₦airaland Forum

Freed from God's Law, bound by man's

comrChris:
just bear it in mind that you will account for any soul you are able to deceive concerning tithe with this your post

Actually you need the spirit of God if truelly you are a christian

Remember no pastor has ever forced his/her members to pay tithe,it is a things of the spirit,so therefor if you see it as afraud from your pastor to you then stop giving but stop deceiving peoples here but remember the bible instructed us not lean on our own understanding,your arguement here has been on your own understanding instead of the spirit

Thanks

Actually, many do "force their members to pay tithe." Many use the same type of tactics the pastor in this clip used...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kmh_IF-eJQc

And because many don't study their Bibles as they should, they fearfully yield to the pastor's threats of curses.

His logic is ridiculous indeed. Did he have the money for the barley before he sold the barley? Of course not! Funny how he argues tithes of sales are not necessary, yet insists earnings tithes are. RoFL

What is the difference in me selling an item for $100 and me workng and earning $100 for my work? Absolutely nothing. The $100 would be financial increase in either instance. If increase of money is not titheable for one, it is not titheable for the other.

It is not me who is hiding.

No, the rich young ruler would not have already tithed of all his possessions before he sold them. He would have tithed off of what the Law required... Agricultural products.

But regardless, once he sold all, he would have an increase of money he previously did not have. And did the Law say tithe was to be off of increase? Yes, it did. But the Law went further than just saying tithe of increase... it clarified that the increase it was referring in regards to the required tithe was to be agricultural.

Of course, the deceitful monetary tithe requirement teachers and their defenders refuse to accept the truth as it is given by the Word of God.

Image123:
Are you kidding? The man said he had kept the commandments from his youth. Of course, he would have being giving offerings and tithes. Why tithe what you have already tithed. Again, tithing is not as important as you would wish. The man was asking about eternal life and you think Jesus should have told him about giving 10%, ridiculous.

the commandments said tithes were agricultural. He would not have been tithing money.

We've been through this before, Image123. You cannot accept the written Word of God. It is foolishness to you because you have been conditioned to believe a lie.

Twist as you might, you cannot prove a monetary tithe given to Tabernacle, Temple or Church.

God's Word is forever settled in Heaven.

Unfortunately, as is quite evident, it is not settled in the hearts of those who teach the monetary tithe requirement doctrine.

The Monetary Tithe was never a Church doctrine

vooks:
If anyone can decide what to do with the money, they would be following Paul's principle of giving as you purpose and certainly nobody should look down on those stuck with a fixed 10% or 5% or whatever they decide on. And this is the whole point, there is NO law on what and when to give

There also is no record of human sacrifices both in the NT nor in church history. If a sect decided to offer them since we lack ALL first century sermons, would they be justified? We have ENOUGH history both in the scriptures and outside of the first few hundreds of years on giving to conclude that tithing was never practiced at all and that gibing was along free will basis. You can't IGNORE all the evidence and rely on your fertile imagination to fill the gaps

About Matthew 23, Jesus was born UNDER the Law and that's why he kept the Law and he instructed the Jews to keep the Law. This point has been hammered so many times I don't understand why you insist on it. He instructed an ex-leper to offer sacrifices according to the Law. Nobody today offers animal sacrifices after they have been healed

Jesus also told one man to sell EVERYTHING he had and follow him. Do you practice or teach this? Not everything Jesus said is for the Christian or anybody who reads them, and there is a very simple test of confirming what's meant for you or not, it is not arbitrally

concerning the man who was told to sell everything, it is important to notice that Jesus did not tell him to give ten percent of the money... No, He told him to give it all to the poor.

The pro-tithe crowd can't explain that one away.

Actually, i am impressed. For me, i thought you were past learning, but i rejoice that you have improved. You used to think Malachi 3 was for levites and priests. Now, you have improved greatly to sons of Jacob, i'm happy for you, really.




Using this same line, one ,may say gullibly too that 2Corinthians was for the Corinthians, not for us. So no business with all it says, and you know how much you love it with its cheerful giving quote.
2Co 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timothy our brother, unto the church of God which is at Corinth, with all the saints which are in all Achaia:

i say this to you and your type.
Luk 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Moses said the tithe was to go to the Levites, widows, orphans and stangers in Israel. Moses also said God's holy tithe was agricultural and to be eaten. Are you hearing him? If not, you apparently will not hear the One who rose from the dead.

Your argument using 1 Corinthians would be valid if it weren't for Acts 13.

Acts 13:46 Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.

The message to the Church at Corinth is applicable to all Gentiles, as is Ephesians, Colossians, Philippians, etc..

Nice try.

Image123:
i'm speaking it to you. Same excuse can be made for any of the epistles as written to so and so, not you. God's house is not only in Jerusalem.

If you are speaking Malachi 3:8-10 to me in an attempt to prove I am supposed to be tithing, you are quoting it out of context. It was for the sons of Jacob... not for me.

Quoting if for me doesn't convince me that I am supposed to tithe. Especially since I know verse six says it was for the sons of Jacob.

Image123:
Malachi 3:8 Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings. 3:9 Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation. 3:10 Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.

spoken to the sons of Jacob, (v.6) not to you or I. The Storehouse was in the Temple in Jerusalem, not in a Church in Nigeria or America.

“Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar’s, and unto God that which is God’s.” Matthew 22:21

The above statement made by Jesus to the scribes and Pharisees is often taken out of its context and used by pastors and laymen alike, in an attempt to prove that God requires tithe of money from the Church member today.

But, when read in context with the entire discourse, and rightly dividing the Word of Truth, it is easy to see that Jesus was not endorsing a monetary tithe at all.

Matthew 22:15-22 Then went the Pharisees, and took counsel how they might entangle him in his talk. And they sent out unto him their disciples with the Herodians, saying, Master, we know that thou art true, and teachest the way of God in truth, neither carest thou for any man: for thou regardest not the person of men. Tell us therefore, What thinkest thou? Is it lawful to give tribute unto Caesar, or not? But Jesus perceived their wickedness, and said, Why tempt ye me, ye hypocrites? Shew me the tribute money. And they brought unto him a penny. And he saith unto them, Whose is this image and superscription? They say unto him, Caesar’s. Then saith he unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s; and unto God the things that are God’s. When they had heard these words, they marvelled, and left him, and went their way.

The disciples of the Pharisees and Herodians asked Jesus a question concerning tribute paid to Caesar. Jesus’ profound reply is overlooked by many today.

The image and superscription on the tribute money was that of the ruling government… Caesar’s. In our modern language, we would say it thusly, “Pay the government the taxes they require. The money is theirs.”

Jesus also said that those disciples who questioned Him were to give to God that which was God’s. Was He speaking of money when He said, “Render unto God the things that are God’s”? Not at all.In the very first chapter of the Bible, we are told that man was created in God’s image. So, the question arises, “Whose image and superscription is on man?”

Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

That’s right… God’s image. And when man places his faith in the Lord Jesus Christ for his Salvation, God’s superscription is upon that man.

Romans 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

Romans 12:1-2 tell us that we are to present our bodies as living sacrifices unto God, holy and acceptable unto Him.

“Render unto God that which is God’s.”

In Matthew 22:15-22, Jesus was not telling the Pharisaical and Herodian disciples to tithe money. He was telling them to yield their own selves, their bodies to the LORD’s service. And Paul echoed that admonition in his epistle to the Romans thirty years later.

God’s image is on us. Let us always be prepared to be yielded to His service.
-- www.boldproclaimer.

adeshola1:
Matthew 22:21....Give to Cesar what belongs to Cesar & give to God want belongs to God..... Hmm....why are some of u robbing God because of greed and wrong interpretation of Scriptures.

The Bible isn't a book we have to interprete with our head as some of us as doing here but we need guidance of the Holy Spirit..

Remember... 1day..All of us will give account.of our lives & don't say someone didn't warn you about this..

PAY YOUR TITHE

Jesus was not saying to give God money in Matthew 22:21.

Nor does the Bible instruct us to tithe.

if using it out of context to prove I am robbing God and under a curse, then, yes..., you would be threatening.

Do you feel threatened by Proverbs 22:16?

If not, then how can I have threatened you with it? If you do, then don't blame me. That verse was written centuries before I was even born.

Again, Proverbs 22:16 is a verse of wisdom that is applicable to anyone and everyone. If you give to the rich, you will come to want. If the rich take from the poor, they too, will come to want. Maybe not this side of eternity, but if not, then they will stand wanting when they stand before God.

As to Malachi, we have been over that already. The curse in Malachi was never for the Church. Why shouldn't I criticize pastors who intimidate their congregations with the threat of Malachi's curse when they clearly take it out of context.

If you can't see that, it is unfortunate.

chysam:
Jesus was being sarcastic about that.Read those verses all over again.
Then take some time out to ponder why christ after telling the hypocrites to do this did not turn to his followers with similar message. Ever heard of Paul who was formerly Saul?.Please tell us why he stopped paying tithes when he became born again.Are you also aware that he regreted working through the OT laws?.Please check your bible to conform. Now you say you take pride in paying tithe,the apostles and everyone who followed christ did not do that.Some of them even wrote the bible.Are you Godlier than them.Did they rob God? Were they under curse? Pease explain

yes, he prides himself in tithing. Much like the Pharisee of Luke 18.

Both he and the Pharisee have their reward.

Image123:
Fable. i still give tithes, God is not complaining. Jesus says it ought to be done.

Thanks for warning us that your post would be a fable. You didn't have to though. We knew it was when we read it.

Image123:
Oh, Malachi is not a verse of wisdom when quoted? Cherry picking.

Malachi 3:10 is a command. Not for the Church, for the Priests of Israel. It is foolish to interpret it any other way.

Proverbs 22:16 is not a command. It does not say don't give to the rich, it doesn't say don't ake from the poor.

Image123:
If you didn't threaten me, then 'Malachi preachers' aren't threatening. They're just reading verses. See your life for outside? You're being hypocritical and double tongued. i defend giving to God, which is what every tithe and offering should be.

not being hypocritical at all. I quoted a verse of wisdom. Totally different than a preacher lying to his congregation, telling them God requires tithe of money or they are cursed.

Image123:
Read again. i admit you're quoting the old testament
to threaten me. You're no much different from those you condemn for using Malachi to threaten others, only poorer perhaps.

I didn't threaten you. I posted a verse showing foolish choices. Giving to the rich and taking from the poor.

An act you defend.

Image123:
Amen. Ironically you're quoting the old testament to threaten me. Try giving to God.

interesting... So you are admitting

1. You oppress the poor to increase your riches

or

2. You foolishly give your money to a rich pastor

Image123:
i don't know, i wonder how you know. What i know is that some tithe preaching and accepting churches have a lot of money and that hurts you despite your not giving them a dime. Your tithe is not missed in heaven or earth.

Proverbs 22:16 (KJV) 16 He that oppresseth the poor to increase his [riches, and] he that giveth to the rich, [shall] surely [come] to want.

God would be more pleased with an anti-tither giving ten percent of his money to a widow or orphan in his community than if that anti-tither took ten percent of his money to a pastor who had a private jet and luxurious home. The widow and orphan are in greater need.

But it must be stressed once more that God does not require ten percent of that anti-tither's money.

Trinity

gebest:
in other words, Malachi 3:10 is no longer existing!

Malachi 3:10 does exist. But it's tithe nowhere resembles the tithe you and defend.

birdman:
considering how long this thread has been going, I wonder if I am missing something. Im getting the vibe that Nigerians have taken tithing to another level, resulting in backlash by some christians. Why is such a simple issue so contentious?

It wouldn't be so contentious if preachers would stop preaching that we are robbing God and cursed if we fail to tithe our money.

For the preacher who is benefiting from the teaching of the monetary tithe, the less cookies in the cookie jar, the more belligerent he becomes with his deceitful doctrine.

Zikkyy:
How come you are not offering burnt offering? is burnt offering not biblical?

wonder if he advocates marrying one's own sister. After all, that too, is Biblical. LoL

The fact is, the only "Biblical" tithes that were given to a religious institution were agricultural tithes. Quite sure the tithe he is insisting we pay is not agricultural.

In the Bible, tithes were never commanded for the Church, never carried to the Church, & never controlled by the Church.

In light of those undeniable facts, who's the real "God-robber"?

Answer: The pastor or teacher that tells their congregation that God requires tithes be given to the Church.

Image123:
have fun. Others continue to understand and give the tithe without giving themselves an headache. Your tithe hasn't been missed in heaven all this while.

but it sure is missed by the extortioner behind the pulpit

gebest:
the truth is always bitter.

which is exactly the reason you refuse to accept the truth

gebest:
pray for spiritual understanding and then test God with ur tithe.

where does God say to test Him with the tithe? Is it not in Malachi? That tithe was not money.

Obviousely, it is you who needs to pray for understanding.

Image123:
Very good. So we have nothing further to discuss on that.

If you were in agreement with God's Word concerning tithing, that would be true. But it is blatantly obvious that you are not.