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Politics › Re: Jonathan Is A disappointment but why should We Believe GMB Will be Any Different by McSterling(m): 7:13am On Dec 16, 2014

Chemali, you've spoken well. @ op, I am also dispassionate when it comes to partisan politics, but given the present state of affairs, we can't afford to sit on the fence. Jonathan has proved beyond reasonable doubt that he's a failure and a complete dead end. The only choice we've really got is GMB. Whether or not he'll fail/succeed, we can't yet say. And we can never know if we do not give him a chance to prove his mettle. It will be foolhardy to vote Jonathan again after all that has happened these four years. Only blind bigoted political sycophants say "GEJ till 2019". They support him mostly on the basis of tribe and religion, not performance. In GMB we have a beacon of hope, at least.

Politics › Re: First Nig Speaker, An Igbo Man Saved "MANDELA" From Early Death, Predicted Lagos by McSterling(m): 6:12am On Dec 16, 2014

The op kinda implies that Wachuku had been intimated about the coup before it happened.

Politics › Re: Yemi Osibanjo As Vp...apc's Masterstroke! by McSterling(m): 5:49am On Dec 16, 2014

funshint:
Nonsense; who is this man for God sake?!...if religion is the only parameter for selecting pple into public office; this nation is truly doomed!

Seconded.

Poems For Review › Re: Poetry Classes For Beginners - NPC (Signup Thread) by McSterling(m): 5:43am On Dec 16, 2014

laykorn:
She already learnt it. She speaks it better than a lot of us sef.
Ayamlaykorn

Wow!

Poems For Review › Re: Poetry Classes For Beginners - NPC (Signup Thread) by McSterling(m): 5:33am On Dec 16, 2014

texanomaly:
Hey Hun. How you dey?

Oh btw Laykorn...when do classes start?

Laykorn says at 9 pm. I see you're learning pidgin English, eh? cheesy

Poems For Review › Re: Poetry Classes For Beginners - NPC (Signup Thread) by McSterling(m): 5:29am On Dec 16, 2014

Signing up as a student...

Christianity Etc › Re: How Do You Know Your Religion Or Denomination Is The Right One by McSterling(m): 8:38am On Dec 15, 2014*

Ichiato:
Man I get tired of writing or typing very easily and as such I hate to repeat myself. I never downplayed the relevance of the many who will or might never change their religious believes instead I explained some other reasons besides indoctrination that could be the reason for their refusal to change. As a matter of fact you're the one who tried to downplay the relevance of the few who did change by bringing up the many people who will or might never change. Why not explain the few that did change like I explained the many that will or might never change these believes. I also pointed out to the history of Africa which for many years had their own traditional believes but majority have now abandoned these believes for new ones regardless of indoctrination. Why not explain that uh? I stated clearly that indoctrination aside, religion fills a void in the lives of believers one which if they leave these believes will become a big empty space. Religion gives them purpose of life, reason for existence and many more. And atheism does not answer these questions for them. And "NO", pointing out that majority of people will or might never change their religious believes does not mean indoctrination is the reason for that. You also have to prove that indoctrination is the reason for their refusal to change which you have failed to do so far.
Thank you for accepting that it is not only religious believers that are been unreasonable.

What do I need to explain about those who changed? I am one of them. I believed wholeheartedly the creed of Christianity because I was fed with it ere I could think for myself. But now I've discarded it though it was no easy task. My discarding it doesn't preclude the fact that I was indoctrinated in the first place. Same goes for many others. We were all indoctrinated whether we had the guts to leave that religion or not. Even if indoctrination isn't the only reason why people still adhere to their religion, it is safe to say it laid the foundation and is therefore an intrinsic factor for sustained belief. Why do you think BH guys go on endless and senseless rapine and killing sprees? Why is it that they can blow themselves up? How did they come about such lugubrious assurance or grim conviction? Why is it that many religionists arrogantly think with 100 percent conviction that only their brand of religion is right and all others are wrong and are going to hell? This fact of indoctrination is something some honest believers concede to. But some can't just bring themselves to accept this because it vitiates their ego. They like to think like you that they chose their religion themselves or that their options among religions wasn't narrowed down by culture.

Yes, religion fills a void for many. That is why they think their very essence depends on it. But again, the very religion that fills this void is so often predetermined by culture. Why doesn't Taoism, Jainism, Buddhism, Confucianism, etc, fill the void for many Nigerians? Why does it always have to be Christianity or Islam? But these eastern religions fill the void for those who have grown up in cultures that host them. And yet many who weren't brought up in any religious culture do not feel this void that only religion can fill. What this should tell you is that the so called void and whatever is believed to fill it, are but products of indoctrination in themselves.

The white man surpassed our forefathers both intellectually and in military might. Ours fathers were illiterate. Their beliefs were never written down, only passed down by oral traditions. Beliefs weren't universal and varied from village to village and clan to clan. Deities were many and members of the same family could have different deities. There was no single religion to unify the various peoples. We lacked vast empires. We only had tribal kings or rulers. Islam was used to unify and homogenize the Arab world, making them strong and powerful. Usman Dan Fodio homogenized and unified the north with this literate religion called Islam. Any wonder why Islam is still deeply entrenched in the north today, even after years of colonization? World religions have always recognized the power of the book. That's why you have the Bible and the Koran. This, our fathers lacked. Would Christianity or Islam be where they are today if they lacked a holy writ? I doubt. So, considering all these, is it any wonder that the white man conquered us and imposed his religion on us? We were clearly no match for the white man.

1 Like 1 Share

Christianity Etc › Re: How Do You Know Your Religion Or Denomination Is The Right One by McSterling(m): 9:47pm On Dec 14, 2014

Ichiato:
You see, you still had to compare and contrast after I specifically explained that it those not matter. We are not in argument as to weather or not people will likely change the religion they were brought up in, as a matter of fact I do agree with you but I don't agree that indoctrination is the one sole reason for this. As I pointed out earlier there are those like you who have proved your very position on this argument wrong. Our great grandfathers (or should i say ancestors)were also indoctrinated in their tranditional believes but many of those traditional believes have gone to oblivion today and you still talk about indoctrination been the one sole reason. My father was born into a Muslim home but today he is a staunch Catholic who I believe will never change his view. I also know of one bishop sanusi who was also born into a Muslim home but today he is a Catholic and was even the bishop of ijebu ode at some point. These are just few examples and their number as against the number of those who never changed is irrelevant. The fact is these people exist and they are prove indoctrination is not the sole reason people remain with religious believe

I stated earlier that all humans are bound to question what they have been taught since childhood. It's a psychological fact. Many remain with their religious believes because despite the many questions their religion has failed to answer leaving the said religion only creates more unanswered questions or at best unfavorable answers. And for those who scaled the huddle they got their desired answers elswhere (weather in atheism or other known religion) I'm also not saying this step was an easy one but never the less it was made. That is why I stated earlier that our life experience shapes our philosophy of it and this in turn shapes the way we think. Indoctrination can only be part of these experiences. This also explains why some people still find their way into religion outside indoctrination.
Those who fail to reason or reply questions with answers such as the bolded are some part of the numerous unreasonable people in the world of which some also are atheist or would you argue otherwise?

Why do you think it doesn't matter to compare and contrast? You point the few who have left their religions as evidence against indoctrination, I point the overwhelming many who haven't (and probably won't) and ask us to contrast both to reach a reasonable conclusion and you think it doesn't matter? Since you want us to accept this few as evidence against indoctrination, I ask,"what, my good sir, should we do about the many who haven't?" Ignore them? What do they point at? Don't they tell us that people will most likely not change their religion? Which is exactly the point I'm trying to make. People will most likely not change the religion they were brought up in. That is evidence of indoctrination. I'm not arguing whether some people at some time or the other have left their religion or not because infact, many have. But what about the vast overwhelming majority who haven't and probably won't? We can't overlook that, even if that's what you want. In a survey, when you pass out a questionnaire, you don't reject some of the replies you get and accept the others. Everything you get is regarded as data, whether you like it or not. It is from this data that you make calculations and reach a conclusion. That is the scientific process.

And yes, atheists are not immune from being unreasonable. Some atheists hold bizarre and preposterous beliefs. The only unifying thing among us is a lack of belief in God, leaving room for varying eccentricities.

Christianity Etc › Re: How Do You Know Your Religion Or Denomination Is The Right One by McSterling(m): 12:59pm On Dec 14, 2014

jesuslovesme123:
No, it's not, dear soul. You just need to keep an open mind, and not feel threatened by The Truth.

John 8:32 - "Then you shall know the truth, and the truth will set you free"

Okay, Madame/Mademoiselle.

Christianity Etc › Re: How Do You Know Your Religion Or Denomination Is The Right One by McSterling(m): 12:41pm On Dec 14, 2014

Ichiato:
Bro, you still fail to grasp what I'm saying. While you agree with me that for some indoctrination is not the reason for their believes you went ahead asking me the percentage of those people like that matters. probably you and many others who are critics of religion were most probably also indoctrinated in one believe or the other.

Why not ask yourself why you and many others like you are now at odds with the believes you were indoctrinated in if indoctrination is the sole reason behind ones religious believes. You still went ahead to Ask for the percentage of those who were able to keep up with their new found believes. Should we also consider those who have gone back and fort their entire lives?

The baine of my argument is this. As adults we all get to question all what we have been taught in childhood. Its a psychological fact. That is why many adolescents are always at odds with elders and that is why the human society is an ever changing one. There are cultures we get to keep from childhood and there are those we get to discard. To further prove my point. Islam and Christianity are today known as the most populous religions in the world. But was that always so? Africa knew nothing of these religions that are so popular today. Was indoctrination any part of the reasons these religion became popular? At the end people just uphold believes that makes the most sense to their view of life. A view that must have been full of very many experiences of which indoctrination is just a part of.

I asked the percentage because I wanted you to contrast the number of such people who have converted to another religion and those who haven't. Of course I didn't expect you to quote any figures for me. When you contrast and compare these two you'll find out that the former is overwhelmingly low. That tells you that people are most likely never going to change their religion.

Many of us who have dumped religion didn't find it easy at all. It took a lot of struggle and time for us to dump it. But how many people can do this? How many can even attempt to question their beliefs? Aren't they mostly arrogant and uppity? Don't they think they're always right and others wrong even when evidence points against this? Don't we see them here on NL saying religion shouldn't be approached with reason or logic but with faith alone? And these are people who won't believe other things without thinking it through or requiring evidence, why is there an exception with religion? Don't you think the confusion of those going back and forth is a product of indoctrination? That should explain why they can't leave their religion once and for all.

Not everybody has the guts to question their religion, and the vast majority of those who do still hold on to their religions because of the fear their indoctrination has infused in them. That's when you hear stuff like "the ways of God are mysterious" and "God understands" or "we'll find out in heaven" and all such twaddle. And even those who abandon their religion still have their worldview shaped or heavily influenced by the religious culture they'd been indoctrinated with. And yes, indoctrination is one main reason why religions have spread. It's a vicious circle. Your parents teach you, and you teach your children and so on. Let's not forget society's role too. Why do you think the Bible tells you to teach your children religion from an early age? Why are there institutions meant for kids solely for religious instruction? It is to ensure that your beliefs crystallize with time in so much that you'll be very unlikely or unable to change it when you're grown, and consequently ensure continuance of that religion.

2 Likes 1 Share

Christianity Etc › Re: How Do You Know Your Religion Or Denomination Is The Right One by McSterling(m): 8:27am On Dec 14, 2014

jesuslovesme123:
Who is a Christian?

This is the mistake a lot of atheists make. You get into a debate about Christianity when you cannot even tell what it means to be a Christian.

There are many raised in Christian homes who are not true Christians.

I was raised in a preacher's home and for the first 16 yrs of my life, I thought I was saved but I was merely a bible reader, church goer, praise worship singer. But I did not know HIM, and I lived the life of a sinner, until the day I had a divine encounter with HIM. Only then did I become a Christian.

Many of the best (true) Christians I know, started out in Muslim, Athiest or Idol worship homes, and had a divine encounter with Christ.

Codswallop.

Christianity Etc › Re: How Do You Know Your Religion Or Denomination Is The Right One by McSterling(m): 7:34am On Dec 14, 2014

Ichiato:
Dear, why do people keep posting the above as if they have never heard of Christians who converted to Islam in adult or vise versa or better still children abroad who had no religious upbringing and yet claimed to find God in one religion or the other. True, in reality indoctrination is very capable of making one believe in something nonexistent but until the said thing can be proved to to be nonexistent you cannot site indoctrination as the reasons (out of many possible reasons) why one believes in the said thing.

BTW
Why is it that many atheist come here and create threads questioning others believes and not theirs. Faining ignorance whereas they know exactly what they are doing.It's easier asking questions than answering one. Many will never stand up to question their lack of believe but would rather question others believe and watch theirs perceived failings then use that to further justify their lack of believe. This one one of the reasons why I have resisted all temptation to post in such threads until know.

What is the percentage of those who convert? How many can even sustain the thought of converting. We can conduct a survey here on NL and ask adherents of each religion if they can convert to a rival religion or any religion for that matter for any reason. We can even go further to ask if they can ever leave their present sect for another e.g Catholic to Pentecostal or Sunni to Shi'a. The overwhelming response would be "NO".Why? Because each adherent feels absolutely confident that he's in the right. Infact, in recent times, more Muslims and Christians are deconverting and becoming nonbelievers than they are converting to the other's religion.

You imply that there are many other possible reasons apart from indoctrination why one might adhere to one religion over others, please let me know these "many possible reasons". The fact remains that the vast majority of religious adherents believe what they believe simply because they were raised in such belief systems. Anybody who disagrees is simply being dishonest and is a perfect epitome of indoctrination himself.

2 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by McSterling(m): 6:48am On Dec 14, 2014

Now the mystery remains, who truly shagged Mary? Who fathered Jesus? Definitely not the holy spirit cos he don't shag. Guess we'll never know.

Christianity Etc › Re: Television In Your Room Is An Agent Of The Devil - David Oyedepo by McSterling(m): 4:01pm On Dec 13, 2014

Codswallop.

Christianity Etc › Re: Why I Deny The Virgin Birth Of Jesus by McSterling(m): 3:59pm On Dec 13, 2014

Nice one, frosbel.

Politics › Re: APC Considers Fashola As Buhari's Running Mate - Channels TV by McSterling(m): 2:08pm On Dec 12, 2014

Alijajere:
Being muslim or cristian does not matter,we only need good governance

Exactly!

Politics › Re: APC Considers Fashola As Buhari's Running Mate - Channels TV by McSterling(m): 2:07pm On Dec 12, 2014

jaymichael:
Majority of those that are saying no to Muslim/Muslim candidate are the same people that will not vote for the APC even if they field Christian/Christian/Christian candidate. The SE & SS is locked down for GEJ no matter who APC field. So why play the game on their own terms? Bring on GMB/BRF and damn the consequences. GMB locks down the North, BRF locks down the SW, its game over. We cannot sacrifice credibility on the alter of ethno-religious card played by some inconsequential fools who want cluelessness to continue. BUHARI/FASHOLA will win. INTEGRITY and PERFORMANCE is what Nigeria needs right now, and we find it in BUHARI / FASHOLA candidacy.

1000 likes

Politics › Re: APC Considers Fashola As Buhari's Running Mate - Channels TV by McSterling(m): 1:55pm On Dec 12, 2014

kimond101:
You must be a religious bigot sir.
Our brothers and sisters in islam and Christianity are dying everyday due to bad governance of the present administration and all that you can think of is to still vote this present administration in because of religion.
Whether Christian muslim, Muslim Christian, Christian Christian, muslim muslim tickets. All we want is change!

Yes!

Politics › Re: APC Considers Fashola As Buhari's Running Mate - Channels TV by McSterling(m): 1:48pm On Dec 12, 2014

mistabiola:
Even if both of them are babalawo (herbalist), I will vote for them.

My Song Our Dream
------------------------------

Operation chase PDP out is not only on but gathering
momentum ...Full steam ahead.

INEC ...over to you ... The genuine wishes of the people
MUST count this time . .

February 14 is the date ....and BUHARI is the Man.
Stand in front of a moving freight train with no brakes at
your peril.

Operation...:

#KickOutGEJ...

#TakeBackNigeria...

#TeamGMB

That's the spirit.

1 Like

Politics › Re: AMAZING: Two Angels Caught On Camera Flying In Brazil (pics and video) by McSterling(m): 1:39pm On Dec 12, 2014

Kizmarty:
nawa oo...so you sef sabi how angels be en

Politics › Re: There Is Little Evidence Buhari Can Fix Nigeria - BBC Will Ross by McSterling(m): 9:35am On Dec 12, 2014

otokx:
Logical premise with no or invalid conclusion.

Or rather a conclusion with no or invalid premise(s).

Politics › Re: I Will Not Fail Nigerians – President Goodluck Jonathan by McSterling(m): 9:25am On Dec 12, 2014

You have failed us already. It's time to go.

Politics › Re: BUHARI Is Not Who He Claims To Be. I have Burnt my APC members Card by McSterling(m): 9:12am On Dec 12, 2014

great1:
reflecting back on the speech that Muhamadu Buhari gave last night, I have every reason to cast doubt that he never paid out bribes to politicians to vote for him. I believe on his behalf other politicians would have dolled out millions of dollars to greedy delegates to vote for him... I have every reason to question his mandate and whether he is the messiah to save Nigeria..

In 1983 he single handedly created the problem we are experiencing today by tampering with a democratic government claiming to be a hero. This dude is 75 years old. I'm sure Amaechi is only using him as a vehicle to get to Aso Rock and replace Jonathan. But I rather have GEJ voted in because he is trust worthy and he is the Leader we need. Not some old looking scarecrows with missing tooth coming to tell us Nigeria is corrupt, when he was the person who brought corruption to Nigeria...

Perhaps if APC had picked Kwankwaso, it would have been much clearer for them to win, but picking Buhari is the worst mistake they've made.
I rather not VOTE than to Vote for the same person who Killed my uncle because of his political hatred for minorities.

Goodluck to them..

You were never an APC member. Stop fooling yourself. Hundreds if not thousands have died under Jonathan's watch and he's shown us clearly that he cares about nothing else but his reelection. Shame on Jonathan.

Christianity Etc › Re: How Do You Know Your Religion Or Denomination Is The Right One by McSterling(m): 9:04am On Dec 12, 2014

This is an honest question that believers do not like to ask themselves. You are a Christian or Muslim simply because your parents were, and thus indoctrinated you with it. Some of you overzealous Christians would have been terrorists by now, had you been raised in a Muslim home.

38 Likes 1 Share

Christianity Etc › Re: Why So Many Atheists Hate Their Own Religion Of Atheism. by McSterling(m): 8:46am On Dec 12, 2014

gatiano:
don't mind them, especially the wannabe black too religious person claiming to be atheists, to them it is prestigious and it kind of give them a sense of little intelligence when infact they are looking for breakfast, lunch and dinner. their master the satanists(whiteman) who also claim to be atheist just to fool the black sheep is acting to be one but he isn't an atheist. He has jorneyed through out the earth and outside the earth, the only thing he keeps finding is non other than GOD. Why won't this white devils just accept GOD, they can't, it is impossible for them to submit to GOD, HE IS A BLACKMAN.

How deluded can you be, sir? Do you really believe this piffle you typed?

1 Like

Christianity Etc › Re: A Prophecy For New York City..disaster Looms. Pray For NYC by McSterling(m): 8:24am On Dec 12, 2014

Zikdik:
You won't recognize sarcasm if it pokes in the @ss with 12 by 12 pole.

Politics › Re: APC Governors Line Up For Buhari by McSterling(m): 6:12pm On Dec 10, 2014

Buhari will win the primaries.

1 Like

Christianity Etc › Re: Jacob And Genetics by McSterling(op): 5:20pm On Dec 10, 2014

gatiano:
nothing delusional, it is the truth. Nation of Islam had been before the earth and the sun which is over 70 trillion years ago? what is a yesterday's united states or the wholeworld's government? Just like in the days of Noah, sodom and gomorrah and pharoah, so shall it be today. but like i said The Nation Of Islam don't attack anybody, they must however say the truth. They seek and preach freedom, justice and equality.

Your delusions, my good sir, surpass me.

Politics › Re: You Think Jonathan Is All That Innocent, Then You Have To Read This by McSterling(m): 4:28pm On Dec 10, 2014

Op, which kain piffle be this na?! I'd readied myself to read a very insightful and analytical post but you gave us this codswallop?! Chai! #thereisnogodo!

Politics › Re: Why Aren't Africans Giving Solidarity For Michael Brown? by McSterling(m): 4:18pm On Dec 10, 2014

Ngwakwe:
I have watched the video severally, the shoplifting happened the same day according to the Ferguson Police and Michael Brown was the culprit.

However, the question is; Was the shooting related to the said shoplifting? the answer is definitely "No"

From what I read, someone dialed 911 after the shoplifting. The police guy was dispatched to the area after being given MB's description. So, that's how he accosted MB and his friend. In order words, the shoplifting created occasion for the shooting. Maybe if there was no shoplifting, there won't have been a shooting.

Christianity Etc › Re: Jacob And Genetics by McSterling(op): 8:01am On Dec 10, 2014

Pr0ton:
Common Nigeria they haven't crumbled, they are talking of destroying U.S.. They wan use their life play kite.

2 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: Christians Who Sin Are Hypocrites - Pastor Kumuyi by McSterling(m): 7:19am On Dec 10, 2014*

Chill out OP, even Kumuyi sins. He is a hypocrite just like several of you Christians.

1 Like

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