sino:


With this work, You fit get the six packs wey you dey been look for o

nb: sisters are looking for brothers with six packs nowadays o

Akhee, leave matter for matthias jare. No sister would prefer six packs to a 6 digits monthly salary or six cars except she is the daughter of a body builder.

So lemme hit the books and hit the ideas that would be bring money

AlBaqir:


# Wallahi.

Qur'an says concerning the word of an infallible Prophet:

Surah Yusuf, Verse 53:

"And I do not declare myself free, most surely (man's) self is wont to command (him to do) evil, except such as my Lord has had mercy on, surely my Lord is Forgiving, Merciful."


# The fact that not every self is the recipient of that mercy, I believe many other things a put in place as gift to weaker souls. Here's an Hadith sahih in both Sunni and Shia books:

Imam Tabari documents:

"....

Al-Hakam said: " `Ali, may Allah be pleased with him, said: `If `Umar, may Allah be pleased with him, had not forbidden
mut'ah, none would have committed zina except a wretched person."

# I think am done on this thread unless my attention is called again.

Thanks for your time and maturity display. May Allah bestow you more wisdom.

Wa Salam alaykum

Wallah, I really get the aspect you are driving from, our souls aren't at the same level and same is our urges and control over lower desires.

You are most welcome dear akhee.

Allahumo ameen. I pray the same for you too


Wa alaykum Salaam Warahmatulah Wabarokatuh

Empiree:
And there many out there offering this common prayer "May God grant you your desires". Chai, sometimes i don't know if to say ameen to that du'a. I get confused.


BTW, Yoruba self get rich language coined in Arabic and English. "DESIRE" perfectly worded in yoruba "disaya" Di Si Aya still gives the same meaning. Incredible!

Stop joor, disaya is used for physical attributes (a woman's chest) and not the same with desire. Or am I missing something??

sino:

One of the narrations states castration was what brought about the necessity for the permission, you would agree with me that castration is an extreme action to take, since sex itself isn't haram in itself. One of the narration also depicts a reasoning which a sahabah brought to explain the permission and prohibition by the Prophet (SAW).

"....Ibn Shihab said. Khalid b. Muhajir b. Saifullah informed me: While I was sitting in the company of a person, a person came to him and he asked for a religious verdict about Mut'a and he permitted him to do it. Ibn Abu 'Amrah al-Ansari (Allah be pleased with him) said to him: Be gentle. It was permitted in- the early days of Islam, (for one) who was driven to it under the stress of necessity just as (the eating of) carrion and the blood and flesh of swine and then Allah intensified (the commands of) His religion and prohibited it (altogether)..." (Sahih Muslim)

Castration is indeed an extreme case but it begs the question akhee, for how long was these sahabahs away from their wives that they were thinking about castrating themselves? Truth be told, one loves intimacy a lot, I think a or 2 weeks expedition shouldn't make any man think of castrating himself. Castration has NO cure faah.

Secondly, if mut'ah is for necessity like eating swine and alcohol, these two things are still necessities when the need arises but mut'ah isn't anymore?

sino:
All in all, the prohibition still stands.

Yes, no sunni argues this.

sino:

Well, he should be able to get you one who has been alive since the time of Ibn Abbas (ra), but i understand if you are scared sha

Scared ke? Do you know the meaning of my name, Zubayr? It means courageous. "Lako mo wa ni ibon"

sino:

Perhaps, and it is also possible that it was a pre-islamic practice as some claim based on history.

This is a wild guess unless you can provide evidences for it. There is no record of mut'ah during pre Islamic period that I know of.

sino:
Yeah, Umar (ra) kept terrifying and tormenting them even after he died

His ghost

sino:
Of course it is haram, reason I am quite amazed as to the huge promotion by the twelver shi'as who are the only group who still believe it is permitted till now, and that should raise a red flag, as well as the supposed "abuse" within their community.

Maybe and maybe not.

sino:
I watched a documentary on bbc, were they interviewed a transgender who sells his body for money in the name of mut'ah. I am not swayed by AlBaqir's arguments, because the reality and information from their books and scholars are in contradiction.

Reality and books can be in contradictions many times. Suicide bombers and the Qu'ran are in contradictions, what people see is not what is stated in the Qur'an. Same can be said with polygamy to some extent.

sino:

Here is an example:

"Salamun Alaykum,

The following question was kindly answered by Mulla Asgher.

Regards

Abbas Jaffer
Moderator - 'Aalim Network

--------------------------------------------------------------

Question:

Is it haram for a woman to make a living at mutah by marrying a man for a short period, receiving a mahr, then observing iddah and marrying another man for a short period and so on so that she is married to say half a dozen men in the year? If it is haram what makes it haram if she is observing the rules for mutah properly? And if it is not haram, does she deserve to be condemned as immoral (or do the men who marry her deserve that)?

----------------------------------------------------------------

Answer:

It is not haram for her to make a living in this way if she follows the rules of Sharia properly. Nor does she deserve to be condemned. This also applies to the men who marry her.

Wasalaam"

In all narrations, the Nabi NEVER made mut'ah a form of profession, because people have turned it into a profession doesn't make it right.

sino:

I don't know how you would understand the above, but it's very disturbing! By the way this would mean this woman would have to be in a place easily accessible to the men (are they on expedition? or maybe they are on travel...), so as to contract mut'ah with her, I wonder why we should condemn prostitution, if the above is allowed in Islam?!

Wallah, very disturbing but yet it is not a yardstick to judge the prescription in the books. The above has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the deen of Islam. You don't turn a necessity to a business making venture.

sino:

Arabs are known for their perversion, Islam came to restructure their lives, I have close relatives who have mentioned how perverted some of them can be even during the month of hajj... The reason why I said the duration of the expedition is irrelevant, the Prophet (SAW) was among them during those periods, he had better information and the divine wisdom to permit it, and I would aslo trust that divine wisdom, especially when it correlates with the Ideals Islam came to preach, when he prohibited it forever!

The Qur'an even exposed their perversion when they broke the law of 'no sex' during the nights of Ramadan. But their perversion is outta this world ooo So mut'ah is only for Arabs?!

sino:

AlBaqir mentioned that mut'ah is a solution to widows and divorced women, but he also mentioned that women can control their desires better than men, so it is still not a solution for these women, because what they need is a father figure for their children and a man to take care of their needs, but if the children keep seeing different men come in and out severally, what would that be teaching them?! And if she doesn't have children, how would changing men like clothes help her find security and comfort?!

There are so many baggage that comes with this mut'ah, but I guess it doesn't matter, once the men's desires are satisfied, it all good and dandy!

See logic! This analysis of yours made sense, and I have no reply.

sino:
Wa anta, jazakallah khayran, many thanks.

Ameen, most welcome.

AlBaqir:


# Nah! You deserve the thanks. The thread was going in circles and getting derailed and insane but you've put sanity back to it.

AlBaqir:

# Obviously.

# @underline, just like every Muslim woman knows her husband can decided to take in another wife, a shia woman knows and very much aware her husband can perform Mut'ah when there's a need for him to.

Case closed if she is aware of it, then in that case, she can't feel cheated.

AlBaqir:

* The truth is in those two scenario, even if the woman grumbles and protest, it doesn't stop the man. And at the end women usually gbaf'Olohun setting condition, "at least he should make sure am getting my normal attention and rights".

Exactly. A woman who is aware of the permissibility of her husband to marry more than one should be prepared that he may marry at any time. Same with a shi'i woman as regards, grumbling won't stop that.

AlBaqir:

# Ìjà ò dé, o npe rare l'okunrin (fight/war hasn't come, and you are bragging you are a man). Every man (especially the married that have tasted sex) can only access himself at that long time of sex absence when that biological force overtakes him.

* Islam doesn't judge or legislate its laws based on the strongest but the weakest.

True

AlBaqir:
* While in the absence of your wife(s), how much is the % of your sexual urge (sincerity) that makes you feel you need Mut'ah? Am afraid there's no meter to measure this if you consider:

And Allah is Knower of what is in the breasts of men.

AlBaqir:
1. Hadith exists that talks about some sahabah intending castration. Is that a measure? No.

2. Hadith exists that says Nabi just ORDERED it without anyone complaining any necessity.

All in all, one needs to train himself physically and spiritually but the truth is everybody cannot be that good. Imagine the initial legislation of Ramadan fasting of "no sex at night for 1 month" yet some sahabah were secretly having sex perse perse with their wives until Allah exposed them, and lifted the restraint. ..........

May Allah bless you for the bold. And Ramadan was ONLY for a month o. Allah Mustaan

AlBaqir:

Finally, sex is one of the siffat (attribute) of our animal self. It weakens our real self (ruh) from its spiritual development (except for those whose ruh have reached a stage it cannot be draw back anymore). According to the experts of irfan, this is where ghusl is very very important to lift the ruh.

You are right, it has no respect for anyone. I was telling a brother that it is not about "I am an Hafiz of the Qu'ran" when you are alone with a lady. All those of the Quran would fly away from your head (even the verses of Zina) EXCEPT if Allah has bestowed His mercy upon you. May Allah safeguard our Imaan and make us not to be slaves to our lower desires (Aamen)

sino:


Of course I get you, are you doubting the authenticity of the narrations that stated the Prophet (SAW) prohibited it too?! It is established that it was forbidden by the Prophet (SAW), therefore, such practice remains forbidden. You should read all the narrations that speaks on prohibition, you would then see that Ibn Abbas's opinion cannot be substantiated with regards to permission due to necessity. The reason why necessity makes some haram permissible, is to save lives, and abstaining from sex isn't life threatening. The categorical prohibition from the Prophet (SAW) using the word forever, made it sealed, and not to be revisited again, no matter the number of wars and expeditions that may come.!

No need dragging this over and over. It is not about doubting the narrations, you and Baqir have tackled the hadith traced to Ali and I don't wanna start the saga again.

@bold, if sex isn't life threatening, then how is it a necessity in the first instance? If those sahabahs didn't had sex then, will they die ni?

sino:

Empiree is there for you na, "wan ni awon ruhaniyah lowo" !

Ruhaniyyah can't travel to the other world

sino:


The narrations available stated this, They did mut'ah with garment, cloak or even dates, these are things. The Prophet (SAW) permitted them to do mut'ah as stated, the cases were peculiar, and afterwards, he forbade them never to do it again. So yes, you may say the Prophet (SAW) authenticated it for those peculiar cases...!

Understood

sino:

If you read through all the narrations of mut'ah, what is most prominent is the permission being granted, you don't grant permission for something new, you tell them that this is new, unlike what you know of before, and this is how to go about it. Does it make sense to tell someone go and do something in which the person is ignorant of?! Wouldn't this person ask relevant questions?! Mut'ah is mut'ah, it was allowed for peculiar reasons and then forbidden permanently.!

What you are insinuating is that the Prophet has taught them about mut'ah before and that's why they didn't ask questions??

sino:

Continuation of a practice after being prohibited isn't something special that should cause doubts, a case of a companion drinking alcohol was reported, do we now say wine isn't prohibited?! Yes there are reports of such, but also Umar (ra) reiterated the prohibition and no companion challenged him. This means they all agreed that it was prohibited!!

They didn't challenge because they were probably 'afraid' of him

sino:

Bro, I do not shy away from stating facts, the Prophet (SAW) permitted those who were requesting to castrate themselves to do mut'ah giving a garment according to one of the narrations on mut'ah. The Prophet (SAW) new better and gave the permissions, and within this divinely inspired wisdom, he (SAW) prohibited it forever!!

No problem o, we will going in circles ni.

sino:

I understand you bro, it really doesn't matter if you do not see any correlation between the two, it still doesn't change the fact that the Prophet (SAW) prohibited mut'ah.!

"Understood"

sino:

If necessity was what permitted mut'ah in the first instance (you should read all the narrations on permission), which made the cases peculiar, then the permission wasn't making zina lawful. It should be noted that there is no authentic narration that claimed sahabas did mut'ah during the time of the Prophet (SAW) when they were at home, nor any narration stating that the Prophet (SAW) told them when, where and how to do mut'ah. However, since mut'ah was prohibited by the Prophet (SAW), such actions automatically falls under zina, since it becomes illegal sexual relations.!

Nobody even made mentioned of mut'ah at home, Baqir even said it is haram!

sino:

I was speaking generally and particularly on the claim of continuous permission of mut'ah. The women were not with the Prophet (SAW), so the cases of permission were peculiar.!

Understood

sino:


I do not have the details of how long those expeditions were, but I think it is irrelevant, since we know that the permission wasn't due to the duration of the expedition, rather it was due to some sahabah wanting to castrate themselves. Regardless, Islam frowns at being away from your spouse for a protracted period of time, it can be a basis for divorce. So to use the excuse of being away from your wife for long holds no water!!

Irrelevant? Really akhee? If the expedition was three days, do you think the Prophet would legislate mut'ah? The permission should have something to do with the duration. Why will a man want to castrate himself because he missed his wife just 6days or 7days or even 2 weeks? Is sex food for him ni?

sino:
Ma sha Allah!

Thanks for your replies and time akhee. Jazakumullah khairan

sino:


This is absolutely hilarious

Lanre pele ku ise o!

Shebi na you gimme work

AlBaqir:


# One websites opens its article thus:

"An old joke observes that 98 percent of people masturbate--and the other 2 percent are lying. But
according to a recent study based on a representative
sample of American adults, only 38 percent of women
said they'd masturbated at all during the past year. The
figure for men was 61 percent"
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/all-about-sex/200903/how-common-is-masturbation-really


# Masturbation Facts and Statistics
https://www.statisticbrain.com/masturbation-statistics/

* But the truth is statistics are usually based on those who admitted to the truth. Millions couldn't come out to admit.

# Here's another interesting research:
Sexual Desire in Women
Sexual desire in females is both more complex and more
fragile than it is in males— less tied to biology, more
linked to psychology. It is generally more variable; related to how they feel about themselves, what is going on in their lives, to say nothing of a partner's lovemaking style.
But experts agree that, in general, sexual desire is lower
among females than among males, so a drop in female
desire for any reason may be more problematic in
relationships.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/basics/low-sexual-desire/sexual-desire-in-women

# @underline^^, Compare to that of men which is a pure biological force.
https://www.psychologies.co.uk/love/wise-words-esther-perel-on-sex-and-relationships-3.html


# Anyway, let's even assume that masturbation is higher in women compare to their male counterparts. The question would be why?

* USUALLY, man is bold enough to seek and demand sex to the extent of rape. On the other hand, USUALLY, women do not have that boldness therefore save haven might be masturbation.

Thanks for the statistics. Really appreciate.

AlBaqir:

# Obviously, according to Qur'an, there's excellent reward for patience.

Naam

AlBaqir:

# As per awareness, generally man do not need permission of his wife to marry either second or more wife, or engage in Mut'ah.

He may not need her permission, but she would be certainly aware that her husband is taking a new wife even if it is at the last minute. Will the wife aware as regards mut'ah?

AlBaqir:

# I think this is answered by some of the post above: men are usually being drive by biological force far powerful than women.

# However, there are lots of men that do and that can control their desires over long period of time. Its just that some cannot.

But how will we know the truthful ones from the insincere ones? Almost impossible, the same way we can't know the man who is sincere with polygamy or not. I hope you get the drift.

AlBaqir:

# Sugarmummy/sugar daddy is a social problem associated with our society just like the Christian or western or communist society averse to multiple marriage and see a man that practice it as "slave of sex or unfaithfulness" despite the fact that promiscuity, formication and adultery is prevalent in their midst.

# Environment where Mut'ah is known and being practiced, nobody sees it as "sugar mummy/sugar daddy thing". Islam does not hide, fear or shy in its laws to the believers.

Thanks for replies. Really appreciate your time.

Empiree:
not even tea but beans loun loun

I won't even remember to brush my teeth, needless to use deodorant. Just me and my uniform.....Ere eee


I won't allow village people to 'do me'

You even remember food?!

No food, no tea nothing. Just put on a T shirt and a knicker, then off I go

Empiree:
O ya akh lanrexlan, go dig up his qabr

I am not muscular enough to be digging grave

You remind of the Winchester boys (Supernatural Series). This is one of the works, digging graves and burning bodies to stop ghosts and vengeful spirits.

Empiree:
You grabbed my point. This is what i was telling him all along based on evidences presented Hence, it can not zina by definition standard.

Yes, it can become Zina by the situations, circumstances and the people who practised it during or after the demise of the Nabi. So comparison with alcohol or pork is out of it

sino:


I do not agree with Ibn Abbas (ra), indeed, the reason for permissions during the life of the Prophet (SAW) were peculiar, but Ibn Abbas was challenged, even if he opined that he meant permissible in such situation as documented during the life of the Prophet (SAW).

You are still not getting the point. I quite agreed that the reason for its permissions were peculiar. But ask you akhee, weren't there tons of wars and expeditions after the demise of the Nabi? When the needs (wars and expeditions) arose again then, is it permissible to perform mut'ah?

sino:

@ bold, you would have to tell that to Ibn Abbas (ra)...

I need Angel Castiel to teleport me to the time and age of Ibn Abass in the desert of Arabia.

sino:

We work with what can be established from the Qur'an and the authentic hadith. If mut'ah was a new legislation, then we ought to have the details from the Qur'an or the Prophet (SAW) himself. From the narrations which showed permission from the Prophet (SAW) did you find any details beyond for a stipulated period and give them something (e.g garment)?! You would see this is not a marriage as sanctioned in the Qur'an, but the companions understood what to do, have you asked yourself, why they never asked the Prophet (SAW) what they should do?!

"Give them something", it sounds like the example you brought as regards Arabs engaging in sex for money. The companions understood what to do because they have been doing it before and the Prophet just authenticated it for them?

If it is not a new legislation, then what is it?

sino:

If a bad man abuses polygamy, or even marriage itself, he would never say Allah and the Prophet (SAW) permitted me to do such and such, but what we find is that shi'ahs practice this their mut'ah and use the Qur'an and the Prophet (SAW) to back up their practice. Even from the narrations from their books (albeit arbitrarily authenticated), there happens to be good reasons to find this practice not being in line with Islamic ideals.

That has always been the bone of contention for ages between Shi'as and Sunnis i.e. Did Mut'ah continue after the demise of the Nabi?

sino:

Arabs were also having sex and giving a token for sex before the advent of Islam...Examples of a new legislation includes how we perform our Nikkah, how we pray, how we dress, etc. all these have explicit details in the Qur'an and the sunnah of the Prophet (SAW). There is nothing new about contracting a temporary "marriage" if the details are not special other that a specified period and a token to be given for the duration.

Akhee, I am afraid this comparison isn't the same. The implication of what you are saying is that the Nabi legislated the "having sex for a token" which the Arabs were already engaged in by commanding mut'ah! That is the meaning of the analogy!

sino:

Why I made reference to wine is because it wasn't deemed haram from the onset, it was permitted (not explicitly), and companions during the early part of Islam drank, even the Qur'an states that there is good in it although the bad is more. Then it was finally prohibited. Such can also be said of mut'ah, the Prophet (SAW) permitted it, and then he forbade it.

Wine was already widespread among the Arabs. They were drunkards among them before the 'advent' of Islam. Allah NEVER made alcohol permissible for them, they were already in the mess. In order not to make them 'run away' from Islam at the start, that's why the prohibition was in stages.

Mut'ah isn't the same with that. No record of any one performing mut'ah before the the first legislation. Moreover, mut'ah wasn't prohibited in stages. I see NO correlation whatsoever between alcohol prohibition and the acclaimed mut'ah prohibition!

sino:

It is zina, once it is established, the Prophet (SAW) prohibited it, such relationship is no longer recognized in the shari'ah, for evidences:

Allah (SWT) says:
"And those who guard their private parts

Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they are not to be blamed

But whoever seeks beyond that, then they are the transgressors" (Qur'an 70:29-31)

This above verse stands till the last day, your wives, and those your right hand possesses(slaves), mut'ah women are not mentioned here, or in any other verse like the above in the Qur'an!

What about before the prophet prohibited it? So in essence, Zina was made lawful before the Nabi forbade it?

sino:

What is impartial is to let men enjoy themselves as much as they want, and tell the woman (especially the married) to remain chaste, what about when the urges come for them too? What about the single men at home who have urges too?! But Allah (SWT) is the Just, Allah (SWT) says:

"And let those who find not the financial means for marriage keep themselves chaste, until Allah enriches them of His Bounty." (Qur'an 24:33)

Do you know the implication of what you wrote?! It means the Nabi was impartial for legislating mut'ah during those occasions as narrated in the Ahadith! I only inferred from your submission akhee unless you are referring to those practising mut'ah without at home without any just cause to justify it.

Is polygamy impartial?!

sino:
Also as quoted above, Allah (SWT) instructs us to guard our private parts against illegal sexual intercourse except with our wives and slaves, if you do not have any of such, then you remain chaste! Moreover, it is legislated for a married man not to be away from his wife for a long period of time, leaving her hanging, so expeditions are meant to be periodic.

I never argued this. Expeditions are periodic, so was the legislation of mut'ah during the lifetime of the Nabi. I am curious, what was the longest duration of those expeditions and wars in which mut'ah was made permissible?

sino:

Alhamdulillah, the family is fine. Allahuma Ameen, many thanks.

Alhamudulilah

Empiree:

Empiree:
Zero he made. He and mr.olai only know how to copy paste without meaningful contributions. This only puts me off. That's why i was never interested in Mut'h topics until this one. DOnt know why i am so much interested in thread. This thread made me aware of the details of mut'ah due to my approach to kick out unnecessary rants like mr.olai. He left bcus he had nothing to offer academically, but to post pics and download nonsense from net

Don't mind those robots, always attacking the messenger and not the message. Products of blind followership.


@bold, it is 'imisi' from awon Ruhaniyahs

sino:

The right question is, who were these sahabah?! Do you have their names?! I had already brought possible explanations for those mentioned, some were wrongly mentioned like Asma bint Abu Bakr (ra), Ibn Abbas (ra), explained himself in another narration using eating Pork as an example. The most notable case is Amr Ibn Hurayth (ra), and his case can easily be explained as being ignorant of the prohibition. Since we do not have the list of these tabi'een and Makkan jurists, and we do not know whether they knew for sure about this prohibition, and for the fact that one of them who was named, Ibn Jurayj, retracted his "fatwa" after he had permitted it, indicating the possibility of acquiring new knowledge which must have facilitated his retraction, all points to ignorance as an excuse.


So if they were aware of the prohibition made by the prophet (saw), or that reiterated by Umar (ra), and still went ahead to practice mut'ah, then they were wrong, but before I can say that for sure, i must have incontrovertible evidence(s) that they knew of these prohibitions already mentioned.

The opinion of Ibn Abbas here is that mutah is only to be performed in situations that are similar to the situations in which mutah was first made permissible. Will you agree with this stance of Ibn Abass? And the pork argument doesn't fly akhee.

But how would they be unaware of the prohibition if mut'ah was prohibited at the battle of Khaybar?! Where many Muslims participated?!

sino:


The narration is still the same as the one that mentioned expedition, and mentioned "we had no women with us" possibly indicating their wives... I was not the one who said it is only for married men, I only asked pertinent questions as who and who should qualify to participate in mut'ah. Qur'an had already stated what singles who are unable to marry should be patient, hence if they are to go into mut'ah, then there would be an explicit verse that would give a clear indication of this permission, not to mention other authentic narration advising young singles to engage in fasting so as to reduce their sexual urge... If mut'ah is a continuous permission, I'm afraid people would not get married, especially in this harsh financial conditions, since you have no obligation to your female mut'ah partner, even if she gets pregnant. You should note that these conditions are not stated in the Qur'an or by the Prophet (SAW), but still we are to believe it was a new legislation?!

"Possibly", well let us agree on the first sentence. Secondly, if these conditions weren't stated in the Qur'an, on what conditions did the Prophet permitted the companions to engage in it? Or the command was just that "Go and perform mut'ah and give the woman her mahr". Without the waliy of the lady, without an witness?

@the bold is also my fear. People will certainly hide behind it and abuse it but many things have been abused in our society today, even polygamy isn't spared.

sino:

Well, personally, i see mut'ah as the kind of "permission" given to drinking wine before it was totally prohibited. Ibn Abbas (ra) brought the explanation using pork. As I have already asked those who claim it is in the Qur'an, to present details of this new legislation instead of using semantics, but no such information can be found in the Qur'an, the best gotten from the Prophet (SAW) is the permission to do mut'ah for a stated period of time, after which he forbade it.

Drinking of wine was widespread among the Arabs even before the advent of the Prophethood of Muhammed (Peace upon him and his household) and they were cases of Sahaabahs who were drinking. So that's why Allah made the prohibitions in stages. Allah NEVER gave anyone the permission to drink to wine (except for necessity) rather wine consumption was one of the vices rampant among Arabs then.

So I am afraid mut'ah doesn't fit in cos it seems to be a 'new legislation' which was allowed at least on two occasions.

sino:

The reason why it is a sin is because we have authentic hadith that states the Prophet (SAW) prohibited it. So it is haram to participate in mut'ah, and it is going against the Prophet (SAW), which is going against Allah (SWT). I have already explained the cases of the sahabah and tabi'een above.

So if it is a sin, what's the huddud for it? What should be the punishment imposed on a man found practising mut'ah? Is it the punishment doted out to fornicators and fornicatresses?! Lesser or multiplied?! I would love to see evidences.

sino:

The Prophet (SAW) does not speak of his own desire or opinion on religious matter, thus I believe that permission of mut'ah during those cases as established in authentic narrations is valid, and when authentic narrations also stated clearly of the Prophet (SAW) prohibition forever, that then becomes the final legislation sanctioned by shar'ah on mut'ah, so it will take more than speculations and assumptions and theories to overrule this facts. If you can't find mut'ah in the Qur'an, nor can you find its details, then it was never part of the Qur'an! Allah (SWT) the all wise, made the permission through the words of His messenger, and thereafter prohibited it once it served its purpose.

So what you are saying in essence is that the main purpose of mut'ah was to serve the sexual urges of men of war on expedition. But akhee, there were tons of wars and expeditions after the demise of the Nabi. So how would you expect soldiers and men on expeditions at that time to fulfill their sexual urges? Don't you think it's impartial?

sino:
PS: Assalam alaykum bro, how have you been?!

Wa alaykum Salaam Warahmatulah Wabarokatuh dearest akhee, Alhamudulilah I have been fine by Allah's mercy. How are you and your beloved family? May Allah's mercy always abide with you (Aamen)

AlBaqir:


# 1. The truth is the same sexual urge that drove those sahabah to the point of contemplating castrating themselves is the same till Qiyamat. So, Yes this age and time still needs it.

# 2. Obviously, there's absolutely nothing meritorious like permanent Nikkah. Observe mut'ah is designed for a purpose at specific place and time, therefore it's not about "why can't we use the money for permanent nikkah". Mut'ah becomes haram for a resident with all the capability to do permanent marriage yet refuse to and hiding under Mut'ah. Kindly see my post on the conditions and guidelines to Mut'ah practice (on this thread).

I understand your point of view but it is indeed saddening that nowadays to see residents with capacity to marry engaging in it. They see mut'ah as an avenue to have intimacy with just a payment and since many aren't ready to father a baby, they go for this 'cheap escape', i.e. sex and just pay.

AlBaqir:
# The truth is Islam made women sacrifice more than their husband. Imagine a man is entitled to marry up to 4 wives + several concubines yet woman has no such luxury.

* Is this injustice? Islam comes out with certain philosophical arguments:

1. GENERALLY man's sexual desires is far higher than woman's. And while woman's urge EVENTUALLY weakens or dies at certain age bracket, man's don't till death comes. While it is GENERALLY easier for women to control her sexual feelings, men generally finds it difficult to do same (hence 99% of cases of sexual harassment and rape, men are chief culprits).

@bold, that is why baba 70 also want to marry omoge 23years, baba wants to 'renew' blood

You are right to some extent but on the aspect of women being able to control their sexual desires more, I don't quit agree unless you can back it up proofs. If I am not wrong, I think masturbation is more rampant among the female folks (Though I wish I could find stats for this).

AlBaqir:

2. For a woman to have two husband at a time will not only constitute problems and danger but also is GENERALLY seen as immoral in every society. The case is not for men.

Saheeh, except some crazy countries.

AlBaqir:

3. Can leads to wrong Child(ren)'s ownership

Therefore, in truth women endured more because they have tendency and capacity to endure, and their reward is far far higher than that of men.

Agreed.

AlBaqir:

Shia have ahadith about every pain a pregnant woman undergo equivalent to the stage of Jihad. Think about that in line with a woman that misses her husband while Ògá adé have luxury of Mut'ah or even the formulated Misyar nikkah to ease himself.

So will the woman (the wife) be rewarded for her patience while Ògá adé is busy playing 'away match'?? Secondly, will the wife be aware that Ògá adé is 'lamoshuaging' another woman outside? Will she be carried along as regards the mut'ah marriage?

If not, then I don't think this comparison with polygamy is 100% in line with mut'ah

AlBaqir:


Consider the following:

1. A Muslim soldier or a businessman, sailors etc out within the reach of his wife(s), and the beast came calling and uncontrollable. What is Islamic solution to it?

* Shia says MUT'AH

* Some Sunni says "nikkah with intention of divorce".

* Other Sunnis says fasting.

NB: While fasting can work for some, it absolutely cannot for others. Even sahabah led by Umar broke the rules of "do not have sex during Ramadan night" before Allah then grant them the permission. So, we are left with either Mut'ah or Misyar.

I think if the wife of soldiers and sailors can endure the sexual urge emanated from missing their spouses, why shouldn't the husband also ready to make the same sacrifice since it is just for a short period?! For the sake of Allah and the sake of love!

AlBaqir:

2. A divorcee or widow with for example 4 - 5 children, not even ready of going back into any so-called marriage which is usually gonna be polygamous. All she thinks now is herself and proper upkeep of her children. And as human being, nature demands once in a while. What is Islam solution to her problem?

Now in this case, who will she contract mut'ah with?! A married man or an unmarried man?! Sincerely, her case will just turn to a sugarmumsy case faah.


Thanks for your reply

Kaytixy:
Albaqir uncle ajala the story teller. He can tell lie lie story just to buttress his point. We all know you except for the new comers here. Don't worry just continue telling yourself lie and those that would believe you. Kai kai kai, I degbe for you ooo

Have you ever made any contribution that is meaningful on this thread?!

6 pages and yet no conclusion?! The thread has been derailed already.

@sino, few questions for you.

1) All those sahaabahs who performed mut'ah during the lifetime of the Nabi, after his demise and some tabi'een were they wrong or ignorant of the hadith of the Prophet prohibiting it?

2) You said mut'ah is only a necessity for those soldiers during war or an expedition but there is an hadith that says some companions said WE WERE YOUNG........... .If mut'ah was meant for married men who have no access to their spouses, what about unmarried young men? Why did the Nabi recommend mut'ah for them? Why not fasting?

3) If mut'ah is akin to eating pork, we know unlawful becomes lawful at the time of necessity and a person is ONLY ALLOWED to take what will cure/satisfy his hunger at that time WITHOUT taking extra along. If mut'ah is similar to eating of pork, is a person who practised mut'ah only allowed to have intimacy that would his sexual urges? Like 1minute or how would we measure that?

4) You said that the mut'ah during the time of the Prophet wasn't a sin but the mut'ah today is a sin. Does that include all those mut'ah marriages practised by the companions and tabe'een after the death of the Nabi? If it was to be sin, is it major sin or minor sin?

5) You said that

sino: The evidences being put forward that the verse is about mut'ah is not traced to the Prophet (SAW)

Do you think the Nabi would legislate something like nikkah (whether temporary or permanent) without a verse to back it up??



Now to AlBaqir, these are your questions.

1) Do you think we need Mut'ah in this age and time? The money one would used in contracting mut'ah, why can't the person use it in contracting the permanent nikkah?

2) Females who are married have sexual urges too when their husbands aren't at home. How do you expect them to fulfill their urges lawfully? Count ceilings?

3) Do you think we still have the conditions that warrant mut'ah now?



Thanks to you both in advance for answering the questions. No questions for Empiree, he doesn't believe in both mut'ah and misyar. Baba is just here for academic purposes and to 'oversee' the affairs.

Rilwayne001:
May the blessings and mercy of Allah abide by us and our family all through the days of our life and may Allah count us among the dwellers of jannatul firdaus. TaqabaAllahu minna wa minkum.

Cc: Empiree, demmzy15, friendng, zenymira, Tintingz, lanrexlan, haffaze777, albaqir, carinmom and others

Love you all

Mr Afeez, don't forget my meat o

Demola, safe journey ehn

Eid Mubarak baba nla.

May Allah accept our ibadah

tintingz:
Well I love watching series movies, supernatural is one of my top favorite. Don't stick alone to Sam and Dean adventure, go watch Game of thrones bro.

Supernatural is about to start another series from it franchise, titled: "Wayward sisters" and have you seen Constantine? It is also an occult series just like supernatural.

Nooo, would check those out though.

Thanks.

AhluSunnah:
Laughing . . when you guys die, i pray you die as a muslim..

There are important burning issue in the ummah and here you are, busy distributing hell fire ticket like person that is doing promo.


Is Jahanaam your inherited property ni?

inagbe1:
Your description has said it all,may Allah bless you.Islam is being endangered and eroded by this supposed salafiyah ideology which is being used to bamboozle and radicalize a lot of people.Is it not ridiculous that the promoters of that extreme ideology are planning to build a beach that women in bikini can be tolerated?

Ameen dear brother and you too.


Wallah, the ideology is sickening. I remember when I was practising this ideology, that time I can't think. It was like my brain was blocked.

When I gained admission into the university then, the core salafi brothers told us in our orientation programme that matriculation gown is bidiah and it is not proper to wear it cos the prophet never wore and it resembles the attire of choristers in churches.


Na so, the mumu lanrexlan then (poor me, what blocked my brain ) collected gown I paid for with my money and kept it, avoided the matriculation ceremony like a plague.



Whenever I recall the incident, I feel I cheated my intellect. I just blind followed what someone told me without verifying.

To Saudi Arabia issue, if you should tell these people, they would tell you that Saudi Arabia issue has always be political and what they are doing has nothing to do with Islam.

Funny people

Sissie:
This is where dogmatism has lead us to.

Uktee, I swear blind followership is a disease. If you should meet with these set of people in the real world, you would be amazed at how they talk and do things.


You will keep wondering if these guys think at all.

Allah in many verses of the Qur'an would say "Afala taqilun(Don't you think?)" To them sheeples, if it their sheik doesn't agree with a certain stand, then they follow blindly on that.

Empiree:
You would recall when I used to tell him to take his criticisms easy on awliya and shuyukh that he doesn't favor, and also to leave sufi ppl alone. He said 'I will not leave them alone and I will never take knowledge from them....abadan".

He didn't realize Ahlusunnah was around the corner (watching) to give him his own Tylenol

God knows who else will come after Ahlusunnah himself

And I was laughing really hard on ikupakuti's post last night. That was funny

"People that live in glass house shouldn't throw stones".
He carried salafism for head not knowing someone with higher ranking is coming

Power pass power my brother.


Nobody should come after him o. We had already had enough of the comedy, we need productive discussion and not takfeering that won't add to the Ummah.

Ikupakuti nearly bust my tummy with that. "Ijebu ideology"

AlBaqir:


# Why did I read this while I'm eating èfó aláta?! Ata don come out of my nose now.

My brother, abeg no vex o. The thing just look like comedy to me ni faah.

I could recall that Ahlusunnah was once looking for a salafi plumber . A Sufi plumber is haram

tintingz:
Brother you watch Game of thrones?

No dear brother, I use to hear from friends. (You see that I can't even spell it correctly )

I learnt it is very interesting but I am afraid would get addicted to it. So I refrained from it and stick to the only series I am watching (Supernatural of course )

ikupakuti:


Tell them, loud it They should go & face their heavenly sent nightmare

IF it was a sufi or a shia creating all those threads by ahlsunnah, all those salafi maggots would have being crawling all over the place, flooding everywhere with albani said this, uthemeen spoke that, bn baz decreed those,

Now this guy is an offshoot of their ijebu aqeeda, they avoided him like plague coz they use the same manhaj but his own is unadultrated

We don wait tire them no show face

@bold, I take God beg you, when making comments be considerate of the people reading the comments faah.


Imagine a scenario when you are just laughing or smiling at your phone, people might think e don dey body small small na

Salafis are being paid in their own coins. Owo Abu ni a fi n se Abu lalejo

Empiree:
but they said your are not a salaf why are you forcing yourself into it

This thread is doing me jigi jigi

The similitude of this thread is well-explained in this verse.

Surah Al-Baqarah, Verse 113:
وَقَالَتِ الْيَهُودُ لَيْسَتِ النَّصَارَىٰ عَلَىٰ شَيْءٍ وَقَالَتِ النَّصَارَىٰ لَيْسَتِ الْيَهُودُ عَلَىٰ شَيْءٍ وَهُمْ يَتْلُونَ الْكِتَابَ …………………َ

The Jews said that the Christians follow nothing and the Christians said that the Jews follow nothing though they both recite the Scripture.………………


Abdelkabir says Ahlusunnah is not on the manhaj of the salaf and he is an innovator while Ahlusunnah retaliates that Abdelkabir is a kaffir and not a salafi but they are both acclaiming salafism to themselves. Who is on the path of salafs now?

Games of the Throne (Salafi Version), Season 1, Episode 3



I could recall that I once told lexiconkabir that salafism is in grades on a thread then. His own version is Symbian version and here comes Android 7.2 version from the Takfeer master of NL .

This is the definition of water don pass gaari for salafism oo

AlBaqir:


# Wonder shall never end indeed!

A full blown takfiri advising another full blown takfiri of not making takfiri of people What a takfiri brotherly advise!

Sign of End time

sino:
Jazakallahu khairan habiby for sharing your poems, I must say, you are getting really good at this, may Allah ( SWT ) grant you more from His divine treasures ameen.

Ameen Wa anta fajazakallah khairan dear akhee.

I am still learning. You are a mentor sir, just treading your noble footsteps.


Ameen thumma Ameen.

Irony of Life

Life has many times defied Newton's 3rd law of motion,
An action doesn't basically yield equal reaction.
You treat a man like a king giving him all the attention,
While you are only a pawn to reach his destination.


Some will love you not for the man whom you are,
But only as a potion just to heal their broken scar.
Sooner or later, they are gone like a shooting star,
And you become a stranger whom they watch from afar.


O my friend! Do not let that in anyway deter you,
Let your mercy fall ceaselessly like the morning dew.
Giving its refreshing bath and aurora not only to a few,
Even to those who never in an inch deserve it too.

Radiate your love like the rays of the sunlight,
Whose warmth is felt by everyone within its sight.
Know that life is a journey; not a duel nor a fight,
Give many people a ride before your soul finally takes flight.


Lanrexlan

..