₦airaland Forum

SilverNorGold:
My brother, they are my explanations, backed by quotations from the Qur'an and other authorities. They are not copy and paste. They are my explanations. I also cited sources, which are there..

God bless us all.

Okay let's see how it goes.

oluwaniyi66:
You are funny

Why na

SilverNorGold:
1. My brother, I quoted the Holy Book, and you are saying "copying and pasting"? Lol, funny..

2. At the emboldened, you are regurgitating same thing. I already explained that, even told you about the Islamic hierarchy, the types of apostasy, which I justified by quoting the Qur'an(which you accused me of copying and pasting).. The atheists behave like our Nairaland atheists behave, attack Allah, Islam and his Prophet, which is punishable. This is the major or complete apostasy I talked about. However, Islam doesn't support killing of people who left Islam or doesn't believe in Islam. I cited verses from the Qur'an, see my previous post.

The issue is on waging war on Allah and his Prophet after dumping Islam, and I cited the Book. Please go back and reread them.

3. You are still repeating the same thing.

May God help us all.

You quoted albaqarah which is fine, the explanation that follows were copied. That aside.
@bold
Who is waging war on allah? So, they are waging war on allah and muhammad ask them to fight /kill in qn4:76?

I'm repeating it because the source you copied the reinterpretation from is not in line with the volume. More so, how can you say if you don't accept Islam that is apostasy for you or them to reach a conclusion of two types apostasy? Apostasy is when you declare that you are no longer doing something again or denounce that thing. The one you call lesser apostasy which is you don't accept Islam, cannot be apostasy. And you said, apostates wage war on allah is another heresy by you muslims. Apostasy is a way of protecting Islam. Can you give example of war apostates waged against your religion?

adams123:
I'm not justifying any killing.. BLASPHEMY IS NOT A KILLING OFFENSE IN ISLAM. THERE ARE OFFENSES THAT WILL NECESSITATE PUTTING ONE TO DEATH.
But I'm telling you that there are errors in the Bible and for book of guidance to humanity from God Almighty supposed not to have any error or contradiction

The book that is filled up with errors is quran.

SilverNorGold:
My brother, I have replied to this.
God bless you.

Please stop copying and paste explanation

SilverNorGold:
1. My brother, first, there's no compulsion in religion, according to Qur'an 2.256.. In the Islamic kabbalah, the Qur'an is the most authoritative. Any sayings that goes against it is null and void.

2. There are two types of apostasy in Islam: Simple Apostasy and Complete Apostasy.. Simple apostasy is when someone decides not to follow Islam. This is permitted in the Qur'an, as there's no compulsion in religion.

However, the Complete Apostasy is when one leaves Islam and then begins to attack it. Historically, such elements once conspired with the enemies of Islam to persecute the Muslims. Hence, the resistance. It was like treason at the time. Similarly, the verses you quoted referred to an atheist, who attacked the tenets of Islam.

"Verily, those who believed and then disbelieved, then believed and then disbelieved and increased in disbelief, never will Allah forgive them nor will He guide them to a right way."

Surah An-Nisa 4:137.. Hete, Allah didn't instruct anyone to kill them, but rather, assured them of their punishment afterlife.

"There is no compulsion in religion. The truth is distinct from misguidance."

Surah Al-Baqarah 2:256..


"Say: The truth is from your Lord. So whoever wills let him believe, and whoever wills let him disbelieve."

Surah Al-Kahf 18:29


But see what Allah said about the complete apostasy:

"A man who rejects Islam and wages war against Allah the Exalted and His Messenger."

Source: Sunan An-Nasa’i 4048

The waging of the war against Allah is the emphasis, not the apostasy. Here's what Allah says about Waging war:

"Whoever kills others, spreads corruption in the land, wages war against Allah and His Messenger, and he joins the unbelievers before he is subdued, then there is nothing to prevent the legal punishment from being applied to him because of what he did."

Source: Sunan An-Nasa’i 4046..

Here, it's obvious apostasy and waging war on Islam, Allah and his Prophet is frowned upon.

Brother, you tried. I love the copy and paste reinterpretation from your source.

Although, you seem not to agree to the fact that killing is justified even with what you just copied.

From the same volume albukhari, the first sentence talks about burning atheists (Zanadiqa) (which is also killing) by Ali. But remember, when Ibn Abass heard it, he said, if it were to be him, won't have burned them but killed them (that is, Zanadiqa) because muhammad has told them to kill.

Isn't this enough evidence to killing justification in Islam?

From the copy and paste you dropped, you quoted qn2:256 no compulsion in religion but you didn't see the volume we discussing go the opposite way of that sura? When there is apostasy in religion, that is a clear cut compulsion, that you must not do any other religion except Islam.

adams123:
you Christians need to learn ISLAM very well... I'm a Muslim but I read Bible.. I compare them because I want to know the truth so that I won't be ignorantly worshipping in a wrong form. You Christians need to take that path instead of all the insults u guys are pouring here.

NOTE! IT'S WRITTEN IN OUR BOOK OF GUIDANCE(QUR'AN) THAT JESUS WILL COME BACK TO THE WORLD AND WE MUSLIM HOLD JESUS CHRIST WITH HIGH ESTEEM AS A PROPHET OF GOD.

Brother, study the Bible don't just read it. With Bible, you are allowed to ask questions not like what al-maida 101-102 says in quran. I know you hold Bible as a corrupt book in your mind like what you have been made to believe. But when you read quran do stop to ask why this is this with no reinterpretation. Ask questions on each event in quran and hadith.

Shalom!

SilverNorGold:
1. My brother, again, I am a sincere guy and a Christian too. Christ never instructed me to attack others, and so be it.

2. You are funny. The questions asked require few sentences. It's all about you justifying your false allegations. You made the allegations, so the onus is on you to prove them.

3. If you were serious, you would have created your thread to post your justification, instead of asking me to create a thread. You made allegations, I asked for evidence and you are now asking me to create a thread, isn't that funny?

Finally, my brother. Live and let others live. Stop misquoting people's scriptures just to portray ours as the best. Instead of wasting time chasing shadows, why not reply to allegations against christianity littered on this Forum?

God bless us all.

There is no false allegations in what I said about justifiable killing in Islam. What I said is true which is contained in quran and hadith. I know some Muslims ustaz have reinterpreted some surat and hadith to you to make it look like it is not justified to kill

By the way, let me see what your explanation will be on apostasy in hadith albukhari volume 6922. Read it first before you explain it.

SilverNorGold I just gave you a tips of the iceberg that killing is justified from a trusted hadith. You can reinterpret it to give different meaning.

techrola:
Una Sabi fear, respect other religion believes..

Stop any act of provocation..

Very simple, don't insult prophet..

What is so difficult about that..

Do you believe what you just displayed is one of the tenets and teaching of Islam?

techrola:
Cry cry baby

Shalom!

SilverNorGold:
My brother, again, you are quoting out of context. Again, I am not a Muslim. I am also not a Muslim apologist. I am just a honest dude.

1. I challenge you to quote a verse and then narrate to me the circumstances surrounding it. Justify your allegation.

2. I stand by my words, and I challenge you to prove otherwise, by providing the circumstances.

3. I challenge you to tell me why the other millions of Christians in Nigeria and billions in the world are not killing people in obedience to the alleged instructions.

4. I challenge you to tell me why an Imam, Imam Abubakar Abdullahi., would do the opposite. Which means your allegations are faulty.

5. I know about the Crusades, all the levels, inside out.. And the so called justification, I challenge you to enumerate the lies and watch me tear all of them to pieces.

We should stop all the Unchristian attacks.

May God help us all.

Funny you! You are not a muslim and a Muslim apologist then what are you?

We will both be on a long ride with this challenge. Create a separate thread title it in defense of Islam against non-muslims. There we will both display our knowledge of quran and hadith.
I believe we will also discuss jihad and it true cause.
Shalom!

techrola:
Show ur face, even in ur aba village, we will locate u

Seun lalasticlala Mynd44 I am concerned with this

elmarshall1:
I wish I can just meet on one one, I swear to God, that will be your last.

Seun lalasticlala Mynd44 place this dude ban, safe a life.

techrola:
It is people like you that deserves to have your head cut off not the innocent ones, if u don't desist from defaming the prohpet..

seun lalasticlala Mynd44 please delete the comments of this dude. And place him on ban. Safe a life. This is how it begins oh.

SilverNorGold:
The title is better..

May God help us all.





This is Evil..

"Islam"? "cancer"? "Islamic terrorism?" Why drag Islam into this, as if it's what Islam teaches? I have lots of Muslim friends, and I must confess, they're the most important people I have ever come across in my life. I have made business with a lot of people, including Muslims, Christians and Atheists..

I have also read the Qur'an and nowhere does it support terrorism or the killing of innocent people. If you read any book, including the Qur'an and the Bible, to look for something to attack, you'll definitely find, as objective reasoning and contexts will be thrown out of the window.

While I strongly condemn the diabolical acts of the bad eggs in Islam, we should stop portraying them(the bad eggs) as though they are the exemplary Muslims.

Similarly, we should not portray the bad eggs in Christendom -- like The Irish Republican Army (IRA),The Lord's Resistance Army (LRA), the National Liberation Front of Tripura, The Anti-balaka(who infamously said: “There are still nine Muslims here. We will capture them. We will kill them. When we finish here, we will go to the next village and kill the Muslims there, too".. ), Army of God(described by Wikipedia as "an American Christian terrorist organization), Concerned Christians., The Phineas Priesthood, the Ku Klux Klan(KKK) -- as exemplary Christians. It's wrong to call them "Christian Terrorists" because of the Unchristian activities of a few.

The truth is, no matter the religion, evil people will definitely justify their actions using any religious books, whether the Bible or the Quran. The Slave Trade, Colonialism, Crusades, Jihadist Conquests, etc.. They all cited or used the Bible and the Qur'an to justify their wicked acts! Such is life! Such is the evil nature of man! Anyone can cherry pick any verse out of context to justify whatever they want to achieve..

May God help humanity.

You are a muslim apologist. I understand you clearly.

Islam is a religion that justifies killing, meaning if you killed a kafr (Islamic view of unbeliever including Christians) oh! muhammad will reward you when you get to Al-jana. Since you said you have read quran and no surat in the entire quran justify killing, then I want to believe you are the worst of them all.

As for the second to last paragraph, have you asked the source you got your info from, the cause of forming those groups you mentioned? And probably you should read what led to forming crusaders in 1028AD. Shalom!

Sonoyom:
Let me stop here, e be like violence go dey here.

You wan use the violence take loot nairaland's palliative abi?

Endsars is bringing sanity to some organizations gradually.

MC oluomo the deputy governor of Lagos state

Nigeria has problems, honestly. Why can't they work on fixing the distribution challenges rather than telling us stories.
So, there are still unused electricity when we live in darkness. Nigeria is a joke.

Bnladan:
Quran Furqaan verse 63...so I leave u in peace

Can you see what I'm saying!? This surat you quoted contradict what Muslims practice. If the guy that murdered the woman could leave this surat and follow hastily to defend Islam by murdering (which is justified anyway in Islam) woman, just because of mocking him with cartoon we won't be discussing this. The question is, why would non-muslims (especially those who have studied the books of Islam) keep mocking muhammad? What wrong has he done that warrant unjust hate on him?
If muslims could genuinely answer this based on what hadith has chronicled on him without reinterpretation, you will see why.

Why did you(muslims) not quote Surat 25: 63 but are hasty to defend Islam by killing at any slight provocation?

Empiree:
Guy, this is theology issue. How does it relate to this thread?. Do you have sense at all?.

If muslims say Jesus is not God, not son of God but prophet, a man etc. All these have evidences in your Bible. So if your Bible created confusion in your head that's your problem. We have evidences in your book for everything we say about Bible.

On what ground would Christian behead a Muslim for blasphemy?. For saying Jesus is not God, not son of God?. Is that blasphemy?. It seems you have wrong definition of blasphemy. If you cut a Muslim head you go to jail. That's a crime. Simple and jail.

As for sango petite, on what bases Muslim is guilty of blasphemy?. Abeg, stop twisting this thread. The french lady displayed sexualized cartoons of the prophet muhammad to his students. A Muslim was offended and took law in his own hands. North off then are guilty and got worldly justice they deserved.
Case closed.

Even the word "JESUS" doesn't exist in hebrew and aramaic which means Jesus is fake word invented by white people because letter J did not exist until recent centuries . This is not blasphemy but fact

Oga, you are really funny with this semi-literate write up. I'm just laughing uncontrollably with this.

TheManOfPeace:
1. The Killing is not justified and not acted on behalf on Muslim leaders, so the Muslims are not to be accused in general., If it was, the Muslims would have acted a different way a long time ago.

2. If I am supposed to trust you just because you said so, you should also trust me when I tell you three Isn't.

Peace, brother, I hope I answered your questions

No. You didn't, because what led to the death of the woman was tagged blasphemying which if you did not deny it, in Islam is death sentence(justified in Islam).

Killing is justifiable in Islam except if you would tell me, what muhammad said in hadith about apostasy is not killing.

TheManOfPeace:
If there was a sketched Muhammad already, why isn't it being shared instead.

You have proved to be a dishonest person, I simply asked for a proof, to convince both me and others, yet you couldn't. It is now obvious that you are just a hypocrite.

Alhamdulilah, Peace brother

I asked you a question, the cartoon of muhammad that got a woman murdered in the name of defending muhammad, what is it ? If it is not, why would you be killing for a cartoon? As per the muhammad sketch, trust me, it exists.

Karmatyra:
the mistake you are making is thinking the Koran is from God in the first place.

No. I don't believe quran is word of God. In fact, my findings are clear on this.

Bnladan:
first, I had never and will never attack Jesus peace be upon him. Secondly, u can do a simple search on the net, just type "basis of islamic fate"and see for yourself.

I have done this, I am not like you. I know Islam very well. So, keep that crap to yourself. In fact, that has led me to realized that a lot of Islamic teachings are not explained to many muslims the few people that know won't tell you. Also, I know quran is not complete without hadith. I know you would want to refute that but I don't have the time.

The problem of many of u guys is dat u don't even know wat Islam is.

Trust me, many muslims don't know what I know.

U don't make research on Islam. The only thing u know is the sentimental conclusions by some people and wat u see from ppl dat are not so islamic. It is in forums like this u get ur knowledge of islam.

Do muslims make research on Islam themselves? Trust me, those muslims that make such deep research will end up like what qn al-maida 5:101-102 says.

So, I don't make any hasty conclusions on Islam, Islam is what it is.

TheManOfPeace:
If you give facts, it will benefit other readers, not only me, so please try and share it not for my sake, but for other's.

This your statement is often used by hypocrites, please try and be honest, and give facts brother.

The fact about the sketched of muhammad?
The cartoon of muhammad in circulation you get offended with it, what difference will the one I'll share to you make ? Let it slide...

Bnladan:
I will leave u with ur ignorance.

Really? If you have any to say to this, drop it. Why would you say you love Jesus Christ you believe him yet you attacked him?

nurain150:
parkervero.I hope I answered your question. That was the description of Muhammad in the injil(not present day Bible) and Torah(old testament).
The prophet was described in those book by Allah to Jesus and Moses as Moses had glad tidding of Jesus pbuh yet the Jews Moses follower reject the Christian and their prophet.similar like the method of similar triangles in geometry the prophet was described to Jesus pbuh him and Moses.Yet the Christians deferred about this. And denied the prophet.But the Muslim believed in all of them and their original books which was not destotered or written by inspiration of someone who came 200 to 300 years after Jesus pbuh.The prophet(SAW) as reffered is Muhammad ibn Abdullah.Do some background checking .Those things I posted are directly from the book .The tafsir path is exergenesis of the Quran.The translation path is work by the aforementioned individual and organization.While the upper Arabic path is the Quran Kareem the word of Allah (SAW) directly.I hope this clarifies your doubt.

But no muslim has provided the original injil, even the companions of muhammad after his death did not provide you muslims the original injil muhammad confirmed in Ali-Imran 3:3

Can you

nurain150:
parkervero.I hope I answered your question.That was the description of Muhammad in the injil(not present day Bible) and Torah(old testament).
The prophet was described in those book by Allah to Jesus and Moses as Moses had glad tidding of Jesus pbuh yet the Jews Moses follower reject the Christian and their prophet.similar like the method of similar triangles in geometry the prophet was described to Jesus pbuh him and Moses.Yet the Christians deferred about this. And denied the prophet.But the Muslim believed in all of them and their original books which was not destotered or written by inspiration of someone who came 200 to 300 years after Jesus pbuh.The prophet(SAW) as reffered is Muhammad ibn Abdullah.Do some background checking .Those things I posted are directly from the book .The tafsir path is exergenesis of the Quran.The translation path is work by the aforementioned individual and organization.While the upper Arabic path is the Quran Kareem the word of Allah (SAW) directly.I hope this clarifies your doubt.

. I didn't read this but let me ask you, do you believe that the Bible is corrupt?

TheManOfPeace:
If you believe it exists why don't you share it with us brother?,

Share what you won't believe? That will be a waste of time. Peace!

nurain150:
See (V.2:76), (V.7:157) and their footnotes.

Sura 2 Ayah 76 note:

See the footnote of (V.2:42)

Sura 2 Ayah 42 note:

Narrated 'Ata bin Yasar: I met 'Abdullah bin 'Amr bin Al-'As and asked him, "Tell me about the description of Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) which is mentioned in the Taurat (Torah)." He replied, "Yes. By Allah, he is described in the Taurat (Torah) with some of the qualities attributed to him in the Qur'an as follows: 'O Prophet! We have sent you as a witness (for Allah's true religion). And a giver of glad tidings (to the faithful believers). And a warner (to the disbelievers), and a guardian of the illiterates. You are My slave and My Messenger I have named you Al-Mutawakkil (who depends upon Allah). You are neither discourteous, harsh nor a noisemaker in the markets, and you do not do evil to those who do evil to you, but you deal with them with forgiveness and kindness. Allah will not let him (the Prophet ) die till he makes straight the crooked people by making them say: 'La ilaha illallah' (none has the right to be worshipped but Allah), by which 'blind eyes, deaf ears and closed hearts' will be opened." [Sahih Al-Bukhari, 3/2125 (O.P.335)]

Reinterpretation of quran is known with muslims

nurain150:
See that you don't use fact that man (SAW) grave was in medina and not Makkah (mecca)

Thank you for the correction. His corpse is mummified in medinna