₦airaland Forum

You cannot stand criticism. That is why you hate SuffferingNSmilling. You want to live in a make-believe bubble. Dangote is likely to make the bad situation worse. In kenya we had a refinery that was making things terrible....but now imagine Dangote who has captured Abuja...selling you refined fuel at twice the international prize..because he will be "saving" forex.

obaaderemi:
I think the RIP guy should be ignored at this point concerning the refinery thing. His arguments have become stupid.

Not it's almost half the price. Normally about 5-6 dollars in kenya. 10 dollars in Nigeria.

obaaderemi:
A bag is cement is almost the same price in Nigeria and little India.

And most inefficient - you're buying cement almost twice the price in Kenya.

GeneralDae2:
Why allow imports, when we are by far the largest producers of cement in Africa?

He controls the market then ask Abuja to ban cheaper imports. And they do as he wishes.

Dangote Cement controls 61 per cent of the market share, Lafarge Africa 22 per cent and BUA Cement the rest

Why dont you allow imports to come in freely if Dangote is competitive.

GeneralDae2:
On the bolded, there is nothing Dangote sells astronomically higher than other suppliers in Nigeria.

Manufacturing is only beneficial if it's competitive. If it's protected - it's a double whammy. It would be cheaper - freight factored - to import from more efficient Indian or South Korea refineries.

Look at you cement or rice - it's way more expensive than imported ones.

Basically, what need to happen is to give Dangotes few graces period to grow from infancy- then allow him to compete internationally - if they cannot compete - they close shop.

The problem with Africa - mostly Nigeria - few companies capture the state - they ban imports - enact monopolies or oligopies - and economy pays for their inefficiencies.

The first thing Dangote will do next year - is to ask Abuja to ban import of refined fuel.

GeneralDae2:
Dangote is heavily indebted to Nigerian Banks for the project after the cost increased from his initially planned 12 billion dollars to 19 billion dollars because he had to build his own small Dangote deep port in lekki and provide some road infrastructures amongst other additional infrastructures due to problems that arose from 2016 after the initial planning and design.

However, by the time the proceeds from the refinery start flowing back to Nigerian banks who provided Dangote over 90% of the debts, that would be beneficial to the Nigerian economy.

Nigeria would not have to pay subsidy, that is beneficial. If Dangote buys crude in naira, it would improve the naira, even if we only supply 500,000 barrels per day to the world from our usual 1 million barrels, we would still benefit because oil prices are still likely to remain high for a while. If the other refineries owned by NNPC come on board within the next two years and we fix power supply, we may not even have to depend on Dangote for local supplies, he'll just export.

No matter how you look at it, it's very beneficial to the Nigerian economy.

Cost of refining crude is 3-5 dollars a barrel. Only Dangote will eventually become very rich. I dont see much impact on Nigeria economy. Going by 20B investment - that he will need to recoup - it will become another cement or rice - more expensive internally - than imported. Dangote will ask Abuja to ban import of cheaper refined products so he can monopolize it - and will load his expensive refined products on Nigerians.

Until you reform your economy from the Northern Elite Capture of Abuja led by Dangote - expect to see few fat cats and a HUGE ZOO.

In simple English - just like you buy cement or sugar or any Dangote product very expensively - expect the same on his refined fuel - as he will load his cost to poor Nigerians.

samorobo:
Lol no get a grip ifbb b yourself. We would be selling the final product if crude oil as well as the raw oil itself. Joe tgats is making the entire money of that value chain,unlike when we sell to Europe then import the final product twice that price - we aren’t only saving the forex but also entertaining a serious boom. Be scared ,africa won’t see our butts.

KaziKazi I hope the Magufuli error (era) is over and you're ready for business. Let see if you will be petty or will sell to us your natural gas.
https://twitter.com/WilliamsRuto/status/1579379175479472131
https://nation.africa/kenya/videos/news/president-ruto-address-in-tanzania-3979690

That was 2014-2016.

Today, approximately 16.6% of rural Ghanaian households rely on pipe-borne water as their main water supply, with 11% obtaining water from public standpipes (SPs) and the remaining 5.6% from private or shared household connections (GSS, 2014).

Just40:
all Ghana thermal units run on natural gas

Focus more on using there water you pump into the earth to supply thirsty Kenyans who rely on streams as source of drinking water

Biomas (charcoal+firewood) will continue to be main source of cooking for quite some time in rural Africa. We should focus on making it more cleaner and efficient - and embracing commercial tree farming to replace it. You can focus on reducing thermal (diesel oil) that you generate most of Ghana power first.

vankelvin:
Kenya has done all that so it makes sense for Kenya to now promote the use of firewood or charcoal? I wish you knew how stupid you sound

False hopes. There will be a similar drop in crude oil export. You can ramp up oil production - to meet OPEC quotas - and that is when we shall see impact.

QuietMynd:
Refined petro products acct for 40% of total import.
Imagine the effect it will have on the naira, gdp will surely jump to nothing less than $750bn, gdp per capital go hear am, price of food will reduce, power transmission upgrading will have been completed by then, investor go dey rush economy like agege bread

Pray it doesnt die - Dangote is indebted to the gills - 7B dollars - and still need 1B dollars to complete it. The cost has shot up from 12B dollars to now 19B dollars.

The refinery cost grew to $19 billion after initial estimates of $12-$14 billion and years of delays. State oil company NNPC, which last year acquired a 20% stake in the refinery for $2.76 billion, said that it expects the refinery to start in the first quarter of 2023.

samorobo:
Lol give it up, I know you desperately wants us to derail like your zoo. You know what they say,” misery loves company “.

Newsflash some section of the refinery has started commissioning. Come mid 2023 a d we are selling hot oil and making hot dollar. You will weep and will be here taunting you for my amusement.

I do commercial tree forest - we use firewood to manufacture tea - because it's extremely cheap.
It not sustainable to convert poor people to use LPG that we dont have - getting into more Oil/forex problems.
When we can grow trees, make coal or charcoal, and repeat.
We plant fast maturing blue gums and such trees - in 7yrs - from an acre - you get 20k USD.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kyDqgkgY7nE

vankelvin:
Hope you know the consequences of deforestation

You dont expect poor people to shoulder the clean energy burden. Let the rich do that by switching off their coal powered plant.
So the priority for people using firewood in rural areas - is to convert them to clean energy efficient stoves.
Next priority is to turn all the motorbikes into electric motors.

This kenyan company has sold more than a million such clean stoves

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPTjtmqCQO8

vankelvin:
[/b]
Have Kenyans heard of Global warming before?
As every progressive country is embarking on the use of clean energy Kenyans are still dwelling in the past. Use of firewood/charcoal in this 21st century ?

The lower Road still under construction.

68816419:
The terrible thing is that, unlike Nigeria's projects, which are fully sponsored and constructed by state governments, their roads and rail projects are always of poor quality and are only built by their federal governments.
here are some of of the flaws of the newly built over hyped Nairobi expressway
Poor Drainage. A drainage outlet constructed along the expressway. ...
Pavement Straight Into a Pillar. A pillar built on a pedestrian's pavement. ...
Drying Plants. ...
Wire Mesh on the Highway. ...
Traffic at Entry Points.

As long as your refined fuel will be cheaper than India, South Kore, UAE and Saudi Arabi - freigh included - why not. But I dont see Dangote getting off ground soon. Might be another 3-5yrs.

Fourpockets:
Dangote will get dollars from the things he exports like cement, refined crude Like you said already.

Dangote refinery, though I don't see it completing this year or early next, the problem about money is nothing to worry about, cos the government knows how crucial the refinery is to Nigeria's economy, they will bail him out so im not worried.
Plus other refineries are coming up in the next five years . We will soon star exporting diesel and avaition fuel to Kenya

What is there to argue with a fool like him?

Fourpockets:
Stop with the ad hominem attacks, argue his point so this thread can be enjoyable for all of us

Where will Dangote get dollars. Focus on improving oil and gas production. Well I dont think you'll consume all the 650,000 barrels so Dangote may be able to sell refined fuel - but Dangote thing is facing a billion dollar shortfall - I dont see that refinery getting off ground in the next 5yrs.

Fourpockets:
Then we would sell it to dangote in dollar, it won't matter cos it will still be the same price we pay for imported refined crude

Kid go play outside. This forum is for adults.

Shaytun:
Nairobi, 7th July, 2022…For the first time in Kenya’s history, the annual revenue collection has hit and surpassed the Two Trillion mark, defying the difficult economic environment brought about by Covid-19. This is after Kenya Revenue Authority (KRA) recorded a monumental revenue collection of KShs. 2.031 Trillion for the Financial Year 2021/2022 (July 2021 – June 2022) compared to KShs. 1.669 Trillion collected in the last financial year (FY 2020/2021).

https://www.kra.go.ke/news-center/press-release/1752-kra-exceeds-revised-target,-records-highest-revenue-growth-in-history

And this is your highest revenue growth, Kenya has never collected more than 13B in revenue before.

I hope Nigeria gov will soon pay lecturers so you can go back to class and finish your studies.

Shaytun:
Lol, RVP has been lying as usual.

You know is usual modus operandi is to pull fake figure out of thin air.
Kenya only collects 13B in total taxes despite taxing the hell out of the citizen.

https://www.kra.go.ke/news-center/press-release/1752-kra-exceeds-revised-target,-records-highest-revenue-growth-in-history

Nobody can loan you expect IMF - not even Ghana domestic debt market. That sounds like you've bigger problems than any country in Africa

Just40:
You think everyone is poor like you er

Ghana never needed and as at now, Ghana does not need it because the problem facing Ghana now is Liquidity

Yes I think we need to sell a few once in a while - exit where gov really doesnt add any more value - like KCB or Safaricom.

kikuyu1:
Exactly! I'm not saying let's fire sale the family jewels- HELL NO!! Let's not send the wrong message: instead let's reduce gov shareholding in some SOEs in exchange for a couple of billion dollars which will be well spent.
Again I stress we're not NEARLY as badly off as the Waffas and have enough manoeuvre room and smart policy guys to make smart moves.

That is all you saw - you didnt see single digit inflation, interest rate, and stable currency. Kenya population now is about 50-51 million.

vankelvin:
Your pupolation is no more 47Million? confused people

Mitchell Targaryen
@Ambrosia_Ijebu
Kenya has 54million people. The have no oil exports worth noting. They import most of their fuel. Their economy is heavily driven by agriculture. And yet they have low interest rates , manageable inflation and a stable exchange rate.

Don’t you people wonder why?

Yes Kibaki was able to cut on borrowing by selling SOES - to finance deficit; This is what we need to do;Next year budget for example; instead of borrowing 800B - we can target to sell SOES for 200B (few jewels like Safaricom, Kengen, KCB) - and borrow the 600B instead.

kikuyu1:
We do have a definite challenge ATM but not a crisis. I saw smth a yr or two ago on the total value of our SOEs. Divesting from the major ones should give us at least 7 bn $ at a conservative valuation. I can't find the source right now.
That's valuable breathing space and we're NOWHERE near as fkd as these mouthy Waffas.

Nairobi Eastleigh - one biggest somali type mall

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IC5m2ZlL_Nk&t=165s

Lots of conspiracy nonsense.
We are dealing with COVID+Ukraine-Russia(energy) economic crisis - 3 yr global crisis.
This is akin to 1972 Iran crisis that took 10 yrs to fix.
It's going to set countries back 3-5yrs if not 10yrs behind.
USD will strengthen - and rest of currencies will weaken - because USD is global currency and, in a crisis, - Cash is King.

Countries most exposed are those most indebted - and they need to build resilience & try surviving the crisis.

GeneralDae2:
I thought this was worth sharing. The currency crises and debt burdens around the world would only get worse.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uO2HC2YJDwc

That problem was fixed. Some uhuru people wanted to pull a forex scam like happened in 1993 under something called Goldenburg scandala. Uhuru and his scammers will soon be facing the law.

Central Bank of Kenya (CBK) Governor Dr Patrick Njoroge has claimed that during the final term of President Uhuru Kenyatta's reign, there was a plot by some government personnel in the finance docket to sabotage the country's economy as was the case during the infamous Goldenberg scandal.

Dr. Njoroge revealed that a section of government officers had infiltrated the public coffers with the intention of embezzling funds in the foreign exchange department but the CBK management has since managed to deal with.

Despite not mentioning the culprits for what he said was a lack of distinctive evidence, he said that CBK managed to get wind of the scheme and was able to stop it thus preventing a similar loss like the 1990s Goldenberg scandal that led to a loss of about 10 percent of the country's GDP.

"In the last two to three years, we have people who were again trying to bring us back to Goldenberg. if you remember what was happening in Goldenberg, this is what some of the people are pushing towards. I don't want to get into details because they will ask me where is the proof, and I will say I don't have proof, am not DCI," Njoroge said.

The CBK boss was speaking on Monday during an induction exercise for Members of Parliament.

samorobo:
Wsup with this?

Debt is not repaid by GDP - it's repaid by gov revenues - which Kenya gov has - and Nigeria doesnt.

obaaderemi:
They got drunk on loans. I thought Nigeria's debt case was the worst until these threads. Kenya is like a bad business that will soon close shop. They right now need the imf than Ghana. Their debt is currently about 70% of their GDP. There's no way they won't default. Even the Chinese are wary of lending them more. They're the next Lebanon. It's not about 'if' but about 'when.'

Splitting hairs. USD was around 115 then - and that rounds up to 20B. If we apply the Nigeria black market rate to your revenues - they will be next to nothing.
Last year - Nigeria federal revenue - N3.93 trillion divided by 750 - is it 5B dollars - official rate (420 naira to a dollar?) is like 10B;
The ZOO - is collecting 10B dollars annually - to manage 200M people.
Let assume at best the 36 states also try to collect 5B!

Zoogeria need jesus.

obaaderemi:
2.3 trillion ksh.... that's $19bn. You don't generate over $20bn like you said.

kikuyu1:
I thought RAO had retired after his attempted come back via Julie Soweto's court room theatrics.

Ati, "electoral coup d'etat!"

[urlhttps://youtu.be/WMi3Wyo3np4/url]

Someone come get this byatch!?

He will run on on like his father until he dies..look like he had a stroke...

Just40:
Ghana is not in distress ... Ghana is in tight space because of excessive spending over the last 4 years ... A spending habits that it has to keep up because of a competitive political space.

In other to keep this spending habit up domestic finance and monies from it investments alone are not enough, it needs to constantly have access to the Eurobond market. Shutting Ghana out of the Eurobond market because of it growing debt portfolio which worried investors of Ghana ability to pay back should it debt portfolio keep growing led to a cascading event.

Those invents has since led to a drastic Central bank intervention which has cause Ghana to effectively set a gold price slightly below international market price like the Russians recently did..

And all gold purchases will be done in Cedis, effectively setting a gold cedi peg which will lead to more Cedi printing. (Underwriting the currency)
Guaranteeing the purchase of all gold produced in Ghana by the central bank first before any export. A brilliant thing that should have been done a long time ago.. Something similar to what Switzerland does will be happening in the next 10 years when it come to reserve holding.

Just as it new HQ is coming up

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cu__oAAt-Xo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liJaAyg0bLY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uP4bLN_ILqs

21 floor building that will cost 200 billion dollars...what are Ghanians smoking.Such building cannot cost more than 10m dollars.You all need to go back to proper school..not double track nonsense

Why is world biggest gold producer ghana in distress'
Answer nobody give a f of gold
Dont a fool
USD fiat money is GOLD
Ghana gold is only useful for some indian woman jewerly

Just40:
Only and Idiot would not keep Gold now.. especially when the only real money is gold and silver.

You think the US Fed is keeping gold for nothing or you thing it was for nothing that Germany and France requested for all it gold back from the US Fed in 2016, maybe you think the Chinese and Russians are shoring up their gold reserves for nothing....?

Boy you have not been paying attention, everyone is positioning themselves well for the coming Bretton wood 3.0...
Those who are going to suffer the most will be those economies caught off guard