₦airaland Forum

Etinosa123456:
For some reason.. bots keep banning me if I quote Tao11

Well abt ur feeble minded claims that Benin never conquered Akure

See the pics below...
It was Posted by u
Coded2

Etinosa123456:
Lol... The fact that your Yoruba historians were to document them, that shows that they were true...

Lol. No history doesn’t work as simplistically as your mind works. Not at all.

What makes Egharevba’s account a classic, for example, is not simply because of his Bini heritage, not at all.

Rather, it is because the sources of his information on Benin is the Bini court historians, etc.

And many of his statements which relate to Ife are in turn indeed corroborated by Yoruba accounts of Ife.

The second pic was posted by u... Obviously the books u post, u don't believe them

The fact that u posted this means that u believed it as true..... Despite the contradicting reports eso from Yoruba history that oranmiyan came instead of ife

No, the fact that I posted the first screenshot in reply to an ignorant Bini means that he must shut up and accept what his fathers said.

But if you want to impose your fathers‘ statements on the Yorubas, then that’s where we draw the line and check what our own sources say.

But in this case my sources agree with your fathers’ at least to the extent that your first Oba was a Yoruba man from Ife.

Regarding the second screenshot, which you’ve been latching on to for long as evidence, first of all the red highlight mentions Yoruba regions where cloths were made to rescue Benin people from n@kedness.

The other part of this screenshot depicts invasions from Benin Kingdom into these frontier Yoruba regions.

So, if invasions and kidnapping is your latest evidence for imperial rule, then we can all agree that Aje from Ibadan ruled Benin kingdom because of his invasions..

Just as Ogedenbe from Ilesha also ruled Benin kingdom. Sighs! The inferiority complex here is thick.

Etinosa123456:
Tao Tao ... Always lieing... Goan read abt the deji osupa....
My excerpt above stated that Benin installed a new Deji but u are blind as usual to see it...not surprising tho

Mumu...I should poi

When the debate is lost, just call the interlocutor a lair, and say you don’t have to present your evidence unless the interlocutor goes to find your evidence for you. Is this the technique you’ve resorted to in shame??


My argument is that, your references are based on early one-sided account which emanate originally from Benin via Olfert Dapper in the 1600s.

The actual kingdoms being discussed do not corroborate such one-sided grandiose account.

If anything of such nature was true, they would gladly embrace the Benin part of their heritage just as the Itsekiri-Yorubas do.

gregyboy:
Can see how useless and heart blinded you have become TAO11, you need sleep, just in a bid to satisfy your ego and disprove benin, everything to you must be yoruba..... Dummy
You see the useless meaning you put up there go and clean it,

Ayelala is an idol, that the benins use in swearing and also warn people, if someone steals and you call ayelala they will come to the neighborhood were they stole they will march round the location giving warnings with their bells, just to tell the person to return it, after some days you fail to return it, the thiefs stomach becomes large filled with water and endless pain

So TAO11 think again.... Have i turned you to the shadow of yourself or have i now brought the real you out

Run from me.... Before you allow a benin man cosumes you with filled hate

One of your daddies already exposed you. He admitted unashamedly that it was the Yorubas who introduced the Binis to all the deities they worship.

Refer to time stamp 1:26 of the video below for his confession:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqso2h2gRDw

Yes, “Ayelala” is a Yoruba word for a Yoruba deity, and it simply literally means “the world is enormous”. Cry and die if you want to, my insecure slave.

I knew what Ayelala is used for since Yorubas obviously introduced it to your daddies. So spare me the story of what the Yorubas through your daddies to use it for. I knew that already.

What I’m asking of you is simply what the word “Ayelala” means in Edo language, if it is an indigenous Edo deity as you’ve falsely and insecurely claimed.

The word “Ayelala” has no meaning in Edo language. Why? Because it is an indigenous Yoruba deity that was introduced to the Edos by their Yoruba masters.

No body invents a system and then proceed to name it in another alien language that he himself does not understand. I guess only the Edos do that, according to dumb gregyboy.

gregyboy:
And your brothers said your writeups are always meaningless and still lengthy... Lol

They couldn’t say that and yet gave me all those likes that brings out your tears.

Yea ghostwon said i was not thinking deeper because i support the benin-ife myth, but your brothers have always seen you as a foilish lady

Yes, he said you lacked the ability to use your brain.

And you later proved that he was correct by ingesting his words even when you had no evidence.

TAO11 am coming to resurface the thread

You’re coming just as Atiku is cuoming??

gregyboy:
Lol, mumu you only brought accounts of oyo people, go check my previous statement, i said only oyo people and some part of western yorubas recognized ife as an idolatary center, as i quoted religious centre..... And the great samuel johson brought the idol oduduwa into life with his pen

Can we see account of the various yorubas admitting to this facts too before 1897 because i know the ijebu in contact with the whitemen so as itsekiris so why post only oyo

My stance is samuel johson was the guy who united all yorubas into one canopy during the yorubas civil war, and before then ife was recognize as a religious centre to only the oyo yorubas and not the entire yorubas,
Awolowo who happens to be a fan of samuel johson for his political aspirations renforced Samuel's Johnson desires untill yorubas were fully united, the ooni was seen before now as a chief priest, awolowo uplifted him from chief priest to a king and demoted alafin who the British made Chairman of kings council

My stance is still well standing with no disproval

Samuel j, brought both ife and oduduwa into life... Disprove

You are obviously a retard ignoramus. I have already demolished you AwoLowo straw and Johnson straw

I cited you four different early references to Yoruba groups including Ijebu and Oyo acknowledging the imperial primacy of Ife/Oduduwa.

It is your now your duty to provide evidence of where Samuel Johnson invented Oduduwa as well as evidence for every claim you make.

He who makes a claim have the burden of proving it. And what can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. So, help yourself.

gregyboy:
Lol, what does it mean in Yoruba... Start coining words fast

Aye means the name of the God, lala means loud

Putting this two together it gives aye-sounding message

Ayellala is used to curse who so ever has stolen, lied, and people that do evi, l no evil doer can step in the shrine of ayelala or even even a wtch..... They will freeze

TAO11 you nor get sense.... Your matter tire me and you still asked the questions i would keep flogging madness out of you ...

Assuming i dont know the names my writups and proved as well as the comments could have made yoy satisfied

May god help TAO11 and those who supports her by hiding and giving her likes they are the people god should help more

Thank for admitting that “Ayelala” has absolutely no meaning in Edo language.

Moreover, one of your fathers in seen in that video admitting point blank that the Yoruba gave you Binis deities to worship.

“Aye” does not mean “God” in Edo language. “God” in Edo language is “Osa” and sometimes “Oghene”.

Also, “lala” does not mean “loud”. It simply has no meaning in your Edo language. I know this makes you so sad.

“Ayelala” broken to its syllabic component is: “Aye-li-ala”.

“Ayé” is a general Yoruba word which simply means “the world”.

“Lí” is the third person present continuous Yoruba equivalent of “have”/“has”.

“Ala” is a regional Yoruba word (popular among the Ilajes and the Ikales) meaning “enormity”.

“Ayel’ala” is a Yoruba word which therefore literally means: “The world is enormous”.

I really hope you won’t eventual become suicidal this way you’re going.

cc: AreaFada2, macof.

gregyboy:
Lol, mouthful lady..... Visit my thread were i placed a price worth of 10,000 naira cash price, to whom ever can prove benin-ife connection from the Europeans arrival till the end of the empir 15 century to 1897, with archeological evidence backing to support it too

Would you ever give up even if you see the truth glaring at you, and i know ife is a myth but you still using it to sustain your yorubaistic ego and also fooling your brothers into it,
For you to admit i defeated you, you rather take sniper like awolowo and die like rat, i would be glad to present you a calabash like the ogboni to hang yourself, many times i have destroyed your lies, instead of you to keep shut and accept fact you go behind my back on an igbo thread to claim benin ties with yorubas, so to prove your point there, that's why am here to disprove such fallacious claims of yours and
Your foolish yoruba brothers acknowledge you for your deceit

Tao11 you went behind my back without tagging me to support your egoistic claims of the benin-ife myth, i constantly tell you desist from it, you still went ahead to post it, to support your points against igbos, and you didnt mention me to be aware, you must be a coward lije your brothers who gave you numerous likes for it,
You and your brother are morons and cowards for doing such if yorubas can claim benin with their false myth, then we will allow any tribe to do same, afterall the yorubas did it aswell even when we know the stroy of their connection to benin was made up and untrue ,
If you wont allow that, then go back and erase those useless point of yours and apologize abd tell your brothers to do the same


Note
tao11 you run from threads when debating me, i know you so well, when your not running, you will bring a different topic to serves as distraction, and if you cant escape you pray another party joins the argument till, you bore us out the threads, the only power you had was when we use to argue on the ownership of oduduwa, then i also use to beat you at it too


Follow on this thread, bring your brothers along too

https://www.nairaland.com/5835965/prove-benin-ife-connection-archeological

Come with the relevance

TAO11 you still have not proved to me why is the
Whydmn guy the only one on the king list claiming ogun ruled ife as a priest not as a king tho, because in the past ife was not having king but priest

You still have not prove to me why you believe ogun is a Yoruba idol and not benin

And you also said the author of the article agreed that ogun and Obalufon abi obamakin was the sane person as ogun and not different people

Rants and tears of my drowning slave

If you are ready to address any of my arguments then wake me up.

When I put forward an argument, what you must do is to engage such argument by raising specific contentions regarding it.

What you do instead as a dummy is to repeat the same rants that you had raised prior to my argument which refutes them.

You never point out what contentions you see with the latest argument. I didn’t expect too much from my slave though.

Lastly, if you must a claim about some other threads then do so by posting a link of the said thread, and I will reply you with a screenshot/link of the specific page where you gazed-out and got disgraced by my humble self.

And for the particular link which which you’ve unashamedly posted here, the attached screenshot shows your final comment to me where I disgraced you and magnified your ignorance.

You gazed-out only on page 2. Here is a link to the page where you were disgraced:

https://www.nairaland.com/5835965/prove-benin-ife-connection-archeological/1#89298903


Here is another one of your propaganda threads where my refutation of your “no Ife-Benin” rant got you running away till date:

https://www.nairaland.com/5839972/post-evidence-benin-ife-connection-prior#89664642

I literally disgrace and chase you away using facts from the propaganda threads that you yourself created.

I dare you to continue posting links to your propaganda threads, and I will continue to magnify your shame by highlighting where you fled after being disgraced. I double dare you.

You got whipped on every single one of your propaganda threads. Keep them coming, there is more than one of them. Nothing should be holding you back, right?

Name me one person on the whole of Nairaland who thinks you are mentally fit. There is absolutely none. I ‘rubbished’ you to that point where you’re you regarded by virtually everyone as trash.

Your brother @ghostwon literally said that you lacked the ability to use your brain. It is my pleasure to have reduced you to a Nairaland rag.

gregyboy:
Not to draw this discussion too long, i accept the king list of roupell was the correct one, since you insist it must be, the list included ewuare and excluded oromiyan am i right........ but why exclude oromiyan if he indeed rule, if he didnt rule did Roupell's state it there was a king who didnt rule.....in his article


Are we also going to accept the first king list of ife kings, just to be correct too, because the first kinglist didnt involve ogun ruling as king more so Roupell's king list informants were fewer compared to thomas informants, talbots who collect is list of kings after 1924 and included oromiyan we don't kniw who were is evil informants he decided not to say who ia informants wee, because it was a distortion to include oromiyan into benin history as a whole egharevba also worked with talbots list too,


I never said oral tradition is not accepted, only if it is not a myth atleast the oral traditions must be traceable with various account,
UnLike the story of oduduwa were samuel Johnson used is pen to give him life,and,forcing him to come from mecca, sky, and lastly the revise version you support oke era

See am not you, who dwell on myth am the one trying to cure you from your insanely love over mythology over facts, i descredited the benin ogun story as a god king son, because i know it is a myth and i never used it to claim ownership, i also personal disagreed on ogiso ruling as rulers in benin but you TAO11, the great dweler and queens of mytg disagreed with me ogiso ruled benin and Oronmiyan came saudi arabia to displace them inother to prove your point oromiyan really came to benin just to uplift your dead ego, you finally accepted ogiso was a benin mythology... Tao11 the wise lady, D

First of all, at no point did I tell you that Oranmiyan managed to be installed as Oba. I dare you to point out where I stated that Oranmiyan was installed as Oba, you huge dunce.

Instead, I stated the precise opposite which was that his son became the first Oba, and that was because the pocket of resistance to Oranmiyan from some of the elders were sufficient enough to dispirit the original plan that he should be formally installed as Oba.

Extant Yoruba and Benin accounts recognize his son (Eweka 1) as the first Oba of Benin.

Secondly, I you lied as usual when you noted that the list included Ewuare 1. That’s a huge Edo lie. Ewuare 1 never feature on the kinglist of Roupell which happens to be the first Benin kinglist.

So, my question still stands tall: Where did the extra twelve audio Oba of Benin (including Ewuare) in today’s kinglists pop out from??

Important Information: Learn to type in English language going forward.

gregyboy:
Eware existed, even though the Europeans didnt see him rule
The esan fleeing from benin was from the result of Ewaure, the towns he conquered are still much Are alive

You're not a bright person obviously. Just like my prior explanations, the Esan fleeing Bini itself is based on oral account. The Esan alive today are not the very same people who supposedly fled (if anyone fled Benin in the first pkace). The Esans of today must resort to an oral account in order to uphold the position that their fore parents fled from Benin -- It goes back again to oral account.

Also, the supposition that Ewuare is the reason why they fled (if they fled from Benin at all) is also based on oral traditions. So everything -- no matter how dumb you are not to see it -- goes back to be based on oral tradition.

,his grave site is still at isi in benin,

I have refuted you on multiple times. A grave by itself proves nothing. The grave (which is presumably made in a pre-literate setting) doesn't by itself inform you about the name and life of the person supposedly buried (if anyone was buried there in the first place). One would still have to resort to an oral account which would say that it is indeed Ewuare that was buried at so and so place. It goes back again to oral account.

So, you're stuck with oral accounts apparently.

And i never stated that oduduwa never existed or ogun never existed because Europeans never had contact with them, atleast they must be something tangible to refrence is existence to, Unlike the yorubas who never kept any records of their people,

All the exploits of Oduduwa, et al. from the unification of all the primordial settlement under one political rule, to the commissioning of the city wall, among innumerable others are all based on oral account just as in the case of your Ewuare I.

So, you must explain why you will adopt a double-standard of accepting oral accounts when it's convenient for you.

ooni was a priest in ife, untill recently he started assuming the title of a king, and caused political unification of the yoruba people

Really!? What date did Ooni change from priest to King? And who changed him? Remember that your JoHnSon straw has been shattered. Just as your AwOlOwO straw which you've now fled from.

Babe i dont even want to go inside the myth of ife, because it is a myth on his own, so as ife kinglist

You mean the myth of how Benin City was founded by the last born son of God??

Or the myth of how your Ogisos sky-dived into Benin City round about without any parachute??

Or the myth of how a European supplanted the last Ogiso to establish himself as the first Oba of Benin??

Which myth exactly??

Moreover, I have already exposed your fraud on the screenshot you attached here. I think you should do yourself the good of always reading what you reply to. It makes you appear less dumb. Here is the reply to it which I have given earlier:

First of all, your attachment refers specifically to post-1800 kings and not all the kings from the beginning. This therefore excludes the era of King Ogun.

Secondly, nowhere does the author of your attachment say anything to the effect that these four lists of post-1800 kings “shouldn’t be taken seriously”. This is simply your Edo lying nature kicking in.

On the contrary however, the author of your attachment finds it “impressive” that these independent lists coming originally from a semi-literate context shows “an absolute consistency” in general.


Having said that, the issue of the ifs-king list here is no where near the mess of the Benin kinglists where Captain Roupell was originally informed by the Benin palace historians and others tin 1897 that there are twenty-three (23) Benin Obas between from Eweka1 and Ovonramwen.

Today however, the Benin kinglists now feature thirty-five (35) Benin Obas between Eweka1 and Ovonramwen.

Where did the extra twelve (12) audio Obas pop out from??

gregyboy:
Lol , samuel johson untied yorubas with the mythical ife, when he wrote the history of the yorubas in 1897, but that couldn't hold them because most of the yorubas couldn't read his book or have access to it, awolowo who read the book, finally achieved samuel johson aim.... To frictional unite the yoruba into one ancestory in a bid to stop the yoruba civil war and the enemity it created,
Samuel johson saw that all yorubas spoke a similar language tho not from the same ancestory
All he did was to unite them under some mythical history of a diety from ife, Oduduwa was a diety at ife he was worshiped as a god, and not the newly invented eledumare guy, the eledumare was brought in recently to accompany
That oduduwa existed as a king on earth TAO11 clap for me i be guru

No you're a dummy. Refer to the attached for your refutation.

cc: LegendHero, BabaRamota1980

Hurry up and begin a search for someone else. Your Awolowo and Samuel Johnson Straws have been shattered before your very eyes.

Tinubu?? ?? ??

.

Atigba:
You have a sharp memory

You are right I made mention of that before base on the information at my disposal.

I have learn more of our history overtime, we have been able to identify the children of Ogiso Owodo. They left Ogiso palace because their mother Oakha was accused of committing adultary by another Ogiso Owodo wife Esagho.

Assokpodudu is the first son and crown prince of Ogiso Owodo, Ekerladahan is the second son born by Lady Esagho.
The third son is Ozorgbor and fourth son Oigi.

Assokpodudu the crown prince established Uzea in Esanland.

Ekerladahan founded Ughoton, Ughoton is the ancestral home of the Uhrobos in Igodomigodo.

Ozorgbor founded Uromi in Esanland.

Oigi founded Ekperi in Esako.

I am glad you’ve now realized that I was right about the point I made a year ago.

For clarification to those who may seek it. cc:Osagyefo98, Mraphel, 900winner.

Both the Yoruba and Benin extant traditional accounts admit that Oduduwa is not from Benin.

Do not be deceived by these crooks who seek to ground the false deceptions that Benin traditional account says Oduduwa is from Benin.

(1) In the year 1897, Captain Ernest Roupell recorded traditions from the Benin authorities which is to the effect that the first king of Benin [Eweka1] is a Yoruba man from Ile-Ife. — Roupell’s Officials quoted in H. Ling Roth (1903), p.7.
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.
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(2) P. Amaury Talbot in the year 1926, as well as Chief Jacob Uwadiae Egharevba in the 1930s also published similar Benin traditional accounts to the same effect that the Benin monarchy originated from Ife.
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.
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(3) The politically motivated equation of Ekaladerhan to be one and the same person as Oduduwa has been traced by historians to have first originated from Benin in the 1970s.

This false equation has been traced to the following amateur Bini writers who unsurprisingly made no attempt to cite the source of their completely strange story, nor named any informant: S.B. Omoregie, D.U. Edebiri, Edun Akenzua, and A. Iyare.

— [G.A. Akinola(1976:23-27); D.M. Bondarenko(2003:63-67)].

Moreover, this modern revision (which attempts to turn the extant official and traditional Benin account on its head) was first announced to the Benin public during the 1978-9 coronation of Omo N’ObaErediauwa. — [R.Blench & M.Spriggs (2004:314)]

Despite its royal involvement when it was manufactured in the 1970s, this late, fake and apocryphal account is still not regarded in academia as the official Benin account.

The “official” Benin account remains that which regards the Benin “Oba” monarchy as originating from Ile-Ife. — [D.M. Bondarenko (2003), pp.63-67.]

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(4) In sum, both the Yoruba extant traditional account and the Benin extant traditional and “official“ account agree that Ile-Ife birthed the Benin “Oba” monarchy.

Atigba:
••• Ekaladerhan live and died in Ughoton according to our historian Egharevba, and my family Ogiso. •••

Atigba: I am glad you’ve finally agreed with me that Ekaladerhan (son of Ogiso Owodo) lived and died in Ugoton.

You once argued with me that nothing of such is true either according to Egharevba or according to Ogiso lineage history.

You argued strongly that Ogiso Owodo died leaving no child behind and that Egharevba account made no such mention of any such Ekaladerhan.

I am glad to see your now-informed comment here as a real-life testimony of the fact that we are bound to learn more as we live.

Remember the exchanges between you and I [TAO11] at the thread found in the link below?:

...

900winer:
No his not, and we never said Benin didn't rule Lagos, but they met the Aworis there.

Benin never ruled Lagos at anytime in Lagos’ history. I have demonstrated this before, and I will do same again to rescue others from ingesting the repetitive lies of our Edo slaves.

Don’t fall for our slaves’ gimmicks. You must know as a matter of fact that they are your slaves, and they wouldn’t mind lying to you to buy their freedom.

Do not be deceived by their propaganda. They strongly believe in the idea of lying/distorting repetitively in the hope that at least some of the lies/distortions will stick as “truth” in people’s minds.

Although I’ve been quite busy, I will nevertheless be back here sooner or later to chase away our Edo slaves as I use to do. My tool for chasing them away will be ”truth” as always, and they will run away again, I promise.

Thanks macof for not allowing these crooks to peddle falsehoods freely. I also thank Atigba (even though we sometimes disagree) for standing against the distortion of his Ogiso heritage by these confused crooks who are neither here nor there.

Again, 900winer, do not believe the lies and distortions of these crooks no matter how many times they repeat them; no matter how crooked they twist, spin, and re-read what text says.

Moreover, no matter how desperate they try to falsely equate an 1848 account (which doesn’t even support their narrative) as a “pre-colonial” account; do not take their distortions and outright lies seriously. Lol.

Like I use to do, I will be back to chase away the insecure France-freak, namely: Prolog, aka Ghostwon, aka Logycs, aka Sanity, aka wtf77. He is scared of me, and he couldn’t hide it. He knows I have a way with exposing him and rubbing it on his ugly face.

Cheers!

Christistruth00:
Lagos Island belongs to the Aromire family till today. Aromire was a son of Olofin an Ile Ife Prince who was the first to settle Lagos with his followers. Aromire was a great lover of Water. He is said to have Swam to Lagos Island on first sighting it. Eko is the way the Yoruba Ijebu pronounced Ereko after Ereko on the Island. Eko (Ereko) means field in Yoruba and Ereko Ile is used to describe an Island.

The Oba of Benin needed a Port to do business with the Portuguese who advised him that Lagos Island was a good location so through an agreement the Awori Aromire family gave him Isale Eko part of the Island just as Sabon Gari is given to outsiders in Kano. The Oba of Lagos is not even the king of Lagos Island he is the King of Isale Eko which was the location of the international Slave Port . The Island belongs to the Aromire Chieftaincy family who are under the jurisdiction of the Olota of Otta in Ogun State who is the paramount traditional ruler of all Aworiland, just as the Alake is the ruler of all Egbaland and the Alaafin the ruler of all Oyos.

Some people have tried to distort Awori History out of Selfishness.

Absolutely!

Lies don’t last, and they’re beginning to realize it.

.

Yes I have a question as well, macof.

How do you embed an image to appear in-between texts?

Thanks.

macof:
••• The text says the land that belongs to Benin is the extreme end towards the lagoon
"Et Korame est restee isolee au bout de la grande lagune" . What we call Enuwa in Lagos to distinguish it from the rest of Lagos. Nobody is dragging enuwa
But your text clearly states that Lagos is owned by people who identified themselves to the Europeans as Ijebu and Oyo leaving the isolated wasteland at the edge of land to Benin •••

Well-done macof for giving these die-hard Lagosian-wannabe Edos a bloody nose over their irrational and inane Lagos claims. You killed it.

I will like to add a clarifying point and a comment though in relation to the so-called Bini area and the name “Eko”.

(1) First, knowing how these deluded Edos have been gripped hard by delusions of grandeur, I believe it is very important to clarify what is meant by Bini area.

The isolated wasteland left by the Ijebus, et al. to the Binis is no more than a Bini-occupied area which the Binis settled in as an immigrant resident trading community as is their trade practice in other parts of Yorubaland.

Moreover, the history of the European coastal trading activities in Lagos (as well as Ulsheimer’s 1603 eyewitness account of certain conflicts in Lagos) indicate that the Binis have settled there — as an immigrant resident trading community — since not-latter-than the late-1500s.

Apparently, they were following in the footsteps of the Ijebus who had also settled in “Lagos” as an immigrant resident trading community.

S.A. Akintoye (2010) has a list of the other immigrant resident trading communities that were also attracted to settle in ”Lagos” by the growing European coastal trading activity. Some of them are: the Ijaw, the Ikale, the Aja (from today’s Republic of Benin), the Egba, et al.

In sum then, your statement “nobody is dragging Enuwa” must be understood by these mythomaniacs in its proper historical context along the lines that the Bini resided there just in a similar way as the Igbos today are the major immigrant residents of Satellite Town for example.

This is not to say that the Igbos are the aboriginal owners of this slum, just as the Bini are not the aboriginal owners of the sandy wasteland. Both groups obviously came in at some different historical points in time, looking for greener pastures.

The aboriginal ownership of all the land remains the exclusive right of the earliest and original settlers of “Lagos” — the Awori subgroup of the Yoruba ‘race’. Everyone else came in centuries later for survival, hoping to benefit from the fruits of the Aworis’ ancient exploration.


(2) Having clarified the foregoing, the name “Eko” — contrary to what deluded Edo Nairalanders love to claim — is not of Bini origin whatsoever.

The 1845 work cited by our deluded Edo interlocutor clearly admits that the name “Eko” was not from the Binis but from the Yorubas.

I have argued this sometimes last two weeks on another thread citing the fact that the Edo word which our deluded Edo Nairaland friends often cling to is not even a general Edo word.

In fact, the word is not found in the Bini dialect. Rather, it is found exclusively in the Esan dialect. Yet, the Esans had no business in Lagos historically. It was particularly the Binis who came.

cc: RuggedSniper.

900winer:
Thanks But i don't even need to answer those guyz anymore you have already decimated them to the point where the have no place to hide

Got it!

The rate in which those guyz unsainbolt when they site you is alarming

That’s what slaves do.

To 900winner:

Please keep referring that died hard Lagosian wannabe (Etinosa) to the thread where I schooled him and used him to wipe the floor.

Or you may reply him with a specific link addressing each desperation he brings to you.

On that thread, I have already made him bleed for every lie and distortion he puts forward.

Always bear in mind that Edos are chronic mythomaniacs, distortionists, and pathological liars.

Each of them lies to himself/herself, so they have no problem lying to you.

Cheers!

This is TAO:

Thank you 900winner, macof, PVision2020, et al. for dealing with these crooks — especially the crook Ghostwon, aka Prolog, aka Logycs, aka Sanity33, among countless other disguised monikers which he often deletes after his disgrace.

These fools banned my TAO accounts hoping that they would be able to go wild and crazy with their delusions without any checks. Little did they know that they will meet you guys.

Guys, take note of the latest joke in town: “Oba” means “King of Kings” in Edo language.

I laughed hard to death on reading that. I just resurrected now. /s

This Edo schizophrenic should probably take over the comedy business from Bovi, Basket mouth, et al.

Perhaps he should also tell us which part of “Oba” is “King” and which part is “Kings”.

Also, he should inform us of how “King of Kings” for “Oba” fits into the phrase “Omo N’Oba”.

Bunch of Edo slaves of the Yoruba King of Benin.
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Moving on: I understand that I, macof, and others have already done justice to debunk the delusions of the Edos who claim that “Oba” began in Yorubaland in the 1940s.

We have already shown that “Oba” is a loan term from Yoruba language into Edo language. Hence the reason why our Edo slaves struggle till date to find its literal meaning from within their language.
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Moreover, Professor Cheikh Anta Diop cited an interesting account about ancient Ife (and the Yoruba word for “King”)in his “The African Origin of Civilization”.

This account is said by him to be found originally in an ancient Coptic text which was first translated from Coptic language into French in the year 1666 in Paris.

In this work, Professor Cheikh Anta Diop quotes Pédrals, who in turn was citing Morié, as follows:

”As Morié puts it, this Obba-Kouso was born at Ife, a locality with which our author is completely unacquainted. Adorned with the title, "first-born of the Supreme God," he resulted from the incestous love of Orougan, god of the south, and Yemadja, mother of Orougan, herself a sister of Agandjou, god of Space. Chango-Obba-Kouso's brothers are Dada, god of nature, and Ogoun, god of hunters and blacksmiths. He has three wives: Oya, Osoun, and Oba. It is quite evident that Orougan and Yemadja resemble the incestous couple Amon (Kham) and Mout. Their son, moreover, has the surname "King of Kush."" — Pédrals, quoted in Cheikh Anta Diop, “The African Origin of Civilization: Myth or Reality”, (1974) p.148.

In the light of this, I ask our Edo slaves to produce any Benin “Oba” reference that predates this pre-1666 Yoruba “Oba” reference. Lol!

Cheers!

According to the weak Edo slave above:

In 1820 a white British commander in lagos visited the oba he was an ethnographer he visited the then disposed oba, oba ovaramen who told the white British man that the obaship was established by a whiteman probably a whitegod

However, Oba Ovoranmwen wasn't born until the year 1857, and he didn't become Oba until the year 1888.

But miraculously, he had been chatting with a certain bRiTiSh CoMmAnDeR since the year 1820. Is God not wonderful??

[I have a screenshot already in case you're thinking of editing your comment]

cc: Trinitykey, Yujin

Quoting from the foremost authority on precolonial Benin history, Professor D.M. Bondarenko. He writes and I quote here:

"In terms of this, it is remarkable that Oba, Benin Second dynasty rulers' title, is also the generic notion for designating supreme rulers' titles all over Yorubaland (for example, "Ooni is Oba of Ife" or "the Oba of Oyo is Alaafin" ).

In the meantime, none of the Edo-speaking peoples' rulers is called so except that of Bini*. ... Only the Benin rulers could correspond to the Yoruba "standard" in the Edo-speaking world, where other rulers governed societies whose complexity did not exceed the chiefdom level.

However, it looks unreasonable to reject the notion that the very title of Oba could appear in Benin due only to Yoruba origin of its holders.

At the same time, it is known that the Yoruba did not influence the political systems of other Edo-speaking peoples, that is, peoples whose rulers are not called Oba.

... Historically, ethnographic sources and European writings of the early and mid-sixteenth century (based on relations from Benin of the late fifteenth century) and of the early seventeenth century, also testify to the Second Benin Dynasty's links with Ife."

Reference: Dmitri M. Bondarenko, "Advent of the Second (Oba) Dynasty: Another Assessment of a Benin History Key Point", History in Africa, Vol. 30 (2003), p.71.
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In addition to the foregoing quotation, I would add that, the etymological origin of the Yoruba word "Oba" is from the Yoruba root-word "Ba" which clearly means: "[to] reign-supreme". And in that case, the word "Oba" becomes "the one who reigns-supreme". This is neat and straightforward.


An Edo bigot, on the other hand, would pretend that the word "Oba" is indigenously thiers. This argument, however, encounters an etymological breakdown as the only Edo root-word they may adduce have absolutely nothing to do with "kingship", "rulership", or "monarchy". The Edo root-word "Bà" means "red", "shine".

cc: Trinitykey, Yujin

According to Roupell's Officials in the year 1897:

The Benin Kingdom was said --- by Benin chiefs and priests whom Roupell interviewed --- to have been established by an Ife-Yoruba man.

Reference: Captain Ernest Roupell (1897), cited in H. Ling Roth (1903), p.7.

cc: Trinitykey, Yujin

Yujin:
Lol. I'm not in ignorant man on the history of West Africa and certainly not not foolish to have a hatred of a history that doesn't concern or affect me.
With regards to the Sungbo Eredo moats, even the name gives a hint. Moats are quite different from walls. Kingdoms can afford to build walls as can be seen in other Yoruba and Hausa kingdoms.
The question any intelligent man will ask is for what purpose was the moat built in Ijebuland? Who was the greatest threat that the Ijebus faced to have built the moat? No Kingdom builds a moat of such magnitude just for normal security. It is an empire styled construction that requires thousands of dedicated workers (slaves from vassals) to build. Even Ife can't boast of such. Only Benin or another empire that preceded it could have built such. The 'bilikisu' story is just funny and a clear case of a concocted fairytale. What does 'eredo' mean in Ijebu dialect?

See attached for my reply. Spambot triggers did it again.

Cheers!
cc: Trinitykey

**William H. Clarke is American.

macof:
LOL. Your command of yoruba language is poor for someone who calls me a non Yoruba and claims to be an expert Yoruba language decoder or cripted programmer or how do you call it again?

Ọlọfin is a dialectical version of Alaafin that stuck due to popularity.
In central and eastern Yoruba dialects it is Ọfin (Palace).
Not "one who twists the rules" ..

There is no Ewọ (taboo) in Atẹwọrọ
Atẹwọnrọ/Atẹwọrọ - Atẹ̀ (like A tẹ̀lé = to follow) , ẹwọn (chain), rọ (descend)
So it means to descend through a chain

You should really stop, it's disgraceful what you do

Did he really NOT KNOW what Ọlọfin and Atẹwọnrọ mean?

I'm shocked (irony!)

Macof, your grasp of the Yoruba language is astoundingly firm. I am beyond pleased.

To add my voice to this for obvious reasons:

"Olu-Afin" = "Alaafin" = "Ọlọfin" = Alaọfin = "The Principal One of the Palace".

The NorthEastern Okun-Yoruba regions use the version Alaọfin.

The Aworis of Lagos use the version Ọlọfin.


It is disgraceful how people who obviously should still be learning how to apply diacritics to Yoruba vowels seem to be self-deluded into thinking of themselves as scholars of Yoruba history and language.

Macof, I think you are expecting too much from those who can't even tell the difference between the letters "O" and "Ọ".

I challenge these self-deluding "scholars" to tell the difference between the following Yoruba words:

(1.) Okó

(2.) Ọkọ́

(3.) Oko

(4.) Ọkọ̀

(5.) Ọkọ

(6.) Ọ̀kọ̀

(7.) Òkò

(8.) Ó ko

(9.) Ó kò

(10) Ó kò ó

Olu317:
(A) Lol! What is the bone of contention ? That you have disgust for information saying, Yoruba were Canaan people . Do you know the meaning of Canaan at all ?

(B) Infact, Arnett(1930,16),in the Infakul of Sultan Bello , was translated into English language which says, The People of Yoruba are descended from the Kaanan and Kindred of Nimrud. This translation was from Arabic which its origin form Roman(Latin) alphabet.


(C) That I affirmed that, Yorubas are not indigenous to Yoruba land,using the Artifacts, Ritual practice, culture , Manufacturing of iron to hit my view ,which null your view and citation from Professor Akintoye because didn't mentioned if

1. Yoruba ancestors were Bantu from Adamawa Mountain or elsewhere!

2. He Didn't proof where the land of ancient Yoruba were in Niger Benue confluence

3. That their first settlement which is not Iwo Eleru had human fossil that is over 13±000 years, . This fossil man is analyzed and classified as not being Yoruba ancestor.

4. The exact spot where Ancestors of Odudua developed alongside their extended family in Ife bowl. And to had known name in Yoruba land,in Niger Benue confluence as an affluent lineage.


5. Your Question: Derivative of Roman Orthography: derived from .......Roman alphabet

...simply mean,The Qur'an being translated into English language is based on English language's alphabet that developed through the Roman Orthography Alphabet.

Orthography:it is spelling, and in this case, I mentioned Latin alphabet ,which I posted previously to lecture you.

Read from Professor Adedoju Ogunbiyi's Arabic-Yoruba Translations of the Quran p.32

Al-Ilürõ, Asl qaba’ il Yuruba, Agege 1989, 38.

The above writers work were based on Yoruba orthography which is based on Roman orthography.

You can also read book from Professor John Hunwick, who devoted his whole lifetime to the study and preservation of the Arabic/Islamic heritage of Africa. And I am sure, you know it is based on Arabic and Latin alphabet.

Ignorance is powerful! Lol.

(A) I don't have disgust for such absurdities. I only laugh at such.

Moreover, I also don't know the meaning of Japan, yet Yoruba has several common words with same/approximate pronunciations and meanings. Oh Yoruba are now Japanese ? Lol.

(B) Sultan Bello's accounts which said Yorubas are from Mecca, etc should be trused over the Yorubas own extant pre-existing oral tradition testimony about themselves.

I think this is worse than a slave-mentality. New terms must be coined to describe the fvckery going on here.

May be its hightime we also concluded that Oduduwa is a Bini since some non-Yorubas (Edos) said it too.

I mean why must we take one non-Yoruba (Fulani) view of Oduduwa's origin over another non-Yoruba (Edo) view of Oduduwa's origin?

Shouldn't we accept both since in your view we must accept anything but our own account of our selves.

Having said that, your statement "This translation was from Arabic which its origin form Roman(Latin) alphabet" is the most clueless statement I've read lately.

What's going on here? Translation from Arabic to English has its origin from a so-called Roman (Latin) alphabet?? ?? What language are you speaking here?? Gibberish??

You earlier admitted (when it was convinient for you to do so) that you're simply clueless about this Arabic thing. But I'm now shocked to ve seeing your latest straw clutching.

(C) I think you love to see yourself as some scholar. Lol. If that is correct, then hurry up enroll in a structured learning environment for Yoruba History.

I doubt if you will ever allow a quack doctor (who has never seen the four walls of a medicine/surgery classroom) perform any surgical procedure even on your enemey.

These so-called affirmations you arrogate to yourself are no more than a comedic piece that has been debunked here severally again and again.

Moreover, I'm not sure why you're singling out Professor Akintoye as if what I cited from him is different from what you will get from unanimous contemporary historical scholarship.

(1) Okay, I laughed!

(2) He did. All you need do is read.

(3) I'm not sure who said the Iwo-Eleru artefacts are from some Yoruba ancestors.

Again, all you need do is read!

It's obvious that you're simply confused about what's going on. I'm not surprised that you're confused though.

(4) Again read and desist from setting your ignorance as a benchmark for others' knowledge.

The exact quarters where Oduduwa was born and raised in Ife is well-known in the Ife traditional accounts.

This again proves my point that you do not read what you respond to as I have already mentioned this account earlier in my comments.

You have equated your ignorance of such information to mean one and the same thing as the absense of such information in the traditional accounts. This is at least unfortunate!

Odu-t'o-du-uwa is an Ejigbomekun man who rose to prominence in about the late 10th century CE.

5. I wasn't asking you no question because I already know that you know nothing about Arabic, and you earlier admitted that until lately when you clutched hard to the unfortunate ineffectve face-saving u-turn.

Instead I was simply telling you that such statement as Romanized Orthography of Arabic is raw absurdity.

And the best you did was to simply write the names of some two individuals.

And somehow the mere fact of typing these 2 names somehow proves that there is such thing as Romanized Orthography of Arabic.

If there's anything you've successfully done, then it is the fact that you've successfully confused yourself about lots and lots of things through half baked information.

And to make it all worse, in case you've forgotten, these 3 things below are what you had originally called the so-called Romanized Orthography of Arabic:

ﻞﻤﺟ

ﻮﻜﺑ ﺐﺒﺳ ﻮﻋ

ﺎﺘﺑﺎﺘﺑ

This is like a 2 in 1 bungle!

Olu317:
English Quran ought be your case study! After all, it is derivative of Roman Orthography!

What does English Qur'an ... derivative of Roman Orthography mean?

Has absolutely zero meaning! This is clearly not your forte. Not even your self-acclaimed classical Hebrew.

You have absolutely no clue what you're talking about. You once admitted this. I'm now shocked what suddenly changed. Lol.

You're simply trying to putting different words together in as much as they sound big or technical to you. Lol.

Olu317:
Lol. So, There is nothing as such Roman(Latin )spelling of Arabic writings ? You are quite hilarious. Any way, I am sure, “English Quran transliteration and translation " ought be your case study! After all, it is derivative of Roman Orthography!

On your Arabic post, some people on this platform will help you out with the translation because it is not my specialisation.

(1)There is no such thing as Roman Orthography of Arabic.

(2) How do the following so-called Arabic words (which you originally pasted) fit into your new goal post? Lol.

ﻞﻤﺟ

: ﻮﻜﺑ ﺐﺒﺳ ﻮﻋ

ﺎﺘﺑﺎﺘﺑ

Olu317:
Well, you probably threw caution out of the wind, which made you blundered over your refutation that there is no such statement, as *Romanised Orthography*and regarding me as *attention seeker*You, particularly ought know better, amongst others who chose your defence line that has no authenticity over Yoruba's place of origin in Niger Benue confluence* amongst ethnic groups that exist in that region!


Unfortunately, you are *100% INCCORECT because,there is Romancized Orthography*

*What is Romancized Orthography* ? It is Orthography of Roman or Roman Orthography.

Let us verify the term *Orthography* from a English language dictionary

1a. Ortograph; Noun (plural: orthographs)
An orthographic projection.

b. Adjective (not comparable)

Of a projection used in maps, architecture etc.,in which the rays are parallel.

Of, or relating to, orthography.

synonyms: (maps) orthographical

2a.Orthography;Noun
 (plural: orthographies)

*The Orthography study of correct spelling according to 
established usage. The aspect of language 
study concerned with letters and their sequences in words

*Spelling; the method of representing a language or the sounds of language by written symbols*.(architecture)

Orthographic projection; especially its use to drawg an elevation,vertical projection etc. of a building.

synonyms with: spelling

Romanized* (Romanise) is simple past tense and past participle of Romanize(Romanise)

*Romanize : To put letters or words written in another writing system into the Latin (Roman) alphabet.*

Thus, the translation and Transliteration of Arabic writing are also written down in *Latin* . So don't be misled by yourself as you had wrongly stated. Interestingly, Arabic Ajami was what appeared secondly as an orthography in Yoruba land before, “The Yoruba language was all but settled by 1875 when the Church Missionary Society convened a conference to put finishing touches to the *Romanized Yoruba orthography* on which Samuel Ajayi Crowther and a host of others (Christian clergymen and specialist linguists) had laboured during the preceding 35 years. In spite of this seeming fait accompli status of the *Romanized Yoruba orthography*..." in THE SEARCH FOR A YORUBA ORTHOGRAPHY SINCE THE 1840S: OBSTACLES TO THE CHOICE OF THE ARABIC SCRIPT by ISAAC ADEJOJU OGUNBIYI


Furthermore, I am not in contention with you or anyone on NL because,I see no rivalry amongst all of us,who are actually genuine *writers/researchers* . Although, some of us may post for knowledge's information purpose but count me out on such ,since, your relied source has never pointed to the direction, where Yoruba ethnic group migrated from in Niger Benue Confluence. Perhaps, proof me wrong with the ethnic group that is ‘Oru' ,whose ancient ancestor known as Ebora.

Obviously you don't have a peculiar interest in Classic Yoruba Language's history per se because, you disregard ,purpose of Art work, megaliths stones carved for rituals, inscription on Opa Oranmiyah, Oriental Swords found in Yoruba's ancestors positions, because of your resentment toward the direction of where Yoruba language developed from and her connection to Semitic origin, in which some Arabic terms are also linked to it.

Oga don't worry about writting the long essays.

There is no such thing as Roman Orthography of Arabic.

Since you've admitted knowing nothing about Arabic, can you then adduce the expert source where you find this so-called Roman Orthography of Arabic?

Moreover, the following are the so-called Arabic words in question which you had pasted.

ﻞﻤﺟ

: ﻮﻜﺑ ﺐﺒﺳ ﻮﻋ

ﺎﺘﺑﺎﺘﺑ

Can you please explain how these foregoing so-called Arabic words relate to your so-called Roman Orthography of Arabic?