₦airaland Forum

honesttalk21:
You are the one deceiving and deluding yourself. Where is your reference? Your claims aren't worth behind waste paper without this.

If it's mere claim Muslims won't be killing Muslims due to racism, politics and nationalism.
Muhammad told his disciples to fight for their country that's why nobody among all Muslims in the world can say anything to stop Muslims from fighting and killing fellow Muslims.

Mosco100:
BELIEVE IN JESUS.
“...Believe in the Lord your God, so shall ye be established; believe his prophets, so shall ye prosper.”(2 Chronicles 20:20). Amen!

The verse you quoted specifically meant Israelites whose ancestors worshiped a God who appeared to Abraham so they have to believe in whatever that God says since that God has fulfilled all what He promised their forefathers.

Today people can't just believe that God unless they see what that God foretold happening around them just as He said!

Continue deceiving yourself with your pbuh prophet honesty is what can help you now!🙂

honesttalk21:
There's no desperation when a claim is false unless it applies to you. Defending my parents religion? How lame an argument? Where is the proof of what you say about prophet Muhammad pbuh or it's forbidden in your creed to share? While at it give credence to your redefined meaning of apostasy.

honesttalk21:
Which dictionary backs this wrong definition of yours?
You have refused for days to provide credible evidence of the allegation you make of prophet Muhammad pbuh. Obviously you have none. Stop deflecting in your bid to redefine apostasy!

Guy, honesty is far from you but it's okay i don't expect someone desperately defending his parents religion to be honest after discovering that his cherish religion is false!🙂

sagenaija:
You are not far from reality.

If you say so!

Critics are people speaking abusively of a religion they have left or never being a member of the religion at all while apostates are people who are speaking abusively of their own religion when they can't even find a replacement.

Muhammad told his disciples to defend their country which is a fact no sincere Muslim can deny this shows you are never honest at all!🙂

honesttalk21:
Totally wrong. An apostate abandons the faith, while critics who stay are dissenters. Redefining terms does not constitute an argument.
Shunning and beheading represent a false equivalence. Comparing organizational shunning to state executions misses the point.
Claims must be backed by sources mockery does not suffice. Where is the evidence of what you claim prophet Muhammad pbuh said?

Nobody sees you better than your heart. An adage in Yorùbá says:

"Kò sí ìwògbè tó ríran bí ọkàn"

There is no mirror that can see you better than your own heart"

People do use the mirror to look at their own appearance where there is light but even when there is thick darkness that's not allowing for any reflection your heart sees you. A blind man may not be able to see anything around him but he's capable of seeing himself as in the type of person he is.

So if this man's heart doesn't judge him there is nothing anyone can say after all being a pastor and church owner is a welcome development in Christendom and for the reason best known to him he has pleaded with members of his own church who are supposed to be his fellow believers!

honesttalk21:
By you who isn't credible enough to say? If you have a credible evidence you will bring it or you are scared to get caught in your lie that despite apostating from Islam no one killed you?

Apostate means people who continue to criticize their own faith instead of walking away to worship elsewhere.
We are comparing shunning to beheading which the whole world knows these two religions for regarding apostates in both.

Will there ever be any good leadership in worldly politics?

God's word says:

 “In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed. And this kingdom will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it alone will stand forever" Daniel 2:44

Before this verse God revealed to Daniel that different system of government will suffice but they will all fail to meet the expectations of their subjects so they will be changed but in this verse God said something that really concerns anyone living in our time!

God said the last and final system of government to rule the earth will not be passed onto any other people as it has been happening for so long and that is the time God will destroy all human government to restore His own government which will remain forever.

Democracy is the system of government the world is promoting today where the people decides where their rulers should come from so they keep voting in and out different people from different tribes then God said it's during the time Democracy is ruling the earth that God will end all human governments.

So do you think there will ever be any good human government in this time of the end?🤔

Those who pierced Jesus in the first century are gone but they have brothers in each generation {Luke 16:18} these are people who always oppose faithful servants of God and they are in different generations so when the Bible book of Revelations say those who pierced Jesus it is referring to apostates of pure worship who will be alive when all these signs are noticed globally.

sagenaija:
Your argument is that we should not take what Revelation says to mean word for word. Why then do you think we should expect that it means those who directly pierced Jesus are the ones to still be alive when he comes? Do you get to see what I was pointing out in your reasoning?

Of course we can use it to get the sense of what was written in the Bible book of Revelation because immediately after it says "all eyes will see Jesus coming in the clouds" what follows in the same verse is "including those who pierced Jesus" so definitely that statement is not literal but an illustration!🙂

You should answer the question instead of throwing it back at me.

Where are the Jewish religious leaders and Roman soldiers who pierced Jesus in the first century?😀

sagenaija:
Let's take this your statement:
"If you are expecting what Revelation says to mean word for word…."
Can you use that to answer this your question?:
Are those who pierced Jesus still alive today?

First of all there is no class among God's worshipers we are all equal, secondly the Christ himself and all his Apostles weren't rich from the moment they started preaching and teaching in fact Jesus himself died without a single thing to be called his own.
So if worldly riches is what determines who you should follow then something is wrong with your faith because Christ's real ministers worth nothing in the world their worth is in heaven:

“Stop storing up for yourselves treasures on the earth, where moth and rust consume and where thieves break in and steal. Rather, store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust consumes, and where thieves do not break in and steal.  For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also" Matthew 6:19-21

This is the opening words of Revelation:

A revelation by Jesus Christ, which God gave him, to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place. And he sent his angel and presented it in SIGNS through him to his slave John. Revelation 1:1

Jesus is the same person {Hebrews 13:8} who always present serious issues using illustrations when it involves the general public! Matthew 13:13


Are those who pierced Jesus still alive today?

So if you are expecting what Revelation says to mean word for word ọmọ i'm sorry for you!🙂

sagenaija:
MaxinDHouse, Is comprehension difficult for you? That verse did not say it is signs. Did you see the portion I bolded? Here it again:
"Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and EVERY EYE WILL SEE HIM, even those who pierced him, and all tribes of the earth will wail on account of him." Rev. 1:7.
"EVERY EYE WILL SEE HIM" means just what it says. It did not say every eye will see signs. You will be reinterpreting the Scripture to say that. Wise up, man!

sagenaija:
So your response to a write-up is: "You people only wake up..........?"
Have Nigerians become so sallow in their thinking and calloused in their hearts?
Concerning one of the things you mentioned check this out:
"Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and EVERY EYE WILL SEE HIM, even those who pierced him, and all tribes of the earth will wail on account of him." Rev. 1:7
Where did your 1914 fit in there?

Read Matthew 24:7-14 and tell me which country on planet earth people will say they are not seeing these signs.
Well that's what Jesus meant but as for seeing him physically even the shape of the earth should tell you that people can't see someone globally at the same time in a physical sense but as for all the things Jesus said everyone on this planet can see it since 1914 till today!

MrEar:
Am sure they have warned you not to preach to a child if the parents are not around.

So how many outsiders have reported that JWs molested their children if those reports aren't coming from exjws who wanted to blindfold honest hearted ones from listening to the GOOD NEWS?🙂

MrEar:
Thank you my Lord Jesus 🙏

You that you were siding someone who doesn't believe in the Good News that Jesus said we should preach globally to all the nations yet you want to claim the same Jesus is your Lord!🤣

MrEar:
When you saw that he debated you with proof from the scriptures you decided to run.Typical behaviour of Jehovah witness.

MrEar:
Your members here rarely report cases involving another member to the police.

So how come the reports are only coming from far away countries yet they say they are not expected to report?😀

Well if you must know those people are xjws so just as many disciples turned their backs on Jesus and never wanted to walk with him again {John 6:66} many are dropping out of God's organization.

Now think of what such ones could say against an organization they couldn't see anything to say against?🙂

You don't believe the Bible so there is no need wasting my precious time with you.
I asked you:

How many JWs child abusers have you caught since you were born?

How come such reports only comes from far away Europe?

What stops anyone from leaving one religion that's evil for a better one?

Try to be honest with yourself?🙂

MrEar:
You have changed mouth now. You went from they are sinners that should be forgiven to it is a lie from the media
So when it is any other religious group, it is TRUTH. But when it is Jehovah Witness, the news report must be a lie?
Anyway, back to the discussion. Jesus Christ loves children. Any religious group that protects child abusers is demonic and not from christ.
I have made this clear to your members when they come to discuss with me. They always come with the intention of trying to make me become a Jehovah Witness but I end up making so many of them go home disappointed about their Jehovah organisation that protects child abusers and drags abused kids to court.

Mrexcell:
The ghosts i have seen don't look scary like the one pictured above they look like every day normal people with clean clothes.

Demons puts on the appearance that's peculiar to each region so if you are from Africa or Asia they will appear as your dead loved ones but if you are from Europe they will appear as Aliens from outer space all the same they are all working together as one!

MrEar:
You can forgive them but that doesn't mean you protect them from getting arrested by the police.

So who told you not to report any child abuser you know?
When they are using the media to tell you lies it's just a pity that you swallow it hook line and sinker.🤔

NO!
The only clause is that you pick anyone you are attracted to among believers! 1Corinthans 7:39🙂

MrEar:
Jesus Christ loved children. He would never have anything to do with a religious group that protects child abusers.

Go, then, and learn what this means: ‘I want mercy, and not sacrifice.’ For I came to call, not righteous people, but SINNERS .” Matthew 9:13
And have you forgotten that those child abusers are sinners shey?

Sometimes i wonder if you people usually read the Bible at all!😟

Satan is fighting God's organization using all sorts of lies against God's holy gathering and you people are so blind to use your mind's eyes.
How many child abusers have you seen in your area that are Jehovah's Witnesses?
Do you know of any group of people in whose gathering you won't find child abusers?
Meanwhile when they say child abusers most of you don't even know know that ordinarily screaming or beating your own child is child abuse in those places.

Yet that is what Satan is using to cover your eyes from thinking! Matthew 5:11-12 compare to 2Corinthians 4:4🙂

Being born again is not based on what is called morality or uprightness rather the true God chooses among true believers who should rule with Christ in heaven they are the BORN AGAIN not just moral agents!🙂

honesttalk21:
Obviously you understand lack of quality or your understanding of what you claim

Guy abeg leave the matter your prophet doesn't know the truth that's why he is confused about nationalism otherwise he should have known that nationalism will weaken the bond of faith and that is why you Muslims are easily compelled to hate, fight and kill yourselves in the face of nationalism!🙂

What is the name of your own church?😀

You people just wake up condemning one church or another as if people must not gather for worship again yet you can't present your own. Does this mean you don't worship anywhere or you just don't want people to gather for worship anymore?😀

When we tell you people that Jesus was installed as King in heaven in the year 1914 (some 100 years ago) you will say Jehovah's Witnesses are false prophets simply because disciples of Christ back then had wrong expectation regarding the fulfillment of Bible prophecy just as it has always happened to God's servants in all generations.

Well if you must know after Jesus was crowned as king in heaven the first thing he did was to drive Satan and his demons out of heaven that is why false prophets claiming founders of churches began increasing in numbers because Satan realized that his time is getting closer {Revelation 12:7-12} this was what Jesus meant at Matthew 24:7-14

So a separation work started some 100 years ago as Jesus began restoring his group by picking faithful individuals from different religions and gathering them in another group which everyone know today as Jehovah's Witnesses! Isaiah 65:15🙂

When you read the Bible and found the word "SAVED" in relation to Christians it has a deeper meaning than you think.

There are two categories of Christians. John 10:16
Jesus emphasized that the two will later become one in the future but first of all you must identify the two categories so as to have accurate knowledge of God's word.

When Jesus began his ministry what he targeted was only Jews and no other tribe! Matthew 10:6

WHY?

Because this nation have lasted for many centuries having God's temple and the sacred writings with them though they keep committing blunders but God never cancelled His promise to used this nation as priests and kings in His kingdom {Genesis 12:3} the promised child must come through this nation {Isaiah 9:6 compare to Genesis 3:15} he will teach them how to help other nations to gain salvation. Zechariah 8:23

So the position to become corulers with the Christ was reserved mainly for Jews but the nation as a whole rejected God's means of salvation which is Christ Jesus {Matthew 27:24-25} that is why the invitation to become corulers with Christ in heaven was thrown open to faithful people from other nations {John 1:11-12 compare to Matthew 22:2-14} therefore instead of holding the Jewish nation as the prophecies foretold centuries before Christ that they will become the means of salvation {Zechariah 8:23} it was revealed that God has rejected that nation and chosen another nation producing the fruit expected from the Jewish nation! Matthew 21:43
The nation that later replaced the Jewish nation is called the Israel of God or the New Jerusalem {Revelations 21:2} this selected people from all nations are also called the New Heavens because they are going to rule with Christ in heaven! John 14:1-3
They are of a limited number {Luke 12:42} but their subjects will fill the whole earth and they are the group that was always referred to as "SAVED" in the New Testament not all believers in Christ.
But why are they referred to as "SAVED" when they are not the only believers in Christ?

Well it's because of the event that will take place in the future before God give obedient humans everlasting life. By the time Jesus begins raising the dead it's this set that will be resurrected first {1Thessalonians 4:16-17} they will not resurrect with human bodies but spirit bodies {Luke 20:34-36 compare to 1Corinthans 15:44} this means they are taken to heaven immediately as they are raised from the dead! John 14:1-3

After their departure Satan and his demons will be driven out of heaven because the presence of faithful humans in heaven proves that these humans could be faithful to God despite the toughest situations they experienced on planet earth! Revelation 12:11

Later Satan and his demons will terrorise all the inhabitants of planet earth {Revelation 12:12} later Satan and his demons will be arrested and thrown into a place where they won't be able to disturb or distract anyone again this will last for a thousand years! Revelation 20:1-2

After the thousand years reign of Christ and his corulers Satan will be let loosed again because by that time all humans will have become perfect so Satan will be given his last chance to test their faithfulness to God just as he did with the first perfect human couple {Revelation 20:3} all these events won't affect anyone who has been taken to heaven with Jesus. Revelation 20:6

So from the viewpoint of God and Christ Jesus whoever is not part of the first resurrection is still liable to death {Revelation 20:5} just as Jesus looked at living people and referred to them as walking corpses {Matthew 8:22} whoever is not part of these first set of resurrected ones is still dead from God's and Christ's viewpoint.

That's why they are referred to as "SAVED" because if they are able to finish their earthly course and ministry faithfully they won't have any encounter with Satan or his demons anymore!

May you have peace!

The problem with Islam is following a higher number instead of intelligently thinking deeper. I've noticed that all the intelligence Muslims count on is numbers so even when it's obvious that they are running in circus an average Muslim will insist on throwing his blows at the wind just to make himself feel good.
Trinity is not Christianity it's a fabrication established after the death of Christ's Apostles and the true God allowed it so that Satan could be beaten in his own game. Islam came as a Trinitarian competitor so that unintelligent people could hold onto something claiming they have the truth but after centuries of shared falsehood the true God restored Christianity making His worshipers stand out unique.
If you want to know true Christianity try to reason out of the box and stop following the crowd what you described up there is not Christianity rather it was allowed for a reason!🙂

ictplotter:
Concept of God

Christianity
• God becomes human
• God dies
• God prays to God
• God sacrifices God to God to forgive humans

This creates theological complexity:
• Trinity (one essence, three persons)
• Incarnation
• Atonement via blood

Even trained theologians admit:

“It is a mystery, not fully comprehensible.”

That’s not an insult — it’s an admission.

Islam
• God is absolutely One
• God does not incarnate
• God does not die
• God does not need sacrifice to forgive

Core idea:

God is transcendent, merciful, and directly accessible.
Let those that have sense think, the truth is not difficult to know if only will can put our emotions outside.

TenQ:
You don't have to engage with me. I think we concluded about that. Discuss the questions with your fellow elders using your Bible as a guide.
Is it too much to ask?

My brothers and i are One {John 17:22} so whatever i believe they believe too!🙂

TenQ:
Ask your fellow elders and open your bible as you discuss.
Unfortunately, topics like these are not discussed by your publications, thus, you cannot independently open the Bible!
SMH!
Have a nice day!!

You see the reason why you don't worth engaging me in such a discussion?

You want me to talk about what i shared with my brothers in sacred service but you don't respect such arrangements yet you feel i should engage you in such a serious discussion.🙂

With who do you agree on your conclusions regarding your questions?

If you don't agree with anyone what makes you think i will agree with you?

Or do you think i'm interested in some aimless arguments that you always engage with random people?😂

TenQ:
So when you are asked to answer questions based on Bible questions like
1. Can anyone see God?
2. Can God be in Heaven and on Earth concurrently?
3. Who was speaking in Heb1:8 to the Son?
You run off to consult the JW manual instead of the Bible!?
SMH!

TenQ:
It seems you don't study the scriptures to know as you've been told what to believe.
All I asked you to do is to study the bible. Is that a tall order to do?

Please quote the highlighted in your previous post to me on this thread?😂

TenQ:
What is wrong with you

Surely you don't think before typing!

I'm living in the same place with those you call "elders"?

TenQ:
But it is good that you ask the other Elders to review these questions

If i'm not living in the same place or city with them so how come you believe we all have the same line of thought just as Jesus prayed for his real disciples {John 17:22} but you don't have anyone to relate with as your fellow believers?😂