₦airaland Forum

dayokanu:
This argument you keep repeating doesnt make sense.

Your reasoning here is senseless. . . . .

Ronaldo Lima at Inter Milan did not win the league that must mean the Juventus strikers e.g Daniel Fonseca was better?

Inter bought Ronaldo Lima for £20 million(A world record fee) and he failed to win them a title.
The only reasonable deduction there is. . . . .Ronaldo was animal [b]S[/b]HIT at Inter.

U cannot be a good player without winning at least a domestic title.
All the best players in this world have won a domestic title for their clubs

edoyad:
Unlike our situation, If  Rooney go injury some people go sleep no wake up like Yaradua 

How many games has Rooney started this season for Man Utd?

We are too big to miss a single player.
Rooney can go on 12 months leave and United will come out unhurt.
We didn't need Rooney to beat the German Champions on their own soil.

BREAKING NEWS. . . . .BOLTON SACK GARY MEGSON.

duduspace:
The only thing I want to see in that index is confirmation of Cesc as the PFA player of the season.

Why are y'all wondering why the press is reporting Fab out for 3 weeks? they've never had anything good to write about us anyway so f**$%k them. I will only await the official news, Arsenal delayed the scan for a day so the injury could settle. They must have done it yesterday so news shld be out later today.

Your dreams are TALL!!!!

RuuDie:
Yeah detractors. . . . listen to NTA news more often and you'll hear a lot of that!  

Good. He does score the odd, spectacular goal every now and then abi but he has to score much more often than he does at the moment, right!?
This, I totally agree - but on the other hand, we don't mind 10-15 goals in the ligue this season from him, wanna know why!? becuz we are not solely dependent on his goals or the goals of any 1 individual for that matter.
If all he does is assist and the goals can come in from all others, that is fine, we'll take it. In that light, it doesn't translate to a waste i any way!

U get time sha. . . . . .

90% of these anti-Berbatov miscreants cannot tell us what made Dennis Bergkamp a LEGEND and yet they see Berbatov as a waste of cash!!!
What does it matter if Berbatov puts the ball in the net or not. . . . .With him in the squad, we won the league and got to the final of the UCL.
With Torres in Liverpool, they have won nothing. . . . With Drogba in Chelsea, they have not won the league for 3 seasons.

I'd rather have Berbatov who has improved our attack a great deal than Torres/Anelka who scores 50 goals per season and winning nowt.
The objective is to win titles. Having highest goal scorer on the planet is a bonus to any team.
As long as United keep winning titles, what Berbatov contributes weighs more in gold than any striker in the EPL.

Without Ronaldo, Berbatov and co have scored more goals than when Ronaldo/Tevez were with us.
What else do these rats want?   I can even understand when Mancs are complaining. . . .Wetin concern GAYnners(Eternal losers)?

Money---they don't have. . . .Titles -- they cannot boast of.
Why are they taking Tylenol for another woman's menstrual cramps?
Last time i checked, United did not lend the money from the Emirates to buy Berbatov.

HNIC:
Kai,
People of the world
Nothing you can do that can satisfy them
Is Arsene Wenger, the first coach to gamble on an unfit player?

It's one thing to gamble and win and it's another thing to gamble and lose.
Wenger's gamble will bite him in the backside if Arsenal drop points in the absence of Fab4.
A draw against Villa with Arsenal(including a fresh Cesc) beating Pompey, Bolton, etc is BETTER than a WIN against Villa and dropping points against the other 3 teams.

In the next three weeks, which teams are we playing
Pompey, Bolton etc?

U didn't give Sunderland any chance when they sodomised y'all.
Arsenal without Cesc are ordinary.

Which of these teams can be compared to an Aston Villa that has beaten all the other 'big 4' teams?
The Match has been described as Cesc 28 minutes of sheer brilliance and even the Villa blogs are hailing the one legged display by Fab4.
Methinks the only medis that will question Wenger's sanity if Fab4 is confirmed out for 3 weeks will be THE SUN(official manc tabloid)

Cesc is out for 3 weeks now so let the probings begin.
Is WENGER insane?

Sagamite:
Most of that is answered at the bottom part of my introductory post on this thread.

If he does not fail in those, i.e. he gets to the SF of ANC or wins it, then it would be if he embarasses himself at WC.

*****Fingers crossed*********

I can't wait for the next 3 weeks when the battle of African Giants commences.

Eastbay:
This ball retention story is what we'll never hear the last of.

It is the best weapon to hurt your opponent.
Barcelona deployed it against us in Rome and we chased the ball for 70 mins. . . .

So it's ok to pay 30 mill for a ball retainer.Why didn't we get Olofinjana instead?
We woulda gotten 10 of him for that sum.

Man Utd is worth $1.8 billion. . . . .We can afford to splash £30 million on Berba.
United are not non-profitable organisations like Arsenal and Chelsea. £30 milla is a drop in the ocean as far as our operating profit is concerned.
Don't join the poor to lament over £30 milla.

How many crucial goals does Berbatov score?
Can you count on him when the chips are down?Honestly could you?

His goal helped us put Tottenham away in last season's FA Cup tie at OT.
What about his massive contribution against Tottenham in the league, Fulham, Newcastle(away) and Sunderland.
Can i count on Berba when the chips are down? A resounding YES!!!

I can count on him to deliver an intelligent ball to a team-mate to score like he did against CSKA in Moscow.
His flick gave Valencia all the time to shoot into the net.
There are some assists that make the goal scoring too easy for the scorer. Berbatov provides that week in week out.

So as it stands,only Rooney alone should shoulder the scoring threat,while Berbasoft dances Atilogwu in the final third?
And you expect us to win something at the end of the season.

Ruud shouldered our scoring threat back in the days. . . . .Did we not win the league with Ruud?
If the chances provided to Rooney are easy. . . .He will be very happy and snappy to shoulder the scoring threat.
That will also boost Rooney's CV cos he has remained under Ronaldo's shadow for too long.

Lemme ask you this question. . . . .United's third goal against Hull ----Whose task was more difficult?
Rooney's assist or Berbatov's task of putting it into the net?
If Rooney gets that kind of service every game, will he complain about shouldering the scoring threat ALONE?

mystikal:
everyone

Count me out. . . . .You losing twats!!!

I am still ALIVE in the fantasy cup.

Sagamite:
I agree 1994 football is better than sex.

But I would not fire a coach for not giving me that even though I have not got sex for years now.

I will wait for him to fail before sacking him.

I am not a big fan of SE football style at the moment and dream of the 90s football, neither am I a fan of England's, Italy's, Portugal's, Russia's, Brazil's football etc but I don't think they will sack their coach for that as long as he is delivering. Neither does it mean that their coaches are not good. Otherwise you are just saying all Italian coaches right from time are pants.

The only football that is sexy to me now is Spain and CIV.

The question now is. . . . . At what point would you put your hands up that Amodu has failed?
Losing out in the next ACN in the group?
Losing out in the knock out rounds of the ACN?
Disgracing Nigeria in the group stage in South Africa?

debosky:
How many asists of goal assists did he make?  

Trailer loads. . . .

[/quote]Talk about finding the needle in a hay-stack.
From this link i was able to bring this out. . . . Ferguson is now opting to use Wayne Rooney as a central striker, rather than playing him out wide, alongside either Michael Owen or Dimitar Berbatov.

In this debate. . . . .I have been able to prove Berbatov is NOT lazy and he is NOT United's centre forward.
The myth about Berbatov being a lazy player and he is the poacher has been blown to bits.
Trust me. . . . The next time you open your mouth with your paraga-influenced opinion, i will shove a cue in it.


[quote]If Fergie believes Fergie has been sub par so far, why does Sharon think he knows better?

He did not say Berbatov has been sub par so far.
Ferguson expects everyone to ship in their own share of goals.

"Those goals from midfield have dried up a little in recent years, so we have to address that.

"I will be looking to (Ji-Sung) Park, Nani, (Luis Antonio) Valencia - even (Danny) Welbeck and (Federico) Macheda - to contribute 40 goals between them. The defenders will contribute a few from set-pieces too."

Since Valencia, Park and Nani haven't scored half of the goals Fergie expects them to contribute. . . .Does it also mean they have been sub-par?
Did Ferguson factor Berbatov's knee operation before saying he expects his strikers to score 60 goals?
Debosky, you are a pile of [i]w[/i]ank.

BlueDiva:
More woes for United.
Mrs. Van der Sar suffers brain damage.

Surely, expect below par performances henceforth from the goalie.
My condolences.

Obviously, you have been staying out of this planet.

Remind me. . . . .When was the last time VDS stood between the posts for Man Utd?
Unlike Chelski, there's strength in depth so we won't miss VDS.

If i were you, i would worry over the absence of Drogba, Essien, Mikel and Kalou.

debosky:
This is a matter of semantics - Cantona personified Utd at a time yes or no? Berba will never be such a player.

He never did.

Yet Utd have scored 30 goals this season with no input from Berbatov - he's bought to create chances and has created just TWO and half the season is gone? What an abysmal failure.

How is it failure? What about assist of the goal assists.
Like i have told y'all. . . . .Stats alone does not show Berbatov's contribution.
There are tangibles and the intangibles. . . . .

Regardless of the number of efforts, the goals counted yes or no? Is someone stopping Berba from shooting? What a ridiculous excuse.

He is selfless. . . . .He is not governed by the number of goals he scores. . . . .He's governed by the number of goals he initiates.

Don't be silly - Rooney will NEVER score 30 goals in a season, never mind 42. . . .You cannot have only one striker with goal scoring responsibility and even Ronaldo's performances were out of character - you RARELY have a single winger producing that weight of goals.

He has eclipsed the total number of league goals he scored throughout last season.
If United go all the way in all competitions and Rooney does not cop any injury, he can score 42.

[b]Fergie's intent [/b]was to spread out that goal threat among his STRIKERS - and that includes Berba, and not sole dependency on a single Portuguese player who was bound to leave.

U slept with Fergie to know his intentions?
Where did he say i want to spread out the goal threat among my strikers. . . .
When you make idiotic opinions, abeg. . . .back it up with links.

I have provided links to every single schitzo i have made here. . . . .Tow that line.

Sagamite:
Apart from Brazil and Germany, no other team has qualified for every WC.

England did not qualify in 1994 for WC.

Holland did not qualify in 2002, 1986 and 1982 for WC.

Uruguay did not qualify in 1994 and 1998 for WC despite winning Copa America in 1995.

Colombia did not qualify in 2002 for WC despite winning Copa America in 2001.

U cannot argue that Holland and England are the best teams in Europe. . . .
Germany, France, Italy are ahead in pecking order so this analogy is not airtight.
There's an empirical evidence that Nigeria is amongst the top 4 countries in Africa.

In South America, Brazil + Argentina are the super powers.
The other positions are up for grabs.
Nigeria has had so much dominance in Africa it will be a travesty if we don't qualify for ACN or WC.

Spain did not qualify in 1992 for Eurocup.

Italy did not qualify in 1992 for Eurocup.

England did not qualify in 2008 for Eurocup.

I have tried to be fair with my arguments by not going beyond 1980. That is just my style. If I did, the list would be more exhuastive.

Qualification is more difficult in Europe than in Africa.
There are many strong countries in Europe. . . .so many teams have equal strength which makes qualification a bit tedious.
It's not the same with Africa.

So what about Ike Uche?

1 player out of 23 players.
Do you know how many players Westerhof exhumed from the Nigerian league?

As long as he is meeting his target, and is obviously selecting the best players we have, it is not in my place to question his tactics of monitoring.

Angola will be a true test. He must deliver in Angola and i'll be here in 3 weeks time to see how good Amodu is.

I would bet on Amodu, but I don't think we have a team that has a birthright to second round. Their are a lot of teams with better players than us.

Westerhof did.
Bruno Metsu took Senegal to Q/finals.
Cameroun also reached Q/finals in Italia 90.
Amodu has no excuse. . . . . . He is not new in managing a national team.

I don't particularly think our players are better than South Korea's or Greece's.

On paper, we shouldn't have topped our group in USA 94.
Bulgaria had Stoichkov and Argentina had Caniggia and Maradona but Westerhof topped his group.
Are you saying Nigeria in 94 were better than Argentina and Bulgaria?

We all had blind optimism then. We were fed parochial views and all superhyped. We all even thought we would thrash Brazil.

Blind optimism?
Nigeria were good value then.
Ariggo Sacchi said he woulda taken that team to win the WC.

Luckily we had hungry players that were willing to pull their weight in a once-a-lifetime opportunity.

It's called MOTIVATION. . . . .A virtue a manager has to instil in his players.
I am not convinced Amodu has injected that to his players yet.

Never losing a game in 12 and winning 9 is an achievement.
Never losing a game in 24 matches and winning 19 is a super achievement.

Obviously, you are attracted to his results and completely ignoring his brand of football.
One can win trophies by playing beautiful football. USA94 team qualified for the world cup, won the nations cup and they play beautiful football.
The brand of attacking football Nigeria played in 1994 is better than sex.

I want Amodu to emulate that. . . . . .Police football is tiresome.

debosky:
Another perceptive deduction. Will a languid and often sulking Berba ever be the driving force and heart of this Utd side like Cantona was? Not in a billion light years.

Cantona was never the driving force. Shut up you know nada about Man Utd.
Roy Keane, Mark Hughes, Steve Bruce were the driving force.

He doesn't have the bottle, neither does he have the personality to be that type of player.
No - Berba holds on to the ball in the final third so he can pass to Rooney to score - ask again how many of the goals by Rooney this season have come from this move.

He doesn't have to be Rooney.
Berbatov holds the ball and plays an intelligent pass to anyone in the box to score.
The kind of quality he gives, he does not get em from his team-mates. That is the difference.

Precisely - Ronaldo was scoring like hell and was bound to leave in a season or two. . . .hence the need for a proven, premiership calibre goal scorer - enter Berbatov with two seasons of 20+ goal hauls.

For a selfish Portugese player who attempts 200 shots per season, it is very normal for him to score like hell.
If you factor his freekicks, penalties, etc. He should be scoring more.
Adebayor's conversion rate was miles better than Ronaldo's in the season CR7 scored 42 goals.

Having an ability to pass like Cantona doesn't now mean this is his PRIMARY role - he is in the side to score goals period. If not, then Utd only have Rooney to score goals.

Having the ability to pass like Cantona is his primary role. The goals is the bonus.
Fergie has given Rooney the role of stepping into Ronaldo's shoes. He did not give Berbatov that responsibility.

Eastbay:
BTW,
You know very well that the Cantona reference was a stretch.
Cantona was aggressive,result-oriented,and scored the occassional crucial goal.
None of which Berbasoft has been able to do.

Cantona was aggressive? U make me laugh!!!
He was aggressive with players and fans who say rubbish about him.
There was nothing aggressive in the brand of footie he plays.

How crucial was the goal Berbatov scored against Bolton last season in Reebok stadium?
What about the lone strikes against Boro and Sunderland at OT last season?
These goals kept us above Liverpool in the league. . . . . Berbatov has scored more crucial goals.

Are you supposed to retain the ball in the final third?

Yes!!!
Retaining it will keep the opposition from having the ball.
It is no secret that United conceded fewer goals last season and the ball retention meant less stress for our defence.
With Berbatov on the pitch, our defence don't come under pressure.

For all Ronaldo's industry, he gave the ball away more than hurting the opposition.
Something Fergie criticised him for even though he scored 42 goals.
In football, retention is the most important thing. When your opponents don't have the ball, they cannot hurt you.

I thought you were supposed to be more incisive there.I thought the midfield is where retention counts.
I still don't see why a supposed striker (whetehr true or false)would have anything to do with ball retention.

Berbatov does have something to do with retention.
U cannot hurry him to play a pass when the whole area is crowded a la Rooney and Tevez(especially).
Tevez gets lost when put under pressure thus giving the ball away and hurting his own team. Berbatov corrected that.
It is no coincidence we kept 14 clean sheets after Berbatov's arrival and our AWAY form in Europe has improved massively.

I think the first part of your statement isn't entirely true.
We had an awesome attack 2007/8,pre-Berbatov.I don't see where the giving away of the ball happened.

Awesome attack, YES.
What about goals conceded via counter attacks from our opponents.
Arsenal pegged us back TWICE at the Emirates because our ATTACK were generous with giving the ball away NEEDLESSLY.

I think Berba was brought in to take the scoring load of CR7 and give another scoring option.Because if anything happened to him back then,we didn't have much else of a scoring threat in Rooney and Tevez.
That's the way I see it.Any other explanation doesn't convince me.

The way you see it is different from the way Sir Alex sees it.
He wanted a replica of Cantona. Cantona did not share the load of goal scoring with our strikers back in the days.
I keep telling anti-Berba groups that until you sort yourselves out and realise what you want from Berba is different to what Fergie wants, your heartbroken moments shall persist.

Eastbay:
Saroun,I'll take you up on this
Why isn't Fergie confident enough to make him your "poacher",especially since in the Bulgaria & spurs case,he seems to be delivering properly?
I bet my life he  (Fergie) is scared to try it.The results would be only a DISASTER.

Fergie was looking at where United needed improvement and he realised we gave the ball away too easily in the final third.
He bought Berbatov. A striker with a cool head, a player who does not hurry when others do.
In Man Utd, the supporting striker role is what fits Berbatov the most because you cannot ALWAYS rely on Rooney to play intelligent passes.

If you play Berbatov as a poacher, the passes from Rooney won't get to him and he will starve!!!

TRIO BOOST FOR MAN UTD

Sir Alex Ferguson delivered some more festive cheer on Tuesday with the news that several Reds are back, or close to returning, from injury.

Following Rafael's comeback against Hull, Gary Neville is the latest to bolster United's defence and could feature on Wednesday against Wigan.

Paul Scholes missed the win over the Tigers after suffering a kick on the hip in training, but is fit for the visit of Roberto Martinez's side, as is Anderson. Nani is the only injured forward.

Sir Alex also confirmed at his pre-match press conference that Jonny Evans and Rio Ferdinand will be back in action soon, with John O'Shea due to return a little later.

Meanwhile, Edwin van der Sar is has been told to stay in the Netherlands with his wife, who is in hospital.

More to follow from Carrington. . . . .

Suddenly everything is looking bright again. . . . .

Rio, O'Shea, Neville all back?
It's looking like another Man Utd title yet again.

FFS, where is Owen Hargreaves??

debosky:
Provide a quote saying he was bought to be the new Cantona. . . it is simply a figment of your imagination.

There you have it, MUPPET!!!
This comment was made a day before Berbatov's first LEAGUE appearance for Man Utd against Liverpool at Anfield.

Manchester United boss Sir Alex Ferguson has happily compared Dimitar Berbatov to legend Eric Cantona.

Ahead of today's clash at Liverpool, Ferguson said: "I've been pleased with [Dimitar] Berbatov's form this season, he's responded well to playing all the time. He reminds me of Eric Cantona, the way he takes his time when other players would hurry.

"And like Eric, although he can do the flicks and first time passes very well, he knows when a short, simple pass is the best option. I always used to say Eric was the best ever passer of the simple pass."

Sagamite:
No, it should not be Nigeria's birthright.
It is not necessarily the best teams  that go to WC.

Show me a continent where the best teams there don't go to WC.

Nigeria is not even in the top 3 teams in Africa and might be joint 4th with 2 teams, so very vulnerable to being one of the best not going.

I admit we are not among the top 3 teams in Africa but FIFA allow 5 African teams so by your own estimation, Nigeria should be the 4th/5th qualifying team.
This is why i said with 5 teams qualifying in Africa, Nigeria should be making it by default!!!!

What makes Amodu not good?

His tactical approach, no player has developed under him, he has not found a new gem.
How many times does he travel to monitor his players in Europe?
Would you bet your mortgage that Amodu will qualify us for the 2nd round in the world cup?

When Westerhof took us to USA, i knew Nigeria would qualify even though we were drawn in the same group with Maradona and Stoichkov.

Katsumoto:
Correct, no one has the right to call himself/herself a coach if he can not get Nigeria to the WC as one of Africa's 5 representatives. Struggling with Liberia was no achievement as was struggling Tunisia who aren't playing particularly well at the moment.

Depending on other result in the group to qualify is not actually an achievement.
Nigerians deserve better.

debosky:
A false 9? 
I think you mean he was a universal deception a la Saha. 

Saha is better than Eduardo and Van Persie.
False 9 = A supporting striker.

Berba was bought to score goals - simple. The only reason he is being allowed to play 'second striker' is that Fergie has seen that the dude's effectiveness at the top has become abysmal - all he is now good for is to roam about aimlessly and score the occasional goal or make the periodic flick.

He has never played as a centre forward for Man Utd.
Fergie wanted a new Eric Cantona. . . . . . .He knew what he wanted in Berbatov and he paid top dollar for him.
Unless you have proof to show us that Cantona was used as a centre-forward, you have shown another form of idiocy yet again.

How is this so difficult to grasp?

Berbatov in Spurs. . . . .Poacher
Berbatov in Bulgaria. . . Poacher
Berbatov in Man Utd. . . 2nd striker.

debosky:
Again, what was Berba bought for? Was he bought as a striker or a midfielder and what do strikers do?

He was bought as a false 9. . . .A second striker. . . . .A supporting striker.
Rooney was promoted to a centre-forward as soon as Louis Saha left for Everton.

Berbatov plays far too deep to be a poacher like Ibrahimovic.
In Fergie's words. . . . "I want Rooney to play with his face to goal rather than his back to goal.
You need one player more advanced and then the other can move around him."

debosky:
Interesting comparison - how many goals has Ibra scored for Barca?  

Ibra is a poacher for Barcelona. . . . . .A straight swap for Samuel Etoo unless you want us to believe it is Thierry Henry or Messi that is their centre forward. Daft analogy yet again.

So as long as Utd keep winning titles, there is no flop at the club and no player is deemed a waste. . . fantastic reasoning. I am highly disappointed in you RuuDie.

Of course. . . . , Winning is the name of the game.
A team cannot win 3 EPL titles with a buncha flops in their ranks.
It is a massive disgrace that Arsenal(a flawless team that packs 20 world class players) have not won a dime in 5 seasons.

Eastbay:
Sauron,
Still waiting on why Fergie would drop him to the bench for critical,huge games against Chelsea and Arsenal.

Berbatov was injured against Chelsea. . . . .Check your facts.
Against Arsenal, the reason was tactical. We played a flat 4-3-3 to match Arsenal's new formation.

Tactical reasons?Still looks like a DUD to me.
Besides, we're not talking about starts here.Total appearances is what we are discussing.

Start is very crucial cos a starting player bar emergency will cop more minutes than a sub.

If United play a different way from Spurs,then why was he bought?It would mean he doesn't fit into United's plans since he wouldn't be needed.
Ok,gone are the days when a player's number reflected his position.but we all know he wouldn't be given 9 if he was a defender.

1) He was bought to improve our ball retention in the final third.

2) Why would he not fit into United's plans. Are Man Utd Tottenham?
What has Berba's contribution for SPURS gotta do with Man Utd? In SPURS, Berbatov and Robbie Keane are the leaders.
When Keane was absent, Berbatov took penalties and freekicks for SPURS.
In Man Utd, Berbatov is not even in the top ten of people to take set pieces. . . .We have Rooney, Giggs, Nani, Carrick and Anderson.
His role/responsibility has changed. . . . .He joined a big team not ARSENAL.

3) Arsenal gave William Gallas 10. . . . . . .Is he a striker?
Was Boulahrouz not wearing 9 for Chelsea at a point? What has number gotta do with it?

RuuDie:
depends on your definition of blistering form. . . . . . note, we didn't particularly buy Berba to come to OT and be saviour or guardian angel for the side. We already had a stable team, no worries or anything, like barren season or relegation threat - liken it to Barca's signing of Ibra, it wasn't warranted by a crisis or rank of a top striker or quality players.

Ruudie, you are too intelligent. . . . .This is the best post of the day.

United(a serial EPL champion + European Champions League) signed Berbatov and people expect him to win us what again?
A team that scored 99% in the previous season bought a new player. . . . .The only thing he can add to the team is 1% to become 100% but idiots like Debosky expect him to add 20% to make it 119% even though the marks available are 100%.

It beats me.

debosky:
You can. . . .but as always you don't make sense.

But i have provided STATS that made you look like a plonker that you are.

When Tevez was at United, Berbatov made more tackles than him.
Even now that Tevez is in Man City, Berbatov has made more tackles than him.

So i put it to you to prove Berbatov is LAZY or admit you are the biggest PLONKER this forum has seen since Folahann.

Sagamite:
Did anybody see how Chelsea's defence played like schoolboys under Ancelotti yesterday?

If that was Amodu, what would people say?

People that kno nada about football.

Amodu is not a good coach. . . . . . .He might be the best in Africa but i doubt he can beat his peers in Europe tactically/technically.
You keep citing his achievement of qualifying us for the world cup but shouldn't that be Nigeria's birth right.

5 African teams go to the world cup and by default. . . . . .Nigeria should always be there.

debosky:
Couldn't have said it any better myself.

You are a goat!!!!
I already said people who think Berbatov does not add value to United are muppets.
U can consider yourself one. . . . .

Berbatov is NOT lazy. . . . . .I can argue that till thy kingdom come.

RuuDie:
quick question for u. . . .  Kaka cost 56milla - has he, in your humble opinion, justified that price-tag for the all-whites just yet!?

U don't need to overflog this issue. . . .

There is a wide gulf between fans' expectations and Berbatov's end product.
Most football fans aren't well informed about his contributions both attacking and defensively wise.
There are many factors a player like Dimitar brings to the table. You have the tangibles. . . .goals, assists . . . . and the intangibles.
But the not so tangible things he does so well are often overlooked by 'muppets' like Debosky and Dayokanu.

Berbatov plays way deeper than he did at Spurs. He has changed his game.
In most games, he doesn't play as a striker at United. His role is to link our midfield and our forwards. He has played deeper than Ronaldo, Rooney,Owen and even Park.

Fans, pundits, journalists etc. expect from him the end product of a striker and he doesn't play as a striker.
But they don't see this and are left with the impression that he doesn't do his job well and thus is a failure.
The misunderstanding is complete and at the same time comical.

debosky:
That is better than being a brainless single celled organism like yourself.  

See this mugu. . . . .Faced with stats that Berbatov tackles more, he kept quiet and he is grasping at straws.

It is a poor return and highlights the flaws in your argument - even his 7 'direct' goal contributions cannot explain the 30 goals united have scored this season. He has been the reason why many more have not been scored with his atrocious misses in front of goal. How many appearances has he had?

How many has he missed?
I remember him bailing United out against Sunderland and Blackburn. . . . .Games United woulda lost if not for Berba's timely interventions.

How many winning goals has he scored this season?  

Loads.
Goals that had taken us from a losing/drawing position into a winning position.
He scored the all important goal against Stoke, Blackburn and Sunderland.

Ok - how many of such goals has he scored? Berba often scores cherry on the cake goals, not game changers - even his assists (such as for Valencia) are of the same quality - after the game has been won and the opposition has given up.

Often? . . . . .If i present hard facts here again, you will choke on your words.
You are just like many other soccer illiterates who conceive dirty ideas in your frail mind and generate an opinion from it.
Berbatov is not lazy and he is by no means a FLOP.  Fergie is happy with his performance and so are United fans who have seen what he does on the pitch.

RuuDie:
citing a certain senseless analogy by someone here:

Dudu having scored 34 goals in 32 appearances for Zagreb, comes to Arsenal and only nets 4 in 17 appearances the following season is a waste of the gunners' precious money.

U don't need statistics to know Eduardo is a massive FLOP.
He is the most useless striker in Europe. . . . .At least Berba's contribution helped his team win titles last season.
What has Eduardo added to Arsenal apart from gnashing of teeth and bad luck?

debosky:
That collective goal scoring has been IN SPITE of Berbatov not because of him. One might even argue further that the absence of those players has resulted in fewer goals for Berbatov.

You are a goat if that is what you could deduce.
At least i have done ma bit to educate you that Dimitar won more tackles than Rooney, Tevez and Ronaldo last season.
Even this season. . . .He has won more tackles than Tevez/Rooney despite copping fewer game time.

Berbatov is lazy is the biggest myth in English football and SAF actually said he covers more ground than Rooney.

Kindly tell us what proportion of the goals this term have been down to Berbatov - he obviously hasn't been scoring them, so has he been the one creating them all?

5 league goals and 2 assists in 11 starts is not a bad return for Dimitar.

Are you a slowpoke? He can be poor in training and hence not deserving of any more than a seat on the bench.
Most of the goals that were laid on a platter for him by other players. .  .now dried up and the flop is being exposed for what he is.

He went for a knee operation, you dimwit.
Up until his injury against Blackburn, he has been our best striker in large proportions.
Nicking goals here n there to bail his team out.

What are the number of goals involved in this argument?

League goals.

37 this season versus 25 the previous season. Out of the 37, how many has Berba scored? Just 5.
With the aid of simple arithmetic, it is clear that the 32 goals are not due to Berbatov hence we can say his contribution has NOT led to the marked improvement, but has occurred in SPITE of him.

You are daft. . . . .His contribution has led to the marked improvement because the timing of those goals also play a significant part.
There are goals that effectively kill games off like what Cesc did to the Villans.
Goals are not just goals in sheer numbers. . . . .It is how those goals affect matches that matters.
As soon as Ronaldo scored his freekick at the Emirates, Arsenal were there for the taking. . . . .Had United scored 10 that night, other goals woulda been icing on the cake. The goal that killed the game was Ronaldo's.

If a simpleton is better at arithmetic than you are then you must be a single celled amoeba.

You are not smarter than a spermatozoon whose task is just to swim.

debosky:
They were bought to perform in line with their previous performances - did any of them score 23 goals in the seasons preceding their moves to Chelski and Arsenal?

Dennis Bergkamp scored 30 goals TWICE for Ajax.

What tournaments have Bulgaria attended in that time to show he played in more difficult games? It's all in your head -Eduardo is better than Berba at international level. Simple.

Does it have to be a tournament?
There are no Euro qualifiers or WC qualifiers?
How dumb can you be when you argue with Sauron?
Only a complete goat will say Eduardo is better than Macheda. . . . .never mind Berbatov and Eduardo(a poacher) was bought to replace HENRY!!!

Eduardo is useless.

debosky:
You must really be retarded - what else is a STRIKER bought for?   How moronic can you get?  

What was Eric Cantona bought for? Dennis Bergkamp? Zola? Kanu?
Get back to me when you can answer that.

logically better? You gotta explain that one for me dude.   The simple math tells me Eduardo is better than Berba at international level - SIMPLE. Everything else is hogwash.

A player plays 2 easy games and score 5 goals.
Another player scores 10 goals in 14 games.
Who would you say is better in the logical sense? The fact that Eduardo has played just a handful of games suggests he's had easier games to play than a striker that has played 76 times.

The difficulty index in playing 76 games is far far higher than playing 28 games.
If that does not help your reasoning, nothing else can.
How can a 26 yr old striker have 28 international caps? Rooney is 24. . . .He has got 57 caps.
Fletcher is 25, he's got 46 caps. Eduardo is useless for club/country.

Proof please - I hope this won't be another case of him 'logically' making more tackles.  

2008/9

Berbatov. . . . . .Tackles won(23), tackles lost(4) in 32 appearances
Tevez. . . . . . . . Tackles won(15), tackles lost(2) in 29 appearances
Rooney. . . . . . .Tackles won(12), tackles lost (4) in 30 appearances

So who has made the highest number of tackles?

jay bee:
R u saying that's due to berba?
Rooney have scored more goals simply because of his increase in responsibility.
He now takes penalties and free kicks plus he his the go to guy (focal point of attack) hence getting more chances.

That is not the point.
I am saying the team has collectively scored more goals this season than last season when Ronaldo and Tevez were still at OT.
Are you saying Rooney alone has scored the share of goals Ronaldo and Tevez scored at this stage last season?

Get some perspective, man!!!

Take out the no of penalties and free-kicks scored by rooney dis season and do a proper comparative analysis

So we didn't score penalties last season or we did not score from freekicks?
Who am i debating with FFS? Are you high on paraga?

debosky:
Rubbish - because he was so shyte in training that Welbeck was preferred to him.  

A recovering player is shyte in training?  See the effects of a single digit IQ!!!!

Wrong - he came to a big side, became overawed and has performed below par. Simple.
How is that relevant to the performance of a single player? You are still a a consummate slowpoke.

Berbatov became overawed. . . . .I laugh in Swahili.
A player that was directly involved in 18 league goals last season with none of them being a set-piece?
Debosky, letz face it - you are a cunt!!!

Please highlight where I criticised Rooney or Owen. The issue here is that Berbatov is a pile of ostrich turd.

My point is. . . . . .Rooney + Owen + Berbatov >>>>>> Rooney + Ronaldo + Tevez + Berbatov.
You are saying Berbatov = 0(which i am disputing)
So are you suggesting Rooney + Owen >>>>>>> Ronaldo + Tevez + Rooney OR Owen >>>>>>Ronaldo + Tevez??
Debosky, by all the powers conferred on me. . . . .You are a simpleton.

jay bee:
Berba according to ManUTD (http://www.manutd.com/default.sps?pagegid={FE60904B-C2A8-4E60-9B05-700DBBC29BBC}&section=playerProfile&teamid=458&bioid=93373)= Striker
Striker's primary role (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forward_(association_football) = putting the round ball in the net
Cost to UTD per goal = £1.6 M

Sauron stop flogging a dead horse. Berba is not delivering no matter what angle you wanna look at it.
He wasn't bought to improve our link up play

Fergie on Berbatov:

"This is a key signing.
"Dimitar is one of the best and most exciting strikers in world football.
"His style and ability will give the team a different dimension and I'm sure he will be a popular player with the fans."
Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/article1635118.ece#ixzz0b5BIIFKt

That is Fergie saying his style and ability will give Man Utd a different dimension.
Can that dimension be goalscoring since United are known to SCORE PLENTY OF GOALS?
Where in that interview did Fergie ever mention he bought Berbatov to score plenty of goals?

debosky:
Is is return per game better than Eduardo's? Get back to me on that - he is a waste of space.

Yes, it is. 48/76 is logically better than 18/28 unless you are a glorified retard. The more games you play, the more difficult it becomes.
Eduardo has only played handful of games. He is the only 26 year old striker that has only played 28 international goals for his country.

I am sure that even his goal rate for Bulgaria since he joined Utd has dwindled - the guy has lost it and is on the way down - an unmitigated flop.

Lost what?
He broke the international goal record for his country when he became a United player not before then.
Criz I have watched Berba play - answer these few questions will you?

How often does Berba make tackles or blocks, aiding the team in defence? How often does he flit in and out of games like a daydreamer? How often has his 'quality' won games for Utd? Not talking about scoring an 'icing on the cake' third goal, but winning games?

This is the idiotic statement that has been proven time n time again is a myth.
Berbatov made more tackles than Tevez and Rooney last season.
He won more tackles, covered more blades of grass than other United strikers last season and that is a FACT!!!