₦airaland Forum

One cannot do anything to get to heaven. Salvation is a free gift of God through Jesus Christ. Jesus has already done the work. We just believe in Him and walk with him daily. Our place in heaven is already secured by faith through the grace of God.

FOLYKAZE: morning bro. Was reading your post and laughing. Lol. Even your bible permit me to use harsh words. The way you handle dove is different from goat.

I wont say much about Ifa cuz I am not a practitioner yet. I have argued with babalawo and lamented about some confusion to him. It fact that they are making this knowledge fully presented to initiated ones. If you want to know everything about Ifa, it doesn't end in what you, what you taught or what you heard. You need to visit IGBODU and see it manifesting for you. Every Orisa will manifest before you and you will understand those forces. That is power of Africa. Can you tell Jesus to manifest before you? Ifa can do that.

Ifa you are yoruba, take your time and challenge babalawo to reveal secrets hidden in your mind to you. You know what I did? I hide cowries and ask him to find it with Ifa. Do any trick you wish....Ifa will reveal it even before you do it. Lol there is power in Africa......you leave it, the world use it against ya. Ask chinese about Iching.

After knowing Christ, I can no longer turn to any mystic arts. Do I believe that these powers exist? Yes, after all, all societies have at some point tapped into them. What we Yorubas call babalawo, the native Americans calls shamans, in the east they are called yogis, gurus, etc. But therein is the problem, none of these are universal in scope and the knowledge they offer is esoteric.

My interest in the points you raised is to know whether the Yoruba traditional system really does have any connections to 21st century science, specifically with respect to organizing data in computer systems. I really did find the link between the 256 odus (16 x 16) and the 8-bit and 16-bit systems we use in modern day computing to be very interesting. I thank you for that bit (no pun intended) of information. I don't think it's a conscious link, rather just another indicator that our universe is governed by amazing mathematical order. I was aware that Egyptian, Sumerian, and certain other cultures had this kind of knowledge (albeit not to the extent we know it today), but I didn't know that it was do close to home, that we Yorubas also were clued in. This only further underscores that there is so much to know about Africa's past heritage, which is what I'm about. But as fascinating as it all is, none of it offers answers to the fundamental questions of sin, morality, justice, purpose, etc.

To answer your question squarely, I want you to seek Jesus Christ. Don't seek miracles, signs, etc. Just seek Christ and you will see the other things follow. The first thing required is to remove pride from the equation.

Since I have agreed to look at the texts you supplied. I would like to implore you, if you really are someone seeking truth, to open your heart to God. Without pretense, arrogance, self-righteousness, or stubbornness. Reach out with all sincerity of heart. That is my challenge to you.

My feelings aren't hurt. Anyone who cannot bear harsh words isn't fit for argument on forums. It is about respect though and being able to submit your arguments coherently for consideration.

You misunderstood me. I asked to text backing up your points excepting the point you made about Africa being the cradle of civilization. That I'm well versed with.

As I said I will start looking at the resources. It doesn't threaten me or my faith and as I am able to surmise from what little I've read, Ifa still fails to deal with the critical issues.

Sleep well.

FOLYKAZE: Lol. You have spoken the truth but I will disagree with some of your points here.

I dont think I call you name personally because the way you present your points from start on this thread shows that you have open mind and willing to learn. Though you holding on your 'defence and weakness attack' but I forced my way in without insulting you.

If it because of what I said against Mr President you pointing at, I am saying I aint sorry about every bash I bath him with. This is stick and carrot game so I think stick is the best for his like. He is insulting my ancestors by patching my history to Judah. He cant even prove is point than pointing to one useless book. You can insult me but I will take it as words; nevertheless, you cant insult my ancestors without striking you. So I think I gave him the best thing.

And the knowledge I present is bunk? Lol. After shredding your forces in bible, you didn't give me credits o. Lol. You are free to call the knowledge anything. Having it isn't final, understanding it is what you need.

Ori is not life force. Emi is the life force. You know we have Emi, Ara and Ori? Ori is more like soul. Philosophically, it your 'me-ness' or consciousness. You have not answered my questions but I wont hesistate to bother you much. I will take your points as the way you understand it.

Adding, I love those having open mind. I really like to hang around people that want to learn. Let me reveal one secret to you......i registered on this site and didn't post here for two and half years. Why? I am reading and liking people's post. I can remember those days I cant sleep without reading logicboy post. Though I dont agree with everything he and other post but we still learn. I am not claiming I am the best or know all.......I am a seeker of enlightenment. And according to Ifa, we learn till death and continue in afterworld cuz Ifa is infinite. So I encourage you to continue learning.

And finally, I dont mock those who ask for books. You were contradicting yourself in your post. You were asking for a book and also saying you dont need a book. I was just kidding around with ya. I am sorry if I offended you on this.

Note this, when something is Infinite, books cant say everything about it. Though I am not discouraging you to stop reading, I am tasking you to observe and experience. If it about reading, I would have become babalawo but bro, it dont work that way.

I think with yeah, the OP and discuss you had with me on this thread as expose some reality to you. The option is yours to journey through it. The dark path has been lighten, it is up to you to walk through it. Nobody is threatening you with hell if you resist. But come to think of it......what is the essence of a person who doesn't know about himself or his history? Is it reasonable for a person to ignore is clothen for rags outside? If our father house fall on one side, it is our duty to rebuild it and not destroying it totally. Africa son....a word is enough for the wise. Goodnight

Thanks for the resources. I'll definitely look into them. One thing about me is that I love to learn and that's why I don't need to devolve conversations into name-calling as you do. Truth will stand for itself. I suspect though that the way you have chosen to present this "knowledge" indicates that it is bunk but I will go along for now and read the texts you have provided.

In any case, to answer your question, Ori, as you said is an individual's essence. It's like their life force. It isn't unique to Yoruba tradition, other eastern cultures have similar concepts. You don't need to work do hard to try to prove what you know. I'll readily admit I'm not an expert in all things Ifa but now that you give provided some source text, we can check its merits.

You mock those who ask you to provide texts so how did you get your information? If it wasn't through written text, how would you know what to recommend to me?

FOLYKAZE: Adding on the electricity in spranging out African civilization



Do you know what Ifa says about Eja Ojiji and Sango? Lol.... If you want to understand Electric charges, how it operates through thunder and lightening, it is fully explained in Odu Okanran meji which gave birth to Sango.

Odu Okanran meji was brought down from Orunmila thousands of years ago because modern electricity. Only those that can reactivate their consciousness can understand this. And if you are looking for a book about this Odu, get 'Oju Odu merindinlogun' and do comparism between it message and theory of electricity, flow of charges and thunder.

Mr if you truely Yoruba, you know one you got lot to know. I am not claiming to know all but I am willing to learn more. If you want knowledge, acquire it with your five senses and not what some gullible minds put down. Cheers man

Can you please provide text written by someone other than yourself?

FOLYKAZE: lol. The Truth is scary and kinda hard to swallow. You can take what you want but the truth stand unless you prove me wrong. World does not necessarily mean whole earth. So if I say your world is paradise mean there is a special earth for ya? There are three evidence there, refute it man.



You need text and dont need text. What are you smoking?

Read about Electricity discovery on Wikipedia...... It started from Egypt and it premises.

About Ifa binary code.....get more informations here https://www.nairaland.com/1477407/ifa-ifa-practice-it-religion#18807997



If you understand the concept of Ori, why dont you understand spiritual case of Ori and ese? You no not what you saying.

Can you explain how Ori came about if you know what you saying?

Can you please provide some text not written by yourself?

FOLYKAZE: lol. The Truth is scary and kinda hard to swallow. You can take what you want but the truth stand unless you prove me wrong. World does not necessarily mean whole earth. So if I say your world is paradise mean there is a special earth for ya? There are three evidence there, refute it man.



You need text and dont need text. What are you smoking?

Read about Electricity discovery on Wikipedia...... It started from Egypt and it premises.

About Ifa binary code.....get more informations here https://www.nairaland.com/1477407/ifa-ifa-practice-it-religion#18807997



If you understand the concept of Ori, why dont you understand spiritual case of Ori and ese? You no not what you saying.

Can you explain how Ori came about if you know what you saying?

FOLYKAZE: @ NativeBoy

I need to know if you are a yoruba cuz I can best explain sin according to yoruba spirituality....so you might not understand me if you aint yoruba. Also, dont get me wrong cuz you might take this as tribalistic or hideous game......most yoruba words do not have direct english vocabulary.

Every individual have their Ori.
What ever you do affect your Ori either positively or negatively.

So I think if you know what Ori is as Yoruba, you will bring in the law of cause and effect. I think thats what pagan9ja called karma.

Lets reason about your questions......what happened to catholic priest after molesting a young boy? What has happened to those christians going against social moral code?

There is social and natural law that deal with sinners and there are also spiritual laws that balance the Ori.

For better understanding, the closest english vocabulary that best explain Ori is consciousness or 'me-ness'.


Yeah you were saying foreigners brought electricity, internet and others. Do you know civilization sprang out of Africa? Do you know the technology that gave birth to electricity was first develop in Africa? Do you know the coding of computer machine is base on binary codes and this is embedded in Ifa? This is what we are saying charging Africans to know themselves and their ancestral heritage. I have told atheist on this forum about the ancient technological developments in Africa before the other world developed it. Ifa is complex 5th generation computer while Osanyin is the 6th generation computer. I challenge you to provide any machine with artificial intelligence and I will provide you Osanyin built thousands of years ago by African.....yoruba specifically.

You were also asking why are we using electricity. Note, development of electricity started from Africa, why wont I use it when I paid for it? If I have problem with their products, since I have the materials and intelligence, why cant I rebrand and develop it? Japan are building their machine on their patterns. It takes only African to rebrand what they got. Our medicine, politics and social structures do not have comparability in other world.....so the question is why do we ignore what belong to us without improvement for what others own?


And lastly, if you want to deal with folykaze, dont bring bible to his face cuz he will shred it totally. Is it the word WORLD in john 3:16 that is giving you headache? Let me break it down.

1. According to http://i.word.com/idictionary/world, World is defined as 7 a: a division or generation of the inhabitants of the earth distinguished by living together at the same place or at the same time <the medieval world>
b: a distinctive class of persons or their sphere of interest or activity <the academic world> <the digital world>. Here you should understand the term World does not necessarily mean the whole earth.... I will accept your whole earth definition if you can provide another verse that back your points.

So from dictionary, it stated that World could mean distinctive part or group of people. So my point is from dictionary meaning, World in the john 3:16 could mean Jew/Israelites.

2. Another evidence to prove that 'World' mean group of people or race or tribe is found in the bible.

Isaiah 45:17
King James Version (KJV)
17 But Israel shall be saved in the Lord with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.

^^^From the above verse, can you say world mean whole Earth in that context? It is glaring that World in that context mean Israelites or Jew.

3. The word translated "world" in John 3:16 is the Greek word "kosmos." The word never means "every individual of mankind who ever lived." In fact, the word has at least seven different meanings in the scripture, depending on the context in which it's used. It can mean Gentiles (as opposed to Jews); it can mean the world of believers; it can mean the world of unbelievers; it can mean the physical creation; etc. So who the points are directed at can be define by Jesus and God which are found in Matthew 24:15 and Deut 6:7 respectively.

From the three points above, it is concluded that john 3:16 was directed to the world of Jew and not the entire earth. You can prove me wrong.


And the John 15:22 you quoted mentioned 'them'.....who are 'them'? They are the Jews/Israelites according to John 4:22 and Matthew 10:5-6. I dont see how 'them' apply to and you. And Israelites aint a person but group of people so 'them' is the best word to use which doesn't apply to you.

From the whole points, you have shown you read world out of context without serious and critical examinations. Jesus or bible God isn't for you. World technology and civilization sprang out of Africa.

What you display conclusively is inferiority mentality, brainwashing and ignorance. Hold unto what belong to ya buddy.

Aww man come on, now you're not being sincere. The meaning of "world" is clear as day. You're attempting to use linguistic hocus-pocus to shroud clear meaning.

In any case, I am intrigued by done the statements you made. Can you please provide some texts that I can read that show that electricity has African origins, binary code is embedded in Ifa, Osanyi is a 6th generation computer, etc. I am as Afro-centric as the next guy but I don't engage in revisionism. I know civilization sprang out from Africa so I don't need any text on that part.

Yes, I am Yoruba so i understand the concept on ori.

okeyxyz: Proof?? Really?? I laugh in dothraki

There's no such thing as artificial consciousness. You rush too quickly and naively to declare the above. The only proof here is your lack of understanding of the world of computing and programming. What the robot in the OP does is simply captures data, identifies/determines patterns in the data and organizes such data to simulate learning(it's actually a trick in it's algorithm, rather than actual learning). Like I said before, there's no such thing as artificial or computer borne consciousness. Consciousness entails self-awareness, self-identity, self-determination(eg: ambition) and self-preservation. How can a computer be any of these. Does this program ever ask itself why it is doing what it is doing? It can't because it is not self-conscious. A conscious entity would be aware that it acts in certain ways either out of pleasure, or the will to survive or dominate in it's environment, etc, in other words self-interest. So what is the self-interest of this program? None!! It's just a robot, just processing what it's programmed to process in order to simulate learning.

Excellent point. It is highly advanced machine learning but it isn't sentient.

FOLYKAZE: You said it all bro..... I dont need to say much anymore.

@ Nativeboy, if you read the OP very well, you will understand I am not preaching any religion but sending a call or message to Africans to hold what belong to them. This message cut across atheism to Islam and christianity.

Also I dont do cherry picking. I chose the best verse to backup my points.....you cant expect me to quote whole bible here. If there are anything wrong in my bible quote, kindly show me.

Writing this was a motivation from the biography of rev. Ogunbiyi who founded Reform Ogboni frat. He was a christian, he lead churches and was highly respect. Despite, he didn't ignore Asebaye. They still worship Orisa in Ogboni today and I am proud I saw some pastors there too.

You were a christian because you were indoctrinated. You didn't make the choice. How long are you going to stand against your fathers?

Considering your query on sin...... In yoruba, sin is more social and cultural. In term of spirituality, it temper with your Ori. Have you every heard 'oun a ba gbin la n ka, asegbe kan o si' meaning whatever you sow you reap, there is no cause without an effect. That is why you have your Ori to guild you and stay by you in everything. Your Ori is your saviour......why are you ignoring it for another jew who doesn't care about you?

Gentlemen,

You are actually proving my point. Indeed all cultures have their own moral codes but what happens when someone breaks that moral code (sin), is it just a matter of saying sorry and we all move on? Again, no society's moral code adequately deals with the issue of sin.

You talk about the law of karma that is found in all societies. Where is the karma for the little girls in Congo being raped and killed and for the perpetrators that are never brought to justice? You have to see that what you are saying is that there is a self-dispensing justice system that balances good and evil in the world. This is simply not true.

Your main point though is that why do those such as myself reject our ancestral religion in favor of a foreign one. I will answer by asking you this question: why do you use the Internet when it was created by westerners. Why do you prefer (I assume) to have electricity instead of candlelight or lanterns? After all, these were brought to us by foreigners. So you see that you cannot reject something on the basis of it being foreign, especially when that foreign thing is superior. Now please do not take that to mean that I am saying that foreigners are superior to us. That is simply not true. What I am saying is that until Judeo-Christian God revealed himself to the world through Jesus Christ, it was entirely fine for each society to practice its own religions.

Truly, these times of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent, (Acts 17:30 NKJV)

But now that Christ has come, all should come to him because he is not the God of the Jews alone but the God of all:

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. (John 3:16 NKJV)

If I had not come and spoken to them, they would have no sin, but now they have no excuse for their sin. (John 15:22 NKJV)

I hope i have been able to make my points clear.

@FOLYKAZE

A couple things:

Conversion to Christianity isn't based on based on God or Christians satisfying a condition that suits you. I think that if you are a sincere skeptic really searching for God, you will find him. The first thing though is to remove pride or self-righteousness from your person. Please note that I didn't say to check your brains at the door as some like to assert that Christians have abandoned the use of their brains.

The point is this: God responds to a sincere heart.

The main question you asked about why people such as myself follow the Christian faith rather than the traditional Yoruba faith is simply because no other faith besides the Christian one deals squarely with the issue of sin: it's consequences and the remedy.

It never ceases to amaze me how atheists will say that African Christians are still slaves to the white man when:
1. The Gospel was brought by and to Jews (not white)
2. Africans were among some of the earliest converts (the coptics in Egypt, the churches in Ethiopia)
3. As you rightly pointed out, many atheists ridicule their ancestral spiritual heritage as primitive and backwards but will sing the praises of eastern religions like Buddhism, Sikhism, etc
4. Most atheists espouse western thought and ideals, telling us to depart from our own paths and in essence be like the white man. Think as he thinks, act like he acts, value the things he values, etc

If you are pointing out that those who brought the gospel to Africa also included western thought in the package then I don't disagree, but the Gospel can stand outside of western thought. Take the Aladura Churches for example, these are churches for Africans by Africans.

In short, you took verses out of their context to use them as evidence for your position which weakens your argument. Secondly, I do not see my acceptance of the Judeo-Christian as the same as rejecting my ancestral past; the religion of my ancestors is unable to address the critical issue of sin.

Lastly it isn't non-traditional religion that victimizes us, it's our own lack of self awareness but that's another topic.

I apologize for jumping around.

Kay 17: I thought about that also, yet a theist's view will be entertained.

I'm not looking to enter a debate here. My intention is to simply state my perspective since you stated that you would entertain the view of a theist. As a theist, this evidences to me that only an intelligible conscious mind, and not an unguided process, can create another mind.

What puts people on the path to hell is the rejection of Jesus Christ who paid the ransom for our sins.

Now, when we make choices, God is looking at the heart. So the question you have to ask yourself before taking a decision is "What is motivating me to do this?" To make the right decision, you would have to answer that question honestly. Without knowing what is in your heart, I cannot make any further statements.

If it's because of peer pressure or something like that, personally I wouldn't do it.

plaetton: It is kind of silly what you are saying.

The Op's mind is agitating, his spirit is yearning for freedom from long expired dogmas.
And you are telling him to simply believe harder and to brainwash his brain more?.
You are asking him to suspend all rational thoughts and just plunge back into the ocean of ignorant bliss?

If religion belief is not rational , but only faith, then why do Christians come on NlL to make arguments with atheists?
As a matter of fact, why do preachers preach at all by trying to rationalize what you clearly think is irrational?

Please point to where I stated that the OP suspend rational thought or where I stated that one could not make rational arguments for their belief. In fact I provided the OP a resource that address the points raised.

I don't pretend to have all the answers, but I believe that if you are really searching for God, he will reveal himself.

I am a Christian and I constantly examine my faith so do not think that you are alone in that camp.

Here's something to consider though. If you or I could fully understand God, would He then still be God to us? Secondly, I have observed that whenever people ask the questions you are asking, they are asking to understand God on a purely rational basis. Everything has to make sense. But the underlying theme of the Bible is that man draws closer to God by faith. The faith factor cannot be removed and man cannot know God on a completely rational basis.

Here is a good site that addresses some of the questions you asked: http://www.alwaysbeready.com/index.php/bible-evidence

The bible does not supply us with the entire historical record of man and many things must be understood within the context in which they were said or written.

Ultimately if you want to know whether the Judeo-Christian God is true, the process outlined cannot be changed: you must take a leap of faith. He will not let you fall.

Hold on.

Because we have more important things to worry about. This is one of the reasons I am proud if my upbringing in Nigeria. Both male and female, it makes you tough mentally and ready for the harsh realities of life. You realize that who said this or that isn't going to put food in your stomach or clothes on your back or a roof over your head.

Even in the US just a decade or so ago, bullying was a nonissue. It was part of earning your stripes as you were maturing. However just like the UK, the US has become a nanny state where kids are mollycuddled.

Look, bullying is wrong but that's not the issue here. The issue is that many kids growing up in the affluence of US have become mentally weak and many are even on drugs for one thing or the other. They cannot cope with life. Somewhere in Africa is an 11 year old girl whose parents have died and now shoulders the responsibility if caring for her two or three younger siblings. One must ask why she doesn't commit suicide.

ooman: i only made a point that our government is filled with corrupt people, and these are all god worshipers, so god has no influence on them, he is therefore useless to the human community...

Is your point that because some people don't live up to a standard, the standard is useless?

ooman: All you quoted is just paul's illusion.

The bible tells you thart your righteousness is like filthy rag, then it gives you a christ for you to believe as a saviour, don't you think someone is playing some mind game on you? You been brainwashed.

I think its the average believing nigerian that fill up the government and not some aliens, so that comment is just a failed excuse.

Who would the someone be? And what is their endgame after so thoroughly brainwashing me?

On the other point I disagree that the average believing Nigerian is corrupt. They, like everyone else, live within a system that insists upon corruption as the way to get things done.

ooman: Ok, let's move on from here, how does going to a dead guy you call christ heal you. Are u suggesting that as a xtian, u are now perfect? If no, then what is the essence of your christ? If yes, why is nigeria corrupt, considering its filled with jesus worshippers?

If Christ didn't rise, then it is all I'm vain but he did rise again. I go to him because my righteousness is like a filthy rag before God but God attributes the righteousness of Christ to me. So while I am not perfect (as a result of being in flesh) I try to reflect the way of Christ so as to be a good epistle. Nevertheless, however I might fall short, because of Christ I am justified before God.

To get clarification, do you think it is the average believing Nigerian that is corrupt or our system of government that begins with our "leaders"?

ooman: Ok then, you got it wrong. No one is a saint, we all do 'stuff' sometimes, that's my point. I never expected you to take it personal on me, or are you suggesting you are perfect?

No I am no saint.

You actually hit the nail on the head when you stated that I was a psychopath for running the traffic light. That is exactly it. My analogy to which you so rightly responded to correctly is that my action is of someone who is sick (a sinner in other words). Now as the Yoruba proverb goes, "the day a sick person realizes he is sick, that is the day he has received healing." By coming to Christ, I admit that I am sick and that's the day the healing process can begin.

ooman: The point is it works, that's why its still in wide use today.

And your point on the questions exactly is?

I'm just trying to understand your claim that you are able to stop telling lies? So even if you did something wrong, would you confess to it?

ooman: Because it saves in some occassions. Even abraham told a lie about his wife in egypt in genesis. So it helps in some cases.

And look at what the consequence could have been.

ooman: Am I able? Yes

Do I? No, am no saint.

I still don't see how asking for forgiveness helps!

If you are able to stop telling lies, why do you tell you lies?

ooman: Good, next: what you need is not to ask for forgiveness from your psychedelia, what you need is to simply stop being a psychopath. Simple.

Your psychedelia is your god.

All quips aside, I'm glad we're having a fruitful discussion. Let me ask you this,

Are you able to stop telling lies?

ooman: You are a psychopath for driving through the red light.

Ahh... To that I will freely admit. I am a psychopath (a sinner) and sin has horrific consequences.

ooman: Yes, but god told him to leave his family and he did, god separated him from others so he can be his own god, and of his descendants.

That apart, are you chaldean, if no, why claim the chaldean god?

Are you saying the Chaldean god is the Jewish god as well?

ooman: I thought u worship jesus not abraham, and jesus was jewish

The point was that God does not belong to the Jews since Abraham was a Chaldean.

Don't want to burst anyone's bubble but is there no one else concerned that everything that points to progress is foreign owned. Where are the local industries or local entrepreneurs. Is Africa's wealth going to be owned by foreigners again.

Logicboy03: Do you see the kind of psycopath christianity has turned you into? Somebody must die for forgiveness to be significant. Th person should die and shoulder your sins.....lolz


#irrationality

I must ask why the name calling? In any case, consider this analogy: There is a law that when the traffic light is red, you must stop. Now say you always drive through the red light and remarkably didn't injure or kill anyone and the local police always just goes right on "forgiving" you. Now one day, you are coming to the traffic light and you see a horrific wreck as a result of someone running the traffic light just as you have always done. Now it may not stop you from doing it, but something will at least prick your heart. Am I a psychopath because my heart was pricked?

ooman: @ bold; Since all gods are made up, worshiping another man's god is worshiping that man by proxy

That is a non-sequitur. God doesn't belong to one race of man. He is the God of all. Was a Abraham Jewish?

Logicboy03: Quote a dictionary if you need to. Just get on with your point

I wasn't going to quote a dictionary. I was simply going to offer the biblical meaning of forgiveness. Forgiveness means that God treats your sins as though you never committed them in the first place. Now if God just went ahead and did this without the death of Christ, what significance does it have to those who are forgiven. In such a world, sin has no relevance since God will treat it as though we hadn't sinned anyway. The purpose of Christ is to show us that God will not just act as though we never sinned, the purpose of Christ on the cross is to tell us that our sins just don't go unnoticed. But if we humble ourselves and admit our sins being convicted as a result of Christ on the cross, then God will forgive. Then, it is as though you never sinned.

True enough that Nigerans attribute every negative thing to juju, but don't kid yourselves into thinking they don't exist.