₦airaland Forum

triplechoice:
Why do you disagree? Is seeking for knowledge at any cost not worth it?

I just disagree that your interpretation is the meaning of the story not that seeking knowledge is not worth it.

triplechoice:
It is not an assumption that there are moderate religious people. It is critics of religion, who are pushing for its complete eradication, that deny this fact.

The only people who ever push for the eradication of religion are those with ideologies that view religion as the competitor. Those types usually have the power of the State behind them. Critics of religion just want the socially incompatible ideas of religion to be kept out of the public sphere.

triplechoice:
Moderate believers are more tolerant of non believers. This can't be said of the fundamentalist.

You’d be better served to give examples of “moderate” believers and the “fundamentalist” believers from a couple of religions. Saying moderates are more tolerant of non believers doesn’t say much. Why is toleration on the part of religious people the difference between moderates and fundamentalists? They get their ideas from the same source regardless if you call them moderates or fundamentalists.

triplechoice:
Even amongst atheist there are moderate atheist and atheist fundamentalist. The later are very intolerant, and are everywhere on the net engaged in psychological terrorism of religious people.

This is why I said that dichotomy of moderates and fundamentalists is totally subjective. Your definition has to do with atheists on the internet mocking religion.

triplechoice:
So it is not subjective but an explicit behavior that anyone can observe and make the distinction.

No, it is very subjective as you’ve shown already.

triplechoice:
Well, I see it as an effective recruitment tactics to get new members, and not useless. It has been working and will continue to work

I didn’t say it was useless. I said the actual interpretation of “original sin” is useless to the church not the interpretation they tell their believers, which is obviously very effective.

triplechoice:
No matter how we want to look at it, religion will continue to be part of our collective reality.It can't be completely eradicated now or in the future.

Why the eradication straw man? No one said anything about eradication.

triplechoice:
Religion as we all know, function as a coping mechanism for some people. Not everyone is mentally tough to cope with the challenges of life. It may be easy for some persons to cope, but for others not an easy thing.

Of course.

triplechoice:
Not exactly the same. For instance, the version of the story in the Koran is not exactly the same in the Bible. Also in judaic methology, the first wife of Adam was Lilith. She failed to obey Adam and was banished from the garden.
Whatever the case, it doesn't make sense for anyone to inherit "original sin" from a story that is fiction.

Regardless, the one in the Bible has a specific meaning allegorically called “original sin”, which refers to a natural phenomenon.

MaxInDHouse:
I don't know the one liking my post so for the benefit of this person i will TEACH!

Lmao.

MaxInDHouse:
I
The Bible book of Matthew was written by the tax collector who knew that the money given to Judas was returned to the temple but it was the same field where Judas committed suicide that those Pharisees used the money to buy since they can't keep it in the treasury box so they picked it and bought the land so that strangers could be buried in the field of blood as they're calling it afterwards {Matthew 27:5-8} but whose money is it?
Judas's money!
That's why the Act account says Judas bought a land with the money!

You get an A+ for this astounding bullshit.

sonmvayina:
First and foremost,God has no material or physical form. God is the totality of the consciousness of the universe fully embodied
.

No physical form but it’s is embodied. Ah, the god of contradictions.

How about half embodied half disembodied?

God is the partially embodied consciousness of the mass energy balance of the fully embodied universe.

How about the totality of the matter of the universe fully disembodied?

How about God has no immaterial or material form?

God is the multiplicity of the trifecta of the infinite, the immaterial, and the timeless………..partially embodied

sonmvayina:
Your problem be say you no dey piss for one place..
Piss for one place, make them see the foam..

I guess you think you’ve written something clever.

sonmvayina:
Forget about Jesus..
He is just a creation of the Roman empire.

Jesus is not a creation of the Roman Empire. Just because they organized their state religion around the figure of Jesus doesn’t mean they created it. The creators, or at least the custodians of the system of allegory that led to Jesus, are in the story of the gospels if you know what you’re looking at. They organized the oldest known form of Christianity but they didn’t create Jesus.
As usual you’re quick to say Jesus was a creation of whatever empire but somehow unable to extend the same criticism to your beloved Judaism. Why is the god of the Jews any more real than the god of the Incas?

sonmvayina:
There is no such thing like original sin...

There is no such thing as literal sin anyway regardless if it’s original or subsequent. That said there is an allegorical meaning.

sonmvayina:
The story is allegorical.

Preaching to the choir.

cornelboy:
He's the creator. He's real.
Na your own god no get name. You can design your own god just like you like in your mind.
Continue fooling yourself.

He can be the creator and the destroyer as you wish.
He can be a She if you wish. He can be the apple of your eye if you wish. It’s your imaginary friend, give it all the attributes you wish. But you can NEVER make it speak it for itself.

MaxInDHouse:
Imaginary but PERFORMING globally, now that God has given us divine wisdom there's nothing agents of Satan like you can say.
Our God is alive! Psalms 115:2-3

Ọ̀gbẹ́ni! present your own god and let's talk about what it has ever done to prove itself in our own time! Psalms 115:4-8

As imaginary as the god you abandoned in Islam. Jumping from frying pan into the fire.

Ọ̀gbẹ́ni, I no get imaginary friends.

triplechoice:
One should seek for knowledge or truth at any cost. They ate the forbidden fruit( knowledge) and their"eyes became open" .

It's an origin myth and also an allegory. Anyone who reads it without bias can find other themes running through it.

Definitely part of an origin myth and I understand your “moral truth” but I disagree.

triplechoice:
Very surprised you're asking this sort of question. It's common knowledge that every religious group has it's moderate believers; The non fundamentalist.

It’s not common knowledge but a common assumption. Who decides where the moderates end and the fundamentalist begin. You say that as if there is a clear line between a moderate and a fundamentalist when it’s totally subjective.

triplechoice:
The concept of the "original sin' is church doctrine meant to instill guilt in the minds of people for something that doesn't concern them in order to make them seek desperately for forgiveness from a saviour or anyone they believe can take the away the burden of guilt.

The church doctrine that may be the greatest scam ever perpetrated. However, there is an “original sin” in the story that is utterly useless to the church.

triplechoice:
The Adam and Eve story is not unique to Christianity. There are other versions of the allegory in other religious groups; Judaism and Islam, for instance.

It's only in Christianity you will find the concept of "original sin" linked to it.

If there's no original sin (there's non), then nobody needs to be saved from anything by anyone. We are the only ones to bear the consequences of whatever choice we make in life.

Judaism and its offshoots share the same Adam and Eve, just different interpretations. All wrong by the way. But you are right, what is salvation to one without sin?

MaxInDHouse:
Imaginary but has been to all nations to pick individuals who are faithful and erased politics, military and racism in their hearts so that they have become one big and happy family of peace loving worshipers globally! Isaiah 2:2-4

Surely it is an imaginary being!

As imaginary as the leprechaun sitting in the corner giving you the middle finger.

MaxInDHouse:
When an interested person ask i will TEACH as for you suit yourself!

Make sure you meditate and ruminate, then spew whatever jargon your cult tells you.

cornelboy:
Lol. Shebi na you give yourself life Abi
Good luck with your imaginary friend you call your God.

You be the one with the imaginary friend “god of the jews”.

MaxInDHouse:
You only need to meditate not just read to understand what you're reading in God's word!

You meditate and figure it out the confusion.

Matt 27:6 says Judas refunded the blood money to the temple priests and hung himself.

Acts 1:16-18 says Judas bought a field with that money and fell headlong and perished.

cornelboy:
What your saying doesn't make any sense to me.
We both have different beliefs about God. So stick to yours while I stick to mine.

My own god is an intelligent being behind existence of all life. The God of the Jews.

Of course it doesn’t make sense to you. Nothing surprising about that since religion has obviously warped your critical thinking and ability to tell fact from fiction. The “god of the Jews” is a fictional character created by that particular culture.
And of course he can be as intelligent as you want it to be. He can be behind, in the middle, and in front of existence of all life if you want it to be. He can even talk to you if you want. He can be whatever you want him to be.
He is the god of the Jews so I guess the rest of you are afterthoughts.

Another example of the confused “word of god” regarding Judas’ role in the gospel of bullshit.

Matt 27:6 says Judas refunded the blood money to the temple priests and hung himself.

Acts 1:16-18 says Judas bought a field with that money and fell headlong and perished.

MaxInDHouse:
Satan wanted Jesus death when he was a baby that couldn't PREACH or TEACH but since he has escaped that stage the next thing is to break Jesus' integrity not to kill him because he knew that will make Jesus a conqueror whose mission is successful!
All what Satan wanted by that time is to make Jesus feel like his earthly mission is not worth it.
Imagine Jews who has been anticipating the coming of the Messiah (Christ) turned against him, their religious leaders spread evil reports about him, most of his disciples left him, his closest confidants one betrayed him the other denied him and while suffering excruciating pains on the torture stake some were mocking him, even one of the criminals executed along with him also mocked him all because he loves to save mankind.

What Satan was expecting from Jesus is to break free and say this people doesn't worth all these suffering but Jesus bear it all till the end and declared "it has been accomplished " John 19:30

At that moment Satan felt really bad because he knew Jesus has won!

Long story short, boychik could have committed harakiri and saved himself and the other unwilling participants in the drama all that trouble. He could even have surrendered to Satan and let Satan kill him. His so called suffering is also overblown. People held in the cargoes of ships during the middle passage definitely suffered more than whatever you say Jesus suffered. People in concentration camps during wars suffer more than whatever you say Jesus suffered.
Besides why feel sorry for his suffering and death when that was the whole point of his existence?
He is supposed to be super man, so why feel sorry for his “suffering”? He woke up from death so why feel sorry that he died?
Literally, your Jesus is nonsense. Allegorically, your Jesus is bullshit.
Here is suffering:

cornelboy:
Lol. What are the criteria of being a god?

It depends on the level of education, vocabulary, and beliefs of the person talking about the god. Gods are as various as humans because gods don’t exist outside the human mind and are wholly dependent on the human mind. However, there is one criteria common to all the gods and that is fiction.

When was the last time you hear the “word of god” come out of a god’s mouth instead of a man’s mouth?

The gods are Omniblablabla and can do all things except speak for themselves.

Lukuluku69:
3. The Swords Peter was carrying a out, Jesus could have asked for it and do a Japanese harakiri and save everyone the drama. Sebi na blood him Papa need?

I second this motion.

MaxInDHouse:
Of course he really contributed greatly though unknowingly because he was only intelligent but not wise!

So Satan wasn’t responsible for his actions neither because he contributed to the plan unknowingly. So instead of Jesus going peaceably to his execution, he managed to besmirch Judas and Satan who were unknowingly part of the plan. Why the drama?

MaxInDHouse:
Satan used so many opportunities {Luke 4:13} Judas just ended up being a scapegoat due to his greed for money! 1Timothy 6:9-10
Satan once used Peter too and Jesus told him immediately that Satan is the one speaking not Peter! Matthew 16:23

So it was Satan that caused Jesus’ death by turning Judas into a marionette. Good to see that Satan contributed to the plan. He’s a very nice antagonist.

MaxInDHouse:
Remember Jesus is no man's brother o!

You only gain through him if you're willing to live by his counsels. All his friends did except Judas who loves money more than himself so it's not Jesus' fault he gave all of them the same chance Judas Iscariot only allowed himself to be used by Satan!

Which one is it, was Judas used by Satan to betray Jesus or was it Jesus’ plan that Judas betray him?

Satan has no part to play here unless you want to say that he was in cahoots with Jesus to use one of his disciples regardless if it’s Judas or Peter.

MaxInDHouse:
Judas is doomed because what Jesus taught his group is not to be taken lightly, for Judas to have failed to keep what Jesus taught them he caused his own destruction.

Of course it's a close confidant that must betray Jesus after all most people only had his name many don't know him facially so Judas fell for the bait it's not compulsory that it must be him!

Why must Jesus doom one of his close confidants and cause that confidant’s suicide if he knew the plan was for him to be executed? He told Peter that Peter would deny him three times, he could have warmed Judas and stop the betrayal by simply giving himself up.
Even if he tried to keep whatever Jesus taught him, it was the plan that a close confidant must betray Jesus so he was a patsy.

In light of this, Judas is not guilty by reason circumstances beyond his own power. Like you said, a close confidant must betray Jesus but why would Jesus approve of such a depraved action that led to Judas’ doom?

MaxInDHouse:
He didn't want himself dead!
The plan was for a perfect human blood to be shed on planet earth to redeem obedient descendants of Adam. So Jesus coming was like a lamb whose blood must be shed

So if the plan was for his perfect human blood to be shed, he should have gone to the executioners on his own instead of the drama with Judas. Unless, he was scared and didn’t want to go through with shedding that perfect human blood of his.

Did the plan include unaware participants who didn’t know that they were characters in a planned event?
Would Judas have killed himself if he was told that he was just a patsy?

MaxInDHouse:
Was it the Romans that wanted him dead?
Remember the Roman governor said his hands is not in this man's death.

The stories say the Roman authorities were in charge and put him to death. The Roman governor saying it wasn’t in his hand is not a defense because his troops carried out the execution.
Also, why bother about who wanted him dead when the plan was for him to die? He should have known where to go and who to go to instead of waiting for Judas to destroy himself.
Why paint him like a victim that had enemies when the point of his existence was his execution. The Jews, Romans, and poor Judas are just unwilling cogs in the wheel.
It wasn’t these parties that wanted him dead. He wanted himself dead as the only begotten son that was given to be executed. So why soil the rest of them?

MaxInDHouse:
Of course he surrendered himself but someone just have to betray him since he doesn't dress differently nor behave like their boss, so only a close confidant can do that.

My questions were rhetorical by the way.
He didn’t surrender. If he had surrendered there would be no need for the so called betrayal. Regardless how he acted amongst them, if his mission was to die and if he knew his mission, there was was need to put Judas in that situation. He obviously didn’t until bloodshed. He could have left them to go to the Roman’s himself without putting Destroying Judas in the process. Just say that’s how the story is written instead of trying to Justify it.

MaxInDHouse:
Judas's love for money brought him to Satan's notice just as an intelligent person could predict the person who can betray you for money among your friends!

What does Satan have to do with this?

Emmato77:
Why did Judas betray Jesus, is because of the fulfillment of the scriptures and prophecy, to liberate the mankind from destruction, after Adam fail God in the garden of Eden.

Did anyone ask Judas if he wanted to play a role in this drama?
If Jesus came to die, why didn’t he just surrender himself instead of destroying Judas in the process?

Being a King must be a pleasing experience, even “God” wants to be a King sitting on a throne

Why does heaven have gates? Are the inhabitants wary of marauders? Did they take heaven by force and now have to defend it?

At least we now know that heaven is something like a giant golden satellite suspended in space.

MindHacker9009:
While your organisation now has $1.45 billion in assets.

Well, Mr. Accountant don’t you know that Jesus needs a War Chest? Space faring flying horses cost money. Heavenly hosts of the finest angels cost money. Angel food, flaming swords, and other equipment cost money. Have you seen the rate of inflation lately?!!

triplechoice:
The story is an allegory that encapsulate certain moral truth. It shouldn't be taken as a literal account of something that happened in the past.

What is the encapsulated “moral truth” of the allegory?

triplechoice:
It's only religious fundamentalist, who due to indoctrination, take it as something that actually happened.

Most moderate Christians know the story for what it is; an allegory. But they won't admit it openly.

What is a moderate Christian? Are there levels of severity in Christianity?

If it’s an allegory, what is the “original sin” that Jesus supposedly died for to forgive and them? If the naked simpletons didn’t literally eat a fruit and Hebrew god didn’t get angry, why did the ghost impregnate the virgin in order to give birth to the sacrificial lamb?
Is Jesus also an allegory? What do s he symbolize?

phatriqk:
I like to think the garden of Eden was situated somewhere in Africa, and possible the Sahara desert, it just mere assumptions though out of curiosity.

It was Mars. When they got kicked out of the garden, the garden and the planet dried up and became red to signify the defection of that great red dragon, the devil. The four rivers were given earthly names to make the story more familiar to humans in their new abode.

Righteousness2:
Typhoon POUNDS Japan
Hurricane SLAMS Puerto Rico
Earthquakes ROCK Taiwan & Mexico
All in less than 6 days.

We are living in perilous times. The nations of the earth are being shaken. It's from one natural disaster after another, as JESUS Christ prophesied would happen in the last days before His second coming.

If you are yet to surrender your life to the Lordship of JESUS Christ! Now is an opportunity to do it. The next Moment is not Guaranteed

[b][/b]
Get your life in order. The Coming of JESUS Christ is Here.

How is that slow moving natural disaster called malaria in your neck of the woods. The brain damage it causes is an ongoing natural disaster and you are an example.

RoyalDiadems:
May the Lord save your soul.

The lord saved his soul then sold it to me, the Harvester of Souls. Your soul is next on my list.

Wilgrea7:
The whole idea of “Christian atheism" seems a tad bit ironical to me

How exactly does one discard the belief in a God based on the bible, and yet accept the belief in a devil?

Even when I was a Christian, one of the first concepts i got rid of while deconverting was the idea of an antagonist devil.

Christian atheism is nonsense. They are the ones who reject the notion of the Christian/Jewish god while assuming Jesus was real and a "good moral teacher". They are monumentally wrong like the normal christians because if you take the magical nonsense out of the story of jesus, all you are left with is a megalomaniacal cult leader with some trite moral principles who is also prone to anger and belligerence when challenged about his claims. He is also psychotic enough to threaten the weakminded with torture in hell if they doubt his "godship".

The "christian values" they think they subscribe to are just humanitarian values that can be found in all cultures. The jesus character is also overrated as a moral teacher. An example is the story of the attempted stoning of the "adulterous" woman when Jesus said "he without sin cast the first stone". How about stop stoning each other like wild savages? The person who wrote the bullshit story couldn't fathom that?