₦airaland Forum

If the cost of living is high, per capita income will be high and the number of millionaires will be high but what they own don't really have the value in reality. Remember North Korea has a per capita income of USD 1500 and they eat well, dress well, live in quality houses, drive cars and use smart phones

Fenrir:
Yes fella, thats exactly what im saying
Its exactly what your ancestors said

Prostration was for the pride meeting a woman as a virgin and marrying her as a virgin, there is nothing traditional about yoruba people at all, just narcissistic

Prostration was only for being a womans first husband and her first man not her second anything at all

I am telling you as a Yoruba man that there can be a second wedding for a woman and the groom would still be expected to prostrate. There is no big deal in prostration to the Yoruba. As a young man the normal way to greet your in law is by prostrating

Fenrir:
Fella, fib about it all you want
The truth is the truth and your people do nothing but twist history and misrepresent it

If you cannot do the white cloth tradition you have no right expecting prostration or any part of your particular traditions

Virginity until marriage was common in the past only because most women married as teenagers and even today most teenagers are virgins. Are you now saying if a divorcee is being given out in marriage there will be no ceremony in the past and there will be no prostration?

Kobojunkie:
How many husbands had land? How many women had husbands who could afford to lease lands? Again, stop telling these fantabulous stories, which mainly serve as embellishment and nothing more.🙄🙄🙄

2. They could make palm oil from what? stones? Abeg, cut the bull, o'jare! People like you like to paint pictures of how poverty was not a problem back then, as if the rest of us as stewpid for you.🙄🙄🙄

Even today that Yoruba land has over seventy million people on their land, land is not a problem if you want to farm food crops like cassava and maize and you pay isakole from your produce in the past. You pay nothing up front. Land can only be a problem if you want cash crops. The society was better organized than today's society because they had nothing like unemployment. They were more productive than others because they made their own clothes, furniture, farm tools, jewels, weapons and etc unlike today when almost everything is imported. Nowhere on Earth was better than Yoruba land in the nineteenth century and before. The only way we are better than our ancestors today is because of the gadgets we have access to now which are mostly imported. There was negligible poverty if any so far the crops don't fail.

Kobojunkie:
. That many were farmers did not mean they owned land or had enough to lease the land.

2. And please, let's stop regurgitating what were mostly lies/propaganda. 🙄🙄🙄

Land cant be a problem for you if you want to farm. You can use your husband's land or any vacant land but you will pay isakole. You can make palm oil too as it was women's job after men do the harvesting. Trading was almost totally a women's affair and they controlled the markets. Many women got rich through trading. Madam Tinubu had over 2000 people in her household. Efunsetan Aniwura used to send ships to Brazil

Kobojunkie:
Stop telling lies! 🥱🥱🥱

If all your great grandmas were farmers then what you are saying is that all men were rich enough to own or lease farm land back in the days, something we all know was not true.

Most people had farms in the past. Yoruba women were traders and often the wealthiest people in the land were women. Efunsetan Aniwura of Ibadan comes to mind as well as Madam Tinubu of Lagos. Men were leaders, soldiers, crafts men and sometimes long distance traders etc but there were often more money women than men in Yoruba land. Only that it is unlikely you would be richer than the king sitting atop taxes and most monarchs were men

Fenrir:
And no, a father does not own his children, they are people not property

Daughters have been sexually assaulted by the fathers throughout all tribes histories and alot during covid lockdown because of that attitude

Its a father's responsibility to raise their children and once 21 years old they are free to do whatever they want regardless of what the father says

Nobody exists as an island. We are people because of other people. We belong to our communities and we build on our forebears. If they deposit in you they have a stake in you. This does not mean children are properties nor does it mean they should carry on as if they should consider only themselves when getting married

Fenrir:
Fella, I understand but what you don't understand that those men no right to disrespect people and demand it is done when it is offensive to most cultures in the world

I never its an outright culture but is narcissistic to manipulate and lie about it

Actually get off your backside and do a very very deep dive into the origins of the culture

1) was never about begging, it was never about respect, it was thanks for purity

2) it was never yoruba originally to return the bride price, they started doing that around the 1970s after the civil war

3) they absolutely no right to go around saying who is exempt and who isnt

4) the only they can automatically demand it and expect it is from their own people for their own people

5) they do not value humility and respect if the second a man says no to it they immediately start insulting him and calling him worthless and all the names under the sun and not automatically just drop it

6) respect earns respect its that simple, if an old yoruba only sees a husband for his daughter as worth marrying her by if he will get on his stomach or not then he should make sure his daughter only marries a yoruba man

7) the majority of them will actively try and destroy a relationship if a man is not willing to do it, how can a person get to the age to of 50+ and have the arrogance to judge people in such a petty manner

They are not humble or respectful men because of how they act as soon as the word no about is said, look at that topic about edo boy that agreed to do a full traditional wedding and no one actually told him what it in involved, and the second he learned about it he was sickened by it and respectfully said hes not doing it, how did that family treat him?

There are a few tribes that will not do it for yoruba if they can respect them saying no, then they can respect everyone saying no

It is not only thanks for purity but an acknowledgement that you are taking somebody away from the clan to go and be increasing your own population. No women no next generation. It is also the reason the bride price is shared to the extended family. It is to kind of compensate them for the loss. It is one of Earth's cultures and we should not be preaching against it. All cultures that are not harmful should be preserved. One thing that can also be done is to get people that will prostrate on contract. If a King is getting married for instance he will not prostrate by himself

shaybebaby:
True,in terms of the Nigerian constitution modelled after a system of government that is not African.

We do however, have customary laws (as established by our forefathers) and in some states, Sharia laws which are faith based.

Will there be friction having those 3 frameworks at play at the same time? Yes.

But just because you have lost touch with your customs ( which you are obviously nostalgically harkening back to with your YouTube links) does not mean you get to decide how, why and what relevance it is should be to us.

Not that I disagree with your sentiment as to its relevant in this day and age,however as much as you are allowed your opinions,it is NOT in your place to judge our affairs because you are NOT one of us nor have you earned the right.

What he does not understand is that Yoruba show excessive respect for age. All cultures respect age but Yoruba is excessive. Unless an old person shows self as not worthy the person will be respected in Yoruba land. I don't have a problem with that at all as age is not easy to come by. As a Yoruba you bow down or prostrate to greet random elders and relatives then how much more to someone as old as your father who is giving you a wife?. That is the issue. You may be exempted in some cases but most people just do it even when they are elderly. Remember in Yoruba land a wife is a huge gift because all her children belongs to the husband's family. I don't agree with Fenrir that it is a bad culture. If you don't agree with it you can be excused

One party system

Just like China has the CPC today, the Yoruba had a one party system before colonization. The one party that everybody belonged to was the Ogboni. Every free born belonged to the Ogboni society and the Oba or king was just a hard working figure head working for the Ogboni. The Oba was not accorded any respect during Ogboni meetings and the Ogboni can overrule the Oba on any matter. They can also sack the Oba without ceremony. No Oba will take any important decision without consulting the Ogboni. The highest council of the Ogboni in a Yoruba town or city will be the assembly of family or compound heads. In Oyo, the highest Ogboni council was the seven member Oyo mesi headed by the Bashorun. In Ijesa, it was the Agba Ijesa.
The system ran perfectly for thousands of years and it is surely more efficient than the system of opposition party democracy. Everybody will be very serious and in the same boat. It can however be upgraded by making it elective. Parties can contest elections into the council under the understanding that there must always be a government of national unity no matter the differences in ideology. This is in a way operational in Germany where parties often share power.
Ogboni as a word means expert and the gathering is a gathering of experts. Therefore trade unions with enough financial members should be able to field candidates just like any political party and they should also be able to remunerate the candidates. In the olden days the Ogboni were not paid by the state because they were the state or the owners of the state. They were generally well to do people. In the modern day, any council member that needs to be paid should be paid by the platform that sponsored him or her.

The statistics maybe right. A home that is not worth more than 15000 dollars in Nigeria is worth over 100k dollars in South Africa

Love800:
As at 2022, india has a 1.2billion lower income class out of their 1.4billion population!
What magic did they want to do in order to increase between 2022 and 2025!

India's per capita is 2,878. Very poor!

Countries with above 20,000 per capita are the ones recongnized as a better figure.

Tell me exactly what you need a per capita income of 20k dollars for.

Why Osun is highest is worth researching into. It is a mystery

If you are on your own, the only way to get financial freedom is to scale up what you are doing to be employing many people. You need proper accounting and faithful employees. When you kick off like that investors will later be begging to partner with you. There is no other way.

Solosolojohquay:
I think the story is true that the crown alafin is wearing now was given to him I used to wonder why the late alafin adeyemi always wore (abetiaja cap) during outing why the other lesser king wore their crown same thing is with the new alafin now always on cap I think the only crown the alafin has now is the beaded ancient crown proof me right if am wrong from this perspective is clear to note that ooni is the superior king can you if count the crown of ooni .

The problem is that in the past the most powerful Yoruba states were controlling Ife unlike now that the government is controlling everybody. If we were still using the old system the Ooni would be respected but not feared or obeyed. The person feared or obeyed will be the head of the most powerful state

Babinski:
It is a common historical account that the Ijesa people originally lived in Ile-Ife before migrating to Ilesa and environs. The Ijesa trace their origin to Owa Obokun in some accounts and to Owa Ajibogun in other accounts. Both were said to be sons or grandsons of Oduduwa.

No genuine historical account affirms that Ile-Ife was ever under the protection of Ijesa. Oduduwa is widely agreed as the first Ooni. It is also widely agreed that Ooni is contracted from Oonirisa meaning "owner or custodian of the gods or dieties".

Sorry to say but the "Omo Oluwo ni" story is no more than a feeble and laughable attempt at revisionism.

Of course there were people on Ijesa land before the arrival of Owa Ajibogun. Erinmoje was on Ijesa land. Owa Obokun who is son of the last Oduduwa came from Ile Ife and established a new dynasty and nation state but the land contained people before him. Remember that the last Oduduwa is not more than 1500 years ago and that is quite recent

Babinski:
The "Adimu" story is not supported by established historical accounts. It is highly unlikely that a slave would be elevated to Priest-King status and left in charge of an ancestral kingdom by Oranmiyan going by known Yoruba traditions and culture.

The Ooni is also known as "Arole Oodua" (heir to Oduduwa). It is therefore clear that Oranmiyan as a descendant of Oduduwa would be very unlikely to thrust a slave into the role of an heir to Oduduwa by installing the slave on the throne of Oduduwa.

According to Ijesa account, Oyo has not always been prominent and Ife was at one point mainly under the protection of Ijesa. The Owa Obokun was a son of Oduduwa and when there was civil war in Ile Ife, he quelled the war and said the unborn child of Oduduwa's Oluwo will be made King. Ijesa account says he was the one that impregnated the Oluwo that belonged to his Dad. The child of the Oluwo became the first Ooni. When the kid is regally dressed, people will ask who is this child and they will say Omo Oluwo ni which was contracted to Ooni

aribisala0:
Some things are irrelevant
Whether Old Ife kings were called Ooni or not is not relevant and you simply have no way of knowing that because you were not there

That is just a diversionary argument

Lagos was not always called Lagos so what?

Throwing in random unverifiable claims does not advance the argument
Claiming odu ifa is another unnecessary diversionary device
Are you a babalawo? Let us not get into all of that

The issues are simple
Today there is no basis for anyone to claim he is paramount king in Yoruba land .
There is nothing like Yorubaland. We can maybe talk of Yoruba land but not Yorubaland. So I agree that Ooni should not make such titles but NO ONE SHOULD. NOT OONI NOT ALAAFIN

Ooni of Ife is just like maybe the Pope

Elegushi and Oba of Lagos are more relevant than. Alaafin

The Alaafin can install the Aare ona Kakanfo and the title is recognized across Yoruba land. That is more or less the only title like that. Then the Alaafin is the most senior Oyo king representing the overall Oyo culture of Oyo, Ibadan, Ogbomosho, Ilorin. That is quite a lot. The Ibadan empire claimed to be working on behalf of the Alaafin and Ogedengbe of Ijesa before falling out with Ibadan went on expedition on behalf of Ibadan as far as Benin and etc. Ibadan was Oyo and was controlling Yoruba land up till the outbreak of the Kiriji war. Yoruba land was a consortium of sovereign states like the Greek states which fought amongst themselves and Oyo was the most successful in the past few centuries. Ife has been under protection since time immemorial. In the past the place was seen as a holy land and not a political headquarters. You can't be that when you are under protection

CodeTemplarr:
Proper Housing? - Housing is cheaper in the north.
Education/Healthcare - Their allocations from FAAC covers those.
Job opportunities - They dont want industries and are only passionate about political domination via religious brainwashing.
Internet - Satellite and GSM cost same for all.
Food - aside being basic, Nigerians spend 60-70 percent on it so anyone who overcomes that can never be the poorest region. Never.
Only intra-state transport is where they lack behind due to higher average distanc between locations.

I don't think housing can be cheaper in the North than in the normal second tier Nigerian cities except it is low quality housing. Building cost is the same. Then I researched number of hotels per state and found out kano has less than 250 hotels when Oyo has over 1000. I wonder if it is because of religion. They should not be poor because they at least have food and should be able to build on that. Then lack of education culture also adds to the poverty because if you are not educated that is a dimension of poverty. They need to start with compulsory education for all. They just need to take it as seriously as they take Quranic education. Then they move to supporting production even if it is leather products that they will start from. Another problem they have is that their culture sees nothing wrong with begging for alms and that can affect overall productivity

Zeebuy:
VAT has not, and has never been a criteria for measuring development in any part of the world. I don't know why you guys keep mentioning VAT. VAT simply shows how well a government taxes the citizens. The SE has, historically, not been focused on taxations as much as the SW has been.

Also, it's laughable you're basing your criteria on the number of hotels in a state. Imo State, I'm sure, has more than 1000 hotels

The information is available online. Rentech has all the data. I can't remember the figure for IMO but Anambra is the highest in the east and it is 749 hotels. It is the only SE state higher than Osun state. Osun is the third highest in the SW after Lagos and Oyo states. Delta has more hotels than any SE state at over 800. SW too is not doing IGR. Only Lagos is doing IGR in the west. All indicators that can be gotten say Oyo state is second to Lagos in everything apart from IGR. It can do the IGR too but the leadership is not yet ready

Zeebuy:
I don't think it's a coincidence that the SW state with highest number of non-yorubas, and also Nigeria's former capital, is one of the top states.
If you guys claim it's so easy, why have you never been able to replicate same in any SW state? Aside Lagos, every other state in the SW is a shithole

After Lagos the next most developed state is Oyo state. It used to be Oyo before Lagos as at decades ago. VAT collection attests to this. I researched the number of hotels and it says the same. Oyo has the second highest number of hotels in the country at 1008. I can't remember Lagos figure. Anambra is the highest in the east at 749 or so. Edo is around 725. Delta is over 800. Osun. Is 697. Only Anambra is higher than Osun in the SE. Enugu is just over 500.

flexyrule:
Is that what you tell yourself at night before heading to bed?

Without the Oil and gas from the Niger Delta, you won't ever see light to power your phone to type that comment.

Know this and know peace!

Oil and gas gives money to government. There are more than sixty million people earning income to feed a total of over 220 million in the country. Oil is less than five percent of the economy and it goes to the government which employs maybe 1.5 million people in total.

Putinofrussia:
SW really trying with the loads of the poor people from almost all regions of Nigeria pouring into SW especially Lagos everyday.
Praises to the Omniscient for keeping us safe.
Ondo has been consistent in leading the pack for a couple of years now.

If you go to other regions too, you will see Yorubas dominating many of the trades. Hausa come mainly for seasonal jobs. They have farms back at home that they go back to. I don't think for instance that Lagos is more cosmopolitan than PH but it has three times the population. It may not even be more cosmopolitan than Benin and high population is opportunity for revenue

gidgiddy:
In 50 years time, Gwari people will be claiming development because the capital was moved to Abuja

You can't compare the Gwari to Yoruba. Eighty percent of cities in Nigeria when the British arrived were Yoruba. Ibadan was the largest urban center. It is mainly Yoruba cities that got depleted for Lagos to grow. The Gwari had no city before colonization.

There are many dimensions of poverty. Lack of proper housing, lack of proper education, lack of health care, lack of job opportunities and even lack of internet access is a form of poverty and etc. People in the SW have more access to a quality life.
Agriculture and being able to feed yourself is the base of any economy and once you get that right the rest should be easy with good leadership. In the late nineteenth century what Japan had in excess was rice and not much else. Their ambitious government took rice tax from farmers and auctioned the rice in markets for revenue. They invested what they got in education and production. The government will set up companies and hand it over to private players later and now Japan is where it is today.

What should be done with sovereign debts?

High income countries should first deflate their cost of living by forcing down rent. If cost of rent reduces to less than three hundred dollars per annum for a three bedroom house then per capita income will not be more than three thousand dollars per annum in any country. It might be less. The GDP of western or high income countries will go down nominally by over 95 percent but productivity will increase since jobs will return from overseas. Their economies will stop being mainly service based. If the GDP goes down by 95 percent or more nominally and the cost of living is flattened out, prices of things will come down sharply and sovereign debts will have to be revalued down with the same factor with which the GDP nominally went down. The US sovereign debt of 37 trillion dollars will be revalued at less than five percent of that and etc. There will be a need to issue new currencies. It may not be necessary to reduce the sovereign debts for all countries. It will only be necessary for countries whose nominal GDP goes down. Then all sovereign debts can be added together and acquired by a new United Nations. The United Nations can be reformed in such a way that each country will contribute and send elected representatives according to economy size. Government revenue will be indicative of economy size and a small percentage of government revenue will be okay. You send elected representatives to the United Nations according to your financial contribution. Oil, gas and any other resources jointly agreed upon should be taken over by the United Nations for revenue too.
Nations can operate without debt. That used to be the case in the past and it can be the case again.
The whole world should then join hands together to pay off the debts with United Nations assets.
What the United Nations needs is to be reformed not an expansion of the United Nations security council.

MaxInDHouse:
You are deceiving yourself!

It's like telling people that the only way to avoid dying by food poisoning is to stop eating totally.

Ọmọ it's by verifying the type of food you eat not avoiding food completely because that will speed up death kíákíá!

Did we die when all cultures held on to their spiritualities and theologies?. No. We had one less reason to fight and kill each other. The world will be better off that way. Without religion

MaxInDHouse:
We aren't bothered if you don't accept our book but one thing is certain it's only adherents of our book that's making peace globally while all of you are fighting and killing one another for reasons best known to you! Isaiah 2:2-4; Micah 4:1-3

Earth will be returned to spiritual tranquility and decorum as it was before religion and peace will be negotiated. Wars will end. It is a matter of time but it will not involve the whole world becoming Jehovah witness. Infact religion has to end before peace can be guaranteed as religion itself is another cause for war

MaxInDHouse:
It's an evil thing to be spiritually blind and deaf at the same time.

Now let me enlighten you why what you are saying makes no practical sense.

Imagine the only religion that promotes orderliness and unity in thoughts: Jehovah's Witnesses Organization as we bow to the arrangement set by Jesus all of us globally do things humbly with love, joy and peace {Galatians 5:22} so that whoever is with us can never ever pick up weapons against anyone! Isaiah 2:2-4; Matthew 26:52

Now to your idea where each person is listening to his/her own minds (spirit) Vladimir Putin is listening to his own spirit, Volodymyr Zelenskyy is listening to his own spirit and they are in control of thousands carrying weapons it led to war.

Had it been all of us subject ourselves to the same line of thought as promoted by Jesus {John 17:22} and his Apostles {Act 2:42; 1Corinthans 1:10; 1Peter 3:8} how can two individuals who have subjected themselves to Jesus believe in fighting and killings to resolve issues? Matthew 5:38-40

So we know that it's the same spirit that is blinding all of you even though you people are using different names to promote your me-first ideology claiming it's ifá/holy ghost that's speaking to each of you! 2Corinthians 4:4

Since people started using holy books instead of divination to know the will of God, what we have had are wars over God because interpretation of the book will differ. If a book can not be questioned that is a dangerous book. If President Putin and President Zelensky are fighting a holy war then it can never be resolved. Thank God they are fighting over territory. People have always fought over territory. Religion is a new reason to fight wars which never existed before holy books.
Whatever you say, it is better to rely on divination than on holy books which simple google will tell you is unreliable. Type contradictions in the Bible into google and see.
Even from your spirit, you can get wrong messages if you apply too much pressure and are over inquisitive. How much more when you subject yourself to a book you say can not be peer reviewed?. Nothing is more foolish.
However it is only something that is peer reviewed that can be accepted by the academic community and the whole world not your Bible

MaxInDHouse:
Don't worry each person will contact his or her spirit whether ifá or holy ghost and come up with different lamba!

If you really know how to contact your spirit, your spirit will confirm everything I have said. The problem we have in the world is that people no longer commune with their spirits as it used to be. They now rely on holy books

MaxInDHouse:
So your own ifá is related to Hinduism?

And you want to convince educated ones on Nairaland using Hinduism and claiming it's ifá.

Ọmọ stop deceiving yourself you can only make sense to people who don't have any idea about ifá and never read books about reincarnation or Hinduism.

There is nothing like life for dead people in heaven all dead people are in their graves awaiting resurrection and no evildoer can be among those Jesus is taking their because whoever is going to heaven must be born again.

So continue with your lamba!

Other than knowing the basics of Hinduism, I have not studied it into depths. I know however of the belief in reincarnation but what I am saying are what I got by thoroughly interviewing my spirit with IFA divination. However most human cultures believe in reincarnation in one form or the other before religion came to upend the decorum. IFA just confirmed and explained it to me

MaxInDHouse:
But i'm not related to (Ògúndábèdé) Oníkòyí nah!

IFA told me that even Jesus still helps people when they call on him