₦airaland Forum

If not that I don't know what's delaying the take off of Peter Mbah's PHC models in Enugu, that award would have been won by Enugu State. But they're yet to take off properly even up till now!

Let it not end up like another abandoned project o! They mustn't finish building all the proposed 260 facilities before taking off! At least let the ready ones start working to serve as a model to other states in the country!

What our presido is wearing is the real representation of a COAT as against a SUIT.

hafeeanubasy:
Bullying?......you lack knowledge.

Most doctors when want Nurses too to start demanding for Doctor of Nursing.


Na patients go suffer with confusion

Nurses doing doctor of nursing science would not cause them to do the works of physicians in a hospital setting. It'll only improve their own professional responsibilities to patients and is a win-win for the system. Many won't even want to be addressed as doctors in a hospital setting like you paranoid lots assume.

DataDoc:
If adding Dr. to your name makes you happy, then do it. Lol

I don't even fancy the title! I'm just ashamed that our medical doctors could make an issue out of the "Dr" title, just the same way they cry when they see other healthcare professionals wearing lab coats!

If they want to ask for salary increment, let them do ask legitimately and not this their current antics of bullying other healthcare professionals with inconsequential things like "Dr" title and whatnots

Cmanforall:
You mean federal hospital?

How about State, missions and private hospitals?

Or are those working there are not considered doctors?

The CONMESS salary scale which medical doctors are paid with is uniform for most institutions approved for residency training. If variations exist, it won't be that much.

Even many private hospitals in places like Lagos pay their medical officers above 316k. I have medical and dental doctors around me, so I know what I'm talking about.

No resident doctor earns less than 400k in a public hospital in Nigeria as at today. Maybe the 316k excludes call duty allowance

Mental healthcare is given little attention here in Nigeria and it's quite unfortunate! Suicide is on the increase. Many of the killings and security breaches we witness in the country are as a result of mental health crisis.

Yet government is not doing much to improve the situation! The few mental health institutions like the psychiatric hospitals are given less attention! If people get the right treatments and counseling sessions, many of the suicide cases would be curtailed and even security situation of the country can be greatly improved through proper mental healthcare! But our political leaders are people of low intelect so they don't understand all these things. Too bad!

Many Pharmacists are now running away from hospital practice in Nigeria due to hostilities by medical doctors! This would spell doom for patients and our healthcare system if the government does not act decisively to restore pharmacists' confidence in the system! Our Pharmacists now prefer to go to Community pharmacy practice, Industrial Pharmacy, Regulatory Pharmacy and Academic Pharmacy etc

This is not good for the well-being of health-seeking Nigerians coming to our hospitals! Government must stop pandering to every demands of medical doctors in our hospitals to restore other professionals' confidence in the system. A word is enough for the wise!

Sonnobax15:

No be lie...

Every hustler just dey suffer for those car owners hand well well...

Reminds of me of a similar scenario that happened between my myself,my banny and one mumu guyman passenger inside my Keke some weeks ago.....The werey heard how my banny and I were calling each other babe but the mugu still went ahead, trying to woo her, right in my presence . Na once I stop my Keke for halfway say make the scallywag come down,say I no dey go him destination again

I hate men who try to oppress their fellow men simply because they feel they have arrived more than such men

Such men can be very annoying! Just because they feel they're richer, they'll want to intimidate their fellow man... nonsense!

Na im some bad guys dey murd because of woman.

Can you imagine?! Commit suicide because of JAMB? Poor orientation!

Many universities offer admissions to people with even lower scores, especially to courses like Microbiology.

These are some of the problems we keep harping on. Nigerians should wake up and demand a healthcare system based on teamwork!

NMA and NARD are fighting to create a monopoly of the Nigerian healthcare system so they can easily cover up negligences and slaughter of innocent Nigerians by their colleagues!

A healthcare system based on teamwork of the different healthcare professionals would put everybody on their toes to give the best to the patients! Imagine a situation where a med doctor knows that his/her drug prescriptions(including anaesthetics) would be scrutinized by a clinical Pharmacist! He'll have no choice than to be at his best, and vice versa.

They're fighting teamwork in the healthcare system for these obvious reasons! They know that it'll no longer be business as usual. Mind you, the great minds in medicine who know what they are doing don't even engage in the unnecessary fights by some mediocres in NMA and NARD. It is usually the mediocres among them that feel threatened by improvement of other healthcare professionals because they feel that these professionals would help to expose their deficiencies! I know some great minds in medicine whom I respect alot and they don't indulge in infantile squabbles with other professionals in healthcare team. They're few though

Nigerians need to wake up at this time to stop the mediocres in NARD and NMA from bullying other healthcare professionals but give way for teamwork which the patients would ultimately benefit from!

HaneefahRN:
We like titles too much
What's the need for everyone wanting Dr of stuffs? Not supporting the residents fighting for nonsense, no profession has a claim to the title. But then they end up making students spend more years in school for no reason.
Our people too like title, Oyinbo sef even consultant will introduce himself as Mr/Miss

Honestly, for us Pharmacists, it is not about titles! Many of my mates who graduated with the Pharm.D prefer to be addressed as Pharmacists! My humble self never uses the "Dr" title but the Parm.D program improved our clinical knowledge very well such that there's always a striking knowledge gap between Pharm.D graduates and others!

It's a big shame that Nigerian medical doctors cry over inconsequential things like titles while our healthcare system bleeds!

A group of people that go as low as crying over who should wear lab coats in the hospital and who shouldn't, making me to wonder if they even know the purpose lab coats serve in the first place.

Our medical doctors really need to change their ways o. No wonder they're not allowed to practice in many developed countries of the world!

QuinQ:
I have both pharmacists and doctors. The doctors I know continued their training through residency, the pharmacists I know, graduation was the end. They then found a job with some company or govt

The doctors you know continued their residency without getting jobs first Stop meddling on matters you know nothing about!

Doctors doing residency trainings are working and those in government hospitals are paid starting from grade level 13 in the federal civil service!

Pharmacists also have their residency training in the West African postgraduate college of Pharmacists! They pay for their own residency training unlike med doctors that are paid to train!

Playing lawn tennis at 70??


RIP to him

donmik:
Apart from Lagos State, all Nigerian states have the same story in their educational infrastructures

Lemme hear word

This is not true!

Many states like Enugu have given a facelift to their primary schools, including those in the villages. I know what I'm talking about.

What is happening in Benue, I think, has to do with neglect of the minority Idoma by the Tivs who have been ruling the state.

advanceDNA:
Yeah ...I never said the comparison btw biochem and pharmacy isn't small..u are just deflecting.........I even said whateva the comparison is doesn't justify a biochemist encroaching the space of pharmacist or getting the pay or of a pharmacist ..

Equally the comparison btw medicine and pharmacy is wide....and doesn't justify u doing the work of a medical doctor when it comes to patient care or getting their pay...

If u don't have the training u shouldn't be in involved in patient care.........u can keep fighting for pay that u don't deserve by using NUC laws to get doctor title
....y'all don't care about patient care at the end of the day...cos u can't even mention the training that justify giving you free hand..

...u just envy medical doctors and u can't even do their job

For crying out loud, pharmacists are not seeking to become medical doctors! It is mischievous for some of you to cling to that erroneous notion! The matter is that all over the world, roles of Pharmacists have evolved beyond just handing out drugs to patients to participating as a team in managing patients' medications therapy. That is not a physicians' area of training but a pharmacist's!

Are you even aware that some of us who choose to study pharmacy qualified for admission into medicine but chose pharmacy instead due to interests? So, why should I envy medical doctors when I chose pharmacy on good purpose??

QuinQ:
See lying o. Go to a pharmacy in US and call the pharmacist "doctor" and see if people won't look at you like crazy. See below

Even your own screenshot shows that they're qualified to be addressed as "doctors"! The fact that the modest among them (like myself anyway) prefer to be addressed as pharmacists -- especially when they work in a hospital setting, doesn't change the fact that many of them bear the title.

advanceDNA:
free hand to operate...?? Please sir, what does this even mean.....is a professional supposed to be given responsibility more than their training...?? Should all professionals in the medical niche be given free hand or this is just a pharmacist thing??
Biochemist also have to learn plenty pathways similar to pharmacist...they do pharmacology, and xenobiotics and other drug related training, does that mean they will now be given free hand to operate into part of the niche of a pharmacist?

Biochemistry is also know part of what medical dotors lean in college..should biochemist be given free hand as well in patient care because they know one part of what medical doctors know?? I'm just asking?? Or is this just a pharmacy thing??

Pharmacist are drug/scientist, that's the scope of their educational training.....their training is limited....just like other medical professionals like microbiology and biochemistry are limited...
.. they are not trained to manage patient care, as it relates physiological and anatomical responses, surgery etc. So yes, their role in patient care will be limited...

Making it look like it's a wrong for pharamcist to be limited to the drug area is a bad thing is absurd ..

again.. u say this like it's a bad thing........medical doctors went through a much broader/robust education and clinical training to manage this scope...
Maybe NUC should expand the scope of pharmacy training from college to clinical level.....
Nurses are even more involved in patient care than pharmacist because some of their training covers it..and that why they do some minor surface surgeries in the UK e.g removal of surface lump like lipoma and other non-cancerous external skin growth.....

again they are drug scientist ....their contribution should be systemically little in patient managemen
then this just about getting money in the first place and not really about patient care because putting a Dr title or paying them more than doctors won't make them more competent to handle what medical doctors handle...

Like I said Maybe NUC should make their training robust enough if the aim is patient care and not competition for money they don't even work for..


I can't overemphasize the fact that pharmacists are drug chemist or scientist. They are already exerting their responsibility based on their training....
Maybe u should enlighten me because no one knows it all......what training does pharmacist have that makes u think they are not fully exerting their responsibility??

Their core niche which is drug discovery and development....medical doctors, biochemist and biotechnologist are even more active than them in research which could lead new drugs that could improve patient treatment outcomes....

To me this is just a case of a worker who just feel they should get same pay with those that do far more than them because they spent similar years in college and work in the same compound

I don't like going back and forth with someone who just wants to argue blindly for the sake of argument.
They're drug 'scientists' simply shows your limited knowledge of the pharmacy profession! Go and start learning about pharmacy from history! Maybe after that you'll understand better.
FYI, there's only a little comparison between Biochemistry you typed about and Pharmacy! I did both, so I know better! Stop comparing both because they're not same in scope. Pharmacy comprises 6 hefty departments and is both a science and an art.

LabStores:
Lol
Dey play
What doctors are fighting for is not just the title in my opinion. They are also fighting for responsiblity and VALUE! How much of responsibilities does a pharmacist have compared to a doctor in hospital settings? How much of value do they give?
Yes, pharmacists study a lot to get their title, but what do they use it to do at the end of the day in terms of responsibilities in the hospital settings?
Do they work as much as the doctors? If you agree they don't, why should they earn more as the doctors?
And we all know they don't even study as much as MBBS do...
Will you say it's because they went through complex and long training too to become pharmacists, so they should earn equally too?
What about the engineers too? I don't even think pharmacists go through half of what some engineers go through in school... There's little or no cramming in real engineering o... You must know and understand methods to pass exams... When you see COMPLEX and advance further math and math methods, your body go shake!!!
Doctors know that when all these other professionals start bearing the same title with them, the next thing is that they'll start asking for equal salaries - what they don't merit (ratio and not amount). They'll also start asking to becoming CMDs...

Cc: Ebubu3, QuinQ, Okaydaddy, Ebubu7, Simple87, Dalohad

insecurities at it's peak! Let the CMDs and other hospital administrators give them the freehand to operate and get involved in patients medication management! For now they're comfortable in having them confined to pharmacy rooms and handing out drugs to patients even if what they're giving out is poison prescribed by the medical doctors.

In most Nigerian public hospitals, medical doctors control the scope of operation of other healthcare professionals! So, that nullifies your assertion that hospital pharmacists make little contribution to patients management. That is the reason why the improved qualifications and remunerations are very apt, let's see if that would somehow compel you physicians and hospital managers to allow these professionals exert their full professional responsibilities to the patients.

QuinQ:
Overseas they are NOT called doctor neither do they use the title! No one calls lawyers doctor in US neither do they use the title - yet ALL lawyers in US have JD including Biden (but his wife was called doctor - PhD). Pharmacists are called Pharmacists not doctor! That's how you avoid confusion! Nigeria cannot be an exception. This is human life we're talking about!

Your ignorance is still glaring from your post. You're not 'overseas" obviously! In the US, Canada, Australia etc, they bear the Dr title, with Pharm.D added to indicate their field.

QuinQ:
You know full well it's no ordinary bachelor's. Bachelor's don't take 7 years. Plus your real training starts after that. This is about human life. All it takes to kill a person is for one "doctor" trying to live up to the "doctor" everyone thinks he is.

* I'm not doctor

You're not a doctor! So you're clearly typing out of ignorance!

In the hospital setting, everybody knows their positions and what they are employed to do. The doctor of pharmacy for instance knows that his focus is on drugs and how his interactions with patients, physicians, nurses and other healthcare professionals should center around medications. Ultimately he helps the patients get the best of their drug therapy. That is what a doctor of pharmacy would do in a hospital setting. Even if he uses the Dr title, it is going to be indicated in his ward coat as "Pharm.D". Physicians all over the world work in harmony with doctors of pharmacy (without complaints) as that has become the minimum requirement for every pharmacist. Nigeria cannot be an exception!

It is just big ego that is driving the NARD guys to go against other healthcare professionals using the Dr title Q.E.D. A group of people that even cry by mere seeing people wear lab coats! Can you beat that! To them, lab coat is now an exclusive regalia for medical doctors! Imagine such display of ignorance!

omojeesu:
The last time you were sick who did you go to see in the hospital?

Well, let me burst your bubble: I give myself the best treatment only few medical doctors can administer. I have never been sick to the point of needing an MBBS "Dr"

To think that most of us don't even fancy bearing the doctor title sef even when we're fully qualified to! Yet these our local MBBS holders are getting worked up about it!

Just allow me make my evidence-based contributions to patients' medications management and pay me commensurate wage for that. You can go ahead and eat the Dr title!

QuinQ:
They ought pass a law that only medical doctors and those with terminal degrees (PhD's) can be addressed as, and use the title "doctor", otherwise people will surely die from all sorts of "doctors" deceiving people

But with your MBBS, you still address yourselves as Dr Ordinary bachelors degree o

omojeesu:
Title craze country!

Inferiority complex
Envy and jealousy
Backdoor to becoming Dr without PhD
Some wanted to become medical doctors but somehow are unable.

When sick these pseudo-drs see the real doctors o!

An optometrist "Dr" put MD in front of his name. When asked what it meant he replied "Managing Director"

Who does a sick person basically come to see in the hospital?

Who do sick Nigerians basically go to see in hospitals abroad?

Corruption has made it all possible!

Worse scenarios on the way!

I think the Nigerian medical doctors are the ones having insecurities here just because they never knew that the Dr title is not their exclusive preserve!

For your information, my humble self qualified for admission into medicine and surgery but chose pharmacy instead. I also thought I could just study my pharmacy within 5years, graduate and start making money but only got to know I was in for a 6years Pharm.D program when I got into the university.

So, don't you and other insecure medical doctors go thinking that pharmacists are not comfortable in our professions but standards just have to be followed!

Or is it only in matters that concern your selfish desires that you Nigerian medical doctors remember to adhere to your much-talked-about INTERNATIONAL BEST PRACTICES?

Very egotistic bunch!

These people are only after their overblown egos! The doctor title for other healthcare professionals has no negative effects on their practices as physicians! It only helps other healthcare professionals to improve their clinical knowledge all to the advantage of first the patients and even the physicians!

The practice has become essential parts of healthcare in different parts of the world from the USA, UK, Europe, Asia and many other African countries including our nearest neighbors; Ghana, Gambia etc.

I wouldn't know whether to term NARD's stand on this matter as IGNORANCE or is it outright wickedness!? Because, like the Pharm.D aspect which aims to train clinically oriented Pharmacists who get closer to and involved in patients' medications management. This development has helped in no small measures to help patients get the best of their medications, identify and prevent medication errors, drug -drug interactions, drug-food interactions and drug-disease interactions. The benefit is that:

1. Patients save more funds by avoiding unnecessary drugs and using just the exact drugs and quantity he or she needs while on hospital admission

2. Dangerous drug interactions are identified and nipped in the buds by clinical Pharmacists, thus saving the patients from drug-related injuries and deaths!

3. Duration of hospital stays are minimized as Clinical Pharmacists help physicians avoid trial and error prescriptions which are currently the order of the day in most of our hospitals!

During my internship in a teaching hospital in the east, I wept for our unsuspecting health-seeking Nigerians because I witnessed daily wastage of funds by patients as relates to their medications! One medical doctor would come in the morning and write alot of medications for the patient on admission, the Patient's care giver would run helter skelter, gather funds and come to pharmacy to buy those drugs. The doctor would start administering those drugs and halfway, maybe when another doctor comes on duty, he or she would cancel all the previous prescriptions and write different drugs all together only for the Patient's relatives to start running around for funds again. At the end of the day, so much money is spent treating an ailment that could have been taking care of with simpler medications.

The whole scenario boils down to a major challenge which is currently facing our healthcare system. I believe this challenge has to do with POOR DIAGNOSIS of patients' conditions before even giving medications. Yet our medical doctors don't care about getting things right with DIAGNOSIS before deliving into not-so-familiar terrain of pharmacotherapy (treatment with drugs)!

Well meaning Nigerians should prevail on NMA, NARD, MDCAN, medical elders and educators to direct more efforts towards getting diagnosis of diseases right! Our political leaders should also lend their voices and efforts in that direction. Go to our hospitals today, many people have been sick for years without the medical doctors pinpointing what their sicknesses are but they only indulge in blindly loading these patients with medications in a trial and error manner without the patients recovering! That's what you get when physicians abandon their areas of strength while dragging spaces in areas where they're poorly trained!

Our political leaders need to stop allowing themselves bullied by NMA and their cohorts! No wonder they're now quick to whip up the sentiments of Nigerian doctors being the most sought after in the japa episodes. Whenever they want to bully the federal government into pandering to their inordinate demands, they come up with the japa threats. But call for applications from medical doctors even to any of the primary healthcare centers, they'll apply in their numbers! I witnessed it recently so I'm not saying what I don't know!

MightySparrow:
I don't understand it, in the 80s, we would be targeting to answer 35 questions in Mathematics. Only very few ones attempted 40 to 45. They even told us there were negative marks.
Is JAMB getting simpler these days?

Obviously, JAMB is getting simpler for the serious ones!

CBT is much more easier to navigate than paper and pencil tests. The time taken to SOLVE and SHADE one question in Paper and pencil tests could be used to do 3 questions in CBT, especially for someone who practiced and read very well.