told his listeners that they must eat his flesh and drink his blood {John 6:54} instead of calmly asking him to expatiate since it's unlawful to do so {Leviticus 17:14} they rashly concluded that Jesus is demonic {John 6:52, 60} so because of this many of his DISCIPLES stopped following him never to have anything to do with him again! John 6:66

So if Jesus is using idioms and parables all we need to ask for is the meaning {Matthew 7:7-8} not to condemn what's in God's word or turning against Jesus.

@ Luke 16:19-31
The torment Jesus is talking about has to do with religious leaders extorting money from people claiming they are God's representatives by the time those common people gets to know Jesus who is the truth the religious leaders found themselves in emotional agony because their mugus has been let loose through Jesus' teachings. John 8:32

This is the meaning of each term Jesus used in that illustration:
*Rich man: Jewish religious leaders.
*Lazarus: Common Jews.
*Table of the rich man: Temple where common Jews go to get spiritual food.
*Gate of the rich man's house: Common Jews always seeking to learn whatever the Jewish religious leaders would say.
*Sour on Lazarus: God's rejection for long.
*Dogs leaking sours: different nations using the opportunity to dominate Jews.
*Death of Lazarus and rich man: change in conditions when Christ arrived.
*Abraham's bosom: Common Jews were favoured by Jesus as he continued to be with them giving them power to perform great signs.
*Excruciating pains for the rich man: the religious leaders became restless because they knew Jesus is surely God's sent but they felt slighted for not being commended at all for their long time service.
*Rich man asked Abraham to command Lazarus to cool his thirst: Jewish religious leaders began running up and down demanding that Jesus' disciples should stop talking about Jesus.
*Lazarus made no statement: Jesus' disciples refused to stop what they were doing.
*Rich man asked Abraham to send Lazarus to his five brothers: Jewish religious leaders wants signs from Jesus' disciples but Jesus said that is unnecessary.
*Rich man argued that if Lazarus whose condition has changed should visit his brothers they will repent: Religious leaders are demanding signs from Jesus' true disciples till today claiming whatever we preach if it's not backed with signs they will not accept it.
*Abraham's last statement: If religious leaders refused to learn from what happened to false prophets in the Bible there is no sign for them.

This is the interpretation of Lazarus and the Rich man but if you want to verify go and read from verse one of Luke 16 to know who are the people Jesus was addressing that day!

Max
You won't drag me into this debate and your tantrums. I have made my points. Take it or leave it. I have more important things to attend to.

Thanks for your understanding.

Ken4Christ:
I am very acquainted with all the usage and it's origin. I have a whole book on this. Max problem is that he doesn't believe at all that there's a literal place of torment called hell. He also doesn't believe that those thrown into the Lake if fire will experience unending torment. They are taught to believe that they just go into a state of none existence. They interpret the phrase, second death as none existence. But I have proven to him countless times that it isn't so with evidence of the scripture. But he still holds on to his lies. He will believe in it when he gets there but it will be too late.

Ken
Smile. None of the two of you is going to the lake of fire. I don't think anyone of you is wicked enough to be there. I know we have our lapses and our differences but to be cast into the lake of fire, it is for those who totally belong to the devil and I don't think any of you have that lifestyle that can be termed devilish in Bible context.
See Ken. Bible interpretation problems is something that has been in existence since that time of the Pharisees and Sadducees (on resurrection), even among the Apostles (salvation, faith, the Gentiles etc). They will not end until the coming of our Lord.
The confusion arises from three things and it will be difficult to come to an agreement on what this three things means.
1. Eternal which literally means forever.
2. Torment which literally means excruciating pain
3. Death which literally means to still living or existing.

All the three above have been interpreted in different ways.
1. Some believe that the eternal torment is a state of pain, punishment for all ages unending. And this group also interpret second death as a permanent departure from the grace and mercy of God. This group using the Parable of Lazarus and the rich man as their major argument. (I believe you belong to this group).
2. Some others believe that death means to cease to live or exist or to go into extinction,which means they can't feel nor experience anything. They also believe that the use of eternal does not mean forever but for an age. Thereby interpreting eternal torment to be a temporary state of eternal regrets (probably of the live they had live and the judgement being passed on them)before they finally go into extinction. This group uses Romans 6:7 as there argument.(I believe Max holds this view).

WHAT DO I BELIEVE?
I believe either way may be right. Both can be backed by scriptures. So therefore, since I live my life through the grace of God, I do not need to bother about the state of the wicked. Whether or not they will suffer forever or they will cease to exist. It doesn't matter to me since my portion won't be with them because I will be living forever with Christ.
So, when people ask me. I just present the two views to them and tell them that none of the two is good or preferred to the other, why not choose eternal life.

Thanks.

Ken4Christ:
In your common grave, people weep and gnash their teeth?

In your common grave, are there worms that do no die?

Does your common grave have a gate?. Jesus spoke about the gates of hell.

Can Satan who is a spirit being be buried in your common grave? Jesus said that hell was prepared for the devil and his Angels. So how would the devil enter your common grave?

You problem is pride. You have belived lies for so long that you don't want to admit it even in the face of overwhelming evidence of the scriptures that says otherwise.

Keep defending the lies of Russell and Rutherford. You will burn in hell if you don't repent.

The concept of hell according to my close study of scriptures have beings well defined by the English translation. The Hebrew did not do well about it too while the Greek did a very good job about it.
1. English (KJV) used Hell for everything.
2. Hebrew used Sheol for everything.
3. Greek used (1) Hades (2) Gehenna (3) Tartarus

So, when a person mentioned Hell (English), before I comment, I ask the question, Which one?
Hebrew - Sheol is used for common grave when all men will end.
Greek (1) Hades is used for the grave where all men will end.
Greek (2) Tartarus is used for a very dark place where disobedient fallen angels are held until the day of judgement.
Greek (3) Gehenna which has been used in two ways both literal and figurative.

Literal because there is Gehenna in Israel during the Second Temple era till the days of Jesus and the Apostles where dead bodies and refuse were dumped and the fire burns continuously and there is always worms.

Figurative because Jesus used this literal place to exemplify the LAKE OF FIRE prepared for the Devil and his fallen angels and also for people who lived wickedly and their names are not found in the book of those who will live forever (book of life).

So, it seems you and Max are speaking two different things. He is speaking about the Grave (Hades) and you are speaking about the Lake of Fire (Gehenna). Both of you are right from your perspective. It is English that sum them all as Hell that brings about the discrepancy.

Thanks.

Ken4Christ:
Sure. You forgot one
The Father is equal to the Son in a context.

Jesus said, I and my Father are one.- John 10:30.

The Jews knew what he meant. So they said:

John 10:33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

When they accused Jesus of making himself God, he didn't say that he was not. Rather, his further comment affirmed that Jesus is God. And he is one with him.

Even Paul wrote in his letter to the Philippian church that Jesus:

Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God - Philippians 2:6.

So, in a context, Jesus is equal with God. In another context, the Father is greater than Jesus.

Good sir.
We have agreed sir. But let us look at the three verses you quoted because it seems they you did not look at them deeply sir. But I understand you perspectives which is good but let us look at the interpretation of those verses you mentioned.
1. John 10:30.
In this verse, Jesus was talking about unity in that verse sir. The oneness he mentioned about him and the father was about the unity that exists between him and the father. He is not saying that he is the Father but that him and the father are united (one). Remember John 17:21 that Jesus said "Make all of the (the church) one just as we (the Father and the son) are one." So, the oneness is about unity.

2. John 10:33.
The people were accusing Jesus of calling himself God because he called himself the son of God. Just like if a goat for instance called itself the son of a man, the goat is indirectly calling itself man. So, the Jews understand that Jesus calling himself the son of God shows that he claimed to be God. Jesus also confirm this in verse 36 where he rebuked them for being angry for calling himself the son of godt.
Jesus always call himself the son of God but the Jews understand that calling himself the son of God is the same as calling himself God.

3. Philippians 2:6
Form of God, meaning there is a God (Father) that Jesus has his form.
Equal with God which means that there is a God Jesus can be compared with.
So, this verse, Paul was trying to show the Philippians that this Jesus is the replica and image and fullness of the Father and that Jesus is not an ordinary being but one who has been exalted to the right hand of the day to receive the same honor and glory.

So, we agree on all these.
Thanks.

MaxInDHouse:
Guy you've gotten the answer to your question: we don't sell Bibles.

So if there's no further questions please let the matter rest.

Max
I have confirmed sir. And I must say Kudos to your organization for doing that. That is a very good and commendable thing to do.

sonmvayina:
Do not murder
Do not steal
Desist from idolatry as we are all God's spirit having a human experience
Honor/respect your parents
Do not bear false witness.
Do not have sex with any family members
Etc.

Nice one sir.
Keep it up. That is the right path

MaxInDHouse:
Guy you've gotten the answer to your question: we don't sell Bibles.

So if there's no further questions please let the matter rest.

If that is correct. It is commendable sir. Keep it up. Let me confirm it and I will get back to you.
Thanks.

MaxInDHouse:
If you're one of our friends who wants to study the Bible with us we will require a copy for you and it's yours forever!

Good and commendable sir. That is good.
But do your members purchase Bible from the kingdom hall whenever they want to get or replace the old one?
Thanks.

MaxInDHouse:
Please walk into any kingdom Hall of JWs and ask for a Bible to study with us make sure you ask for the name of whoever demands payment from you.

Go now don't delay!

Wait sir. I will confirm from my friends.
But state it clears. Are Bibles given for free at Kingdom halls and it becomes your possession or you read it on lease and return it back to the kingdom hall after reading or study?
That is the clarity I need to know. I like specifics.

Thanks.

MaxInDHouse:
He is a thief!
Whatever he is using it for is worthless if the payer feels he is obeying the law of tithe.
Saul was ordered to destroy the whole of Amalek but he preserved some things claiming he wants to use it to the glory of God if God rejected Saul for such then there is no reason why all so called pastors shouldn't tell their members that tithe is no longer Christian practice! Hebrews 7:5-12



Advertising the books in Christ's name is the CRIME, anyone can become an author writing interesting articles but don't attach it to Christ that's unchristian!

Okay sir.
Do you sell Bibles at JW?
Thanks.

MaxInDHouse:
According to God's word tithing was instituted among ancient Israelites so that the system of worship will run smoothly since Levites weren't given any inheritance when they left Egypt.
But when Christianity was established the tithing cease because they weren't practicing the old system of worship again {Hebrews 7:5-12} this impostor keeps speaking against God's organized people because we teach people that tithe is unchristian practice.
Secondly he publish books and sell to people claiming how to increase members of the church which is unchristian because the church can only increase through adequate preaching and teaching of God's word anything aside from that is paganism but because he wants to extort money from people he keeps on advertising his useless books in the name of Jesus who said:

You received free, give free.

That makes him a confirmed thief!

1. It is true that tithing is not for believers and it is not necessary. I do not subscribe to it but I a church have members that pay tithe willfully without being coerced and the pastor uses the money for the people in the church and community, and not for himself, then I can't call such a pastor, thief.

2. He sold books he wrote? I don't have issues with selling books or other materials. They are not salvation. At least churches sell printed Bibles and even bookshops sell Bibles too.
I don't know maybe in JW you share Bibles for free.
But I may have issues with his topic and what is the detail of what he wrote in the book. But I can't judge the book that I have not read. That will not be just and that is not what the scriptures taught me.

Thanks.

Ken4Christ:
Please remind me. I have forgotten. Seven point resolution?

Okay sir.
If we can agree on the following then, it means we are just speaking for the same thing in different forms.
1. The Father is God
2. The Son is God
3. Thw holy spirit is the spirit of God (Father and Son)
4. The Father is greater than the son.
5. The Son is subject to the Father.
6. The Son is supreme over all things except the Father.
7. The Father is supreme over all things including the Son.

Do we agree sir or are there still grey areas you don't agree?

Thanks.

MaxInDHouse:
Whether you agree or not the fact remains that Jesus who is the firstborn of all creations is part of creation!

I do not disagree. He was the first of all God's creation and he is the creator of all other creations.

Thanks.

MaxInDHouse:
All intelligent beings humans and angels are God's children the difference is some are spirit beings while we are human that doesn't change the fact that the first born of creation is part of creation.

Sure. If that is your context. Correct.
1. Jesus is the son of God
2. Angels are sons of God
3. Adam is the son of God
4. The righteous are sons of God and daughters of God.

If that is what you mean. Then correct. That is the position found in scriptures.

Thanks.

MaxInDHouse:
Who cares for apology?
I can use the Bible to prove that he is a thief so let him prove that jw.org is a cult we will both use the Bible.
There's no need for apology if he truly feels jw.org is a cult group that's a welcome development but he needs to use the Bible to prove it while i use God's word to prove that he is a thief!

Okay sir. A thief must steal something. Sir, can you proof with evidence like you said you will what he had stolen?
Thanks

MaxInDHouse:
Wrong!
Only BEGOTTEN son which means he is the only creature that God made all by Himself.

Read my modified and read Hebrews 1:5.
Adam was also God's son in Luke 3:38. What about that, so we plenty because I am also a son of God if that is your context. Abi