₦airaland Forum

MelesZenawi:
Support?
Igbo biafra or the other way round with conditions?

Which one.

Don't be suprise but I have many bini friends...loads of them and they are always antagonistic to biafra as you...so I am not always suprise with most of you guys stance against it on nairaland.....real life is always samething....

Your perception is also what I witness offline....

The Benin may not be comfortable with the Idea of Biafra for now because of what happened during the Nigeria civil war.

The Mid west region maintained it's neutrality before the war but at the start of the war, the Biafra army invaded and occupied a neutral Mid West region, commiting atrocities, rapes and the massacre of civilians in Urhonigbe rubber plantation.

When the federal forces entered Benin to liberate the Mid West, the Benin and other midwestern youths were only too eager to enlist into the Nigeria army to liberate their land.

The suspicion that Biafra will not maintain their boundaries is always there.

MelesZenawi:
The ground can only be test-run through yes or No system of voting. Which is the universally accepted pattern.

I feel the reason awolowo didn't want you guys to go is because he couldn't bear to see part of their own flesh cut-off.


Everyone is ready as ever.

So for once reciprocate the good gesture of Zik....

Whenever your leaders ask for such support from us, be rest assured we will consider it, but for now they haven't solicited such support from us. All we hear are noises on the internet.

Who are your representatives that want our support.

MelesZenawi:
You and this your zik and Benin ancestry..Lol...funy

Anyway you shouldn't be skeptical....about anything but pray for us to succeed...selah


Killing ourselves shouldn't be your concern as such has not been recorded before.

Meanwhile Your submission they solicited for Zik's support and got it......There is this adage that says one good turn deserves another.



If Zik supported you guys back then what is then holding you guys in reciprocating same gesture now that it is highly needed.?

Aside from politics, I already gave you the relationship Zik had with the then mid west region that lead to his support, don't forget that Awolowo refused and worked against the actualization of Mid West region.

Hope you can see how misinformed you guys are when you say the Benin have more in common with the Yorubas.

The Yoruba didn't want the creation of mid west but the midwesterners were able to secure support from Zik an Igbo leader from the east and Northern leaders.

The mid westerners first organised themselves at home before they reached out to others for their supports.

I asked you before how have you guys organised yourselves at home?

Have your political, traditional and religious leaders openly thrown their weight behind Biafra.

I tried to be balanced and realistic as I could in my submissions, don't just pick what suits you from them. The people of mid west did their homework before reaching out for outside support.

Most leaders in then mid west were in support of the agitation. Traditional rulers, religious leaders, political leaders and ordinary people were all in support. Do you have the same consensus and support for Biafra in the east for now.

MelesZenawi:
In simple terms, this is our affairs. Why I hardly meddle into other people's affairs....


Nevertheless, Support Igbo biafra and if finally actualized, all these questions you raised will be addressed as you will be watching from Nigeria.

Support the agitation first and leave the rest as to how it will be handled.

You want me to support the agitation that I am sceptical about?

My fear is when you start killing yourselves in Biafra, you will start running to Nigeria as refugees, we don't want that.

Now if you want my support I will give you a little history of how it's done, what you guys are trying to achieve is not rocket science, it has been done peacefully before in Nigeria, we all can still remember what happened when Ojukwu tried to achieve it with force.

Something similar was achieved in 1963 by the midwesterner and this is how they did it.

Brief history of creation of Mid West region of Nigeria.

Before the British left Nigeria, the minorities agitated for their own autonomous regions from the big three regions of East, West and North to take care of the minorities.

The British proposed new regions to be carved out of the West, East and North.

The Mid West which was to be carved out of the West was to cover present day Ondo, Edo and Delta.

The Ogoja/Rivers was to be created from the Eastern/Northern Region.

Now back to creation of mid west region.

The political leaders of the 1960s were more interested in achieving independence for Nigeria rather than the creation of regions, they promised to sort out the creation of regions after independence.

After Nigeria got independence in 1960, the leaders, Awolowo, Zik and Ahmedu Bello were no longer interested in creating more regions because they didn't want their sphere of influence to reduce.

The mid west people lead by the Oba of Benin pressed on but Awolowo flatly refused to support and grant it.

A political platform was created in the yet to be created mid west region for agitation, notable mid west sons such as Okotiebor, Edo-Osagie, Denise Osadebe threw their weight behind the agitation.

The support of the Anioma or Mid West Ibos were easy to secured because majority of them believed they share the same ancestry with the Edos and rest people of Delta.

Haven't secured almost the full support of the people of mid west apart from the then Olu of Itsekiri which Awolowo elevated to Olu of Warri, the agitators needed the support of other regional leaders such as Zik and Ahmedu Bello because the Mid west people couldn't achieve it alone.

After Zik and Bello became the president and prime minister respectively with Awolowo in opposition, the NCNC, Zik party men in Mid West solicited for his support and got it. Don't forget that Zik himself saw himself as a descendant of the old Benin empire as he later revealed in his autobiography years later, so it was easy to support his people.

With Zik on board and in a coalition with the North, it was easy to secure the support of the North and there was nothing Awolowo could do but to give in and Mid West region was actualized.

Mid West region is the only region in Nigeria to come about through referendum of the people. This came about through strong leadership which the Oba of Benin gave, unity of all, everyone that supported it truly believed in it and all saw themselves as brothers and sisters from the same source even though they speak different dialects.

The people agreed that the capital should be in Benin City, where a lot of them believed they descended from and the prime minister from Anioma/mid west Ibo.

After the hard work of achieving the Mid West region in 1963, the Igbos decided to planned a failed coup in 1965 which undo all the hard work of mid westerners and set Nigeria on a downward trajectory since then.

Now if you want Biafra, you have to identify those across southern Nigeria that genuinely want to be part of it and begin to build consensus, you need a political platform, you need a respected leader to rally around, you will have to forge alliances with other regions and convince them why they should support you. There will be a lot of politics involve and your political leaders have to be on top of their games.

The aforementioned is what you need to start to agitate for Biafra.

You don't demand support and expect to get it on a platter of gold, you need to do a lot of work yourself.

Hope the brief of history of how Mid West region was achieved help you in your quest and good luck.

MelesZenawi:
In short term, Igbo political elites post no threat to Igbos. They can be retired easily.

No bloodshed coz such has not happened before. It is just a figment of your Imagination.

We don't run such society and as such none holds such followership.

So this your particular argument is dismissed. Such politics of blood shed is hard to be seen here in Igboland.

Moreover, Kanu agitates doesn't make him or give right to leadership, a lay down procedures will give rise to a new Government. It is no war.

We don't run societies on kingdoms but on repbo purposes.


Why not allow them go and see if there will be bloodshed anyway...Is a trial.

What have you done so far to demand a better stewardship from your current crops of leaders, oh I forget, you are waiting until you get Biafra before you start demanding accountability from your leaders.

As of today, Imo state workers are yet to receive their February salaries, Abia is still waiting for January salaries, is this also the fault of Nigeria federal government or bad governance from your leaders.

There are states in Nigeria that have already received their March salaries.

If you can not hold your current political leaders to account now, what makes you think you will be able to do it under your utopia Biafra, all I sense from you is wishful thinking and day dreaming. Nothing wrong to day dream, keep it up.

How do you intend to actualized and achieve your Biafra without a standing army of your own, without a political structure and a strong local leader to rally around. You haven't even be able to defend your farmers against the Fulani herdsmen that are destroying their crops and sources of incomes.

How many state did APGAN, your Igbo political party control in the south east.

Are you going to fight the federal government to get Biafra or through political negotiations and under what platform are you going to do that.

How many of your leaders and elites have openly, physically and materially supported the Biafra Agitation.

How many of your traditional rulers have openly supported the actualization of Biafra.

How many of your religious leaders have openly supported Biafra Agitation.

Those calling for Biafra mostly come from 2 categories, the disillusioned majority who are suffering from the inept government and a few charlatans like Kanu who are travelling around the world collect money and enjoying themselves in the name of agitating for Biafra.

Those that truly believe in the Biafra agitation don't have what it takes to actualize it and those that have what it takes are not interested in the agitation, they are rather enjoying themselves in Lagos, Abuja and other Nigeria cities with their millionaires and billionaires friends.

Biafra is a pipe dream which is dead on arrival.

MelesZenawi:
What will guarantee them any position . The facts is that the politui elites will be heavily checkmated because it won't be business as usual. Do rubbish and get beaten as even before you run for elections u must think twice.



The question looks more hypocritical. First of all Nigeria states are still struggling for development. Secondly you cannot call such development.

Thirdly the answer is simple the Nigeria society makes vital factors of business exchange domiciled in one area. Drop seaport or river port here plus international airport and see who goes around because same issue of shipping would even be made easier for business men and women at their doorstep.

In a new country with all these development will be closer and nearer to the people with business enabling environment.




Even outside Nigeria samuk, people own properties and pay taxes for their properties. So those in Abuja will learn to adjust and be paying their taxes all time.

Finally saying that with time nature will take it's effect in Nigeria is just a fallacy. Nigeria is totally Irredeemable and highly Irredeemable.

Using Covid-19 as a criteria for them to change is also another pure dream because even worse has happened before and they couldn't change....even this one won't change them.

So looking at all this I think it is advisable for those who should have their way to agitate and escape from the current federal arrangement. The problem in Nigeria is that people don't know what they want. If you bring agitation to their doorstep they will Insult you, if you decide to stay alone and agitate alone, they will term you selfish. These are the exact problems.

People used to say Igbos are dragging them now Igbos decided to fine tune their struggle to Igbos only, you will hear them saying Igbos are selfish.

Let's just say that those who wants to leave should be allowed without bickering, accusations or sort of.


This will reduce all these mutual suspicion in this country.

You seems to be suggesting that the current Igbo political elites will have no role to play in the New Biafra.

Let say for example, Nigeria decides to grant the Igbos their Biafra, who do you think they will negotiate the exit with.

Such Igbo exit from Nigeria will be negotiated by your current political leaders.

Do you think after such negotiations they will relinquish their powers to the likes of Nnamdi Kanu or do you think the federal government will negotiate with Kanu to start with.

The only way to then seize power from your current political leaders after you get your Biafra will be through a revolution which will no doubt lead to more bloodshed and turn your new Biafra into a war zone with some of you guys running back to Nigeria as refugees.

Change usually come, but slowly, that is why they say Rome was not built in day.

MelesZenawi:
So you prefer Igbos remain in this ship for christ-sake?

Let's be fair, can't you see we are not making any progress as a nation but rather retrogressing.

Nobody in this world has gotten freedom by appealing of nature....but that's anyway..


Samuk, can you now proffer solution on way ahead?

I like gathering facts..

With the way things are now, we all must allow nature to takes it's course. Who would have thought that Corona virus will force our elites to start using the same local hospitals as the ordinary people.

Everything has it's expiry date including bad governance.

There are too much mutual suspicions in the land. No tribes trust each other for meaningful renegotiation at the moment but I believe with patience, nature will someday force our hands to collectively do the needful or perished together.

The ordinary people failed to understand that the problem is not necessarily between tribes as the politicians would make us believe but the elite ruling class and the poor.

The real problem of Nigeria is bad governance. The ruling elite comes from all tribes and the poor citizens also come from all tribes.

For those calling for Biafra as solution, what guarantees do you have that the political elites of Biafra will not be just as corrupt as the current Igbo political elites or are you guys saying Igbo governors and politicians are not corrupt.

What stop your current governors and senators from developing the south east and show the rest of the country how to govern properly.

What stop the numerous Igbo billionaire businessmen and politicians coming together to turn the south east into Dubai instead of running to help develop Lagos, Abuja and other cities.

Mistakes where made in the 1960s that we all must learn from and ensure not to repeat.

When the time comes, we all will sit down to renegotiate the country, that time it will be based on equity, equality and fairness, no cheating. Patience is all it will takes.

Biafra going to form it's own independent country will create new and yet to be seen challenges, every tribes in Nigeria are too intertwined either through marriages or otherwise for such a breakup not to create friction and animosities.

What will happen to the numerous Igbo establishments across the country, do you want to become a foreigner in Nigeria? Igbos are said to own nearly 60% of the properties in Abuja alone, have you thought about what will happen to this investments when you become a foreigner in the land.

With little patience, Nigeria will reordered itself.

MelesZenawi:
Enemies of ndigbo showing themselves one by one.

Out of the abundance of thy heart the mouth speaks.


Igbos are asking to leave not with any other people but only them, why then the fuss.


Igbo speaking area and you are talking of oil Wells.... natural boundary only Igbos speaking.

We ain't dragging anybody but just Igbos for biafra.

What them is your problem?

is it simply hate?

I don't hate Igbos, I am only saying you can't leave after helping to create the mess that Nigeria has become, to allow you to jump ship now will not be fair on the rest of us.

The Igbos are more Nigerians than they would like to believe.

MelesZenawi:
Igbos are not Nigerians and Nigeria is not us....take back that statement.

They say Referendum is not a call for war. What they are asking is simple conduct a yes or no referendum for igbos to determine whether they want to stay or leave Nigeria?

Igbos only, no other person....so I don't see how that is encroaching on the unitary system of Nigeria...unless you want to sound mischievous.

Or are binis the one hausa-fulani will use to fight Igbos?

You sound like someone that will take up weapons against igbos?

You are the one that is sounding mischievous by alluding to the fact that you would like what you call Igbo speaking area of south south to be included in your Biafra.

The only region that had the foresight to demand for a referendum from the British before they left was the mid west region. Every other thing since then, be it creation of states, regions, change of constitution and system of governance have been done through fiat.

Why demand for referendum now, did Ironsi and his Igbo brothers gave the rest of Nigeria the opportunity to have a referendum before he changed our fantastic regional system of government to unitary.

Let see how you are going to take off the mouth of the North from our oil wells without a fight.

Unlike in the 1960, when the Igbo controlled the eastern and mid west military forces, they control nothing today, the Hausa Fulani control every forces in the country and will not need the Benins to cut you to size if need be.

You will have to be patient until the oil wells run dry to have your Biafra.

MelesZenawi:
It more preferable that you use the Nigerian term South south than Niger delta. Niger delta consists of over 9 states in Nigeria.

That been said as I totally agree with you but the natural boundary is simply Igbo speaking areas....case closed.

It is only a fool or a problem monger that will come and be dragging another persons ethnic boundary.


Your submission is quite inorder but natural boundary remains Igbo speaking areas. That's the definition of natural boundary and not national boundary.

Do not kid yourself to think that Biafra will come to fruition without another war and bloodshed.

The current Nigeria we have today came about as a result of the Igbo military coup of 1965 and the civil war that followed.

For the country to revert back to how it was when the British left, another war has to be fought, nobody is going to give Igbo independent Biafra on a platter of gold, they will have to fight for it and good luck to them.

Incase you guys forgot, the British actually gave you the autonomy you are now clamouring for and much more before they left Nigeria but you became over ambitious and greedy, you wanted it all to yourself.

By 1963, Nigeria had four regions. The Igbo controlled two of the four regions, they were head of the Army, Senate, President of the federal republic of Nigeria, head of almost all government ministries. The Igbo controlled territory contained more than half of the Nigeria crude oil wealth.

In the 1960s every region controlled it's resources and paid 50% tax to the federal government.

The North didn't have enough of it's indigines to filled all their jobs so they retained white expatriates pending when they trained enough northern man power to occupy those positions because they didn't trust the Igbos to take those positions.

In 1965, Igbo overthrew the democratically elected government and killed the prime minister from the north, federal ministers from across the country who were not Igbo, two regional premiers that were not Igbos, killed non Igbo military officers and turned Nigeria into a unitary system of government which will currently operate.

They quickly moved to the north and ordered the foreign expatriates out of their jobs and filled those positions with Igbos, the north protested up to the point of saying they wanted to leave Nigeria, all their protests fell on deaf ears.

The North decided to stage their own coup, which they did and succeeded in 1966 but rather than return the country to the old regions, they saw the selfish benefits in the Igbo made unitary system of government put in place by Ironsi.

The Igbo made unitary system allows the north to control over 80% of the oil wells in the south and all other juicy positions in the country unhindered.

Now the Igbos wants to reverse the system without a fight, you guys must be joking, you created this current Nigeria, you guys are Nigeria and Nigeria is you, you go nowhere, we are all going to manage and enjoy your creation together.

If you want Biafra be ready to fight another war.

MelesZenawi:
Your problem is emotions and you use bad words when feel defeated.

Your behaviour will even scare many who may have different reasoning.

You want to feel among and mingle with Same people but at sametime you loathe time.

Which makes my logic simple. Since you don't like anything Igbo, you are better taken care of and catered for in oduduwa Republic.

Is this also hard to take?

Mr moderate, you only saw my reply, you didn't see your Igbo brother bragging of how the Igbo defeated an imaginary country and army of Benin during the Nigeria civil war.

Your Igbo brother was the one that left the issue being discussed and jumped into the Nigeria civil war and you are unhappy because he was reminded that the Igbos actually lost that war with over 2 million of their people perished.

Do you people want to also put a spin on this contemporary history of Nigeria that's just a few decades old, because you doubt anything and anything that doesn't fit into the Biafra narrative.

AmuDimpka:
Zik isn't an authority in Igbo land and I am Igbo go and ask anyone ...Igbo even respect ojukwu more than zik! Zik was so myopic in his dealing....but that is aside


Give us Benin evidence of Onitsha start from

Language
Culture
Food
Worship
Mannerisms

That is when I can see you as sensible....Benin has no influence even in the near by Delta Igbo of Ika...they defeated Benin severally that was why they built moat in their city of mud houses ...bunch of cowards...it was Igbo that in less than 24 hours defeated Benin in mid west invasion on their way to ore...loook at tiny Benin that Ijaw defeated and took their land till date and that is why Gelegele can't be Benin land again ! Igbo came and took Igbanke while Yoruba Akoko

You are either a poorly manufactured Aba made robot or your brain stopped developing at age 4 or you escaped from a mental health institution because every primary school pupil in Nigeria know that Nigeria got her independence on October 1 1960. That is why we celebrate independence day every October 1, dummy.

Between 1967 to 1970 when the Igbos lost over 2 million of her indigines in the Nigeria civil war, Benin was neither a country nor have a standing army to be defeated by Igbo, for you to think and believe otherwise shows your level of reasoning and mental capacity, very poor and below average.

AmuDimpka:
Your stupidity is legendary...so zik is now an authority....a man that Igbo don't even hold in esteem.

Okay show me evidences of Onitsha coming from Benin

Start from language, culture, foods and religion

Ozuo

If Zik is not an authority and the Igbos don't hold him in high esteem, I guess you are the one they hold in high esteem, you can carry on in your delusion, Mr Authority

Imagine you implying that Zik is stupid and by extension anyone that quotes him is also stupid just because you don't agree with his autobiography.

MelesZenawi:
Nairaland is riddled with fake news. If there are such statement I will know that more than you.

Go get a reliable source.

Nigeria argument and character now showing fully in you.


in how sound you proved to be, look at what you are bringing....lol


highly disappointed.


Okowa never said such and will not. That's fake news and rubbish with no source.


Are you this petty?

Below is from Sahara reporters

Gov. Wike: Rivers State Not Part Of Biafra

Rivers State Governor, Nyesom Wike, has stressed that Nigeria must remain an indivisible and united nation, saying the government and people of Rivers will not be part of the agitation to break up the country.Speaking Tuesday at the Sultan's palace in Sokoto when he led a high-powered delegation of traditional rulers and leaders of thought from Rivers on a Sallah visit, Wike noted that every nation in the world has its peculiar challenges

BY SAHARAREPORTERS, NEW YORKJUN 27, 2017

Rivers State Governor, Nyesom Wike, has stressed that Nigeria must remain an indivisible and united nation, saying the government and people of Rivers will not be part of the agitation to break up the country.

Speaking Tuesday at the Sultan's palace in Sokoto when he led a high-powered delegation of traditional rulers and leaders of thought from Rivers on a Sallah visit, Wike noted that every nation in the world has its peculiar challenges


The governor affirmed that the onus is on the leaders of Nigeria is to find lasting solutions to the various challenges confronting the nation, stressing that there are better ways to solve the agitations and problems facing Nigeria, rather than seeking a break-up.

"Rivers State and its people believe in the oneness and unity of Nigeria and that is our stand. In Sokoto, we have a father in the Sultan. In fact, he is a father to all Nigerians and he is a peace builder in this country and beyond.

"I have also been friends with the Governor of Sokoto State, Aminu Tambuwal , since before his emergence as a Speaker of the House of Representatives and this will be sustained despite the fact that we belong to different political parties," he added.

Tambuwal, who accompanied Wike upon the visit to the palace, had earlier said that the visit could not have come at a better time than now. He expressed the hope that his visit would help to strengthen the bond of unity between the two states.

In his remarks, Sultan Muhammad Sa'ad Abubakar described the ongoing agitations in the country as symptoms of the rot in the Nigerian system, adding that although a lot of things have gone wrong in the past, hope is not lost.

"A lot of things were done in the past by some people with impunity and nothing was done. That is why you find a shortage of good governance now weighing us down in the country. However, as it is now, no matter how bad your hand is, you cannot cut it and throw away," he added.

The Sultan called for dialogue to resolve all the misunderstandings and problems in the country, saying that Nigerians should work together, retrace their steps and move forward.

In that regard, he appealed to Nigerian statesmen to wade into the matter. "We are not short of statesmen across Nigeria and they should help the country by championing the dialogue," he said.

Those in Wike's entourage include former Rivers Governor Celestine Omehia; former Acting National Chairman of PDP, Uche Secundus; former NBA President, OCJ Okocha; Chairman of Rivers State Council of Traditional Rulers and Amanayabo of Opobo Kingdom, King Dandeson Douglas Jaja; Amanayabo of Abonnema, King Gbobo Bob-Manuel; and Oda of Abua, King Kelly Obunge.

MelesZenawi:
Okowa never made such statement and hardly speaks.

Wike never said such. Amaechi will be quick to tell you he is an Igbo man even his wife is from here.


So your logic is useless. Stop arguing like a pained typical Nigerian kicking for facts.


You are now bending argument to Nigerian way.

Is there any Benin man answering Igbo name?

Is there any Benin man with Yoruba name?


Your answer is as good as mine.


Let's be logical.

Delta State Governor, Senator Dr Ifeanyi Okowa has dispelled claims of the Indigenous People of Biafra, IPOB to the effect that Anioma Nation in Delta State belongs to Biafra Republic.

Governor Okowa stated that the Anioma ethnic nationality was never a part of the South-East region and does not subscribe to the renewed agitation by the Indigenous People of Biafra, IPOB.

The Governor stated this during an interactive session with newsmen at the Government House Press Centre Asaba.

“Biafra agitation, we have criticized it. Anioma land as it is said, from here, was part of Bendel State, it was part of the Midwest Region.

“We were never part of the South East and obviously we cannot be said to be part of them. We may speak the same language but we were never part of the South East. We were part of the old Midwest, we were part of Bendel, we are now Delta State and we are Deltans." he said
(Quote) (Report) 26 Likes (Like) 5 Shares (Share)

https://www.nairaland.com/2911424/anioma-nation-not-part-biafra

MelesZenawi:
You sounding like someone losing the argument but I don't want you to.

I only want you to see reality as it is and not by emotions. In your south there exist many Igbo groups.

Sometimes you should bluntly face fact which is how real men survive. Bring to the table something more achievable and not baseless logic.

Stop annexation...it is evil but face the truth. I hold nothing against Edo, not at all but I see them same as Yorubas both in behavior and everything coupled with facts that both have kind of same history. I have seen an Edo person with name Ajiboye same as Yorubas. politically they are same in thought.

Be logical sometimes.

Those you would like to refer to as Igbo of south south, Ameachi, Wike, Okowa have severally said they and their people will want nothing to do with Biafra and they should be counted out. The south south will not replace the Hausa Fulani with Igbo overlord when they can control their various resources 100%.

MelesZenawi:
Nigeria argument.

Benin to ogoja man...

U Sabi road to south south at all. How near and close are you to far away cross river.

Well I am not advocating for any lumping but simply Igbos as biafra is only. Agitate for Edo republic since you doesn't want to be in Oduduwa.

My argument I always maintain will never be skewed but simple, blunt and the truth.

Sit there and be shouting Niger delta when reality is far from you. For you to may headway, you must accept reality and face it head on.


How many hours will it take you to reach Akwaibom?

How many minutes will it take an Abia man to reach same?


Work with sound map and not emotion. Most of you guys are just ruled by emotions not faction ground. Biafra of today is Igbo and Igbos alone.

Same way others should learn to accept facts rather using Nigeria logic that is dead.

The south south coming together to form Niger Delta will be strategic for defence purposes in case our neighbours become over ambitious in the future as there is strength in numbers.

MelesZenawi:
This one is still talking of south south...Lol

Do you speak Igbo, do you understand Igbo, you bear Igbo names, do you study Igbo as language in your school?

The above answers your question.


If I am opportuned, I will rightly put Edo , Urhobo and Itshekiri in west ....that's the right map.


If you are really sound in your argument, all your facts and submission should be sound as a learned human being and not as skewed as a Nigerian.


You have to face facts and not emotion.

You must be delusional if you think your Biafra will go behold the current five states of the south east.

The creation of the south south is one thing Abacha did right.

If and whenever Nigeria breaks up or goes into Confederation, this is how current southern Nigeria will look like, the landlocked south east will form Biafra, south south coming together to form the Niger delta, and west will form Ododuwa.

MelesZenawi:
I totally agree with your ending paragraph. Highly superb....Homogeneity....you concluded that line very well.


But someone keeps adding you in any map they draw no matter which way also speaks volume.

You are also guilty of what you accuses others of, given the opportunity, you also would like to add Anioma and almost all part of south south to your Biafra map.

MelesZenawi:
Your own argument is highly myopic.

Benin empire or kingdom is long gone. Contain yourself with your fellow edos and stop going trajectory. That's the simple logic.


Distorted documents doesn't move me. I can only see through reasons of such history prevalent and most especially through behavioural pattern.

I can't claim to be A and everything I am doing looks and sound B. It makes the argument look foolish.

Unfortunately for you, Benin history is well documented and nothing you and anyone else can do about it now. If you don't like the Obi of Iseele-Uku claiming Benin ancestry fo his people, you are free to go to his palace and take up the issue with him, same for other tribes across the south south that claims Benin ancestry, you are free to take the fight to them.

MelesZenawi:
Totally different from my question.

What happens to his names from Benin to Igbo.

Do you know the meaning of nduka or Ezeagwuna in Benin language...

Does it have any meaning there?

Why is there no single Benin name attached to him?

How do you correlate this two?

Sometimes we have to reason before typing...

More you didn't even answer my question.

Today every member of the British royal family bear English names but they have German ancestry, hope you can see why your logic is myopic.

MelesZenawi:
Link only showed coronation but in anyway all these aren't substantiated.

History is not just something to fabricate,it is seen years by and will continue to be seen.

Today a Benin man reasons like a yoruba man and both agrees easily and understands themselves quite well same as an urhobo man....this shows age long and how history works meaning both had been in the same train and terrain for a long time while in Igbos it is purely the opposite as both never agree showing the history is more of business and conquest.

You cannot claim years of co habiting and hardly agree on any issue, that simply tells u that such relationship never existed but did on hostility.

Both explanation says it all.

You are irredeemable, you argue with Nnamdi Azikiwe about his history, you discount the history of Iseele-uku as told by the Obi himself, you wave off and distort Oluadah's history of his Ibo/Eboe people written in the 1700s, you say the Oba of Lagos and Olu of Warri don't know what they are saying, all these because you want to force Biafra on people at all cost.

You now see why people outside of the south east are very wary and sceptical of being part of your Biafra. Look at what you are already doing to people's cherished history, imagine if you now have the power to officially rewrite them.

Because of people like yourself, Biafra will continue to remain a pipe dream and at best confined to the present five states of south east.

MelesZenawi:
Well from your submission, one thing stand out and that is the name Ewohinmwin...today Esan and it will be more understandable if we conclude that Obaseki has full ties with Esans. The rest sounds like make up of a sojourn to another land.

Benins can't be claiming Igboland when they actually reasons against same people. People that have been together for too long are known to have common understanding and struggles.

Why is this particular case difference...can you explain?

Below is an extract from the first interview granted by the newly installed Obi of Issele-ukwu

INTERVIEW
"At first, I was embarrassed to see elders bow before me –25-year-old Obi of Issele-Uku"

Published April 1, 2017
===>> http://punchng.com/at-first-i-was-embarrassed-to-see-elders-bow-before-me-25-year-old-obi-of-issele-uku/



Can you tell us a little about the Issele–Uku Kingdom?

If you look at our history, we are descendants of the great Benin empire [/b]and as the history goes, on or about 1230 AD, Oba Eweka of Benin the first sent his second son, Prince Uwade towards the Eastern part of the Benin Empire first of all to check the influx of the Easterners into the kingdom and secondly to expand the empire. So Prince Uwade came along with his wives and some delegate warriors towards the eastern part, they settled here in the present Issele–Uku. So they settled and practised the same pattern of ascension to the throne like that in Benin. So after him, Prince Uwade became Ogewade and after him, his first son took over. So, that has been our brief history. We are descendants of the great Benin Kingdom.

AreaFada2:
Do you want to know for real education or to cast doubt? So that I can tell you the debt of detail commensurate with your motive.

Some of the guys here are not genuinely interested in learning what they are ignorant of, they only asked these questions not to learn but to cast doubts, their over bloated egos as being part of the so called big tribes will not allow them seek genuine history.

The history of where the Obasekis originally come from in Anioma is on the official Obaseki family website, same as the history of the various tribes that make up Anioma.

Rather than read and seek genuine history as told by the indigines themselves, you see someone from across the river Niger who hardly knows his own history arguing the history of Anioma with the indigines themselves because in their warped minds they should be able to decree anyone to become Biafra irrespective of their history.

Someone as illustrious as Dr Nnamdi Azikiwe said is ancestors were from Benin, you see a faceless person who probably has no history casting doubt on the Zik of Africa.

Anyone that seeks the history of the various tribes across the south south region of Nigeria can find most on the internet, written by the indigines themselves.

Even here on Nairaland you will see an Igbo arguing Anioma history with IKA people, you see Igbo man arguing the history of Ekpeye and Ikwere with the natives. So engaging them at times is for the benefit of those genuine seekers of history that may come across the thread.

History is nothing to be ashamed about, as great as the Benin empire was, other tribes (Ikas, Akures, Ifes, Izons, Itsekiris, Urhobos, etc) contributed and played their part and have become part of the fabric of the society. The Benins are not ashamed to acknowledge this.

Unlike any other places in Nigeria, Benin have a documented and written history spanning almost 600 years and if you add Ora history, Benin history is more than 3000 years old and you see an ignorant somebody from tribes that were lumped together in the 1900s by the British calling Benin small, Benin may be small in size now but there is no any other place in Nigeria with a bigger, richer history, the reason it's called the cradle of black civilisation.

MelesZenawi:
You are a blatant liar.

Oba of Benin presides over few local governments in Edo state.

I wonder how someone was so influential just to lose it in twinkle of an eye.

The Benin narrative is full of lies and moreover that was then and not now.

Anything Benin ends in Edo state and similarities with yorubas.

That's all.

You are now being mischievous, if Nnamdi Azikiwe said Onitsha was founded by descendants of Old Benin empire, why asked about Asaba that is just a stone throw from Benin City.

AmuDimpka:
Even Esan who are their cousins no even send them they want to bring their madness to Igbo Anioma area ....look at tiny Benin

Must you display your ignorance publicly, have you not be following the thread? Did you not read where Nnamdi Azikiwe said the old Benin empire extended to Onitsha and he was a descendant.

MelesZenawi:
Edos are Yorubas.

There is no need arguing that..

To the average Igbo, Edo is Yoruba and to the average Yoruba, Edo is omo Ibo. This confusion is largely due to ignorance.

By Ojealaro Stewart Friday.

After being incominicado for some days due to a horrible armed robbers attack at my Abuja abode,I improvised and got a gadget to peep into the items that are trending on social media. Two outstanding items caught my attention. One is the matter concerning APC illegally-convened NEC meeting to oust Oshiomhole. This though huge is not enough to make me ignore the biggest topic of all...the deposition of Emir Sanusi of Kano and his banishment to Nasarawa State. I saw many articles on the matter by Nigerians and once again,wittingly or unwittingly Nigerians admitted the preeminence of the Benin Throne above all other traditional stools in Nigeria. As one of my brothers,Elabor Joe pointed out,he said " It was Emir of Kano that was dethroned but it is the Oba of Benin that is trending in lieu..." I think he said this because of the fact that Nigerians are comparing the Kano stool to the Benin stool. Yes,it is this sacrilegious comparison that provoked this my article. Benin cannot in anyway be compared to Kano and these are my reasons;

1. Age of Stool.
While the Benin throne is over 3000 years old( from the time of the Odionweres through the Ogisos to the Obas),the Kano Emirate is an aftermath of the 1804 Jihad of Usman Dan Fodio. It is a stool that is less that 300 years. The majestic aura is new and spiritually bland compared to that of Benin

2. NATURE Of Thrones.
The Oba of Benin is deemed a living god amongst men. He is an absolute monarch and no one is above him except God. No governor or president has a hand in his appointment. He is born to be King not to be elected. There are spiritual repercussions for anybody to tamper with the procedure of his ascension . On the other hand,the Emir of Kano is usually picked as you would a primary 6 class monitor by the governor of the state. This is with the understanding that he is answerable in certain matters to another traditional ruler...the Sultan of Sokoto.

3. Constituents of both Kingdoms

The Emirate of Kano is ruled by Fulanis but with over 80% of the constituents Hausa people. There is lack of traditional harmony that goes when the ruler and the ruled are related. Bola Ige ( of blessed memory) once described Edo people as a family not nation not tribe but family tied by blood.

4. Degree of supervision by state governments.

Let's get this very clear,no Governor nor head of state can depose an Oba of Benin or any of his cousins who are hereditary occupants of the mini kingdoms in Edo. Using the Oba Overamwen case as an instance of when an Oba of Benin was deposed is farfetched and irrelevant. His was a consequence of international war between Britain and Independent Benin Empire. The fact that he was not replaced by any person who is not his son tells you the situation is quite different. No, Oba of Benin cannot be deposed. According to Pauly Okpere,no Edo Governor dares tries it. In Edo,it is the governor that panders to the Oba not the Oba that panders up to the governor. The farther a wayward governor can go is to suspend the Oba from the state traditional council and this is not common and in fact,it only happened once and by a non indigene Military Administrator called Tony Onyeregbulem( Terrible Tony he was called). What happened when he declared Oba Erediauwa ( God rest his soul) suspended? The whole members of Edo state traditional council in solidarity with their traditional father boycotted the council and traditionally suspended Tony Onyeregbulem. While the Suspension of the Oba was lifted through the wise intervention of his relative Prof Ben Nwabueze ( who clearly knows his cousin was treading dangerous waters). But because the spiritually powerful Edo traditional rulers did not lift the suspension on Onyeregbulem,he died tragically in a certain hotel in Kaduna. Some claimed he was calling mosquitos Benin spirits before his demise. Let me also give another example of the suspension of a Benin hereditary traditional ruler...The Ojuromi of Uromi. Oshiomhole only deprived him of allowances from the coffers of the traditional council which is controlled by the governor. He did not dare go further than that as the people of Uromi throughout the period of suspension still hold their traditional court at the palace of the King of Uromi with the Ojuromi himself presiding. The conclusion is that,suspensions of the Oba of Benin or any traditional ruler in Edo state can only amount to statements made in poof and nothing more. It is the pronouncer of such sacrilegious statement that is actually in danger of repercussions.

CONCLUSION...

The deposition of Emir Sanusi incongruously laid to rest the matter of who amongst Nigerian traditional Rulers is the real deal.Nobody talked about any but the great Oba of Benin. This is because,they see the others as 'Efulefus' where the Oba of Benin is involved. I believe so too.

Shiver99:
LOL! Ok, let me just say this because it's clear that you are severely misinformed. At the height of the benin empire, most igbos still were not aware it existed. IT was simply insignificant to the vast majority of the Igbo population other than the tribes that neighboured them or traded directly with them.

OLaudah stated that he came from the province of 'eboe' in the 'vast benin empire'... Now, anyone informed by history, reading that statement should have paused there. Olaudah is believed to come from somewhere around modern Anambra so such a strange statement should be treated with skepticism.

The reason that Olaudah made that statement is because, during that time, Europeans had only made in contact with coastal African kingdoms. And in their crude understanding believed the territory of Benin covered all the land from west Africa to modern day Ethiopia, completely ignoring all civilisations in between; as indicated in that book. Now does that make any sense to you?

Even Olaudah himself in his biography wasn't convinced of this European belief and made sure that his readers knew it. He made sure after that sentence to state that neither he nor anyone in his town had ever heard of Benin prior to arriving in the west.

Once again, Igbos are very different from your people, I suggest you look west and stop dragging Igbo history with Igbo people.

The second to your last paragraphs is a complete fallacy, there is no where in Olaudah's book where he stated that neither he nor anyone in his town had ever heard of Benin prior to arriving in the west. It's either you haven't read the book, you misunderstood it or you read it upside down.

Olaudah made mention of the great king in Benin who he described as having less than nominal rule over his people, even though they where part of the Benin kingdom, his people where mostly allowed to run their affairs with little or no interference from Benin City, the capital of the empire.

There where no singular Igbo race as you would make us believe at this time, hundreds of years ago, present day Igbo land comprises of different people and villages then.

You stated that there are claims that Oluadah was possibly from present day Anambra, whether Anambra, Abia as claimed by some or Anioma in Delta state, one thing is for sure, all these places where one time under the Benin Empire.

Historians believe Olaudah to have been a native of Anioma or the south east because of his tradition which he described in his book.

You treat Nnamdi Azikiwe autobiography with scepticism, you treat Olaudah equiano's autobiography written over 200 years ago with scepticism and expect us to believe and take your Aba made stories written yesterday as history, wonder they say shall never end.

AreaFada2:
Dude, most people who make provocative statements here are not as smart as they like to portray themselves. Due to British disingenuous machinations, the rise of big tribes by population and the skewing of historical facts make people think life was always as it is now.
Like you mentioned, independent accounts of Benin history by Europeans over nearly 600 years abound. Rome, a small settlement by the River Tiber rose to control their known world.

Aside copy and paste, one on one, most cannot verbally explain the history the claim to know here. In Benin history is woven into the unique morning greetings of each family, songs, folklore, stories, proverbs, worship, prayers, marriage, royal activities and celebration, professional guild occupations, etc.

Most of them have no history, that is why you see a lot of distortions in their stories. How do you take stories from people who where formerly of different tribes and clans and try to make a unified history out of it without making a mess of the entire exercise.

Onitsha history is different from it's neighbouring Igbo towns, but because they have all now be lumped together as Igbo due to politic, you see someone from Owerre who hardly knows his own history arguing Onitsha history with Nnamdi Azikiwe. Similar thing you find with the Yorubas with someone from Ogbomosho arguing the history of Lagos and Lagos monarchy with the Oba of Lagos.

MelesZenawi:
As we all know Azikiwe genealogy has been disproved by many scholars as years run by. So read again and see the distortion and non agreement in his essay.

Since you and your co travellers know Nnamdi Azikiwe genealogy more than the great Zik himself and all his forebears before him who passed down their history to him, it's a complete waste of time debating you guys.

But be reminded that the history of Benin Kingdom is too established for you guys to be able to distort or change it.

Various European nations had been visiting and writing independent accounts of Benin Kingdom and it's vastness since the 1400s, about 600 years ago, long before the names, Yoruba, Ibo and Igbo where coined to represent a group of villages/villagers and returned slaves for political identification.

Like Benin, Rome is just a city today confirmed to the Vatican but it will be a historical heresy to argue that it didn't once rule over almost the entire known world including Europe and part of Africa.

Throughout history, great empires and kingdoms do rise and fall and shrink in sizes.

The Obi of Onitsha doesn't only carry the Benin traditional sword, his official traditional title, Agboghidi is also a Benin title.

Agboghidi the original bearer of that name/title was a great man from Ugo town in present day Orhionmwon local government area of Edo state.

In recent edition of Ofala festival, the Benin traditional attire was fully represented by a group of Onitsha men and women who wore them.

There was no such thing as a pre colonial Igbo, what you have where villages which where mostly under the leadership of the Oba of Benin.

You guys can read the works of Olaudah Equinano if you are really interested in the true history of what is today known as Anioma and south east Igbo.

Olaudah Equiano.

Olaudah Equiano (c. 1745 – 31 March 1797), known for most of his life as Gustavus Vassa (/ˈvæsə/),[5][6] was a writer and abolitionist from, according to his memoir, the Eboe region of the Kingdom of Benin (today southern Nigeria). Enslaved as a child, he was taken to the Caribbean and sold as a slave to a Royal Navy officer. He was sold twice more but purchased his freedom in 1766.

Olaudah Equiano is believed by historians to have been a native of either the present day Anioma or present day Abia State. He wrote his book in the 1700s when there was no place called Igbo land in Nigeria, long before latterday revisionist where born.

MelesZenawi:
How do you feel writing this essay to reach onitsha.

I am not disputing of Yorubas relationship to Edo as it can even be seen in names both answers, title of Kings and others.

But on Igbo claim, it totally and unholy fabricated and should be discarded the way it comes. Igbos don't have any culture in common with Benin even by names, kings title or any..

For Urhobo , nobody is disputing that but towards R.niger the story is purely fake.

Find yourself a copy of Nnamdi Azikiwe autobiography and history of Onitsha people to read.
Below is an extract.

Nnamdi Azikiwe: My Genealogy and Nativity

"Thus, in tracing my paternal lineage, I could say that both parents of my father are direct descendants of Eze Chima. As for me, I can trace my paternal ancestry in this wise: I am the first son of Chukwuemeka, who was the third child and first son of Azikiwe, who was the second son of Molokwu, who was the third son of Ozomaocha, who was the second son of Inosi Onira, who was the fourth son of Dei, the second son of Eze Chima, the founder of Onitsha." SOURCE - Nnamdi A zikiwe: My Odyssey, Chapter I (Spectrum Books, 1970) "My Genealogy and Nativity" p4 "I can trace my maternal ancestry thus: I am the first son of Nwanonaku Rachel Chinwe Ogbenyeanu (Aghadiuno)Azikiwe, who was third daughter of Aghadiuno Ajie, the fifth son of Onowu Agbani, first daughter of Obi Udokwu, the son who descended from five Kings of Onitsha. Five of these rulers of Onitsha were direct lineal descendants of Eze Chima, who led his warrior adventurers when they left Benin to establish the Onitsha city state in about 1748 AD." SOURCE - Nnamdi Azikiwe: My Odyssey, Chapter I (Spectrum Books, 1970) "My Genealogy and Nativity" p5 "One day I asked her (grandmother) the meaning of the word 'Onitsha'. She explained that it had historical significance. The terminology meant one who despised another. It is a contraction of two words, Onini to despise, and Ncha meaning others. So that the two words when joined together mean one who despises others. Then I asked her why we despised others. She patted me on the back and told me that it was due to our aristocratic background and tradition. I insisted that she should explain to me the basis of this supercilious social attitude. She told me that we despised others because we descended from the Royal House of Benin and so regarded ourselves as the superiors of other tribes who had no royal blood in their veins....." "I continued to belabor my grandmother to tell me more of the history and origins of the Onitsha people. She narrated that many many years ago, there lived at Idu (Benin) a great Oba who had many children. Due to a power struggle regarding the right of precedence among princes of the blood and other altercations, there was a civil war in Benin. One day, the supporters of one of the princes insulted and assaulted Queen Asije, the mother of of the Oba of Benin, who was accused of having trespassed on their farmland. Enraged at this evidence of indiscipline and lawlessness, the Oba ordered his war chief and brother, Gbunwala Asije to apprehend and punish the insurgents. In the attempt to penalise them, Chima, the ultimate founder of the Onitsha city-state, a prince of the blood in his own right, led the recalcitrants against his Uncle, Gbunwala. This intensified the civil war which rent the kingdom of Benin in two and led to the founding of Onitsha Ado N'Idu....... ..." "As the great trek from Benin progressed, some did not have the stout heart of the pioneer-warrior, and decided to settle at different places, known today as Onitsha -Ugbo, Onitsha-Olona, Onitsha-Mili, Obior, Issele Ukwu, Ossomari, Aboh, etc..." SOURCE - Nnamdi Azikiwe: My Odyssey, Chapter I (Spectrum Books, 1970) "My Genealogy and Nativity"